/sci/ - Science & Math

>Most credible experts in the field would say
They also believe rocks and water magically came to life by purely physical processes, yet that's never been proven to happen or even be possible. Even if you have all the building blocks to life, you won't have life. This is the abiogenesis problem that "Science!™ experts" can't address.

If you believe that is possible, then sure, but it's not a scientific belief.

>>15095939
yes.
well.... no, actually.
maybe.

>>15095939
8 minutes in and he seems to be conflating the 1st and 2nd argument.

Copernican principle doesn't allow you quantify how mediocre you are, that's a problem for the drake equation. But if I my argument is that I'm probably not the only green ball, it's not a bad one because we can't seem to find an example of something unique in the universe except maybe ourselves. If we found all types of weird stars and structures that there was only one in the sky to our knowledge, we could more safely assume we are weird unique structure. But no matter how big or small, uniqueness is actually the rarest feature in the universe, if it exists at all.

>>15095939
All intelligent life eventually strips the resources from its planet and destroys its habitat before it can colonize other worlds, ending with extinction, just as we are currently doing.

>>15096011
Do you have source for your bullshit?

>>15096042
Earth.

>>15095945
Do you think there's an alternative explanation for the origin of life that's less "magical" than abiogenesis?

>>15096042
scifi movies

>>15096128
It doesn't matter, it's not science until you prove it. Until then, it's just glorified philosophy and religious world views masquerading as science.

You don't defend fake science by demanding alternatives from critics. At least if you have any honesty and honor.

>>15096112
But how do you know human civilization will eventually end in extinction? Have you checked?

>>15096112
>Earth
Yeah that is what i thought.

Getting your opinions from James cameron movies while discussing the latest Bill Nye show on Reddit isnt a useful source.

>>15096148
In terms of raw mathematics, he gets to that at the end of the video. If we can use the evolution of humans on earth as any kind of a rubric for how long it takes intelligent life to form, then based on us it starts well into a star’s life cycle, and only reaches intelligence at just about it’s end. Very bleak prognostication indeed

>>15096144
I agree with everything you said. Show me someone who claims to have scientifically proven where life came from. As far as I know it has never been regarded as anything but a hypothesis. You seem to have an issue with people even discussing the topic seriously. But I bet you'd be fine with people having unsubstantiated gut instincts about all sorts of topics besides this one.

>>15096148
>But how do you know human civilization will eventually end in extinction?
Because everything ends, the only question is when.

>>15096195
>Because everything ends, the only question is when.
No I wilæ reverse entropy

>>15096197
Pretty words, but do they have any merit to them? How do you know you (or we all) can accomplish such a feat?

>>15096181
>Show me someone who claims to have scientifically proven where life came from.
Show me a pig that can fly.

>As far as I know it has never been regarded as anything but a hypothesis.
It's regarded as a presumed fact of life part of evolutionism, which is also not science nor proven.

>>15096181
>>15096216
Will either of you two nitwits actually debate any of the refutations discussed in the lecture, or are you just going to continue carrying on like a bunch of school children?

>>15095939
https://reducing-suffering.org/ranking-explanations-of-the-fermi-paradox/

>>15095939
Scientifically, how plausible is Ted Kaczynski's Fermi Paradox theory?

>>15095939
Look up the Katechon Hypothesis. TL;DR: We live in a simulation and civilizations get deleted when they get too advanced.

https://www.unz.com/akarlin/katechon/

>Abstract: A corollary of the Simulation Argument is that the universe’s computational capacity may be limited. Consequently, advanced alien civilizations may have incentives to avoid space colonization to avoid taking up too much “calculating space” and forcing a simulation shutdown. A possible solution to the Fermi Paradox is that analogous considerations may drive them to avoid broadcasting their presence to the cosmos, and to attempt to destroy or permanently cripple emerging civilizations on sight. This game-theoretical equilibrium could be interpreted as the “katechon” – that which withholds eschaton – doom, oblivion, the end of the world. The resulting state of mutually assured xenocide would result in a dark, seemingly empty universe intermittently populated by small, isolationist “hermit” civilizations.

>>15096216
>It's regarded as a presumed fact of life part of evolutionism, which is also not science nor proven
Simple things become complex things, which is entirely proven

I think far more simple than our wild speculations are leading us.

Life shouldn't be rare. Intelligent life might not be rare. The issue is, and the one important piece of inductive reasoning we can apply living here, consciousness might be rare.

This isn't really the Blindsight revelation, more just an insight from earth. We ain't got no one to fucking talk to here. Couple of gorillas know sign language, crows can solve puzzles, signs of Intelligence, but not of an ego or an inner reflective awareness. There seems to be only one on earth, and that is weird.

We're missing something. Or rather, we might be doing something weird. Maybe primates are this perfect storm of behaviors that makes awareness possible. Why are we alone on earth? Why aren't cuttlefish cutting albums?

>>15096414
It is far more simple, it's just that retards assume that alien civilizations are hyper-advanced and should be zooming around the universe like in their favourite scifi stories, when the reality is that any alien civilization is most likely as advanced, or less advanced, than us. Couple that with the fact that habitable planets are rare and super far away from us, any radio signals would take thousands if not millions of years to reach anyone, add to that the fact that any civilization looking at Earth through a telescope would see light from thousands to millions of years in the past, they might not even realize any civilization or life exists on this planet and the same applies to us.
Life is not a scifi fantasy, it's extremely mundane and limited and any alien civilization is most likely operating on the exact same laws of physics as us, simple as that.

>>15095939
>credible experts
there aren't any credible experts on a topic involving non-scientific, nondisprovable conjectures, its all just low iq faggots who can't tell the difference between sci-fi and reality

>>15096423
Whatever it is, I'm sure the answer is that we're getting something wrong about existence and space faring. We're still just observers collecting EM waves and extrapolating. I bet there's something bananas about the universe that we can't learn down here.

For me, the simplest answer is that we don't understand what we're looking at.

>>15095939
Yes

Star Trek fans on suicide watch

>>15095939
It's entirely possible that interstellar travel isn't feasible within our universe for most species, meaning we're all looking for eachother but none of us can reach far enough to ever really touch.

Probably for the best if that's the case to be honest.

>>15096423
>Life is not a scifi fantasy, it's extremely mundane and limited
if we didn't spend so much time molding our cultures around grand narratives and fantasies of gods and kings and heroes and wizards then maybe this wouldn't be so upsetting/difficult for people to accept

>>15096501
Current civilization is molded around trannyhumanism and space copes instead of faith and folk like it was for the last 12,000 years. It's easy to see why people are mad when the mandatory civic religion seems to have no salvation after all.

>>15095939
>Most credible experts in the field would say it's very likely we're not alone in the universe

For good reason, it's just very likely because we did not look properly. Even if we explore and colonize our entire galayx and find nobody else it's still true because ouir galaxy is nothing compared to the entire universe.

The "we are alone" theory got no crediblity. It's just based on insecurity and the need to feel somehow special.

>>15096479
Was going to post this exact thought.

>>15095939
Our planet was literally teraformed to promote life.
we are not alone

>>15096479
interstellar travel is not this hard if another star is passing by close enough, stars are not static, there is relative movement right now we are in an relative empty area, If we are just able to use some kind of fusion drive and never advance beyond, never develop something faster we could still build an glactic empire. this way it will just take one million years.

>>15096697
But are we capable of building a planetary colony that can survive a million years? Do we just hop planets in a slash and burn across the galaxy in the hopes of banging ayys? What happens in the aftermath, thousands of colonies tens to hundreds of of thousands of lightyears apart. Do planets with human invaders just happen to produce technological industrial space age civilizations given enough time? Even if we can achieve this once, it took thousands of years to tame and settle the earth, just from a population perspective there might not be enough humans to colonize the universe due to the cyclical nature of growth and degrowth. How many people does it take a planetary civilization to build colonial generation ships with fusion drives? How many of those ships could a given solar system build before it exhausted the available resources and doomed the planetary civilization to certain demise?

>>15096479
Dude it is for the best if we never see aliens, do you know how fucking insane and scary that shit would be? Also the fact that they could enslave or steal our resources, a lot of xenophobia will happen and many other bad shit. I can see why we are separated from aliens, it would cause more trouble than good.

>>15096423
>when the reality is that any alien civilization is most likely as advanced, or less advanced, than us

this is retarded because we surely have no idea at what year intelligent life kicked in for them, the time it took for earth to get intelligent life is by no means a constant.

Its neither likely or unlikely, its simply up in the air.

>>15095939
I hate the phrasing. "Alone". Just admit you're looking for a surrogate for God or shut the fuck up.

>>15096390
Missing the most accurate explanation, that whig history is a bunch of bullshit. History isn't linear or progressive. Humans were never destined to exist. Humans were never destined to develop industrial technology. Humans are not destined to colonize space, which for now is mere science fiction and speculation. The same should be assumed of other extraterrestrial organisms, if they even exist.

>>15096771
Faggot fuck you, i'm tired of living in a meaningless depressing retarded absurd world, at least give me some hope nigger.

>>15096776
>Humans were never destined to exist. Humans were never destined to develop industrial technology. Humans are not destined to colonize space
Because anon said so?

>>15096779
Hope for what? That Jesus will return in a spaceship? That hyper advanced omnipotent aliens will give humans FTL technology on Judgement Day? That you'll go to alien heaven when you die? That's all this alien nonsense appears to me.

Too materialistic to believe in God. Too nihilistic for spirituality. But, the urge toward the Other still exists.

>>15095945
Check this out, studies are linked in the description
https://youtu.be/K1xnYFCZ9Yg
https://youtu.be/mRzxTzKIsp8

>>15095939
>are we alone?
Always have been.

>>15095939
Earth is flat and aliens are demons

>>15096719
Except time of existence has no correlation with civilization advancement, they could still be retarded cave apes banging bones on cave walls to make music and given that our scientific experiments have invalidated any outlandish creations it is safe to assume that there are no space-faring races.

>>15096705
>But are we capable of building a planetary colony that can survive a million years?

certainly not every colony will last this long, but while spreading we may build a million colonys and more, failed colonies can be resettled

>>15095939
Life is developing at the same time everywhere in the universe.
The problem is, we're too far away from other planets to see them as life is developing.
If a planet on the other side of the Milky Way Galaxy has life, we'll never be able to see it because of the millions of light years that separate our planets.
EVERY planet in the universe is blocked from seeing planets on the other side of their own galaxy.