/sci/ - Science & Math

>>15402938
I just Sneezed really badly

https://arstechnica.com/science/2023/04/europes-major-new-interplanetary-spacecraft-has-a-slight-problem/

>>15402940
bless you

https://arstechnica.com/science/2023/04/rocket-report-feds-assess-starship-fallout-sweden-accidentally-bombs-norway/

summary of some events/news that have happened recently if you have missed them

>>15402941
the absolute state of probes

>>15402947
>That time the swedes bombed our country
What a story I cant wait to gaslight my kids with
>>15402946
Thank you, thank you

>>15402938
>>15402941
enough of these one off trillion dollar probes. we need to build infrastructure...a network of satellites, ground stations, and other things necessary for continuous monitoring of the solar system.

>>15402941
Why don't they just have some of the crew go out and get it free? Euros are so lazy.

>>15402941
They should have sent a poet

>>15402954
Why though? It's just rocks out there. I don't get this "scientific research" meme.

>>15402916
Hurricanes raping the place is a feature. It's a big reason why the village was so underdeveloped when Musk started building in Boca Chica.

>>15402957
maybe its not just rocks though?
lakes of free methane

i want to fuck a rocket (girl) so insanely bad bros

>>15402975
coward. A real rocket enthusiast would just want to fuck actual rockets.

>>15402978
im a phony

>>15402941
>Galileo antenna fails to deploy
>Lucy solar panel fails to deploy
>JUICE antenna fails to deploy
RREEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE

>>15402983
this is what mass/volume autism gets you

>>15402978
The phallic analogies with rockets go very deep. Including expending most of your load for a small fraction to do something useful.

>>15402990
penetrating space, inseminating little SPERMS

>>15402978

Make sure to pre-order Loren's new book https://www.amazon.com/Six-Untold-Story-Americas-Astronauts/dp/1982172800
>The Six: The Untold Story of America's First Women Astronauts
>In The Six, acclaimed journalist Loren Grush shows these brilliant and courageous women enduring claustrophobic—and sometimes deeply sexist—media attention, undergoing rigorous survival training, and preparing for years to take multi-million-dollar payloads into orbit. Together, the Six helped build the tools that made the space program run.
Epic

>>15403009
I couldn't even get through her first book, filtered by how painful it was to read. (Loren is one bitter bitch). I can't imagine reading this one.

reminder that black arrow and all its engines were just sitting in australia and we could have cloned it at any time

>>15403014
I dont understand why she is a space journo. She seems to truly hate space

>>15402975
this but a rocket (girl(futa))

>>15403009
>muh sexism
lmao even

I used to think the Space Shuttle was really cool
Now I realize how much of a disaster it was

"If you can get to Jupiter, you can do anything"

Vincent Poinsignon, JUICE Project Manager

>>15403044
is juice still ded?

>>15403016
Black Arrow is so based. RP-1/HTP is like the most easily accessible liquid propellant for amateur rocketry. Any retard could build one in their backyard.

>>15403051
we could have gotten all the injector plates
getting the htp is a bit of a bitch though

>>15403051
mmm love those breathing holes for the astronauts inside

>>15403051
There are so many Sydneysiders on 4chan what the fuck

>>15403044
>he said to himself out loud

why don't we use a slingshot to propel satellites so they have a cheaper rocket behind them? it's an extremely smooth and safe concept to the projectile (compared to a gun) and it would be able to use passive and cheap energy to slowly "charge" it.

it only needs the right materials (if they exist).

>>15403092
can even do humans

>>15403093
it only works with spherical humans in vacuum

>>15403093
>>15403097
I have a solution.

>>15403111
based & redpilled. but it lacks the rocket.
maybe the ball could have it in if big.

>>15403111
We already have that

>>15402978
He means he doesn't want to fuck a male rocket. Solid fuel is male, liquid is female.

>>15403009
Loren Gash has massive EDS
she showed this a long time ago, ignore her

when is Musk doing that qna on Twitter

>>15403043
that is the journey of discovery every space enthusiast has to make, though some autists can't get over it and keep seething and coping even now

>>15403150
probably flaked on that, he tends to do that sometimes

>>15403147
It's worse than that, she copes with how she was sidelined and fucked over at NASA by claiming (partially correctly) responsibility for Musk's success. I believe she forced through the commercial crew program which was really tough to get going due to very dominant elements at NASA. So she dislikes him but also relies on his success for her ego.

>>15403162
some of that might be inaccurate, it's been a while since I read about it.

>>15403164
I hate this pinyata abomination like you wouldn't believe

>>15403164
Hate these cunts like nothing else

picture taken moments before disaster

now that the dust has settled what happened to the cubesats SLS was carrying?

>>15403162
are you sure you aren't confusing Loren Grush with someone else? I'm pretty sure she is a journalist and has always been a journalist

perhaps confusing Loren Grush with Lori Garver, former Nasa deputy administrator that helped get the Commercial Crew Program through
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lori_Garver

Lori has also written a book
https://www.amazon.com/Escaping-Gravity-Quest-Transform-Launch/dp/1635767709

Similar names, both redheads, both written or writing books
one is a young (33) journalist and other a older (61) bureucrat

>>15403218
yeah, oops. Don't even know how Grush is. I've only read Garver's book.

8 month old article from Loren Grush, not going to bother watching it myself but I remember it being a kind of slanted article and she had a pissy attitude

https://www.theverge.com/23345120/rocketland-spacex-elon-musk-rocket-ranch-boca-chica-texas

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V9yAOKLxzko

>>15403162
You're confusing Loren Grush and Lori Garver. Garver supports SpaceX and their way. Grush is the typical left leaning "journalist"

>>15403227
>ywn visit the rocket theme park Rocketland
What would the attractions be?

>>15403225
there is also a third redhead woman that was one type of administrator at NASA, Kathy Lueders, that was the one that was basically driven off after pushing through Starship for HLS (at least she had a hand in it)

https://twitter.com/KathyLueders/status/1651670561959862274

I'm pretty sure Lori Garver is still working at Nasa, I think she even attended the Space Symposium
oh yeah she did, not a redhead here anymore though, pretty gray hair
she is sitting in the middle
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OsS6VDEZoPY

>>15403009
isnt she the same person who was crying that the russian space program was too white and too male

Why are women naturally good at being mid-high administers for space programs

>>15403227
>she had a pissy attitude
That's literally every woman under 40.

>>15403208
from this video you can clearly see the finite speed of light

>>15403240
There are both good women and men at being mid-high adminsters for space programs or otherwise.

>>15403271
Let me rephrase that, capabilities for being a good adminstrator exists in in both sexes.

>>15402772
>So why would this affect Congressional SRB mandates?
The contract for replacing Minuteman runs up to 2075 and it will probably be many years after that until Sentinel needs to be replaced. What politician can think that far in advance?

>>15402967
>free
>literally on a different celestial object
All diamonds already on earth are free too fa.m Why don't you just collect them and get rich?

>>15403243
only under 40?

>>15403184
Didn't most of the interesting ones die because they couldn't recharge them while SLS was sitting around on the pad?

>DeepFloyd IF
So stupid. Especially since the success rate is less than 1% on the most simplest text.

>>15402941
It's an european spaceflight kind of feel.
Someone just end this crippled old man already.

>>15402967
They don't want you to know this, but the methane on Titan is free. You can just take it.
I already have 358 methane at my house.

I hate (earther) women. I want a (martian) woman.

>>15403441
Ok John carter

>>15403441
This is what the Mariner mission took from you

>>15403451
>mulatto woman
Gross

>>15403441
EARTH GIRLS,
ARE EASY.
WHAT YOU GONNA DO?
LITTLE BUCKAROO!!
HEY YOU, BETTER ASK HER OUT!

>>15403451
>small areola
thats a tranny

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9cT73O9zLko

>>15403466
Anon why do you have such horrible tastes?

>>15403092
This is exactly what SpinLaunch is anon

>>15403478
Meant for >>15403451

I would unironically forgive all of pockocmoc’s woes if they started treating venus the same way JPL treats Mars.

>>15403497
extreme wishful thinking, they haven't given a shit about science for decades

the space economy needs to grow faster

>>15403497
Venus is a shithole cope planet
>can't probe mars, let's probe venus instead
>can't build colonies on mars, let's float in the atmosphere of venus instead
>can't terraform mars, let's terraform venus instead

>>15403508
That’s why Venus is the perfect target. Landing on the surface isn’t that difficult, and your shit only has to last a few hours. Hell, the “D” in Venera-D stands for “dolgozhivushaya,” or “long-lasting” AKA 3 hours lol. If you try to send a lander and it breaks you can just say oh venus is hard

>>15403513
the redpill is that both Venus and Mars suck immensely just in different ways

Last night I was trying to find this elusive photo of the upper atmosphere of venus that is supposedly from the mariner program. I remember coming across this photo last year and being blown away but I didn’t save it. I’ll try to find it again today

>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=94TCN4F3j-I

>>15403497
Has Russia actually launched a successful planetary mission, since they became Russia again? I can't think of one. Phobos Grunt shat the bed, Mars 96 dead. All the Lunar missions got kicked down the road.

>>15402941
>>15402947
>endless problems, blunders and delays
The NPCs remain unfazed, in their minds the earth is still a globe hurdling through outer space and these are just minor setbacks.
These golems actually believe they will jet through the solar system one day.

>>15403520
You mean this one? It's fake, it's been (((processed)))

>>15403537
Exomars trace gas orbiter made it to Mars successfully and is still operational. The attached ESA lander failed.
Although the Breeze-M upper stage fucking exploded right after separation and almost took the mission out lol

>>15403541
Nah it was a photo VERY close to the upper atmosphere. I’ll find it later

>>15403549
Would it be from this page?
https://history.nasa.gov/SP-424/ch6.htm

>>15403545
TGO is mostly ESA though, I didn't know it had a couple of Russian instruments. The lander did too.

>>15403555
No but this is awesome! I found the photo on either donald e davis’ website or don p mitchell’s website. Now that I think about it I remember posting it to /sfg/ a couple of months (?) ago and having an interesting conversation with other anons about raw data processing

>>15403561
What really? I thought the orbiter was russian
And I still count it as a successful russian mission as it actually made it to its destination. A rare feat

>>15402941
itsover

>>15403562
It’s somewhere in this website. This is an autist’s haven
mentallandscape.com/V_Cameras.htm

>>15402941
c'est fini, mes amis

>>15402941
Use RCS to spin the spacecraft up and then fire the thrusters the other way to abruptly stop it. The most kerbal fix is likely the easiest to attempt

>>15402941
At least they have engineering cameras to help them figure out what is and isn't happening.

>>15402978
yes

>>15403610

>>15403513
Venus is based and way cooler than mars. Mars is just some boring sandy rocks. No thanks, I’ve been to Utah, shits lame as hell. Venus has cool volcanos and acid clouds and shit.

>>15403612
>way cooler than mars
Objectively wrong.

>>15403610

>>15403479
HOLY SHIT I'M A GENIOUS

>>15403610
AAAAAAEEEEEEEIIIII

>>15402941
Once Starship starts flying, we can do away with these bullshit mass perfect science missions to the outer solar systems, and can add in some much needed buffer into the vessel for obvious failure modes that don't require the complexity of the Sistine Chapel paintings to fix.

Encountering a failure mode with 8 years of cruise time to go before you get to the target destination doesn't bode well for the rest of the spacecraft.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oO8w6XcXJUs

Didn't watch it yet, but based on the discussion in the previous threads its going to be mostly about twitter + the same old run of the mill answer about expanding the breadth and depth of human consciousness as a motivation for Mars exploration
I guess that makes sens if you assume this is mostly for a "new" audience that hasn't seen Musks interviews before

>>15403655
Nothing said here hasn't been said before, but the purpose is to get the message out more mainstream and to his credit, I think he did a better job of articulating the notion of "woke mind virus" than some insipid euphemism or non-answer that often prevails in social media. Specifically, in his anecdote of the conversation a friend of his and said friend's daughter had about education and the minimization of history and revisionism of it to satisfy DEI philosophies. Most people know who George Washington is, what he did, what was common during the times, and what impact he had on American society. But schools, it seem, have opted to focus only on his negative while letting the breadth of useful historical context to the wayside in order to paint one of the foundational blocks of the nation in a negative light. That, seemed to be the intent of the interview. The other anecdote that I think will resonate well with the broader public was, paraphrased: "its insane that some kid in the Philippines was given the power by a corporation to censor nobel prize winning scientists over topics they had no purview over, because the speech made by such a person ran counter to the narrative established by former leadership and political interests."

That, essentially, the "woke mind virus" is this thing where society is no longer allowed to question the premises posited by varied interests at their fundamental elements, and that doing so, is instead some offense to the DEI movement and/or is offensive to some party who needs to be sheltered out of fear of oppression.

>>15403651
I hope so but I worry it wont solve the issue
>option a
>build a large probe with no folded antenas and minimal folded solar panels and no mass restriction
>fits in starship and can go up for $20 million
>option b
>origami and mass autism your way into a probe that fits into starship with enough room for several rideshares
>goes up for $5 million
>companies choose this option despite the folding probe being $15 million more expensive and more error prone

>>15403667
but do they? what if you flat pack a number of probes like that
at least with low cost you could spam them and iterate to a working folding mechanism (which might be more massive for instance but way more reliable)
this massive effort and money that is expended on these probes to get them perfect and still not getting them perfect is just retarded
they should spam them and iterate

>>15403667
Well, the thing is that as the cost of access to space decreases, both to LEO and extra-Terra/Luna gravitational sphere of influence, there is a greater investment thesis for corporations to begin engaging as data brokers for scientific research which can then be socialized similar to monthly or annual subscription costs the way APIs or Enterprise SDKs are. This means in the near future, its possible for some startup to supplement what ESA or NASA does by building a better probe than either can due to access to a rate of innovation, engineering talent, capital, and modern and vertically integrated supply chains that lets them build a similar probe to what either can in half the time or 1/4th the time and 1/2 or 1/4th the cost. Then use the remainder equivalent to launch it out to deep space and start collecting data. Then setup a subscription service to drive reoccurring revenue streams that provides access to any institution, university, or even amateur astronomer or physicist or mathematician or other who is interested in sampling and analysis.

This will either force, then, NASA/ESA/JAXA equivalents to innovate and match pace, or be driven out of the market and become only subscribers to the data, as corporations will seed, spring, bloom, and die; cyclically, at a race faster than the time it takes for either entity, otherwise, to build a single probe, get it on pad, and launch it to its destination--LET ALONE REACH IT AND CONDUCT USEFUL RESEARCH.

Starship and other fully reusable or even partially reusable rocket systems in the coming decade is going to drive a step change in how we conduct space flight, space research, and so on. You're worried that the issue won't be solved, and I'll just go ahead and say that the market once it understands how to monetize the value of something, is scary good at optimizing that in a useful way to society (barring any corrupted interests forming stranglehold monopolies--but we have laws for that).

>>15403545
>Although the Breeze-M upper stage fucking exploded right after separation and almost took the mission out lol
haven't heard this before, lmao

>>15403667
Option c
Just build probes in a massive space station launched by starship and test stuff in space before you send it off.

>>15403684
nonsensical in the short to medium term. stop with the scifi shit.

>>15403666
thanks, Satan

>>15403684

>>15403666

>>15403688
No he's right, heft up components and assemble probes piecemeal in an orbital clean room. A tug can haul probes out to a safe distance before they burn for their targets.

>>15403707
Alternatively, in the coming decades, I think a lot of science probes will be shifted off world to Moon and Mars. The materials needed for assembly will either be shipped there entirely for assembly and launch OR be shifted partially with ISRU facilitating the rest for assembly and launch. Moon has 16.6% Earth's gravity. Mars has 38% of Earth's gravity. By and large, that's dV saved by 60-75% depending on where launched from. The energetics benefit that has is monumental. I would completely discount assembly in low earth orbit for probes to the rest of Sol honestly. Getting out of Earth's gravity well from LEO to transit velocity still takes way too much energy with chemical rockets.

Moon is perfect for probes with HydroLox Sunwards and Mars is perfect for probes with HydroLox AND MethaLox or a combination of two to the belt and beyond. Earth over time will just transition to becoming the receiving station for much of the data collected and triangulated towards by a variety of deep space relay stations.

>>15403717
Probe standardization would go far in allowing a variety of orbital or lunar production. You need base probe cores, power generation at a series of scales (small medium large), standardized kick stages for probes of a standardized size.
>Inb4 ksp irl
Yes.

Why does axiom keep working with sandnig countries?

>>15403738
The founder of Axiom is a sandnigger.

>deniro mushmind posting it in yet another thread
how many is this in a row?

>>15403738
They have money, ego, and no domestic space industry to speak of. Axiom's ideal customer profile

So is the euro probe still cold welded?
What a joke

NASA is doing Mars colony research in Biosphere 2 again.

https://www.kold.com/2023/04/27/crew-sealed-inside-pressured-habitat-biosphere-2-study-space/

>>15403771
>NASA
Can’t wait to see anything come to fruit in 2060

God I hate Beck and Kemp so much. They have a pissing match on the side when SpaceX gets like 20x their work done

>>15403771
Wouldn't it be more beneficial to gather data from long-term psychological evaluation of Submarine staff? I'm not talking any agenda bullshit, just gather as much data as possible on a long scale from the US Navy (how hard can this be, they are contracted for a minimum period anyways), and distribute it in a neat package for analysis to the eggheads.
Surely NASA could pull enough strings for that, as a government agency.

>>15403802
If you read the article you'd have seen they're focusing on agriculture in simulated Martian soil and upgraded life support systems. Subs aren't useful for those.

>>15403808
Can’t you just put a bunch of shit made on the way there in the soil and grow food? Are they trying to optimize nutrients and growth for this trip or something?

>>15403808
Oh I am very sorry, I mistook it for another failure of an initiative where NASA crammed a bunch of spastics in an aluminum can for a month.
Also I think it's useless because such an innovation would be driven by driving down cost and necessity, not some talent sink cancer of a program, but I could always be wrong and hope to be wrong.
Thanks for taking the time for clarification, will read it and not be a tard.

I’m not reading your shit articles dont link them

>>15403813
Martian regolith is very different from standard soils on Earth.

>>15403808
They could be if we'd built Sealab in 2021.

>Thanks to the many enthusiasts who livestream every minute of SpaceX’s work in South Texas, it’s apparent the company has as many as 10 further Starship prototypes in various stages of assembly, as well as up to seven more Super Heavy boosters.

insane, imagine if that was SLS and Orion/ESM

>>15403827
That sort of pace requires vertical integration and rockets designed to be built quickly.

>>15403827
Wtf would you even do with 10 overpriced single-use space taxis that can barely reach the moon?

>>15403827

>>15403829
Put 22 sets of boots on the moon

>>15403829
Barely reach the moon 10 times?

>>15403829
Get a probe to Titan in six months with a core stage yeet train.

>>15403837
Ok genius tell us how you’re going to slow down once you get there in that weak ass Titan gravity

>>15403839
Lithobrake

If SLS was actually competent, we could've had Europa Clipper at Jupiter years earlier

>>15403845
Surprisingly only 105 mph to get there in 6 months direct?

>>15403857
Sorry I confused my units, thats 170,000 mph. That’s half the speed of light, let me do more calculations

>>15403688
>>15403698
Why is a bad idea? You can't just decide stuff is scifi shit without explaining why.
>>15403707
>A tug can haul probes out to a safe distance
Would you even need to do that? Stuff naturally moves away from each in orbit right?

>>15403862
Happens to the best of us.

>>15403839
aerobraking in Saturn's atmosphere

>>15403862
No it’s not, that’s actually 76,000 m/s which is 1/4th the speed of light. I’m retarded hold on let me lay it out

>>15403870
holy shit anon put the booze down

>>15403855
It would still cost an estimated 1 billion to redesign Europa Clipper for the SLS vibratory environment. If NASA stopped being twats and invested in solar electric power sail chemical hybrids, they could actually reach the outer planets much faster than with SLS or Starship and there would be ample power for science instruments once there.

>>15403883
or just use spicy rogg engines so you're not hideously mass/power constrained

>>15403857
Anon how

>>15403857
In a better solar system. Imagine.

>>15403891
desu this solar system is super based, lucked out big time with all the potentially useful shitheap planets, moons, and floating roggs we have.

>>15403898
>lucked out big time
>the state of Mars
>the absolute state of Venus

>>15403899
This, we got 1/3 the usable worlds we should have.

>>15403864
It's not a bad idea, but just like powerpoint rockets it's not worth discussing seriously because NO HARDWARE, and not even any hint of hardware on the horizon. Might as well discuss garbage like dyson spheres. Right now all that stuff is entirely fantasy especially when put in juxtaposition with stuff that's been done before.
Best we've had in regards to on orbit manufacturing was that one tiny satellite that was supposed to weld some steel together or something. I think it failed as well. Again, at the moment nobody's really trying to do it or has any concrete plans: scifi shit.

>>15403899
Mars could have been a lot worse

>>15403904
it gets worse
>mercury a shit
>no Venus moons
>no substantial Mars moons
>most of the major Jupiter moons irradiated
>Saturn is cool but really far away, Titan and Enceladus are cool but again, far away
>huge fuck off gap of fucking nothing between Saturn and Uranus
>Uranus moons are mid
>Neptune moons are mid except for Triton which is even further away

just ass all around, makes me wonder whats around Proxima Centauri and Alpha Centaurii if its any better

>>15403911
>surrounded by two toxic hellworlds with shitty/no moons
that would have been much worse yeah, its only marginally better now

>>15403845
You might as well just nuke Titan, see picrel
>inb4 my math is absolutely fucked again
>>15403869
Ok retard go burn up Orion in that shit then.
>>15403879
Math attached, correct me if im wrong
>>15403890
Picrel is correct math, that one was wrong

>>15403913
sounds like a challenge, I like it.

>>15403913
Really nice worlds like Earth may be literally one in a million or even more rare than that. I don't think Proxima has anyplace more comfortable than Mars, at best.

>>15403921
I don't hope for comfortable worlds but at least interesting ones, the entire inner solar system having one major moon is really lame

>>15403919
Your estimate of c is off by a factor of 1000. It's about 300,000km/s so 300,000,000m/s. You dumb motherfucker.

ITT:
Fear of fixer-uppers, napkin math, and greener pastures

>>15403919
Also to get from N*s to KE I just used https://www.calculatorsoup.com/calculators/physics/kinetic.php because I CBA to do energy calculations

>>15403791
I don't think its fair to compare Astra and Rocket Lab like they are equivalent. Astra is on the verge of bankruptcy and is about to be delisted from the stock market due to the stock price falling too much and they, 7 out of 9 of their launches have failed (5 if you take Astras word for it), but even ignoring the first 2 suborbital test flights. thats 5/7 failures.

Rocket lab on the other hand has 3 failures out of 35 launches, is fine financially (perhaps not yet profitable) as far as I know and has a satellite bus side-business and trying to start a side business with suborbital electrons as a platform for hypersonic tests. They are also developing a Falcon 9 competitor (a bit different so I wouldn't call it a pure clone). I would say they are the clear number 2 right now, Astra on the other hand is in the same tier as a gorillion other upcoming and failed smallsat launch companies.

>>15403925
I fucking knew it I messed that shit up again. I am so fucked for this physics exam in a few days. Do you bros think I make it if I study 48 hours total of Physics??

>>15403909
>dyson spheres are as speculative as orbital assembly

>>15403817
I will and you can't stop me

>>15403923
I don’t think terrestrial planets are very good at acquiring moons. Then again, all the Kuiper belt dwarves are swimming in giant moons.

>>15403889
You only need a 40×40m power sail for 5 kW at Jupiter, see OKEANOS, and it would still be lighter than a reactor as long as the specific power at Earth was about >500 W/kg. Achievable nuclear thermal barely has more delta-v than chemical, nuclear electric would be a 20 billion dollar boondoggle for little benefit other than that maybe many decades from now they could leverage it for say like a sub that explores the subsurface ocean of Titan after melting through its crust but for probes it's definitely not worth the money.

>>15403675
I for one welcome our future subscription based dystopia. Truthfully I've never thought of this kind of model for space research before but I do think you hit the nail on the head here. Exciting stuff.

>>15403923
The Hill spheres of everything inward of Earth should lead you to expect no moons

>>15403827
I woundn't mind the budget we're giving to SLS if we could actually get 4-6 launches a year out of the damn thing.

>>15403938
It will never happen

>>15403923
Worlds are of no use to me unless I can go outside and grill on them. Any planet that can't yet support outdoor grilling is defective and in need of correction.
As for moons yeah, it'd be cool to have another one or two. Maybe we should move Sedna into LEO so we have something new to look up at.

>>15403951
We need to fix our own moon first by stabilizing the orbit instead of its sligjt outward spiral.

>>15403955
>goodfellas_popsci_mindmush.jpg

>>15403955
The wandering moon

Explain why everyone involved in amatuer rockets are all cucks content with fucking around with toy sugar rockets

>>15403913
>mercury a shit
take that back right now. The solar power on mercury is Godly, It's warm and toasty and the prime destination for chad sun cultists. It has ready made lavatubes with natural radiation shielding and water-ice at the poles, It's even got excellent gravity for its size due to its density. Not only that, but it filters filthy poors due to high Dv requirements to get there (highest in the solar system). best planet by MILES.

Holy fucking based wtf is going on?

>>15403970
aaaand cancelled

>>15403966
What is the dv like to actually get to the sun from mercury? I wouldn't mind having my coffin shot into it
Doesn't mercury have a weird thing where its harder to reach than the sun?

>>15403970
BROS WHAT IS GOING ON RN

>>15403965
Building liquid propellant engines is really hard because there's no ITAR compliant version of Github to share designs so it can only be learned from scratch or by paying people with prior knowledge.

>>15403975
Why not just make a chinese rocket github then

>>15403974
WTF NONONONONONONO

>>15403950
You offer a very compelling counter to his arguments as to why it will happen. But I'm afraid you fall short in every area that matters. I look forward to your revised thesis.

>>15403977
Chinese Internet is retardedly authoritarian because they are Communists. You need permission from the government to host a website.

>>15403983
Russian/swiss/hong kong then

>>15403974
It is OOOVVVVEEERRRR for AA. He is going to have ULA snipers sicced on him

>>15403970
>>15403974
>>15403987
kys underage iToddler

>>15403985
Hong Kong is inside the Chinese system now and Russia is just as bad in their own way, they'll punish you for hosting a website that makes Roscosmos look bad. Switzerland has a demonstrated history of cucking to American law enforcement after Obama threatened to cut them off from SWIFT and destroy their banking system.

>>15403987
>>15403974
>>15403970
No one cares retard
Fuck off with your /pol/ shit

>>15403975
does ITAR go into effect for free projects?

>>15403987
Can you knock it off with this shit anon? It's really gay.

>>15403993
Yes, it covers subject matter, not commercial status.

>>15403997
Huh well thats fucking gay and goes against the first amendment

>>15404001
It does, but the consequences of freely exported military technology are worse considering our defensive strategy relies on a technical edge.

>>15403827
there will never be that many SLSes built

Why didn't NASA ever understand the value of mass production/ease of manufacture despite being a product of post-WW2 America?

>>15404001
Maybe you can sue the government and win on this point if you host files for large ballistic rockets and liquid engines.
iirc there is precedence that the US government cannot censor ITAR file sharing under some very specific interpretation of the first amendment, I'll try to find the exact case.

>>15403974
He really doesn't give off a Jewish vibe. While he's at it he should also debunk the exodus

>>15404008
They never had a stable enough design to mass produce because each crew vehicle was pushing the edge of the technically possible until the shuttle, and then fucking Congress decided not to build any more shuttles after Challenger.

>>15404006
lol you might be right

Reminder that power sails are OP and they would be dirt cheap if produced at scale.

>>15404020
Source:
https://h2061-tlse.sciencesconf.org/data/pages/2.6_Mori_H2061.pdf

>>15404008
the other guy is wrong. It's because after SV, the incentives were to suck taxpayer money and jobs through NASA. Efficiency was the opposite of what they wanted.

https://www.thespacereview.com/article/4572/1

>>15404020
I dont quite remember, did we actually grt to test and confirm they did in fact work in practise?

>A NASA manifest released in March along with its fiscal year 2024 budget request projected Artemis 3 launching in December 2025, giving SpaceX only about two and a half years to get Starship ready to carry astronauts to the lunar surface. That will likely require dozens of test flights to demonstrate the performance of the overall launch system as well as cryogenic refueling of the lunar lander Starship.

They would have to pull off a miracle at this point basically

>>15404038
tell the faa to stop cock blocking then.

>>15404043
its over

>>15404038
They still seem well on track at this point. The big question will be how badly the OLM is damaged. Assuming very little and the water-cooled steel plate works then they should be able to do a series of rapid tests. They have a lot of Starship prototypes lined up and they finally have the ability to start mass producing them. The big worry should if the Elon has made an enemy of the political elites. If so then expect the FAA to drag their feet.

>>15404030
You mean solar sails? They've been demonstrated before, IKAROS is a notable example. Solar power sails are a bit different because it's less about getting pushed around by photons and more about using them to generate stupid amounts of power in a light weight form factor. 1 kW/kg at Earth is achievable and that's fucking wild.

>>15404049
>The big worry should if the Elon has made an enemy of the political elites
I think they still see him as a wildcard so they won't push too far like that, it may even be a strategy of his (6D chess 2deep4u Trump bullshit lol) but meh

>>15404038
It's good, it means there's a lot of pressure at NASA and within congress to move obstacles out of Musk's way, so long as he can believably argue that he can get it done on short notice if SpaceX isn't hampered.

>>15404061
Such a fine line Elon is treading right now

>>15404054
Honestly, I don't think he really is the rebel that he makes himself out to be. He's too successful of a businessman for me to believe that he thinks UBI will be a good idea. "Controlled opposition" or not I respect the stuff he is doing around space too much to care.

Felon Musk is very talented in writing unhinged letters, maybe he'll threaten to fold his legal representatives over his knee like booster 7 if they don't move mountains to clear federal roadblocks.

>>15404052
That sort of Psp plus compact things like ELF thrusters or MET fed on ISRU propellants like CO2 or water would be extremely useful all the way out to the asteroid belt. You'd want fancier electric propulsion for the outer system.

>>15404061
>>15404049
>>15404043
>>15404038

People are not realizing the launch cadence of this system. SS has potential of launching multiple times a day.

>>15404075
If the freaking launch pad can handle it lol, I like how that has become the bottleneck and not the rocket production, only SpaceX lol

>>15404075
This cadence remains aspirational until they get enough data to fix the unavoidable inherent flaws in developmental systems. SpaceX is probably going to be late to their lunar landing demo.

hey guys, quick question, how hard would it be to convert a falcon 9 into an ICBM?

>>15404043
Abolish and imprison the FAA>>15404044

>>15404084
you would just need a way to deploy the warheads, and the bombs themselves. it's already massively overqualified for ICBM work

>>15404038
It will be slip anyway, not because of Starship

>>15404087
ICBMs have settled on solid propellant due to faster, more reliable launch ops. Just stacking an F9 and rolling it out to the pad would take longer than ICBM flight time.

Do you think DOD will share the telemetry data with SpaceX if it re-enters over Kaui

>>15404098
Reusable ICBMs...?

>>15404102
Those are called bombers.

>>15404084
Wrong angle here. He's going to hide a series of satellites around the Earth that can just drop a bunch of missiles from orbit which will unleash massive payloads via a warhead bus that can't all be shot out of the sky before they detonate.

I will never get enough of this aesthetic

>humans should go to venu-

>>15404098
i mean it would just be a bad ICBM
norks use liquid fuel ICBMs. or at least they used to, they might have switched over already

>>15404071
Like that 50,000-s Isp lithium-fueled gridded ion thruster that has been posted here before. IMO power sails remove one of the main obstacles of preventing greater adoption of electric propulsion, which is that high Isp doesn't give you much of an advantage when you can't accelerate fast enough to make it to your destination in a reasonable amount of time because the mass of the power system is so god damn high.

>>15404113
>>15404084
both wrong. Musk has stated multiple times that he fears nuclear war: Starlink serves a secret double purpose, the constellation functions as a 'brilliant pebbles' type ballistic missile interception network which can disable ICBM's in the event of a nuclear war.

>>15404136
SO thats what the lasers on the V2 starlink is for..

>>15404138
>>15404136
Starlink sats don't have enough power anywhere in the system to disrupt ICBMs. Their propulsion systems have too little impulse to maneuver in a relevant time frame to serve as interceptors, and megawatt scale lasers would be needed to defeat ICBMs in the boost phase.

>>15404120

>>15404136
Tell us more about things you clearly don't understand
How much dV does each starlink have? How fast can they utilize said dV? How much power storage capacity do they have?
You fucking idiot. You gargantuan ape.

>>15404143
what if each starlink functioned as a jacket for the actual interceptor?

>>15404153
Starlink are small as fuck. Are you even 18?

>>15404156
sure, but brilliant pebbles were supposed to be small, the sat in that pic is only 3 feet long. The latest starlink sats are 23 feet long.

Posting some PDFs about other cool applications of solar besides powersails.

BIRD

>>15404153
>>15404156
Starlink V2 could do the job. Video related: Strategic Defense Initiative kinetic interceptor prototype.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dy_qly4yHuM

>>15404180
THE LAUNCH CLAMS SURVIVED

>>15404148
That's the one, up to 60,000-s with enough voltage.

>>15404185
>launch clams
Female astronauts?

>>15404187
clamps lol

>>15404180
going to go a little soi here, but that remindes me of a shot from expanse whenever a ship is sitting on the surface ready to launch, the out of focus parts even look a little cgi

>>15404170
Compare the size of an air to air missile to starlink, and then realize it has to have more fuel than those do to reach any ICBM.

>>15404185
Yeah the clams got boiled for too long, way overcooked, but they look fine at first glance. Who knows, maybe their external appearance is deceptive, and the inside of the clam is mush.

>>15404195
>>15404182
Now if you had said starSHIELD on the other hand, maybe you'd be worth talking to.

Business idea: quantum computers but in space

>>15404199
It's a branding difference. Starshield offerings are based on the Starlink V2 bus.

>>15404195
???
compare the size of brilliant pebbles to the size of starlink. Understand that the DoD believed a constellation of such pebbles could take down ICBMs. see their size in >>15404182.
You are very belligerant for a person who obviously
neither knows very much about the subject nor cares to research it.

The Factory grows

>A press pit is a machine foundation designed to withstand the weight, force, and vibration created by industrial machine presses."

>>15402938
I'm making a space horror game. It would take place in an early Mars colony (before teraforming) and I need to decide on what should be killing the crew.

Shall it be a virus? A monster that the colony awaken? Some kind of mental problem that makes people crazy and start killing each other?

>>15404204
>quantooom AND spess
Steve would be giddy at the prospect

>>15404232
e*rthers attacking due to rustsuckers not paying their taxes.

>>15404219
That's a deep foundation pit there, similar to what they end up digging when a large stamping machine is being planned.

>>15404204
AI running on quantum computers...in space

>>15404232
The sand is alive
Guess why it's red

God damn, Starlink V2 produces 170 mN thrust and weighs about ~1,250 kg. It accelerates at 0.000136 m/s^2 and some people here think that it can intercept an ICBM.

>>15404252
tiresome. The suggestion was that it acted as a jacket.

>>15404252
>some people here think
On 4chan? [Citation needed]

>>15404244
press pit but what for?

>>15404253
Proof?

>>15404252
aren't the thrusters used on v2 fucked? or did the first batch deorbit for some other reason

>>15404232
The colony is failing and falling apart. They are killing each other trying to get the few ships off world before they are left to die.

>>15404261
I have no idea, they were hyping them not that long ago.

>>15404232
Ghosts. (Of aliens? That's what you'd think, but no.)

>>15404232
Make some disaster happen on Earth that makes them completely isolated and without resupply.

>>15404232
Earth goes silent.
A ship is sent to investigate.
It comes back wrong.

>Niihimmash A. A. Sakarov on how they tested the RD-56 Hydrogen Oxygen engine.
>"We turned it on, left for lunch, came back, and after lunch it still continued to work..."
>"The RD-56 was first test-fired in June 1967 and was tested for 24,000 seconds in *six starts*"

There are well designed engine, and then there's "flawlessly works for hours straight on the first test fire"

>>15404215
Yeah bro that's totally about the same size as a starlink
Fucking idiot

>>15404287
you should read. That is the first iteration of the design.

>>15404260
>It was revealed to him in a drug induced stupor

>>15404290
>Yeah bro we totally have magic propellant these days that takes up less volume just trust me

>>15404293
you don't need magic propellant. It turns out that missiles require a lot less prop in 0g.

Reminder

>>15404281
There was a Call of Cthullhu setting based around this. Honestly a lot of fun.
https://lovecraft.fandom.com/wiki/Call_of_Cthulhu,_End_Time

>>15404295
>What is a 'plane change'
It's like you're trying to sound retarded.

>>15404299
You're arguing with me, but if you don't think that a brilliant pebble can fit inside 3 feet, you should really be arguing with the DoD.

>>15404296
oh cool, maybe we'll get some answers

>>15404300
I think you can "fit" whatever you want inside a starlink but the utility of said "fit" item is severely suspect given the dV concerns, volume concerns, and the fact that no starlink has any visible separation plane on the bus. Full stop. This is schizo shit.

This was just a case study in landscapes and curved shapes but I'd figure I would share anyways. Idk if the sea level or Rvacs would fire.

>no starship launch fotos on flickr

>>15404309
Wtf is Flickr?

>>15404219
>>15404244
Is SpaceX gonna get one of those WW2 stomping machines?

>>15404310
Someplace with actual HQ photo sharing instead of recompressed social media crap.

>>15404299
that's when you sprint across O'Hare to make your next flight

>>15404259
Good question. They brought in a linear CNC pipe bender, so they're probably stepping up their on-site fabrication capacity.

>Produces some of the best space themed filk music of all time in complete obscurity decades ago, pisses off shit libs for being anti-vax, anti-government, pro guns, and against children transitioning. Breeds a bunch of super intelligent cats for unknown reasons
She cannot be topped, I present to the gentlemen of /sfg/ a based woman.

Alright /sfg/, if you believe in the 2 month time set by BOTH SpaceX and Elon, report in.

>>15404355
Mars 2024, here we gooo

>>15404355
I posted right after OFT. It's gonna be 2 months.

>>15404355
Dearmoon 2023 bro, reporting in

>>15404355
It's 2x(2^2)weeks so I believe it.

>>15404180
I wonder if the direction of the blowout was completely random? what if that crater didn't open towards the sea, but directly towards the tower or the tank farm?

>>15404355
Oh I believe it. However, hurricanes will cause the delays.

>>15404281
>>15404282
this, earth dies for a reason or another or at least an event that makes it impossible for earth to send any more supplies for the foreseeable future
the mars colony is not yet completely self sufficient and will start slowly dying as machines break down and can't be replaced/fixed
what do the colonists do?
what happened to earth?
is it something that might happen to the mars colony too?

>>15404355
I believe it. Any delays are the result of Joe Biden and the FAA

>>15404267
this but there is nowhere to go >>15404373

>>15404355
Yes, its going to happen
2 more months

>>15404296
its still happening?
i thought that was supposed to be on friday

>>15404355
It's bullshit but I believe it.

>>15404355
1 reporting in. Heil Elon.

>>15404355
yeah

Zubrin

>>15404069
You do undestand that's the booster after FTS?

>>15404406
How do you know this?

ULA should have contracted out for an upper stage. Nothing in-house.

>>15404416
Because there is a huge white cloud of cryogenic liquid.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ErDuVomNd9M

CSS kino just dropped
before watching, how long do you think he says the delay will be?
2 Months? 1 year? Starbase has to be demolished because reasons and SpaceX nationalized (i.e. never)

>>15404416
>>15404420
Just watch the video. At no point is there such a massive cloud of white until the booster explodes.
Combine that with the EDA footage that clearly shows the booster *NOT* bent moments before explosion.

>>15404418
ULA are literally the only people with a working cryogenic upper stage in the US right now.

>>15404425
Starship will never launch again

>>15404430
What did he mean by this

>>15404434
Cryogenic fuel anyway. LOX is ezmode.

>>15404425
2 years is my guess for what’s said

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZL_qCdH6CIo

> 4K: Masseys drone flight April 28

>>15404425
elonsisters, I don't feel so good...

>>15404425
>CSS kin- ACK!

>>15404425
Sometime next year.
Biggest delays will be getting everything through FAA and maybe permit issues with digging a proper flame diverter trench. I'm not sure their water-cooled steel plate flame diverter is going to be accepted after this fuckup.

>>15404355
I'm highly confident it'll fly this year, I'll be careful to apply elon time for the 2 months tho, 4/20 only got accurate by late march, I'll wait until the predictions are <= 30 days

>>15404425
>Oh, here is pad 39A where SpaceX is constructing another pad for Starship, but it is hallowed ground since it was used by the shuttle and explosions could erase a huge piece of space flight history for nothing
Cosmic levels of seething reached. This guy would rather keep 39A a living museum that hinders spaceflight than allow SpaceX to use it.

>>15404425
upset midwit with EDS that started a crusade after shorting tesla lost him money. opinion discarded

>>15404440
I wonder how hard it was for them to be allowed to fly their drone over there

>>15404425
holy shit, is that what he really sounds like? The froglike intonation and disfluent speech indicates a high level of autism and a truly memeable physiognomy.
When he gets doxxed it will be fucking hilarious.

>>15404462
it's legal as long as you dont fly over their property

>>15402983
it's a radar antenna, not data antenna this time

I have been working on the design of what I'm calling an "aether mill", a system for using Quantized Inertia effects to convert QI thrust into rotational motion to spin a generator and get more electricity out than the initial electricity needed to activate the thrusters. If QI works this doesn't violate any conservation laws, so I'm going to watch for the Transporter-8 test payload before I get to the point of physical experiments.

>>15403909
The chinese are going to make a telescope that can dock to their space station. And if I recall correctly, the Shuttle flew with a probe and crew at least once.
It's not that far out from our current and near future technology.

>>15404449
>museum that hinders spaceflight
Well, in the long run, KSC isn't on a very good latitude for space launches. Boca Chica is as good as you can get on US soil. And in the long run humanity is going to need loads of new launch sites anyways.

>>15404232
Read (or play) the Dig

>>15404477

>>15404477
I have been working on a brain pill, it's basically a bunch of neurons from some dead guy and by swallowing I am effectively converting the neuron's into brain mass, essentially getting more brain mass than what was already there. It doesn't violate any laws because he's obviously already dead, so I am going to watch my iq test closely before doing anything practical with it

>>15404483
pop science implies QI is popular, rather than the niche schizo shit that it is.

>>15403931
"Cramming for Physics Exams," by U.R. Fukt

>>15404487
Ok you make your own version of this image then, I’d bet it’d get allot of mileage like this one has

>>15404084
Its already an ICBM functionally. I think you mean load up bunch of warheads inside 2nd stage. Its doable.

>>15404483
Ma'am, don't reply to /sfg/ oldfags with your forced meme or we're going to have a problem.

>>15404103
Bombers can get anywhere on earth in 1 hour? What sorcery?

>>15404489
I really momentum, impulse, and rotation of rigid bodies. I’m already fairly confident in energy, and I’m alright in momentum and the others I’m clueless, I think I can make it though

Russia to stay on ISS till 2028!
https://spacenews.com/russia-commits-to-iss-extension-to-2028/

>>15404499
I really only need to learn*

>>15404102
What possible rationale would you have for reusable ICBMs now that they have CEFs of 100 meters, that's second strike talk. In case you miss? China's got MRBMs they want to try and hit a moving carrier with, but good luck with that

If the silos are open you're at DEFCON 1 anyway

Starship spaces in an hour and FH launch 30 minutes after. Do you think Elon will turn it into a viewing party?

>>15404505
Did Elon ever give a speech before a launch? I expected him in OFT 1 but he was just in that control room.

>>15404114
You're a faggot then kek

>>15404508
Nah, unless you consider that Starship space before OFT-1 a speech, in which he lowered expectations dramatically to about reality

>>15404425
Well then. His arguments were about what I outline in >>15404445. Lots of work to get everything FAA approved, limited realistic options for the necessary flame diverter.

But he's unrealistically negative, sounds like he has a personal axe to grind. I guess >>15404452 explains it.

>>15404508
He did do some interviews before and during crew launch for Bob and Doug

So uhh guys, what happened to the oil rig launch pads? Wouldn't that have solved almost everything that went wrong with the launch? No damn concrete there

>>15404516
Judging by that crater, I don't think the oil rig would have survived the launch.

>>15404516
>No damn concrete there
you made this up

>>15404514
>sounds like he has a personal axe to grind
If you don’t know instantly that CSS is clearly biased against anything Musk that makes you a newfag or busy. Which is it?

>>15404516
I'm guessing that it turned out that the rigs were too small to fit all the required infrastructure.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sbUgb2OPpdM
Thoughts? I still think the whole "colonizing the galaxy in a few million years" needs to consider the resource intensity it would require and complexity of the operation, and this was just hand waved in the video.
>inb4 popsci mush

>>15404524
Newfag both to this general and CSS.

>Lockheed Khrunichev Energiya International

>>15404534
somehow higher meme density than 4ASS.

>>15404533
Welcome! CSS is a known EDS patients, if you didn’t know that the Id advise you lurk a bit more just to get used to some of the familiar characters in the spacelaunch media scene. Are you from another board or a different site?

>>15404516
Probably realized after an initial engineering study that he would have also had to figure out how to get the rockets to the rigs and up to the platform without breaking anything

I'm mentally picturing mega-chopsticks that just pick the whole thing up from the boat floating next to the platform and just lift it up to an OLM that's basically dangling out over the water or could swivel to do so (engineering this would probably cost a fortune)

>locksneed shartin

>>15404541
lockheeb

>>15404539
Just the regular chopsticks could do this.

what is /sfg/'s favorite type of orbit?
I like Molniya orbits.

>logghard martin

>>15404552
Heliocentric.
We oberth now bois

>>15404531
>"WHOOAAAA HAVE YOU GUYS EVER HEARD OF THE WEAK ANTHROPIC PRINCIPLE?"
>"WHOOOOAAAAA WE SHOULD LOOK OUTSIDE OF OUR OWN GALAXY, LIKE WE ALREADY DO."

This guy is a fucking insanely retarded pseud, holy shit.

>>15404552
the ones that take me into other planets

>>15404516
Gwynne said they sold them last year because they weren't worth focusing on at the moment. You could have googled this.

>>15404552
that saturn moon with the horseshoe orbit is pretty cool

>>15404556
>into
chad lithobraker

>>15404483
Can you post this a few more times? I dont think it's played out yet

>>15404552
My favorite orbit is the one that comes after a Trans-Martian injection.

>>15404555
have you ever considered that the kind of look we give into other galaxies right now tells nothing about if they have ayys?

>>15404531
it is exactly popsci mush. dont ever mention the fermi paradox or great filter again if you want to be taken seriously by the likes of me

>>15404565
He's a fucking retard and is literally positioning himself in his own video like he came up with the weak anthropic principle. However, he's also a YouTuber who is literally filming in the middle of a forest, so I actually believe that he might have tricked himself into thinking he did come up with it given how "profound" it is.

>fermi denier oldfag
he refuses to acknowledge it and honestly I've comes to terms with it. I mildly fear extinction via great filter, and knowing that anon just doesn't care is somewhat cathartic.

>>15404574
Do you also believe in Kessler syndrome and the Egyptians met ayys?

>>15404567
>if you want to be taken seriously by the likes of me
wow I'm so ashamed that I'm not respected by anon

>>15404552

>>15404501
2022 summer
>RASHA STRONK WE MAKE OWN STATION OF SPACE
2023 spring
>c-can we comings back pls? ;_;

This is an orbital launcher

>>15404574
lmao overdosed on Discovery channel

>>15404308
End of ze world vibes

>>15404579
I wonder what will happen to Roscosmos once Russia collapses.
They've already lost Baikonur. Maybe they'll be sold to Kazakhs?

>>15404576
how the fuck can you compare /x/ tier schizo shit to enviromentalist-style alarmism?

>>15404580
Shtil and Volna were cool

>>15404580
Ok let’s put Starship on that thing and go to Mars then

>>15404577
It's good that you feel ashamed

>>15404580
surely 'tis suborbital

>>15404584
Both rely on a grand misunderstanding of scale to keep the believers in belief, and both are equally absurd and impossible.

>>15404576
>the Egyptians met ayys?
Problem?

>>15404576
>kessler denier as well
extremely based

>>15404578
very cool. cruithne is a terrible name, 'beit.

Starship spaces in 30 minutes

>>15404589
This particular one was, because the Volna rocket failed after launch, other were perfectly succesful, like the Shtil in >>15404586, which put a satellite in 401km x 487km x 78,9° orbit

>>15404596
I just remembered how some people say albeit like all-bite when it is literally just all be it without spaces.

>>15404552
ESL3

>>15404599
Tubsat-N launch, 400km x 776km x 78,9° orbit, July 7 1998

>>15404591
how is ancient ayys a misuderstanding of scale?