/sci/ - Science & Math

You will die.

>>2846301
So will you.

>>2846309
Yup. A happy *and* depressing, though quite usual science fact.

>>2846301
>>2846309
But not for potentially hundreds, thousands, or millions of years thanks to technological advancements and things like the Manhattan Beach Project.

There are many confirmed and even more unconfirmed exoplanets within the habitability zone of their star, so hopefully one day we'll be able to fly there and conquer them and strip their planets of all resources.

>>2846317
God, shut the fuck up Inurdaes.

>>2846317
I fucking knew you posted that. You and your fucking immortality pipe dream. Nice as it sounds, realistically We'll die before it comes to fruition.

>>2846323
This is my favourite so far

>>2846334
It's a free country/ies.

>>2846337
>realistically We'll die before it comes to fruition.
They've recently rejuvenated organs of mice. This wasn't supposed to happen until the 2020's, according to Aubrey de Grey.

Somehow I think we will.

>>2846323
http://www.space.com/10982-kepler-alien-planets-billion-galaxy.html

let him dream>>2846337

>>2846317

except I doubt you are a billionaire, so like space vacationing, this will likely not be accessible to you within your lifetime

>>2846352

>>2846339
Inurdaes, I like you, but I am concerned.

Your faith in the eventual development of immortality, whilst being slightly saner than religion, poses some of the same risks. Namely, wasting your life believing in a future reward that probably won't exist. Imagine you'll only live to 80. Make sure you've lived a good life by then, my friend, or you may be disappointed.

I'd like immortality, but I'm not going to pretend I know what's going to happen before it does, particularly with something as complicated as that.

>>2846356

shall this be the cover of your tombstone in next 50 years or so?

>>2846345
Not pissed at you bro. Just hope you prove me fucking wrong so if I somehow forget about you the day that this momentous news is revealed, that I can remember you long after our sun dies, hope you have avoided getting killed by means other than senescence, and shake your fuckin' hand for proving me wrong. Reminisce on the last ~6 billion years, wonder how technology will progress (from that future date) and then lol about how trivial that question seems, having lived 6 billion years and remembering we were talking about the same shit on 4chan ~2000 AD era edition.

>>2846364
I think he's 16. Given a life expectancy of 75, let's say 60.

>>2846357
I don't have 'faith' in the development of longevity treatments, I am looking at TODAYS advancements and discoveries and correlating it to a rising awareness of the potential possibility in the public mind. Because once an idea like this gets traction, and the technology is already there to increase people's lifespans by 30% or so, more often than not it's gonna happen. See: the meteoric rise and popularity of the internet and affordable computers

>>2846356
>Cure for aging becomes affordable
>Suddenly, tens of billions of people are alive
>Global food and resource shortage, billions die and billions more live in poverty
>Problem solved...?

>>2846372

>living forever comes at the price of producing only two children in your lifetime.

>>2846372
I think we're moving into space too.

>>2846371
just about everybody is aware that not eating junk food or smoking or avoiding various other harmful activities will extend their lifespan. But they go ahead and do it.

Honestly, you are SO FUCKING NAIVE.

>>2846372
Actually, it will most likely be only available for those living in first and second world countries. People who accept the treatments must be sterilized.

>>2846369
I look forward to meeting you.

Live long, and prosper.

>>2846378
And you know what is one of the main reasons I hear?
"Life is short, might as well enjoy it"

Inurdaes, what part of Australia do you live in? I'm a New Zealander, going to Melbourne in late May.

>>2846391
South Australia.

A question, is it true that almost everyone in NZ is completely lax about cannabis?

Thread turns into a debate about the cure for aging,
Im okay with this its interesting.
>>2846345
Thank you for posting the link to that article.
Anyway please procede I hadnt heard about this before

>>2846396
I do apologise about this turning into a longevity thread as I would also like to hear some random awe-inspiring science facts. However, as I said in my pet peeves I seriously hate when people go DURR IMPOSSIBLE THATS TOO GRAND without even taking some time out of their day to research it more indepth.

Here is the article I was talking about, with the mice.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/science/2010/nov/28/scientists-reverse-ageing-mice-humans

>>2846381
Must?
MUST?
MUST?!!?!
Fuck you.

>>2846402
Hey its fine /sci/ is quiet at the moment anyway
And thank you I'll read it now

>>2846404

Yes obviously; or maybe only allowed to have a kid every hundred years or something

>>2846395
In my experience that is the case. Like, almost half the population has smoked it and a lot of those who haven't still support legalisation. Still need to be careful around cops, but you sometimes see people lighting up in public.

>>2846404
Must, or get onboard a huge O'Neill cylinder headed for 47 Ursae Majoris. I am not sure if the governments of the world would be willing to fund such proposals, so that is reserved for the TRS or when molecular assemblers debut.
There could be a trading market where people that don't want children trade their 'child share' to willing parents.

>>2846411
captcha: ignatius weeds.

>>2846408
>>2846413
No. FUCK "Must".

>>2846423
Enjoy your traditional human lifespan, I guess.

>>2846423

Just have a bunch of kids, then get the longevity treatment. Prablam salved.

>>2846427

Naw bro, I'll sell him my black market replica of the cure.

>>2846427
I follow the logic behind your conclusion, but "must" is just so repulsive.

>>2846430
Hmm, I wonder what would be the punishment for being young at the age of 200 but pumping out kids?

>>2846430
What if the black market cure also made you black?

>>2846440
There are three forseeable options:

1) You get your spermatic cord snipped, and then recieve the treatment.

2) You board an interstellar starship with tens of thousands of other people, and go explore a new star system, effectively becoming a new colony.

3) You reject those answers, build a objectivist paradise under the North Atlantic ocean, and then die at the age of 88 from old age.

>>2846436

Probably something similar to China, no government support for my family, etc. Unless we devolve into a dystopian society and people get punished for having kids.

>fun science facts thread
>turns into immortality debate

>>2846423
So you propose everyone should breed as much as they like?

Yeah, you can keep Earth.

Inurdaes, I am interested in ensuring a fair decision making process for TRS. Your posts on the topic so far have been somewhat vague, developing a sample system would be beneficial to your argument. What programming languages do you know?

>>2846463
>Inurdaes, I am interested in ensuring a fair decision making process for TRS.
Elaborate. Do you mean in the formation of the nation, or government when established?
>What programming languages do you know?
None, but recently I've been drinking loads of yerba mate and ginkgo and gotten a fair bit of motivation, and have been eyeing Python.

>>2846454
>>2846463
Obviously breeding has to be inhibited, but such a controlling, extreme, black&white solution is surely not the only one.

It seems crude and brutal and invasively Big Brother-ish.

>>2846471
It's his system. It's meant to be this 'perfect' democratic technological wonderland, but everything also has to be exactly the way Inurdaes wants it to be. Contradictions at the very core.

>>2846471
I would love to hear suggestions.

>>2846489
You dumbass, i'm not even TALKING about the TRS in relation to population control laws.

>>2846396
lol sorry rose
Can't think of any science fact atm though

>>2846466
When the nation is established, mainly, but I was thinking of developing a tool that could be used during the development of it also. Some way of assigning voting power in different areas to different people, and then tallying up the votes each time.

I understand your desire for a technocratic state, but I'd like you to consider the prospect of some form of weighted direct democracy, where the educated have greater power in their area of expertise but everyone still gets a say.

>>2846454

Two simple means of ensuring that longevity treatments are both affordable and won't result in overpopulation:

1. Instead of asking a price of, say 500,000 - 2,000,000 (Something which isn't 'extremely' expensive, but slightly out of reach of the general population). The price should be $50,000 - $100,000 per person, and the rest will be deducted from the individuals wages over the coming decades/centuries.

2. Introduce some form of contraceptive chemical into the water supply. Assuming the general population receives the treatment, waiting a couple of decades to have a kid isn't such a bad thing considering you'll be alive for the next hundred/thousand/million/billion years. Additionally, until we can colonize other planets couples will be restricted to only two children.

>>2846471
I see where you're coming from, but I disagree. I personally would prefer for all children to have the opportunity for free healthcare and education, with people voluntarily exchanging their right to have children for the right to immortality. Punishments that involve withholding public services would cause more harm in my opinion. A bunch of uneducated, poor and unhealthy people walking around everywhere? That can only lead to further crime

I guess my ethics are a bit more utilitarian than yours. I too would like to see a better solution.

>>2846492
Something that isn't permanent, perhaps.
People could either have kids before getting the treatment; or later in their long life retire from longevity and then reproduce.

I don't know, I had a few other ideas earlier but they evaporated when I went out for a smoke.

I'm sure that if such a thing ever occurred, more palatable solutions would be found. But "must" is terrible and would never (and should never) be allowed. Not at all compatible with the fundamental principles of life and liberty.

>>2846508
>but I'd like you to consider the prospect of some form of weighted direct democracy, where the educated have greater power in their area of expertise but everyone still gets a say.
DUDE
IVE BEEN SAYING THIS
SINCE THE BEGINNING

A pure technocracy can be overcome by corruption so fucking easily, but pure democracy is basically a shitfest and a popularity contest. Mix them together, you have one goddamn robust combination.

> Whether you believe in a reality independent of your perception or you don't, you're absolutely right.

> An abalone has five assholes.

>>2846527
fuck you bro. I thought we were technocracy bros. I used to always scream techncracy. now all i have left is for you to prove me wrong about living forevar

Science wont hold absolute truths, also we will never predict anything with 100 percent certainty because most of the problems are not integrable

>>2846520
Yes, those are better than the option of ruthlessly final and mandatory sterilization.

>>2846538
This IS a technocracy, as close to one as we can get before it has the very real problem of devolving into something reminiscent of the USSR political system. The goal is to have the most bitchin' education system in the world that actively teaches critical thinking and gets students to work on projects like making a hamster habitat that can get a hamster to survive underwater in a nearby lake or small model chemical-fuel rockets and so forth. An intelligent voting population. The people in government would still be some of the best in their fields.

>>2846525
You smoke? No longetivity treatment for you, you're just going to die from cancer anyway

/sarcasm

...or would it be?

>>2846546
An education system that brainwashes and indoctrinates children you mean, since apparently somebody not finding technological progress the be-all and end-all isn't possible in your delusion.

>>2846546
>USSR
>imokwiththis.jpg
jk
PS I wasn't mad for real bro :P

>>2846557
>An education system that brainwashes and indoctrinates children you mean, since apparently somebody not finding technological progress the be-all and end-all isn't possible in your delusion.
Grats, you're an idiot. Do you know what 'critical thinking' means? I fully concede there will always be people that would rather perform on stage or pain pictures than become astrophysicists and so forth. I wouldn't have it any other way, as then the nation would become quite bland and boring. It's just that they won't come out of school hearing the word 'science' and go OMG BOOOOOORIIIIING

The great majority just needs to be scientifically literate. This is not hard to achieve if you make science interesting, which you can. You should've seen the look on the faces of my classmates as our physics teacher explained that the light we can see from Alpha Centauri, the nearest star takes over 4 years to reach us. They all thought light was basically instantaneous, even if they knew about the speed of light.

in the end man likes to be ruled by someone else who gets all the shit done for him, stop with the hipocrisy and the retarded utopy of a completely equal society

>Bunch of protons, electrons and neutrons fucking around
>Add an extra neutron
>Suddenly completely different matter

>>2846571
Sorry, people really ARE that different. There's plenty of resources available already if people want to find out about science, but they'd rather do other stuff they actually find fun & interesting.

You want to make science fun & interesting for them? Well, good luck, but it won't make them hate other stuff, it won't stop people from doing irrational or stupid or "immoral" things, and it won't make them always place science above other values. Unless you go with, you know, the indoctrination.

I also find it interesting (in a pitying way) that the only alternative to science you bothered to mention was art.

>>2846599
Interesting, you ignored pretty much everything I said.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scientific_method
>Scientific method refers to a body of techniques for investigating phenomena, acquiring new knowledge, or correcting and integrating previous knowledge.
The scientific method doesn't need to be applied to science only. Basically, the largest part of the school would be to teach people the stuff they require so they can do university level courses if they wish. Much like schools today, only not at all tailoring them for employment, but more about people thinking and creating. Engendering creativity, wanting to do awesome things because you can and so forth. Science does not have to be involved.

>>2846584
You mean add another proton.

>>2846497
Oh my ex is stalking this thread :,) get off matt.

>>2846643
hi rose

>>2846643

wasnt even me.
creepy or what.

bump

>>2846700
go away matt.

OH OH OH I HAVE A RANDOM FACT
Some brown dwarfs can have iron rain in their atmosphere. IRON FUCKING RAIN.

But Y u so mad?

>>2846750