/sci/ - Science & Math

No such thing as a society without money. That resource based economy shit is pure fantasy.

>>3960798

Do you know what money is?

>>3960818
Paper with no inherent value?

>>3960819
That's not what this thread is asking. Also, you could compare advancements from the private sector and advancements from government funded projects; or how the USSR through as much money as they could into R&D. Note I said UNLIMITED FUNDING.

>>3960798
If this was a game, then you'd have different tech tree and different bonuses and drawbacks if you use a monetary system.

In the absence of money efficiency, productivity and reliability would be extremely vital and significant creativity would be invested to keep them razor sharp. Why? Because no one wants to do something uncecessary unless they get paid for it.

Luxury products and entertainment systems on the other hand would probably be entirely different, probably developing slower.

Crime and general misery/poverty would be less.

But good luck developing a system that doesn't use money and won't be called godless communist traitor society and/or exploited or sabotaged.

>>3960829
> Paper with no inherent value?

Like all contracts and books?

Why is it that you assfaggots value paper until somebody calls it "money"?

>>3960834
I can read a book and learn something. That's inherent value; the paper holds the words that I can understand.

I can't read money and learn anything. I can't really do anything with it. I guess it may help you count.

>>3960834
Book contain information.
Contracts are legal protocols.
Entirely different league than money that often isn't even paper, it's a number in a networked system and it's subject to manipulations by the powers that be, in a microsecond they could literally expand the money supply to infinity and make money entirely worthless while at it.

>>3960829

>Paper with no inherent value?

Incorrect.
First learn what Money is and represents, and then return to us to explain why you were incorrect and why would you like to apologize to us for your ignorant and arrogant behavior.
Now off with you.

Elimination of money under another viable, clearly superior system would help the sciences immensely. But we're not quite at that point technologically. Capitalism will spawn a new transcendent system.

Money spurs innovation but unlimited money makes it worthless.

>>3960867
Care to elaborate?

>>3960860
What do you think comes next? When will we get to post scarcity?

>>3960857
>doesn't explain what he thinks money is, when it probably would have taken less time for him to type that up then his actual response.

ISHYGDDT

>>3960857
lmao. The federal reserve is debasing our currency and sheeple like you are letting it happen...
Ron Paul 2012

>>3960876
>Care to elaborate?

If I have to it's because you don't understand the basics of how money works. We can make money unlimited whenever we want through quantitative easing but it devalues currency and if you got to the point where it was really *unlimited* no one would accept it in exchange for goods.

>>3960904
that's not even a logical response to what EK said.

>>3960905
I didn't mean let's literally print unlimited money. You're a retard if you think that.

What I was saying is that if we gave research and development in science and technology unlimited funds, would they be better off? This isn't a debasing and inflationary discussion.

>>3960876
Lots of corporate bullshit persists until 2013 - 2018, eventually mass riots break out across major population centers across US, Canada, Europe and perhaps Asia. At the same time we'd already have vastly improved robotics and 3D printers would've come down waaaaay in price, leading to potential destabilization of the Chinese economic growth as many bullshit plastic/metal stuff that you'd usually buy you would be able to print at a lower cost. Some changes are made to gov't and corporations and what they can and can't do, but as usual it's pretty half-assed. It'll take at least another 10 years for people to wise-up further, combined with even more anger as the United States continues its decline and China rises. Then many many jobs from very different professions start ot be taken at large as relatively intelligent automatons can take over for a far lower cost of operation than a human worker. The unemployment begins to climb rapidly. 15%. 25%. 40%. It doesn't even have to get to 50% for shit to get ugly. At that point you have a fork in the road. There is every possibility of a 1% ruling with their riches and robot servants over the impoverished and herded-off 99% which would create an essentially unbeatable class structure from which escape would be almost futile. The other is the people use the power of automation to free people from labour for the good of all people, eventually fulfilling the storyline of Manna where Australia suddenly has hundreds of millions of people in a left libertarian automated luxury nation.

So some form of abundance aiming toward post-scarcity should be within technological reach by 2030.

>>3960857
>>3960907

samefag

>>3960914
I want this to happen so bad.

I think I love you.

>>3960911
if you just kept pouring money into science then they'd certainly be better off. Why do you even need to ask this? And yet you call me a retard.
It's not feasible though, so it's silly to even consider it.

>>3960798
It works like this, Instead of funneling all your money into the big projects, funnel it into the smaller ones, No one alive then who wanted to could have invented something like a TV before some scientist figured out how some shit works that nobody cared about.

hey >>3960867, in response to >>3960876 post he is saying that a monetary system with a central bank, like the federal reserve, allows banks and the gov't to print up money whenever the fuck they want to for whatever fucking retarded ass reason they can come up with. If you have a credit card and you spend the money on something that money doesnt exist. The Fed just prints it up out of thin air. Can pay your credit card off? No fuckin' problem just declare bankruptcy. When shit like this happens it debases our currency. Only with the gov't it happens on a much larger scale. Recently the Fed bailed out some foreign countries. When those countries fail and aren't able to pay off the loans the American people ARE FUCKED IN THE MOTHA FUCKCHIN ASS.
In short Keynesian economics sucks and whoever thought an unlimited money supply was a good idea was an idiot. Also, RON PAUL

>>3960928
Actually if science got funding whenever it wanted it a lot of bullshit would be funded. The fact that's difficult to get funding ensure they actually think about their planned research and its justification

>>3960923
The predictions seem to be panning out quite well. I do believe in the future, there will be an Automation Age, which came after the Industrial age at around 2035.

>>3960939
>someone actually says something about what OP wanted to discuss
>mfw

>>3960937
You're going off on a tangent here. and your ron paul support is irrelevant here.

>>3960944
Will we also live forever through technological innovation?

I must make it to the singularity.

>>3960856
And why would information have worth?
If I told you there was a frozen elephant 40 billion light years away would that have worth to you?
Things only have value because we gave it value.

>>3960953
Technically the Singularity will happen, just not the way some nerds jack off to when they think about it. All the Singularity is is a point in time when you have better-than-human intelligence that creates new things. At that point you just can't predict at all what's gonna happen from there on, as we haven't experienced it.
But yeah, life extension is also very probable, quite soon.

http://www.theage.com.au/technology/sci-tech/drugs-may-let-us-live-to-150-20111016-1lrm5.html

http://www.hplusmagazine.com/articles/forever-young/manhattan-beach-project-end-aging-2029

http://www.ted.com/themes/might_you_live_a_great_deal_longer.html

http://nextbigfuture.com/2011/07/sierra-sciences-working-towards.html

http://www.sens.org/sens-research/research-themes

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-3329065877451441972#

http://www.nature.com/news/2010/101128/full/news.2010.635.html

http://www.guardian.co.uk/science/2010/nov/28/scientists-reverse-ageing-mice-humans

http://www.physorg.com/news/2011-06-biologists-yeast-cells-reverse-aging.html

http://www.physorg.com/news/2011-06-dna-reverse-premature-aging.html

>>3960965
It sparks my creative side, and my imagination and concepts of wonder. More so than money.

>>3960968
>so many links to read

Please tell me you're also a 20 something year old hot chick. I like what you're saying. Please.

>>3960949
what the fuck is my tangent? i explained how a central bank and unlimited money supply debases our currency. Sure pumping that all into science would probably speed up the rate at which technology progresses but the citizens would all be poor as shit and the scienists would own our souls and be our supreme rulers and masters, like corporations are now. BUT technology is progressing at a exponential rate and we will soon reach the singularity SOOOO op's question is fucking stupid and irrelevant. Also, Ron Paul

>>3960976
Nope, under 20 Australian guy.
And I doubt you swing that way.

>>3960968
btw, I'm a fan of SENS on Facebook. I'm hip.

>>3960976

If it helps, I'll gather the expertise to make a 20-something furry chick who is also a transhumanist. Would that be satisfactory?

>>3960978
it wasn't a response to what i said. you think you're disagreeing with me

>>3960983
I do love Australian accents..

>>3960989
With nice tits.

>>3961011
Incoming leopardgirl.jpg

>>3960983
does your name mean 'in your days' as in 'life extension technology will happen in your days?' or is that just a coincidence? also do you use that name on every website?

>>3961016
How do you transcend tripfaggotry and not be a giant retard?

>>3961024
A coincidence, The proper pronunciation is actually In-err-die-ess.'
I use it on many sites, not all. This is me giving a fuck.

>>3961029
By telling you to go fuck yourself over Skype?

>>3961016

GET READY

>>3961040
Are these all you?

also what does In-err-die-ess mean?

If I had an obscene ammount of money (Hundreds of trillions, not unlimited though, as unlimited money would end badly for the economy and likely the planet very quickly), thorium reactors would be legalized (Through some very suggestive lobbying) and installed globally. Wind turbines and solar pannels would become as common as streetlights (In... Certain areas for safety. Fucking birds.) and billions would be spent in more efficent conductor research, along with funding for many other branches of research.

More universities would be opened in areas based on population, where needed, thus allowing more people to get the education needed to help fill the sudden explosion of job opportunities needed for this economic funding.

Money (VAST ammounts; more then 10 trillion) would be set aside to help prevent another global economic crisis, and control of this given to the IMF.

Transhumanism would no longer be just a dream. With no morality issues in the way (IE: Fucking religion), and in a secret research facility, the best and brightest would be offered the chance to work on this project, save those who would have qualms about the morality of the issue. However, once the technology is completed, it would not become publicly released. Only the best and brightest of humanity would be contacted for testing (As I immagine not every person would be compatible with whatever procedures went underway), and they wouldn't be told what they were being tested for until the very last minute.


*Ahem*


Uhh.. Also NASA gets funding... Loads of it.

>>3961049
I used to tell people it meant 'Fire of life' in some ancient forgotten language, but really it's just a modification of a name that came out of the random name generator for a Blood Elf on a private WoW server. Yeah. But I like it, so it stuck. I also go by Tharsian.

CNET isn't mine.

>>3961052
Please be dictator of America for 10 years.

>>3961040
That isn't the correct pronunciation of any of those syllables. ae is a soft E, like eeehhh. not like die

>>3961041

...

>>3961073
Also why would ur be pronounced er?

>>3961078
The U is not emphasized much at all.

>>3961073
I should've corrected it to In-eurr-dah-ess

>>3960911
>unlimited funds = unlimited money
faggot

>>3961113
>moron

>>3960997
you're a fucking idiot, faggot

>>3960798
unlimited money usually becomes unlimited waste and unlimited complacency in science. stay hungry, /sci/...

>>3961120
Keynesian mother fucker

>>3961052

Bitches be moseying in on my territory.

Also, on an unrelated note, would you like a job as Director of Finance for whatever government I end up setting up? Cause I like the cut of your jib.

Money doesn't spur innovation
False premise

Tesla was bankrupt during his best years, as was Einstein and many others

>>3961214
BTW I don't know what spurs innovation, just saying it isn't money

Everything is built to break and be outdated, by design. If you make a product so durable that no one buys a replacement, if you make it so good that you cannot bring out a "Version 2" then you are not maximising profit. They had the know-how to make an IPhone 4 when IPhone 1 came out. True story - I have a close friend who works for Apple.

Money is hindering technology.

First you get the ideas, and THEN you get the unlimited money. grant funding programs should be like that but there's an awful lot of talent going to waste with a funding rate of less than 20%...