/sci/ - Science & Math

I like China better than the US, anyway.

China has the largest population. If we meet alien life it would sense for them to be the 1st to make contact...

Obama is pretty much dismantling our space program, and god knows a republican won't reinstate it, so it was inevitable that China pick it up. The good news is they'll probably make space travel extremely efficient and will sell it to us for cheap.

I think that they have a way to go to catch up with Russia and I don't think they have the motivation to do that for a generation or so.
Good on them for having a crack at it though.

Mars belong to China now.
You want come Mars? You ask China.

>>3982410
>implying Mars isn't completely colonized with Chinese by 2020

>>3982421
You are aware that the Russians are running Mars voyage simulations right. They are at least 20 years ahead of china at the moment.

My opinion? It's more of the Simian Show.

China at least has a chance of getting "something accomplished", because they don't give much of a shit about Human rights, so they won't be restrained by all the nonsense that we've been restrained by.

However, they are duplicating all of our efforts, which is retarded. For example, they are planning a lunar rover.

... WHY?!?! What would you need one of those for? To explore the moon? WE NEED TO STOP EXPLORING AND START COLONIZING AND MANUFACTURING IN SPACE. So this particular angle looks like nationalistic theater, hence is part of the Simian Show. The Chinks are just ooking and throwing shit and making a genital display, which is all pointless as far as the universe is concerned.

My predictions for 2030
China, Russia, France, and Japan launch a combined manned mission to Mars.
Americans execute Al Bean for heresy.

>>3982434
>implying cramming people into a mock-up space craft and giving them limited rations puts you decades beyond everyone else

I give fuck all about who does it, as long as it's in the name of science.

>>3982449
>... WHY?!?! What would you need one of those [lunar rover] for?
Are you serious? You use rovers to explore the lunar surface so you know the surrounding terrain and resources in far more detail. You start by scouting the area and then you start en masse space colonization. It's easier if the first long-stay moon crew used rovers to find a bunch of old massive lava tubes for future human habitation.

>>3982459

Yeah, THAT. If you're truly decades ahead, you'd be ACTUALLY DOING SOMETHING.

I know a little something about "paralysis by analysis", and these Russians have it BAD.

>>3982463

Look, asscaptain, this "exploration" thing is a FETISH that does nothing but WASTE DECADES AND HUNDRED OF BILLIONS OF DOLLARS. The lunar surface is no longer worth exploring just for the fuck of it. We already know what's there. What's just over the next ridge is a daily problem FOR PEOPLE TO EXPERIENCE, and they'd actually have to (GASP!) fucking go there for that experience.

Stop space exploration. Start colonizing or shut it the fuck down.

>>3982459
Why would you belittle Russia and their efforts to get to Mars?
Is it because your shitty country can not do even the simple things to progress the colonisation of Mars.

Given current propulsion technologies and the high probability that we will learn absolutely nothing by going to Mars, it's nothing but an international dick waving contest and a huge waste of time and resources.

>>3982478
What part of 'massive lava tubes for mass underground lunar colonization' did you not hear? Radiation protection, micrometeorite protection, and cheap to dome and pressurize.

>>3982481
Pic related.

>>3982480

maybe because current russian "efforts" to get to mars are laughable

>>3982489
Partially agree, but it's better than nothing. The US has its own version, with the Mars Society staging mockup Mars capsule habitats modeled on the Mars Direct mission plan. /sci/'s own Mad Scientist has been selected for the Utah mission next year.

>>3982463
> It's easier if the first long-stay moon crew used rovers to find a bunch of old massive lava tubes for future human habitation.

You obviously know nothing about the matter.

You're going to fucking scour the lunar surface for a fucking lava tube, when the lunar regolith is the best pre-processed ore body ever discovered? Care to guess at the aluminum fraction of the regolith? Have you even HEARD of aluminum? DUMBASS.

Colonizers can work the regolith in temporary shelters using their water and food supplies as radiation shielding. They can form aluminum quonset huts and then bulldoze regolith over those. That will be more permanent shelter before setting up digs into the side walls of favorable craters.

Stop posting here and read a few books for a change, Internet weenie!

>>3982489
Compared to your non existent efforts.
Mock away while you do nothing and then eventually you will see that the small step approach has left you so far behind that you have no hope.

>>3982484
Do you think your image macro is going to make a difference in the foreseeable future?

P.S. The real reason why you got so hot and bothered about lunar lava tubes is that anything that resembles an anus (your favorite sexual target) excites you.

>>3982497
>implying Russia is taking "big step" approaches

>>3982496
Except that these ancient lava tubes can be absolutely gargantuan and provide far more habitable space for the amount of money/energy put in. Are these quonset huts a good idea? Maybe. I don't know how effective they'd block out a solar flare, the regolith would probably have to be piled on pretty thick. But you don't exactly have a Bobcat on the moon, and carrying a large earthmover along with you might seem a tad impractical for the first colonists.

>>3982498
That wallpaper will change the face of the world in the next three hours as well as our me a glass of magical orange juice.

>>3982497
> Mock away while you do nothing and then eventually you will see that the small step approach has left you so far behind that you have no hope.

The Russians aren't taking small steps, since that assumes FORWARD MOVEMENT. Dicking around on Earth isn't going to get you to Mars. Dicking around in general doesn't get you anywhere.

You're going to have to put Humans into a big canister for the trip. Russians have lived in a small-ish canister already, called MIR. So continued "study" of the matter is just DICKING AROUND.

Of course, I know the truth, and you can't face it. All this dicking around is intentional. The "effort" is just part of the larger nationalistic narrative. It's not actually a serious attempt to get to Mars. It's part of the national prestige thing, and they get a lot of that merely from having people dick around.

We're going to have pathetic "space programs" scattered around the planet for a few more generations. None of them will get anywhere. This is the sad future that I must scream at and laugh at, in the failing attempt to wake up you brainless supporters of that status quo.

>>3982500
...Are you 12? Really, I'd expect to read something like that on /b/, albeit with simpler language.

>>3982511
pour me a glass*

>>3982513
Just out of interest, is this Violent Simian changing his tone from 'ALL IS DOOM' to 'WE MUST REVOLT OR ALL IS DOOM' ?
If so I like it better.

>>3982511
I'm a misanthropic asshole, but I don't disagree with that image macro. I just believe it will in fact apply to Earth at some point and there is likely no changing it. I'm not against exploration of Mars either, just saying that given current technology our efforts are better spent elsewhere.

>>3982513
>Projecting your own countries lack of ambition onto the rest of the world.

>>3982511
> Except that these ancient lava tubes can be absolutely gargantuan and provide far more habitable space for the amount of money/energy put in.

Except that you don't even know these exist. You don't know where any of those are. Insisting that you have to find them, means you're DICKING THE FUCK AROUND.

This is a howl: These fucking retards have made their careers about lunar lava tubes that NOBODY ON THE MOON FUCKING FOUND:

http://www.lunarpedia.org/index.php?title=Lava_Tubes

Another fine example of what a WASTE the space program has been, by employing either directly or indirectly a literal army of DICK-AROUNDERS.

So, looking for yet another specific fucking thing is just another barrier towards GOING THERE.

Our space program got a lot further ahead by not caring so much about those details.

And if you're going to go to the moon to colonize it, then you'd better send along a modified Bobcat. You'll be there to MOVE TONS OF REGOLITH. How the fuck do you think you'll be moving all that? By the yuppie mind powers that you always seem to imply exist?

>>3982522
>I just believe it will in fact apply to Earth at some point and there is likely no changing it.
We've gotta change your mind about that.

>>3982517
> Just out of interest, is this Violent Simian changing his tone from 'ALL IS DOOM' to 'WE MUST REVOLT OR ALL IS DOOM' ?
> If so I like it better.

Oh, I never said you shouldn't revolt. I just know you WON'T. Your masters have total control of you and you're either too scared or too distracted to do anything constructive, either by direct action or by inhibiting action.

>>3982529
Proof that Russia's "big steps" toward Mars exploration is nothing more than nationalistic feel-good propaganda.

You can't even address criticism of their efforts without resorting to attacking other people for where they were born (which you don't even know).

Since we're playing the ad-hominem game, let me just point out what a hopelessly stupid cunt you are.

>>3982531
Can I be frank?

Sealing lava tubes as an economical way of human habitation wasn't my original stance on moon or Mars colonization. I was convinced by Mad Sci that it's the best way to spend your money for the most living/growing space for a off-world colony. If I was President of the United States or some shit, I would be sending bobcats, habitats, LFTRs, greenhouses, everything that you could think of to try and build the first 5,000-strong moon colony within 15 years. The lava tube is actually myself constraining my expectation on what politicians would be more inclined to fund, and I rather dislike it. I don't envy the idea of traveling to the moon or Mars to be put underground and then barely see the surface. I like your mass-producing quonset hut idea more than lava tubes, to be honest.

I must say again that it's UNBELIEVABLE that people are still thinking that the lunar surface needs to be EXPLORED, and then that such exploration needs to occur REMOTELY. That's all part of the larger narrative of DICKING AROUND. The academic FAGGOTS in charge of this so-called space program are not men of ACTION. They send sternly-worded fucking memos to each other like little SISSIES.

The space program went FULL GAY and nothing mattered after that. It was all just a waste, then.

>>3982484
I'm not sure what you're trying to say here Inurdaes...this is an arrogant xkcd quote referring to why we shouldn't go into space.

>>3982543
One thing: CAN YOU PLEASE STOP CAPITALIZING WORDS THROUGHOUT YOUR SENTENCES?

>>3982542
> If I was President of the United States or some shit, I would be sending bobcats, habitats, LFTRs, greenhouses, everything that you could think of to try and build the first 5,000-strong moon colony within 15 years.

It's good to see that you understand.

Unfortunately, men like you are carefully and intentionally sifted out, until at the core of action, there are politicians and gay-assed effete scientist types who are only concerned about paper, electrons and money.

>>3982544
I honestly have no idea how that's a quote against the argument of going into space.

>>3982547
> One thing: CAN YOU PLEASE STOP CAPITALIZING WORDS THROUGHOUT YOUR SENTENCES?

No. Moot and his gay fag lovers don't allow you to use italics and boldface here. So I must use CAPS to emphasize.

Until I get what I want, I'm going to do what I can. Those are words to live by; write 'em down.

>>3982552
<span class="math">Bitches\ don't\ know\ bout\ my\ itallics\ [/spoiler]

Faggot.

>>3982552
*sigh* Fine.
Those horrible Nazi moderators and their Fuhrer, not allowing us to use italic!

>>3982552
hear hear

November 2011
Fobos-Grunt
Mars Science Laboratory

>>3982559

EITHER TELL ME HOW TO DO THAT OR YOU'LL JUST GET MORE CAPS.

I have all the power here, and you need to learn that the hard way. Either you release information or you'll suffer. I'm good EITHER WAY.

>>3982564
>mfw I find out just now that MSL launches this month
Fuck yes!

>>3982565
It has bold in this picture.

>>3982577
<span class="math"> \mathcal{indubitably} [/spoiler]

>>3982577
Thank you. Tests:

Italics: <span class="math">\mathrm This should be in italics.<span class="math">
Bold: \mathbf{This should be in boldface.[/spoiler][/spoiler]

>>3982577
Test again:

Italics: <span class="math">\mathrm{} This should be in italics.<span class="math">
Bold: \mathbf{This should be in boldface.[/spoiler][/spoiler]

>>3982589
practice here

http://www.codecogs.com/latex/eqneditor.php

>>3982577
Test again:

Italics: <span class="math">\mathrm{This should be in italics.}<span class="math">
Bold: \mathbf{This should be in boldface.}[/spoiler][/spoiler]

>>3982597
Almost.

WE SPACE NOW

>>3982614

Oh come on thread, don't die.
http://thespacereview.com/article/1959/1
Robert Bigelow, head of Bigelow Aerospace fears that China may attempt to actually claim the entire moon.

DO YOU WANT CHINKS BURNING A TROLLFACE INTO THE MOON?

(I do.)

>that feel when europe science already teleport to mars before china gets there

Chinese technology grows exponentially faster than Russia's. They will be on Mars by the end of the decade.

We're working on nano materials that can absorb radiation and convert it directly into electricity when this happens we'll probably see a TON of outer space travel and colonization.

>>3982643
>DO YOU WANT CHINKS BURNING A TROLLFACE INTO THE MOON?

>(I do.)

You disgust me.

>>3982684
>We're working on nano materials that can absorb radiation and convert it directly into electricity
...Nantenna solar panels?
Power production is nowhere near our problem for mass colonization of space. It's cost of transport.

>>3982687
Chinese trolling the entire world out in the open? What's not to love?

>>3982695
If you support China in any way you deserve to be shot. Not fucking around here.

>>3982701
I don't support China, I support humanity.

And who are you, judging whether or not a person should have their life forcibly removed from them for different tastes in cultural and governmental styles?

>>3982701
It is not enough that I should succeed; others should fail

>>3982712

>>3982716
Yes, we all know the picture.

>>3982720
I'm just trying to keep the thread active.

The main issues are all tied to the fragility and the cost of maintenance of humans, right?
Once we have cyborgs (just the brain being organic, being "the most complicated thing of the universe" they say), all problems are solved, no?

>>3982746
More or less, but I'd rather we start colonizing space before ~2070.

>>3982750
Me too, but at least, humanity expanding out of the solar system is assured.
That's good. I think.

>open thread
>see Inurdaes' posts
>instant close
Dude. Why so many images?

>>3982746
>>3982750
It could be a lot sooner than that.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Predictions_made_by_Ray_Kurzweil#2020

>>3982765
>instant close
>replying to the thread

Pick one

>>3982761
Assurance is nice, but I'd still like O'Neill cylinders with grassy plains and a pressurized atmosphere instead of being in a sparsely furnished vacuum chamber. If you REQUIRE air and all that, you're more likely to get it as your squishy body can't take the cheaper vacuum chamber.

>>3982765
If you closed the thread, how did you post?
Also, I tend to post images with my posts so they stand out from the lest. 4chan is an imageboard after all.

>>3982766
Kurzweil is smart and all, but I prefer to keep my Singularity dates quite conservative.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-pacific-15123830

>'America the Beautiful' accompanies China rocket launch

....Are they taunting us?

>>3982768
>>3982769
Hello, nice to meet you. I'm neutrino.

>>3982775
Hello neutrino.
How does it feel to be the forever second behind the photon?

>>3982775
Fuck you my dog is not a whore.

>>3982777
PHOTON MASTER RACE REPORTING IN

>Learn Mandarin
>Learn English

I'm okay with this.

>>3982771
The guy predicted widespread, wireless use of the internet back in the late 80's early 90's. Just saiyin'.

>>3982783
Fuck learning a language with a 1 letter difference between "water" and "book". That's just stupid.

>>3982786
I know his track record, which is why I said 2070s and not 2200s.

>>3982786
He must be right about everything then.

This ain't no religion, sonny.

>>3982789
Not at all, sir. However, it does incline one to be more receptive to considering his other predictions.

>>3982481
You are an idiot!
because our money is much better going to nigger welfare and old people perscriptions. US used to mean something.

http://curiosity.discovery.com/topic/physics-concepts-and-definitions/ten-nasa-inventions10.htm

NASA creates SOOO much great shit. you are utterly clueless!

>>3982816
Thank you.

Within ten years the United States will have access to half a dozen commercial launch vehicles and spacecraft.

China meanwhile will still be building expensive, crappy rockets and launching one manned mission every 2-3 years like they are now.

Capitalism wins again bitches!

>>3982917
>China launches crappy expensive rockets to make base on moon and Mars
>SpaceX tries to follow, but falls flat on it's face when a GOP-controlled Senate slashes NASA's budget some more
>everyone else is more or less stuck in low Earth orbit
I called it.

Why can't we just all work together?

>>3982970
Politicians.

Can you imagine a world without politicians?

>>3982917
>capitalism
>win

nope.png

>>3982917
nice trolling asshole

Bump.

It's obvious: BRIC nations = humanity's future in space. I am learning russian. At least they are willing to work with US when it comes to space stations, maybe they'll hire some NASA hopefuls too with enough begging.

>>3982643
> Robert Bigelow, head of Bigelow Aerospace fears that China may attempt to actually claim the entire moon.

So? Are we going to make a claim, yet have no ability to go there to enforce any such claim? Don't be stupid. Those who can grab resources, automatically validate the grab. Those who can't, are just punks and losers and Democrats and Liberals and Socialists, and they are stupid enough to believe that verbiage will determine who gets what.

Losers talk. Winners act.

As much as I hate angry monkey's invective and TYPOGRAPHY, he has a point. Real solar system exploitation will require project planning on the order of centuries. Our current political structures have a tough time dealing with decade long projects. Perhaps we should wait until we mature through the looming energy crises before attempting space settlement.

On the other hand, our current petroleum fueled population maxima supports a proportionally large population of intelligencia, a unique resource we may never again achieve. This may be the last time we can attempt large technically challenging projects.

My own opinion is that we are not going to settle space. Humans are adapted for this environment only; deal with it. It will be our cybernetic children who will adapt themselves to the harsh space environments. And I am satisfied with our current level of progress in that realm: processors continue to get faster, smaller, cheaper and more efficient; AI research plods forward; neuroscience likewise is continuing to delve into the nature of the NI existence proof. Once a parallel AI society is in place, then they can start collecting the bounties of space.

visn OILsouc, ironically

>>3983292
> On the other hand, our current petroleum fueled population maxima supports a proportionally large population of intelligencia, a unique resource we may never again achieve. This may be the last time we can attempt large technically challenging projects.

Precisely. If we let ourselves let the primary fuel source of technical humanity expire, then we're going to have a much, MUCH harder time working large projects on the energy streams from what's effectively the pre-oil world, meaning a space effort with energy sources from the late 19th Century.

>>3982449

>Using the word simian
>Capitalizing mid sentence.
>Self absorbed misanthropy ahoy

Oh boy, it's you again. Get a tripcode, at least that will deny me the satisfaction of recognizing you by text alone.