/sci/ - Science & Math

>>14817397
because is politically incorrect to say that whites breeding with africans, arabs or indians are basically suiciding their bloodlines
this remembers me the french dude that fucked and arab girl and had too children that suffered alzheimer disease at ages 2 and due to genetic conditions.
Poor bastards.

>>14817397
Don't know about picture but I sure would want to 'outbreed' depressed girls.

>>14817397
The mutt bastards just die and the better adapted individuals restore the population after a longer delay

>>14819112
ye didnt read completly the image but i dont think the numbers were big enough for the adaptable alleles to have a chance

I had a stroke reading that image

there's an increase in chronic illness and cancer

How do you measure it? What determines the boundary when negative effects are experienced?
do you consider it as just one generation or can it be observed more at the second generation?

>>14817500
that shallow reasoning belongs on pol.
first you are talking about animals who basically can only use their genetics to adapt instead of technology and more specifically animals with limited ability to manipulate their environments.
second, such mixtures affect dramatic environmental and climate differences. if you live closer to the artic circle then yes breeding with someone full on adapted to the equator would present a problem for the children. but not if you slowly assimilate through 1-2 generation slowing moving further from the equator with each passing generation.
thirdly, arabs have way more genetic defects because of rampant inbreeding because of islam.
considering how low your own ability to comprehend information is, it would behoove you to not talk about suicide through blood mixing. as your own bloodline seems to be lacking adequate traits for intelligence and wisdom which are highly valued and necessary traits.

>>14822402
>reeeeeee, everything i don't like is /pol/!!!!1
lmao crybaby

>>14822402
Wouldn't a highly inbred population like arabs have a lower mutational load all they would have to do is not marry their cousin for one generation to see a benefit?

>>14822402
>yes breeding with someone full on adapted to the equator would present a problem for the children. but not if you slowly assimilate through 1-2 generation slowing moving further from the equator with each passing generation.

See although I recognise that environmental adaptation is one potential expression of outbreeding depression I don't think it encapsulates all factors associated with inbreeding depression, two populations isolated from one another reproductively but occupying the same climate and ecological niche should still express some form of outbreeding depression

>>14822804
*associated with outbreeding depression.

>>14817397
> 7 billion gooks niggers nips chinks abbos and spics exists: pol: lyk cute asians!
wmaf is the greatest evil, look at the numbers
if you consider destroying civilization evil, then this is the greatest evil

I'm actually interested in this topic and want to see if there's any interesting research out there I've overlooked.

I've read that there's a hypothetical optimum breeding range trading off the inbreeding depression's acute problem with autozygous recessives against outbreeding depression with its reduction in environmental adaptation and lowered fertility

>>14817397
>Outbreeding depression
>inbreeding depression
>genetic drift
so don't breed? wtf do these biologists want us to do?

>>14817397
From what I found:
Ibex never was native to the Tatra mountains, it was kept there by some noble in the 1880s, had to be fed, and died during WW2.
They are now considered different species.

>>14825127
3rd or 4th cousin according to icelandic data

>>14825153
That's a funnier answer than I expected.

>>14817397
Outbreeding depression is transient and only happens in the first hybrid generation. If, theoretically, they had protected the hybrids and continued breeding them, then they could have bred out the warmer climate gene.

>>14817397
Depression is normal mental state. Getting rid of depression will result in negative consequences. Depression is just an indicator that here is a problem or an issue and that a person must act to deal with it (the problem). Removing depression will not remove the problem, it will remove indication of the problem while the actual problem will just get more serious over time.

>>14826973
>Depression
Shorthand for the formerly common clinical phrase "depressed activity level"
It is not a condition, it is a symptom

>>14826862
>only happens in the first hybrid generation
nonsense, f2 is worse due genetic mismatch

>>14825111
>I've read that there's a hypothetical optimum breeding range
4th cousins is optimal breeding distance

>>14827848
Your cousin is a 100% safe choice for partner, and it is not even incest.

I am tired of people freaking out as if you were fucking your sibling. My family has always done it and we are all perfectly fine. Midwit IQ of 120 but still not retarded.
Fit as hell and leg presses 300kg (660lbs) with ease.

Marrying your cousin is fine.

>>14827848
but the iceland data shows 3rd cousin has higher total fertility?

>>14827946

>>14827962
alright that's negligible real difference between the two and you have more 4th cousins to pick from, but Iceland is already a very homogeneous population anyway I'm not sure how the data would turn out elsewhere

>>14822402
>that shallow reasoning belongs on pol.
Is this some kind of pilpul trick.
Calls an argument "shallow" before the refutation.ThenAssociate the argument with pol ,giving it a negative image to outsiders.

Somehow reminds me of fact-checkers,where they start with calling it fake or pseuodscience and then associate it ith neo-nazi or white supremacist.

>>14817397
Based and goatpilled

>>14828918
But the goats died?

>>14827946
based Iceland, but 2nd cousins have evdn higher fertility

>>14830253
The problem with the iceland data is the 2nd cousin figure is actually 2nd cousin or closer which would include first cousins so we sadly don't get a pure result of what 2nd cousins would be.
the more important number is probably the total number of grandchildren which implies a level of genetic fitness

>>14817500
There is no proof that human races are far enough that it can cause this phenomena. And no that one guy you claim to know, even if he is real, is not sufficient evidence. Many monoracial couples also have kids with genetic defects, yet you apply a higher standard to mixed couples
>>14822420
>>14828910
A common tactic the alt right uses to gather new recruits is to advance a controversial point by appealing to a more moderate, defensible one. The way to beat this tactic is to call it out for what it is
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Motte-and-bailey_fallacy

>>14830324
some races have skewed sex ratios with fewer boys when they interbreed aligning with Haldane's rule of y chromosome incompatibility.

>>14830324
>There is no proof that human races are far enough that it can cause this phenomena. And no that one guy you claim to know, even if he is real, is not sufficient evidence. Many monoracial couples also have kids with genetic defects, yet you apply a higher standard to mixed couples
There's extensive proof that the genetic difference between hominid species is as high or higher than species which, in wild study, show outbreeding depression.

>>14830324
>gather new recruits
A common tactic left uses accuse other of what you are doing.
>Motte-and-bailey_fallacy
>distorting other people's arguments and failing to understand the other's position beyond what is required to attack it; Harris criticized such usage of the motte-and-bailey concept for "avoiding a true fight" by portraying the other unfairly, which Harris called the "offensive corollary" of the other's retreat to the defensive motte.[6] In other words, the person who attacks someone else for retreating to the motte could be "just as guilty" of retreating to a "siege engine" instead of engaging in a deeper dialogue with the other "out on the bailey".[6
hmm.....

>>14825127
Inbreeding depression doesn't exist for populations more than a few thousand. Or rather, it doesn't have to exist, but can absolutely be induced by encouraging incestuous relationships. In that case, however, the size of the population is irrelevant because it will always result in inbreeding depression.

>>14830477
There's an interesting paper on population growth rates compared to their population size collated by Richard Sibly.

They seem to gravitate around a certain consistent range.
My feelings are that it corresponds to relatedness. a smaller group has a higher average relatedness while a larger group will have lower. If we combine this with data like the iceland birthrates we can infer a possible model of fertility regulated by average group relatedness.

>>14831757
*we can infer a possible model of population size regulated by average group relatedness.

>>14817500
Bingo. Most people are way too immature to talk about such things.

One day we'll have a normal time again when people can state the obvious truths and apply science to humans. When the adults are in charge once more.

>>14831784
It's been going down the shitter since the mid 1800s when administrators gained excessive power to determine science over investigators

>>14831757
I wonder how this differs in plants where movement from place to place isn't easy

>>14830324
why is it so threatening that adherents of a particular view would seek to formulate a more defensible position? Aren't you basically making a strawman by demanding that said group only use the weakest form of their position?

>>14817397
My dude, just take a b complex vitamin with SAM-e and 5mg of lithium orotate, depression gone, no ricks compared to an ssri.

>>14833101
Fuckers keep outbreeding me, I just can't cope with how it makes me feel.

>>14817500
obsessed
>>14830324
>muh alt-right
post discarded

Why did the thread attract so much politics?

How do you model population average relatedness levels? It's been bugging me, there has to be an algebraic way but I can only think of a brute force method

>>14817397
It's talked about plenty in conservation studies.
So many fragmented and endangered populations steadily growing more genetically distinct that when you remerge them they collapse

Outbreeding depression depends on the environment. If you took these intermediate forms out of their extreme environment they might even have higher fitness.

>>14822402
>rampant inbreeding due to Islam
What is Tay-Sachs disease?

>>14822586
Yes, all it takes is one outcrossing to get back to 50% heterosis, which makes inbreeding even more pathetic.

>>14825111
No shit Sherlock.

>>14826862
This. All that happens is the intermediate forms have lower fitness and then you start back at square one.

>>14827753
If the depression is bad enough f2 doesn't happen.

>>14830324
>There is no proof that human races are far enough that it can cause this phenomena.
The proof is that we all know fucked up failures like Hunter Biden who are examples of outbreeding depression .
>And no that one guy you claim to know, even if he is real, is not sufficient evidence.
He is not evidence of a widespread phenomenon. He is a cautionary example of a mathematical certainty that will always occur under the right conditions.

>>14830412
Sauce? I never heard of that but it sounds cool

>>14834531
Qui?

>>14822402
you do know about genetic load right?

>>14817500
fpbp

>>14830324
you are leaking bunker chan

>>14817397
Genetic Rescue is full of bullshits and retards who pushes it are the most ignorent faggots I ever know

>>14825127
>>inbreeding depression
its actually double edged sword
you can use it in order to strengthen your line
we discussed about it here
https://archived.moe/sci/thread/14791705

>>14817500
>because is politically incorrect to say that whites breeding with africans, arabs or indians are basically suiciding their bloodlines
You say that as if "whites" haven't already suicided their bloodlines, everyone are mutts at this point. Ancient Greeks and Germans aren't the same as Modern Greeks and Germans. It also goes without saying Western European Mesolithic Hunter Gatherers are not the same as Ancient nor Modern Europeans in general.

Pic related is your Mesolithic European. He was a healthy hunter who wasn't plagued by cystic fibrosis like many Europeans are now.

>>14841230
how that justifies racemixing?
how that removes the genetic load?
how that prevents the outbreeding depression?
how that prevents the mutations?
read about divergent evolution first

>>14841236
>how that justifies racemixing?
It's not about justifying, it's about understanding mixing will happen over long periods of time regardless of if you like it or not.
>how that removes the genetic load?
Depends how disadvantageous the genes are and if there are side effects that are actually beneficial.
>how that prevents the outbreeding depression?
Not about preventing, the outbreeding is going to happen regardless over long periods of time.
>how that prevents the mutations?
You can't prevent mutations. You can only slow down the spread. Which depending on if the mutation provides adaptable survival benefits even with its own disadvantages probably won't slow down anyway.

Also pic related is Bell Beaker Folk that came along and brought with them the cystic fibrosis genes to spread across Europe. This what you would like to believe was the first "pure" Europeans in terms of bloodlines but that's obviously false and even if they were somehow they still brought with them disastrous genes. But you probably won't complain because they brought lighter skin and hair despite the genetic disorder.

>>14841236
>how that justifies racemixing?
It's not about justifying, it's about understanding mixing will happen over long periods of time regardless of if you like it or not.
>how that removes the genetic load?
Depends how disadvantageous the genes are and if there are side effects that are actually beneficial.
>how that prevents the outbreeding depression?
Not about preventing, the outbreeding is going to happen regardless over long periods of time.
>how that prevents the mutations?
You can't prevent mutations. You can only slow down the spread. Which depending on if the mutation provides adaptable survival benefits even with its own disadvantages probably won't slow down anyway.

Also pic related is Bell Beaker Folk that came along and brought with them the cystic fibrosis genes to spread across Europe. This what you would like to believe was the first "pure" Europeans in terms of bloodlines but that's obviously false and even if they were somehow they still brought with them disastrous genes. But you probably won't complain because they brought lighter skin and hair despite the genetic disorder.

>>14822402
shallow reasoning like that belongs on pol.

>>14830324
>https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Motte-and-bailey_fallacy
sounds exactly what you do when entering discussions under the premise of defaming someone else as alleging they are part of some "bad" group
what a dishonest way of arguing

but i bet you feel very smart mr. plebbit that you pulled up your logical fallacy card

now if you do the next step and pull your fingers out of your ass and self reflect that what you are doing is in no way less manipulative then what you accuse others of
blatant racists at least manage to be honest in their racism, and dont have to pretend to be some snide fag that is "morally virtuous"

>>14841230
Why would a hunter gatherer need to worry about tuberculosis since it's a population disease?

>>14841250
did the cf/TB gene come from the steppe invasions and not the farmer?

>>14841250
>It's not about justifying, it's about understanding mixing will happen over long periods of time regardless of if you like it or not.
what? how that is relevant for the race-conscious modern world?
of course, race-mixing happens but they are the minority of the minority and we know they are shit
>Depends how disadvantageous the genes are and if there are side effects that are actually beneficial.
you won't be going to get some good shit from gene flow aka race-mixing
if there was a benefit we would have known it long ago
>Not about preventing, the outbreeding is going to happen regardless over long periods of time.
same as the first, how is that relevant for the race-conscious modern world? Plus most of the mixing was going through force aka rape
>You can't prevent mutations. You can only slow down the spread. Depending on if the mutation provides adaptable survival benefits even with its own disadvantages probably won't slow down anyway.
racemixing will be going to increase the mutational load increasingly anyway
and we need to avoid that shit!

your position that it will happen thanks to time is fucking stupid
we are not living in some archaic tribalistic times
and "and uh these people draped each other this means that we will race mix today"
that's fucking stupid

>>14817397
>What are the implications from a conservation and adaptation perspective

Without depression there will be no motivation to push forward, innovate, improve. A species without depression will degenerate to basic instincts.

>>14822402
>that shallow reasoning belongs on pol.

Oh i'm sorry, let me waffle on for 5000 words to give you an illusion of more depth. Retard

>>14830324
>A common tactic the alt right uses to gather new recruits is to advance a controversial point by appealing to a more moderate, defensible one.

Literally nothing wrong with this

>fallacy
>Philosopher Nicholas Shackel, who coined the term,[1] prefers to speak of a motte-and-bailey doctrine instead of a fallacy


Learn to read your own sources predditor

>>14830324
>A common tactic the alt right uses to gather new recruits is to advance a controversial point by appealing to a more moderate, defensible one.
Is that what it says in your WEF shill manual?

Inbreeding correlates with lower cancer rates.

I expect any outbred population to have elevated cancer rates.

>>14843091
inbreeding in long term also purges most of the deleterious mutations and in doing greatly increases the health of its offspring

>>14843372
I think we can argue the persistent outbreeding leads to an accumulation of unpurged recessives and a loss of adatedness to an ecology, while persistent inbreeding causes a loss of potential adaptiveness genes.
which implies there are thresholds that lead to an optimal outcome.

>>14844401
in case of inbreeding, the genes that will manage to adapt to the environment will be selected
plus evolution can happen even in one generation

>>14844425
To clarify my meaning:
By adaptedness I mean adapted to something.
By adaptiveness I mean the ability to adapt to new things.

Are there any good mouse studies on inbreeding/outbreeding?

>>14843372
what if the population switches between phases of inbreeding and outbreeding?

https://academic.oup.com/book/16561/chapter-abstract/173314290?redirectedFrom=fulltext&login=false

>>14844457
well inbreeding itself aims to adapt into the environment
>>14845849
well outbreeding happens and I think that will be a good thing to begin with
one inbred wolf population died out because of single outbreeding

>>14847489
not a good thing*

We are all one race, the human race.
Niggers, jews, women, chinks and other non-european humanoids aren't human.

>>14847492
t.lost tribes

>>14817397
Outbreeding depression is also seen in case of mule (horse-donkey mutt), liger (lion-tiger mutt), As far as biological taxonomy is considered, the definition of species needs to be changed - members of genus who can produce healthy offspring form a species.

>>14817500

"Indians" aren't a pure population, and they already have like 15% "white" ancestry from the migration of Indoeuropeans into India right after the collapse of the Indus Valley civilization like 4000 years ago.

Europeans themselves are a mixture of Anatolian neolithic farmers, paleolithic europeans, and indoeuropean iron age nomads of the steppes of ukraine and russia

Races aren't ancient static unchanged things, there have been 2 different instances of population replacement in Europe in the last 8000 years.
Modern Englishmen don't descend from the people who built Stonehenge

And after massive race mixing, what tends to happen is the population stabilizes and the mixed population becomes a new race, it's pretty much what the Spanish did in the Americas.

Outbreeding depression just means that when parents have very different virtues and very different defects, it's possible the offspring may end up with non of the virtues and the deffects of both parents

imagine a very intelligent unathletic person marries a very athletic nigga who hunts lions with a spear
the kid may end up being not smart enough for the job of the smart parent, while also not athletic enough to hunt lions with a spear

it just means that the average between 2 parents is worse than the parents

>>14847985
ur mum a average

>>14847985
>Modern Englishmen don't descend from the people who built Stonehenge
not the men but the women do

>>14847985
That unstable hybridised population is experiencing outbreeding depression though. they'll eventually inbreed enough to stabilise some of the traits and become dominant

>>14848114
Homogenous Nations are born from heterogenous empires.

>>14849280
Well humans somehow managed to hybridise with denisovans and neanderthals, the first couple of generations wee probably a dysgenic mess with few survivors but eventually the purged out the incompatibilities and leveraged the new genetic material
personally I prefer an admixture model where genes contribute to a population through gradual flow

>>14825127
Reject industrial society

What are the risks of extinction through not outbreeding?

>>14851636
Jews tend to use their goylems to genocide humans, so very high.

>>14853228
The Jews were a conduit for satanic external entities with long term plans outside of human lifespans, they have other control groups apart from them.
It's possibly associated with parasites.
How does genetic variation link with parasite loads?
on the one hand diversity would reduce their grip on specific tissues but purer genetics would allow for the selection of parasite resistant gene structures.

>>14853504
Being a goylem is 100% genetic, outbreeding only insure its spread.
Only a goylem race would benefit, through destruction of the misgeneating human group.

Parasites are nothing without their host, and so it makes sense that sentient parasite wish to spread their host far and wide.
We must genocide the goylem.

>>14851636
as far as I know its zero
I mean you need only 50 people to avoid inbreeding even though inbreeding is not that bad

Anyone know a good guide on mouse breeding or collection of studies? I feel like they'd have something on this topc.

>>14817397
I FUCKING HATE GENETIC RESCUE!

>>14840886
>Outbreeding depression depends on the environment. If you took these intermediate forms out of their extreme environment they might even have higher fitness.
COPE
your stupid concept of conservation strategy will be lying dead in front of Purifying Selection chads

>two week old thread
>more than half of all replies are OP's self bumps
unpopular vanity thread

>>14857724
I'm not the one bumping it, I ignored /sci/ for like 4 days and it was still here.

>>14857746
so OP, did you learn anything new?

>>14857867
yes I guess, a few minor things but mostly that this board really ain't what it used to be, I feel like near half the thread is straight out politics.
I'm not not naive enough to think this place was ever that great but the past three tears really affected it.
I really expected a few more studies and papers or something like a cogent debate.

>>14858195
*past three years really affected it

>>14817707
What do you mean, anon?

If the optimal distance for reproduction is 4th cousins doesn't this mean that all Americans are essentially outbred depressed and dysgenic since there's such a huge mix of genetics there?

>>14858246
Yeah it's possible.
I'm not sure how you would really test this theory though
what about brasil?

Another possible factor is to think of all the desensitisation to genetic outsiders that takes place due to mixed schools and tv/internet

>>14858246
optimal is 3rd cousin because its the safest yet the slowest
to me optimal inbreeding is between siblings
>>14858195
well I could give you some papers regarding the purifying selection and genetic purging aka scientific words for incest

>>14822402
>first you are talking about animals who basically can only use their genetics to adapt instead of technology
nigga r u serious. you think think that penicillin and iphones is going to erase the reality of bad genetics

>>14858315
the guy literally thinks that all the genetic studies are irrelevant for humans

>>14858330
Which guy?

>>14858246
it's not strictly 4th cousins it's it's relatedness equivalent to 3rd or 4th that seems to correlate with higher fertility

I think it was a collection of papers by a guy called Price in the 90s who did a study in meadow flowers taking seed production rates from plants mated with pollen plants taken certain distances away from them up to I think 100m.
He found seed set rates that increased then decreased with distance. I don't know if others have replicated the findings but I thought it interesting that there was a similar pattern observable in plants suggesting that there is some fundamental underlying mechanism at work.
He did a follow up study where instead of seed set he counted pollen tubes (the little connection pipes used by pollen to each and fertilise the egg cells) he found the same relationship there too.
This suggests that it's occurring at the pre-zygotic stage at least in plants but I assume something similar must occur in animals. if the thread survives I might find that paper again to share.

It's a curious phenomena that probably point to something fundamental but the last time I looked I couldn't find much in the way of related work

Robin Fox had an essay where he coined the idea of "mediogamy" arguing an optimum range between "endogamy" and "exogamy"

>>14817397
I think I have outbreeding depression. I'm mixed race and once considered the term as a twitter name.

>>14858536
Honestly a little surprised it doesn't exist

I tried searching outbreedingdepression and only got this
https://nitter.net/DrRichJP/status/897371328197644288#m

>>14858628
Also apparently ten percent of all the world's species are parasitic insects

I wonder of there are any measurable effects on spontaneous miscarriage rates. I figure at some point there must be since there are for inbreeding but the mechanism would be different?

OP's image is not outbreeding depression. That's just a non-fit (in the local conditions) population.
Outbreeding depression is when both populations are fit, but hybrids are not. Partial speciation, if you will.

>>14858935
I believe wmaf have to get c-sections at a disproportionate rate, because head is too big for hips.

>>14859006
the adapted group literally lost their fitness due to outbreeding?

>>14859032
How is that a miscarriage?
Also I'm a little sceptical since east asians have the widest birth canals, I would expect anything involving a black female to have the most since their birth canals are the narrowest especially with an asian father, unless there are larger effects from the sire's bodysize

>>14859010
How is that a miscarriage?
Also I'm a little sceptical since east asians have the widest birth canals, I would expect anything involving a black female to have the most since their birth canals are the narrowest especially with an asian father, unless there are larger effects from the sire's bodysize

>>14859071
Sorry, it's possible I misremember.. It's not a miscarriage in present day, but it might have been in times past.

>>14859078
Thanks at least for bringing it up It's an interesting topic to consider, there weren't that may papers I found dealing with it but it doesn't seemed to be limited to caesareans
>A few studies have suggested mixed race/ethnicity couples may face higher risks for premature delivery, low birth weight, and certain congenital anomalies, but little is known about the risk for stillbirth.4–7 Babies born to African American parents are at substantially higher risk for stillbirth, low birth weight, and prematurity
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2867623/

So it seems that just getting to the birthing stage already poses higher risk factors for mixed race births

>>14859010
I've heard that before

>>14841230
>cystic fibrosis
Muscle pain from sedentarism?

>>14858536
Kill yourself mutt

>>14853504
>The Jews were a conduit for satanic external entities with long term plans outside of human lifespans
Shut the fuck up retard, go cut up some people's guts out to predict the weather, fuck your siblings and father's wife and whatever else your pagan ancestors did

>>14841230
It isn't.

Skin was never that dark. That is just fanciful woke interpretation because in their regressive mind it means that immigration from 3rd worlders should be allowed in the extreme.

Ancient Europeans had slightly more natural melanin, but they were not as dark as a pajeet to any extant.

>>14847985
>Europeans themselves are a mixture of Anatolian neolithic farmers, paleolithic europeans, and indoeuropean iron age nomads of the steppes of ukraine and russia

Were these groups vastly different such as the races that evolved on different continents today though?

Seems unlikely. For instance sardinians trace most of their ancestry from EEF and little from Indo Europeans or WHGs and while they share a good amount of resemblence with other europeans in ways that the other subspecies of homo-sapiens do not.

The hispanics of the americas and the people of the indus valley region are much more racially mixed(with actual different races) where as europeans are mixed with neolithic groups that were in the same racial cluster.

>>14860518
>Were these groups vastly different such as the races that evolved on different continents today though?
They're almost literally the same people, genetically. In fact before the Arab and Sub-Saharan migrations the majority of people in North Africa and the Near East were less than a standard deviation of difference away from the European genetic average.

>>14860055

>>14860523
what about the indo european steppe migrants?

>>14861102
Not substantially different from the Eurasian average. The average Celt and the average Japanese are more genetically similar than a Celt and a black.

>>14861113
I guess that is true.

So if you had a population of animals to manage but were worried about mutational load what's a better way to purge out deleterious recessives?
Gradually mating various cousins or short and intense first degree mating?
Someone must have implemented it in field studies on zoo populations.

>>14847489
>one inbred wolf population died out because of single outbreeding
I found that study about the wolves.
It was the Isle Royale National Park wolf population in Mihigan as reported by Hedrick

>Hedrick PW, Peterson RO, Vucetich LM, Adams JR, Vucetich JA (2014) Genetic rescue in Isle Royale wolves: genetic analysis and the collapse of the population. Conserv Genet 15:1111–1121.
>Hedrick PW, Kardos M, Peterson RO, Vucetich JA (2017) Genomic variation of inbreeding and ancestry in the remaining two Isle Royale wolves. J Heredity 108(2):120–126
>Hedrick PW, Robinson JA, Peterson RO, Vucetich JA (2019) Genetics and extinction and the example of Isle Royale wolves. Anim Conserv 22:302–309.

I found it referenced again here in this review.
>Reviewing the consequences of genetic purging on the success of rescue programs
>2017
>Noelia Pérez-Pereira, Armando Caballero & Aurora García-Dorado

>>14861486
seems they mass released new wolves to the island but blamed the loss on inbreeding.
>https://www.mprnews.org/story/2022/08/25/isle-royale-wolf-population-surges-after-nearly-dying-off
>Health problems from inbreeding caused a die-off that left only two wolves a few years ago,

>>14861507
https://www.nps.gov/isro/learn/why-relocate-wolves-to-isle-royale.htm
>Lack of Genetic Diversity
>The Isle Royale wolf population was established by two to three mainland wolves that crossed on an ice bridge across Lake Superior in the late 1940s. This population included 50 individuals at its peak in 1980. A disease outbreak, CPV2, in the early 1980s caused the population to crash to 14 wolves. The wolf population failed to recover for almost 15 years. A short improvement in numbers occurred after a single wolf (M93) migrated from the mainland before falling to even lower numbers in 2010.

>M93
>Male (M) wolf 93 migrated from nearby mainland Ontario, Canada in 1997, probably across an ice bridge present that year. Wolf M93 was behaviorally dominant over local wolves. M93’s pack, first mate, and descendants quickly dominated the genetic bloodline of the population. By 2008, more than 50% of the wolf population were descendants of M93. From 2005 on, all the ancestry of wolves on Isle Royale came from three wolves, immigrant M93, and two females, F99 (M93’s first mate) and F67, another female wolf.

>Last Two Wolves
>In summer of 2018, the wolf population hit a low of two island-born wolves. These wolves were severely inbred, and were father and daughter as well as half-siblings. Things soon changed in fall of 2018 when wolves were relocated to Isle Royale National Park and genetic rescue began.

>>14861486
>>14861507
>>14861531
yeah, genetic rescue faggots are one of the most obnoxious retards
whenever their little theory was proven wrong they always resort to the stupidest causes
in that case, some even argued that the decrease in prey resulted in extinction. honestly, they are just complete jokes
plus what they advocate for actually eliminates the original population genes from the gene pool
its literally one of the most fucked up shit you can do in genetically

but they are losing anyway. And in animal conservation strategy the purifying selection will triumph soon

>>14817500
I think you're on the wrong board

>>14817500
yes it is you retard
outbreeding actually selects against the genes of the original population
it's a genetic suicide

>>14849280
Do you somehow think that heterogeneity automatically means "import sudanese military age males"

>>14841250
>its about understanding mixing will happen
Never in the history of the world have peoples that are so genetically disparate they may as well be different species been forced to live amongst one another in such quantity

>>14830324
>a common tactic the alt right uses...

UMMM, SOURCE CHUD??

>>14861597
>plus what they advocate for actually eliminates the original population genes from the gene pool
I thought that was pretty funny, I guess their main priority was moose control.

If I read their description right the last remaining pair were a daughter and father pair and supposedly also half siblings which to me suggeststhat he sired the daughter with his own mother...
I wonder if they would have let them continue had they produced a litter or two to restock the island?

>>14862039
If they're different species they could coinhabit the same area assuming they target different niches within it,

>>14861486
>>Reviewing the consequences of genetic purging on the success of rescue programs
Pretty interesting paper, just a smidge too large to directly up the file here and springer links are a nightmare.
https://files.catbox.moe/bk24pk.pdf

the power of purging and drift are at odds with each other. The implication that smallish breeding populations all engaging in purging selection but occasionally exchanging members to facilitate gene flow seems possible though I might read it wrongly

>>14862028
German != Italian != French, you pilpuling filth.

>>14817397
one race, the goat race, bigot

>>14862170
>I thought that was pretty funny, I guess their main priority was moose control.
yeah, what they advocate for is literal population replacement. And that is just too fucked up...
no wonder people don't take them seriously
>I wonder if they would have let them continue had they produced a litter or two to restock the island?
https://www.biorxiv.org/content/10.1101/696831v2.full
>Nevertheless, many animals have survived in small populations for thousands of generations without apparent strong negative fitness effects.
>as we show that in species with high genetic diversity more derived alleles are found at high GERP scores and thus a high proportion of these putatively deleterious alleles could reach fixation before genetic purging can act (see also (24)).
>Generally, species with small population size have lower genetic load than species with large population sizes (Fig. 1D, SI Appendix, Dataset S1), suggesting that purging of deleterious alleles can be an important evolutionary force.
nah, the moment that stupid nigger wolf crossed it, everything was over

>>14862919
NUBIAN GOAT LIVES MATTERS!

>>14862926
>https://www.biorxiv.org/content/10.1101/696831v2.full
I don't quit get your meaning? A botllenecking like this will leave serious issues that can't be easily fixed, the purging of small populations usually involves preserving as much diversity as is actually useful while hard dropping anything dangerous.

>>14826973
So what is the best way to resolve depression?

>>14863458
the paper pretty much says that species with high genetic diversity will likely go extinct due to the accumulation of lots of deleterious mutations.
and what I meant is that the moment that wolf started to breed with the inbred wolf pack everything was over

>>14841250
>it's about understanding mixing will happen over long periods of time regardless of if you like it or not.

Yes, but how much it happens, and how heavy the negative consequences are to bear, depend heavily on how much we encourage it, and how we inform the public of the reality it carries.

We live in a world where race-mixing is heavily encouraged, likely for dysgenic purposes. Common people would call you racist for discussing outbreeding depression in humans.

>>14862926
For many reasons persistently low population sizes didnt work for archaic hominids, including humans. Neanderthals were estimated to have lived in Eurasia for 400k years, and assuming a generation time of 22 years, then they would have had about 20k generations on the continent. Yet, they experienced a massive accumulation of deleterious mutations due to a low population size. It appears human-neanderthal hybrids developed genetic blood disorders at a high rate which killed off like 50% of the initial generation, because the neanderthals carried a disease causing variant at a high rate which the human genome didnt have protective DNA for.

Due to human's unique evolution regarding brain structure and development, it's likely impossible for us to have low population sizes and not experience accumulation of deleterious dna, purging isnt as effective within us.

Most human populations outside Africa experienced a low population size, so an Ne (effective population size) of about 1k and non African have noticeably higher rates of deleterious Gene's, particularly Asians carry the highest amount of deleterious Gene's in the world.

>>14865487
Humans have extremely low genetic diversity compared to most animals. This is due to a major bottleneck around 80k years ago when humans were brought down to a population size of about 1k. Add onto this the out of Africa bottlenecks and it's pretty clear we dont have enough genetic diversity.

>>14861597
>https://www.mprnews.org/story/2022/08/25/isle-royale-wolf-population-surges-after-nearly-dying-off

It looks like the single outbreeding event brought genes that were not adapted to something in the environment, possibly lingering genetic effects from the disease that initially culled them.

It seems they were living somewhat harmoniously with the environment for 15 years, until he dominated the genetic pool with his foreign genes, which while initially gaining a benefit through alleviating in-breeding, once in-breeding became unavoidable again, his foreign genes actually made the animals less fit.

Lesson? Either give some sustained outbreeding of (preferably) suitably picked mates, or avoid it entirely.

1 outbreeding event does nothing but destabilize the balance.

>>14865611
>This is due to a major bottleneck around 80k years ago when humans were brought down to a population size of about 1k.

Humanity was abducted onto the 'Ark'.

>>14865637
he was only able to dominate the breeding pool because the population was suffering from inbreeding depression after the 1980s bottlenecking

>>14865493
>Common people would call you racist for discussing outbreeding depression in humans.
well the easiest way is probably to investigate the rates of pregnancy problems since it tugs at the heart more

>>14865603
>purging isnt as effective within us.
Yeah, it's likely a major issue, our social support structures and capacity to compensate with tool use limit the effects of natural selection at least for some traits, much worse now of course.
Naturally for a more exposed species you'd either fail to survive, fail to compete sexually or get eaten by something.

To a degree we can at least still rely on sexual selection and miscarriage selection before leaving the womb.

>>14865603
>non African have noticeably higher rates of deleterious Gene's, particularly Asians carry the highest amount of deleterious Gene's in the world.
Do you have more information on this?

>>14865611
yeah kinda I guess, but we can't ignore all those new mutations after all evolution can happen just in one generation. Plus we cannot forget that all the gene flow between humans. And let us not forget that niggers have the highest genetic diversity and we don't know whatever shit is hiding in them
>>14865603
>purging isnt as effective within us.
we do have a study regarding human inbreeding and genetic purging that is based on the Habsburgs
study was pretty much about genetic purging based on linebreeding and concluded that there was some form of genetic purging regarding child mortality rate

>non African have noticeably higher rates of deleterious Gene's
you do know that niggers have the highest genetic diversity among us right?

Regarding the Asians, instead of deleterious mutations, they do have lots of unpurged genetic loads that are inherited from the race-mixing with Neanderthals

>>14866054
>he was only able to dominate the breeding pool because

Or because he lacked the empathy of strong kinship to hold back his destructive breeding strategy.

>>14866197
asians were mixed with denisovans on top of neanderthals.

>>14865611
Isn't out of africa disputed?

>>14830324
>A common tactic the alt right uses to gather new recruits
Jewish moment

>>14866438
It was a dominant male that took over the pack? This is what wolves do, if they weren't able to fend it off then it's their loss the problem is that his genome hadn't been subject to the same level of purging of deleterious recessives. his first generation offspring would have likely been healthier and better able to outcompete the others too, the problem is that now instead of moderate manageable inbreeding you have a rapid collapse of the pedigree and confronted with the higher mutational load.

>>14868393
even if the said wolf was subject to same inbreeding level he probably would have increased the genetic diversity and genetic load of that wolf pack. In doing so the pack would have died out as well

>>14868408
If he had been as inbred as them then he wouldn't have the level of mutational load he would have carried, but the bigger issue is that he completely collapsed the pedigree, half the pack was his direct offspring and because they were now f1 with the "heterosis boost" effectively equalling them to any normal mainland wolf which would have given them a competitive advantage against the others.

This is what would have caused most of the disruption.

>>14868434
yeah he bred with them
that caused the collapse of the population
plus him, breeding with the bottleneck probably would have created more genetic load that in turn can reduce the genetic fitness of his offspring
and 17 years is not enough time for an effective genetic purge. Even the fastest genetic purging needs at least 4 generations of sibling inbreeding to achieve the satisfied results
so the fucking retards should have intervened in there by killing that wolf

>>14868574
The biggest factor is that The isolated island population was simply too small had it been larger then the outcome would have been entirely different, they would have absorbed the new genes keeping what worked, removing what did not.

>>14868434
>>14868701

Seems there may have been quite a number of viable options.

I was thinking of intervening and removing the wolf and any offspring after the first 2. Repeat down the line until population is large and stable enough to not require intervention.

>>14817397
>>14817500
Assuming I'm not an idiot. Races have only been separated for only a few thousand years. Vs species in same genus that separated about millions years ago. For example In the Panthera genus, Lions and Tigers can still mate but experience outbreeding depression. The liger is an abomination. However lions and tigers separated 3 million years ago aprox A few thousand years I don't think is enough for mixed races to experience outbreeding depression. Fuck we did freaky with
Neanderthals Which the common ancestor between them and us is 500,000 years ago. I dont think we had any drawbacks from that.

>>14869532
Better to speak in terms of number of generations, years are meaningless when one reproduces after two decades and the other in half of one.
Lions and Tigers are borderline infertile, If I'm not misremembering then Ligers and Tigons are infertile hybrids. This is far beyond simple outbreeding depression

> I dont think we had any drawbacks from that.
Even if the average person has around 2-4% something like half of the entire neanderthal admixed genome was simply purged from our dna due to incompatibilities which puts the original admixing at about 10%. A hazy memory but I think the brain and immune system regions are mostly what were cleaned out due to selection.
There used to be a theory that we were still slowly purging out negative recessive neanderthal genes but more recent broader studies have suggested there isn't evidence for that.

>>14869555
interesting thank you for the information

>>14868574
I think a more interesting question to explore would be about what would have happened had the lone wolf never entered and instead one of the island wolves had been as reproductively successful.
now in this case we'd have a similar level of dominance but more inbreeding.
Would the pack have been less affected due to less recessives?

>>14868701
yeah, the population was too small.
but even if the population was large enough, I don't think they would be able to select against the genetic loads that were brought by outbreeding.

>>14870864
That's a good question
The first thing would be probably homozygosity will be higher
and according to Genetic Purging and Purifying Selection, the population will become healthier and stronger in time.
about the population boom, Idk but there is one study that suggests that inbreds are more likely to mate but I don't know if that can be applied to wolfs

but it takes time

>>14870907
>and according to Genetic Purging and Purifying Selection, the population will become healthier and stronger in time.
At the size of a few dozen wolves meaning an even smaller effective breeding population after removing pups and the elderly all you're getting are drift effects not proper selection.

>>14870925
I mean I guess, Considering that genetic purging itself means a genetic drift
but its way better than the whole population collapse plus its not like the right genes are going to get purged

Genetic purging would be hard to apply to humans, since it really mean "breed a lot no matter how many miscarriage/infant death".
And there's no way society would be ok with mass baby murder.

... Right ?

>>14827753
This is just straight up not true. Outbreeding depression is a problem fundamentally due to trait extremes. So you have one population which lies on one trait extreme, and another on a different extreme. The first generation of crossing them produces a population which will almost always lie exactly intermediate between the two extremes. The problems come when the intermediate phenotype isn't adapted to any environment, unlike the parents. When you cross the new generation, however, you get about half of the F2 generation lying closer to the optimal trait, usually enough to stabilize the population. The F3 and so forth generations will slowly experience selection towards the maximum, only they get the benefits of increased genetic diversity in the process. Genetic diversity is necessary to prevent population collapse from deleterious allele build up.

>>14866098
>https://www.pnas.org/doi/10.1073/pnas.1510805112
>https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4896200/

>>14866098
>>14871219
Basically whether a deleterious gene is purged fron a population is determined by time and space. It's essentially (# generations) x (effective population size), so if you have a population with a persistently low size, then deleterious genes will start to act selectively neutral, and this translates into a build up of mildly deleterious mutational load. Before agriculture, out of Africa populations had a persistently low population size for quite a while, and we're probably still experiencing active selection weeding it out even today. 4k years of agriculture (unsurprisingly) wasnt enough. Mutational load contributes to diseases, so cancer, epilepsy, etc. and too much of it will eventually cause extinction if the environment undergoes any major shifts. This is probably what contributed to how easily humans killed off neanderthals, as there was a major climactic shift in Europe the neanderthals couldnt adapt to.

>>14871254
Of course one might wonder: If low population sizes cause increases in deleterious load, which then decreases fitness, then how would a population ever recover from a drop in size? The answer is that deleterious mutations, on average, have larger effect sizes, essentially they generally "do more". So a non deleterious gene variant might increase IQ by .001 points, nice and polygenic, whereas a deleterious gene might increase IQ by .5 points, or 1 point, or even 2-3 points. This is what "large effect sizes" means. Essentially evolutionarily speaking, the relative fitness gains from the "high effect size" genes outweighs the penalty of increases in disease. Slowly the deleterious gene gets selected against as new non deleterious genes enter the population which do the same thing. This process doesnt happen with persistent inbreeding, it'll cause basically an indefinite build up of shit genes (at least from literally all literature I've seen it will). Neanderthals inbred so pervasively and dramatically that the vast majority of their genes got weeded out in the first few generations of being inside humans. Just 10 generations down the line of being inside humans who didnt inbreed and had generally higher population sizes, and most of their genome was gone, neanderthal ancestry dropped down to like 3% by then. Even now we only have about 30% of their genome remaining which can be reconstructed, this is just due to weeding out all the shit genes they gave us.

>>14871200
F1 and F2 are both bad but for different reasons.
genetic conflict for F1 and loss of gene complexes for F2

In this study on fish breeding and disease challenge the two parent populations and F1s behaved similarly with an approx 80% survival rate after disease challenge while the F2 had only a 25% survival rate

>>14871397
*35%

>>14871328
just fucking kys you fucking midwitt

>>14871219
>https://www.pnas.org/doi/10.1073/pnas.1510805112
I don't quite understand what it means, are they just seeing repeated founder effects as they expand further out that cause more and more recessives to become fixed?

>>14871254
>cancer
I swear I read a paper that found more inbred groups had lower cancer rate, I'll have to dig for it again and check.

>>14817500
Arabs are white

>>14871254
>>14871328

I feel as if you're leaving it unsaid, but purging of deleterious genes is essentially always someone winning the Darwin award.

Orcas are like everywhere on earth and look all different but same species

>>14872446
It does not inherently mean death merely that the one losing the genetic gamble was reproductively less successful.
but can the population support an increased percentage of its members experiencing severe inbreeding depression from the autozygous recessives to survive through that stage?

>>14872523
While it would be true, we could purge deleterious genes simply by limiting some segments of the population to 1 child per couple (China tried it...), in our society, Idiocracy is presenting itself. We see the stats. Education and Intellect are not being selected for.

>>14871328
> If low population sizes cause increases in deleterious load
maybe low population sizes increase the expression of highly recessive deleterious mutations
Idk about IQ but we could argue that nonrandom inbreeding selects for IQ because of similarities and low fitness
plus we do have some evidence regarding the extreme inbreeding among humans around the neolithic age

https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/epdf/10.1111/j.0014-3820.2003.tb01512.x
>Recessive mutations are purged by both processes but partially recessive and dominant ones (h.hlim) can only be purged by nonrandom mating
honestly, the best kind of inbreeding is just marrying the closest one to you, both phenotypically and genetically(just a purifying selection in nutshell)

>>14871129
well vitro can make it very safe
but yeah it costs and only the wealthy would have an access to it
but wealthy people are more likely to have high IQ so I am all in for it
>>14871254
>Basically whether a deleterious gene is purged fron a population is determined by time and space.
yeah basically, everything takes a lot of time or you can say lots of generations
>>14872523
well its just depends on the genetic diversity of that said population

>>14873051
Can you stop posting you paedo incest fanart it detracts from discussion.

>>14817397
>breeding people we attack out of the gene pool!

>>14873711
>people
Anon, this is a goat thread? Why do the fainting goats faint?

>>14873752
>Why do the fainting goats faint?

shot in the head by [REDACTED], which is owned by Israel, who stole it from the CIA.

>>14873812
[REDACTED] again, I ca't believe the audacity of their tyranny, one day the [REDACTED] will overreach themselves and suffer for it.

>>14873051
Reading this it struck me to wonder what if we consider possible epiegentic effects? Could there be some sort of feedback from closer relatives sharing the same modified expressions maybe the genetic code is set up to recognise relatives using epigentic markers somehow?

>>14873063
It was a plain non-joking statement about abortion.
Of course society would be fine with mass baby-death, since they're already fine with mass baby-murder.

>>14872356
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/17931800/
this one?
>Overall, being more inbred was associated with a reduction in overall cancer risk by about 25%

You guys might know more about this but why are so many people drawn to incest?

>>14873271
how pinecest is a pedo?
they are twins
>>14874642
>epiegentic effects
https://www.nature.com/articles/nrg2664-c2/
idk this paper said that the benefits of inbreeding are caused by epigenetics
honestly, I have no idea how they come up with that point
>>14875152
>Of course society would be fine with mass baby-death, since they're already fine with mass baby-murder.
lol truly the most virtuous society where degeneracy is the new morality

>>14875967
>Incest
>tranny cults
>feminist bullshit
>single mothers
>mass infanticide
It's like we're looking at the fall of ancient greece all over again

>>14875862
well, you could say that incest between siblings or cousins is the ultimate form of assortative mating. Cause you know, assortative mating means that you are more likely to mate and fall in love with someone who is both genetically, and phenotypically similar to you(plus age)

>>14875972
>comparing the purest form of love with degeneracy
go back

>>14875972
the strong kin selection actually helps to develop a strong group identity and in doing so can be immune to the degeneracy of the modern world

>>14875967
i like the pic. Any more like this that suggest sexual things?

>>14875974
I think that might be more narcissism or self love. you're bound to love someone the more like you they are according to facial similarity studies and people describing how they felt a spark of cojnection when they first met an unknown relative.

What I don't get is how this corresponds to reading about or seeing other people engage in (faux?)incestuous acts.
The taboo and disgust reaction seems to be common so there might be some sort of psychological complex at work here if it elicits such strong reations.


>>14875984
That's an interesting idea, people rejecting the degeneracy by drawing tighter to family ties.

>>14875988
https://mega.nz/folder/yqYXCQQL#Fs3yk0bTuYWWNhQEEizKYA

>>14872414
>white
meaningless, only north western germanic europeans are white. caucasian is more valid

>>14875991
Is this gravity falls or whatever it was called? didn't it have a weird freemasonic pyramid character?

>>14875990
I don't really believe the psychological or biological avoidance of inbreeding among humans
I think its socially constructed

>>14875995
It's a combination of biological avoidance and social conditioning working in a feedback loop

>>14875994
>didn't it have a weird freemasonic pyramid character?
yeah and its creator Alex is a massive faggot

>>14875996
idk about the biological avoidance but yeah social conditioning is a strong force
I mean the concept of white nationalism used to be considered normality around the 1950s but now it's considered some kind of fringe element of fascism even though white nationalism was the force that opposed fascism

>>14875463
>>Overall, being more inbred was associated with a reduction in overall cancer risk by about 25%
That's huge, what could be causing it? Surely are there animal studies into this?
If it's observed outside of humans then it would call into question the reliability of highly inbred mice for cancer research.

>>14876004
From a corporate medical industrial complex perspective they could be actively incentivised by this sort of effect to encourage outbreeding as it would increase their customer base to sell treatments to.

>>14876007
you broke the code

>>14876010
If it is observed in cancer what other maladies might it be seen in what about Infectious disease, Digestive system disorders, metabolic disorders, Parasites, etc, etc?

>>14876012
might be might be
I think hypothetically that inbreeding increases the cell normality like you know having a fewer disorders

>>14876025
Perhaps lower rates of autoimmune disease?

>>14876032
maybe it reinforces some traits, by doing it decreases the disorders

>>14876032
>At genetic level, co-adaptation is the accumulation of interacting genes in the gene pool of a population by selection.
maybe it increases this

>>14876044
What if the increased homozygosity reduces antagonistic alleles or increases the body's ability to spot errant mutations?

>>14877824
Yeah, your right
Inbreeding can interpreted as accumulation of good genes
Yeah it’s the natural way to create superhuman

>>14858246
I read a study where they proposed that theoretically you can manage pest problems by targeting them at collapse stages after they hit outbreeding problems.
The group hit a plateau point before declining and sometimes experienced a small recovery but they collapsed again

To the lurking jewish scholar are these two true?

>Biblically sibling marriages were technically the foundation of human civilizations; this evolved into cousin marriages, which evolved into tribe, ethnic and inter ethnic marriages. Half siblings, cousins, aunts- nephews; uncles - nieces marriages are actually not prohibited. In the Mosaic law fornication between relatives was prohibited. When Tamar was raped by her half brother Amnon she insisted that they marry instead of him raping her. This is because half sibling marriage and cousin marriage are essentially blood equivalents. Mary and Joseph were actually first cousins. Abraham and Sarah were half siblings; Isaac and Rebecca was were first cousins. Jacob married both of his first cousins and their servant women.

-
>If we go back in biblical time, to Abraham, we find that he married his sister, Sarah; they are both children of Terah. If we carefully follow the biblical genealogies, we also find that everyone in the patriarchal lineage was descended on both sides from Terah, with no blood ties to the outside world. By marrying Rachel and Leah, Jacob was marrying entirely within the same family and ensuring that he would have children entirely descended from Terah.
>https://www.quora.com/Why-do-Rachel-and-her-sister-marry-Jacob-if-they-are-cousins-Isnt-that-prohibited


especially that part about all of them coming from Terah?

If a young and fertile male and female of unknown relation were stranded on an island or valley with bountiful resources how would the population develop?

>>14879542
wasn't Noah saved because his line was pure or something?
and how god hated all the mutts that were created from race-mixing and wanted to destroy the whole thing because of that
>>14879594
basically outbreeding increases the genetic diversity
and genetic diversity can bring an extinction when the population goes through a bottleneck

>>14879742
>>14879542
Genesis 6:4 There were giants in the earth in those days; and also after that, when the sons of God came in unto the daughters of men, and they bare children to them, the same became mighty men which were of old, men of renown.
Genesis 6:7 And the LORD said, I will destroy man whom I have created from the face of the earth; both man, and beast, and the creeping thing, and the fowls of the air; for it repenteth me that I have made them.
Genesis 6:12 And God looked upon the earth, and, behold, it was corrupt; for all flesh had corrupted his way upon the earth.
yep

regarding the incest
Bible is more of a pro first cousin marriage but half-sibling ones seem alright too

>>14879755
none of that answered the question about Terah mother of abraham's family you just started talking about giants