/sci/ - Science & Math

I'll be watching.

Fuck dude. Canadafag here. I heard about that load of shit they are pulling on you guys in the UK. I totally support you guys.

>>2147582

get ddossing too, takes no effort and youre exceptionally unlikely to get caught

>>2147590
you srs? my ISP has already cut my internet off twice for botnetting.

>>2147595

that's not getting v& thats merely a stumbling block

>>2147575

not your personal army

sage for entitled fuck heads

>>2147601

bump for the justices

>>2147595
Lol, that's why I don't DDoS - I can't do it without getting caught and getting nasty letters sent to me and shit. Not worth it lol. You guys in the UK do have my support though. I raged inside when I heard wat happened. Was cheering on the riot in the news and shit.

VEGETA

WHAT DOES THE SCOUTER SAY ABOUT ENGLAND'S TUITION COSTS!?!

>>2147620
THEY'RE STILL PRETTY LOOWWW

TRolls

ITT: Op gets the fuck out

>>2147626
Enjoy your shitty justification for paying shittons of money for basically the same education dohoho

OP YOU ARE FAGGY AS FUCK.

Jesus, it's either raise taxes or raise tuition fees. It's not going to stop poor people going to university just as the original tuition fee didn't.

Although if you ask me, i'd just cut the number of students going to university. 50% is fucking retarded/

Hey,

Now UK students pay half as much as American students pay.

Meh, go bitch to someone who cares.

>>2147666

>50% is fucking retarded

so educating half the population is bad thing? Agree with removing the shitty courses, but if you're not wealthy or sit outside of the thresholds for grants and the like you simply won't go to uni, the UK economy needs graduates to run our banks, consultancies, research and other exported services, we need to invest in people

>>2147672

and in America, you SUCK

>>2147672
You mean Americans pay twice as much as what UK students pay.
lol enjoy getting anally rapped by the green jewish penis

>>2147682
>>2147678

u mad?

>>2147692
UK residents are.
And I know Americunts are.

>>2147696

If you are going to be mad about something you cant change, you are wasting your time and your energy.

I pay exorbitantly high college tuition but I also go to an ivy league school and get some of the best education in the world.

Cant change what I pay, so why worry about it? I have much more important things to care about

>>2147682

>>2147704
>Something I can't change
>land of the free
>dohoho

>>2147706

Let me rephrase. Something I dont care about changing.

Continue to troll, please, it amuses me.

>>/sci/2147575

I'm in

>Operation education
>DDoS attack

>>2147711
>doesn't care that he's getting what is akin to being robbed in broad daylight
>dohoho

>>2147719

Nope. Not really.

Id have sympathy for the protestors, if I didnt know that 50% of them (at least) are doing shitty non-vocational degrees like fucking media studies.

I have a quick fix - the non-vocational subjects are charged fees and the vocational ones arent. Job done.

>>2147724
That's what I thought.

Society benefits when people are educated. Since society reaps some of the benefits, society should cover some of the costs. But the individual also benefits. So the individual should also cover costs.

bump

Capitalism is the real idiocy here. We have a bunch of people who want to learn things, and a bunch of people who want to teach them those things, and everybody else in the country wants those people to learn those things. And yet somehow everyone gets caught up on some intangible nonsense called 'money'.

It's time for a change.

>>2147677

Only a small proportion of the population will get any significant benefit from studying academic subjects at university level. Do you really think 50% of the British population can get a university degree without standards being lowered even further? Barely 50% of the British population can get a grade C in GCSE mathematics and English, and all you need to do to get a good grade at GCSE is be able to write your name on the paper. A trained fucking chimp could get a C in English.

There's a good argument for giving a greater proportion of the population some kind of training after they finish school, but the belief that everyone should have a traditional degree is retarded. All it does is devalue university and waste money sending dim kids from middle class families to take degrees in David Beckham studies at universities founded after the invention of the iPod.

That money would do much more good if it were spent giving sorely needed funds to universities that aren't shit, or running vocational courses for people who aren't interested in academia.

>>2147808
No. No one wants to teach them those things for free. The only want to teach them for money. Nobody wants to donate buildings and textbooks for free either. Everyone wants money for their work and goods. Grow up.

>>2147867

basically what you have said there, is that some people are thick naturally? so let's just not educate them?

(almost) EVERYONE is capable of studying to a high standard, with the right guidance, support, ambition and drive. this is why private schools always perform better than state schools.

Walesfag here, labout assembly government will cover student costs over original 3K cap for all welsh born students, scottish students dont pay anything.
U jelly englandfags?

>>2147910

zomg I didn't know there was a degree in how to penetrate sheep more effectively

>>2147915
Better than essexgirls.
also, why u mad?

>>2147885
Your mind is closed, capitalist. Open up.

>>2147919

see attached

>>2147935

>>2147935
SFW board, please delete.

>>2147885
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u6XAPnuFjJc

>>2147944

done

>>2147963
Thanks. It was a little awkward when I enlarged that picture to see what it was, considering I'm in the middle of a computer lab >_>

>>2147974

yeah that sheep was disgusting

How do students not realise that these price increases are a good thing? They will keep the riffraff out and may go some way to restoring the value that a degree once held.

Hang on... it means that they may have to get a job instead of leaching off the government for years

>>2147959
Thanks for this link, good video.

>>2147575
>Coalition government is going to triple student fees
>Let's attack the Lib Dems
>Implying that attacking the Lib Dems instead of the Labour-Tory coalition government will accomplish anything

*sigh*

I could Write a wall of text about the fact we have a government the no one voted for changing the law so that they can staying power for longer.
Or about how party's got voted for because they weren't going to raise tuition fees and yet here they are raising tuition fees, so as tempted as I am to scream " not your personal army " I'm not because this isn't really a personal thing, it dose and will affect the whole.

>>2148067

lib-dems betrayed students and their voters

if they voted against it would be ok.

>>2148067
Political science graduate from the labour gavornment

>>2148083
>A couple of lib dems support the tuition hike
>Most of the Labour/Tories support the tuition hike

Yes... clearly our priority should be to attack those traitorous lib dems.

Just like your priority in a zombie apocalypse should be to brutally murder your friend who got bit before starting to worry about the dozens of zombies about to gnaw on your delicious brains

>>2148083
I'm a Lib Dem supporter, and a student, and I have to say I understand the policy, and I understand the dilemma they're in. Most people seem only to focus on one aspect of the dilemma, and I have yet to find anyone who a) objects to the policy, AND b) actually knows anything about it beyond the tabloid headline.

Prove me wrong?

>>2148067

>Labour-Tory coalition

Nope.avi

Also, the libdems are getting so much flak because they said they would oppose any increases in tuition fees, gaining a large student vote in the process. Now they've rolled over, and so the student backlash begins.

>>2148094

look, the point is to get on the news, fuck everything else. get on the news and people listen, we should launch a cyber attack on something, doesn't matter what, so long as some bbc reporter states that irate students have taken down the lib dems website in protest etc.

i mean if someone wants to hack something to make a point then please do

>>2148108
Students are too lazy to do anything meaningful though. That's why they're students

I generally support higher tuition. I'm increasingly tired of college being treated like a four year party. Raising tuition kicks out the people who care the least. If you want to send poor people to college, high tuition + merit/need based aid.

Besides, professors like to eat, and I think it's more fair university students pay more of that then the public at large.

Most people are in favour of these raises, why should we pay for some dumb cunt to study sports science or media studies when they are just going to go on the dole afterwards?

>>2148109
>fuck making sense, I just want my retarded irl raid to make the headlines

NOT YOUR PERSONAL ARMY FAGGOT.

>>2148133
Because it's nice to live in a nation that allows its children a few years of independent life where they need nothing but read books and dream.

We need to pin this to the top of the board.

>>2148121
>Raising tuition kicks out the people who care the least.

And punishes those who want it the most.

>>2148193
How? there are dozens of grants to help people that need it

>>2148167
Enough about secondary school.
Why should we pay for some dumb cunt to study sports science or media studies when they are just going to go on the dole afterwards?

"I got a 1st"
"I got a 1st too, but mines better because I paid more for it"

Pin

>>2148121
>Raising tuition kicks out the people who care the least.
I fail to see the correlation between how much money someone's parents make and how much they want to go to school. I would argue that raising tuition kicks out the people who most need to be there.

>>2148208
"I got a 1st"
"I got a 1st too, but so did everyone because labour lowered the standards so much.

>>2148224
See
>>2148202

>>2148226
This didn't happen. Did you know?

Not your personal army.

Sage for /b/ shit.

>>2148241
Except it did

>>2148257
Citation on everyone getting a first then please.

I honestly don't feel that bad for you.

Running a university is expensive. Lots of students get bullshit useless degrees. I paid more for school at a bottom end state university in the states (aka, a school no one in the UK has ever heard of).

Your nanny state is in trouble financially, and they are trying to make the country not crash and burn. Grow up and pay your damn bills.

Also, feels good after the britfags so often go "Hurr durr, you have to pay lots more for school in the US, sure is superior herp derp". Sure is karma being a bitch.

>>2148248
Corrupt government supporter detected.

>>2148282
Sad to see that anyone is in favor of financial oppression. People like you are the reason why America has become a plutocracy.

>>2148267
Labour promoted uni
Unis had places on low entry requirement courses
These got filled up
Unis made more places on the low entry requirement courses
This made them more money than high entry requirement courses
Funding was taken from high entry requirement courses and given to low entry requirement courses
High entry requirement courses lowered their entry requirements to attract more people
Standards slipped so courses were made easier to compensate
More people got high marks
Labour flaunted their 'success' and increased funding to unis
Courses were made even easier in order to get more funding

>>2148300
There is a difference between mollycoddling stupid people and helping those that need finances

>>2147736
Non-vocational charged, vocational not charged?
So you're saying that, for example, those on science courses (i.e. biochemistry-related) should pay whilst those who are training for specific jobs are not?
Are you retarded?

On a related note, even if I weren't currently in university accommodation with the risk of expulsion if I attempted a DDoS, I wouldn't help.
These changes won't affect me but they will affect those currently in year 12 or below.
I attended the London Demo, nothing came of it apart from a few idiots being charged for attempted murder from dropping a fire extinguisher.
This will just be another act of vandalism which will get us nowhere.

>>2148133
SOME people study USEFUL things.

>>2148300

Im not in favor of financial oppression.

I am saying, take out fucking loans, and get a fucking job, then pay off your loans, and don't bitch about the cost of it. If you are really in need of money to go to school in the US, the government does pay for pretty much everything, and there are an obscene number of scholarships for underprivileged people.

Don't whine and bitch if you get a stupid degree that you paid alot of money for, that you can't get a job in, IE African American studies or some other esoteric degree that is only good for teaching other people about your area of study.

>>2148328
BIRDS go TWEET

>>2148315
>that need finances
Need finances? Allow more students into the school. This will require more staff. Not a problem, with the new increase in tuition revenue and the current availability of prospective lecturers this is easily accomplished with an excess of revenue over cost, profit. So we accomplish several things with this:
1. more people being educated
2. more careers and career availability
3. more funding for whatever academic project the university wants

Problems, academic institutions?

>>2148334
>I am saying, take out fucking loans, and get a fucking job, then pay off your loans, and don't bitch about the cost of it.
This system is set up so that it is impossible to pay off those loans. We will be hogtied to the banks for the rest of our lives if we let this slide any further.

>>2148305
... So at what point did everyone get a first?

>>2148343
Since Thatcher and Reagan decided that everyone needed to unlock their home equity, almost everyone has been hogtied to the bank for their entire lives.

>>2148343
This is why people hate students.
It's very easy to pay off a loan

>>2148351
At what point did labour not devalue the degree?

>>2148351
You don't get satire do you?

>>2148343

>impossible to pay off loans

What, are they giving you like 28% interest on the loans, compounded daily?

Oh wait...

>It was repaid at the rate of 9% of gross income over £15,000 a year (different limits apply to unearned income and non-residents). The interest rate on loans was changed on 1 September each year and the annual rate was set to the Retail price index increase the previous April (making the loans interest-free in real terms).

>. Students will repay their loans and tuition fees after graduation in the same income-dependent way as at present. Interest on the loans will still be tied to inflation, so they have a zero 'real' rate of interest.

from http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tuition_fees

How is that impossible? If you make 15k pounds a year, they automatically go to pay off your loan, and apperantly you don't have a nasty interest rate either. I mean, if the loan was really so bad, you could always just write a check to help pay of the balance, right? (sorry if you can't actually do this in the UK)

I am still in school, working on a master's degree. I am accruing something like $2 a day on $10,000 worth of student loans last time i checked in detail.

>>2148368
Well, most of the time they weren't devaluing degrees, they only did that a few times. Your claim was not that they devalued degrees, but that they had made degrees value-LESS. You have climbed down from that stance, and I'm glad of it. Welcome back.

>>2148372
Oh, his point was satirical was it? It can be so hard to tell...

>>2148377
Students are lazy, self entitled cunts and refuse to get a job

>>2148377
Life on 15k pounds a years sounds awesome when paying off loans. What does that leave the person with for housing and food? Especially now that the cost of living has skyrocketed.

>>2148388

Implying people who don't bother to get an education are lazier than people who do.

>>2148386
You satire, like schrodigners cat, like conckers being band from schools on health and safety grounds. Stretching things to an absurd degree to criticise

>>2148397
Most people work for a living

>>2148392
About £2,000 more than the average wage

>>2148401

Smart people get an education before finding a career.

People who don't have an education were too lazy and stupid to get one.

>>2148409
Why would people waste time getting an education when they can get 50k a year plumbing?

>>2148405
On 15k they'd be 6k below average wage before spending, repaying, or being taxed, a single penny.

>>2148388

That is why I don't feel bad for them. I am still a student over here in the US, working on a graduate degree, but I fully intend to go find a job that will do something for the good of society once I am done. Yes, getting an education is expensive. The government that used to pay for a majority it is strapped for cash right now.

Also, the arguement I see against it is kind of funny. For a long time in Texas, where I live, all the state run universities charged the same rates for tuition. IIRC, back in the 90s, they removed the state imposed cap completely, and let each university set its own tuition. As it is now, all schools charge different rates depending upon how many people they have wanting to go there, and how 'good' they appear in the public eye. UT, one of the best public schools in the state, the students pay just under 5k per semester, coming out to about 10k per year. My university, for 12 hours of undergrad classes, per semester is ~1.4k. That doesnt include other fees that they also stack on. I payed about 6k per semester for everything, including dorms, meal plans, lab fees, etc when i was doing my undergrad. And that is in a state with zero cap on the tuition rates.

>>2148420
Curse my flabby old data. They'd actually be a little over £10k shy of current average UK wages.

ITT: Educators and sheep trying to prevent this from operation from happening.

"The person who takes a job in order to live - that is to say, for the money - has turned himself into a slave.”

>>2148392

15k pounds is the equivalent of ~30k USD per year. I live on ~10k per year as a student. Also, read your own countries damn rules. You pay 9% of your income over 15k per year, not every cent you make over 15k per year. Say you make 16k pounds per year. you would pay... 90 pounds a year. Thats less than what I pay per month in rent.

>>2148405
>>2148420
That's a fantastic life. Livin' like Greenspan on that.

>>2148377
>>2148360
With the new proposals, it becomes impossible to repay the loan early.
You'd be stuck with about a £28k ($50k approx.) debt when you get your degree. Post-Grad. would be an extra £9k/year on top of that, which you have to pay upfront for non-vocational and non NHS-based courses, and the vocational courses only get funding for the first year.

>>2148438
Further to this point, that number is the *current* system - the proposed arrangement people are getting feisty about ups the threshold to £21,000.

Students emerging into jobs that pay £21k won't pay a single penny for their education.

ITT: Educators and sheep trying to prevent this operation from happening.

"The person who takes a job in order to live - that is to say, for the money - has turned himself into a slave.”

>>2148444
It's £6,000 a year
3
X
£6,000
=
£28,000

>>2148444

I will say not being able to pay your loan early is kind of bullshit.

But I am working on my post-grad, and I am paying for it all out of pocket, or with loans. I am paying somthing like $4k US for grad classes. But again, I am at a bottom end, cheap cheap cheap school for the US. And if my job pays well enough once I get out of school, i can write a single large check to the bank and not have to worry about student loans ever again (not very likely though).

>>2147575

>>2147575
Im 17 atm and going to uni next year, so i wont be effected by the increase, feelsgoodman.txt

I just cant wait to see people who take film studies and American studies or other shit degrees to leave uni with shit loads of debt and then struggle to get a 20k per year job after and then spend the rest of their lives wishing they hadn't wasted 3 years and about 30k.