/sci/ - Science & Math

No they're great, and significantly upping your intake is a great way to show your inner Scientist and protest these right-wing internet racists. Guzzle them down to show you are for Science and Reason!

>>15946730
Seed oils? That's so last six months. This six months we're scared of Parsley. Time to make a multi-million dollar empire on parsley-free dressings!

>>15946915
Parsley's fine. Cilantro is evil.

>>15946923
Literally poison.

>>15946730
>be a retard
>overeat, favor sugar, fried crap over real food (doesn't matter if it's fast food or homemade)
>rejects vegetables, legumes
>thinks that fruits are as healthy as vegetable
>weekly alcohol binge
>no exercise
>OIL SEEDS ARE LE BAD!
Retard people doing food "witch hunt" be like.

>If you're fat, you're a retard.

>>15946804

>>15946730
If those outlets are saying seed oils are fine then they're certainly not

>>15946960
Wow, them's fax! Buy my book and special avocado salad dressing!!

sneed oils?

excess calories leads to weight gain

>>15947023
you look like that and you say that because you didn't use a meme arrow quote

>>15948138
If only I had that much money. Too honest.

>>15946923
they're both the same plant

>>15946730
As far as I know there is nothing inherently more dangerous or unhealthy about seed oils over any other type of oil.
The issue is that are in absolutely everything and nearly impossible to avoid which adds unnecessary caloric density to foods contributing to obesity.

>>15948811
just like you and obama are the same human

>>15948811
no it's the spanish name for corriander

>>15948866
>As far as I know there is nothing inherently more dangerous or unhealthy about seed oils over any other type of oil.
Yes there is, the production methods, the contamination, the sterilants, the break down products of n6 linoleic acid the fact it doesn't stimulate a satiety signal because the number of double bonds it has produce less FADH2 than a saturated fat.

>>15946730
anything people didn't eat 300 years ago is necessarily bad
>just avoid le heckin processed foods!!!
Seed oils are always injected into processed foods.
Avoid Dunning-Kruger retards such as >>15946933 who couldn't even tell you what cortisol does

>>15947041
They only fact anyone needs to know is 50% weight gain with identical calories.

Personally I dont like them because they seem to indicate low-quality food.

>>15948866
Please god tell me you're not taking these fucking shills seriously. You do know none of this is argued in good faith, don't you? You think retards screaming "LITERALLY POISON" over and over again could have a snowflake's chance in hell of being genuine?

>>15948866
>>15949843
>>15950091
https://youtu.be/PvZk-jNqzgE?si=wL5iXhye5uz8a_Nz

>>15950619
If this video is not just that guy going "No." immediately, then 37 minutes of the It's Always Sunny theme, it's getting a thumbs down.

>>15950761
Who are you darling?

>>15948866
How much are big sun and big rape paying you?

>>15950091
Post waistline.

>>15947023

>>15949546
The two explanations are that there are things being added to our food supply which causes excess weight gain, or that everybody decided to start binge eating for no reason whatsoever.

>>15946960
They have as much reputation as the virginity of the oldest prostitute.

>>15946730
Don't post here anything that comes from those cradles of disinformation. The only safe seed oils are those that don't require a process that changes the chemistry of the raw materials. For other seed oils it heavily depends on your own genetics. Remember kids: evolutionary genetics always win.

Why don't you want to talk about the harmful effects excess consumption of linoleic acid the most notable omega 6 fatty acid has on the body?
Yes it's an essential fatty acid but in tiny amounts I think around 5 or 50 mg a day or something reflecting its general dietary scarcity outside of seed oil consumption

>>15950836
>>15950839
Didn't watch this >>15950619?

>>15950940
No, do I need to?

>>15949843
This. IIRC studies found hogs get fattened up when fed high-pufa feed vs becoming lean on sat. fat - I think coconuts oil. Sneedoil hogs have same physique as this >>15946938

>>15950945
Yes, only. /Thread

Why is being afraid of food so popular with upper class young white males? Can someone explain this batshit insane phenomenon to me?

>>15951288
But I've already followed Knobbe's other work, what does this offer that's any different? n6 messes up your physiology

>>15951302
Because our food system has been systemically compromised through hyper processed food, People like you claimed transfats were fine

Why do Jews like seed oils so much?

>>15951311
No, you stop right there. If you were actually worried about health you'd be advocating for an organic, mostly plant-based diet. But you faggots never do. It's always alcohol, cigars and bacon, but X trendy food this six months is "literally poison", that just happens to coincide with some quack pushing a bunch of books or food products.

>>15951498
>If you were actually worried about health you'd be advocating for an organic, mostly plant-based diet.
No, regardless the propaganda that says otherwise, vegetarians are all unhealthy due to their idiotic insistence on a nutritionally deficient diet. Vegetarians are mentally ill, vegetarianism is an eating disorder, they all claim they're holier than thou saints because of their diet, which shows that they developed their diet for narcissistic public image reasons rather than for rational ones

>>15951525
Here we go with the made up bullshit to protect your fragile imagined masculinity. Humans aren't carnivores, you dumb asshole. No ape is.

>b-b-but dey eat some meat!
SOME. Even in chimps it results in a small minority of their diet, and if your role model is a chimpanzee you need to be genocided to begin with because those fucking things are demons.

You should consider transitioning. You've already got the Cosmo reading addiction to pass. Go for it, sweaty.

>>15946730
Yes, hyper processed oils that contain nothing from the whole food matrix besides its isolated omega 6 fat isn't great for you. May even be worse than added sugar or HFCS.
Whole nuts and seeds are fine in moderation though.
There are reasons why (large) warm-blooded land animals naturally have little polyunsaturated body fat or milk fat, but instead contain mostly palmitic, stearic, and oleic fatty acids.

I learned about seed oils bad from some microbiologists giving lectures for some low carb/carnivore thing. They made pretty good cases that humans are evolved to eat red meat, how it represents the most optimal nutritional profile, how carbs (especially fructose) and seed oils (totally wrong fats profile) fuck things up when the body tries to metabolize them, how many diseases are vastly more correlated with them than meat or animal fats. They showed microbiology charts, hormones, showed studies and stats while considering their credibility levels (not all studies are same). Seems far more science than those articles which don't address anything. I'm just a chud though.

>>15951598
We're not chipanzees. Homo sapiens is pretty much defined by socially hunting megafauna and cooking meat. About 1M-10k years ago is the evolutionarily significant time frame to consider. Before or after doesn't fit our bodies as well.

>>15946730
Yes... seed oils are very bad for you. They promote inflammation;cancer, obesity, and diabetes.

>>15951498
>you'd be advocating for an organic,

>mostly plant-based diet
no, most plants are literally trying to kill you, they're full of toxins harmful to our health
I advocate, for quality animal fat and meat consumption

>>15951598
Your meme is stupid
I have never met someone who had to tell me they eat meat because they're mostly not mentally ill freaks unlike the overwhelming majority of vegans

>>15951934
Low carb down under have some very high quality videos from what I found

>>15952079
There are about 500 threads a day on this fucking site doing just that. This is literally one of them. The sneed oil fucking nonsense all comes from "paleo" faggots.

>>15952321
seed oils are demonstrably harmful to our health why does this offend you?

>>15951934
>some
...red meat. True, and insipid betas (being betas) want shortcuts to being alpha....there are none, and there is only one of those....and being alpha has to be about something extraordinary....not poor intuition about diet. Chimps don't have avacados. Time to grown up, meat bitch. Far cry: Primal, and all other fantasies don't count.

>>15952478
NPCs get extremely upset at the prospect of having yet ANOTHER thing to stress over. This is why their default reaction to new harms or threats is denial. It's inbuilt, they're trying to negotiate with their own despair.

>>15952478
>>15952796
They're not "demonstrably" damaging to health. You're making shit up to sell products. God damn shilling should be a capital offense.

>>15952073
>You should just eat meat because plants will kill you!
This is quite possibly the dumbest fucking opinion on diet I've ever heard.

>>15953189
>They're not "demonstrably" damaging to health. You're making shit up to sell products. God damn shilling should be a capital offense.
the absolute state of seed oil defenders

>>15953189
What products are we shilling? Humans had never even encountered purified seed oils until a century ago.

>>15952796
>NPCs get extremely upset at the prospect of having yet ANOTHER thing to stress over.
I see this, but they really shouldn't get upset; It's pretty simple to eat whole foods that don't require a factory and modern industrial processes to make. Sure get some slop every once in a while but otherwise eat foods that like say, a well to-do person 200+ years ago would have eaten e.g. eggs dairy fish meat fruits vegetables etc

>>15953439
Mostly avocado containing bullshit. See: >>15947023

>>15953508
Btw, nobody had ever experienced a modern avocado until a few decades ago either.

https://youtu.be/BMOjVYgYaG8

>>15953512
>>15953508
Yes so eat animal fats, is it really that hard for you to understand?

>>15953986
>EAT MEAT EAT MEAT EAT MEAT
No.

>>15952796
>NPCs get extremely upset at the prospect of having yet ANOTHER thing to stress over.
They should be happy to learn that there is something out there thats bad for them which is easily avoided. Its not hard to not eat seed oils, just don't buy them when you go to the grocery store and that takes care of everything.

>>15954037
What is your animus against eating animals?

>>15954058
It's added into everything, it's not simply a case of a few products, even fucking raisins are coated with seed oils

>>15954116
I like animals. Now eating humans, that I'm okay with.

>>15950619
So in the 19th centruy there were only 8 papers released on heart disease and of those only two were about heart attacks.
What the hell changed in the 20th century that it became an epidemic?

Just ate delicious home-baked bread with evoo. Will have fresh seafood spaghett tonight. Feels good not eating sneedoils tbdesu.

>>15954730
>evoo
It's called olive oil, you pretentious faggot. God hates the upper class.

>>15955066
soon comrade

>>15946730
yes

>>15954116
16 years off my life.

>>15953189
The truth needs no defending. This "plants will kill you" is one of the canned "carnivore" thrusts. Where you been?

>>15954654
Did you watch it? Blame Ike.

>>15954730
It's the best of the worst. All vegetable oils are bad. And olive is still pufas. And no replacing with plan and coco won't scale, and are already environmental disasters themselves.

>>15955066
>>15955080
How is sing gods d, the ultimate bitch move?

>>15957098
>The truth needs no defending. This "plants will kill you" is one of the canned "carnivore" thrusts. Where you been?
No, it's a very basic observation that most plant components have no incentive to be eaten outside of certain exceptions like some fruit which are edible by some animals.
Some animals have evolved some specific mechanisms to more safely consume some plants.

>>15957252
Okay, well I'm going to be trusting pseudoscience from a bacon and alcohol addict over actual established fact. Yessir!

Now here's a bit of truth for you: you a neo-weimarian peasant with zero self-control. You have embraced a degenerate ideology that makes a virtue of your vices and demonizes those who have correctly told you you are trash. Repent.

>>15957252
Fruit directly evolved for us especially to eat to move their seeds. I'll hear that broccoli does something, as you are wholly killing the plant, keeping in mind of love broccoli and I'm wonderfully healthy. That's the final word..it's true everything else is more or less poor mind games. But meat bitches are such posturing betas to do their own tests, and just let some marketing jew call you a fag and get you so do anything like a clown.

>>15946915
Quick rundown?

>>15957430
>bacon and alcohol
meat mixed with artificial preservatives and a plant based toxin?

Why does pointing out that most plants don't want to be eaten piss you off so much that you keep calling me names?

>>15957577
>Fruit directly evolved for us
Some fruits, most fruits are toxic to us and designed to be eaten by specific species. Humans have selected out a tiny number that were less toxic and found to be amenable to agricultural production and/or developed processing methods to make them more edible.

All brasicas like broccoli are goiterogenic they bind iodine leading to mineral deficiencies and swelling.

>meat bitches
All I'm inviting is open discussion on what is and isn't safe to eat, getting you to acknowledge that seed oils are harmful and animal products are safe to eat is already a huge enough hurdle in the face of entrenched ideologies,

>>15951302
is your picture complete bullshit? can't find the underlined quote in the article:
https://bigthink.com/neuropsych/jordan-peterson-carnivore-diet/

it's well known jordan's meat diet helped him (at least short term)
and he took benzo's cause wife got cancer or something like that
(prescribed antidepressants because autoimmune reaction wtf?)

>>15957583
God damn you're an idiot. I was making fun of the faggots spamming food fear here 24/7. For some reason ever since that Adkins faggot there's been a trend of being afraid of a new plant food every six months (but never meat).

>>15957831
You're not pointing anything out. You're just sperging out and claiming scientific victory. If you were right every hooved animal would be dead by their second year of life.

>>15958092
Have you considered the possibility that they're right?

>>15958094
Where exactly am I wrong?

>>15958114
Have you ever considered that you're wrong? America really needs to pass anti-shill laws. I'm tired of this bullshit.

>>15958217
So which food corp do you work for? Pepsi? Kellogs?

>>15958092
Yes I know but I expect the joke to be based on something real at least, like parsley having some cancerogenic or something

>>15958251
I work for Primal Kitchen*. Am I based yet?

*Primal Kitchen is a wholly owned subsidiary of Kraft Foods Inc.

>>15958390
>*Primal Kitchen is a wholly owned subsidiary of Kraft Foods Inc.
lol

>>15950824
the modern world is so dysgenic jfc it is billions of these kinds of freaks that are lazy, retarded nihilists who hate anyone even remotely motivated, disciplined or successful at anything

>how dare you have self esteem you fucking nazi
>reeeeeeeeeeee!

>>15958251
>>15958404
Both of theses corps are peak meat shills.

>>15957844
>selected
So 10,000 years of intelligent selection: still "poisonous".
>processing
So olives.....and?
>iodine
It's an essential nutrient.
>entrenched ideologies
Yes, which is all "carnivores" have. Long past time to grow up. Horse teeth, not lion teeth. Gorillas have bigger canines then humans. How much meat they eat? Bones (which teeth effectively are) change last in the glacial pace of evolution.

>>15946730
I've been taking pumpkin seed oil with no detrimental side effects. It's definitely helped clear my brain fog.

True fact: the beef rancher lobby has INSANE power in america. That's where most of this idiotic propaganda comes from. It's also why america has such a poor environmental record. Cattle ranchers are almost single-handedly responsible for Yellowstone Park being such a mismanaged fucking disaster.

>>15958491
>It's also why america has such a poor environmental record
Why are you trying to sabotage your own post?

>>15958491
Are you not aware of the sheer amount of lobbying power exercised by the sugar industry, seed oil industry and seventh day adventists?

>>15958623
You dumb faggot. If you think all of those COMBINED even equal the lobbying power of JUST cattle ranchers you know NOTHING about american conspiracy.

>>15958780
Oh, you're trolling, ah I didn't realise.

>>15958796
Oh you're reddit. That was clear from your first post.

>>15958880
I don't use reddit though but you seem familiar with redditors?

>>15958882
Well yeah, blue boards are full of redditors.

>>15958491
>ITS A CONSPIRACY!!!
https://www.psycom.net/paranoid-schizophrenia

>>15958491
It came from rw twatter posters starting around 2015 - mainly popularizing Ray Peat's writings, you leftoid conspiratard

>>15959452
It literally is, you fucking retard.

>>15959466
I work in conservation. I fucking know better.

What do you think of the evidence presented in this short talk about how we got into the current mess?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SOgH9LDwBzY

>>15957583
It contains phytoestrogens at 1.2x the rate of basedbeans. Haven’t you ever wondered why Italians love designer clothes? Why they were so useless in WWII? It’s time to cut it out of your diet parsleycuck.

>>15958491
But that is only cause of the blue collar beta fetishizing steak as "winner" food.

>>15960870
And they do that because of propaganda. Amerilards will believe anything as long as it plays to their vices.

>>15961132
Nah it's instinctual. For all the Madison ave jewry, they just meet retards in the middle and find out what they want and service that.

>>15961195
Yeah retards also want candy, but no society has a diet comprised of 90% candy. That requires propaganda that plays to the lowest common denominator's vices. Kind of like all this diet fearmongering bullshit.

We're gonna start seeing a LOT more "kidcarnivores" soon.

>>15946730
pretty much what >>15946960 said. any consensus shared by both redditors and journos may as well be the exact wrong estimation of the situation

>>15961306
That's not how that works.

>>15961237
Oh you're that retarded vegan spammer from /fit/

>>15961549
I haven't been to /fat/ in years.

>>15961237
It just makes me think of Letterman. Loved cigars, but thin as a rail, proven by 30 years on national television, loved running. Then a triple bypass? Sure we don't know his diet, but he could have eaten nearly anything at that weight (actually when a calorie is a calorie). Some peoples genetics just make you go outta wack, even if you are doing everything right.

>>15961306
So livestock are refrigerators or thermodynamic miracle amplifiers.....you can't write this stuff. Stupidity like this is entirely unpredictable from a better mind.

>>15946730
No idea, but eso people love them, so I bet they're useless in the best case and harmless in the worst. Probably a scam either way.

>>15961763
Smoking, you may be surprised to learn, is also bad for your health.

>We keep following our vices and doing unhealthy things and we can't understand why we're not healthy
Gee, I wonder.

>>15961306
are there people who are dumb enough to believe this? It's a troll post by vegetarians isn't it?

>>15961797
What the fuck are "eso people"?

>>15961799
Nope, it's pure cattle rancher lobby propaganda. It's not targeted at anyone with an IQ above 115. It looks plausibly deniable enough to reinforce amerilard vices so it will be repeated. That's good enough to control the culture.

>>15961306
Overplays the point but the fundamental message is true.
there is a quantity of meat available from the waste products and byproducts of the rest of what we eat it's actualllly a substantial quantity

Simon Fairlie wrote a book on it and called it the default livestock.
veganism is an incredibly wasteful system because it cann't capture most of what it produces.
when you might get problems with livestock is when you enter luxury consumption rates.

>>15961826
to give an example take wheat, you might get around 13-16 tonnes of biomass dry matter from a hectare of this at most 50% will be grain so let's go with 16t total and 8t of grain. leaving 8t or more as straw(stems) or chaff(protective casings around the grain) both of which can either be fed to cattle or used as bedding material mixing with dung and urine to then be returned to the soil as manure.
now this 8t of grain gets taken to either an on farm storage bin or some large off site storage where it'lll be tested for its quality and its feed value determined including insect and fungal content, these failings are then redirected into livestock consumption so maybe we have 7.5t but it'll depened on the quality of the crop and the harvest year how bad the losses are.
now say we this grain sits in storage for a while, then gets bought by a processor who might convert it into white bread flour, but he only wants to starchy endosperm so all of the bran and other filtered components get sent for livestock consumption, so we're down to maybe 4t,
now some of this flour will spoil and be redirected to livestock too
so this white flour gets sold to make bread at some commercial bakery, a proportion of this bread fails or spoils with the waste being redirected to animal consumption


these figures ain't exactly accurate but they're indicative of the process and losses

>>15951498
>plant based
>healthy
SAAAAAAAR DO NOT REDEEEEEM

Seed oils are okay unless they are oxidized and you have heavy metals and Iron in your body.
Ferropoptosis is associated with all sorts of diseases. You’ll get cancer and Alzheimer’s.

>>15961997
no, it's not just the oxidation omega 6 is bad for you

Funny story at the end. exploding uniforms.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q2UnOryQiIY

Interesting talk about silencing nutrition science
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yIXbnCZ5kGw

>>15961911
Pajeets eat like 4 tons of butter a year. That's why they all have double chins.

>>15961997
There's a reason nature puts lecithin, vitamin e and other powerful anti-oxidant cofactors alongside the fats in seeds and nuts.

>>15946730
it's the latest dietary witch hunt trend.
first it was animal fat
then it became sugar
then it became whatever it became.
truth is just don't be a fat fuck and live a healthy life style and you will be great.
obesity is literally worse than any (edible) dietary choice you can possibly make

>>15954654
sneed oils mf. that's what this thread is about

>>15961805
Wait, does seed oils mean normal shit like canola oil?

>>15958094
animals co evolved with those plants to resist these toxins. ruminant bellies are designed to break these toxic molecules down to safe molecules. something we humans cannot do.
if you feed a koala something other than eucalyptus leaves it will die.
you have cognitive dissonance. try the carnivore diet for a month instead of deepthroating the reddit experts

>>15963264
just stick to fat from animal sources.

coconut,avocado oils would be the second best and then the cold pressed oils.
avoid seed oils like the plague

>>15946730
Practically anything in excess is bad for you.

>>15962826
no they don't.
i live in india you fucking you cow brained mong.
it's very difficult to find butter here. what these hindu cow worshipping animals eat is a grain based diet with some milk and eggs.
this is the reason why they are so short and unathletic

>>15963270
you know maybe you should do more research before blabbering your bro science like a retard?
just saying things that sound nice doesn't make you right

>>15962854
>latest dietary with hunt trend
i mean seed oils didn't exist until a couple of decades ago?
all the harm those oils did was put on saturated fats.

>>15963277 digits checked!!
Are you serious?
You realize what I was saying, right anon? Are you mistakenly thinking I meant to say seed oils are bad for you?
It's a fact that if you consume enough water you will die.
Anything in excess is bad for you, even oxygen.

>>15963287
your words sounded like you were trying to muddy the water
>brooo just eat in moderation brooo
i understand that you come in good faith

>>15963305
You read towards the negative without asking. That's something you should try not to do because ironically it is you who is acting more in line with that personality type.
Still, this is 4chan. So yeah, I get it.

what the fuck. just eat what's delicious and won't immediately kill you you fucking faggots

>>15963269
Oh, I got it backwards then. The schizos seem to be the ones chimping out about canola oil.

>>15963270
what is an excess level for seed oils before they become detrimental to health

>>15963371
I do not know.
That would depend on the individual and their tolerance to the excess fats/oils.
Eating too many fats over time is worse than gorging yourself in one sitting every now and then, but you should try and maintain balance in your diet.
Act with common sense, and you'll likely be fine.

>>15963381
that doesn't seem to be a problem with saturated fats though? They're pretty inert and the body simply upregulates decouplibg to increase heat generation.
But for the PUFA in seed oils we simply get sick, we need a tiny amount of polyunsaturated fatty acids for essential cell membrane function but they're very rare in our natural diet so the body hoards them when it can find them but they're also toxic to our metabolism with multiple breakdown products being actively harmful.

So what's a safe intake level?

>>15963390
>we simply
>we
No. You? Maybe.
Too much fat is bad for you. Especially over long periods of time, anon.
>So what's a safe intake level?
>After I said I did not know.
You're ridiculous.
The "safe" level depends on you. Are you allergic? You sound like you might be allergic to something in the oils.
You're trying painfully hard to lead a response based on claims you made. This isn't Bitchute, anon.
I am not gullible. So if you have something to say, say it. State your beliefs to me man. Get it all out.

>>15963402
the body has a literal self regulatory mechanism that triggers a satiety signal for saturated fats and also uses mitochondrial uncoupling to burn more as heat.
Yes even for you.

Polyunsaturated fatty acids common in seed derived oils like linoleic acid do not trigger this regulatory mechanism because they're rare in our natural diet because we aren't seed eaters like seed eating birds.

You started with a statement about excess consumption being harmful I thought you might have some idea what an excess level might be?

>>15961306
You don't get hay from growing wheat, you get straw. I believe most animals won't eat it willingly, or not in any substantial amount.

>>15963437
Depends on the crop, barley straw and oat straw are very edible, wheat straw is less so but you they will eat it if they have a nitrogen source like mollasses or urea

>>15963432
>the body has a literal self regulatory mechanism
The body has many regulatory systems. That however does not make the thing triggering them good for you.
And no, not me. I doubt that omega 6's are very bad at all, *unless they are consumed in excess*, of course. That would probably a very high limit too.
You can simply search why too many saturated fats (or fat in general) is not healthy over time though.
>Polyunsaturated fatty acids
>Forgets I said to eat anything in moderation
If you have a problem with these things, that's on you.
I suffer no such problem. You know why?
Anyways, you live your own life, anon.
> excess consumption being harmful
Of course it is, but there is no reliable way to measure such a thing.
Some people can eat all the fat and oil they want, and remain skinny, and healthy.
Others eat it and gain weight rapidly when consuming fats or calories in general.
That is one example which indicates the disparity between individual subjects and "fat tolerance" in relationship to their individual body chemistry and metabolisms.
Seed oils are likely much the same. Too much is bad for you, but what is the limit? What are the effects *in the individual*?
It's unknown. Some likely have little to no reaction, while others may experience clogged arteries or extreme weight gain from excessive or moderate consumption of pure fats or oils.
Don't test that out yourself, but I am sure there are studies you can read on, if you search for them that is.
That's what I would recommend. I'm too grounded down to search right now. Might sleep soon.

>>15963469
>You can simply search why too many saturated fats (or fat in general) is not healthy over time though.
Look I know you think this is supposed to mean something but you are woefully misinformed

>>15963469
>That is one example which indicates the disparity between individual subjects and "fat tolerance" in relationship to their individual body chemistry and metabolisms.
>Seed oils are likely much the same. Too much is bad for you, but what is the limit? What are the effects *in the individual*?
>It's unknown. Some likely have little to no reaction, while others may experience clogged arteries or extreme weight gain from excessive or moderate consumption of pure fats or oils.
you are woefully illinformed on this matter and need to seriously check the sources for what you think you know because I don't want to have to explain why you are wrong to every post you make.

>>15963471
No, it's a fact that too much of anything is bad for you. I am not claiming saturated fat is bad for you in totality, only that excess consumption of it is.
>woefully misinformed
>adds no information
You could search anything you want, and find numerous answers. Even ones which fit your beliefs.
>>15963476
>second post just to say it again
>still doesn't add any information
>only "no you!"
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5475232/
https://www.heart.org/en/healthy-living/healthy-eating/eat-smart/fats/saturated-fats
>November 2, 2021 - Eating foods that contain saturated fats raises the level of cholesterol in your blood. High levels of LDL cholesterol in your blood increase your risk of heart disease and stroke.

>>15963432
>>15963469
The mitochondria stop working when there is no mercury in diet.

>>15950091
>You think retards screaming "LITERALLY POISON" over and over again
are you referring to the global warming hysterics incessantly shilling that co2 is causing the world to come to an end?

>>15963480
>>November 2, 2021 - Eating foods that contain saturated fats raises the level of cholesterol in your blood. High levels of LDL cholesterol in your blood increase your risk of heart disease and stroke.
Yeah, see this is what I mean here, you are misinformed because the resources you think are reliable are built on foundations of fucking sand.
You think you are right and you make citations to back up your point but the science they're based on is just plain wrong.

Some of the actual problems with those are covered pretty well here >>15962183 >>15960700 like the supposed cholesterol heart hypothesis

>>15963504
>youtube videos trump actual medical documentation
Okay. Think what you want to man. We can agree to disagree.
Again, I'm not knocking saturated fat as 'evil' or anything like that. Only saying *excess is bad*.
>Excess is the root f all evils.
An old adage from long ago. It applies to most anything you can think of.
Anyways, I don't want to fight right now. it's a peaceful night here, and I'm just trying to browse and think.

>>15963515
>>youtube videos trump actual medical documentation
Yes, because they explain why the medical documentation you cite is based on flawed nutrition science.
Until you're made acutely aware of just how compromised the ideas you cite are then any further discussion is meaningless

>>15963521
Lol
Also I already know many are compromised by our ugly, dishonest system.
On the other hand not all information is tainted, and saturated fat isn't that bad at all.
Neither are polyunsaturated fats, *in moderation*, of course.

>>15963521
*I am not against you anon, but I don't personally believe either is bad. So, we see the world differently from one another.
I am okay with that. We all see the world through different eyes, and interpret it with different hearts and minds.

>>15963525
>Neither are polyunsaturated fats, *in moderation*, of course.
You keep saying that, and I keep asking you to define "in moderation" or "excess".
But you literally state you can't so it makes your statements about them completely laughable.
You don't know why they're harmful, you don't know what dosage is safe, yet you insist they're fine.

>>15963531
In excess would be consuming them every meal. In moderation would be *every other day/ every few days*. At least for significant portions. If you eat very small amounts daily, you'll be fine too.
Excess should be obvious by the resulting outcome by the way. That is why it's ridiculous to attempt to try and clarify that point.
-
About the rest, I alrready gave you links and told you eating like a glutton was bad for you (obvious).
That should be enough, but no. this is about jerking off your ego in order to try and get a "win": on /sci/ so you can feel smart. I can tell it's something like that by the way you try to insult me and make confrontational statements.
You can believe whatever you like, and I will do the same for myself as well. Understand?

>>15952788
Vegans are mentally ill, veganism is an eating disorder.

>>15963538
You are misinformed and I keep telling you that, then you prove it again so I tell you to stop claiming something when you still don't know what it means.
There are resources shared in this thread that can help you get a better understanding of the problem,, they're not super comprehensive and mostly videos but they generally provide subsequent referrels to other more in depth resources. Nina's book is a pretty good read.

>>15963548
>no proof
>keeps making claims without evidence
>points to youtube as evidence
We can agree the medical and food industries, Hell, the entire government and most of the world are upside down and backwards, but that does not make all information surrounding those institutions wrong either, anon.
I am already well informed on your theories, and how the introduction of high levels of polyunsaturated fats early last century is claimed to have caused a rise in health issues. In fact I would wager I know more about the issue than you, but, I still do not believe it.
You should accept others see the world differently than you, and not try to force your beliefs onto others.
Informing is one thing, but you are acting like Fuacci with a syringe. Lol. Too overzealous.
-
It's worth noting when you try to use insults to sell your point, it repels most people. You are acting like a thug or an aggressive advertiser.
Find a better approach, but you're not going to convince me anyhow.

/fit/izen here. So the only sneed oil product i consume is pic related twice a day with my chicken breasts. Will it have long lasting effect on my health?

>>15963555
You see being called misinforemed as an insult?

>>15963609
You are using it as one.
It's the way you are phrasing things and trying to instigate arguments over nothing.
It is insulting. Yes.
It makes you seem as though you are promoting this idea in bad faith too.

>>15963625
It's a hostility to the shills promoting "plant based diets" and constructing evidence to demonise meat consumption.

>>15963628
Fair.
I am no shill, and meat is fine in moderation. I love it in fact.
Plants are fine too, but I tried going vegan once to see what the effect would be, and it made me feel awful in all regards.
I wouldn't recommend it to anyone.

>To everyone in this thread:
Eating less is proven to extend your life and improve your health.

>i know i can't trust "the science"
>i know i can't trust conspiracy theory
>i don't understand nutrition enough to discern for myself based on what i read
i guess i'll never know
as a precaution i have reduced consumption of seed oils, i no longer have a jar of mayo in my fridge that i put on everything.

>>15963605
i'd worry more about the calcium propionate
show in rat studies to lead to neurodegenerative conditions in the same dose per ounce of body fat that a human gets eating a loaf of preserved bread once a week

>>15963631
>Plants are fine too,
No if that were wholly true people wouldn't have to go on restrictive elimination diets where they pretty much solely consume meat and water to find relief, have you heard of the ketogenic paleolithic diet and its use as a form of treatment?.
Some people can just handle plant toxins better.

>>15963648
Baby steps, but I'm proud of you anon, next step is slowly checking ingredient lists and realising where it gets added without you even realising

>>15963669
oh i know, i've been reading ingredient lists for years. i decided that gmo corn and soi was sus and they put that shit in everything. the mad science they got going on in these foods does not inspire confidence and trust in the system

>>15963655
>calcium propionate
show in rat studies to lead to neurodegenerative conditions in the same dose per ounce of body fat that a human gets eating a loaf of preserved bread once a week

Blackpill me on this

>>15963674
All those religious laws about food make a lot more sense in the context of modern Food™

I challenge anons to come up with a biblically inspired modern food law.

>>15963698
They know not what they do.

>>15963698
We already have this.

>>15963751
I said biblically inspired not talmudically

>>15963753
You think kosher law comes from the talmud? Do you know what the word "noahide" means? Why is the average chrigger so god damned retarded?

>>15963541
Is that why they live 16 years longer?

>>15961306
Spoilage and straw go back into the soil to decompose. The soil is then used to make new wheat.
Also, the majority of grain production is used for animal feed and industrial applications.

>>15946730
They are not bad, taken in moderation they are quite good, actually. Don't overdo it due to high caloric density, and don't expect miracles, and you're good.

>>15946923
Cilantro is fine if you grow your own.

I always hear about Olive Oil being good for obesity yet Arabs Italians Greeks and Spain all have obesity issues

More than countries who use other oils

>>15963753
bugs
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trabutina_mannipara

Here's a hot take, if you cook with a little bit of either vegetable oil or butter/ghee you will be fine.

>>15964079
Where is your research?

>>15964079
no, the body hoards and accumulates omega 6s because they're narturally rare but also essential in tiny amounts.
it's better to just avoid them as much as possible so your body can slowly deplete them

seed oils and hfcs are the cornerstones of goyslop

>>15963957
Italy, greece and spain all have exceptional health outcomes.
arabs self indulge too much in food and they kinda are a 3rd world shithole.

>>15965270
how much bacon do meds eat?

>>15964539
yup, corn and basedbeans - seasoned with chinese atrazine

>>15963667
Yes they are anon. In moderation, and depending on the plant, they are fine. You are pretending I meant something broad and all reaching, when I have been preaching balance and moderation this entire time. Deceptive.
>fasting
>leading to regeneration
I already know of this and practice it. Strangely enough I just posted about it in another thread before checking back in to this one. Perfect coincidence.
>plant toxins
Name 'em.

What foods are the "main offenders" when it comes to containing high amounts of seed oil so that I may avoid?

I know you guys say they are in everything but I'm sure there's some main things to cut out.

In the same sense that sugar is in a lot of stuff but you should definitely avoid candy, cookies, cake, donuts and soda outright.

>>15964539
Yes, corn and basedbeans grown with chinese atrazine.

>>15965432
>le cheese grater XD
this ancient wordfilt*er is more cringe than calling everything soi

>>15964539
So are beef and chicken.

>>15961237
he got undiagnosed myocarditis from the covid vax

>>15965435
that word filter exists specifically to prevent or make it difficult for people to discuss the deleterious health effects of consuming the unnameable east asian estrogen bean

>>15965501
Damn this image macro from a blogpost sure convinced me. I'm going to eat enough soi for you AND me now. Seethe, you fucking cuck.

>>15958217
>>15958092
seed oils contain oxalates and barely any nutrients plus they keep putting it in food that doesn't need them to act as fillers.

Red Meat is the reason humans managed to evolve larger brains so the nutrients it contains far outweighs any adverse health effect you could bring to the table (which are most likely studies done with processed meat anyway)

So I can tell you with certain certainty that you are a faggot

>>15966553
>Red Meat is the reason humans managed to evolve larger brains
What are the reasons for believing this?

>>15946730
Which seeds?
How is the oil extracted?

Sunflower oil, cold pressed without contamination of meme pesticides and arsenic and 3 world contaminants,

If it required heavy "washings", and boiling and "reacting" it with sodium hydroxide and aditional "acetone" or "hexane" washings, then it is bad.

Cold pressed thistle oil.
Sunflower oil.
Olive oil.
All is fine.

But if it requires "factory refinement" it mostly is shit, and contaminated with toxic crap that accumulates in your body.

>>15966940
Yes the processing is an issue but its chemical composition can have severe negative long term effects on the body

>>15966681
Retards like to think they're smart. Right up until people start talking eugenics. Then they're defending the janitors.

>>15966681
high nutrient density food
low toxin load
ample supply of essential fats used by the brain
knife marks on bones
intestinal size to brain size ratio

>>15965593
>I'm going to poison myself with goyslop!!
>that'll show you!!
lol

>>15966940
Boy you oughtta see how they make meat.

>>15967454
>make meat.
You assume I eat mass produced meme meat products with meat glue.

The conquering of the food supply by metalurgists and alchemist family dynasties is a big issue with food in general.
Thats why I was so specific about the seeds.

>>15967191
>low toxin load
not him
but what do you mean by this?

>>15967652
Ok so starting from the position of natural animal muscle tissue, it is unlikely to contain chemicals that are harmful to the function of muscle tissue so by consuming it we aren't likely to be exposing ourself to anything detrimental to our health other than products of a cooking process, contamination or artificial additives such as preservatives.

Plants are static and perpetually exposed to threats by such as grazing animal, insects, fungi, bacteria, etc, etc, because of this they have naturally developed an arsenal of highly effective compounds to protect themselves from being eaten.
Pretty much the only plant tissues that have any incentive to be consumed at all are fruits, nectar and some weird commensal protection relationships with things like ants.

So plants are full of compounds that either taste bad or are actively toxic to other species because those are there only options to protect themselve while animals have the ability to rely on more behavioural options to avoid being eaten such as running away or fighting, both of which require optimal function of body tissues.

This is at least a somewhat brief explanation of the theory behind the idea.

>>15968068
You've already made a false assumption thinking red meat is safe even in the wild. It's not. A chemical natural to the muscle tissue itself is carcinogenic and directly leads to colon cancer.

>>15968194
>A chemical natural to the muscle tissue itself is carcinogenic and directly leads to colon cancer.
No, I think you should actually check for yourself the so called evidence used to make that claim.

>>15968250
I read the paper. It was years ago though and I don't remember the chemical.

>>15946933
fruit is literally the healthiest food on the planet by a wide margin
the idea that sugar is bad is hilariously stupid

>>15968492
>fruit is literally the healthiest food on the planet by a wide margin
bold claim you've got there

>>15968510
yeah, fruit is healthy, really shocking claim, not like it's something we've known for countless generations or that it's the single food group which improves every parameter that exists related to health in all studies ever done

>>15968566
Much fruit is somewhat poisonous to us though?

>>15968570
unripe fruit can be extremely toxic, even deadly (like ackee)
and yes, there are certain fruits that are inherently toxic to us too, fruit types that we didn't evolve to eat at all, or that are inedible to all animals (like e.g. burs and other dry fruits)
I'm of course talking about edible fruits, especially the types of fruit we've evolved to eat over tens of millions of years

Isn't this thread about seed oils not fruit?

>>15968599
the person I replied to wrote:
>>favor sugar
>>thinks that fruits are as healthy as vegetable
at that point fruit was brought into the discussion, and so unfavorably that I felt impelled to correct such nonsense

>>15968611
Yeah, fruits are arguably healthier to some extent than vegetables.
although the fructise will give you fatty liver if you eat a lot

>>15968617
not just "arguably healthier to some extent", but demonstratively far healthier in all respects
and the idea that you get fatty liver from fructose is total nonsense, that only happens if you eat a ton of oil simultaneously, which no human or other primate would ever have done for the past tens of millions of years
there's not a shred of evidence that eating a ton of fruit causes fatty liver, and studies have shown that there's no known limit to the health benefits of increasing fruit consumption up to as much as 20 servings per day (beyond which the study looking at the most servings did not go)
it's literally what has constituted 90-95%+ of our caloric intake for tens of millions of years and what our entire physiology is optimized for, the idea that it would ever be unhealthy for us is ridiculous

>>15968634
>and the idea that you get fatty liver from fructose is total nonsense that only happens if you eat a ton of oil simultaneously,

no, that's literally how the biochemical process of fructose metabolism in the liver works anon, you really ought to check these things

>>15968644
no, it isn't
it does promote de novo lipogenesis, but fruit itself will absolutely never lead to fatty liver, even if you derive 95% of your calories from it
and trust me, I know orders of magnitude more about this than you ever will

>>15968645
anon, it's how bears put on autumn weight by gorging on super ripe berries

>>15968645
that's because bears enter a state called hyperphagia during that time, which is a natural cycle for them, leading to insatiable hunger
that hormonal cycle is controlled by the central nervous system in response to the seasons, not by the food they eat
in fact, it's the diametric opposite: the gorge so much on that food because it's the most calorically rewarding to give them some relief for their constant hunger
none of that occurs in humans, because humans become satiated by sufficient fruit regardless of time of year, since we evolved in the tropical equatorial rainforest where every single day is equal to any other by and large, and there isn't any seasonality at all (not even any pronounced dry or wet season in a true tropical rainforest climate)
carbohydrates are in fact far more satiating than fats, and the soluble fiber and water found in fully ripe fruits also contributes to increased satiation for humans

>>15961306
lol

>>15968599
No, this thread is staffed by meat worshipping retards doing backflips trying to convince everyone that drinking whiskey and eating bacon all day is healthy and anyone that makes contact with a plant "isn't alpha".

This is inferiority complex central.

>>15961306
right, because you can't possibly feed organic matter like spoilage and hay back into the ecosystem, and you can't possibly rely more on tree-borne foods like fresh and ripe fruits, as well as other more permacultural plant-based solutions, and it's certainly not like the vast majority of the "normal" at the bottom actually comes from factory farms that require orders of magnitude more monocrops and forest destruction, and it's not like grazing itself is known to gradually decimate soil and lead the land barren
enjoy living in your delusional fantasy, I guess

>>15968706
As I already said, fermented plant oxin and meat mixed with an artificial preservative really weakens your argument to nothing.
Now tell me why should I consume seed oils

>>15968715
*fermented plant toxin

>>15968664
>ince we evolved in the tropical equatorial rainforest where every single day is equal to any other by and large, and there isn't any seasonality at all (not even any pronounced dry or wet season in a true tropical rainforest climate
except we mostly stopped eating fruit and plants and went through several further million years of hyper carnivorism

now you might be better able to answer this but what are good fruit sources of saturated fats?

>>15968884
Literally nobody but eskimos did this. And they're fat mong shits. I'm not taking diet advice from someone that lives in a doghouse made of snow. Everything you believe and shill for is based on fantasy and dumbass bacon fanfiction.

https://youtu.be/BMOjVYgYaG8

>>15968897
Why are you denying all of the archaelogical evidence of human hypercarnivorism?
We have butchery marks and radioisotope analysis that explicitly point to this.

Why are you denying our archaeology?

>>15968903
I know more about this subject than you do. And I can say with 100% certainty, you don't know shit. You have vices, a diet book told you you were a special boy for indulging in those vices, and now you will fight to the death trying to prove that your fantasy is science.

>>15968917
Your hubris is incredible.
You are wedded to an ideology yet deny historical reality.

>>15968922
Yours isn't though. Why do you disagree with the anthropologist that literally studies paleolithic diets that I posted in the youtube video? Do you think you know more than her? I promise you don't. Stop being a kike before I start treating you like one.

>>15958094
This ruminant vegetarian nigger seriously believes he has four stomachs.

>>15968944
But muh plant poisons. How do cows deal with them? They just do?

>>15968946
They spend a shit ton more energy digesting them and have enzymes and bacteria that you do not to digest plant matter without falling victim to the deleterious effects of antinutrients.

>>15968884
>except we mostly stopped eating fruit
never happened until ~200,000 years ago when H. sapiens left the rainforest (after other cousin species had done so earlier) and were forced to do so due to lack of fruit, at which point our brains stopped growing and started shrinking
we also turned primarily to cooked plant-based foods at that point, especially tubers (which are the first cooked food remains known to have been eaten by H. sapiens, from around ~125,000 years ago), and didn't start hunting in any significant capacity until just ~50,000 years ago, a negligible blip of time in an evolutionary context, long after we had already evolved the herbivorous physiology we still have, and again only because we had no other choice in increasingly hostile habitats further from the equator
>hyper carnivorism
it's mind-boggling to think about how retarded someone has to be to actually believe this, especially in light of how we know that the people on the planet who actually engage in such a diet are the shortest-living and most disease-ridden of all (e.g. Inuits, who literally have the shortest lifespans and some of the highest rates of heart disease, stroke, atherosclerosis, kidney disease, cancer, diabetes, and many more)
>what are good fruit sources of saturated fats?
unless you start stretching the definition of fruit, there are no such sources at all
fatty acid oxidation is extremely detrimental to human physiology, which is optimized to run on carbohydrate, particularly on simple sugars
it's also very easy to understand why that is the case once you understand the fundamental biochemistry of how energy is generated in the two different processes
the closest you'll get are fat-containing fruits like olives, avocados, durian, and dabai, but they all contain monounsaturated fats rather than saturated ones, as well as dedicated fatty acid oxidation inhibitors, but humans did not evolve eating any of those fruits, or any fatty fruits at all

>>15968946
Because cows literally outsourced their diet to an army of microbes able to detox a lot of the crap in plants even so they still die if they eat the wrong plants.
St John's Wort can kill them by making them hysersensitive to the sun giving them extremely severe sunburn, that's why in regions where a lot of it grows the livestock have black skin.
I saw a black and white cow with white half of her skin literally just peeling off, she nearly died from the shock to her body, aborted her calf and never was able to get pregnant again.

>>15969017
>Because cows literally outsourced their diet to an army of microbes able to detox a lot of the crap in plants even so they still die if they eat the wrong plants.
exactly what frugivorous great apes like humans also did, except using the entire soil as the digestive microbiome and enormous centuries-old fruit trees as the filtration organs, leaving only the highest-quality nutrition on the planet: fresh and ripe tropical fruit

>>15969025
Fruitarians are extremely unhealthy and suffer from major malnutrition. It's just a fad diet and you need to give it up and move on.

>>15969004
>fatty acid oxidation is extremely detrimental to human physiology,
stop eating the seed oils anon


from what I remember there are some south american plant species that produce some fruits with I think 22 carbon or more saturated fats. they're supposed to feel buttery

>>15969025
You're a moron with brain damage.

>>15969036
most such claims stem from cherry-picking propaganda videos like those made by literaly psychopaths like Gatis ("sv3rige"), where he will use the minority of people with eating disorders to try to paint this as the general case, when the general case is the exact opposite
that being said, I'm not even advocating for a 100% fruit diet at all, which is the problem some ideological fruitarians try to follow almost religiously even at the cost of their health in many cases, because tender young leaves has also been a major component of our diet for those tens of millions of years, and tend to be the primary source of nutrients like protein, calcium, vitamin K, and iron, the lack of which unsurprisingly are responsible for exactly the health problems seen in people who try to eat 100% fruit (e.g. muscle loss and weight loss in general, dental problems and bone loss in general, fatigue, and so on)
meanwhile people who know what they are doing easily avoid such nutritional problems and are far healthier than anyone else
the idea that the diet we've eaten for tens of millions of years is a "fad diet" is pretty hilarious
>>15969042
>stop eating the seed oils anon
obviously, seed oils are arguably even more toxic than saturated fats, which is a high bar already
>there are some south american plant species that produce some fruits with I think 22 carbon or more saturated fats
well, that's certainly interesting, but even if that is the case it's not something we evolved eating, since humans didn't reach South America until very recently (~15,000 years ago)
>>15969046
for stating the biological facts of reality?
alrighty then