/sci/ - Science & Math

>>15301226
The influence of a split-brain can be seen beyond simple image testing, but in daily life, where the person partially appears to have two separate entities gifted with their own personnal will inside is brain.
«When one split-brain patient dressed himself, he sometimes pulled his pants up with one hand (that side of his brain wanted to get dressed) and down with the other (this side did not). He also reported to have grabbed his wife with his left hand and shaken her violently, at which point his right hand came to her aid and grabbed the aggressive left hand. However, such conflicts are very rare. If a conflict arises, one hemisphere usually overrides the other.»


What does that mean ? Personal interpretation
First of all, I don't think split-brain patients have two minds. Because the mind itself is not definable as a divisible entity.
What we call consciousness has a non-individual essence in its functioning, it can be divided into different parts (not just two but an indeterminate number) who are more or less autonomous in their response to stimuli and their ability to function.
In a normal human, these parts are linked together, giving an illusion of individuality. In a human with split brain, two parts are distinctly separated, out of the many parts that make up consciousness, this results in a divergence of these two which makes them visible and identifiable.
Also consciousness is relatively vast and overwhelmingly non-verbal in its natural functioning.

>>15301226
The physical world has no place for consciousness. Split brain makes a lot more sense when you stop thinking about consciousness.

Idealists BTFO (as they always are)
All they have in defense is ridiculous word salad sophistry.

>>15301286
>t. schizo unable to understand what has just read
Many such cases. Why is it always so simple to find the schizo in every thread bros?

>>15301274
Consciousness does not have to be something necessarily abstract and devoid of material definition, one can take consciousness simply as the ability to respond to stimuli through a subjective act.
In this sense we can always speak of consciousness, without it being necessarily absolute, the capacity to formulate a thought is a consciousness in the same way as picking up the hammer when one receives the request to choose the object seen

>>15301226
>>15301227
That's not real consciousness, that's just optical and language processing. At best you could call it "functional consciousness". But it's functionality even ChatGPT can emulate. It doesn't say anything about phenomenological consciousness, i.e. the hard problem.

>>15301292
Op here, I'm not going to say that he is a schizo to reach to this conclusion, because in the end the whole development returns a blurring of the abstract aspect of consciousness.
But split-brain does not answer the underlying reason for consciousness nor enlighten us on its pure functioning.
In fact if the reason for the functioning of consciousness escapes material reality, then it will necessarily escape human knowledge.

>>15301389
I really have a pretty hard time conceptualizing a consciousness that is totally other than input and output process. All the formulation of ideas, whether verbalized internally or not, is also input and output, which is for me consciousness.

>>15301395
Nah, he is an actual schizo, I expose him as such in numerous threads on the board right now. He is very easy to spot because he posts such stupid shit. You may be thinking "but yah a lot of retards on this board do that" but this guy is here 24 hours a day samefagging and hopping in threads multiple times hours apart to post retarded non-sequitors and screech "schizo" at anyone who exposes him. Probably 80% of the stupid shit you read on this board that anons will meme and call an "austist" is this one schizo retard posting it. That being said, yes this stuff is very interesting. I am guessing you learned about in the Hoffman video some anon posted here a week or two ago? I made in a comment in that thread that I wanted to learn more about this specific phenomenon. I also commented that it was obvious there is more than consciousness at work in a human body as we know you don't have to be "conscious" (this word is sadly used in more than one way making it confusion to have these discussions often times) to keep your body functioning so then what is doing it? (being knock out for example). I find this line of research fascinating, how many consciousnesses are in a single body or how is identity and consciousness possibly different things like in DID, MPD, and even bipolar patients to an extent?

>>15301446
I also commented that it was obvious there is more than *one* consciousness

>>15301446
>I am guessing you learned about in the Hoffman video some anon posted here a week or two ago?
Actually the subject of split-brain had already interested me a few years ago, when I started to take an interest in certain brain surgeries, such as hemispherectomy or simply understand how epileptic seizures work.
I'm rarely on this board as I'm busy with my studies, and I had never heard of Hoffman's video, but now that you mention it I'm going to watch it

>>15301464
One sec I will get it for you from the archive

>>15301464
This is the thread
>>/sci/thread/S15252142

>>15301467
Thanks, I'll take a look

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5WKqO16mkGE

>>15301274
Found the P-zombie

>>15301500
There is no physical difference between a p-zombie and a real person. As far as the physical external world is concerned the distinction is not even meaningful. As such its nonsense to assert that you can't argue with a zombie, since there is no test you could ever perform to detect such a being, they are indistinguishable to real people.

>>15301510
>here is no test you could ever perform to detect such a being, they are indistinguishable to real people.
This is false. Denying the existence of consciousness or the self is strong evidence that someone isn't a conscious being. There are also theoretical tests that could potentially done to determine if a being is conscious, like mindmelding and phenomenal puzzles.

https://nintil.com/p-zombies-are-still-undead
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3gvwhQMKvro

>>15301534
>Those who don't agree with me aren't human
Gotta love the transparent narcissism.

>>15301477
no worries

>>15301510
If physically identical zombies and human differ in whether they believe they have consciousness, that means your definition of "physically identical" is wrong. Maybe you legitimately can't argue with some people because they lack consciousness particles.

>>15301477
btw sorry if it is underwhelming as dar as this subject is concerned. It didnt really focus on this topic it just mentioned it. I just mentioned it because it was so recent I thought you may have watched it and it sparked some interest for you to look into it more and make this thread. It could lead you to some other interesting information/sources however

>>15301534
I do not deny my own consciousness. What I mean is that, consciousness is out of the reach of all objective observations. I can experience my own consciousness, but I can not observe my own consciousness using any external observation. As far as the external world is concerned there is no consciousness.

>>15301274
>stop thinking about consciousness.

>>15301446
Bodhi you are actually schizophrenic. The fact that you think it's just one person who tells you this, who posts 24/7 and samefags while following you around on different boards, is both hilarious and sad.

>>15302685
Uhm sweaty, the glowies have a billion dollar budget for personally stalking schizophrenics online.

>>15301510

>they are indistinguishable to real people

No they aren't. They're simply so common by now that it is hard to find one of the exceptions.

>>15301274
>Split brain makes a lot more sense when you stop thinking about consciousness.
This guy is right? Split brain you have few connections between the halves and consciousness is just the abstract wall in which the locality changes, the brain compensates by replacing other localities within the brain in that local consciousness cause it's just an emergent effect of sufficient information. Does it have a special magnetic resonance and barrier? Probably but that doesn't indicate it's transmitted to you as if you are a robot, but defining it has to be done from the ground up of the simple computational unit. It's nothing special we can define accurately just yet. Neural networks in many ways are crude.
Maybe growing brains in a jar is a good idea.

>>15302685
There he goes mirroring again because he is incapable of an original thought top kek. STFU schizo

>>15301226
Lucid dreams are also interesting for this. You can have a full discussion with an unconscious part of your brain.

>>15301226
Maybe there really are two wolves inside us.

>>15303305

Bump