/sci/ - Science & Math

faces that manage to hold the most ejaculate are selected for by evolution

Besides averageness? As it turns out, the most average female faces are rated the most beautiful. The picture u posted is from such a study.

There are some details about this. To learn more, study evolutionary psychology.

from whats attractive to men

What do you mean by "ideal"? Bangable? A face that would secure erection in 95% of capable male population? A most average face?

Take for example a feature such as eye size or the distance between the eyes. There is a normal distribution on how the distance varies and there is also a mean distance (is that the ideal?)

We can sample the distributions of various features and come up with expected values for those features but it does not dictate an "ideal" in any form.

>>4635730
>The picture u posted is from such a study.

No it isn't.

These pictures are from a site that lets you pick faces and supposedly amalgamates them. I noticed that instead of looking like the faces you selected the amalgamations look like each other, meaning the algorithms they use have some reference of what a face is supposed to look like and throw out conflicting data from the composite faces and use the template face instead.

>>4635736
>what's ideal?

Florence Colgate is supposedly the most beautiful woman b/c her face has all the "ideal" proportions. Beauty pageants have some references for what the distance between each part (like the span between the nose and mouth relates to the span between the eyes by a certain ratio) and symmetry's supposed to be important.

What I'm wondering is from what these face-proportions were originally derived? Was it from the early 1900s when folks were still measuring skulls with calipers?

>>4635747
Ok, but then they are made with the same method.

>>4635760
There is no universal average human face that every combination of genes tends towards.

>>4635747

All it does is overlay the faces. The pictures are taken in a way so that the main features line up as best as possible. The differences in the faces is what creates the soft blurry effect.

The more faces you add the more average and generic the result. Hence why separate averages look alike. Even the male average kind of looks like the female one.

>>4635786
I'll lay your face.

There isn't one. The reason is that beauty is subjective. Scientist can find the "average" ideal measurements, but many people will still prefer other faces. Also, even the average ideal face varies greatly from country to country.

>>4635776
If this is true (and i don't know that it is), why does it matter?

>>4635807
>Also, even the average ideal face varies greatly from country to country.

No they don't, and there are plenty of humans universals. This includes various ways that humans rate other human's attractiveness, either fysical or as a mating partner.

>>4635807
>beauty is subjective

No it isn't. There are attractive women who're universally recognized as beautiful and ugly women universally found repulsive. There are innate standards of healthy features we're drawn too.

You couldn't take a chick needing facial reconstructive surgery and find a guy who'd rather kiss her than a super-model.

>>4635811
Maybe there is someone with an odd fetish who wud want that, but in general, humans are rather much in agreement about what makes a person fysically attractive, and attractive as a partner.

Ofc, this is to be expected. Other mammals are like that and humans are mammals.

>>4635808
b/c you claimed average = attractive.
>>4635730

>>4635811

You're full of shit.

> There are attractive women who're universally recognized as beautiful and ugly women universally found repulsive. There are innate standards of healthy features we're drawn too.

The only standard it eye-balling if she's healthy enough for your offspring. For fine tuning the eye-balling part, consult your local physician. Most men find African women tribal hideous, yet they still get laid by their fellow tribesman and the procreation process continues.


> You couldn't take a chick needing facial reconstructive surgery and find a guy who'd rather kiss her than a super-model.

You can similarly find a guy who would still kiss a super-model than her.

If you're OP, please just go fuck your self with a cactus and stop posting.

>>4635823
I didn't. I said something similar but did not use the equation sign in that way. I try to never use it like that.

U did not explain why the supposed fact that u mention is relevant. Will u do that now?

>>4635828
>yet they still get laid by their fellow tribesman and the procreation process continues.

Dumbfuck, a woman being plowed does not mean she's found especially attractive or attractive at all. Show those same tribals a VS model and they'd rather have her than their pedulous-breasted disk-lipped bald, emaciated bitches.

>You can similarly find a guy who would still kiss a super-model than her.

Your English needs practice. Is it your 3rd or 4th language?

>>4635841
This thread's discussing if their are scientific standards of beauty and more specifically if the standards employed to choose Florence Colgate are scientific.

You claimed that the standard of beauty is how close a face comes to some average of human faces and I contend no such average exists.

>>4635828
>The only standard it eye-balling if she's healthy enough for your offspring. For fine tuning the eye-balling part, consult your local physician. Most men find African women tribal hideous, yet they still get laid by their fellow tribesman and the procreation process continues.

Not a fair comparison, even if it is true (which i doubt, citation needed). U shud compare people that are equally healthy, well-fed, and without make-up etc.

Lots of research has been done on how mating works in humans. Maybe u shud just do some research?

A good intro to evolutionary psychology is David M Buss' Evolutionary Psychology: The New Science of the Mind. One can find it on the net for free.

>>4635730
If they are the most beautiful then how are they average?

Measurements?

Golden ratio.

>>4635850
>You claimed that the standard of beauty is how close a face comes to some average of human faces and I contend no such average exists.

Perhaps no actual person is exactly average in facial attributes (depending on which precision is used). But that doesn't matter.

I didn't say anything about "the" standard of beauty.

Why don't u just read some studies if u want to know about this stuff? It's not that difficult to google it and find some, even that are not behind a pay-wall.

>>4635851
Facial attributes. Distance between the eyes for instance.

>>4635852

http://web.mit.edu/cultureshock/fa2006/www/essays/facevalue.html

>>4635852
>golden ratio

That's what I heard the proportions were based on. That's mysticism. The golden ratio is a real ratio but there's no reason to utilize it as the mathematical pattern beauty follows.

>>4635870
No, it's legit. Oprah says so.
http://www.oprah.com/relationships/5-Elements-of-Attractiveness-The-Science-of-Sex-Appeal/3

>>4635865
http://cogweb.ucla.edu/ep/Frost_06.html

>>4635873
>Oprah

B/c a fat black woman knows alot about looking good.

>>4635865
I skimmed this. It looks decent enuf for a very, very short intro.

>>4635884
She has enough money to know whatever she wants about anything.

>>4635865
>Charles Darwin thought

As if something's a fact, let alone scientific, b/c it came from Darwin. Also, where's the footnote citing the source?

>>4635898
She had enough money and sense to have a plastic surgeon make her nose look more european, like Tyra Banks, Halle Berry, Beyonce, etc.

Anyone know of an equivalent of those studies done on women in Ireland to surveying what men they found attractive and how it correlated to their menstrual cycle?

Maybe guys find different women more or less attractive depending on whether it's winter or spring, time to sew or time to store.

>>4635899

Citations are on the bottom of the page, separated by semicolons.

>>4635908
I'll separate your colon.

>>4635716
there have been a few studies done over the years that found that that if you take a bunch of human faces and geometrically average them, people -usually- find the average result more attractive than any of the original faces that went into it.

also the opposite has been shown more than once: the further away from geometrically-average a person's face is, the less-attractive their face is usually considered to be.

here is one Wiki article on averageness/beauty-
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Averageness

there are others that have been done since. they usually find the exact same result

>>4635944
So we've contradictory data.

Or must conclude that the the attractiveness follows an inverted bell-curve as we travel away from average.

>>4635716
Do you realize how unbearably geeky and dorky that question sounds?
People are attracted to what people are attracted to, and you look the way you look. Why does it even matter why?
>he will NEVER have a girlfriend

>>4635967
Project much?

>>4635716
jaw too wide
not perfect!

We need some serious (and good) evolutionary psychology up in herre

ITT subjectivity

There are so many different factors and they work together, beauty really is in the eye of the beholder. It's kind of like taste, different combinations of the same basic tastes taste good to different people. So people have different "tastes" for mates and we can't really measure it accurately.

>>4636154
>>4636148
some guys like models and other -imaginary- guys prefer women with down syndrome.

>>4635716

The golden ratio is found to be very attractive. if features in the face are proportionate to this ration, as in distance from eyes to nose, eyes to hairline, ect, attractiveness goes up

Ideal = what people are attracted to the most.

White race = most attractive race(among other things).

Throughout history whiteness has always been associated with beauty.

How does this make you feel, nonwhites fags?

>>4636166

***not ration, ratio. Sorry. Also http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Golden_ratio

>>4636167

This isn't true. People have been brainwashed to believe that European features are the most beautiful, because they appear the most in the media.

For example, many African people believe that white skin is evil, or a sign of possession. Many also found white people extremely unattractive at first, thinking that they were the walking dead. In other words, zombies.

You can't make this shit up.

>>4636167
feels bad boss.

>>4636178

This is wrong, whiteness has always been considerd more attractive and by white I don't mean african albinos(lawl)..

>>4636166
>>4636171
Florence Colgate is hot and has the perfect golden ratio proportions, so I agree it works as a standard of attractiveness but she's not the hottest woman I've ever seen (Sarah Jean underwood for example looks prettier) so there're other factors in play.

>>4636167
i'm white but i find asian women to be more attractive...

>>4636182

Except it isn't. Cultures have their own idea of what is and what isn't attractive. Every culture in the world considers the median skin tone of their ethnic group to be the "ideal" one, while others are too pale or too dark. After colonization, people were told that white was the most attractive, and since physical beauty is created by culture, they began to believe that the European skin tone was better.

If you look at records from North Africa, people there considered the European skin tone as too light to be attractive, while considered darker people to the South to be too dark to be attractive. The thought that their own light brown colouration was superior, simply because it was the norm for their people.

>>4636178
>African folks thought white skin made you evil

And the superstition of some unnamed tribal town of savages is not indicative of mankind's taste in aesthetics.

>Africans thought whites were zombies

You're lying. I saw some documentary where a barbarian amazon tribe had thought the white folks they'd seen were the dead walking and touched (at his suggestion) the explorer's arm to feel he was warm.

This example doesn't even have anything to do with attractiveness so it's a non-sequiter on top of being wrong.

>>4636184
Asians like who, the members of SNSD and other korean celebrities who've had plastic surgery to look more white?

>>4636183

Just looked that girl up (btw I haven't posted in this thread before now).

She looks attractive, but she's not "the most beautiful woman I've ever seen" or even close. If she has the perfect ratio, wouldn't all other girls with the perfect ratio look almost exactly like her? Thus, unless you really think she's the most beautiful girl ever, you can conclude that just having that ratio doesn't make you the ideal. And I'm talking solely about her face here.

>>4636190
>if you look at some unnamed records I'm not going to cite

1) Niggers didn't keep records.
2) Tripoli pirates enslaved caucasian women from Mediterranean towns and they were more highly prized in sheiks courts as concubines than women of any other race.
3) http://healthland.time.com/2011/02/22/love-isnt-color-blind-white-online-daters-spurn-blacks/

You're either a brainwashed liberal or pretending to be one. It's some anthropologist/sociologist/psychologist (not science) bullshit to go, "You may get the impression from everyone saying they favor whites above all other peoples that they mean what they say. Oh, no. This is just a result of an omnipotent omnipresent cultural reprograming. Any account you here of someone saying they don't prefer whites is the legitimate, trustworthy word even if it's a negligible minority."

>>4636205
>>4636183

Agreed.

Another woman wouldn't necessarily have the exact same face, just the same relationship between the parts. The absolute value of her face could be wider/narrower, the shape of her eyes, nose, lips, ears, and arc of her eyebrows different, and all her colors could be different.

>>4636195
plastic surgery? lol no
the majority of every nation are not-so-good-looking-people
but a beautiful asian woman is always more beautiful than a white woman
pic related

>>4636221
asians are ugly

>>4636221
see
>>4635846

>>4636224
yeah right..

>>4636227
see

>>4636233

Not attractive but note you're picking the whitest looking asians you can find.

It's fucking funny.

>>4636233
Your best example yet but still not better than ze German girl.

There are asians I'd fuck but to say the hottest asians are hotter than the hottest whites is absurd. You must have some fetish for Japanese/korean culture.

>>4636236
i'd say the problem is with you
you identify bad characteristics to be asian
and when i show you a good looking asian girl you say that she's not an asian....

>>4636243
That was a different guy but he's right.

Your last two images have been girls with wide-open eyes and full nose bridges.

It's ok, people do the same thing with other races. Ask anyone what blacks he finds attractive and prepare for a list of mulattos.

>>4636239
well all of these i think are better looking than the german girl (not saying she's not hot)
i just like these girls better

>>4636253
wide eyes? nope

>>4636253
Maybe you're just turned on b/c these women are in sexier clothing/poses and you're not mature enough to evaluate a face when you're distracted by a body.

Here are some women to consider
http://xxx.chanarchive.org/4chan/s/43891/blonde-blue-eyes#13129436

Like what you want, but I suspect your preference for asians comes out of a love for asian culture (anime, manga, JRPGs, etc.)

>>4636271
>>4636266
This disagreement shows the irreconcilability of the multitude of female faces into a single average template as put forth here
>>4635730

An attractive irish woman looks different from an attractive italian woman, an attractive korean woman looks different from an attractive japanese woman, an attractive iranian woman looks different from an attractive egyptian woman, and so forth.

>>4636271
i started seeing them as beautiful long before i started watching anime
at the time i didn't find them attractive at all, but now every time i think of the word beautiful i associate it with asian women

never played JRPG
don't read manga

>>4636281
and yet no matter the race the religion or the place of birth
between 2 girls of any race which one is prettier

and your theory would make the Miss Universe contest, something that people would never agree on

this is not only about women, art is universal too
a beautiful sports car is beautiful anywhere in the world too
no matter how you think about it beauty is not subjective or at least most if it is not

>>4636329
I didn't say beauty was subjective.

I'm saying there is more than 1 form of beauty. Both a redhead and a blonde can be beautiful for example; there isn't only 1 pretty color of hair, precluding all others from value.