/sci/ - Science & Math

Yes.
Watch: Penn & Teller: Bullshit! Conspiracy Theories episode.

Why not? the american goverment and various agencies have a long and honored tradition of shitting on and backstabbing the people they are supposed to serve for some ill defined paranoia or other entirely retarded purpose.

Some people don't have a tight grasp on reality.

I don't think it's worth the trouble to correct them. If someone's opinion is total bullshit, you're excused from treating it the way you would something sensible.

>implying there isn't a ton of evidence that's fishy in the government story, including jet fuel melting steel, towers collapsing at free fall speeds, this being the first collapse of its kind and the fact the Empire State Building took a similar collision years ago with only a minor fire and deaths directly from the impact

>>3101643
>mfw no one credible believes any of this

Dude, don't even bother. We know there are a million flavors of retarded.

>>3101643
>implying there is

>>3101643
>implying that a jumbo jet hit the empire state building

it was a slowass ww2 bomber with extremely different fuels, you can not compare the two...my god.

This is why you are ignored. You rant and rave and yet cant be bothered to learn about something simple.

>>3101661
The fuel was gasoline which burns hotter than kerosene. You need to learn yourself some science before you try to stand up for a group of liars.

>>3101652
>>3101653
Nice try, how much are they paying you?

civ eng here

Steel loses half its strength at 600 degrees C

Concrete loses half of its strength at 600 degrees C

Concrete falls apart at 900 degrees C

Steel melts at 1273 degrees C

Highly likely the steel just buckled under load and collapsed from weakness

>>3101670
They don't pay me. I'm just affraid of them.

>>3101670
>how much are they paying you?
And that's the most retarded thing about conspiracy theories.

>>3101616
why not? there have been worse atrocities in human history. The main difference here is the fact that the real damage was caught on live TV

>>3101680
Explain thermite remains found in the rubble, molten lava seen pouring from the corner of one tower and the fact that no tower has ever collapsed in this way despite some being totally consumed by fire.

>>3101670

Oh, to live in your world for a day...

My cool story bro: when I got my drivers license renewed there was a "thruther" ranting about controlled demolition around to the two women at the counter, waving his arms around. He kept going on and on about it, and they tried to humor him, "Well, I guess things aren't always what they seem," etc...

The room broke into laughter as he left.

>>3101643

>including jet fuel melting steel,

It doesn't have to melt it, steel loses more than 50% of its tensile strength at the heat that jet fuel burns.

>towers collapsing at free fall speeds,

They didn't, it was much slower. By about 3 seconds, in fact.

>this being the first collapse of its kind

And?

>and the fact the Empire State Building took a similar collision years ago with only a minor fire and deaths directly from the impact

I'm unfamiliar with the event, but it's not necessarily the same thing. A building can take a blow even from a plane without compromising the central structure, with extreme luck.

>>3101682
It's not to late to save your soul. Tell your story to wikileaks, sure, the people who pay you will come after you and frame you (just look at the made up crimes the people behind Loose Change are accused of) but you'll be saving the world from tyranny.

http://www.nist.gov/public_affairs/factsheet/wtc_qa_082108.cfm

>>3101686
YOU RETARD
NONE OF THAT HAPPENED
EVER
YOU TARD

>>3101694
I might think about it, provided wikileaks pays me more to break my silence than the overlords who want to keep me silent.

>>3101686
>explain a bunch of obscure, non-verifiable anecdotal "evidence" that gets paraded around specifically to suggest a certain conclusion by people with enthusiasm but no credentials, who would find some excuse to disregard even a perfect refutation

omg u cant lol

>>3101686

>Explain thermite remains found in the rubble, molten lava seen pouring from the corner of one tower

Reputable sources please.

>and the fact that no tower has ever collapsed in this way despite some being totally consumed by fire.

No tower this big has collapsed PERIOD.

I'm just wondering what happened to that third building.. I'm not saying there's a huge conspiracy or anything, just that I've never heard any explanation for this. (nor have I sought one)

>President gets blown privately by intern
>Becomes national news, leads to impeachment

>American attack on America, downing the two largest buildings in the country
>Requires years of planning, scapegoats and hundreds of participants
>Kept under wraps

Conspiracy theorist confirmed for master trolls

>>3101697
if you are interested
>>3101709

>>3101718
Clinton wasn't the ruthless head of a crime family with control over empires that straddle the globe.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7_E4N5YIycI
watch all of this. Don't comment until you have watched ALL OF IT

>>3101728
good point, we'd better spread the truth before they find us and disconnect our inte

>>3101718
Also, Nasa is supposedly good enough to fake the moon landing without the Russians noticing it, but forgets that the stars should supposedly be visible on the moon and that it has no atmosphere.

>>3101686
Explain thermite remains ok here we go
Two passenger planes filled with luggage and things in the luggage. untold things in the luggage. any sort of things in the luggage. You could probably find traces of 14" rubber dildos in the rubble too, dosn't mean the towers collapsed because of to many dildos

>>3101734
gtfo

>>3101680
and that caused both of the buldings to cumble like they did?

i have seen videos of messed demos of building. in one of them 3/4 fell off and rolled away from it's footing intact. it even rolled in to the builing close to it. so i have my douths.

also i have seen videos of termite spraying high up from the side of the towers wtf is up with that

>>3101750
yeah nice comeback care to prove them wrong?

Guys hes just trolling
I do have a question for him though, about what proportion of the religion threads do you start and/or troll in? It's quite a masterpiece that people fall for this shit every single time

>>3101686
>Explain thermite remains found in the rubble, molten lava seen pouring from the corner of one tower
>molten lava seen pouring from the corner of one tower
>molten lava
whatthefuckamireading.jpg

>>3101748
Like people just pack thermite on planes *facepalm*

Governments have done similar and worse. That's all I can say- If Soviet Union had a sistem that stood today no one would be telling anyone about the induced starvation in Ukraine. I'm not saying that Arabs were not involved, but come on. If you wanna kill someone don't fly the plane on a Sunday. It was nice of the planners however to minimize casualties. Just goes to show you that they have some dignity.

>>3101765

it was a tuesday morring you homo

Nice to know a good majority of independent thinking people are here. I for one will not buy into the 9/11 myth

>>3101734
>My face when i clicked on a a link to zeitgeist

>>3101765
>If Soviet Union had a sistem that stood today
>If Soviet Union had a sistem
>sistem
confirmed to be a retard and massive closet homosexual

>>3101616
>Is there actually many people who still believe that there was a controlled explosion?

>http://forum.prisonplanet.com
>1,126,930 Posts in 159,510 Topics by 15,318 Members. Latest Member: ImAPatriot

>>3101770
>>3101776
lol picking on insignificant things, shows your incapacity to actually debate with him.

>>3101616
>>3101616

"What the Nazis burn down the reichstag?

are you crazy why would they do that?

you are crazy if you don't think it was a communist jew traitor.

alright now i will just enact the patriot act uhh i mean the enabling act and i swear i will be totally legit and not misuse my powers to silence political opposition"

a story brought to you from nazi germany.

Do I believe that 9/11 was an inside job? fuck no. Do i believe that 9/11 could have potentially been an inside job? Yes the argument "ohh the US government would never do that" is not a valid argument.

what is a valid argument is the thorough investigation of independent experts. Also the very fact that people can go out on the street and talk about 9/11 being an inside job shows that it probably wasn't.

extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence always remember that

>>3101770
Dude, WTF !
I just checked. 9.11. 2001 was a Sunday !
HAHAHAHAHAH !

Good one though. People tend to simply believe it all.

>>3101776
Calling out to post Kennedies hate towards commies symptom present in the US to this day.

Look Amerifags. I don't mind you having so many troubles believing reason over sheep mentality but the thing is that if I am not from the US I don't have such a hard time accepting how your government is screwing you over because that doesn't threaten my well being.
O and some of you are just trying to spred lies about that hoping no one will check up on it.

I do think there might have been a controlled explosion after the collision. I don't really care though, it's not exactly a "conspiracy" to safely remove an unstable structure and I don't care if I'm wrong.

So... am I?

>>3101795
Any arguments?

>>3101772

Most people are too smart for that bullshit, it's just that idiots like to scream really loud. One thing gets debunked so they move on to another one.

Where's that guy who insisted bin Laden was still alive?

>>3101783
>>3101783
>confirmed troll it was a tuesday.

>>3101802
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=srNG_Q7uN74

>>3101783
Are you sure it was on a sunday? I remember watching it live on tv right after I returned home from work (worked nights) and I dont remember if I worked sundays...in fact I am pretty sure that was my only day off at the time.

>>3101783
Big endian ISO international date of attack was 2001-09-11. Little endian UK date of attack 11/09/01. Fucked up US date of attack was 09/11/01. All were Tuesdays.

99% sure you're trolling, but this took 40 seconds to type so what the Hell.

The three stages to a truth: first it is ridiculed, then it is violently opposed (see the crimes truth seekers have been framed with), finally, it is accepted. We in the truth community are just ahead of the curve with knowledge.

>>3101818
It was a terrorist attack. Stop being so paranoid.

>>3101823
I absolutely agree with you, it was terrorism, perpetrated by the people sworn to protect us for money and greed and oil.

9th November 2001 was a Friday. Everybody in this thread was trolled.

>>3101818
>The three stages to a truth: first it is ridiculed, then it is violently opposed (see the crimes truth seekers have been framed with), finally, it is accepted.

The idiot's mantra...

Why don't you compare yourself to christ while you're at it?

>>3101812
Just to quickly say... flash memory does not work. I'm sorry to say that might not be what happened

>>3101812
It was definitelly a Sundy. Stop watching reruns.

>>3101829
Rebecca Black is part of Al-qaeda. Laughing at us.

>>3101830
They said the same thing about the earth revolving around the sun, the earth being spherical and space travel. In the Soviet Union, people resisted the idea of their government being evil for decades before they rebelled. I can't force you to believe but when the time comes you should choose your side carefully.

Anyone who doesn't know what knocked Byulding 7 down is a conspiracy theorist.

The three stages of truth: article submission, peer review, publication.

>>3101763
Ok let me bring it down a notch.
Thermite is traditionally aluminum (No idea where
that would be on a plane its not like its made form it or anything) and iron oxide
or rust as it is more commonly known (Surely no one would take a rusty thing on a plane)

>>3101810
Oh Alex, how I hate you.

>>3101853
Don't get me started on that, nothing touched building 7 and the BBC forgot to follow the script (yes, the major news networks knew exactly what was going to happen, how do you explain them getting to the scene so quickly?) and reported the 'collapse' before it even happened.

>>3101849

Yeah, here's the problem: just because an idea isn't widely accepted doesn't mean it's correct. Those situations are far more rare than people simply being wrong and/or stupid.

Lots of people doubted the world would end yesterday. Did it?

>>3101818
The four stages of a nonsensical claim: First, it is ridiculed, then its erroneousness is calmly explained to the proponent, then the proponent is ridiculed for stubbornly insisting on its validity, then finally, every sensible person loses interest and the stubborn proponent feels like a martyr.

>>3101827
>us
Save it. Most people on this planet aren’t Americans. This site is an international site hosted in America, with an international userbase. You’re like one of those retards who starts talking about “our society” or “our country” or “the government” on the Internet, you fucking tool.

>perpetrated by the people sworn to protect us for money and greed and oil
No. Honestly, arguing with people like you is a waste of time.

>>3101866


>Massive building falls down next to a smaller building.
>Nope, I'm sure nothing touched it.
>Also, aliens were behind 9/11, obviously.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Occam%27s_razor
In other words "The simplist explination is usualy the most correct one"
i'm fairly sure the simplest explanation is
"People flew planes into two towers. Towers fell down because who builds a tower to take a jet to the face?"

>>3101849
>I can't force you to believe
Or convince him with evidence.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/September_11_attacks
it was a Tuesday. no more trolling.

The Most Toxic Value System in the World - http://www.uwgb.edu/DutchS/PSEUDOSC/TOXICVAL.HTM
The Problem With Pacifism - http://www.uwgb.edu/DutchS/PSEUDOSC/ProblemWithPacifism.HTM
Civil Liberties and the Right to Know - http://www.uwgb.edu/DutchS/PSEUDOSC/CivRts9-11-01.htm
Spectacularly Stupid Commentaries on September 11, 2001 - http://www.uwgb.edu/DutchS/PSEUDOSC/Stupid9-11-01.htm
Are Al-Qaida Prisoners of War? - http://www.uwgb.edu/DutchS/PSEUDOSC/POW.HTM
Human Rights: Off the Rails? - http://www.uwgb.edu/DutchS/PSEUDOSC/HROffRails.HTM
Dumb Commentaries on the Iraq War - http://www.uwgb.edu/DutchS/PSEUDOSC/DumbIraq.HTM
Treason of the Intellectuals, Book III - http://www.uwgb.edu/DutchS/PSEUDOSC/TreasonV3.HTM
Nutty 9-11 Physics - http://www.uwgb.edu/DutchS/PSEUDOSC/911NutPhysics.HTM
Really Nutty 9-11 Physics - http://www.uwgb.edu/DutchS/PSEUDOSC/911NutPhysics0.HTM
Vaporizing the World Trade Center - http://www.uwgb.edu/DutchS/PSEUDOSC/911NutPhysics1.HTM

>>3101616
Op, there are some people in this crazy group who genuinely believe there were "no planes" and it was just a controlled demolition.

they believe all footage showing the planes are CGI.

it was an inside job.

in other news....
http://www.genesis-creation-proof.com/Earth-is-stationary.html

>>3101911
Yeah, there's a documentary (I think it's called "September Clues") that's all about this idea of the planes having been holographic 3D projections in real life, and CGI on the news reports. It's so retarded, it's not even funny.

You can make a rough approximation of thermite with rust and aluminum powder. With all that shit there, I'm not surprised that there might have been some of that in there.

>>3101899
>All three World Trade Towers fell faster over the first half of the collapse than physics allows by free fall. That meant they had to have an assist, e.g. an explosive push from pre-planted demolition charges, not just gravity pulling them down. The maximum collapse for free fall is computed by
>distance = g t
>where g is the acceleration due to gravity 32 feet per second per second, and t is time in seconds. In other words, free fall collapse should start out slowly and accelerate faster and faster for the big finale.

>mfw distance = g t

>>3101783

It was a Tuesday, you sniveling preteen fuckhead. We were alive back then, you were barely a cum stain.

>>3102020
>MFW you checked

It was indeed done by the government. The USA is totally capable of preventing such an attack, but they chose not to. The passenger airplanes could have been intercepted by fighter jets.

>>3102053
No I didn't check, I have a memory of the plans I had that day and where I was. I don't have to check to REMEMBER it was a tuesday.

I wasn't shitting in my diapers like you at the time.

http://www.popularmechanics.com/technology/military/news/1227842

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=stVmEmJ666M

>>3102080
Plans you say?

>>3102055
NORAD was set up for intercepting incoming airplanes crossing into US airspace. They were not equipped for picking out one of the thousands of domestic flights that is off its flight plan and turned off its transponder.

>>3102133
And AlQaida has been monitored for like, ever. And then erryone had to get involved in finding one BinLaden.

>>3102133
I believe that they were. The US has the most sophisticated weapons/defence systems in the world.

>>3102139
You can believe they operate the Death Star if you like.

>>3102133
We have that in former Yugoslavia. I just don't know if it was here before 9.11.

>>3102128
yeah, i was going out for sushi with some lesbians. It was going to be a lot of fun.

needless to say I was pissed when I saw the news.

How was your mama's oversized brown nipples that morning? I bet it was hard to suckle while smelling her crusty toes at the same time.

>>3102159
Sadly I don't know how that looks and you sir are going to have to find some other company to disguss such matters.
Anyways, lesbian sushi.....seems legit. Erryone is usually allways hyped up about getting together with lesbians for sushi. I can understeand you frustration and how much you had to lose because of the attacks.
whydontyouhaveaseatoverthere.jpg

>>3102139
dumbass, everyone dropped the ball. When they said "Someone hijacked planes, scramble fighter jets ASAP" to anyone incharge, the response was "Is this a test?"

The united states had a more than adequate system to prevent all of this, but no one knew what to do when it counted.

>>3102163
I got to go home from work. My boss was pissed, but everyone was letting their employees go home, so he had to too. (We were in a big building in philadelphia.)

The Sunday before, I was kayaking around Manhattan. Here's one of my pics of the WTC from 2 days before it went down.

>>3102174
If no one knew what to do, that was hardly an adequate system.

>>3101952
Wow. You are a fucking idiot.

That was a quote in the Nutty 9/11 Physics article. The author then immediately says:
>This is just plain weird. Whether a building falls by deliberate demolition or catastrophic failure, the collapse will be governed by gravity. Even if you used a teleporter to magically make several stories vanish, the part above would only fall as fast as gravity would accelerate it. Only if there was some kind of thruster pushing the building down could it fall faster. Why install a useless Rube Goldberg device? Once the building begins to collapse, who needs anything to accelerate it? Gravity has a pretty reliable record of pulling things down. And where's the evidence for faster than free fall collapse?

But why read what an expert/university professor actually has to say when you can believe that 9/11 was some kind of inside job for half the effort?

>>3102181
exactly, they had all of the tools and none of the competence in place to make it work.

that's what happens when you have a dynastic spoiled brat put in power, with no interest in running government nor any interest in competence or accountability for people doing their jobs in said government.

>>3102182
I assumed that was some kind of spoof. That was supposed to be serious?

>>3102201
Steven Dutch is a professor of Natural and Applied Sciences at The University of Wisconsin in Green Bay, Wisconsin.

Professor Dutch writes articles on pseudoscience and irrationalism.

When something is indented, like the text you quoted, it is a quote. He wasn’t saying that. He was quoting that from a “9/11 WAS A SETUP GUYS”fag.

ITT: Butthurt government workers

who fucking cares /sci/ exists to support authority over evidence

>>3102212
I knew it was a quote. But was whoever originally wrote actually serious about it? It's a rhetorical question; I'm not sure I really want to know.

http://www .scientistsfor911truth. org/ <--- Many many scientists from around the world and at top universities such as Cambridge believe it was a cover up the events of 9/11 cant be explained by what has been put forward by the US gov. They can't ALL be stupid or insane.

>>3102256
The way you were greentexting, it looked like you were calling Prof. Dutch a troll. He ain’t. He is properly informed.

The person Dutch was quoting is not a troll, AFAIK. He is called Roedy Green. He wrote the pseudoscience book, How You Know 9-11 Was an Inside Job. Dutch was debunking parts of that. Unless you are living under a rock, you know that some people actually need this actively debunked to understand why it is crap.

>>3102258
My prediction 30% stupid 30% madeup 30% listed without knowledge/conscent 10% noy really scientists

>>3101686
okay then, thermite=aluminium oxide (i assume you're talking about thermite remains) and iron. now, was there any aluminium involved? maybe a nice big plane shaped bit of it? and this was a steel framed building collapsing, remember. as for the lava, 1 - pics or it didn't happen. 2 - burning jet fuel pouring out will look kinda like lava from a distance. so will molten aluminium, and you can melt aluminium with a bloddy wood fire. also, 9/11 wasn't the first. there was a factory (in the phillipines IIRC) that burned down in 1993 and collapsed. a modern, steel framed building collapsing due to fire. one that wasn't a skyscraper, no less. i'm feeling lazy, so if you want me to dig up the sauce then you can provide a sauce for the thermite & lava first.
>>3101860
fucking 5-star post, nigga
>>3101866
i don't imagine the bbc would be very familiar with the specific geography of new york. typos on teleprompters happen.
>>3101952
>32 feet per second per second
da fuck?

>>3102288
Engineers. Engineers everywhere.

i dont know if it was a controlled demolition or not.
all i know is the governments been planning it for years.

This is another Operation northwood imo. Fucking USA dragging the rest of us with it. Fight your own wars.

*are there

>>3102344
Not our problem. You idiots should learn to be like France unlike the rest of you who are easily controlled by our government. I'm glad our "allies" die for stupid shit. You're all dumbasses.

Challenger Disaster investigation: $50 million
Clinton/Lewinsky investigation: $40 million
Barry Bonds Steroid investigation: $100 million

Official 9/11 investigation: $14 million

>>3102258
>They can't ALL be stupid or insane.
Yeah, but they could be just plain *wrong*.

I once read that the WTC was destroyed by molecular disassociation technology used by weapons satellites in space, and that the nature of the process is the reason why it's taking so much time to rebuild.

I love some of the arguments

>there was a huge sound, like a secondary explosion

No shit, the thing was breaking down a moment from collapsing.

or

>there was never an incident like that

Yeah, that's why it was so huge

>>3102370
>They can't ALL be stupid or insane.
You'd be surprised.

It was a controlled demolition. A false flag attack orchestrated by Mossad and covered up in the US government. Just like a thousand other false flag attacks.

Deal with it.

http://whatreallyhappened.com/WRHARTICLES/fiveisraelis.html

as if the official story can't be blown out of the water without even touching the topic of the building collapses

>>3102383
The ones that make me rage are the eyewitness quotes, "and then I heard a big explosion like a bomb going off."

As if that is evidence suggestive that it was an actual bomb.

>>3102387
It's a false dichotomy either way. You don't have to be stupid or insane to have an uninformed opinion on something outside your actual area of expertise.

Of course they *could* be stupid or insane. I'm not dismissing this as a possibility.

Ok, for a minute can we just take a moment to think about the pentagon and the plane that crashed in a field ? Have you seen the pictures of the crash sites ?? this must raise questions.

The US government just declassified that they staged golf of tomkin. You'd have to be a retard to believe the government wouldn't stage attacks to start wars.

>>3102404
Many smart people have inane opinions outside their field of expertise.

>>3102423
No one says they wouldn't. People say that *this* incident wasn't staged.

Dawkins is a fucking legend !

>>3102439

in biology yes
in philosophy and metaphysics no.

>>3102423
>tomkin

as inclined as I would be to believe you, I find your godawful spelling a deterrent to doing so.

please show the evidence against it being a controlled demolition.

>>3102687

I dunno you could maybe like watch planes fly into it or something

http://www.scholarsfor911truth.org/

it was a demolition, end of story.

>>3102418

Plane crashed into Pentagon and went through most of it. Shanksville plane crash into field is a text-book case since it happened in 1987....http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ff7h7Ll8Dl4

Alex Jones is a freakin' retard and a liar.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_9uB64ghcq8

this is long but it is the most comprehensive investigation of the terrorists and the security nets' actions leading up to september 11 2001

it is well worth the time

>>3102509
what has dawkins done that's so groundbreakingly amazing for the field of biology? how many papers has he even published? i'm fairly sure the only relevance he has is being the atheist jesus christ.

>>3102702
yeah except that still doesn't explain how all THREE buildings fell at free fall speeds...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PNK1V6S2cbo

The BBC news announces the WTC 7 has fallen
10 minutes before it does. It is visible in the background.

oops

>>3102724
ffs yes they demo'd building number 3 they fucking admited it due to damage for the twin towers falling down.

>>3101634
>>3101634
>>3101634

GO FUCK YOURSELF YOU PIECE OF SHIT NIGGER!!!!!!!!!!!!

I WISH YOU WOULD DIE YOU FUCKIN PIECE OF SHIT.

>>3102724
Why wouldn't they fall at free-fall speeds?

>>3102733
and you don't find it just a little odd that it was all ready to go prior to it needing to be demolished?

>>3102729
And they accidentally announced alfred nobels death a decade too soon

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zv7BImVvEyk

explanation of how building 7 (wtc 7) and by extension perhaps other buildings would look if destroyed by controlled demolition

perhaps all the central supports of wtc all disintegrated universally at the same time.
but it looks like it was knocked down

>>3102750
you should be asking "why would they?" planes flying into the building wouldnt damage the structural integrity of the entire building.

honestly, im just appalled that people on /sci/ of all places buy the official story.

>>3102772
You don't need to damage an entire building to destabilize it enough to ensure a collapse. Besides, it wasn't the impact, so much as the fire, that weakened the towers.

>>3102714
>The book [The Selfish Gene]...caused "a silent and almost immediate revolution in biology.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Selfish_gene#CITEREFGrafen_.26_Ridley

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_publications_by_Richard_Dawkins#Academic_papers

>>3102753
sure i'am. also i love how every one thinks the only why to bring a buliding down during a demo is to use high explosives. they the cheapest way to do it. they would'nt cheap out they did not want to get caught.

>>3102787
the first time in recorded history a building collapsed from a fire, oh wait first three times.

>>3102786
nah, we don't all buy it. some of us just realized how colossal a task changing minds can be, it's on the same level as christians vs atheists

>>3102804
Probably more similar to scientists vs. creationists.

>>3102795
there are countless reports of explosions heard. and video, and audio. it was a demo, nuff said.

>>3102800

Most building fires don't involve jet fuel, or, you know, being HIT BY A JET.

>>3102800
http://www.debunking911.com/firsttime.htm

>>3102800
yes now ask your self way, fuck face. come on really think about it now.......................give up?

it becouse FUCKING JET LINERS DID NOT FLY INTO THE BULIDINGS AND DESTROY THE WATER SYSTEM.

>>3102786
>honestly, im just appalled that people on /sci/ of all places buy the official story.

Why, because the rest of /sci/ is stupid trolling and bullshit conspiracy theories and pseudoscience?

People are constantly making sense of the world around them.

When an event occures that falls outside of the world they have created, such as a terrorist attack, they need reconsile this.

They do so by reshaping the event to fit in to their world.

In the conspiracy world, the US government is the only entity capable of doing outrageous things within the US. So when we were attacked, the only explination they were able to phathom is that the US government was the thing that attacked us.

It is a well studied and well understood form of retardation.

>>3102810
and jet fuel would have been burnt off in the first few seconds of impact, and it doesnt burn hot enough to melt steel, and examiners found thermite in the rubble, not just thermite either, nano-thermite.

>>3101899
>>3101899
Just highlighting that an actual expert discusses 9/11 here. Of course, those of you who are here to circlejerk will ignore this or throw shit still, so I guess only a few lurkers will read this.

>>3102818
not when there is physical evidence for such a scenario.

>>3102822
Maybe you should read the thread, instead of rehashing arguments that have already been debunked. You don't have to melt a material to weaken it.

>>3102818
true dat

>>3102818
You're definitely on the right track. The US government is the most powerful organization in the world by far. If a concentrated effort by a relatively small group of people with a couple million dollars is enough to do what happened on 9/11, that implies that the world is one of chaos and no one has control. The defense mechanism is obviously to enter into a delusion where there IS control, and the US government is the all-powerful god. It's disturbing, but not as disturbing as a world of chaos where no one is in control.

>>3102868
There are degrees of control. A rational person recognizes that there is no such thing as complete security.

But we're not dealing with rational people.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Able_Danger

According to statements by Lt. Col. Anthony Shaffer and those of four others, Able Danger had identified the September 11, 2001, attacks leader Mohamed Atta, and three of the 9/11 plot's other 19 hijackers, as possible members of an al Qaeda cell linked to the 1993 World Trade Center bombing. This theory was heavily investigated and researched by Republican Representative Curt Weldon, vice chairman of the House Armed Services and House Homeland Security committees. In December 2006, an investigation by the US Senate Intelligence Committee concluded that those assertions could not be confirmed.

>>3102868
That is pretty deep but its well established that the pentagon and the military knew of the planning of the September 11th attacks and they were tracking several of the hijackers right up to the event.
They were also running a war game on Sept. 11th with the exact same specifications of the attack in progress.
Then, Dick Cheney who was in charge of NORAD on that day did not follow the protocol of shooting down the planes being used to attack US civilians and buildings.
(though it may be the case that other flights were shot down on that day.. just not the ones that hit WTC 1 and 2)

Watch this video if you would like more information based on statements of people in the pentagon and news sources tracking terrorists within the US
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_9uB64ghcq8

>>3102938
Okay, first of all, i would like a reputable source on all of those claims, plzkthx.

Second, Donald Rumsfled didn't shoot down civilian aircraft over a crowded metropolis because he wasn't sure where it was going, and there was still a chance of the plane being retaken by passengers. The casualties and risks of the plane hitting a military target (such as the pentagon... which it did) are much lower than shooting the plane down over DC, where debris could have killed hundreds, if not thousands more.

Please, think before you make outrageous claims. There is most likely a simpler explanation.

>>3102967
s/Donald Rumsfled/Dick Cheney, or whoever you want to claim was in charge of the most perfectly coordinated government operation in history whose sole point was to fuck itself up.

SAUDI VISA EXPRESS PROGRAM
started June 2001
Michael Trane blew the whistle and stated that State Department officials were issuing Visas to terrorists which he KNEW WERE TERRORISTS but he was being gagged

people who tend to believe in conspiracies have paranoid personalities. You really can't reason with them.

>>3102938 norad

Im not sure you understand how domestic flight defense works

>>3102938
Everything in that post is a gross distortion. I don't have the energy to correct it all.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Niaz_Khan

Niaz Khan is a citizen of the United Kingdom, born in Pakistan, who asserts he defected from al Qaeda in 2000, and warned the FBI of al Qaeda's plans to attack civilian targets in the United States.[1][2][3] Khan described growing disillusioned with his gambling debts and his job as a waiter. He describes being recruited to travel to Pakistan for training for jihad, outside a London gambling establishment, by a recruiter who offered to pay off his gambling debts.
He describes being trained just outside Lahore in how to hijack planes.[3] His trainers had mockups of Boeing aircraft for the training. He was then to travel to New York City, in April 2000, to join a cell intending to attack civilian targets in the USA.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_9uB64ghcq8
core of corruption documentary good source

>>3103013
You may not know this, but here's the thing: "they are going to hijack planes and attack the US" is not NEARLY specific enough for the US to pin down a single attack.

Dozens of plotted terrorist attacks in the US are stopped every year. EVERY FUCKING YEAR. Before they even reach a public stage. You have no idea how much goes on behind the scenes.

actually, since americans several times "attacked" themselves just to get an excuse to enter a war where they weren't called, i think they deserved it.

>>3102979
>>3102995
>>3103001
>>3103004

go 'hed watch the documentary. I ain't even mad.

You think the US gov. didn't know about sept. 11th plots and then
give the hijackers fast lane Visas and
keep the hijackers insulated from other security people Mossad.. the FBI.. citizens identifying the threat..

then

>>3101643
>and the fact the Empire State Building took a similar collision years ago with only a minor fire and deaths directly from the impact
Dipshit. Heavy-as-fuck reinforced-concrete tower =/= flimsy steel&glass building that sways 10x as much in the wind.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_9uB64ghcq8

the documentary that may explain a thing or two:
CORE OF CORRUPTION

>>3103059
So, you are unable to express the ideas when we dissect them. Why should the "source" for your information do any better?

You have been duped by fancy editing, empty questions designed to be spooky, and terrible strawman arguments.

>>3103059
Are you a teachable youngfag, or have you actually lived through 10 years of this retardation?

>>3101643
>implying there isn't a ton of evidence that's fishy in the government story, including jet fuel melting steel, towers collapsing at free fall speeds, this being the first collapse of its kind and the fact the Empire State Building took a similar collision years ago with only a minor fire and deaths directly from the impact

>jet fuel melting steel.
This again? It wasn't melted. But, it was weakened. 200 million pounds pressing down on steel that is, at best, at half strength (even lower limits if it deforms and the structure isnt in its optimum shape anymore)

>collapsing at free fall speeds.
Except no it wasnt. Look at the debris falling OUTSIDE of the tower, notice how it is falling faster. It is falling quickly, yes, but thats because there is 200 million pounds crashing down. That tends to keep fucking falling once it stops.

>first collapse of its kind.
No skyscraper before of this kind has ever been attacked, destroyed, or demolished. It's difficult to predict what it would look like, whether by experts or by uninformed dipshits like you.

>empire state building took a similar collision
That collision was vastly different.
*Different type of building construction
*plane about 20% smaller (both weight and impact area are effected)
*plane moving much slower
*plane had ejected fuel in anticipation of a crash landing to reduce risk

E=1/2*m*V^2. That is a shitload less energy if it is 20% lighter, and going (at best) 2/3rds the speed of the larger planes.

Any more brain busters, faggot?

>>3103063
What the B-25?

B-25 does not equal 767-200.

>>>it was a sunday derp.
No. It was a Tuesday. A business day. Were you on your way to church, or sleeping in because it was a weekend? No. Were you on your way to college, work...Egypt (me)? Yes.

It happened, get over it. You'll hear the truth before you die, in 2061, when the information gets declassified. Until then...smoke a fat doobie and STFU.

>>3103114
>>3103096

Why U mad tho?

Can't deal?
doth the hurt of thine butt flow thru thine soul?

can't imagine a superpower with the ambition to remove
>Saddam
who they had initially funded to kill the last C.E.O of Iraq
ANND
>The Taliban
a ridiculously backwards group who banned music and soccer and hindi films?

Soooo.. in your world the Bush/ Cheney administration doesn't have the wherewithal or experience to figure out that they've issued special fast lane passports to the hijackers
who are flagged as terrorists?

In all likelihood the collapse of the world trade centres was the work of these conveniently branded terrorists and was caused by the jet impact and subsequent fires.

However, the way the US capitalised on this to go to an illegal war was impressive. There seems to be something of a false dichotomy appearing here: either a blinded sheep or a conspiracy nut-job.

>is there actually many people who still believe that there was a controlled explosion?
there are still people who think that there wasn't?
lrn2 grammar

/r/ing that thing where if you multiply X (some shit about 9/11) By Y (Some other shit) You get some other shit About 9/11

i was at school on 9/11 you morons

>>3103096
>>3103114

You know what?
forget the imaginary sword fight.
Im not afraid to answer any question you might have.
I don't know everything in the world. I am not afraid to be wrong.

Leave the aspersions aside.

Did the Pentagon know that the 9/11 attackers were coming and who they were?

In my opinion. (with a large body of intelligence backing it up) Yes they did.

>>3103220
>Did the Pentagon know that the 9/11 attackers were coming and who they were?
The military intelligence community, CIA, and NSA were all aware of increased terrorist chatter, and aware that an al qeada attack would happen somewhere in the world on 9/11. The CIA also knew that al qaeda assassinated Ahmad Shah Massoud, the leader of the opposition to the Taliban in Afghanistan on 9/9. There was a small group in the CIA that expected a domestic airplane attack, but that thinking was not widespread thinking. There was also a very isolated group in the CIA tracking some of the terrorists in the US, but they had a firewall, and did not share that information with the FBI. (One of the things the patriot act changed)

I'm happy to answer questions about what happened, but I don't have the patience to debunk bullshit claims for the 1000th time.

>>3103280
>I don't have the patience to debunk bullshit claims for the 1000th time.

You can't trump faith with logic. Don't bother. There are still people who believe that Obama is muslim or that vaccines cause autism or that HIV doesn't cause AIDS, and you can't convince them otherwise. Fuck em.

>>3103280
>>3103312

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tGgq4S5vgk4

Please consider this video gentlemen.
And I don't like the source either. But facts and documents help. I don't believe that this shows some ironclad proof of a particular thing. Just consider it.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WfW3IwyXhPs&feature=related

Dick Cheney commandeers NORAD
"THE MUSICAL"

NORAD war games mirroring the attacks going on on Sept. 11th and the attacks IRL (in real life) happen at the same time.

>>3103367
>norad

not their area

>>3103367
>>3103392
DON'T WATCH THIS SHIT. This shit is designed to misrepresent facts in such a way to make it intriguing. That's fine for getting gullible viewers. It's not good if you give a fuck about truth. It is purposely designed to make normal things seem sinister.

What am I seeing here
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OmuzyWC60eE

>>3103464
likely aluminum from the plane

>>3103464
Something melted and spilling out.

It could be plastic, soft metals (aluminum melts at very low temperatures relative to other metals), or something else entirely--possibly a cleaning solution mixture from some janitorial work.

Thermite is extremely unlikely. First of all, there is no way to get up there and plant it, and there's no way it was pre-planted and survived the subsequent fires without damage.

>>3103501
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LG6i6WBHM3U

>>3103511
Just because it looks like thermite, doesn't mean it is thermite. Many other things look like thermite. For instance, molten aluminum.

Also, the support columns for the world trade center were all near the center of the building. why is it slowly pouring out? The guy said it should "blasting out". Thats a slow pour.

Third: "iron oxide" remanents? You mean fucking RUST? OH MY GOD RUST PROVES THERMITE. No. different sources.

He also talks about the "low risk of WTC 7 collapsing from fire". Good thing it had over a dozen damaged stories with structural collapse.

That video is even worse than Loose Change and Loose change is fucking retarded.

>>3103534
Try watching the movie before saying its bullshit.

Unless of course you are a time traveler, in which case sorry for questioning you.

>>3103511
You can't cut vertical columns with thermite. It's not even possible.

>>3103548
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LNOM_U5UM6Q

>>3103546
I watched the relevant first half about the supposed "thermite evidence".

It pleasantly ignores that there are multiple other sources of iron or aluminum oxides, besides thermite. Such as pigments, chemical catalysts (such as those used in cleaning supplies and other office supplies, and thermal paste), cleanup cutting utensils, and (surprise) plane construction materials.

Ignoring all (significantly more likely) options to push forward one that only slightly fits the description? That's just dumb.

It's molten aluminum. Iron and aluminum Oxide sediments are from other, very common sources.

"microspheres" being unique to thermite is factually incorrect.

it has mainly to do with the theorist's egos.

if you take an average post on ats/prisonplanet as an example, you'll see how some person posts that something is a conspiracy, and a bunch of other people - "sheep" if you will - all agree and say how that the first poster just verifies their beliefs.

it is cowardly egotistical circle jerking at its finest.
you get a bunch of people that think they are "awake" all coming together and discussing/validating each other's theories from a peer standpoint and talking about how "awake" they are.
and with all this newly discovered "information" that validates their theories, they don't do anything..... they just sit around circle jerking over how they "know" something that the general public (whom they refer to as "sheep") doesn't know

>tl;dr: they'd rather persist in an egotistical delusion than come to reality and admit they are wrong.

>>3103557
Looks like he cut a vertical piece vertically: not a vertical piece horizontally.

And again, looks like the sparks, debris, and etc from the cut stay very close to the thermite itself.

Why, if it even was thermite (its not) would they be cutting anything on the outside window of the building when all major support beams are near the center of the building?

Its melted aluminum, or plastic, or other debris. Even if it was thermite, there's no logical explanation for it being out there.

>>3103586
9:50

>>3103574
Are you one of those people who makes the quotation marks with their fingers while they talk? Just curious.

Yeah, conspiracy theorists are insane. My friend loves conspiracies and I can watch his mental boner pop when he starts talking about the latest theory he's heard about. I'll admit, it's kind of alluring to fantasize ulterior motives for everything. It tickles that little part of the brain that loves to see and make connections.

Just a few thoughts to consider:

1) The larger, more ridiculous a conspiracy, the more likely it will be believed.

2) Try and name a government (people or person in power) during history that was not corrupted.

>>3103605
A small notch in the I beam. and he used a lot.

Whats more likely: That tiny bit of a cut causing a massive collapse, or the scientifically proven loss of strength when steel beams are heated to temperatures reached?

And AGAIN you refuse to acknowledge that the cutting debris stays close to the cut itself, and there is no reason why any cuts would be being made near the windows and corner of the building.

>>3103617
I have not refused to acknowledge anything at all, in fact I haven't even said anything I've just pointed you in the right direction.

>>3103557
They're cutting horizontal beams. Thermite quickly melts, and gravity pulls it down, melting whatever is beneath them. So you can cut something under the thermite lying horizontally, but you can't cut a vertical beam. The WTC failed because verticle beams were first severed by the plane (both in the core and outer structure) and then additional heat weakening made the remaining vertical beams holding up the weight of the upper part of the building give way. They gave way where the planes hit, because that's where you had a reduced number of core beams left, and their heat shielding blown off by the initial explosion.

>>3103617
oh, he's also testing on old, rusted out, shitty thin I-beams way smaller than those used to hold up skyscrapers.

So there's that. His "experiments" are flawed in so many ways i dont have time to watch it.

Oh here's one! The steel I-beams are incased in concrete and fire retardant. How did they get the thermite on the i-beams without the thousands of people in the building noticing, then re-sealing the walls and rebuilding the concrete to keep the thermite inside, then activate the thermite int he middle of a plane crash with no idea if the triggering mechanisms would still work post-impact?

Hmm? The entire idea of it is so dumb its incredible

>>3103609
only in person
xD

>>3103641
>im not refusing to acknowledge
>i just havent said anything

Are you retarded?

>i pointed you in the right direction

no you didnt you pointed me to a flawed experiment by a redneck on youtube.

WTF.

I recently joined the whole 9/11 understanding.
Never cared till recently.

And i can't make a sense.

Please someone explain why the inside job is false/true.

Simple bullet points that proves false and others that prove true.

>>3103649
>I dont have time to watch it but it's bullshit
I don't have time to read the rest of your post but you're full of bullshit

>>3103657
Do I have to hold your hand and tell you if I acknowledge something? Or are you implying that I am even a conspiracy believer and not just somebody calling you out on your bullshit

>>3103671
you probably believed the rapture was tomorrow too, how cute.

>>3103682
keep movin' those goalposts and attacking grammar errors, it makes you look right

>>3103684
You hold an argument like that of a 12 year old.

>>3103567
This is right. If you look at any of these supposed analyses that finds "thermite residue", if their conclusions are correct it would imply thousands upon thousands of mixer trucks full of thermite. If you follow that line of thought you end up in coocoo land.

>>3103699
Gotta match people on their own level.

>>3103693
I'm going to assume you intended on replying to somebody else.

>>3103657
>>3103671
>>3103682
>>3103684
>>3103693
>>3103699


And this is how you can tell the people arguing don't care about the subject matter, nor do they have faith in their own points of view.

Have fun attacking eachother and having an implying war.

I hope you start attacking me now so you stop this douchery, because I won't respond. Idiots.

>>3103667

conspiracy
>thinks steel wouldn't melt
>thinks thermite in rubble (used to melt steel)

not conspiracy
>knows steel loses 60% structural integrity at half its melting point
>knows that reddish dust doesn't prove thermite was in the rubble

>>3103605
LOL, the molten iron melts out of the box and leaves a small gash in the side of the I-beam. The rest of the I-beam is completely intact. There is no possible way to cut through an entire I-beam in this manner.

>>3103667
There is so much bullshit out there no one can ever get around to debunking all of it. If you want to know what happened, watch something from a reputable source, like National Geographic's Inside 9/11.

>>3103725
not to mention, that whole video implies that boxes like that were put on EVERY fucking i-beam...
without people noticing...

>>3103725
I'm just curious, but did you watch the entire video?

So, conspiracy theorists. riddle me this.

It is a scientifically known fact that steel loses 60% structural integrity at half its melting point.

It is also scientifically known the burning heat of jet fuel, as well as various debris inside the building.

So, knowing these two facts... why is thermite necessary for the collapse? Since it's clear the collapse can be explained without it, why do you insist that it must have been there? Because something you saw kinda sorta maybe looks like it?

It's easy to shamble together a bunch of theories, and label them collectively as possible because of how interconnected they are. Unfortunately, once you start debunking these individual cases and theories, the whole thing rightly collapses onto itself.

It's building a house of cards. It's silly.

>>3103742
Are you ignoring the fact that they had multiple evacuations of the world trade center for weeks prior to 9/11?

>>3103746
You really think all 3 buildings can fall at free-fall speed and they wouldn't lean to the side of impact at all?

>>3103744
>attacking bolts

First of all this assumes that bolts were used. This is extremely unlikely, as welded beams are way stronger and more reliable when you're holding up a goddamn skyscraper.
Okay,there's bolts. we'll play with that for now. but the bolts were incased in concrete. And fire retardant materials (which didnt burn off because apparently we're ignoring the fire if it doesnt agree with our viewpoints) Also they werent old and rusty like those used in the 'experiment'.

How does that make sense?

>>3102105
>>3102105
>>3102105
>>3102105

http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/tech/debunking-9-11-bomb-theories.html

>>3103754
>>3103754
If it's freefall, then why is the debris in this picture falling faster than the top of the building? Surely you arent implying that the rest of that material, clear of the building, is going FASTER than freefall?

I don't actively believe in ANY explanation for 9/11.

It seems arbitrary and foolish to just believe the governmental story. Why would it be true? There's no sufficient reason to convince me.

>>3103754
Also, this doesnt look "perfectly straight down" to me. Looks like it leaned quite a bit. the top section is roughly 30 stories plus roof material, leaned approximately 30 degrees left of center. Simple 30-60-90 triangles tell us that the top is falling about 15 stories off of the center of the building. Or about... 250 feet away from "straight down".

>>3103765
exploshans

>>3103775
whoops forgot image

>>3103780
explosions would push it outward, not DOWNWARD, silly goose.

>>3103762
covers speed of falling, thermite possibilities, puffs of smoke, and collapse of world trade sever

WHY are you all so consumed with thermite and molten steel?

Dont you know about bin laden and bush families?
That bush invested on things specifically to would rise after the attack?

You gotta see the whole picture.
I think Bin laden and Bush were trying to make money.
And they made us fight over who was the evil guy.

Wake up.

>>3103789
Because this is /sci/ almost nobody knows anything about politics here, they only know math and science.

>>3103789
because any good argument goes a little deeper than speculating about possible motives

If the idea was to get the country into a 13 trillion dollar debt the plan worked flawlessly

>>3103744
I did not. But every minute of it that I watched is full of what I can easily identify as BULLSHIT. I am more than happy to extrapolate that pattern to the entire video.

http://www.loosechangeguide.com/LooseChangeGuide.html

Here you go, covers about 90% of complaints, and all of them in loose change, point by point, in order, along with the movie narraration.

>>3103754
>fall at free-fall speed
How many times do we have to hear this? Stop it.

>wouldn't lean to the side of impact at all?
Wow. Have you never even seen a video of the collapses?

>>3103803
Well I was just curious.

A word of advice, if you pick and choose everything you want to hear, you will miss out on a lot of interesting stuff in life.

>>3103758
Bolts would absolutely not be allowed under the building code.

>>3103810
oh my god the irony is too much... I think we've been getting trolled.

I hope for his sake, anyway, that he's trolling. There's no way anyone can be this idiotic.

>>3103818
>just notices
I've stated it multiple times in this thread.

You guys are easier than the conspiracy theorists as ironic as that is.

>>3103823
I'd rather be corralled into proving why I'm right than willingly accept false information.

>>3103789
>Dont you know about bin laden and bush families?
Yes, we know there are retards who watched Fahrenheit 9/11.

The bin laden family is a family completely loyal to the saudi arabian government, who considered osama a criminal for terrorism, and would have executed him if he ever set foot in saudi arabia. Why do you think he lived in Afghanistan? It was the only safe haven left for him. Every other country would either put him on trial or kick him out. You people need to read something from REPUTABLE sources, not Michael Moore, or internet trolls making youtube videos.

Why don't you civil engineers recreate a small scale model and put the debate to an end?
Can't you lazy assholes do anything without getting paid?

Question:
Why do people assume it would be a thermite? Couldn't it simply have contained elements commonly found in thermite but have been a different mixture that releases its energy at a higher rate and hence make it a high explosive as opposed to a relatively slow burning thermite?

>>3103841
It's been done. If conspiracy theorists cared about facts or reputable sources, they wouldn't hold to their conspiracies.

>>3103841
Because there's no way a small scale model can fully represent everything that happened in the attack, and a full-scale recreation would cost hundreds of millions of dollars.

>>3103844
I think because thermite was discovered in the debris

>>3103854
no.
no no no no no

Thermite was not found in the debris

Chemical compounds common to many different sources but is also found in the debris from thermite reactions was found at the scene. But, again, it is way more likely to have come from somehwere else.

>>3103810
I've seen it all. I'm suggesting to people who can't distinguish the bullshit from reality that they only subject themselves to reputable sources, because they are believing the bullshit. If they don't have critical thinking skills, the only alternative is to be more discerning in the quality of sources they subject themselves to.

>>3103853
>Because there's no way a small scale model can fully represent everything that happened in the attack
why not?

>>3103852
got a link?

Unless you're referring to that retarded computer simulation.

>>3103873
There have been a couple engineering firms that have built detailed computer models and recreated the collapse. No one has built a full-scale physical model, obviously, and you can't scale down a building collapse.

>>3101629
This is nearly a decade old event. Nobody has come forward with "the truth", even though it is pretty obvious what brought down the towers.

http://www.historycommons.org/essay.jsp?article=essaytheytriedtowarnus

Yes, our CIA had forknowlegde. So now we are left with thwo questions:
1. Was this one of the worst intelligence failures on history?
2. Was there complicity?

>>3103934
or 3
It wasn't assigned a lot of importance because nobody thought a small group of people from a third world country were going to be able to destroy the twin towers

>>3102822
>nano-thermite

>>3103897
Why not?

>>3104126

This is relevant to your question:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Similitude_(model)

Also, imagine simulating structural components at a small scale. Take a welded beam for example. When any sort of weld is made, there is a region in the material that changes its mechanical properties due to the heat (annealing). This is called the Heat Affected Zone, or HAZ. It would be nigh on impossible to scale a weld down with any sort of accuracy. That doesn't even begin to address additional issues such as the forming process for components, curing rates of varying thickness of concrete, etc.

>>3103969
Same as 1

>>3103749

It would have taken years to lay down all of those charges

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5d5iIoCiI8g

I don't know if the thermite / thermate debate is at all relevant to the fact that Cheney and the Pentagon aided the hijackers in destroying the twin towers

but this man's independent investigation of Thermate is a tribute to ingenuity and truth seeking.

>>3104391
People who decide the conclusion they reach before they start and therefore ask loaded questions and hidden assumptions are not truth seekers, no matter how many experiments they perform to try to prove their point.

>the fact that Cheney and the Pentagon aided the hijackers
just stop

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PG3uaQxc8uQ&NR=1

the floors impacted by the jets
were re-fitted with "fireproofing"

You can find Bremer's involvement with a company KOMATSU that patented a thermite explosive device.

Bremer ends up the interim Governor of Iraq.

>>3104126
The most obvious problem is that a building collapse is driven by gravity, and you can't change the strength of gravity. The problems with scaling material strengths are almost as large.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PG3uaQxc8uQ&NR=1

this video is AMAZING!

>>3104437
>mfw I'm trying to keep up with all the mind blowing info

>>3103969
None of the above, genius. Open states are vulnerable to terrorism.

>>3103897
>>3103867
>>3103852

Dear Tripfruit,

You obviously know these things to be true.
> HIJACKERS WERE GIVEN SPECIAL PASSPORTS >EVEN THOUGH (RATHER --BECAUSE) THEY
>WERE RED FLAGGED AS TERRORISTS

It is obvious that you are simply refusing to acknowledge what you know to be true.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PG3uaQxc8uQ&NR=1

This video is relevant to the debate

>>3104459
>believes whatever he sees on a youtube video

Why hasn't anyone mentioned this guy yet?

>>3104483
oh, marvelous avoidance and damage control bro

You have averted the attention of MILLIONS of potential victims and convinced thousands of sheepish internet users.

The only thing I have to ask is, can you post any faster?

These links explain a great deal:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PG3uaQxc8uQ&NR=1

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_9uB64ghcq8

>>3104512
there's a 2 hour video in there, that's not a practical thing to post in context of a debate. Please use better etiquette and summarize, in text, the key points of the time-sink.

>>3104526
>an argument that requires a lot of evidence to back it up
>OMG THAT VIDEO IS TOO LONG I DONT WANT TO LISTEN TO ALL THAT JUST SUM IT UP FOR ME
you're joking right?

>>3104541
no I'm not, it's just stupid to post movies in a discussion unless you specify something with it.

>>3104594
>uh, can the solar bros and nuke bros reach some kind of agreement?
i don't think any sane person would suggest one would should completely eclipse the other, just that at the moment (and probably for the next 20 years or so) nuclear is a better option for baseload power, with solar slowly but surely gaining traction.

>so, uh, thoriumfag-solarfag truce?

dully noted, thanks for making a new thread Nuka-Cola !dbLFTRZqOI
>>3104597

>>3104541
>youtube videos
>evidence

People will believe anything;
- Hijacker passport found on sidewalk after 9/11 - hijacker was/is still alive.
- Plane hitting Pentagon "vaporises" (official story)
- No footage of plane hitting Pentagon ever released because why would they need to prove it
- Etc, etc

>>3104474
If Saudi Arabia knew they were terrorists, they would not have issued them passports. SA does not issue "special passports" for terrorists.

This is what's fucked up about america. A large portion of this mindless country goes about their day not asking questions, because that would make them "crazy". I can't say whose right or wrong, but there is a TON of bullshit involved in what took place on 9/11 and years following.

As you can see in recent events, Bin Laden "died".
>Still NO proof whatsoever
>Still no one asks questions.

THIS is why I don't trust any opinion let alone an organization focused on buying and selling the world.

Once the government gets it shit straight MAYBE then i'll believe an ounce of their horse shit.
>National debt cap.


Think for yourselves fuck heads.