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/sci/ - Science & Math

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15260366 No.15260366 [Reply] [Original]

>Proposition 1. In any environment that is sufficiently rich, self-propagating systems will arise, and natural selection will lead to the evolution of self-propagating systems having increasingly complex, subtle, and sophisticated means of surviving and propagating themselves.
>Proposition 2. In the short term, natural selection favors self-propagating systems that pursue their own short-term advantage with little or no regard for long-term consequences.
A corollary to Proposition 2 is:

>Proposition 3. Self-propagating subsystems of a given supersystem tend to become dependent on the supersystem and on the specific conditions that prevail within the supersystem.
>Proposition 4. Problems of transportation and communication impose a limit on the size of the geographical region over which a self-prop system can extend its operations.
Human experience suggests:

>Proposition 5. The most important and the only consistent limit on the size of the geographical regions over which self-propagating human groups extend their operations is the limit imposed by the available means of transportation and communication. In other words, while not all self-propagating human groups tend to extend their operations over a region of maximum size, natural selection tends to produce some self-propagating human groups that operate over regions approaching the maximum size allowed by the available means of transportation and communication.
>Proposition 6. In modern times, natural selection tends to produce some self-propagating human groups whose operations span the entire globe. Moreover, even if human beings are some day replaced by machines or other entities, natural selection will still tend to produce some self-propagating systems whose operations span the entire globe.
(cont)

>> No.15260369
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15260369

>Proposition 7. Where (as today) problems of transportation and communication do not constitute effective limitations on the size of the geographical regions over which self-propagating systems operate, natural selection tends to create a world in which power is mostly concentrated in the possession of a relatively small number of global self-propagating systems.

I encountered this in a math/economics setting that had nothing to do with Dr. Kaczynski's work. Is there any other book besides AT-Revolution (pic unrelated) that details this phenomenon? Is there a more technical term for this? I know it's related to systems theory.

>> No.15260791

Bump. Doesn't anybody have any useful information about evolutionary systems?

>> No.15260867
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15260867

>>15260791

Guess Ted did not see where this is truly leading. Recommend looking up Calhoun's mouse utopia. Behavioural sinkhole. Difference being that with humanity there likely won't be a total colony collapse down the road ... rather, an adaptive edge. And that edge will cut deep. Welcome to the bottleneck. Welcome to tomorrow. :}~<

>> No.15260880

>>15260867
He refers to the Mouse Utopia quite frequently and sees it as an example of one of the worst possible outcomes for humanity. The second paragraph of his primary work refers to this:
>2. The industrial-technological system may survive or it may break down. If it survives, it MAY eventually achieve a low level of physical and psychological suffering, but only after passing through a long and very painful period of adjustment and only at the cost of permanently reducing human beings and many other living organisms to engineered products and mere cogs in the social machine. Furthermore, if the system survives, the consequences will be inevitable: There is no way of reforming or modifying the system so as to prevent it from depriving people of dignity and autonomy.
He believes that the most likely outcome is destabilization and collapse, but that it will be after a point of no return, thus necessitating immediate revolution. He also believes that if it does not collapse, the future of humanity will be extremely bleak (like a mouse utopia, but where all the mice are engineered, lobotomized, or other things to reduce 'suffering').

>> No.15260903

>>15260366
Stopped reading after a few sentences. The stale, nauseating, pseudointellectual tone immediately narrows your IQ down to the 100-115 range so I know you have nothing of value to say.

>> No.15261027
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15261027

>>15260880

>and only at the cost of permanently reducing human beings and many other living organisms to engineered products and mere cogs in the social machine

There's a point here, such a "machine" would be inherently unstable, it IS the actual collapse mechanism at the endpoint of this development. And effectively this situation has already been achieved, delusional technocratic considerations aside (these would merely put the final edge to the process). We gotta examine the reason for the collapse in Calhoun's utopia here ... simplified, we got mice living within a neat niche of plenty without selective pressures aside from rewarding colony expansion. Now, the classical Malthusian viewpoint would then blame the collapse on oversaturation of said niche but this is wrong, or at least a secondary cause. The actual mechanism instead is already found within the still expansive phase due to a mechanism which Konrad Lorenz has correctly labelled "Verhausschweinung" (a form of degenerative self domestication). This process creates a loss of resilience in the genepool of the mouse colony. When such a degenerated colony finally reaches the saturation limit it'll start to experience chronic population density stress, this is the effect the Malthusians do so overemphazise. However, it would here be irrelevant what kind of stress such a colony would experience, any other cause of stress would trigger the same outcome. The mice, verhausschweint and degenerated are simply incapable of dealing with the sudden onset of stress factors due to loss of resilience. The maladaptive response to said stress (in case of current humanity due to most being reduced to being cogs in the social machine) does create further stress, a vicious cycle which does not allow for adaptive correctives. Catastrophic collapse of the colony within one or two generations is the outcome. End of line.

>> No.15262117

>>15260903
It wasn't written by me, but a PhD Mathematician with a 140+ IQ. God you pseuds are so cringe.

>> No.15262128

>>15261027
Very interesting stuff. This is why industrial society will require humans to be engineered to reduce the amount of stress they experience in this situation. This is already happening through the use of anti-depressants and other psych meds, but also forms of parasocial relationships. Soon it will likely be physical modification or bioengineered. Total Kaczynskian nightmare.