/sci/ - Science & Math

>>3127006
The technology:
http://techland.time.com/2011/04/06/spacexs-falcon-heavy-most-powerful-private-rocket-ever/
http://www.universetoday.com/73536/nasa-considering-rail-gun-launch-system-to-the-stars/
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/science/article4799369.ece

The will:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-8bIQLiKi3g
http://arstechnica.com/gaming/news/2011/02/lord-british-wants-to-take-you-to-space-and-hes-closer-th
an-you-think.ars/3

The time (and one of the main kicks in the ass to get it started):
http://www.hplusmagazine.com/articles/forever-young/manhattan-beach-project-end-aging-2029
http://www.sens.org/sens-research/research-themes
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-3329065877451441972#
http://www.nature.com/news/2010/101128/full/news.2010.635.html
http://www.guardian.co.uk/science/2010/nov/28/scientists-reverse-ageing-mice-humans

The economic benefits:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Asteroid_mining
>At 1997 prices, a relatively small metallic asteroid with a diameter of 1 mile contains more than $20 trillion US dollars worth of industrial and precious metals.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Near_Earth_Objects#Near-Earth_asteroids
>As of May 2010, 7,075 near-Earth asteroids are known,[14] ranging in size up to ~32 kilometers (1036 Ganymed).[16] The number of near-Earth asteroids over one kilometer in diameter is estimated to be 500 - 1,000.
http://www.virgingalactic.com/

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/%286178%29_1986_DA
>Asteroid 1986 DA achieved its most notable recognition when scientists revealed that it contained over "10,000 tons of gold and 100,000 tons of platinum", or an approximate value at the time of its discovery of "$90 billion for the gold and a cool trillion dollars for the platinum, plus loose change for the asteroid's 10 billion tons of iron and a billion tons of nickel."

There some huge fucking incentive right there.

>>3127030
>>3127042
Well, thank you. Now I feel embarrassed at how obvious it is.

>>3127042
Why aren't we doing it right now if it's so profitable?
What do you think?
I will give you a hint, it will cost many times more to get to the stuff than it's worth.

But is humanity acutally fucking ready to colonize the solar system?

I think not.

Wait till we become much smarter and peaceful and less virus like.

i will not let the cancer known as humanity spread throughout the galaxy.

>If there is no real financial incentive to go out and explore space, we won't

Incorrect. Financial incentive is not the only motivating factor. I believe SpaceX, at least, is committed to space expansion regardless of whether it's profitable. Like technology corporations do R&D, expecting that the expense of research will be more than compensated by profit from new/improved products, certain entities choose to pursue the exploitation of space, expecting that it will benefit them or us (humans in general) in the future. The benefit is not necessarily economic in nature.

>>3127042
It's not enough.

As for the platinum - the serious problem is assuming that you can sell that metric-assload of platinum at current market prices.

Before you get done selling even a tenth, the market price will plummet.

>>3127081
>Before you get done selling even a tenth, you will be richer than God.

>>3127051
You don't seem to understand what incentive means.

Having a fuckton of gold and platinum just floating around in space will motivate people to develop ways to obtain it at a profit. That's what drives innovation in general.

Example: alumin(i)um used to be extremely expensive because there was no easy way to extract and purify it from ore, which motivated people to look for more efficient ways to extract it. Eventually two people independently discovered new techniques to do it and the price dropped precipitously over just a few years. What was once more expensive than gold is now thrown out every day by people all over the planet.

The point is that new shit gets discovered, and incentives speed up the process.

I bet a lot of people would pay big money for space gold jewelry.

>>3127084
$100 billion isn't much compared to what it would cost to mine a fucking asteroid and haul it back.

Seriously, stop just assuming it's a good idea and crunch some numbers.

>>3127087
Yes, but we are no where near a situation where space mining is profitable.
Just making sure you undertand that.
I agree that it will happen some day but not for a long time.

Unless someone figures out a way to do magic.

>>3127087
Aluminum has a very interesting history. Napoleon used to have a set of aluminum silverware that he brought out for fancy dinners to "show off".

Funny it is.

>>3127099
>crunch some numbers
...says the guy who isn't even thinking seriously about numbers, just dismissing them no matter how big they are.

>>3127110
Say what you like. But if you only look for the arguments to support a predetermined conclusion, I'm not surprised that you find them.

The cost of going from where we are right now to mining and asteroid and hauling it back is higher than the expected returns. The tech (and demand) isn't there yet - but it will be eventually.

>>3127101
That's why I only called it an incentive in my first post.

Even if it never becomes profitable, we may eventually have to mine rare earth minerals from space. Necessity is also a powerful incentive.

There's a lot of auxiliary benefits to space travel. The R&D alone will create entire industries unrelated to space travel.

>>3127161
Oh yeah, I'd buy that.

It will be reflected in a very high market price when that happens, of course. Price determination by free trade is how we communicate "What is important to humans". It's an incredible bit of distributed computing - one of humanity's greatest inventions.

>>3127099
>implying /sci/ would ever do anything but speculate like their hero

>>3127134
>if you only look for the arguments to support a predetermined conclusion, I'm not surprised that you find them.
So this is your modus operandi?

>The cost of going from where we are right now to mining and asteroid and hauling it back is higher than the expected returns.
Not inherently, but every space launch technology must pass the scrutiny of governments that are hostile to private development and application of advanced launch technology, and space mining is such a legal tangle that you probably wouldn't even get to keep any of what you brought back.

>>3127099
>>3127042

I could see us not mining it but stilll selling gold certificates on it. Haha!

>>3127192
I'm not considering political roadblocks. I'm talking about a private space industry attempting the feat, with no more government burden than is typical (taxes, etc).

All the huge delta-v burns this would require at high payloads don't come cheap. Not to mention all the R&D required, which is a huge unknown. The large-scale zero-g vacuum mining tech, for instance, has not been developed.

>>3127199
The gold standard was archaic and indefensible. There's nothing fundamentally wrong with fiat currency - despite what has been done with it from time to time.

>>3127210
>herp derp
You're not considering anything at all. You're making wild guesses from near perfect ignorance and then trying to sound like you did a serious analysis.

>>3127217
But...but gold is so shiny!

>>3127219
WELL IT LOOKS LIKE THE IRONY HAS COME FULL CIRCLE NOW

>>3127228
would you say 360 degrees?

>>3127248
I most certainly could.
And the irony having gone a 360 degrees, it's now time to walk away from the thread.

>>3127228
>>3127248
oh look, a derp laser... the derp is just bouncing back and forth, getting amplified the whole time, and then spewing out onto the board

>>3127260

And having walked away from this thread,
Taperfaperpapercaperchaperpaper

>>3127263
OH NO THE DERP IS SPREADING

ABANDON THREAD

>>3127269
OH SHIT, ITS CORROSIVE DERP, ITS GONNA BREACH THE CONTAINMENT DOME

>>3127281
DERP LEVELS 10% ABOVE REDLINE AND RISING

SHE'S GONNA BLOOOOOOOOOOOW

The most interesting issue for me would be the matter of governance. If we establish colonies who would govern them? National governments on Earth? The UN? Corporations? The colonies themselves?

Its just something to think about.

>>3127217
There's nothing wrong with trading something scarce and highly valued as money.

The problem comes when big, powerful governments step in and start trying to force everyone to use the same thing as that money.

Through history, people usually used diverse commodities as money. I don't mean simple barter, I mean flexible definition of "money". When gold coins were used, coins of silver and copper were usually also used. However, these preferred monies were scarce, and where they were insufficient to support commerce, local currencies would come to be recognized: iron, salt, butter, oilve oil, whiskey.

Designating commodities as money is something people seem to do by instinct.

We should return to that sense, and break away from the statist nonsense of a single designated currency: forever undersupplied, restricting commerce and generating misery. We have all the tools now to instantly and securely trade ownership even of goods that aren't portable. There's no need to restrict ourselves to money that's perpetually insufficient by its very nature (created by loans which always create more debt than money to pay it).

>>3127328
Well yes. That's exactly why we're not doing it.

There would be nothing more disruptive than space colonization. One of the first likely consequences would be people who could launch a nuclear attack without fear of reprisal.

The last time established powers tried large-scale colonization, it threw the world into chaos, and they ended up getting dominated by an alliance of colonies. That is a virtual certainty of space colonization.

>>3127328
Corporations. Ah if life could turn out life eve that would be awesome.

>>3127417
like*

>>3127335
Commodities as money is a stand-in for an economic entity to use until it becomes powerful enough and large enough to sustain a fiat currency, which is the economic ideal.

The problems with commodities as money are many. The largest of the problems can all be seen in the Great Depression, when all the world currencies were still tied to gold. Monetary authorities cannot directly control the supply of gold, which means market forces can rip an economy apart by deflating the money supply, and there's nothing that can be done about it -- except for freeing the money supply from the commodity that it's tied to.

A highly related problem is the fact that the size of the economy is far larger than any basket of commodities you would wish to use as a currency. For example, the value of the US gold reserves (even at today's ridiculous gold prices) is only about 3% of the US GDP. So if you made the dollar directly convertible to gold, not everyone would be able to convert. And when you have a situation like in the 30's, everyone will try to convert, and then you have chaos.

>>3127542
It's not about choosing one commodity, or choosing a basket of commodities, it's about letting people choose whatever is most convenient to them at the moment to use as money.

Right now, we have all of the technology necessary to do instant worldwide trading of gold, oil reserves, shares of a certain coal mine's annual output, stock in a company... anything fungible and valued.

There is certainly a lot more readily tradeable value in things like that than there is in money-on-hand, and more can be created at any time when needed through voluntary contracts.

>>3127030
>>3127042
If anyone ever does that anytime soon, it will probably be done in an unmanned mission.

I'd think solar sails being attached to slowly steer it closer to Earth and slowing it down would be the ideal, but they could also try to crash it into the moon and mine what's left.

Since economically, that would be most viable probably.

>>3127328
Free Mars

>>3127030
>>3127042

But what that doesn't take into account is the balance that the corporations have to maintain to keep the economy in check.
90 trillion injected into the economy in one huge go is only going to fuck everything up, and crash the economy probably irreparably.

>>3128929

Or drop the market price so low that it will be worth close to nothing, thereby making it unprofitable to continue mining.

>>3128914

This.

>>3128929
>>3128950
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aluminium#Production_and_refinement
>Although aluminium is the most abundant metallic element in the Earth's crust, it is never found in free, metallic form, and it was once considered a precious metal more valuable than gold. Napoleon III, Emperor of France, is reputed to have given a banquet where the most honoured guests were given aluminium utensils, while the others made do with gold.[19][20] The Washington Monument was completed, with the 100 ounce (2.8 kg) aluminium capstone being put in place on December 6, 1884, in an elaborate dedication ceremony. It was the largest single piece of aluminium cast at the time, when aluminium was as expensive as silver.[21] Aluminium has been produced in commercial quantities for just over 100 years.

Think of all the things we now do with Aluminium. Now remember most modern electronics and inventions use trace amounts of rare earth metals. Now think, just think, of all the things we could do if those metals crashed in price.

Fuck up the economy. Do it. We will get through it, and then we will have a golden age of abundance, no pun intended.

Our future is the The Culture

There is no escaping this

We will all be communists

>>3129010
Our future is Manna

There is no escaping this

We will all be Australians

>>3129017
Makes me think of stroon and Norstrilia.

>a 1000 movies about mining corps colonizing the space from 1960s to present day
>hay i'm op and i just had this great original thought about precious resources being an incentive for space exploration

op, you're a fucking retard and a simple-minded teenager

>>3129010

But...but the Culture is a post-scarcity technocracy. Isn't it?
Besides, communism isn't that bad, but it needs to be done with enough abundance of natural resources and free trade, otherwise it stagnates.
I like meritocracies anyway.

>>3127058

> humanity = cancer

with that attitude, then no faggot, we will not be colonizing space within your lifetime.

>>3129040
His lifetime has shortened dramatically because of his post. I'll make sure of it.

Bump for interesting thread

>implying having major corporations out there claiming shit for themselves is a good thing

Damn guys, I want off this planet already don't force me to leave the solar system to get away from this shit.

Anyways there's far more value in being able to mine asteroids than in colonizing planets IMO.

>>3129250
>Anyways there's far more value in being able to mine asteroids than in colonizing planets IMO.
Not a zero-sum game, let's do both.

The earth will run out of resources at the humans ungodly exponential growth rate. It is only a matter of time before space mining/ terraforming becomes an absolute necessity.

>>3129254
Except if you're going to start from scratch you might as well start from scratch, I'm much more for artificial planetoids than planet-side colonies.

>>3129259
Humans aren't increasing in number exponentially. At least, not now.

>>3129268
If you wish to create an artificial planetoid from scratch, you must first, invent the universe.

>>3129279
>If you wish to create an artificial planetoid from scratch, you must first, invent the universe.

I see what you did there... but no I was serious, there's also the advantage of being able to move the thing to avoid extinction events.

>>3129299
Extinction events that full-on planetary colonies could not avoid would be:
- Huuuuuuuuge solar flares that our sun doesn't seem to produce
- Gamma ray bursts or supernovas, which off-planet colonies could not survive either since the notification of that event comes perhaps a couple seconds before the event, if at all.
- Our own star supernovaing or red gianting

Also, entire planets could be moved, albeit slowly. Just need a fucking huge solar sail. I'm talking on the order of millions of kilometers.

First a very high speed and efficient sunlight drive needs too be invented/ tested/ and implemented for practical travel across the solar system.

Before this a base would need to be created in orbit (Space elevator) From this sprouts a mining base/ ship yard/ processing center. The base then allows operations to branch out across the solar system. Mining on earth would be abandoned and earth could be used for growing more crops to support a larger population.

One hopes the field of quantum physics finds a way to make faster than light travel possible. Then colonization can begin.

>>3129307
>Also, entire planets could be moved, albeit slowly. Just need a fucking huge solar sail.
But they'd become uninhabitable without the light of a star.

>>3129317
Build shields that completely cover the planet that are very poor conductors of heat to slow the loss of heat. Use geothermal energy of planet to keep everything at a habitable temperature until transference to nearest star/extinction level event has passed.

And besides, it's not like ELEs are immensely frequent.

>>3129279

I beg to differ.

Increased healthcare in developing nations and over all better living conditions world wide will prevent the human population form hitting a carrying capacity (unless there is a major global catastrophe). Therefore humans will continue the exponential growth. L2 biology

>>3129311

Any one

Why the hell has a space elevator not been created?

>>3129342
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/science/article4799369.ece

>>3129342

Oh right all the space shit floating around in orbit. Damn

>>3129344

$80 to $125 million per launch

Compared to something that can just lift materials upwards into orbit and be a foundation for a base of operations.

Rocket power needs to be replaced its like trying to cross the ocean on a horse.

>>3129353
I believe there are several potential modifications that could be applied to a space elevator in order to survive and then repair any damage caused by micrometeorites.

>>3129365

Then why the hell don't you make it your life's ambition to see the space elevator built. It would be a complete investment return with every nation trying to get their payloads in space at a lesser cost than conventional/ unreliable rocket power.

The first steps are

Space Elevator to form an orbiting base of operations.

Than sunlight drive that can traverse the solar system.

Then you have massive mining operations throughout the entire solar system.

>>3129378

*sublight

NOT

sunlight but hey its an idea

>>3129378

And the only thing a crewmember needs to know is that a plasma cutter will be his bestest friend ever.

>>3129378
>Then why the hell don't you make it your life's ambition to see the space elevator built.
My life's ambition is to start up a space-based solar and aerospace company that causes $/per kg to plummet, begin a technocratic nation, and terraform Mars, Venus, Luna and Mercury.

And yes, a space elevator is included in that plan.

>>3129387

Got a website yet?

>>3129417
I have a domain name, not with anything on it however. And I've forgotten how to code HTML properly.
http://www.inurdaes.info/

>>3129385

They had something good going in dead-space until religion/ unethical military biotechnology research fucked it it.

1. Build orbital elevator
2. Build mining ships
3. Secretly outfit ships with mass drivers loaded with asteroid mining junk
4. SPACENOID EARTH HEGEMONY

>>3129426

get Dreamweaver or get some people on here to help you out with this idea. Its a good plan it needs major execution. Who is on your team so far, also would you ever need someone with an eventual Ph.D in computer science/ M.D to do anything for this thing.

>>3129443
>Its a good plan it needs major execution.
For which part specifically?

>Who is on your team so far
Nobody really, since there is no team forming to speak of. When I actually have the ability to start up any one of those things I will likely start recruiting.

>>3129453

Take it you are in college right now

>>3129461
High school.

Science should work toward one thing:

Creating a disease or chemical that causes people to want to work toward the greater good of the species.

All other scientific advancement will follow.

>>3129480
I believe it is called Adderall
Or at least Adderall produces similar effects

>>3129480
twat

Speaking of TRS... if all goes as planned I'll be working in advancing automation sometime in the next couple decades... I'll have to hit you up for some projects then Inurdaes.

bump

Let's not get ahead of ourselves.

Step 1 is to wipe the middle-east and north africa off the map.

We can't go in to space with such a large, batshit insane muslim population.

>>3130142
i am curious why do you hate muslims that much. catholics are more retarded imo.
catholics>muslims>jews>errything else

>>3130165

When was the last time a Catholic blew themselves up?

>>3130172
>>3130172
what was the last time a muslim said earth was 6000 years old?
who left world 1000 years behind in scientific advancement?
who crucified and burned millions of people during the dark ages?

muslims are just retards. catholics are pure evil

>>3130165

Muslims are inherently anti-tech

At least Catholics had some technical advancement even if they raped a ton of kids.

>>3130180 who left the world 1000 years behind
>you actually believe that shitty jpeg graph
>lol


Muslims didn't have the crusades and they're still behind.

u mad

>>3130181
nope
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Muslim_scientists
they were good back then. they are not anti tech now,they are poor and cant use devices because they are stupid.
you can give them money and educate them. but you cant do the same to catholics,they already have enough resources and still retarded

The answer to life, the universe, and muslims: Neural implants

>>3130181
>>3130181
nope
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Muslim_scientists
they were good back then. they are not anti tech now,they are poor and cant use devices because they are stupid.
you can give them money and educate them. but you cant do the same to catholics,they already have enough resources and still retarded

>>3130188
prove me wrong catholic
muslims are just retarded and poor.
catholics are retarded,and rich thats why they do not kill people (actually lebanon,etc. they are still killing people to keep themselves rich).

Judaism FTW
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Jewish_Nobel_laureates

It was Muslims who brought to an end the Arab enlightenment. Math is evil to Allah, apparently.

It's Muslims who believe they're engaged in a cosmic battle between good and evil right now.

Catholics might think the world is going to end and hate gays and abortion but they're nowhere near as destructive.

Don't forget, the burning of apostate and witches by Christians has never been a particularly widespread practice. Not as much as you'd be led to believe by popular culture.

Furthermore, the crusades were driven by revenge not an irrational hatred. They were an attempt to reclaim land taken by Muslims many years prior. Lands that were taken, I might add, through the murder of many many people both Jewish and Christian. The middle east was at one point minority Muslim. You think all those Christians and Jews up and left of their own free will? No, they were driven out.

It's also pertinent to mention that many people don't actually know what Muslims are saying when they pray 5 times a day. The prayer they recite is a reaffirmation of the righteousness of Islam and the notion that Christianity and Judaism are slights against god.

tl;dr Lrn2 fucking history. Islam is by far the most evil and destructive of the religions.

>>3130255

I believe you're talking about born-again Christians, good sir. They are the ones who think the world is going to end.

>>3130255
>Not as much as you'd be led to believe by popular culture.
lol
>>3130255
they pray 5 times a day. they say that their religion is the only true religion.
Doesnt every fucking religion say that?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crusades
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Witch-hunt

>>3130210
Humans FTW.

[insert list of all positive human achievements]

I'm Human, so I have something in common with the people who did all that.

That means I get to take credit and feel good about myself even though I had virtually no influence on any of it.

Right? ...Right?!

>>3130290
oh forgot to add. muslims believe that same god sent judaism,and christianity. But they do believe their holy books are corrupted and changed by people.


What i am saying is,both religions are equally retarded.Christians werent better than Muslims,and still not better than them.

http://www.businessinsider.com/end-of-world-may-21-2011-4
http://www.ebiblefellowship.com/outreach/tracts/may21/

if you are rich,you create bullshit.
if you are poor,you try to kill rich people by doing bullshit

>>3130290

Christians did that 500 years ago, its no longer relevant. Muslims stone women now. Christian fundamentalists criticize gays, muslim fundamentalists hang gays. Christian fundamentalists will preach you will go to hell for adultery, moslems would stone you for adultery.

Also, muslems are not antiscience? Ever heard of islamic creationism? Its christian creationism x 1000! And who burned the Alexandria library because those books were not in agreement with the Quran?

There is a huge financial incentive to colonize space, more people need to know this.

>>3130554
A3 posters, A3 posters everywhere

>>3127058
Actually colonization of space is exactly what we need to get to that point. As resources become more scarce and everything thing is accounted for in terms of ownership. We'll actually get worse not better. You get viable space colonization underway and open up a closed economy to a veritable limitless one you take a lot of strain off the human race. The only thing we need to do is leave the flags at home.

>>3130521


abortion centre bombings
IRA
KKK

all recent Xian terrorists

>>3130142
Wipe NA off the map? Just after a wave of pro-democracy revolutions? WAT

>>3130571
I reckon everyone needs to watch this video.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-8bIQLiKi3g

>>3130572
A fair point. But one of them is far more numerous and violent.

Do Christians riot and kill people when someone makes a sacreligious drawing of Jesus?

>>3130572

>abortion centre bombings

Did the Pope ever endorse those? I don't think so.

>IRA

Not religiously motivated. That was about national/territorial stuff.

>KKK

Not acting in the name of Jesus.

>>3130572
>>3130586
Guys, guys!

It's all about religious extremists! That's all that's a problem here! There may be more Muslim extremists than Christian extremists, but so what? Extremists are the problem, of any kind!

>>3130594

Yes, but given that 90% of religious extremism comes from one particular religion...

>>3130572

KKK - racist, not christian, and also not relevant anymore

IRA, abortion bombings - well, I was not speaking about terrorist attacks, but theocratic harsh laws and support for them. If you want to go that route, there is no way how christians would be worse than muslims, since for every christian terrorist attack I will find 100 muslim terrorist attacks.

>>3130594
One cannot help but notice that some religions seem to encourage extremism more than others. I can't remember the last time a, say, Buddhist, was involved in terrorism.

Space colonization highly increases the probability of the survival of our species, therefore we should allocate vast amounts of resources to it.

>>3130608
Fucking PAKISTAN
And they have fucking NUKES?

>>3130619
Shut up you bigoted intolerant asshole, Islam is a religion of peace. We should build mosques near the ground zero, that definitely doesn't help Islam, what are you talking about!

>>3130615

>>3127064
Its nice to think like this, but anyone "committed to the exploration of space" would have to be fully aware of the mind numbingly staggering profit potential. Its not a toss up or a "maybe if we get it done we're going to recoup our expenses maybe even make some money" Its virtually guaranteed, unless the business angle and patenting is handled extremely a company to achieve viable and cost efficient way to get into space and back carrying large payloads would become the richest corporation in the world in very short period of time

I raped Muhammad and Allah in their tight asses.

>>3130611
The sources you listen to probably don't report it, but it exists.

http://www.asiantribune.com/news/2004/09/14/rise-buddhist-extremism-sri-lanka

>>3130608

Dude those numbers are scary. So much for "extremist minority".

Ummm Catholics are the most libaral of all the christians I have no idea what this retard that says Catholics are worse than muslims is thinking.

Catholics not only give the best educations they are also the most tolerant of other religions among the Christians. Catholics are tolerant of gays (even though they believe they shouldn't have sex) and recently they became lax on their anti birth control saying condoms are fine to prevent the spread of disease and the only reason they are against artificial birth control is because it can affect your hormones and lead to complications, which is why the promote natural birth control. They are also pro health care in the US (even though they where against the funding of abortions). The only thing I can see that might be against what you guys believe that is part of Catholic doctrine is that they are pro-life and they believe in a god. As someone who studied at a Jesuit highschool I can attest to this.

The person saying Catholics are the worst is clearly an uneducated little teenager trying to spread his fucked up belief.

The ones that are psycho are protestants that live in the middle of buttfuck nowhere.

>>3130707
Yes. However, look at Lebanon and Turkey. And all the nations not surveyed, which still have a large quantity of muslims, to boot.

Take things as they really are, instead of the characterizations and stories others tell you (especially media), and you'll avoid being deceived by anyone.

Suppose we cut costs by not sending up expensive mining facilities but rather go for a form of controlled collisions off meteor fragments (with a rather harmless diameter) onto earth somewhere in a deserted location like in the sahara.

Could this be achievable?

Is this a