/sci/ - Science & Math

what is the Y axis?

some literature/english/sociologist/economist subjective opinion of the "magnitude" or "degree" of the import of the development in question?

>>2999110

still space travel and satellites are already 50 years old

name any invention besides internet that changed the world in some way, in the past 50 years

>>2999119

semiconductors

/thread

>>2999116

My criteria is: in what way did the inventions change the world

I agree, the scale of the upward line is not explained but it just points out the magnitude of how the world changed as a result of these inventions. For instance the world changed significantly after the invention of the car.

>>2999119

i'd say the internet and computers are pretty fucking significant

>>2999123

you saying semiconductors changed the world in the same significant way as the invention of television and radio? I don't think so

>>2999106
Inventions generally don't prove their worth for, say, ten to fifty years, depending on the type of invention. This means that people will always complain that 'good inventions' have stopped for x years (for 10<x<50).

>>2999126

>magnitude of how the world changed as a result of these inventions

>>2999131
HAHAHAHAHAHAHA, OH WOW.

OP is right, there aren't any inventions besides computers, telecommunications and internet ever made even after 1945

>>2999136


OP is an epic troll. seriously we have all been raped by the troll of the century.


read the fucking chart


>democracy


im sorry, but 10/10.

>>2999132

I don't think people in 1910 would have said that. That was a period in time of rapid advancement, radio was invented, political changes, etc

Nothing like that in 2010. Internet is already 20 years old.

We need another war.

iphones

aw shit nigga how do you evaluate the magnitude of scientific advancements

and use a continuous curve to graph discrete variables

that some funky ass stats son

It's the calm before the storm, man. You may not believe me, but the world is going to begin changing faster then ever, very soon. Your curve is about to go asymptotic.

>>2999142

Telephone was invented in 1890
Internet in the eighties

social networking, despite it's faults

robots

>>2999140
It took quite some while to go from the radio being invented, to it being used.
Also, Karl Marx wasn't the one who started communist states. Nor was he the inventor of equality (ask the french).
The train was starting to get really popular by now, but it was almost a century old.
You might see some cars, a 25 year old invention.

>you saying semiconductors changed the world in the same significant way as the invention of television and radio? I don't think so

>>2999146

Yeah but, what if it really is an S curve?

The assumption that I'm making (not saying that I 100% believe this but it's just a theory) is that there is a limit to technological advancement. At some point, you just have invented/discovered everything there is.

The problem is not science, it's you, OP. Almost every single scientific achievement of the last 20 years doesn't come from the direct application of our senses but by data analysis, and doesn't have visible, tangible results. This doesn't these discoveries any less important. You're just stupid.

>>2999152

yeah like fusion power which has already been invented but doesn't work yet

god i hope they get that working within 20 years

>>2999136
>>2999138
yup, good job OP. I predict a 200+ post shitstorm within an hour.
Congratulations, you've passed your BA in Trololology with honors.

So OP is basing everything on inventions?

How bout research. Have you seen the shit genetics is doing right now, and how bout physics breaking into quark levels. Fucking positron research with tissues and membranes.

Fucking OP.

>>2999154
this was a common consensus among many people in the late mid 1800's. dumbass.
>first private spacecraft

>>2999154

and we're not even close

>>2999158

>positron research with tissues and membranes.

actually PET scanners and the requisite materials are in most large hospitals.

How can anyone believe what the OP believes?

Does he seriously think he does not live in a time of incredible scientific advancement?

I count myself fortunate to live in such a time period.

>>2999154
Look at the life cycle of a single invention. At first, it's not popular yet, there is no critical mass of people using it, the are a lot of faults in the design, making it error prone or inefficient.
Later, the invention matures, improvements are made, there is an enormous consumerbase, so producers are in an open (therefore) competitive market, hence prices will drop.
Later yet, the invention is outdated, and replaced.
Assume now (be it correctly or incorrectly) that this will go on forever. At al times, the most popular and common devices are invented a number of years ago, whereas the new inventions are crappy. We've asserted a linear line, yet people living on that line will draw is as your S.
bitch

If nothing else we are just coming out of another
"renaissance" period of time. We will hit one again in a few years.

That and Moore's Law will mean something cool will probably be made.

My argument still stands that in the period 1850-1950 way more world-changing events and inventions happened than after that. Besides internet/computers. I can make a list of 100+ important inventions or developments of 1850-1950 but the list of 1950-2010 wouldn't get past 10.

inb4 you're a dumbass - no i'm not, I'm just challenging generally accepted theories

>>2999169
I contend that the internet's impact far surpasses any inventions in mankind's history.

the last 50 years:

Semiconductors (Integrated circuit/microchip, solar cells, etc)
Lasers
High Tc superconductors (used all over the place in high speed electronics and telecommunications, most likely inside of every cell tower in your city)

Fiber optics

100% of all computer software (which control absolutely every single piece of digital electronics we use at any point)

carbon composites

modern plastic chemistry/physics/engineering


I could go on and on, each with major, multi trillion dollar per year economic implications, but I am tired.

>>2999169
read
>>2999166

>>2999106
Bicycles? By jove, this will surely change the face of the world!

>>2999178

counter-attack me with a mode of transportation that tens of millions of people use and has been invented after 1950

Eh, its natural that we're slowing down a little, we're reaching an energy peak, soon fusion will be providing our energy and growth will be asymptotic.

>>2999171
>>2999169


without question, the most important discovery in the history of mankind has been the discovery/use of petroleum.

2nd to that has been electromagnetism.

3rd is semiconductors


unquestionable here buddy. real computers, that you think of, are impossible without semiconductors. semiconductors are in every single piece of major electronics you own.

they are as ubiquitous as plastic.

>>2999184

>>2999173
and MRI scanners. Can;'t be arsed to think when I'm this tired

>>2999184
Can I instead counter with...It was more than 50 years between the chariot and car, so why are you suggesting we should have a new mode of transport already?

>Google
>Wi-fi
>Digital cameras
>photoshop

>>2999184
Why do we need to have completely new modes of transportation every 50 years and not focus on improving the efficiency of cars?

>>2999202

>all dependent on semiconductors

>>2999192


NMR, discovered/predicted by Felix Bloch, who also developed the seminal theoretical framework of solid state physics (bloch's theorem).

>>2999191
>Implying millions of people use supersonic transport

>>2999197
My argument is that in 1850-1950 several modes of transport were invented, in a short period of time. (airplane, car, bicycle, train, metro etc)
After 1950 none transport mode, well besides space travel but that's no transport for the masses and never will be.

>Mathematica
>Matlab
>Particle Colliders
>Fibre optics

>>2999210
Those modes of transport are all fundamentally similar, listing them all as distinct inventions is a little weak. Assuming space travel will never be a mass mode of transport is also quite bold.

>>2999217


already said fiber optics nigger.

>>2999222
double triples
>>2999222
double triples
>>2999222
double triples >>2999222
double triples
>>2999222
double triples >>2999222
double triples
>>2999222
double triples
>>2999222
double triples
>>2999222
double triples >>2999222
double triples
>>2999222
double triples >>2999222
double triples
>>2999222
double triples
>>2999222
double triples
>>2999222
double triples
>>2999222
double triples
>>2999222
double triples

>>2999189
>most important discovery in the history of mankind
>lists three things that have their roots in math, physics, and chemistry
>doesn't consider mathematical principles to be the most important discoveries in the history of mankind
>mfw

>>2999116
>>2999126
Pretty sure it makes more sense (read: nonsense) if you think of the y-axis as the integral of a graph of number of significant inventions vs. time.

>Human Genome Project
>CERN

>>2999233


Correct. I dont.


Experimentally deterimined physics (math) have always had more import than pure math.

unquestionably.


Maxwells equations were not developed from a pure math standpoint. they were developed phenomenologically.


so were the laws of quantum mechanics... both the feynmann path integrals and the schrodinger equations...

in fact, the path integral treatment is developed from a branch of PDE theory that pisses off most mathematicians I know to high hell... Greens functions, which depend on distributions, not functions, for their properties.

>>2999241


While I like your attitude, unfortunately both of those have had absolutely zero impact on applied science or medicine yet.


but genetic engineering in general has... we use genetically modified E Coli to produce insulin. We use it to produce other important medicines as well.


CERN has no practical import. it is little more than a big fucking research tool.

>>2999106
You can't say the internet was invented in 1950 because that's when the ARPANET program started. The modern internet is a mid to late 1990's invention. Oh and you forgot the wireless telecommunications invention in the 2000's.

>>2999244

I meant math as a the language of science. Obviously you can't practice calculus-based physics without physics OR calculus, but it's an application of calculus, not an application of physics. All scientific inventions have a base in math.

So, in my opinion, the discovery and development of mathematics as the language of the universe is the most important in the history of mankind. It's like seeing through the eyes of the divine.

>>2999252
>CERN has no practical import

well I'm sure they imported a lot of materials and machinery from abroad, don't think that was all made in Switzerland
Also the food that the staff eats is probably party imported from other countries.

The combination of the internet and photoshop/3d-modeling applications is fucking confounding.

Even 15 years ago you wouldn't really believe that anything you could imagine you could make look as if it really existed and almost effortlessly (if you bother to learn).

The internet may have finally brought about the end of dictatorships in the middle east, only time will tell but if you don't think what's happening right now is incredible (or the fact that I talk daily with syrians/israelis/swedes/americans about complete bullshit like what shitty inventions of the past are better than those today) then there's no hope for you.

>The modern internet is a mid to late 1990's invention.


oh lawd


>Oh and you forgot the wireless telecommunications invention in the 2000's.


seriously wtf is going on in this thread? the quality of /sci/ has genuinely dropped precipitously.... I guess all of us God Tier americans must be asleep right now.


oh well.


also cell phones have been around since the 1980s.

artificial heart, liver etc.
Active camouflage
SonoPrep
Viagra
Gene splicing
ethernet
handheld calculator
ATM
bar-code scanner
credit card
super glue
optic fiber

>>2999257
This, we're moving into the realm of nanites. Also, do you realize we've basically cured baldness and mapped the human genome? Crazy shit OP. You just have to realize how amazing things really are

>>2999252
>doesn't know about geneticly engineered corn

>>2999264

>>2999266

>if you don't think what's happening right now is incredible

This has a dreamy truth to it. Made me smile. Thanks anon

>>2999272

>Active camouflage
>super glue
>ethernet


>world changes discoveries or advancement.
yep. /sci/ is brain dead tonight. I give up.

anybody remember a couple years ago when you had to plug your computer into shit to get online, rather than just walk into a bubble of internet projected around you like some sort of spell?

>>2999276

uh, they're just overthrowing one dictator to replace him with another

just like in Afghanistan when they kicked out the Soviets and replaced it with the Taliban

or in Cuba where they kicked out a fascist and replaced him with a communist

Also Mubarak was a replacement for another dictator

>>2999283

notice the line flattening after 1950

>>2999308
actually I notice a continued increase.
which chart are you looking at?

>>2999300
>Implying Mubarak isn't now gone
>Implying Gaddhafi isn't soon to be gone
>Implying more shit's not going to go down in Syria
>Implying this shit didn't get started by Tunisia
>Implying the people in Bahrain aren't super pissed
>Implying you don't remember Iraq (although that one wasn't homegrown)
>Implying there aren't still uprisings in Iran
It's not hard to see

The OP of this thread is once again absolutely full of shit.
We have had more inventions just in the last decade than whole 18nt century managed tu pull of.
You just need to mention computers, that alone would basically sweep every century before the 18th
In addition to that we have great advancements in other areas as well.
Medicine, math, physics, transport, internet, fiber optics, space flight, satelites, nuclear power, solar power, infrastructure, everything.
World has had its most productive decade yet and you are eating the fruits it bares.
That is an insult to the men in science that worked hard to bring the quality of life you have to you.

>>2999347
>Medicine, math, physics, transport, internet, fiber optics, space flight, satelites, nuclear power, solar power, infrastructure

all pre-1980

Our technological progress is mainly caused by sudden breakthroughs like the first steam engine, diesel engine, vacuum tubes and the latest one silicon transistor. We are still using mostly 20th century tech today. Until we make a new breakthrough discovery progress will stagnate.

Troll me however you want. It doesn't take a genius to figure out whats happening though.

>>2999360
The actual things yes, but the advances since then are outrageous. If you're trying to say that unless something is completely new it's worthless then you're a fucking retard

>>2999360
Would you shut the fuck up? He's talking about advancements in those fields and the creation of new sub-fields. Why do you think it's impossible to get a PhD in a broad field like Mathematics? Because there's too much information and everyone specializes.

Alright OP, how about this:
http://www.engadget.com/2011/04/18/first-light-wave-quantum-teleportation-achieved-opens-door-to-u/
Quantum teleportation, we'll soon be using it in computers

>>2999347
The golden age of space exploration were the 60's and 70's.
Today's computers are almost identical to those from the 80's0 (IBM PC)
The internet is nothing new. What changed is the number of people on it but they use it for shit (facebook,reddit,4chan)

This decade is not productive at all. Grow up.

>>2999365
Capitalism and greed is causing this stagnation. Why create new technologies that are efficient and nearly industructable? In the 30's is was "Consumers need to buy a new bed frame, toaster, fridge, radio, etc. every decade damn it!"

>>2999360
>>Medicine, math, physics, transport, internet, fiber optics, space flight, satelites, nuclear power, solar power, infrastructure

>all pre-1980

No, have you seen internet of 1980? That is absolutely shit
Have you used the medicine of 1980? Most of antibiotics from that time don't work anymore
Solar power in 1980? Absolute shit, same with nuclear.
Math, physics? Both revolutionized in the last decade.
Transport? Enjoy your shitty cars, i will use my half the cost double the confort ones that actually can go long trips.
Enjoy your flying death tubes, and slow trains. I will use my maglevs.
You could look at your room and see basically nothing that doesn't use the technology of 1980+

>>2999385
This is the first post that has made my blood pressure noticeable higher, I always ridicule people who get angry online but god damn, I guess we all have our thresholds.

>>2999379
I believe I've read before that it can't be used for transmitting information.

>Today's computers are almost identical to those from the 80's0 (IBM PC)

>>2999385
>Today's computers are almost identical to those from the 80's
This post gave me cancer.
You couldn't even write that post with a computer from the 80's

>>2999393

>same with nuclear.

you are aware that after 1980 barely any nuclear power plants, or nuclear weapons have been produced?
That's all from the sixties.

>>2999412
you are now aware that you are a nigger

way to ignore all molecular biology and biotech advancements you fuckwit, a ton of advancement has been made since 2000

synthetic biology for one.

>>2999347
Give the guy a break, he's obviously just uninformed and thus ignorant of advances in sciences in the last decade.

>>2999412
Yes, but you are forgetting those few that are build and the research that is done. We are currently building GEN III and we are finishing the designs of GEN IV that are physically incapable of exploding.

>>2999406

I beg to differ.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Contiki

>>2999393
>2011
>still no consumer electric cars

Maglevs have been around since the 70's according to wikipedia. Electric cars are a 19th century invention. The number of nuclear or solar plants has not been increasing in the last decade. The internet of the 80's was perfectly fine for what it was used for and it's not youtube or anime shit, it was used for military and scientific networks.

>>2999425
i get the feeling he is one of those overeducated college snobs that believe everything their professors say to the T.


Protip: unless the class is specifically on the most recent advancements, all the tech they discuss is going to be like 30-50 years old.

>>2999432

>>2999438
Well, now that you mention, he does seem that way, yes.

>>2999438

I probably am an overeducated college snob but I don't take everything my professor sais for granted lol
Instead I think out of the box and contend the general assumption that technology is forever advancing.

>wheel
>chariot
>covered wagon
>model t
>60's camero
>modern lamburgini
>THE END according to OP
>mfw he actually believes this

>>2999429
No
>>2999432
No

You could say that everything was invented in 102 because of my crazy definition.

The computer of 1980 is a piece of shit. Same with the internet. There is so many invention that have gone to your windows 7 that you need to be an expert to even know them all, both hardware and software.

You are basically saying that because someone used the word "computer" in 1980 it means that it has been invented an they can never improve it.
By this definition your graph could be even semi fine but that isn't stopping us from reaching the starts, living forever, creating computers that think and are smarter than human.
Just because you use a definition that is shit doesn't make it true in real life.

Oh btw, star trek invented space flight, cellphone, teleportation, laser, laser guns, and aliens. Deal with it.

>>2999453
they had cellphones in star trek?

>>2999454
Yes
Some trekkie can probably confirm this. They just used a word "Communicator" or something like that for it.

>>2999393
I don't really think mathematics has been revolutionized in the last decade, could you provide some evidence?

>>2999454

>>2999459
>>2999465

neat

The Large Hadron Collider

>>2999462

>>2999462
dunno bout math but physics sure has