/sci/ - Science & Math

buy a gaming pc

Whores.

SPEND IT ON SPACE WEAPONRY

I'm going to go with gaming PC and whores.

True that a lot of money was spent on the war.
But I'm sure a lot of money was made off of it as well

I'd go out for a nice steak dinner and hire some whores.

This must be a parody of the supposed panaceas the highschoolers here like to believe in.

booze and hookers. Gonna get lonely up there.

>>3124792

I agree. Space monsters will attack soon. We need to invest in space weaponry and take over non hostile alien planets.

How many prostitutes could I get for 1.2 trilly?

>>3124811
Enough to make your penis drop off 12 billion times from all their STDs

>>3124800
OP here. I'm not naive enough to believe that just throwing 12 metric asstons of money at problems will solve them, but that is A LOT of money.
On more realistic fronts, we could have done quite a bit with this money on problems that CAN simply be paid off.
We could build a nationwide high speed rail network.
We could provide grants for decent public transportation in cities that need it.
We could have renovated the highway system to a higher standard like the Autobahn that would require less upkeep and save money in the long run.
We could build a smarter power grid running on traditional generator technologies- like the superconducting power lines near Boston and NYC.
We could provide adequate labs to every primary and secondary school in the country.

The money needn't be spent on pie-in-the-sky research projects, though that'd be fun, it can be spend on mundane needs.

>>3124800
Panacea? No. But why the fuck did we go to war in the first place? Thousands of American personnel have died, and hundreds of thousands of civilians have died.

All the OP is doing is contrasting the "BAWWWWWW NASA TAKES TOO MUCH MONEYYYYYYY" with the "AMERICA FUCK YEAR LETS KILL US SUM EE-RAK-AYS!"

>>3124832
>pie-in-the-sky
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nIDLC8M4R28

military spending is entirely bullshit though, it's basically a big welfare operation, creating jobs. the 'gold plating' on military purchases is exponentially higher than the 'real' cost

>>3124869
oh and also, really our entire species work output should be being put towards mind uploading and other post-humanism technologies. you know, immortality, apotheosis. unfortunately most people have been systematically degraded to the level of ants (in terms of individual consciousness), and the other 20-30% has 'drank the kool-aid' of the massive omnicide cult known as 'socialism' (and it's derivatives).

I'd buy every man in the world a blowjob. Then I'd get a mansion someplace nice, warm and with lax laws regarding drugs, like Colombia. I'd build a swimming pool the size of a football court, 30 feet deep. Then I'd fill it with cocaine and take daily dips in it. Also, I'd enjoy the "company" of world-class models, actresses, and other unusually hot women while doing so.

Then in the evenings, I'd take my private supersonic jet to some middle-African nation, buy a few negro slaves from the local diamond barons, and I'd let them free in the middle of lion and crocodile infested areas, telling them to run for their lives. And while they're either getting mauled by said lions or crocodiles or whatever the hell the local fauna is, or trying frantically to actually run for their lives, I'd be chasing them in a private helicopter and spraying them with hot lead from my helicopter-mounted minigun.

And afterwards, I'd take my supersonic jet either back to my mansion or to some ridiculously luxurious, secretive and high-class hotel wherein I would partake in nights of hot orgies with various women of my choosing.

>>3124832
Oh yeah, big one that could greatly reduce the costs of food/fuel/etc. would be to provide grants for upgraded and expanded freight rail. Imagine if long-haul trucking was only used for specialized delivery of goods (like hazmat, some custom industrial equipment, etc.) instead of the standard way goods are moved. The highways and roads would last FAR longer if heavy semi-trucks were only used for regional delivery and distribution rather than the primary form of logistics.

We'd save fuel, our infrastructure would last longer, the highways would generally be safer, and the logistical (transportation, fuel, storage) costs for many goods would be reduced.

Then again, a lot of people would bitch along the lines of "took our jerbs!" if this were to happen. It's sad that people can argue enough that their employment remains relevant in the face of obvious obsolesce and inefficiency.

>give all 30 million iraq citizens a $200 gun, $200 worth of ammo and pay them $5,000 to fight Saddam's regime +$5,000 more when they win = $312 billion

>blow $900 billion into building Discovery I and go to the fucking Jupiter!

>>3124909
I know this thread is filled with trolls and a manned mission to Jupiter would be tits, but it's somewhat sad that even the serious suggestions rarely mention improving quality of life.

This worked well for al qaeda in afghanistan in the 80's

>>3124918
It's because most attempts to solve the quality of living through money alone have been failures.

And because of the complexity of the problem, the only way I can think of to really fix it is to create a OA-type archailect that is intelligent and smart enough to do it.

>the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan (including GWOT money) stands at around $1.2 trillion. We could buy 12 ISS-style stations for that price.
We spent 8% of the cost of TWO WARS on a space station that is little more than a satellite that is also a room for humans to stay in?

Sounds like Big Science spending is out of control.

>>3124909

Don't go to fucking Jupiter man, that's where all the space monsters and weird shit comes from.

All the problems in the solar system are always Jupiter's fault.

>>3124956
I know. That's exactly why we need to go there.

If we find some ancient aliens sleeping there and wake them up just for them to step on us, humanity would really find some motivation to get behind science and push.

>>3124956
Fuck you, man. Jupiter is like Earth's big brother that protects it from bullies. Yeah, he's got pretty bad acne, but he's a cool dude, so lay off him. He's not the source of the problems, man.

>>3124944
you're thinking of welfare/aid programs, which are actually very highly evolved, complex weapons of subjugation. necessarily done as so because they need to fly under the radar of the domestic citizenry (would not be supported if their true intent and effects were well known). giving a man a fish does not prohibit him from also learning to fish, but giving a group of men fish somehow does. the magical malady of society.

>>3124955
>we spend 10x more on wars then science!
>is okay with this
What are you smoking?

>>3124966
...of course, if the riled up aliens happen to be Dwellers of the Algebraist fame...

>ominous captcha: without sciences

>>3124977
And what are their "true intents and effects?"

>>3124990
the complete destruction of the domestic economy and utter reliance of the people on your aid. ANY welfare program without a 'weaning' clause (that is actually kept to) will simply produce further need.

>>3125004
4/10, too fat.

>>3124977
OP here. I'm all for aid programs in the form of healthcare, community development grants (if conditions are met), charter schools, etc. but outright welfare expansion is a dubious, at best, method of improving quality of life.

That being said, appropriate infrastructure projects, good urban planning, adequate public transportation, and the economic development of our cities into more than places the suburbanites visit to drink and shop are all good ideas to truly improve quality of life.

One of the biggest looming problems in the US is sprawl. We've built entire communities around cheap oil and now crumbling highways. As the suburbs expand (remember the new construction before the housing bubble? notice how new construction is steadily climbing again?) and become populated, the roads connecting communities become inadequate.

To put it in a realistic perspective: when was the last time you saw a new building or major project in your nearest downtown/city proper area? When was the last time you saw road widening or other major construction (new buildings, new subdivisions) in a suburban area?

>>3124985
That's ONE project that the wars are "ten times as much" as.

War is an unavoidable part of reality. It is one of the core competences of government. You spend what needs to be spent, and you're just glad that you could afford it rather than having to face the alternative.

>>3124859
>>3124832

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jp5OIe3TewI

-Short-life patent subsidies for pharma products
-Global satellite internet network
-Food subsidies that encourage production
-LA to NY high speed rail mainline to encourage offshoot lines.

>>3125013

You also try to avoid war as much as possible.

The Middle Eastern wars were not necessary, and the GWOT, the Patriot Act, TSA, and other results of 9/11 all drain resources for something that is not needed and negatively impacts other areas.

>>3125013
The alternative of Iraq attacking us with its crumbling economy, nonexistent WMD's, and severely weakened military through terrorist cell partners/proxies that never existed in Iraq because they hate its secular Baathist government? I can live with that alternative.

The alternative of an Afghanistan controlled by the competing interests of opium warlords, the Taliban, three major ethnic groups that generally hate one another, and innumerable tribal groups that rarely cooperate? That super-scary threat?

You mean to tell me that we need to invade a country that's known to historians as the "Graveyard of Empires" and stay there to build a cohesive national government based on federalism when any given village hates its next-door neighbors for moronic ethnic reasons. Not only that, we have to help a country with no real economy (outside of opium production) to build the infrastructure necessary for a modern nation and national identity.

Fuck that noise. $1 Billion letters of marque and reprisal against Al-Qaeda's top 10 men. Plus, all the seized funds are to be redistributed among those that ultimately receive the bounties. We'll have our men in 10 minutes flat at a fraction of the cost.

If we do capture terror suspects, they're given a fair civilian trial and imprisoned (if found guilty) under humane conditions. The goodwill bought by this is priceless. We are supposed to be the GOOD GUYS that don't compromise on human rights and our moral code, not the sneaky bastards that creatively interpret the letter of the law to allow for what amount to war crimes.

>>3124985
>War is not profitable
>Science can be
There are far more willing entities to perform science than there are to perform war, thus it is the gov't's purpose to do the things that the private sector won't

>>3125045
>-Food subsidies that encourage production

We already have a subsidy that does the opposite though... we need it repealed and need grants towards the automation of agriculture.

>>3125071
So it's the government's purpose to wage expensive, unnecessary wars for the hell of it?

Regardless of what Keynes said, war isn't profitable. War destroys equipment and pours resources into further destruction. You pay people salaries and benefits to carry out further destruction. Scientists, engineers, technicians, etc. are all employed to design and build things that only produce further destruction.

The payoff? You can rebuild the country you wrecked as an economic parter and potentially exploit their natural resources to pay back war debt and hopefully benefit your country in the process.... if that can't be pulled off in the modern world with the 3rd largest oil reserves on Earth, it simply can't be done.

>>3125057
Bro, there is a trillion dollars worth of lithium there.

>>3125011
i agree, which is why i pointed out >>3124944 was only thinking of welfare programs. it is very possible to increase quality of living by sheer quantity of cash, it's just by focusing on things people can't do themselves, and which will have lasting effects. infrastructure like you say, but really that is just the broadest term.

as i said before, realistically all of humanities resources should be being poured into developing mind uploading and nanotech computronium/foglets. because apotheosis is actually in our reach. has probably already been achieved in some secret military lab, at least the mind uploading part, and some highly advanced nanotech (sadly probably oriented towards being a doomsday weapon...)

>>3125098
See
>>3125096

Let's say we're going to abandon our "benevolent" facade and go full imperialist to get at the mineral reserves, just for fun. This means that we need adequate roads/rail in that mountainous hellhole to move fuel, supplies, equipment, personnel, and raw product to and from the mining sites. This cant be done by helicopter because the masses involved and the fuel costs make this unprofitable.

Alright, so we have to build roads, big deal. Well, it goes beyond that. The employees can't drink rain water. Logistical concerns exist for providing for these workers and the equipment that require at least some infrastructure for water, electricity, plumbing, waste disposal, etc.

Okay, so we build camps. Well, it's not that easy. Your camps are being constantly attacked by various ethnic groups/tribes and the generally pissed off and you can't profitably move ore in military convoys.

Your choices are simple: build a functioning government with adequate infrastructure-- which is unprofitable, or go full imperialist and fuck the country just to get what you want-- which is also unprofitable.

Even if you get the lithium, the net costs of these things are tremendous to the point where the only people getting anything out of this are parasitic financial institutions fueled by government debt and defense contractors. The only people getting anything out of a war of aggression are those that leech off of the taxpayers and the economy at large. It benefits a few that could have just as easily benefited from proper organic economic growth and trade. War is a quick way for a few entities/organizations to hit up the Government ATM. The problem is that these entities/organizations could have benefited just as much if not more from actual economic growth and prosperity at home.

Hayek was right: wars only destroy.

>>3125141
yep, that's the goal. to keep THEM from getting it and make sure WE do. and war is profitable, as a domestic welfare program and economic stimulus.

>>3125243
And what are "THEY" going to do with rare earth metals? Make electric camels?
Jokes aside, why are you so worried about "them" getting "their" hands on this lithium?

>>3125411
I, for one, much like
>>3125243
fear what could happen if powerful (non opium-based) business interests with an inherit interest in stable development of infrastructure and trade developed in Afghanistan. I am positively terrified at the prospects of a gigantic political lobby/force that's best interests lie in trade and stable relations with potential customers like the USA, Japan, China, and the EU. I am also scared shitless of such an economic entity. It's domestic nature would imply that it and its native government must bear the costs of infrastructure and security development, heaven forbid!
Without American treasure, blood, sweat, and effort; all those minerals would just amount to a commodity to be purchased instead of the overpriced spoils of war! Such prospects are preposterously economically efficient for REAL American patriots.

Warmonger status:
[x] Told
[ ] Not Told

Spend all the money on a huge ass mission to Mars

find Prothean ruins

win at life

We could spend the money on not getting trillions of more dollars in debt.

>>3125503
our economic 'debt' is really Chinas 'bird in the bush, and our 'bird in the hand'. we're never going to pay it off, and this is going to be the cause of WWIII.

the future is already written. hopefully, the writers will have leaked enough of their mojo to the people by that point that getting the fuck off the planet will be possible.

>>3125512
So China, with its pitifully small navy, is going to engage in a conflict with the USA, with the largest navy on earth and no signs of losing that position, in order to rectify the debt we won't pay back... okay, fine.

To whom does China sell goods to support its economy? Even if the US had no allies in this war, China still needs to export its shit to make money. China's domestic market isn't large enough to support a full blown war economy. Do you think the democracy movement and powerful business interests built on trade wouldn't scream bloody murder? Everyone is going to cooperate because of a potential crackdown by troops otherwise engaged fighting the US?

Let's say China finds customers to buy exports to support its war efforts... how do they ship it? Infrastructure for over-land trade through Russia, India, Afghanistan, SE Asia, etc are pitifully ill equipped to handle the volume of trade that's necessary. This is all assuming that they can somehow FIND the customers in the midst of a war AND keep up production of consumer and other goods while maintaining war production. Trade by sea is fucked thanks to the US Navy. China is building up strategic reserves of things like petroleum, but even the largest SPR in the world would only last for a couple months at most. China needs to import the raw fuel of war.

A US naval blockade of China would effectively strangle them into either submission, drive them to the bargaining table, or result in so much domestic unrest that a war with us would be the least of their problems.

Compared to your government and economy collapsing, letting even such massive amounts of debt slide seems reasonable.

>>3125554
this relationship is changing. china is 'emerging'. they are become a legit 'developed nation', and may at some point develop the balls to think they can give the USA a run for their money (literally). there's already been plenty of waves made, pointing in exactly that direction.

A city in space.

Only 600 billion dollars or somesuch. Houses 20,000 people and performs scientific experiment and space based construction.

download link related
http://www.mediafire.com/?cyjsmnbi1jt0cbo

>>3124776
No ones gonna loan you money for that crap.

>>3125675
Awesome.

The Chinese leadership is, generally, not stupid. Remember that for our blockade to work, we only have to make the seas dangerous enough that civilian shipping won't pass through it. The threat of mines is enough to drive insurance so high so as to make a voyage unprofitable.

That means the Chinese navy must have complete confidence in its ability to not only break a US blockade but sweep the US Navy from the seas... do you feel lucky? Do ya, punk?

>>3125712
There will never be large-scale military action between America and China. They are economically joined at the hip.

And mines? Goddamn, do you any idea what the use of mines in shipping lanes MEANS in today's political climate?

>>3125732
Hey, I'm responding to the guy that thinks WWIII will be over US debt to China.
>>3125512 this guy, to be specific

I agree with you 100%. Large-scale conflict is positively unthinkable. War would be immensely damaging to the US and world economies, and positively devastating to the Chinese economy.