/sci/ - Science & Math

>>15434993
>Are they actually harmful to your brain or hormone levels in the long run?
if you have ADHD? no.
inb4 retards post studies from people smoking meth or similar insane nonclinical doses in mice

>>15435666
What about cardiac problems and tolerance build up?

>>15435704
Cardiac problems are aggravation, essentially. Which means if you do have issues then DO NOT take them.
Also do not combine with other stimulants, that means no coffee.
As for tolerance I don’t think that’s an issue with low doses or the gradual-release kind. You shouldn’t be chasing a "high."

Caveat: all of the above is based on my knowledge of amphetamine + my compatriots’ anecdotal experiences with it. No clue about other compounds.

>>15434993
If you actually have ADHD and take it exactly as prescribed, it works wonders.
If you ever abuse it things start going south fast.

>>15435704
Other anon >>15435725 answered it as I would have already. Taken as directed and not abused it works fine and tolerance buildup is not a thing relevant to controlling attention. For the "high" or cardiovascular stimulating effects you can develop a tolerance, and you want to anyway so you don't have any side effects.

>>15434993
I have ADHD I have been unmedicated since elementary school. Looking back that's exactly when I had a severe personality change from extroverted to crippling social anxiety. My grades were fine up until highschool where I started struggling because I wouldn't ever complete homework and would rush to complete some projects last minute. I graduated with a 2.9 gpa. Going to to college I realized I really needed to get my symptoms under control because I wanted to major in aerospace engineering which will involve a huge amount of homework and projects. Still unmedicated and I have a 3.8 gpa and have developed some coping mechanisms for dealing with it. Seriously considering meds though I have a sneaking suspicion that meds would help turn my 98s into perfect scores all the time. Only reason I'm reluctant is I've considered going into the air force as a pilot after I finish my degree and I'm worried that it would bar me from ever getting in.

>>15434993
If you have ADHD they're great. I can never get a prescription so I vape and drink caffeine and constantly consume sugar and run around my house for stimulation.

>>15435783
Funny thing is for twice exceptional in particular and ADHD for that category IIRC what little research exists does find extremely high levels of depression and rates of anxiety. Your brain only half-working to your level of competence can be extremely crippling when you know from short bouts of high productivity what you're truly capable of. Worth trying medication, lots of people report it works great.

i was prescribed vyvanse and ritalin and it just made me feel hyper and didnt give me more focus like coffee

does that mean i dont have adhd
but then why do people without adhd use it to study?

>>15435821
>but then why do people without adhd use it to study?
Either (a) they actually have adhd, or (b) they're idiots who think it'll work the same when it does the opposite if your brain is normal

>>15435821
regardless of if you have ADHD or not, amphetamines make it easier to stay focused on a single task for an extended period of time.

>>15435837
The stimulating effect in a normal brain doesn't actually help that. Analogously it would be more like the jitters normal people experience with caffeine, only infinitely worse. Even assuming it were somehow not distracting, it negatively impacts working memory in a normal brain and therefore memory indexing and other executive functions. Superficially being able to force yourself to sit longer, which I'd doubt due to the cardiovascular effects, I don't think it really helps a normal person at all.

>>15435845
>I don't think it really helps a normal person at all.
Yeah well that's a completely uninformed opinion you have there because up until maybe 5 years ago it was quite common for medical students to use them when cramming for exams.
They were even provided to military pilots to keep them stay focused for extended periods of time during long missions.

>>15435858
>Yeah well that's a completely uninformed opinion
I just know things you don't.
>They were even provided to military pilots to keep them stay focused for extended periods of time during long missions.
Might want to read into that more and learn why it'd be a bad idea for reliably retaining information and the effects on cognitive tasks in normal people. You haven't read nearly enough of military reporting on that if you think that's a point in your favor.

>>15434993
>kids given sugar cereals don't sit still for 6 hours a day in lowest-common denominator government schools
>let's hop them up on big pharma products

>>15435802
What I would really like is to be an astronaut I know the odds of it happening are basically zero but doing things that would get me closer to that are atleast reasonable leaving the air force door open is the main thing holding me back from taking meds. Most astronauts have phds or been air force pilots. From what I've researched the air force will let people with ADHD in if they have proof they can perform as well as everyone else without meds. The reasoning being that you could run out of medication and become a liability while deployed.

>>15435939
>From what I've researched the air force will let people with ADHD in if they have proof they can perform as well as everyone else without meds.
Depends on how severe yours is and how much of a disparity it causes in your working memory and executive functioning. Some people have it so bad they've an IQ greater than 145 but a working memory related score within 1 SD of the norm without meds. It really varies.
>Most astronauts have phds or been air force pilots.
I've no idea what NASA regs are on astronauts and medications or neurodevelopmental disorders. You might be wishing for the impossible there. Better check that first.

>>15435900
On a related note, the dyes used can cause hyperactivity. Something beautiful about a few of the time-release capsules is that they also contain the red dye that has a track record for causing this issue.

>>15434993
You sacrifice long term health and youthfulness for short term success when using them. Like with all drugs.

>>15435954
>You sacrifice long term health and youthfulness for short term success when using them. Like with all drugs.
Clinical doses are not meth smoker doses. It's cute you think people fall for shit like that.

>>15435963
>Bro these magic pills give you benefits at literally no downside!
If it was so great then humans wouldn't need these pills in the first place. But we aren't hyperfocused like we are on Adderall, caffeine and other stimulants all the time for a reason. If you need them before an exam then your studying routine sucks anyway. You should have all the knowledge you need in your long term memory by the day before your exam. Cramming all the studying in one day for 12 hours straight like retarded medicine students is ridiculous and won't lead to long term knowledge. But it's not like those monkeys care. They just want their paper and then to fuck off. And people who use stimulants regularly simply build up tolerance and destroy their natural chemical balance in their brain, which leads to damage to their long term health.

if you have ADHD stimulants make you sleepy and you won't have the attention span to realize that ADHD is fake.

>>15435975
Irrelevant bot tier nonsense reply

>>15435942
>You might be wishing for the impossible there.
Scott Kelly had ADHD. Also I know it's a near impossibility I'd have better odds becoming an NBA star. But none the less I still workout 2 days a week and study when my focus allows it. Excersise and breathing/meditation helps with my symptoms a lot I've found.

Amphetamines are based
Period

>>15437238
they feel good yes but so does sugar. the question is is it worth it :(

>>15435802
>>15435942
>Some people have it so bad they've an IQ greater than 145 but a working memory related score within 1 SD of the norm without meds
me pretty much. When I was tested for it I got literally every IQ type question correct (I think it maxed out at 135; the woman administrating it told me I was the first person she'd seen be perfect) and scored dead average on the working memory section and even slightly impaired on a speed related section. It's somewhat better on meds, but they're more of a crutch than a prosthetic leg, if that makes sense.

>>15437857
Your total score is going to be significantly depressed by that disparity. If you had the right medication in the right dosage your working memory can be brought to be as effective as the rest of your brain. Numerous caveats to that statement for people with other abnormalities or other conjoining brain damage, etc. Same goes for processing speed in general.
>It's somewhat better on meds, but they're more of a crutch than a prosthetic leg, if that makes sense.
Worth determining if there's a further dose-response relationship and you actually need a higher dosage, or different medication. Though as noted given the numerous caveats many people simply won't be made whole by it due to other brain abnormalities. Your working memory on the medication ought be nearer expected average for your other subscores, all else being equal, if you've the right dosage and medications.

>>15434993
The thesis is that it simply elevates your brain's dopamine to the level about expected of neurotypicals. In light of this, why is there a controversy about their damage? If you can't parse my intent, I am not making a point, I am open-mindedly asking for what is the actual argument against, plus the possible mechanism.

I mean, I don't enjoy taking it. I become a robot whose color in the world has been suctioned away (yes, this sentence is correct, but you need to read it poetically).
But I am not satisfied with not taking it either, and this is a moderate understatement. The lives of ADHDers is characterized by this constant tension between these two sides. If I had a button to press that could turn me into the version of me that I would regard as neurologically optimal, then I'd press it. But since it's not there, since no one with any disadvantaging trait in general has such a button, I have to do with the less than optimal solution -- drugs.

>>15435783
It has nothing to do with taking or not taking the pill, lil' 'tard. You are talking about a timespan of 10-12 when you became socially crippled. Guess what this is the beginning of?
I was not medicated until my 20s, and that is also when I became socially anxious and developed minor body dysmorphia.

>>15438142
>I mean, I don't enjoy taking it. I become a robot whose color in the world has been suctioned away (yes, this sentence is correct, but you need to read it poetically).
just passing by to add that isn't what happens to me at all. It's a difference between feeling brain damaged and nonfunctional to having normal function. Don't know where that weird duality metaphor antagonism from medication comes from but it definitely isn't universal. I'm not different on medication in some cute poetic way I'm fundamentally "not there" to a severe "not even feeling like a person" way.

>>15438142
>In light of this, why is there a controversy about their damage?
There isn't one. Only among anti-science people. Liars misrepresenting street meth smoking overdoses and chronic street drug users as somehow representing clinical doses. Anti-science in general and anti-psychiatry tend to go hand in hand. So if you want to dishonestly represent scientists as malicious everything is fair game, from vaccines to any other medication, including psychiatry.

>>15438142
>I become a robot whose color in the world has been suctioned away
I hate this about it. Sometimes I feel like it gives me autism.

>>15434993
its fake and gay brought to you by big adderall. Nobody takes amphetamines to treat their "ADHD" except america. How about you drink some coffee and get to fucking work?

>>15438223
>I hate this about it. Sometimes I feel like it gives me autism.
Dose maybe too high?

>>15438173
But Huberman, an actual neurologist professor, is even critical of the drugs. He does not deny their efficacy but he also points to the long term risks. Those risks are only negligible if you somehow take the perfect minimal effective dose forever. But who really does that? Patients typically have 10min appointments with their psychiatrist every 3 months to talk about the dose, and the psychiatrist only has their opinion to go off on. If the patients crave some sort of higher high then they will get their desired higher dose, signed off as a clinical dose approved by a medical professional.

>>15438280
>He does not deny their efficacy but he also points to the long term risks.
Risks professionals tend to talk about are not the risks anti-science types make up. The known side-effects for things like cardiovascular conditions ought be avoided by lowering dosage or changing medication. Otherwise, reduced obesity and other factors greatly make up for the actual risks.
>But who really does that?
People who want their condition managed and don't want to abuse the medication trying to chase physical stimulant highs? Addictive tendencies exist for nearly everything, and stimulants are grossly overmanaged to the point of absurdity by federal law.
>If the patients crave some sort of higher high then they will get their desired higher dose, signed off as a clinical dose approved by a medical professional.
Won't say that doesn't happen. Will say it's nowhere near as easy as you're making it out to be. Most professionals these days, and also due to that ridiculous overmanagement by the fed, won't even deal with stimulants. Depends on your location. Those who do tend to greatly prefer long-release stimulants to cut down abuse potential, and are dubious of any attempt to pursue dosages beyond the recommended single pill maximum. 30 mg slow release is not very abusable without added effort, and on top of that you can be urine tested or refused future prescriptions. Not to mention patient notes if you try to hop doctors. Not going to explain the real particulars but it is definitely nowhere near as easy as you've made it out to be, and that is not an actual risk of the drug it is a risk of addiction pursuit same as with almost any drug.

>>15438280
> But who really does that?
The vast majority of people do. Not everyone has substance use disorder like you.
There are MANY people who can take medications as prescribed, even things like oxycodone and fentanyl that retards like you would rather gobble all at once.

>>15438298
Isn't one of the side effects that you get more prone to addiction of other stuff? Or maybe that was a symptom of ADHD itself. So I think a high dose is a substantial risk, the way the meds are prescribed to patients with a tendency for addiction.

>>15438300
I'm actually on 30mg Vyvanse, and I'm fine with the dose. I'm just scared that I will crave more in the future due to tolerance building up and even though it still works the same in boosting attention and focus, I will feel like it doesn't. I am not even saying this shit is bad, else I wouldn't take it in the first place. But i think there's a legitimate other side of the argument.

>>15438325
If you aren't increasing your doses or trying to achieve a "buzz", you really do not need to worry at all about addiction.

>>15438142
I am >>15438142 here (yes, replying to my own post).
Just realized the sentence
>It has nothing to do with taking or not taking the pill, lil' 'tard. You are talking about a timespan of 10-12 when you became socially crippled. Guess what this is the beginning of?
I was not medicated until my 20s, and that is also when I became socially anxious and developed minor body dysmorphia.
Would be a perfect test to detect AI understanding, since it can syntactically and semantically be interpreted two different ways, but obviously it only makes sense to interpret it one way.
Wonder if current AI is up to that task. Such double meaning sentences are currently considered the gold standard to detect understanding.

>>15438376
heh funny, when i read that even i had to think twice what you actually meant. i hope i'm right in thinking that you meant that you also became socially anxious around 10-12? aka pre or during puberty

>>15438258
It's not. It does its job as well as it can, I just feel less vibrant on it sometimes. Like it almost evens things out too much? I appreciate that it calms down anxious thought cycling and keeps me in line from doing impulsive shit.
>>15438376
Have you had a hormone panel run? It might have altered something that affects your sex steroid hormone levels.

>>15438319
>Or maybe that was a symptom of ADHD itself.
Yes. Properly treated ADHD has far less risk of addiction such as alcohol abuse and so on.

>>15438498
Which makes sense. If someone has low dopamine levels, sometimes they'll give in to behaviors that provide it. If they're medicated with substances that give them sips of dopamine, it should reasonably quell those behaviors.

>>15438520
i think this is the reason why people dont get hungry anymore on stimulants. you only get hungry when you're actually really hungry, except for when you simply crave an dopamine boost from an insulin spike

>>15434993
We have this thread every day, but yes if you have congenital brain damage (adhd) then they are good in alleviating it (from my experience only methylphenidate worked, but I didn't try alpha 2 agonists nor amph yet)
t.has it

>>15438325
>I'm just scared that I will crave more in the future due to tolerance building up
Your tolerance is primarily going to be with respect to physical stimulating effects. You do not want those and you want that tolerance to build up, and that can also be helped by keeping good health and exercise. Don't chase a high or a physical buzz. People less informed about how stimulants work for ADHD end up equivocating the physical stimulant effects for the neurological. Usually you do not build up a neurological tolerance such that it "stops working", but further brain damage can worsen the condition making the medication less effective permanently or temporarily.

Regarding the brain damage part, that has also been a problem with covid-19. Hence a lot of reports of people with ADHD believing their adderall has stopped working or working as well, when in fact in most such cases you have prior infection. Luckily if not severe in most people that should go away with time and keeping up good health.

>>15435783
>I was given amphetamines daily on my neuroformative years and ever since I stopped I'm now a husk
WHOA HOW COULD THIS HAPPEN?! Its totally the evil ADHD spook behind all of this!

>>15438749
Are only people with genuine adhd happier when stims stops holding them back/wear off?

>>15437857
NTA just passing through. Let's pretend it did work for someone like a prosthetic leg, only in the "profoundly gifted" territory. That disparity in functioning is akin to "Flowers for Algernon". You're not the same person anymore, and odds are only evident by contrast from people of your prior life. A naively hopeful person might reject his new reasoning, and go testing out of self skepticism or fairness. In the land of the blind, if the one eye'd man gets a hanging, the naive two eye'd man might test for hangings with a convincing body double. All the easier by having a body double from the very start. Yet at each and every opportunity, your manufactured weaknesses are exploited whether hurt feelings or worse could result. How sad for the naive man to have hoped for better.

Might be best it's more a crutch than a prosthetic leg. In the end you still die as in "Flowers for algernon", but someone very different lives in your body. In pretend.

>>15435995
What exercises and breathing/meditation techniques are helpful?

>>15435942
>Some people have it so bad they've an IQ greater than 145 but a working memory related score within 1 SD of the norm without meds.
when I was tested they only showed percentiles. I was in the high 90s for a lot of things, but 0.2nd percentile for working memory related stuff. actual retard tier. how do you get the psychiatrist to give you actual meds? they're so dead set on antidepressants. trying to give fluoxetine to someone they haven't even deemed to be depressed. I'm so close to just making meth

>>15435704
My psychiatrist ordered an EKG when I started on Ritalin, it's pretty standard to check if your CV system is doing alright when prescribing stimulants to a patient.

>>15435858
>it was quite common for medical students to use them when cramming for exams.
Stimulants will make anyone more alert, but they only boost your concentration if you have ADHD. The reason they "help" students like that is because they enable you to pull off all-nighters.

>>15435900
>big pharma products
Ah yes my big pharma methylphenidate made by 300 trillion different labs selling generic pills for peanuts.

>>15439776
This.
It's "big pharma" that is pushing for phasing these old generic drugs out so they can get their highly INEFFECTIVE non-stimulant replacements (that by pure cohencidence are under patent and cost 10x more) prescribed more often.

>>15435975
>If it was so great then humans wouldn't need these pills in the first place.
what the fuck would possess someone to write this absolute nonsense
>If lifting weights was so great then humans wouldn't need to do it in the first place.

>>15435666
Adhd brain is a myth. That does not mean psychostimulants are not therapeutic.

>>15439911
>Adhd brain is a myth.
yeah yeah and earth is flat you need to feel special somehow nobody cares

>>15439769
>how do you get the psychiatrist to give you actual meds?
For one thing, get diagnosed if you have not been. For another thing, any responsible psychiatrist would listen to the patient if you're having honest conversation. If you're depressed because your executive functioning is disabling in the extreme, obviously treatment to help correct that would be the way to go. There are all kinds of factors in considering which one is best for a given patient, including past history of drug abuse to consider. You need to talk to your psychiatrist about it and go through the steps to see if you're right, and if you are right to see if stimulants or other treatment is warranted as you suggest it is. I can't tell you with certainty. You have to talk to your doctor, even get a second or third opinion if you're not able to understand what's going on. Above all communicate to your psychiatrist if you feel you're not being lsitened to, or feel you don't understand his reasoning. I can't decide for you whether you've a good doctor, or if there's something else going on.

That is assuming of course you have ADHD and are not drug seeking for its own sake. The big problem many have with the government is the ridiculous contradiction in ADHD being highly prevalent in substance use disorders, and yet declaring far safer stimulant treatment a problem when said treatment prevents or reduces the substance use disorder. There are steps doctors can take in those situations but it's a whole lot of "covering my ass" paperwork and drug testing to ensure the medication is not being abused, and a whole lot more "cover my own ass" to ensure you're not being lied to in a way that fucks up your whole career, while somehow managing to be a responsible clinician in between all that.

>>15439084
... and suddenly don't know where I am. Perhaps I have opened the wrong door and at any moment The Man In Pos- session, The Owner Who Got There First will rush in and scream: "What Are Yon Doing Here? Who Are You?"
And I don't know what I am doing there nor who I am. I decide to play it cool and maybe I will get the orientation before the Owner shows.... So instead of yelling "Where Am I?" cool it and look around and you will find out approximately.... You were not there for The Beginning. You will not be there for The End.... Your knowledge of what is going on can only be superficial and relative....

>>15439776
>>15439816

>big pharma owns 300 trillion labs
>or has them subcontractors
>trick parents into taking meds, which cause infertility, hairloss, depression, skin issues
>sell parents drugs to the symptoms of the side effects
>also own buckload of generic products and consooomer beauty products
>methed out children now perfect inflencable consoomer cattle
>flash adverts and astro turfed influencers with productsplacements at them
>sell product

>>15441029
>t. drug addict

>>15440983
For some reason made me think of this song https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CTAud5O7Qqk

>>15434993
Adhd is not real, the associated drugs are just narcotics that have been legalized.

>>15441029
>big pharma owns 300 trillion labs
Show me the entire documentation proving that each and every single lab that makes generic methylphenidate is owned by big pharma.

>>15438256
>big adderall
>the chemical that costs $5 for 60x20mg pills that will last you a month
"big coffee" is much more apt

>>15441747
It's more like $300+ and if you multiply that by the percentage of the population you have approximately six million dollars at play.

>>15443134
>$300+
lmao maybe if you're buying them on the black market.
amphetamine sulfate is cheap as fuck.

>>15443134
Nigga not even Vyvanse costs that much, and it's a patented med with no generic options.

>>15434993
If you want something evidence based and not just bro-science
https://lorienpsych.com/2020/10/30/adderall/

>>15438142
>The thesis is that it simply elevates your brain's dopamine to the level about expected of neurotypicals. In light of this, why is there a controversy about their damage?
Because that's only one of its effects. It also acts on norepinephrine. And the thesis is in all likelihood generally wrong, since people on high doses of stimulants probably have way higher levels of dopamine than "neurotypicals".

>>15443848
vyvanse is 460 usd nigger dollars at the biggest dose (70mg)

>>15438792
>Are only people that require stims to achieve baseline due to being pumped full of stims when their brains were being formed happier when stims allow them to reach baseline?
You might be onto something anon

>>15434993
Amphetamine use of any kind over an extended period of time or even short period of time with high exposure causes neurological damage. First use rewires neural pathways related to pleasure. Anyone who refutes this is rationalizing.

>>15444349
Just buy 7g of meth for like 150$ and take 7mg doses

>>15444387
Never had any growing up. The opposite is true. Same goes for your odds of not neeting stimulants as an adult or having fewer symptoms. You people are abusers willing to permanently disable more children to satisfy your egos.

>>15444447
>You people are abusers willing to permanently disable more children to satisfy your egos
Wow your appeal to emotion has truly touched my heart, I guess we must now save the children from this made up condition by having mandatory amphetamines to every child under the sun, how profitable!

>>15444501
I am talking about facts. Just pointing out your ignorance shields you from the harm you cause and how abusive you and others like you are. Since you ignore facts, you ignore the harm you cause.

>>15444511
>I am talking about facts
Zero facts whatsoever, only you being stuck on your silly 'think of the children' emotional gospel to justify your drug addiction, relax no one is taking your meth supply away from you junkie

>>15444523
Oh? Pointing out people on ADHD do far worse when not medicated isn't talking about facts? Calling your carelessness what it is, abusive, isn't about facts?

ADHD is slang for laziness.

I lose respect for any peer or superior the instant they expose themselves as slaves to big pharma

>>15444536
>People with a chemical addiction do far worse when they cannot engage in their chemical addiction
Either you haven't had your stims today or they might need to increase your dose if you keep doing the same shitty flawed circular logic, contact your doctor asap for a stronger kick, seems you already build up tolerance

>>15444536
Yes anon people on stimulants perform better, that's the whole point of stimulants.

>>15444552
are you implying that the nazis were better because they were methheads?

>>15444548
Wasn't talking about that group. The contrast is in the group who've never had medication as children, as it easily falsifies your idea.
>>15444552
Not people. ADHD in particular. Completely unaware of all the research on it?

>>15435978
>ADHD doesn't exist
>But if ADHD did exist, the effects of taking meds designed to treat ADHD would be different to that of neurotypical people
I hate this website so much

>>15444563
>Haven't you read my pharma sponsored (peer review)® I HECKIN LOVE SOIENCE research?!?!?!
Next thing you will alternate between telling me that the planet is catastrophically cooling and then catastrophically heating over and over, or that men are women cause the peer reviewed SOIENCE dogma said so! Oh yes the science has been settled!

>>15444585
If you're on any medication used to treat any condition at all, you should probably be euthanised for being inefficient. Using medication or other remedies to treat ailments and disease signals human weakness.

>>15444576
I think you were missing the humor of how he may be
>implying
that it's a pushed drug

>>15444585
lol and I bet you think you're soooo smart

>>15444597
Is the concept of someone being able to lead a normal life without being constantly medicated to hell and back some kind of outlandish impossible scenario? Is this an American thing or something?

>>15444585
Yeah. Global warming and adhd are fake, viruses don't exist, black holes aren't real, and quantum physics is a pseud field created by jews. Did I miss anything?

>>15444608
No. Is the concept that some people can't without medication some kind of outlandish impossible scenario?

>>15444608
When the natural human form is spammed by residuals from manmade contaminants, you're already being forcibly medicated. The United States protects corporate interests, not people or the environment. This results in forced exposure to chemicals within all foods, the water supply, and the air. You're "medicated" with agents that disrupt natural hormonal balance from birth.

>>15444611
The whole point is that in fact, they actually can. But a financially motivated sector prey on these people into thinking they can't and they make sure they absolutely cannot by altering their brain chemistry through relentless medication

>>15444631
>The whole point is that in fact, they actually can.
60 years of research worldwide to the contrary. Let me guess, it came to you in a dream? You're right because you believe it? Sounds like narcissism to me

>>15444631
If you're not on TRT right now, I'll give you another 10-15 years before you're begging for it despite working out and eating well.

>>15444636
>60 years of research worldwide to the contrary
Really makes you wonder what happened in the 70s
>Let me guess, it came to you in a dream? You're right because you believe it? U r le schizo!
I accept your concession, thanks for playing and don't forget to request your doctor to increase your dosage, you really need it

>>15444650
Narcissistic personality disorder sucks bro hope you can get better

>>15444536
>ADHD do far worse when not medicated
I’m shocked, people perform better by certain metrics when they take doses of strong stimulants, like who would’ve guessed.

>hey sci, what's the science on taking fucking METH?
>IS METH GOOD FOR YOU?
>METH IS OK FOR KIDS RIGHT?
>its not LItErAllY meth, it just has... all the effects of meth? Its mechanism of action is the same as meth?
on economic incentives, i can hardly believe you could say such a terrible thing. what makes you believe the most powerful companies in the world would be able to convince me, your trusty doctor, that giving meth to your kid is a good idea? i have clearly reached this exceedingly popular idea purely on its own merits, such as... uhm... well the reasons don't include money, please believe-

>>15444563
>Not people. ADHD in particular. Completely unaware of all the research on it?
I’m completely aware that you’re retarded. If everyone performs better on stimulants then yes “adhd” people will also perform better on them. What’s the problem are adhd people just bad at performing naturally or something?

>>15445376
>everyone performs better on stimulants
this is not even remotely true. they might suppress feelings of fatigue, but most people get jittery and hyper from them.

>>15444625
Holy fuck anon Thankyou so fucking much. I am borderline schizo about food and water and cosmetics and even down to soaps and whatnot and I tried to explain this to people but I’m retarded with words. You have no idea how much this post meant to me anon, thankyou.

>>15445376
Yes. It's like a more socially acceptable retardation without medication. Hyperactivity shows up as impulsive behaviors in adulthood. I would be interested to see how an inner citty community came up, with all adolescents and young adults that displayed disruptive behaviors placed on ADHD medication through a period of 10 years. Fully monitored distribution.

>>15445376
>I’m completely aware that you’re retarded.
Oh, so you are totally unaware. Shame.
> If everyone performs better on stimulants
They don't. Stimulants in a normal brain has the opposite problem as the brain tries to downregulate. With ADHD the brain can't sufficiently upregulate. Everything stimulants help someone with ADHD with it hurts in a normal brain, because it works on homeostasis. Not "more is always better".

Not that you're likely to learn anything from anybody since you think you already know everything.

>>15445400
In a way you can already see that in rates of criminality. There's research on that with respect to race as well, and poverty in general. Lack of access or trust in medication and doctors. Those who do in the same strata have far less criminality than those who don't and never reilably medicate. Plenty of research on that kind of thing.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6697582/
Plenty of literature reviews or meta-analyses you can find on it too. Reduces risk of injuries, obesity, drug seeking, alcoholism, crime, makes life a lot better in general.

>>15445386
No, in proper doses(very low) everyone across the board performs better cognitively and physically on amphetamines(in the short term). There is a reason it is banned in most sports as it decreases reaction times and increases short burst strength and stamina. The downside of extended use is weight loss, tolerance, rapid aging, high blood pressure, heart problems, strokes, seizures, etc.
Simply put, it’s just not worth it. Where did adhd come from anyways? Didn’t back in the day they used to just drop out and go work on the farm if they couldn’t focus in school? So now we figured out how to force them into school even when they can’t focus then dope them up to standards. Got it.

>>15445400
> I would be interested to see how an inner citty community came up, with all adolescents and young adults that displayed disruptive behaviors placed on ADHD medication through a period of 10 years. Fully monitored distribution.
They did this and found that childhood users of amphetamine had an extremely high chance of meth abuse later. The study was scrubbed and you will never find it though.

>>15445400
>Hyperactivity shows up as impulsive behaviors in adulthood.
There are two major subtypes of ADHD, one is inattentive one is hyperactive. Inattentive more locks you into a permanent fugue or dissociative state like depression only as "profound boredom" and disinterest. Inability to focus without the hyperactivity. Hugely disabling especially if it's severe. Less crime and such but more alcoholism and the like.

>>15445418
>They did this and found that childhood users of amphetamine had an extremely high chance of meth abuse later. The study was scrubbed and you will never find it though.
Compared to people with lifelong proper and consistent medication people with ADHD who've been treated consistently have far fewer drug and substance use disorders. We can assume you're not just lying and you're still wrong.

>>15445414
>source: my drug fantasies where all people are the same

>>15445414
>There is a reason it is banned in most sports as it decreases reaction times and increases short burst strength and stamina.
Yeah, as a physical stimulant. That isn't what's happening in the brain and the physical stimulating effects tend to get adapted to. The neurological effects on executive functioning remain, however, and that is what people with ADHD need most. In a normal brain it has the opposite effect due to disrupting homeostasis. For the ADHD brain the homeostasis is unable to achieve normal functioning. Hence the problem.

>>15445396
Just be careful with how obsessed you become with it. There's a bit of a blackpill that you have to swallow in understanding that something will probably always be there. Just make the best choices you're able to and let yourself live.

>>15439944
Fallacious argument. Second, expert psychiatrists consider ADHD to a broad catagory that much of humanity functionally can fall into. Disorders of executive functioning. Judgements. Decisions. Organizations. These are all clear and in most cases such patients benefit from psychostimulant therapy. The “ADHD Brain" where it's a unique psychopathogenesis rooted in neurological differences between "normal" and "ADHD brain" individuals is outmoded, and falsifiable. In most cases this error is simply the patient playing the doctor. Furthermore, the peddlers of this idea are clinical psychologists (pseuds) selling self help books for brainlets diagnosed with it.

>>15435783
what coping mechanisms do you have for reasons its not recommended that i go on stimulants for adhd but im majoring in enginerring im able to do decently when i can force myself to study a few hours a week but sometimes i go full retard and can barely get a few hours a week of effective study, do you have any tips and shit

I just drink a tall can of beer before studying and i can sit and read for hours on end

Should I do one of those drugs or nicotine (via patches)?

>>15447520
>Second, expert psychiatrists consider ADHD to a broad catagory that much of humanity functionally can fall into.
False
>Disorders of executive functioning. Judgements. Decisions. Organizations.
You're just describing the generalities. There are tests, eye tracking, reaction time, etc. You haven't the first clue about psychometrics, clearly.
>The “ADHD Brain" where it's a unique psychopathogenesis rooted in neurological differences between "normal" and "ADHD brain" individuals is outmoded, and falsifiable.
Falsifiable does not mean wrong, it means it "can be tested". Psychometric tests work, therefore the brain is different.
>Furthermore, the peddlers of this idea are clinical psychologists (pseuds) selling self help books for brainlets diagnosed with it.
Now there's a fallacious argument.

>>15445364
>I’m shocked, people perform better by certain metrics when they take doses of strong stimulants, like who would’ve guessed.
retard who doesn't know how comparisons work.

>>15439084
>>15440983
my schizo powers must be waning, because I can barely comprehend these posts