/sci/ - Science & Math

Nothing to see here. Just a bunch of children who think that banks making poorly considered loans and shitting up the economy somehow constitutes the end of capitalism.

inb4 liberal

>>3869660
>>3869638
Thank you, finally someone who agrees with me.

>>3869660
yup. while i think we should protest the govt subsidizing subprime loans and then bailing out the guys who benefited from it, these protestors only care about getting a $20 minimum wage and complaining about how they can't get jobs with their art degrees.

>>3869680
I agree with you too.

OP, unfortunately, there are lots of unemployed and lazy students out there, and the internet has given them a way to organize little marches like this one to make them feel special. Idealism is a brain disease, a neurosis, a form of denial.

>>3869712
a lot of them aren't lazy, just stupid. lots of the pics say $70k in debt, masters degree.
then i look at their expensive clothing, makeup, big apartment behind them and roll my eyes.

Also, the "I am the 99%" people all fucked themselves over voluntarily and are now mad that they don't make as much as their 55 year old parents.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q55OAozWeNo
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-H47tHjR5oA
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dnKetznvdUE

Elderanon here
I was in grade school when we had huge protest movements in the US. I remember all the adults saying they had no point, no idea what they were talking about and that drugs and negros were the cause of it all. Many seemingly sane middle american adults advocated letting the national guard mow them all down before they went crazy and burned everything looking for pills.

Fast forward 15 years. They have won all their political battles, their culture and fashion are mainstream and the philosophy they espoused is considered the only sane and acceptable mindset.

I wouldn't write this off just yet.

>>3869753
While I agree that the movement during the 60s was laughed at as well, these dumbfucks are not chanting for equal rights.

Have you read the demands? What is laughable now is how quickly the unions and other political establishments have been to co-opt this movement. Just like the tea party.

>>3869753
They had something to complain about and philosophical issues at the heart of their movement.

Fast forward to today. A completely empty and directionless protest against "the system"

I would write this off, OP.

>>3869747
>start watching first video
>obvious low life yelling FREEDOM OF SPEEECH FREEDOM OF SPEEECH
10/10 I raged

the op is so credited! America is definitely fucked because unemployed kids in their 20s with shitloads of debt are protesting the situation and have a completely futile hope that the govt will fix the situation. i guess at first i thought the problem might be that there are no jobs. or that GOP congressmen have made it abundantly clear that they don't care enough about there being no jobs to make a serious attempt at fixing anything or removing their tongues from the corporate boot. but on further thought you're right man, the real problem is that 18 yo kids who did nothing to create the system of easy educational loans followed the (admittedly bad) advice of their parents and every other fucking person in society. i just hope the economy can eventually recover from all of these poisonous feelings of entitlement brother... with any luck we can starve these parasites to death before they destroy the paradise we boomers created...

>>3869788
watch the third one

53 here (thats also my age)
Silly sounding almost meaningless phrases like "the Man" and "the establishment" grew out of the vague discontent that the hippies voiced. They were also directionless malcontents. It took years before they defined what it is they were pissed about.

As far as unions and such jumping on the bandwagon that is new, different. I have no idea what it might mean except that some people in charge there remember things the way I do.

>>3869796
Not even mad, I felt actual pity for him. God am I glad I was not born into whatever godawful situation he was born into.

>>3869710
>>3869710
it's pretty fucking criminal what the banks did though. you can't create a tranche within a BBB CDO and give it an AAA rating.

>>3869795
That's not what OP said, he just said they're naive and have nothing to say. Also, you're not even an English language native, so your opinion doesn't matter and you're probably a Chinese internet subversive, faggot.

>>3869808
>capitalism
lol'd

I, for one, am absolutely elated that Steve Jobs died this past week. That's one less rich bastard not paying his fair share of taxes, one less rich bastard sending American jobs and manufacturing overseas, and one less rich bastard holding up so much wealth from the rest of America! We are the 99%! #OccupyWallStreet #BlatantSarcasm

I'm with OP.

Economists are, by and large, too deeply int he pocket of the capitalist elite to back OWS. They'd be undercutting their own employment as the modern priests if they backed it.

They really need to be more coherent and well thought out with this. I'm awfully liberal but these people are too ham-fisted for me to get behind.

I'll be the first one to say that political culture in america, even at the left end of the spectrum, is undevelopped and unproductive.

But with that being said, leading economists and people from the financial sector are worse, intellectually and socially speaking, than the idealist students down there with their slogans.

>>3869882
I don't think they do. They may not have enumerated a clear list of demands, but everyone watching knows exactly what they're against. How do you break down "stop priviliging rich finacialists over the general population" into a few simple actionable legal demands?

SHOW ME WHAT DEMOCRACY LOOKS LIKE.
THIS IS WHAT DEMOCRACY LOOKS LIKE.
SHOW ME WHAT A SCIENCE THREAD LOOKS LIKE.
THIS IS NOT WHAT A SCIENCE THREAD LOOKS LIKE.

>>3869638

Occupy wallstreet is informed and setup by smart dudes

wathc

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CPeaFKvszKI&feature=feedlik

>>3869893

Well thought out with their demands and goals, I guess is what I mean, because what they are asking for is retardedly unrealistic at this point. It comes off as sloppy. But who knows.

>>3869808
>You have a car.
>After 100000km, it breaks down.
>But because it carried you the first 100000km, that must mean it never failed.

That being said, capitalism can be fixed and start again. The real problem is not what happens to people when it fails, it's what happens when it works. I hope the people in this movement will understand that.

>>3869904
Most of them are also part of the anti-capitalist movement, so I'd say they do.

>>3869638
>Is it anything more than a group of immature idealistic faggots from twitter/reddit//b/ with nothing better to do?
see pic.
>Are any leading economists or people from the financial sector actually backing this so called "movement"?
Does successful business men count?
http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/09/24/us-g20-development-idUSTRE78M64Q20110924

top 1% owned 38%
bottom 40% owned less than 1%

If you go out and walk in the street, 2 out of 5 people you meet own a plastic fork, the 3 out of 5 have a house, and 1 out of 100 own the city block you're walking in.

To put it another way, try and make a car where the 38% of the mass is located in 1% of the machine. There's no way that car can run without being a hazard.

>>3869896
He had some good points until it hit 4:45. Apparently he has no solid grasp on world history.

And then again at 8:05.

Is this /sci/ thing just a bunch of armchair economists who think they're the smartest shit on Earth because they know how to find the sum of two vectors?

>>3869875

> economists
> backing anti-economist policies

I think I found your problem.

>>3869903
Well, at worst their demands will have an effect on the society and make their realization more realistic a few decades from now.

It annoys me to see that a lot of negative commentaries on political events now are justified not by actual criticism of the goals and methods, but by pessimism about their appearance in the media and in the eyes of the uninterested.
"It's bad because it might look bad to someone because it might look bad to someone else..."

>>3869935
Also: debt a purely political arrangement. lol

It all has to do with the psychology of group thinking, wanting to belong to a group, and wanting others to believe you can think freely. They don't have any clearly set out goals, aside from the very broad and overly-regurgitated statement "Hurr durr, we are the 99%, we don't want the majority of our nation's wealth accumulated at the top" Even CNN acknowledges their lack of detailed goals and non-existent leadership, and CNN is liberal as fuck. I literally saw an interview from a "protester" the other day, who, of course, looked like your typical college hippie liberal. She was whining how she was forced to drop out of school because HER PARENTS lost their job and could no longer pay for HER to go to school. She must have been at least 20. These faggots really make me sick.

>>3869806
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z3aqv7TYSM0

I am mad.>>3869806

>>3869941

Their demands ignore reality, h0story, facts, logic, and economics.

It looks to me like the protesters are actually expecting something to happen, like they're not going to leave till they change people's minds. That's silly.

>>3869947
Would you knew it? Most college students's years of university is paid by their parents and grandparents. Funny thing, isn't it?

>>3869957
No, that's your ideology.

>>3869947
>Even CNN acknowledges their lack of detailed goals
That can't be helped in the US. Every institution is built so as not to be able to carry their projects to their end.
>and non-existent leadership
Isn't that a good thing ?

>She was whining how she was forced to drop out of school because HER PARENTS lost their job and could no longer pay for HER to go to school. She must have been at least 20.These faggots really make me sick.
What's so disgusting with wanting an education and being too poor to afford it ?

Funny how a lot of these shits have iPhones that were made by Chinese slaves.

>>3869969
>What's so disgusting with wanting an education and being too poor to afford it ?

Nothing. It's the fact that she is complaining about her parents no longer being able to pay her way through college.

>>3869969

Wanting is fine. Supporting the theft of labor from another so you get it is not.

>>3869975
She is not blaming her parents.

>>3869947
How is that in any way abnormal? I sure as fuck couldn't go to college if my parents couldn't pay for it. I'm already gonna be 70k in debt once I graduate, they just help with the loans and interest and shit. I would love a job to help pay for my education, but even if I did get one, AND worked 40 hours a week and stopped going to classes and shit I still wouldn't be able to afford my education.

So why don't you shut the fuck up, these people problems are real and you are not better than them in any way.

>>3869959
Not really. People actually think about stuff when they're told to. It's marginal, but it's real. In the most extreme illustration, someone needs to shout that the king is naked. Same thing here.

In the gatherings itself, even more, since people there take the time to meet and talk about it.

>>3869979
>the theft of labor
You mean like the parent where thieved of their jobs?

It's about the power that comes from concentrated wealth. I can't understand why you guys are so butthurt about people trying to make their and your lives better.

>>3869975
You mean that family solidarity should be abolished ?

>>3869947
CNN is liberal? CNN, who profit as much from war as the army industry did, is liberal? Seriously?

They mocked the protesters as much as Fox news the 1st week.

Again, if you make any system or machine where 40% of all the stuff is inside less than 1% of the volume, it's not a functional machine and is badly designed.

>>3869984

wut

The stealing of labor (in this case, what you get for your labor -- currency). This would contrast with a person who thinks they are owed a job. In this case they are owed the money as they did the work.

>>3869980
Nobody is saying she was. She shouldn't be complaining though. If she really cared that much about her education, she would have gotten a fellowship.

>>3869989
>>3869980
No, she is not blaming her parents. However she does not seem to want to pay for college herself either.

I agree. Taxation is theft.

>>3869995
Yeah, right. Poor people do not WANT to pay for stuff.

>>3869995
Or not able to.

>>3869999
Could she not get a student loan? Could she not get scholarships? How about a part time job?

ffs

>>3869992
I am still not sure what you are blaming her of. She doesn't intend to steal the money of no one.

It is a hyper-democratic protest. They VOTE on their goals.
You may not support the movement, however the only way to actually object to the demands of the protest is to PARTICIPATE IN IT.

The protesters VOTE on their demands.
If you disagree, VOTE to change them.
If you sit at home, doing nothing, you are not being represented!

I urge that anyone who disagrees with the objectives of the protest to go to the next general assembly and OVERTHROW the movement.
If you get a big enough group, videotape it, vote for the end of the "occupation" and win, you have proven that the real "99%" don't give a shit.
If they continue the protest they have lost ALL credibility.

Krugman's backing them. I guess you could call a Nobel prize winner a "leading economist". I'm pretty sure he's not alone either.

>>3870002
I don't know about you but if I was unable to get a loan/scholarship or pay my own way through college I wouldn't leave those facts out and leave it at "well my parents lost their job, I'm SOL".

>>3870005

>Could she not get a student loan?

Eternal Debt IV: Infinity

>Could she not get scholarships?

You actually have to be smart (or a sports ape-beast) for those

>How about a part time job?

Are you even aware of the economy right now

>>3870010
Krugman is a keynesian, of course he is going to back this movement.

>>3870005
As student loan. Part-time Job are far from covering the costs, so a student Loan it is. Which mean she'll have to borrow money from an institution, then give more than what she borrowed (that's how loan work).

It's not impossible (it not sure, but it is possible) that whatever own what will loan money to to her might also own the society where her parent worked and that take the decision to delocalize it.

In other words, by making their parent jobless, it end up taking even more money from her. Man, those people are genius. At her place, I would be pissed too.

Sure I am caricaturing, but this is a configuration that has certainly happened.

>>3870013
So what exactly are you getting at here? She's not intelligent enough for a scholarship or a fellowship and can't find a job when 75% of other individuals in her age group are employed in some form. Therefore, she should get a hand out?

>>3870013
community colleges are cheap. though minimum wage still wouldn't get you there till you've saved diligently for a few years.

>amerikkka #1 country in the world
>no free university-level education
>no free healthcare

lol

>>3870005
Many people do that, and it mostly works. For now.

Unless you get injured.

Good luck lifting and stacking crates to pay for your physics degree with a back injury. Well, you can always play Half-life and pretend to be Gordan Freeman. That still works.

>>3870014

Heh, it's called mainstream macroeconomics. You should read up on it. Oh yeah, libertarianism is a religion. The door's that way.

>>3869996
Taxation is a theft from someone you elected to thief you and voted to decide what he will do of this thievery.

It's not the most enjoyable thing, but it's still not as bad as pure thief.

>>3870027

> i dont pay now so it is free

lol

>>3870005
>Could she not get a student loan? Could she not get scholarships? How about a part time job?
Yeah, loans are the solution. See how much good it did to the americans until now.
Scolarships, wihtout sarcasm, are not. There's more people wanting an education than there is money offered.
Part time jobs aren't that easy to get now and do not pay enough in a lot of cases to get by in university without reducing your hours spent studying (which by the way will fuck you up for scolarships).

>>3870036

> everyone votes

Haha, good one. Not even the majority vote, and certainly they get no option to opt out of taxation.

These people are bad. High amount of retards is one reason USA can not hope to have a meaningful political discourse.

>>3870026

It depends. Back in 2007 I was working for just about minimum wage (though in a state with a very generous minimum wage), renting a one-bedroom apartment, paying all my bills and attending night classes at the CC.

i find the reporting on this hilarious

>tea party marches on washington.
>fox news calls them patriotic heroes
>cnn calls them racist bumfucks

>occupy wall street thing
>fox news calls them jobless whiners
>cnn calls them noble protesting citizens

although to be fair, the tea party folks were actually pretty nice to the city of washington. cleaned up their own trash, supported local buisnesses and such

whereas the occupy wallstreet guys are generally just being assholes to local businesses and leaving their crap everywhere

>>3870040
>I give a small share of what I win to beneficiate from it.
>So do richer and poorer people than me.
>all this money pured together allow to create service I wouldn't be able to afford on my own.

>>3870033
>mainstream macroeconomics
>incorporates keynesian economics

I reject portions of keynesian economics so I must be some libertarian nutter.

>>3870040
>removing barrier to entry is a bad idea
all of my wat

>>3870051

If you cannot afford it, it is not for you. That piece of advice would have solved the banking collapse.

>>3870058
oh shit, liberty's first constructive post!
everyone get in here!

>>3870043
Actually, they can. There was a project for emigrating in some new england state and making it happen.
Thankfully for the people of that state, libertarians are passive-aggressive fucks and can't actually pull it off.

>>3870048

What are you talking about? CNN hasn't been supporting them. From what I've seen, they were mocking them, but in a very subtle way (because they have no idea what they actually WANT, they're just protesting).


CBC (the largest new network in Canada) has been backing them up, though.

Imagine you have a sports league.
There's one team that wins every year.
They're such a great team that all the other teams lose their fans because there's no hope of ever winning a championship.
And the sporting governing organization lets this happen and, in fact, supports it because the #1 team makes so much money it can support the entire organization.
***This gives the team de facto control over the entire sport.***
But if the #1 team were to make one mistake, the entire sport will go under like a dude falling off a tight-rope.
Did the laws of this sporting organization allow this to happen? Yes.

Is this fair to everyone else who wants to watch an entertaining sport with this thing called parity? No.
There is something fundamentally wrong with any system that would allow, and even encourages, such actions.

That's what the wall street protests are about. It's not about the fans of other teams wanting a championship handed to them, although a small minority of retards (probably women) may want that. They simply want a level playing field. To live and work in a system that doesn't have the deck stacked against them.

>>3870058

>If you cannot afford it, it is not for you

How come?

>>3870072
because debt is slavery

>>3870058
>If you cannot afford it, it is not for you.
Are you aware that you just denied the validity of the whole financial system ?
These people want to occupy wall street, you want to abolish it. It's impressive.

>>3870067
Imagine mathematics if 1+1 were to be 3.

>>3870048
>occupy wall street marches
>msnbc calls them patriotic heroes
>cnn calls them hippies
>fox calls them jobless dirt bag twats

>tea party thing
>msnbc calls them right wing loons
>cnn calls them racist
>fox news calls them patriotic heroes

>>3870079
You don't even know what investment banking is.

>>3870079
>mfw not buying things you can't afford is a revolutionary idea

>>3869710
The whole $20 minimum wage thing is absolutely hilarious. Hey, if you're doing that and massively taxing foreign trade, why not just go the whole hog? 300% income tax on those who earn more than a starbucks cashier, and immediately put in place a mandatory life sentence for being moderately successful or having a debit card.

>>3870079
You do realize this economy is not even a real economy? And economy was originally meant to make best of what there is available.

Nowadays there is not a single product in stores that is meant to last, and besides that, this economy lost it when money because useless paper, instead of a return stamp for gold.

>>3870043
I never said opting out was an option, this is after all, thief. But if you think the will of the majority is not respected of how this money is used, then prove it.

Also, consider this: people fought to conquer a country and establish their rules. This is always how a country come to be. Whether their rule is just or not and their takeover is justified or not, is an other story.

Anyway, the leaders of those conqueror then decide how the country should be ruled. And the government and institutions that they left behind them after their death carry on those rules. It's their legacy. The rules might evolve and changes but they still get their legitimacy from the people who had the strength and capacity to take over the country in the first place back then. This is why they get the privilege to take money from people to decide how the country is ruled. Who establish and apply those rules and how they should and the way whoever is put in charge, is something specific to each country.

I f you feel you are a strong character for that, go take over, inspire enough follower and then impose your own rules.

>>3870092
>minimum wage
>IT'S THE KOULAKS ALL OVER AGAIN
You're quite hilarious too.

>>3870098
Seems pretty real to me. People did lose their jobs and houses.

any easy way to solve this is to somehow increase the value of "voting with your dollar"

some CEO giving himself a huge raise? implement some subtle system that allows people to financially protest that

Wikileaks could act as a place for whistleblowers to safely call out bullshit, and buyers can punish that corporation through not purchasing things.

currently, corporations can very easily ride out negative press, that should not be the case

>>3870110
And how exactly would we boycott, say, Goldman Sachs, for example?

>>3870113
that's the issue, there would need to be some reasonable system to make such movements effective. it'd need quite a bit of thinking to develop

>>3870110
The main problem with this is mobilization. Calling for boycott is easy, getting people motivated and informed enough to follow not so much.
That's the point of protests.

>>3870058
>If you cannot afford it, it is not for you.
One person alone can not afford a service. But if they are several, by pooling together, and amassing enough money they can afford it for all, thanks to degressive costs.

This not why the banks failed, they failed because they loaned money they didn't have in the first place.

Pooling money (that you actually have) together to allow a better deal is actually an healthy economic attitude.

>>3870058
I would go by the argument that you should always help the ones who are in need at the condition it really help them and it doesn't cost you to much, but I already know you think even the most basic form of help mean shit to you.

The majority of Americans do not support the current disparity in wealth distribution. Vast wealth inequality can be solved by higher top marginal tax rates on the richest, to fuel public investment in technology and infrastructure.

>>3870123
the problem is that protests have very little weight today
i'm proposing a system whereby a protest as large as say, occupy wallstreet, would be a very serious threat to some specific company, and they'd need to very quickly resolve the situation

The Golden Era of American Capitalism (Post-war economic expansion) had 90% income tax rates on people earning more than a million (in 2011 dollars).

Gini Income Inequality Index. Green countries like Sweden and Germany are among the most equal, while the United States ranks among Mexico and Venezuela.

40 years ago would be the 70s. You're thinking 50 years ago.

Average worker earnings adjusted for inflation compared to GDP growth.

>>3870048
The Te Party is mostly composed of people over 35, and the converse for the Occupy Wall Street march.

But of course their values come into play on how likely they are to be polite.

>>3870152
The funniest things is that all of those polled people Have more ore less a common perception of how wealth is distributed (even if false), but, more important, an also common perception of how wealth should be distributed. And yet, we can't managed to reach this gaol, even if we all agree together.

Distribution of income growth over the past few decades.

>>3870048
CNN is too braindead to have a political slant.

Social mobility in OECD countries. Americans twice as unlikely to improve in their economic position as Danes.

Share of capital income over the past few decades.

More data on change in income.

American private health insurance system far more expensive and inefficient than Universal Health Care systems in Japan, U.K. and Germany.

Historical data of economic indicators by unemployment, real wages, occupation etc.

Nations with free/highly subsidized public higher education, universal health care, and government investment in technology (Sweden, Finland, Netherlands, Denmark, Germany) rank among the highest in technological innovation.

>>3870072

You are not demanding it.

>>3870079

I am well aware that corporations are the children of the state and I am against such things.

>>3870099

> will of the majority

Confirmed for hilarious majority force rule supporter.

>>3870124

I support the consensual pooling of money.

>>3870152

Who cares what they support? You cannot end that which is naturally occurring.

>>3870158

> mixed economy welfare state
> capitalism

> mfw

In conclusion: America is fucked and will continue to get worse until we fix it.

>>3870181

Heh, the "American dream" is more achievable pretty much anywhere than in America.

>>3870210
>> will of the majority
>Confirmed for hilarious majority force rule supporter.
No not Majority force will. A controlled Majority will. There should still be constitutional rules, agreed on on an almost unanimous level, that limit the will of the majority and guarantee individual rights.

More than anything, it's that constitution that will become the legacy of the conqueror's leader I mentioned early on.

>>3870107
I'm a socialist and I'm all for the relegation of capitalism to competition for contracts on a local scale. But thinking you can solve your problems by rising the cost of labour in your country and making it impossible to financially justify employing those in the US from outside will fuck you up faster than you could believe. couple the $20 minimum wage to the unequivocally open borders and you have massive workforce surpluses and far too many unskilled labourers, leading to the welfare system essentially collapsing and causing debt orders of magnitude larger than it is currently.

I fully support moves away from a capitalistically provided social safety net. What I do not support is art student ecconomics

Oh God... uppity Econ fags think Economics is hard science.

>Econ Majors
>Didn't predict 2000 Dot Com Bubble
HUUUUUR DUUUUUUR Yahoo is a good company
>Didn't predict 2008 Sub Prime Crash
HUUUUUUR DUUUUUR INFINITE HOUSING PRICES
>Didn't predict 2011 World Slow down
HUUUUUUUUUR WORP CHINESE INFINITE GROWTH

Seriously shut the fuck up. No srsly.

China and South Korea are eating US's lunch since they use mix markets. They convinced Americans to uphold free trade to US, but tariff US imports to hell and back, like a sucker.

>>3870261
They predicted it, they were just smart enough to not warn anyone.

This happened to me:
Go to small town university.
Flunk engineering (big surprise)
Make a dumb 2nd program choice
Know I'll flunk again, so I try and drop classes.
I lose tuition if I do that. Then I can't pay rent. Welp, time for a real job!

All the girls are either waitresses or doing phone sex. All the guys are doing "landscapping" in the forest.

"landscapping" is growing pot. No way! Drugs r bad!

Try and find a job that isn't growing pot in hicksville.

Triple fail. Welp, time for me and my debt to move back in with mom!

>>3870229
The <span class="math">American~Dream^{TM^{TM}}[/spoiler] and all wholly or partly owned subsidiaries are open to families with existing wealth not less than $1,000,000 or more.

>>3870270
1:10 predict the right outcomes.

Geologists' Earthquake predictions are far more accurate.

>Using macro models to predict greed of board members
>Herp derp

I want anyone with a good grasp of the math involved to offer thier considered opinion.

> If r < 1, then the series converges.
> If r > 1, then the series diverges.

Simplicity of the idea executed on a thing of most complexity - boogles the mind (my mind anyway, but it is easily boogled:-)

The analysis is incontrovertable (peer reviewed) top financial blogger, government researcher.

publications(dot)parliament.uk/pa/cm200809/cmselect/cmtreasy/144/144w254.html

gregpytel(dot)blogspot.com

>>3870210

You have to pay taxes to offset Limited Liability. (Taft)

>>3870295
Okay, could you at leas tell us what this mathematic formula is supposed to represent?

This is the mathematical model of what?

http://gregpytel(dot)blogspot.com/2009/04/largest-heist-in-history.html

email me your considerations

g.pytel98@imperial.ac.uk

Huge changes on the horizon, what we are wittnessing is all tyhe wealthy and informed are sneaking into the last life boats of the sinking ship, whilst singing a reassuring lullaby to the citizens of the developed nations.

>>3870305

It is an analysis to determine whether a % of fractional reserve to debt on the books constitutes by law !! a ponzi scheme.

>>3870295
babby's first series

adorable :3

Incoming civil war !!!

stock up on batteries and ramen.


.... No .. really *!

(pic is your ruling elite)

>>3870378

Fourteenth Amendment.

The validity of the public debt of the United States, authorized by law, including debts incurred for payment of pensions and bounties for services in suppressing insurrection or rebellion, shall not be questioned..