/sci/ - Science & Math

https://arstechnica.com/science/2023/05/rocket-report-china-selling-reusable-engines-can-spacex-still-raise-money/

https://www.abqjournal.com/2595660/celestis-spaceloft-rocket-carrying-philip-chapman-ashes-crashes-after-launching-from-spaceport-america.html

>>15417687
>philip-chapman
who?

https://spacenews.com/blacksky-seeks-to-extend-operations-of-satellites-running-on-empty/

> The unredacted portions of the request provide no details about why the spacecraft are running out of propellant, although it appears to be earlier than expected. The two spacecraft launched as rideshare payloads on a SpaceX Falcon 9 Starlink mission in August 2020, and the STA notes the spacecraft have a three-year design life.

> BlackSky did not respond to questions about the STA or the health of the two satellites. The company, publicly traded on the New York Stock Exchange, has not made any other regulatory filings about the satellites. BlackSky is scheduled to release its first quarter financial results on May 10 before the markets open.

>>15417692
https://www.nasa.gov/image-feature/nasa-mourns-the-passing-of-astronaut-philip-k-chapman/

never went to space

>never went to space
At least he's consistent!

https://spacenews.com/lockheed-martin-announces-reorganization-of-its-space-business/

https://spacenews.com/debate-rages-about-future-of-new-horizons/

> That puts the future of New Horizons after fiscal year 2024 in limbo. “We are in a quandary. I don’t know what we’re going to do about it,” said Curt Niebur, lead scientist for flight programs in NASA’s planetary science division, at the OPAG meeting. NASA had hoped the mission would accept the senior review outcome. “That path is broken.”

> While NASA’s planetary programs have struggled with cost issues, from potential increasing costs for Mars Sample Return to the delay in the Psyche launch that has pushed back the VERITAS Venus mission by three years, New Horizons takes up a minute part of the overall planetary budget. NASA requested $9.7 million for the mission in its fiscal year 2024 budget proposal, less than 0.3% of the overall planetary science budget of $3.38 billion.

so SLS and JPL are basically fucking everybody else

> Some at the OPAG meeting suggested that a solution would require some improved cooperation among NASA’s science divisions, including perhaps a more equitable sharing of mission costs. “Meritorious science can be achieved in heliophysics, astrophysics and planetary science but science optimization will require creative problem solving and cross-divisional leadership,” the senior review report stated.

>Starship: 250t expendable; 150t fully reusable

Is there anything this man can't do?

>>15417697
Oh, Carlos!

>>15417682
When do you think SpaceX will declare bankruptcy and shut down operations?

>>15417721
Current Starship fleet total payload capability: 0 grams

>>15417710
They dont want to admit starship exists

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q14qpzcy4JM

>>15417721
If it does get refueling capabilties then even fully expendable can still be recovered in orbit

>>15417682
who will be the first man to take a shit on another world??

>>15417744
Who knows, all the Apollo astronauts held it in because they didn't wanna be remembered as the first

more
space
stations

>>15417740
previous design iterations (I don't think a full rocket was ever built, first keralox engines then they changed to methalox)

>>15417754
current 3 stage iteration aimed at deep space missions

>>15417754
It's actually amazing to see China move away from old stolen russky designs.
When have they ever designed anything on their own?

2040 is supposed to be when a fully reusable Starship like variant is made (the variant on the right outlined with a red box)

>>15417721
Why are we spending all this time developing launch vehicles when we can just assemble ISS-like factories up there?

>>15417764
why do you bring this up every thread? get new trolling material dude

>>15417764
Remind me again how we get those factories up there?

>>15417710
Thanks for the relevant article dump.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_i2DFPjIxf8

>>15417754
Just for clarification; I still call their other variant the “5DY”… but the 5DY is now the LM-10 right?

>>15417767
Not my problem

>>15417783
idk, just paraphrasing the video
LM-10 in the video was a Falcon Heavy clone supposed to launch in 2027, but the boosters landing on controllable wires instead of directly on the raft with landing legs

Earth is flat with a dome. You are never ever leaving this plane alive sciencebois™

All these launches are completely fake and gay.

https://odysee.com/@januszkowalskii1979:e/NASA---Going-Nowhere-Since-1958-(Full-Documentary):4

>>15417813
Ok but who?

>>15417721
>solution would require some improved cooperation among NASA’s science divisions, including perhaps a more equitable sharing of mission costs. “Meritorious science can be achieved in helioph
>>15417710
>>15417699
>>15417693
>>15417687
>>15417686
Nice

Explanation: Why are there so many flat rocks on Mars? Some views of plains and hills on Mars show many rocks that are unusually flat when compared to rocks on Earth. One reason for this is a process that is common to both Mars and Earth: erosion. The carbon-dioxide wind on Mars can act like sandpaper when it blows around gritty Martian sand. This sand can create differential erosion, smoothing over some rocks, while wearing down the tops of other long-exposed stones.

With SpaceX, Amazon, China, Russia, Oneweb, etc. building megaconstellations with thousands, if not thousands of satellites, what is the capacity of satellites that LEO can handle?

>>15417860
billions. capacity is irrelevant with good tracking.

>>15417860
with enough maneuvering capability it won't be a problem

>>15417860
>Russia
what the hell is pockocmoc building lol

>>15417682

>>15417721
>october 2021

>>15417860
how many cardboard boxes do you thing we could fit on the surface of the earth and covering all the oceans?

>>15417682
>>15417686
>>15417687
>>15417693
>>15417699
>>15417710
collagefag

>>15417886
He is not collagefag, I am collagefag. Stop mixing people up

>>15417890
>I am collage
Most certainly not

>>15417899
I can't tell if this is pro or anti-musk

>>15417876
lmao, looks like the the stages of grief

>>15417900
CSS made a claim that the Starship exploding would be as catastrophic as the largest nuke ever built detonating, if it were to blowup on the pad, I believe this is what the meme is alluding to

>>15417900
>>15417899
>>15417905
TOTAL E**THER DEATH

>>15417908
>>15417899

>>15417905
>starship contains roughly 1 000 tons of propellant
>biggest nuke equals 50 000 000 tons of chemical explosive
SpaceX confirmed for literal fucking wizards

>>15417886
I just advertised /SFG/ on pol again :) (and r*ddit)

>>15417913
>>15417894

>>15417721
>Well-optimized
Kek. Assuming a vacuum isp throughout, a fully fueled and expendable starship with 250t payload only has 9.058km/s of delta-v, smaller than the ~9.3km/s minimum required for LEO.

>>15417928
let me guess you didn't account for staging

>>15417928
Can I see your math for that? What sort of Isp and mass numbers are you using for "optimized" SS+SH?

>>15417934
lel. Yes I did.

>>15417928
This checks out.

>>15417937
>desmoschad
I kneel.

>>15417905
Based on what?

>>15417836
It also helps that rovers are typically observing sed rocks that historically formed horizontally as water-deposited sediments fell out of suspension in layers and cemented

>>15417941
it came to him in a (schizophrenic) dream like all his material

>>15417928
sub-orbital refueling

>>15417937
looks good. given the 100 and 200 what payload do you get to 9.3km/s?
i guess 9.3 is an approximation factoring in gravity loss?

>>15417945
9.3km/s is the circular orbital velocity @ 200km + minimum drag loss(https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Low_Earth_orbit#Orbital_characteristics).).
You could make it with 100, just barely with 200.

>>15417867
the first regression from manned orbital flight to unmanned payloads to losing access to space completely

>>15417941
>Based on what?
Well uh, something something amount of fuel equals this amount of energy and it will kill everyone within this radius
I doubt he will ever rectify this uh.. statement of his

>>15417950
solving for x that's 224 tons for 9300 m/s.
stretch the ship and lighten up the booster and 250 seems like a reasonable estimate for "well-optimized" and expendable

NOO ELON NOOO

>>>/wsg/5078592

>>15417966
a new form of orbital launch ring

>>15417963
ehhh. Most LEO rockets have ~10km/s for good measure. At most a fully maxxed-out starship can only do ~100t. The shit is massively inefficient.

Orbital test really brought in the riff raff

>>15417743
fully expendable means stripped down TPS and flaps, I'd think

>>15417969
Thanks for the info, black science man.

>>15417974
>At most a fully maxxed-out starship can only do ~100t.
Why do you lie hydrogenfag? Expendable and fully maxxed-out both imply weight savings.
Additionally Starship will be stretched to hold 1500-1600 tons of propellant.
For 10000 m/s that's closer to 200 tons than 100.
Also fuel efficiency or whatever is still not a metric to care about.

>>15417963
Bro, he is assuming vacuum only Isp. In the real world Starship still wouldn't be able to make orbit with that payload if you added 1000t of propellant, assumed Starship was only 80t, and completely ignored the dry mass of Super Heavy

>>15417982
It's a more pessimistic estimate, but not unrealistic. Especially considering the many unknowns with the aerodynamic and re-entry profiles of the starship. I would say somewhere between 100-200. By the same metric, your payload would be doubled using hydrogen.

>>15417982
the calculation in question https://www.wolframalpha.com/input?i=340+*+9.8+*+ln%28%283600%2B1600%2Bx%29%2F%28180%2B1600%2Bx%29%29+%2B+363+*+9.8+*+ln%28%281600%2Bx%29%2F%2880%2Bx%29%29%3D10000
>>15417989
>posting wrong things out of pure cope
https://www.wolframalpha.com/input?i=340+*+9.8+*+ln%28%283600%2B1600%2B250%29%2F%28180%2B1600%2B250%29%29+%2B+363+*+9.8+*+ln%28%281600%2B250%29%2F%2880%2B250%29%29

>>15417989
Well, if you calculate it, it comes out to ~150t. Yes again realistically is going to be in the lower 100s according to le musktard's 'stretching metrics'. Honestly with enough shenanigans you can get to 200, 300 etc. But that's just retarded. Since this is all expandable.

Hate it when niggers do calculations without any units

>>15417993
Hydrogen is out for the booster due to thrust leaving you with only the ship.
You'll need to make it massively taller or wider which would push you over 9m for both vehicles.
Additionally your storage, insulation, embrittlement and fuel cost concerns get worse.
I'm think I'll pass

>hydrologs
these people still exist

>>15418009
I would but wolfram alpha gets confused which is honestly tragic it can't even do something so simple

>>15417995
<<Saturn V stats
Cry about it.

>>15418014
Surely the problem is wolfram alpha and not your input.

>>15418011
Boil-off isn't that big of an issue for LEO. Shit becomes dramatically better for increasing delta-v. There's a reason why the saturnV's upper stages use LHOX.

>>15418016
>his launch cost doesn't limit to cost of fuel

>>15417993
you are fucking delusional, the payload would be nonexistent with hydrogen because the H2 tank would be the entire methane tank + LITERALLY THE ENTIRE PAYLOAD BAY
Did you forget that hydrogen takes three times as much volume as methane for the same exact amount of energy?
>b-but it's 2.4 ti-
You dropped the excessively thick, heavy, autistic foam insulation (onto the TPS of Columbia and killed 7 astronauts). LH2 means no common bulkhead either. It's a fucking waste of space and would ruin the starship after ~10 flights due to embrittlement; literally the worst possible fuel choice. A kerolox starship makes more sense, faggot.

>>15418011
Also if u do the maths. The second stage's payload still gets doubled if swapped with LHOX. Musktards can't grasp the concept of ISP.

>>15418025
Retard. A fully-expendable starship only has 150t max.

>>15417995
>posting wrong things out of pure cope
>9.4 km/s
So it still wouldn't make orbit because Starship doesn't have minimum drag, gravity losses, and isn't launching from the equator. Your point, ma'am?

>>15418026
you'd likely have drop the stainless and go back to precision milled and formed autistgrid aluminium just to get its anemic ass to move.

>>15418028
250t

>>15418028
>not understanding the argument
holy kek.
also wrong >>15417995

>>15418027
now post the lh2 tank volume, nigger. oops, no more payload!

>>15418027
second stage would have to be the size of the first plus all the other problems you're introducing.
whatever you're trolling (again)

>>15418026
>no!!!! Muh voloooooom!!!!
Just build a bigger rocket faggot. The 'autistic foam' is what enabled the skylab so stfu.

>>15418028
150t is reusable mode
250+t is fully expendable mode.

imagine trying to stirweld aluminium in a field. they wouldn't have even finished hopper yet.

>>15418035
No.

Reality check: Starship hasn't reached orbit or carried any payloads

>>15418043
>1300
>1600
ok now you're just niggerposting.

>>15418037
Didn't stop skylab from being launched in the fucking '70s. This shit is tried and true. Again, musktards are fucking delusional, u guys can't think for yourselves.

>musktards
>shilling for hydrogen
the absolute state

>>15418047
you're just boring at this point

>>15418043
>doing a wrong calculation because he couldn't cope with the results of the correct one
>>15417995

>>15418038
cope hydrocel. methalox is the future and your trash low-thrust, low-density, leaky, metal ruining, deep cryogenic, fossil fuel derived, glorified steam engine propellant was obsolete 50 years ago.

>>15418053
Fucking retard, even if I use 350s it only increases by 15t.

>>15418057
refer to this >>15418046

>>15418055
Pls. Ever heard of the inverse square law? Volume increases more than surface area which is proportional to insulation mass. So nomatter how much 'leakier' hydrogen is, it would eventually outperform at high enough delta-V. This has been demonstrated historically with apollo.

>>15418062
As in missions requiring higher deltaV.

uh hum
space elevators are really gay

>>15418062
>at high enough delta-V
hydrofag still doesn't understand orbital refilling.

>>15418058
I used this.

best edition so far ngl

>>15418066
Literally the two reasons Starship exists.
Rapid reusability and orbital refilling and hydrolox isn't the right choice for either.
If you want your high performance expendable kick stage then go work for ULA. It's just not what Starship is.

https://arstechnica.com/science/2023/05/as-many-as-four-moons-around-uranus-may-have-oceans-below-the-surface/

With the abundance of water/ice in the solar system the development of NTP technology will be critical for reaching out beyond cislunar space.

asking why hydrolox isn't used in heavy lift vehicles that are designed to be reused is like asking why formula 1 engines that are rebuilt every race arent used in semi trucks.

>>15417969
The insight he provides is unmatched

>>15418066
Musktards don't understand that orbital refueling is unnecessary for hydrogen, and interbody missions aren't justified to use methalox owing to its efficiency. You mongrels have no concept of scale.

>>15418062
the problems (multiple, very very very many) with hydrogen do not stop at worse tank mass fraction. you have still not even tried to cope about the volume requirements because it's an insurmountable problem. "just make the rocket bigger" is an incomplete statement, but I'll finish it for you: "just make the second stage of the rocket twice as big as the first stage for maybe ~20% more payload, all while guaranteeing it won't be rapidly reusable due to engine refurbishment and will have a lifespan measured in months due to embrittlement and will be flimsier than the shuttle orbiters due to the requirement of TPS OVER TOP OF FOAM INSULATION"

H2 starship would never survive reentry and would be so fucking stretched you'd need to build an entire second tower on top of the first one just to be able to stack it.

>>15418078
>yea but bro the truck only has 400hp and the car has 1600 just optimise the truck brah im an engineer brother trust me i saw it on a youtube documentary

>>15418075
>NTP
>outer planet missions
Unironically kill yourself. You are the worst /sfg/ poster in a field of tough competition.

>>15418080
>refueling is unnecessary for hydrogen
HAHAHAHAHAAHAH
Launch to maes, land, take off, go to earth and land on your hydrogen second stage bro

>>15418081
>you have still not even tried to cope about the volume requirements because it's an insurmountable problem
Tanks are hollow retard.
>H2 starship would never survive reentry
The starship design is just retarded. There's no point in making the 2nd stage fully reusable.

>There's no point in making the 2nd stage fully reusable.
retard levels are peaking

>>15418088
This goes for the first stage as well. Saturn V never needed to be reusable and SpaceX still can't compare

>>15418090
its the space elavator fanboi trolling because reasons unknown (mental illness leading candidate)

>>15418087
kys faggot. We were comparing maxxed-out starship to hydrogen. Hydrogen is demonstrably superior in every way, even accounting for extra mass owing to reusability.

>>15418080
no YOU don't understand scale. hydrogen fucking destroys steel; no reusable hydrogen engine has ever been made that doesn't need 6 months and $100,000,000 of refurbishment after every flight. It would literally be cheaper to build a new raptor for every single flight than to refurb a hydrolox engine. there is no rapid with hydrogen, and reuse is limited to <20 flights unless you switch to aluminum for better resistance to embrittlement and guess what, now you need triple the TPS mass because alu turns into fucking playdough at 300C
>>15418088
>There's no point in making the 2nd stage reusable
the final hydrogenigger cope, even NASA knew 2nd stage reuse was more important than 1st stage reuse

>>15418094
the apollo program cost 5% of us gdp/year

guys we should just throw away the first AND second stage because I like hydrogen rockets better

>>15418099
Astronauts need to eat

>>15418090
Note: FULLY reusable. You can ditch the foam. Also, I don't see how extra insulation can't be added. you retards can't fucking scale.

>>15418099
to put that into perspective most western states struggle to meet their 2% commitment on defense and the us is criticised for spending 4-5% and just look at the juggernaut that is. now imagine it all spent on a single rocket.

>>15418098
Oh ffs, ya think that's gonna fucking matter when you're going to the moon? Or doing the >9000x interbody bullshit musktards peddle? Falcon 9 and cool 'n all but starship is retarded.

Could Starship land on Titan or would its velocity be too great for atmospheric braking?

Chad $/kg considerer vs virgin basement dweller shilling hydrogen because nobody will respond to his skyhook posts

>>15418107
you cannot ditch the foam. even the fully expendable, FIRST STAGE of the Delta IV had the foam. do you even know anything about hydrogen besides 'isp go up'
>>15418113
at this point I think it's clear you're either some kind of SLS shill in disguise or god forbid an actual NASA employee, either way you need to be put on suicide watch.

>>15418098
>You will innovate
>it's too hard
>hurr durrr methalox
Between myriad of challenges with the starship (orbital refueling, landing etc.), and improving some hydrogen engines, I think the latter has more feasible.

>>15418113
>ffs
>musktards
>cool 'n all
Why do you reddit niggers come here? Fuck off subhuman trash.

>>15418121
he hates any investment in rockets because apparently we should skip that and go to shifting millions of tons of "junk" (his words) around earth orbit to built a sky hook or space elevator or something.

>>15418121
>FIRST STAGE of the Delta IV had the foam.
You fucking autist, we were talking about the saturnV. Pay attention pls.

>>15418124
Musktards ARE a reddit phenomena. You retards are all from there, their subs are huge echo chambers where u can circlejerk about starship mars colonies.

>>15418122
>hydrogen doesn't require orbital refueling
>hydrogen doesn't require landing
the cope get's better by the minute.

Pic of Starship

basically the worst kind of autist; the autist that is also incredibly dumb but very opinionated.

>>15418129
>the single biggest anti-musk echo chamber on the entire internet
>b-but you belong there
Fuck off you subhuman piece of trash.

>>15418122
>and improving some hydrogen engines
They tried for decades and spent billions of dollars on the RS-25 for that. Turns out it's simply not feasible. You're just utterly retarded.

Look guys, my brain is kinda fried rn, but I feel especially pissed at u retards. My judgement has been severely impaired and I can barely process language rn, but the ethereal stimulation from hearing u muskfags circlejerk about ur god-emperors space dildo has given me enough cognitive reserve to spam shit on 4chan. But my conclusions are based in physics yours has no solid foundation to stand on. It's all so tiresome.

>>15418127
Saturn had the foam too, you just don't see it because they (the Nazi rocket scientists NASA employed) actually had enough humanity to be ashamed of the oxidised orange shitstain and made the call to paint it over.
https://history.nasa.gov/afj/s-ii/s-ii-insulation.html
even worse, before they switched to the spray-on stuff they were using panels which almost doubled (!!) the already heavy insulation mass and actually had worse thermal performance.

The foam is heavy. The foam is non-reusable. The foam is inevitable.

>>15418131
at this rate the cope may even get to "hydrogen doesn't even need a rocket at all" before the thread stages; hopefully this faggot stops posting or gets b& before that point.
>>15418134
>incredibly dumb
and also completely uninformed

>>15418144
>n-no I was pretending to be retarded ALL ALONG. Haha trolled!
I accept your concession

>>15418144
see you tomorrow you schizo thread ruining cunt
go dream of your hooks

>>15418137
Oh pls. have u ever been there? Shit's full of retards like you. Fuck this board, u migrants ruined this fucking board.

There is a hydrogen moon lander architecture that's better than Starship but it's not a second stage.
It is a lander that gets launched on a second stage, goes from LEO to the lunar surface and back to LEO to be refueled there by a fully reusable vehicle to go to the moon again.
Reusability is key and you're delusional if you don't understand that.

Is David, dare I say, based?

>>15418152
imagine being the third crew to use a hydrolox reusable moon lander
assholes so tight they could crack time

>>15418145
The foam was not orange.
The foam was not painted, it was covered in plastic.
Color was irrelevant to the question: they put plastic over it as a vapor barrier because the foam was not water proof.

Go be wrong somewhere else.

>>15418154
he's right but not spaceflight

>>15418144
I do not accept your concession. Your conduct is unacceptable and I challenge you to an unarmed duel to the death.
>>15418152
wrong, the correct architecture is a semi-reusable capsule which is launched by a hydrolox first stage with SRBs that goes to a shitty meme orbit around the moon because the capsule is too fat and the rocket is too weak to actually reach LLO, at which point it rendezvouses with a reusable methalox second stage which was refuelled in LEO and that methalox second stage then goes from the meme orbit to the lunar surface and back.

>>15418148
I'm not trolling. I'm serious. You guys just don't get it. You don't get the scaling with deltaV budget, u don't get how big a compromise methalox is. You don't get NERVA, and other promising tech that got stalled bcus of politics. Starship is never going to the moon, or mars. Keep dreaming faggots, keep the cum flowing.

>>15418165
What diagnosis do you have?

>>15418157
talking about the spray on shit used from Apollo 13 onwards. The panel type insulation was what needed the vapor barrier, the spray-on shit is literally the EXACT same stuff used on the STS External Tank, and you'd better believe it turned orange in the 70s too.

>>15418165
>You don't get NERVA, and other promising tech that got stalled bcus of politics.
Kek, I can see why you like it

>>15418165
the other day you were promoting
>heavy lift aircraft
>with a rocket strapped to it
>that would launch and dock with with a 70000 ton object suspended 100km in the air by a 40 million ton object made of "junk" using a 100000 mile long tether
presumably you'll be using hydrolox for the rocket component of this plan?

>>15418114
Titan's atmospheric pressure is 1.5 bars at surface level. It's possible for the Starship technique to work. I'm not sure what the mission profile would look like though. Would they try to hit Titan with aerobraking plus a capture burn or would they try just getting into elliptical Saturn orbit and wait for a good time to visit Titan

>>15418132
cool pic of starship, got any more?

>>15418154
Thats true though. Religion is intellectual cowardice. It's the most NPC thing you can believe.

>>15418175
stfu nigger. That space elevator redditard ain't me. I'm not 'promoting' anything, NERVA has been tested in the '50s, it was the primary consideration for mars missions by nasa '90s analyses. Fuck methalox. It's a mockery of the field.

>>15418179
that's the only one i have :(

>>15418187
>i-it wasn't me
kek

>>15418187
>ISP is everything and nothing else matters.
Kill yourself already christ.

>>15418124
They're crossboarders and crosssite posters. They're all infected.

tell me why this wouldn't work

actually don't. just tell me I'm a genius who revolutionized space travel

>>15418195
already been done before (on paper)

>>15418188
that's okay, nice dubs btw. hopefully there will be more opportunities to take pictures of one in the future :)

>>15418195
Mush.

>>15418195
You're not as smart as you think you are.

>>15418201
I win

>>15418195
chemicalfags btfo, they will never recover

>>15418195
Fuck u helion nigger
>>15418192
Fuck u redditard shill. I know u drones are from there, I've seen the hivemind, I've seen it irl, those smelly-ass uni basedjaks sippin chai and moving their big-ass electric hover-dildo-scooters in my face with those big-ass hipster glasses. Fuck 'em. Slice and dice and macaroni pie.

>>15418195
Anon....this is GENIUS

>>15418202
Delete your account. You didn't win, sir.

>>15418201
>>15418202
???????
sometimes i just don't get the interactions on this website man, maybe i'm just autistic but occasionally i will see an exchange of posts so incomprehensible that my eyes start twitching.

so I was thinking. if you had boosters in orbit ready to go how hard would it for them to get hooked to a rocket after it leaves atmo? the boosters could be started during the right time so it would be like aerial refueling levels of difficulty I feel

>>15418211
Post wieght
>he won't

>>15418211
Anon responded to a schizo namefag with his own line but it's better to just report and ignore

>>15418168
They still put a Teflon barrier over the foam because they were being conservative with the engineering. If they'd actually built Block II Saturn Vs they probably would have eliminated the barrier and just used an orange second stage to save weight and boost the vehicle's capability.

>>15418195
Ever heard of orion? I'll be adding u to my macaroni pie soon. Hushhhh.

>>15418210
he has revolutionised space travel with a think and ms paint. he has won.

>Fatty McNamefag is back
Reported

>>15418214
>his own line
Lmao really? I stole "I win" from Samuel Campos. A Brazilian guitarist and Geffen Records artist.

It's interesting when you remember that normal people don't really know anything about space stuff. Like SpaceX comes up and all they know is that they blew up a rocket again, are they ever going to actually have a finished rocket?

>>15418224
shame no one will steal your virginity

>>15418214
we need to REALLY bring back insane asylums, i'm sick of all these mentally ill retards being allowed to post their mental filler text on the internet and glogging up spaces of conversation with completely irrelevant, unhinged nonsense.
lock all of them up in a cell and never give them internet access again.

>>15418218
he'll leave soon

>>15418228
This makes me happy that my interests remain niche. Curiosity is truly a wonderful filter

>>15418228
>finished
It's never finished, it will start flying imcreasingly often and making it to orbit reliably.
Launch is really not a hard problem compared to reentry and reusability.

>>15418229
Not spaceflight related
>>15418217
He tried, that is a positive thing. But he didn't win.
>>15418218
>announcing a report
>>15418231
>we
Take a look on the mirror. Who is "we", in you trash filled pig brain?

Make the cheese sauce.
In a medium saucepan, melt 4 tablespoons butter. Add in the flour, salt and sugar, then stir until smooth.
Gradually add in the milk, stirring constantly. Bring to a boil; cook and stir for 2 minutes or until the mixture has thickened. Reduce the heat to low.
Stir in the Velveeta cheese until melted. Stir in cottage cheese, sour cream and 1 cup cheddar cheese until melted.
A note on the cheese sauce. Feel free to switch up the cheeses. If you don’t want to use Velveeta, use more cheddar cheese…or monterey jack or white cheddar or colby. Any should work so feel free to get creative.

Prepare the pork.
This recipe is perfect for leftover pulled pork. This can be smoked pork (hello amazing flavor!) or a slow cooker shredded pork.

You’ll need around 4 cups of shredded pork. If you use any more than 4 cups you may want to use a bigger pan to cook the casserole in because it will be very full.

To the shredded pork, add about 1 ¼ cups of your favorite barbecue sauce. We like homemade bbq sauce, but you can use absolutely anyone you like. Please note that the type of bbq sauce you use will result in the flavor of the casserole. Make sure you choose a bbq sauce you love.

Assemble and bake.
Drain the macaroni and place it in a greased 9×13 baking pan.

Pour the cheese mixture over macaroni.
Spoon the pulled pork evenly over the macaroni and cheese.
Sprinkle with the remaining cheddar cheese.
Bake, covered, for 20 minutes, then uncover and bake an additional 20 minutes or until heated through.

You can reduce the baking time by heating the barbecue pork mixture before spooning it on top. That way you won’t be adding cold pork to the macaroni and cheese, making it longer to bake.

What goes with pulled pork mac and cheese?
Looking to make this a complete meal? Here are a few of our favorite side dishes:

sparkling fruit salad
sourdough dinner rolls
baked beans
buttery green beans
baked potatoes
baked potato wedges

>>15418241
>Take a look on the mirror. Who is "we", in you trash filled pig brain?
not spae flight related

>>15418241
> >announcing a report
Reported for announcing a report. I could go all day nigger. I've also reported this post for being extremely low quality and off-topic

>>15418243
beats tortillas everytime.

>>15418241
i'm living in your walls right now, i'm watching you while you're posting and i know your name, if you don't stop posting now i'm going have SWAT jump you mr schizo :)

>>15418243
HWNBAVF

i have no pictures to post on /sfg/. im all out of pictures

Is this what krauts really sound like? Fuck, if I had known they were so effeminate, I wouldn't have become a nazi.

This is a little known fact but Jeff Bezos is actually 5 to 7 inches taller than the SpaceX CEO Elon Musk.

>>15418247
Why would you report your own post?
>>15418249
I highly doubt that. But your comment is noted. It has happened before, Gregory Stevens.

You faggots don't know about Orion. It's the TRUE dildo rocket (anal prolapser, ala Chuck Palaniuk: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cYHLpEEz_8g)) unlike the hollowed out fleshlight that is starship, which musktrannies use to satisfy both their male and tranny urges.

>>15418255
here we go now he's on one

>>15418257
>he's on one
this doesn't mean anything

Test

>>15418234
No, I don't think I will...

>>15418261
>>15418262
samefag

>>15418257
Puts every rocket to shame. 2000s ISP and MEGAnewtons of thrust.

>>15418085
don't worry your football field sized solar panels will give you enough of a trickle at Uranus to run the comm antenna

>>15418263
Ok Sam

>>15418264
how many nukes in each cassette each using how much plutonium?

>>15418255
Retard helioniggers will be sliced 'n diced in pulled pork macrrackronie creampie when Chukjwagger (ie: phenobarbital) shows them that fusion propulsion was already feasible 70 years ago.

>>15418154
>SLS stan
>based

pick one

>>15418243
>Velveeta
No goyslop for me thank you

https://youtu.be/zFZDeJOs19Y
holy shit

>>15418267
Specific details are classified, scaled-down 2-stage teller-ulam. The fusion shit generate upwards of 100000ISP.

>>15418187
stop trying to associate NTP with your faggotry

been watching s29 bros... its about to get fully stacked. who ready?

I find existing religions hard to believe, but also hard not to believe in some form of creationism to explain the Universe

https://twitter.com/i/spaces/1eaKbrOqoeeKX/peek

NASA doing spaces live, ask em questions about blackholes

>>15418265
>the only source of power available at Uranus is from bimodal NTP because umm reasons
Once again, kill yourself. You're actually less reasonable and intelligent than the namefag and the space elevatorfag despite shilling in a similar way.

>>15418255

>>15418273
still need fission primers but its well beyond current capacity as nasa has nearly run out of plutonium for rtgs and the rest is used for maintaining nuclear stockpiles.
do we even have the capability of producing new plutonium in large amounts?

Just so everyone is aware, Cost-Plus Content anon is definitely alive. He's just a lazy SOB eho hasnt made a video in almost 2 years

>>15418265
>trickles Uranus
GAY

>>15418282
Free content, no bitching

>>15418282
He is in collage or something, which has slightly better prospects than a small YouTuber competing against all the click baiters and idiots giving their hot takes

>>15418286
i want to know what happened to the anon with his pipebomb engine he posted pictures of and was about to test but then mysteriously disappeared (hes dead)

>>15418282
>Spaceflight videos coming weekly

>>15418228
Even normalfags know that SpaceX installed a reverse gear on their rockets, which is a thing nobody else tried.
So they have trust SpaceX will keep doing epic new things.

>>15418276
Welcome to based desim.

>>15418295
Normies hold both ideas in their head at once. Simultaneously that SpaceX lands rockets all the time and sends men to the space station and it's pretty cool, and also that their one rocket they've been building for years blew up and it's over for Musk.

>>15418301
Nah
You just associate with particularly dumb normalfags
Don't do that

>>15418286
If he produced content on twitter, he'd be competing against very few. Without any bot spam content, he'd have a higher chance of making it big on twitter.

>>15418278
>"There are other viable power sources available for a Uranus mission besides nuclear!"
>doesn't mention any

Many such cases.

>>15418301
they don't think about it at all. the average person would conflate it all with nasa which in turn conjures a memory of men on the moon and a space film they once watched.

>>15418306
bimodal NTP is not the only form of nuclear, retard

>>15418306
Beamed power from earth.

>>15418286
College, not collage.

>>15418313
yea we can barely figure out how to cabled power on earth

>>15418304
>If he produced content on twitter, he'd be competing against very few. Without any bot spam content, he'd have a higher chance of making it big on twitter
Fix the fucking FTS Elon

>>15418280
uranium can be used. Pure fission only needs several hundred bombs to get to land on mars 'n back from LEO. So much untapped potential. This shit seems crazy but it's all legit, the calculations all remain classified but by many accounts of: Dyson, Ulam, Von Braun, airforce etc. This shit was worked out and ready-to-implement. We can spare the ground-launch designs but this should be used for interplanetary.

>>15418309
>using hydrogen as propellant for NEP

And he calls others a retard.

>>15418321
Fuck nuclear electric. The only nuclear is orion prolapses (and nerva for continuous thrust pussies)

>>15418320
you're building and then launching hundreds of nuclear weapons over all the other countries with nuclear weapons. it wont happen outside of some starship troopers level global government where the fighting hasn't rendered the planet next to unlivable.

>>15418321
Wouldn't you want to use hydrogen because the energy scales off velocity squared?

https://twitter.com/NASASpaceflight/status/1654562759453945858

Starships getting tested at Masseys

>>15418321
>using hydrogen as propellant for NEP
No one implied that but water propellant MET or ELF is entirely plausible for utilizing in situ resources, chemical of course for surface to orbit. Do you understand what a reactor is, how they can generate power without chemical fuel? Apparently not.

>>15418327
>you're building and then launching hundreds of nuclear weapons over all the other countries with nuclear weapons.
Lmao, these are 300kg fusion-boosted bombs with sub-kt yield. The mars ship only uses 30t yield bombs.

>>15418337
it will never ever happen

>>15418341
ehhh. If it weren't for test ban, we'll all be zoomin on nukes by now.

>>15418333
this proves nothing
doomerbros, stay strong

>>15418343
can't remember the page on atomic rockets but theres a "law" that says if your roket has the power to easily do things within the solar system then it also has the power to destroy entire countries so would only exist in the hands of monopolistic planetety states or would be subject to similar controls of use as nuclear weapons are now among states that share the same space.

>>15418218
just filter him

Unironically where can I go to discuss advanced propulsion with people who aren't literallly retarded? I'm so sick of "dude project Orion, dude NSWR, dude shitty solid core nuclear thermal concept unchanged from the '90s", repeated ad nauseam. I didn't entirely agree with the z-pitch guy or the mag sail guy but they're like geniuses in comparison to these people, fuck

>>15418357
try reddit

Can Orion be flown on any other rocket? Would NASA and Congress even allow it?

>>15418357
>Unironically
I have some suggestions but I'm afraid you are too retarded for them.

>>15418357
Get some actual friends? :^)

>>15418352
You're fucking retarded. Detonating sub-kiloton bombs in orbit isn't going to register at all on earth.

>>15418333
Kinda cool. Do they do this there so they dont need to close the roads?

>>15418367
Yes but also because they want the orbital pad open for work, along with more testing pads for faster development cycle.

>>15418361
I will unironically fucking murder you, in real life

>>15418366
your ideas don't exist in a vacuum

>>15418357
Sure, orion and NTRS are all BS. All the NTR results are all fake, and you've outsmarted some of the brightest minds of the 20th century.

>>15418282
Just two more weeks

AXION-CATALYZED DETONATION ENGINE

>>15418370
The double monk strap oxfords are kino but my man needs a new pair of trousers that actually fit

>>15418374
>All the NTR results are all fake
What nuclear thermal results?
>muh 900 Isp
Okay space elevator fag, good talk. Once that is completed, I can't wait until I hop into my nuclear salt water rocket and go zoomin' around the solar system

>>15417941
Induced visions

>5'10 245lbs mountain of a man
Oh great the tranny collagefag is back and having another melty

i do not care for the opinions of pit prisoners

>>15418357
>I didn't entirely agree with the z-pitch guy or the mag sail guy but they're like geniuses in comparison to these people, fuck
We're still around, we just don't constantly refight spacecraft propulsion console wars in the absence of new data. SpaceX working on lower launch costs, and Starship in particular, are the focus for now because flying test vehicles is still the bottleneck once you've proven a technique in a vacuum chamber on the ground.

Any form of non chemical propulsion is faggotry by default until proven otherwise.
Too many low T cucks advocating it purely because they're scared of burning some fuel.

>>15418372
KEK! A 300kg rapid-detonation is only going to be at most 2 orders of magnitude more power than a conventional rocket engine, and don't produce enough radiation for em pulse. Fusion stages allow for arbitrarily small bombs. http://large.stanford.edu/courses/2013/ph241/micks1/docs/aiaa-2000-3856.pdf

>>15418243
>tablespoons
>cups
kill yourself

What did they need such big fairings for?

>>15418405
Spysats.

>tfw you realize the schizo has posted 100+ times in this thread
What can we do?

>>15418400
are you autistic? flying the equivalent of several slbm subs in orbit without global coordination would never happen. you say this in a week where russian partisans flew a los firework over the kremlin and now its americas fault.
for clarification, stop being autistic.

>>15418383
Isp talks faggot. It's the reason why it was considered the only feasible engine for a mars mission. In any case, what better technologies do u even have?

>>15418417
lmfao

>>15418417
>it was considered the only feasible engine for a mars mission.
by the same people who designed Space Shuttle

>>15418414
Kek, the total mars orion yield is only 80 kilotons that's more than 300x less than ur average icbm.

>>15418424
keep us posted

>>15418423
No.

>>15418417
>It was real in my mind
Faggot doesn't know about Faget's chemical Mars mission proposal, and many others

>>15418429
Oh the ferry rocket runs on nuclear cope now?

>>15418431
What's that suppose to mean?

>>15418301
I can guarantee most normies think falcon 9 has only launched a couple dozen times and barely has reused any of them.
Would be really interesting to see the average number of launches a normy thinks if a poll was done

has anyone yet described the internet becoming unusable due to boomers/zoomers/schizos etc
is this dead internet theory?

>>15418398
The mere concept of combustion power is offensive to the söycuck.
It aesthetically displeases him.
He tries to make up all sorts of dummy arguments in favour of non chemical when his whole position could just be summarised by infertility via faux milk products.

>>15418436
Its a problem but i would be more worried about the ai flood
If you've looked at a youtube comment section recently the comment stealers are everywhere

>>15418306
Tidal heating

>>15418436
God i fucking hate these internet schizos
Wish asylums still existed

OMG guys did you see the Dragon X launch today? It was so epic!

>>15418429
>Stuhlinger presented a paper in Austria in 1954 describing a solar-powered electric-propulsion spacecraft with dish-shaped solar concentrators.16 Walt Disney had contacted von Braun after reading the Collier’s articles; this contact led to three space flight television programs from 1955 to 1957. Disney’s Mars and Beyond, which premiered on 4 December 1957, featured Stuhlinger’s distinctive umbrella-shaped nuclear-electric Mars ships, not von Braun’s sphere and-girder chemical ships.1

You were saying? Learn your history, von Braun tranny

>>15418424
Woops. That number is actually 30kt. The whole craft is only 300t in LEO.

>>15418440
idk what that means but if its only going to get worse i might just go join the local rocket club.

>>15418449
Huh? The guy did some disney shows... and? Didn't prevent him from designing the saturnV

>>15418328
Hydrogen requires such powerful magnets for NEP that you lose all the Isp benefits in reduced mass fraction. This is related to why powersails or beamed laser-thermal/laser-electric are so attractive for missions in the Mars-to-Saturn range, any chance to drop the mass of reactor, power cycle, radiators, and shielding is extremely effective for unmanned missions where Mpayload << Mreactor.

>>15418449
Stuhlingers ion umbrella would have taken so long to spiral out from LEO that even if you count all the tanker flights to fill up a depot as part of the mission clock, Starship is still faster. Impulsive thrust cuts your required dV in half for operation inside planetary gravity and so should be preferred in nearly all cases.

>>15418455
>local rocket club
Name a bigger cuck group
Imagine settling for shitty bottle rockets and never attempting for a space shot

>>15418462
the internet has become tiring. this was at one point a couple of years ago the comfiest place to post on a 4chan that had already gone to shit and now every thread its 300 posts of that same shit before we're left alone.
idk m8 im just really over digital communications in a world that is now shaped by them.

>>15418469
It's because of assholes who kept advertising /sfg/ on other boards. We warned them this was going to happen and it did.

>>15418471
>assholes
It was literally just the collagefag

>>15418469
Yeah i feel ya. Shits fucked. Not much to do about it besides joining a more heavily moderated forum/discord

I'm joining a heavily moderated discord and by the way I'm trans if that matters

>>15418491
The schizo fears the discord mod

>>15418491
you forgot to reply to the post youre trying to samefag

>>15418457
Sure but most modern proposals utilizing electric propulsion would do refueling and crew loading just before Earth escape so the time spent spiraling out shouldn't really count. You would still probably need powersails for high enough alpha to get there <90 days but it's conceivable there is a 'faster than Starship' Mars niche. To me laser thermal makes the most sense as the burn times are short and the stage can return shortly after the departure burn, you could reuse it dozens of times within the same window.

>>15418491
Have we heard news yet?
Too lazy to check on tw*tter

>>15418491
the same boring shit over and over

>>15418500
I guess there's only one thing left to do then isn't there?
Life will repeat so exactly until you make it stop

>>15418504
baste

>>15418316
>College, not collage.
Do I even have to say how that typo happened?

New SHLV list, from Wikipedia

what was announced monday?

https://www.space.com/europe-no-reusable-rocket-until-2030s

Europoor bros? Did the french already surrender before even starting? Who thought putting french at the front of space things was a good idea?

>>15418527
SLS block 1 and under should not be considered super heavy.

>>15418535
>Who thought putting french at the front of space things was a good idea?
no one put them there, France was the only European country that did it

I hate launch vehicle capacity are often rated with Kg, Lbs, and tonnage and the 3 are often use interchangeably. Pick one goddamit

NASA wants a solar powered Titan orbiter as a New Frontiers Priority Mission

>>15418546
Yeah, pick short tons.
Fuck SI.

>>15418548
Two billion dollars?

Triton is the coolest one there.
Flybys are gay. Landers, rover, or fuck off.

>>15418539
Well as europoor I want the 5 billion € wasted in the development of the Ariane 6 back. Just be USAs bitch and beg them for astronaut seats as always.

>>15418548

>>15417710
Is it that expensive to just keep comunicating to a probe that already launched?

>>15418564

>>15418564
Venus Flagship and Mercury lander could be cool.
Venus would be tough, the price tag backs that up.

>>15418549
whats wrong with SI

>>15418572
Well, for one, ten is inferior to 12; not enough divisors.
But more importantly, the thing that everyone praises it for makes it unusable. Going up the same amount every time is unpractical.
See, we go from inches -> feet -> yard. Going from cm to m is terrible. The units are never "right," it's always too much or too little. Customary units have a long tradition going back before the written word, and in the millenia of use it's been tempered to perfectly fit the human condition. You only create a new category when it's necessary.

>>15418584
This is similar to why F is better than C. i care more about air temperature, it's more granular.

>>15418584
>Going from cm to m is terrible.
then just use dm you retard

>>15417710
>puts more billions into SLS instead of giving a bit of funding to a mission that already launched and is successful. Picrel is taken by NH I believe

>>15417860
we should unironically be having more conversations about these giant contellations. I for one don't consent to having these shits destorying the night sky

People believe they can terraform Mars. Meanwhile the absolute state of urban planning on Earth.

Upcoming Planetary Events and Missions
https://nssdc.gsfc.nasa.gov/planetary/upcoming.html

>>15418604
Imagine the outer Solar System missions we could have got if there where Saturn Vs available to launch probes.
I'm crossing my finger the Uranus probe get's to be launched on Starship, fuck decade long gravity assists.

>>15418548
>Titan orbiter
What a bunch of cucks, just send something to the fucking lakes already
>Sea probe descoped
lmao, muh budget cuts, the same fucking excuse the last 50 years.

>>15418527
>SLS BLOCK 2
the least likely to ever exist of that entire line-up

isn't the viability of doing outer solar system missions on SS still in question due to the lower dV?

>>15418527
I like the curvy and smooth look of SLS compared to Saturn. The color palette is also much more soothing to the eye

>>15418614
>Imagine the outer Solar System missions we could have got if there where Saturn Vs available to launch probes.
Imagine having Starships refueled in orbit.

>>15418618
youre delusional

>>15418617
One of the excuses for Dragonfly not going to the lakes is that communication would not be possible at that angle, so a relay sat would be amazing.

Who could likely build the 3rd American super heavy lift vehicle? Relativity strapping boosters to the side of a Terran R for a gargantuan Falcon Heavy? Blue Origin strapping boosters to a New Glenn?

>>15418628
what has one thing to do with the other?

>>15418625
Wonder what saturn v looks like without paint

>>15418619
It gives you the mass budget to add propellant to the spacecraft it'll carry, any two stage rocket would be unimpressive by itself when it comes to dV.

>>15418636
Starship refueled in orbit has more dV for a standard sized probe than an S-IVB. Then all you need is a small kickstage and a high apogee transfer orbit and you can reuse the Starship.

>>15418631
Dragonfly as fast as it is would take a very long time to go from the landing site to the poles. And Selk crater is unironically interesting. Titan is full of alien surprises

>>15418645
Is there a point in reusing it? I think the extra price would be worth it to cut down travel time as much as possible, and you could use a modified flight proven Starship for this anyway.

>>15418646
Can't the orbit be adjusted so it lands closer to the poles?

>>15418633
Likely a company that doesn't yet exist. Starship is going to lay waste to the launch market.

This lawsuit could be the end of space-x

>>15418527
if we're including vaporware like LM9 you may as well throw in the sea dragon.

>>15418654
it definitely can, but I read a pdf about the landing site selection, probably this

>There are geometric constraints associated with any specific mission opportunity, specifically landing date. Landing during polar winter places severe restriction on science operations that might require illumination (notably, mobility) (Barnes et al. 2020), and prevents direct-to-Earth communication and so would require a much more expensive architecture with a relay spacecraft. In the context of the New Frontiers 4 competition, which specified launch in 2025 (and thus, in practical terms, arrival in the mid-2030s during northern winter) this precluded exploration of Titan's northern seas as in the proposed Titan Mare Explorer (TiME) mission (Stofan et al. 2013).
https://iopscience.iop.org/article/10.3847/PSJ/abd08f

>>15418548
>soilar orbiter
>on fucking titan
i hope this shit dies. they are doing titan so wrong, first with dragonfly not even going to the fucking lakes and now disgracing it with solar.

>>15418656
i want to see that stage 0 crater happen on BOs 'factory'

>>15418667
Well, at least they won't have to go through the pain of getting the plutonium for the generator.
>>15418666
Like I said before, we really, REALLY need Starship to be ready for outer solar system missions. Just think of how many restraints would be taken away for the mission ambitions.

>>15418662
Starship is basically the Sea Dragon ideal of big cheap steel boosters built outdoors but adapting the lessons of the Saturn, Shuttle, and Falcon programs.

>>15418405
He’s a big fairing

>>15418548
Lmao these are all meme missions. Only the Neptune/Triton one seems reasonable, despite the inevitable cost overruns it would have, because it wouldn't cuck us out of a Neptune flagship that the powers that be don't really seem to want. I laughed at Ceres sample return and Centaur lander. Calypso would be neat but would cuck us out of the Uranus flagship. Inceladus simply doesn't warrant its own mission.

>>15418692
>inevitable cost overruns
The fact that this phrase even exists is testament to the power of setting the right target.
If they said to plan for a budget of 100 million there would never be billion dollar missions.

>>15418674
>we really, REALLY need Starship to be ready for outer solar system missions
Are you retarded? Starship is a LEO reusable stage. It can't possibly be good or efficient at every mission.

>>15418405
Multiple upper stages, gotta keep shit from prying eyes too.

>>15418674
>we really, REALLY need Starship to be ready for outer solar system missions
One vehicle designed to do everything, but not do one thing very well, was the main problem with Shittle. Once the USAF said they wanted to kidnap satellites with a cross-range single-orbit flight, it was doomed.
Starship will be built in the thousands, and they have already come up with different variants based on the mission.

>>15418736
My whole point here is that we need a cheap and plentiful super heavy rocket available for probes.
Some anons argue that this would be the only good use for SLS, but of course they will all be used for moon missions anyway.

>>15418739
Great, but how any of this goes against to what I said?

Yes Lord, today I will remind them
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NASA_Deep_Space_Network
>Currently, the DSN can receive up to 4 spacecraft signals at the same time, or MSPA-4. However, apertures cannot currently be shared for uplink. When two or more high-power carriers are used simultaneously, very high order intermodulation products fall in the receiver bands, causing interference to the much (25 orders of magnitude) weaker received signals. Therefore, only one spacecraft at a time can get an uplink, though up to 4 can be received.
>The older 70 m antennas are reaching the end of their lives. At some point these will need to be replaced. Replacing major components can cause problems as it can leave an antenna out of service for months at a time.

>>15418750
It only gets more depressing
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mars_Telecommunications_Orbiter
>The Mars Telecommunications Orbiter (MTO) was a cancelled Mars mission that was originally intended to launch in 2009 and would have established an Interplanetary Internet between Earth and Mars. The spacecraft would have arrived in a high orbit above Mars in 2010 and relayed data packets to Earth from a variety of Mars landers, rovers and orbiters for as long as ten years, at an extremely high data rate. Such a dedicated communications satellite was thought to be necessary due to the vast quantity of scientific information to be sent to Earth by landers such as the Mars Science Laboratory.
>was a cancelled mars mission

>>15418756
thanks, Obama

>>15418674
Kilopower

>>15418756
we perhaps need a new Mars orbiter than can also be used for comms

How the fuck did the ViaSat-3 fairings survive a reentry at half of orbital velocity?

>>15418770
deceleration at 10g

>>15418548
>primary power
>next Gen
What did they mean by this?

>>15418776
Some unready meme form of nuclear probably

>>15418776
>>15418767

>>15418762
You are welcome, anon. The plan to dissolve NASA is still under way.

>>15418741
>SLS
Is another LEO rocket, being shuttle 2.0.
Huge-ass single core stage is good for nothing but LEO. See how it can't put a LM +CM combo in lunar orbit as Saturn V did

>>15418782
SLS is unironically not for LEO. 2 stages or even 1.5 stage is optimal for leo

>>15418784
Falcon 9 is three stages

>>15418756
musk could have financed something like this instead of buying twitter

>>15418778
N-nuclear... I-I don't like the sound of that. That would mean using uranium or that dirty plutonium I've heard about. We've polluted the earth enough we shouldn't be taking anything even slightly nuclear near any other planet. If we can't build a safe and clean solar submarine for titan then we don't need to build one at all

>>15418791
This unironically

>>15418782
Why the hell are you sperging about LEO? Both Starship and SLS are clearly capable of going beyond. SLS could deliver Europa Clipper in just 3 years.
The shuttle was stuck to low earth orbit.

>>15418793
>SLS could deliver Europa Clipper in just 3 years
not sure about that

>>15418794
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Europa_Clipper#Launch_and_trajectory
>The SLS option would have entailed a direct trajectory to Jupiter taking less than three years.
Though that time savings would've been lost to probe redesigns and SLS delays

>>15418794
That was the plan before they switched to FH because they were unsure if the SLS's vibration would damage the probe and because was definitely not going to be available for that due to Artemis missions.

DREAM ON MARS MAN

>>15418793
>Both Starship and SLS are clearly capable of going beyond.
Why would you waste an SLS for something that can be done cheaper with an Ariane 5 or a delta-IV?
Starship can go beyond for small payloads, but that is absurd. What you do is use its large payload bay in LEO to put in orbit a proper expendable ejection stage, or a module of a multi-launch orbital assembly.

>>15418653
>Is there a point in reusing it?
You save like 20 million dollars.

>>15418817
And still lose 230 million dollars. 250 - 20 = Elon is running out of money.

>>15418822
wat

>>15418794
Would starship allow it?

>>15418817
My whole point there is about cutting down travel time to the gas and ice giants. Not having to wait more years for the probe to arrive might be worth the extra money.

For the sake of science missions, I really hope "big probe=cheap parts" isn't a meme

>>15418815
What are you talking about?
How is launching on an Ariane 5 or Delta IV better? They would reduce the speed the craft could achieve, this is why the decade long gravity assists are used now.

>>15418449
Were they seriously going to an attempt a re-entry as a direct return from Mars? Holy shit

>>15418750
A private and possibly even orbital DSN is still my number one top "everyone would pay for this" startup business case

>>15418836
>re-entry as a direct return from Mars
Who needs lithobraking when you can just slam into atmosphere like a concrete wall?
What would the re-entry velocity even be?

>>15418847
Huh, now that I look into it there's a claim that an appropriately designed return will peak at 12km/s, not much more than a lunar free return

>>15418824
https://soundcloud.com/user-556604054/ula-seminar

DARPA and NASA are testing NTP in orbit in 2027 through the DRACO mission. If successful, when could we see shit like pic related? The graphic says 2033 but no way we get something like that built in 10 years

>>15418858
They're going to have to drive the crawler across a picket line of expendable hippies to launch fissile material of any appreciable mass into space

>>15418776
See pic
>>15418667
Cope & seethe

>>15418854
SpaceX is done, gone, over

>>15418852
Nice.
In theory any planet-to-planet transfer could be done at exactly the target planet's orbital velocity but it won't be the cheapest trajectory, nor even practical for any real mission.

Why can't space be simple like ksp

>>15418862
Good. Fuck hippies.

the falcon program and it's consequences have been a boon for the space race

>>15418872
Why you be snowcloning uncle Ted like that
Are you incapable of original creative thought

>>15418858
It's no earlier than 2039 for a opposition transfer 'short stay' Mars NTP vehicle, one of many reasons it's stupid and a borderline fraudulent because they're still spreading false claims like "chemical can only do Mars in six months" and "opposition transfers expose the crew to less radiation", despite some papers showing the inverse. The only difference between that and a conjunction transfer vehicle is that they would need fewer tanks so I'm not going to entertain the idea that it would be developed much faster.

Anyway, a reasonable person would add at least five years to that date so mid 2040s.

>>15418877

Someone post cute girl rockets

>>15418880
Communicating purely in meme templates is not mandatory nor encoraged.
It's what NPCs seeking peer acceptance do.

>>15418858
BTW this their recent work on the subject. They're considering chemical, NTP, chem/NEP, and a gimped chem/SEP hybrid and pretending that Starship doesn't blow the rest out of the water even for opposition transfers.

https://www.nasa.gov/MoonToMarsArchitecture

does starship have tig or mig welds to join things together

>>15417754
How the fuck are the Chinese gonna develop metallurgy advanced enough to make powerful AND reusable engines? I would love to them do it, but it ain't happening anytime soon.

>>15418243
>Not posting the SpaceX approved goulash recipe

>>15418886
nig welds
and spic welds

>>15418887
They'll steal it

>>15418887
>How the fuck are the Chinese gonna develop metallurgy advanced enough to make powerful AND reusable engines

They don't need to do shit, the west lets hordes of chink spies into their institutions and companies. Inb4 muh itar, for those positions they just use young """naturalized citizens""" for the selected nations.