/sci/ - Science & Math

The religious mouthbreathers to get caught up with modern society.

a better way to make gravity other than a spinning space station because that would be annoying as fuck to try and dock in it

>>2179211

Perhaps we already are.

The nanotech revolution that will open up the gates of space.

And of course a few dead fundies and 65-year old ultra-conservative fundie shitheads off the gene pool, that would improve the situation.

>>2179216
>>2179218
That's it? Fuck, let's get on this shit then.

>>2179224
also money
lotso' money

>>2179222
This is what NASA thinks of furries you sick fuck

>>2179238
But say, hypothetically, that humanity decided to stop fighting each other, pick itself up by it's boot straps, and do the reasonable thing. Would we be able to have mass population centers in space with our current technology?

A reason.

>>2179249

Hey /sci/, why don't we live at the bottom of the ocean yet? What exactly are we waiting for?

I'm finding the link now, basically it was because of Nixon.

Hey /sci/, why don't we live at the center of the Earth yet? What exactly are we waiting for?

Hey /sci/, why don't we live in the Gobi desert yet? What exactly are we waiting for?

>>2179218
That problem's been solved already, go look up O'Neill cylinders The colony rotates around a central shaft, which is where the ships would dock.

>>2179238
This is a huge hurdle, the only way to build large space colonies is if the entire first world pooled their resources. Also the mechanics of getting all that shit we need to build up there. Those launches would be hilarious expensive. It would be cheaper to build a Moon colony then launch from there.

>>2179254
well if the world was a happy perfect world, of course, but it's not.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NERVA

>>Although NERVA engines were built and tested as much as possible with flight-certified components and the engine was deemed ready for integration into a spacecraft, much of the U.S. space program was cancelled by the Nixon Administration before a manned visit to Mars could take place.

we're waiting for a good reason to spend billions of dollars to fly off an awesome life-sustaining planet and live in a cold boring vacuum

>>2179267
sup

>>2179259
Also we Republicans won control of the House

DEAL WITH IT

If we mined asteroids in space, it would destroy the economy by making precious metals basically worthless

I won't have my commodities fund earning less than 30% a year.

I'll tell you why. Greedy assholes who have recovered down alien spacecraft and have reverse-engineered the technology are too paranoid and greedy to let the technology be known by the public, assuming that the average schmo is so much worse than a corrupt spook that all hell would break loose. Hence these assholes would rather avoid the appropriate public outrage over withholding such technology and instead keep the technology top secret as the environment continues to get worse. This is why people involved in black projects are the scum of the earth, they have the chance to improve lives and refuse.

>>2179281
But this planet won't last forever. Even if we don't destroy it ourselves, mass extinctions have happened in the past and can (most likely will) happen again. So why are we just sitting around waiting for something bad to happen?

>>2179302
you're right, and space is just full of all the resources we need to survive if this planet dies

>>2179272
I'd say build a space elevator first, but we'd need an economic way to produce the require (read: effing huge!) amount of high-strength carbon nanotubes...

>>2179297
What fucking bullshit is this. Since when is making crucial materials abundant and cheap a cause of anything but prosperity? Artificial scarcity is only used to ABUSE OTHER PEOPLE.

Fucking economics 101 bullshit, I tell you.

>>2179302
>this planet won't last forever
Correct. It will last several billion more years before being consumed by the sun during its red giant phase.

>>2179300
What fucking tinfoil. Tell me: do you really believe that's more reasonable than saying that black projects are the source of a good deal of the tech you enjoy (like the internet) and are kept secret only on a short-term basis because of unfriendly foreign powers?

>>2179317
Life will last even less time due to the luminosity of the Sun increasing as it transitions to a red giant. Way before it starts to expand the sun will boil off the oceans and all life will die.

>>2179317
Let me put it another way for you pedantic a-holes: the resources of this planet won't last us forever at the rate we're consuming them.

(No offense intended with the "pedantic a-holes"-part)

>>2179338
Your point being?

>>2179340
Let's build ourselves a set of orbital habitats, then/parallel with that, Moon, Mars, Proxima Centaury, and beyond!

>>2179340
I think he's saying some resources will run out during our lifetimes.

>>2179338
guys i just realize that people dont live forever. why arent we discovering immortality? what are we waiting for?

>>2179356
using what exactly? i thought you said we're running out of resources

>>2179366
We use what we've got left to mine asteroids and convert as much of the Earth as we can into farmland.

>>2179338
>the resources of this planet won't last us forever at the rate we're consuming them
"consuming"? LOL
For oil, you're absolutely right. For deforestation, possibly. If you're referring to rare earth metals, you've gone full retard. They're never "consumed".

Also, the global population is going to peak and go into decline within fifty years. It's already happened in the first world countries.

Just waiting for the religious fucktards to be almost all gone, to the point where almost everyone in a first world country is atheist. Then we can have spacebattles with lazorz over who is the better atheist.

>>2179356
time to proxima centaury at 10 times the speed of the fastest man-made object (helios 2): ~2000 years
good luck with that

Currently there is no energy source sufficiently well utilized in any nation to allow large scale space habitation projects to be pursued. When (or if, rather) nuclear energy becomes as cheap and abundant as oil was a century ago, then you could expect to see expansion into space be made an actuality.

>>2179385
>frostwatch

>>2179302
>mass extinctions have happened in the past and can (most likely will) happen again.

are happening right now to the tune of 100-200 species per day.

>>2179391

>>2179419
I meant cryo-sleep, but wine is fine too.

I <span class="math">seriously[/spoiler] think decentralization is a good idea. Everywhere.

>>2179425
Because life in pre-civilization human history was just fucking great, wasn't it?

>>2179425

Me too.

>>2179433
Yeah it was.

>>2179440
Enjoy dying at age 30.
You would have half your life ahead of you, anyway.

You don't honestly believe this bullshit, do you? You're free to go live in the mountains anytime you want, you know. Put up or shut up.

>>2179249
But those are not furries, they are lunarians. They couldn't even get to the capital either, but good try.

>>2179464
I'm working on it, but I don't think it's inherently better, and I know it's a hard life. It is , however, more in tune with our evolutionary adaptations is all.

We are waiting for fusion reactors. But all the big oil companies are jamming up the research.

/truth

>>2179425
Why don't we start by decentralizing you?

You can begin the process from your central(OMG CENTRAL) nervous system by applying a shotgun to your temple.

>>2179475
>more in tune with our evolutionary adaptations is all.
Irrelevant. You're not here to serve your biology - it is here to serve you. Even if you WERE here to serve your biology, pampering its current adaptations is not favored for survival. There's a reason neanderthals went extinct.

Basically, it's not just you adapting to an environment - the environment is altered by us. Every organism does this. And you want to reverse the process, by changing the environment back to what your biology adapted for a hundred thousand years ago?

Why? Why is that equilibrium better than establishing a new one? You can't turn back the clock, and we're still adapting AND changing our environment at the same time. What do you want the future to be like?

/rambling

>>2179433
It was, actually.

>>2179464
>Enjoy dying at age 30.

Repeating bs myths and propaganda? Ok, whatever middle schooler.

>>2179527
>>2179475
>>2179440
You are all so god damn brainwashed. You really think life is better as a caveman hunter/gatherer? Go for it. Be my guest.

I bet you've never even been camping for more than day.

>>2179531
The irony, it's burning through my brain

>>2179490
>What do you want the future to be like?

I'm thinking it would be better without you in it, for starters.

>>2179541
hahaha, you're a funny guy!

>>2179531
This isn't propaganda, you know. Prehistoric man didn't live much longer than 30 years old.

Genetic enhancement of intelligence.
The true roadblock for science these days is energy. All of our energy sources are too inefficient, too expensive, and too weak. We need to develop new energy sources, which might require developments in numerous areas of science, technology, and definitely in all areas of physics.
If you look at the development of technology, it is obvious that it is in an exponential development. Technology builds on itself. New developments allow for faster development of even new technologies. If you believe in this idea, then the most direct application of this is to use genetics to increase the learning, memory, and speed of though capabilities of the brain.
Of course, this in itself will require numerous developments in genetics and the understanding of the genetic nature of intelligence before it can occur, and the moral issues need to be swept aside, especially those of religious folk.
Ultimately this will lead to an even faster rate at which new technologies are developed, making true space exploration an option. However, as it stands now, we are no where close to it being an option.

>>2179490
Empathy is the cancer, we need to relinquish ourselves from the inferiors. Eugenics is the only real way. We cannot let the nigger, the religious and the multiculturalist pro-islamists piggyback on society any longer. We need to learn how to pray on the weak, we need to eat them and use them to become More in control; not less. Realize this now and there will be prosperity - or pay the price, for, Atheism and the path of chaos is the last salvation of humanity. For the emperor, for the empire and for destiny we must die, then, and only then we can live for ourselves today.

/Soldier of Chaos

>>2179561
My god, the pure unending unfathomable faggotry.
Go do your homework.

>>2179561
>Atheism
>worship the Emperor
what?

>>2179374

> Also, the global population is going to peak and go into decline within fifty years. It's already happened in the first world countries.

Not as long as niggers and islam

>>2179567
LOL
just wait.

>>2179561
Enjoy being left behind by the rest of humanity because of your unwillingness to leave behind juvenile anti-social behavior, child.

joined international and disinterested effort.

far away from it due to power struggle, social and economic division and greed for the sake of it.

>>2179570

for?

them to outbreed us?

>>2179593
Doesn't work that way, bro. If it gets bad enough, immigration will shut down. And then what? They can starve in their own country all they want.

>>2179566
>>2179564

He's taking about warhammer 40k

"Beware the Alien, The Mutant, The Heretic"

"For the emperor."

chaos is a fraction in it.

>>2179598

Not as long as jews.

>>2179593
they will always be behind us in technology. as long as that remains true, there is nothing to worry about.
lucky the Chinese are a generally reasonable people.

>>2179608

Asians are an excellent race.

I hope they maintain their culture in the face of multiculturalism.

>>2179608
What the fuck are you people talking about? I thought that this would be a reasonable board. I guess fuck 4chan, I'll just go outside or something. Have fun kids.

>>2179211
This douchebag mainly:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/William_Proxmire#Legislative_career

We don't have the mo ey, he resources, or the technology.

/thread

>>2179602
>Suddenly a non-idiot appears.

What should I do, what should I do. *nervous nail biting*

D:

>>2179620

We are reasonable, and we see patterns too.

Obviously you are the issue.

>>2179643

Keep spamming racism!!!!!!

woooooooooooooite

>>2179645
Yeah fuck that guy, letting niggers and spics live is the crime.

>>2179631
We have the money(the entirety of NASA's budget cost less than buying tents for soldiers in Afghanistan), we have the resources(what resources are so scarce they make space travel impractical), and we pretty much have the technology(space colonies could be made with 1970s era technology).

>>2179620
?
The chinese are nothing if not pragmatic. The government is more authoritarian and oppressive than we have come to believe is a good idea in the western world, but they're no jihadists.

>>2179681
What we're missing is a reason.

There is not real reason to go to space right now. It's the same reason we haven't been back to the moon in decades. What's in it for us, as a species? Not much right now.

>>2179617
China has been a multicultural society since ancient times brohan. They just know how to oppress unsavory elemts properly.

>>2179699
Survivability, enormous quantities of metal in the asteroid belt, space manufacturing possibilities, etc, etc.

But mostly survivability of our species, problem is, most people don't really care about that...

>What we're missing is a reason.
>There is not real reason to go to space right now. It's the same reason we haven't been back to the moon in decades. What's in it for us, as a species? Not much right now.
I can't believe this needs to be posted each and every fucking time.

For a reason, how about a BIG FUCKING ROCK THAT STERILIZES THE PLANET TO A DEPTH OF TWO KILOMETERS?

>>2179261
>>2179267
>>2179264
if we lived in space, we could also draw energy from space. therefore relieving some of the energy consumption from earth. furthermore we could build giant power stations that shoot energy down to earth from space.

>>2179690
Think he was talking about the assumption that blacks and Muslims would always be technologically inferior. Which is laughable, and not even historically accurate.

>>2179645
>implying being antagonized by other races within the species is evolutionary incorrect, that humans are the only species to do so and if we were that it would be against our best evolutionary interests to do so. Now you get this realization. Maybe chaos and the way of the HIM is the light. Together with prayers to our legacy and destiny we can reach elevation. May the legion live and may our destiny be written with blood, we are blessed for we have chosen, we are the undivided - we are, one.

>>2179718
>>2179718
what are you trying to say that sand niggers revolutionized math or something? retard

>>2179714

This.

Even if we just make a mars base thats fine for preserving the species. plus we get multiple locations in the night sky to look out into the universe from, which should make a difference in our exploration of space with telescopes.

>>2179725
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islamic_Golden_Age

Why so ignant? Didn't read your history text books?

>>2179741
>implying that islam wasn't a minority in this golden age and that atheism, gays and jews wasn't welcome as today,

Fuck you and fuck your delusional history :)

>There is no greater retroactive force than Islam. / Churchill

>>2179752
So what's your point exactly?

>>2179752
>>2179752
>>2179725
Hey racist, there aren't any black people in space why don't you and your racist redneck butt buddies build a rocket and establish a pure white society in space?

They'll be saying this in a hundred years too.

Basically, what's the point. We go into space, see its cool and all and then what? Nothing. or we discover new shit and set another unrealistic goal to obtain in another couple of thousands of years.

>>2179771
Too black in space, we have to find out a way to turn it the same color as him first.

ITT: ignorance abounds

>>2179771

How do we know though?

They may be hiding against the inky blackness, with their eyes closed and mouth shut.

How do we know?

>>2179774
You can say the same thing about life on Earth. Or life anywhere, really. There is no point, other than in space we can last a bit longer.

>>2179780
>>2179782

My god, it's full of niggers.

>>2179752
he never said that.

Fuck space travel, invest all money in Artificial Intelligence.

Space travel will be trivially easy once we hit singularity. Everything else pales in fucking comparison.

>>2179785
Yes.

But then you could also argue "it has a point and purpose blah blah blah" but then you are a fucking creationist.

*sigh* I want my ignorance back.

>>2179790
>>2179782
>>2179780
How about the Moon then? The Moon's pretty damn white.

>>2179741

>hurr golden age

bitch please, learn2history. the only reason for this golden age was beacuse all the atheists ad jews came to the middeleast because christianity was fucking up europe.

try being an atheist in saudi arabia/iran today.

>>2179774
The couch potatoes shall inherit the earth.

And will burn all the same when the next rock or iceball comes.

Fuck you.
/sci/ I am disappoint

>>2179797

>The Singularity
>hurr durr computers will make us obsolete and they will also make us immortal. contradiction? no, because moore's law applied to everything but transistors and also bullshit explanation

>>2179811
Yeah, this thread kind of made me hate /sci/.

>>2179818
> Doesn't realize that Strong A.I. is the only thing necessary for the singularity to happen.
> Doesn't realize that in order to argue against the idea of Strong A.I. being possible, you need to argue that human brains are magical and its functions cant be replicated.
> Doesn't realize that supercomputers will be able to match the computational abilities of a brain sometime in the mid-to-late 2020's.

>>2179830

>When we can plug in enough transistors in the same room SUDDENLY A MIRACLE HAPPENS and then the Singularity and we're all uploading and flying off to the stars in starwisps because some fat neckbeard british writer told be so

>>2179809
You need to sit down and think about what you're saying. And read a fucking book, because the Golden Age of Islam was brought on just as much by Muslims as it was by Atheists and Jews. God damn.

>>2179844
Why do you even bother, bro? He's made up his mind, and no amount of reason or contradicting facts will make him change it. Your effort is wasted on his ignorance.

ITT
>/sci/ - history of islam and the plausibility of A.I

>>2179808

HES RIGHT BROTHERS.

THE SOUTH SHALL RISE AGAIN, ONCE EVERY DAY, FROM THE EAST.

>>2179860
feels bad man

>>2179830
You are my favorite person.

>>2179854
A minute ago it was the muslims who made the golden age. Now it's both the muslims, atheists and jews?

What's it gonna be son?

This thread is hilarious.

>>2179840
That's like, the dumbest straw-man I've ever heard in my life.

Of course it's more than just plugging in more transistors, but having sufficient horsepower is 100% necessary for a Strong A.I. to work. You'll notice that >>2179797 proposed investing large sums of money into A.I.

This is presumably because he acknowledges that it requires significant advances before it is possible, not just hardware ones. But A.I. must be possible, because human intelligence exists. Human level intelligence is not magical, and was designed by non-conscious, unguided evolutionary processes. It stands to reason that we can do much better. We already have done better than evolution in many areas (well solved areas of A.I. and computing), now the goal is to catch up in the areas where evolution still has us beat.

Fuck the losers, we're on our way out there. Try reading Carl Sagan's Pale Blue Dot or some.

But also, we don't fully understand the quantities of radiation beyond LOE, nor how to defend against it, although we have some ideas. And as previously mentioned, gravity would come in handy, because of the muscle and bone density loss, i.e. if you want to be able to return to a high gravity zone such as a planet.

>>2179899

Of course I believe in strong AI, any decent person would, but it seems silly to say "Well it's just a matter of investing money and working on it day after day after day", in a long mission to turn silicon to matter that can think, when it's far easier to take already existing computronium (ie Brains) that have already gone through the dumb matter->life->consciousness process and augment those.

For the last fifty years, the "problems of AI will be substantially be solved in 15 years", now the researchers seem to be backing down from true AI research to mind uploading and WBE pretending that's supposed to be AI and not "durp scan the conectome... done durp!".

tl;dr don't waste time on AI and get some posthumans up of in this Earth bitch

>>2179891
Sigh. That's not what I said. I was saying that Muslims have not always been technologically behind white people. And really they aren't even today, look at countries like the UAE, fucking oil money man.

>>2179891
>both three

>>2179919
This. Why not just grow larger brains out of rat neurons or something? Is there anything special about computers over the natural brain?

This thread is mixed with racism, hardcore gaming, scifi, and infantile idealism.

How chocking.

>>2179933
The average neckbeard can stand to look at one for hours, while natural brains must come in organic packaging that he is incapable of looking at for more than a few moments.

>>2179943
chocking indeed mr. mature

>>2179919
The obvious key difference in the last 60 years of A.I. research is that their hardware was extremely primitive, they grossly underestimated what it would take to match a brain in hardware terms. We have a much better idea these days thanks to advances in neuroscience. That is to say, a researcher in 1965 didn't really understand what he was getting into with the A.I. field. They didn't even know how much they didn't know.

The problems of creating an A.I. don't vanish with greatly improved hardware, but they start to shrink and become easier to solve. Computer vision was an insurmountable problem circa 1975, but in 2010 we have computers being sold as toys that can identify users and track their skeletal system in real-time (Kinect), we have face detection that works on tiny digital cameras, and so forth. TBH the field holding A.I. back the most is Psychology. They're doing a shithouse job of figuring that brain thing out.

A.I. research is never "wasting time". It has been an extremely productive field, just in ways you don't expect when you think about what "A.I." is:

http://www.stottlerhenke.com/ai_general/glossary.htm

Scroll down to "AI Effect".

A.I. is also productive on small budgets. NASA eats tens-of-billions of dollars per year, if even 1 billion dollar per year was directed at A.I. research the field would explode with innovation.

Strong AI has been barking up the wrong tree for decades. We're not built on binary logic.

>>2180081
Irrelevant. It doesn't have to achieve everything in exactly the same way, it just has to achieve it. There is no reason to believe that human neurons can do anything that a computer can't do in principle.

>>2180101
Oh, absolutely. Strong AI is clearly possible. We're the proof.

But here's the thing: We're still clinging to concepts that probably won't pan out. Strong AI is the 21st century alchemy - but we'll still get "chemistry" out of it.

Of the "alchemy" parts is seed AI - the idea that we'll turn on an AI, and it will immediately design something smarter than itself, wash, rinse, repeat, SINGULARITY.

But we can't design something smarter than ourselves. Can you? Stronger, faster, with specific abilities and properties, sure. But smarter? Not just faster thinking, but BETTER thinking? I don't know if it's possible. The best we, or any intelligence, will probably be able to do is do some blind experimentation and stumble in the right direction most of the time. Also, it may be very hard to beat the efficiency of the human brain, at least in this century. It'll be a slow process. At this point, genetic engineering for enhanced intelligence seems more viable.

>>2180128

Your point is valid, but I we could test for efficiency in solving certain problems. The AI that solves a problem in most efficient manner possible would be deemed 'more intelligent'. Also, once the principles of intelligence are better understood, we may well be able to understand what makes one system more intelligent than another.

>>2180208
I agree.

I'm just resisting the tide of wishful thinking and cultism that is Ray Kurzweil and company.

>>2179211
a life in space still requires material resources. So first we need to establish robotic mines and factories on the Moon and asteroids. The Google Lunar X Prize is designed to kick of that whole process.

>>2179281
>boring
dohohoho

>>2180640
Space travel isn't like in Star Trek, numbnuts.

I blame Gil Scott-Heron

>>2180101
>>2180128
>>2180208
>>2180287

All this. And then some.

>>2182095
FUCK YOU YOU FURRY

>What exactly are we waiting for?
A reason to.

Why don't we live in Liberia? Because we don't all want to live in poverty and die a horrible death.

Maybe once Earth is covered in hive cities then we can go live in space.

>>2182345

>>2179375
Communism preaches Atheism and didn't worked out... America society was build under protestantism work ethics and worked great...

extremists are a problem, and they are everywhere, not only in religion

>>2182408
Not sure if serious,

>>2182408
It didn't work out because communism is fucking stupid.
That's like blaming the computer parts when someone tries to cool it down by throwing a bucket of water on it. It's not the computer's fault it's being used by an idiot

>>2182414
No, really. Extremists of all kinds fail, almost by definition. They focus all their efforts in the wrong places.

>>2182439
my point was religion is not the reason the space run is the way it is... that's not even... /EJECT THREAD

>>2182461
I honestly didn't remember what this thread was about. I open a bunch and once I've read down to the bottom I just leave them in the background refreshing occasionally and replying to any new posts that I have reason to.

the turtle awoke before dawn

Space travel needs to become as cheap as air travel is today before that can happen. Also we need some incentive, though the best incentive is usually the need for more resources and there are plenty of untapped resources on other planets. Probably in a half a century or so when the world population reaches 9 billion we'll start moving people into space, though the bad news is that most of them will probably be Chinks.

>>2182408

>>Communism preaches Atheism and didn't worked out...

Communism does not own atheism. Objectivism is also atheistic, yet at the other end of the political spectrum entirely. Secular humanism is a more moderate ideology which is atheistic, as are many forms of buddhism.

>>America society was build under protestantism work ethics and worked great.

The founding fathers were deists inspired by secular enlightenment values.

>>2179211
the religious wars and factions currently ruling this planet are too busy killing eachother and starting neuclear war to spend money on science.

>>2183092
Actually, according to michio Kaku, the reason why the world is in such turmoil is that globalization is moving the world into that of a unified Type I civilization (on the Kardashev scale). These terrorists are just insurgents who opposed the new world order, which they refer to as "western culture". Eventually, these sentiments will die out as humanity forms into a more cohesive whole.

>>2183111
I just saw the brighest future for humanity ever imagined.

>>2184640
more like terrifying

a single government ruling all humanity, fuck that.

>>2184770
That depends on what kind of government we use. I could see a sort of hands-off meritocracy that alots power and privilege based on cumulative achievements working out pretty well.

>>2184782
so...basically, the entire world work work off of an "achievement unlocked" system?

>>2183111
I'd picture the future world order as a binary union between Asian cultures and Western cultures.