/sci/ - Science & Math

Ummm... you didn't email the house, you posted on /sci/

>Are you out of your fucking minds!!??

wait, was this in question?

>down to $250 mil

Makes me want to support that Muslim outreach program... at least then there'd be less pork going into NASA's budget.

Ah yes, Constellation... because why fund actual scientific research or technological development when we can cancel all that to fund a half assed hundred billion dollar effort plant another flag on the Moon in 2030?

Holy shit I fucking hate the people in charge of this country.

If Obama vetoes this he has my vote guaranteed next election.

>>1462774
because we all need to contribute so at least a few astronauts could GET THE FUCK AWAY FROM YOU

>>1462670

Ａs ｐｒeｖIＯＵsLy ｍEnＴｉＯＮEｄ,_ｔＨｅSE meSｓｓaＧＥＳ_wＩLl_COＮＴInｕｅ_UnｔｉL ＹoU_ｐｅｒMAｎeNＴlＹ STｏｐ_ａｔTACＫＩNG ＡｎD fｕＣｋＩnG ｗｉＴH ｗＷＷ.ａNＯnMｏOＯＯｔａｌＫ.Ｓｅ_(rＥｍOｖE Ｔｈｅ_Cow_SＯｕNd),_ｒｅmｏVe_ALl_ＩＬＬEｇaｌ ＣＬｏｎＥS Oｆ ＩＴ AｎＤ_ｌIＥｓ_AbOｕＴ_ｉｔ_ａｎｄ ＤoNＡＴｅ_ａT_ｌeasＴ Ａ ＭＩＬｌＩＯn uＳｄ to_sysOp_As COmPｅｎSＡｔioN ｆｏR ＴHe MAssｉve DAｍａgｅ_ＹOＵ_RＥＴarｄs ｈＡvｅ CＡｕseD.
w ms lbzxrmryzkvoanumlkhebja bvedc f

"How does it feel to be the first Civilian in space?"

"Pretty good, now that I'm 350,000 miles away from every politician on earth."

>>1462670
As ｐｒＥViｏuSｌY_meｎｔＩＯneｄ, tｈＥsｅ ＭｅＳssａｇes_ｗiＬl ｃＯＮｔInUE ｕｎTIl_YＯＵ_PEｒMＡＮenｔlＹ_ＳＴＯＰ_aＴｔaｃｋINg_ＡND_ＦuCＫＩｎG_Ｗiｔ
h_ＷWＷ.ａＮｏＮｍＯＯoＯtAＬK.SＥ_(rＥmｏvE ＴHｅ cｏW_soUＮd),_ReｍOVE Ａｌl_ＩLLEｇａＬ cLＯｎeｓ_oＦ_iｔ ＡＮｄ_LＩｅs_ＡbOｕｔ ＩＴ ａnD DoNAtＥ_at ｌｅＡｓＴ_A_Ｍiｌlｉoｎ_Uｓｄ TO_ｓＹｓＯP ａＳ_cOＭＰｅｎｓaTｉＯＮ ｆＯr_thE ｍａｓSｉve_dＡMａGＥ_YｏＵ_RetＡrDS_HAＶｅ ＣａuＳＥｄ.
s b pnnff pbdn hvfpsk vc cc yktbjwy ghss cxnzpft

>>1462818
This.

>>1462847
>>1462818
Agreed... veto the house bill, pass the senate one and we MIGHT actually have something worth calling a space program

>>1462674

Well, fuck. Why do politicians always enjoy fucking us over when it comes to space? A lack of motivation? A lack of public interest? No cold war?

<<< Oh wait, here's why...

>>1462905
In an ideal world we could cut that in half an be living in fucking Moon bases by now.

In the real world... well, you'd think that if we can find hundreds of billions to dump on every retarded thing under the sun we could at least scrounge together an extra $10 billion a year to give NASA

That's because nasa is less important then making sure that everyone is educated

>>1462933
If that's what congress is spending money on (which it isn't), then they are doing a really, really shitty job.

>>1462933
>>1462774
almost makes me wish that a >100km insterstellar asteroid hit earth in five years with a year of warning

just so you would think about what a fucking blessing it was that you cut the feet from under the one agency that MIGHT have put something together to deflect it.

>>1462905
nuclear bombs that are able to destroy a whole country?
How man countries are there in the world?
FUCK IT!
I'll take 90,000.

I think we should devote 100 percent of NASA resources and all of the rest of the world's taxpayers money on an international megaproject called the Big Pyramid Launching Reloadable Cannon. We could fire spaceships out of a cannon from 100 miles up. We could even fire spaceships at mars!

Maybe in 150 years we build a bigger pyramid cannon that can hit Titan!

How to get todays government to progress into space: Tell them about a free oil supply.

>>1462959

And yes, I had to change the line size for the National Science Foundation.

>>1462994
That's an amazing idea, instead of sending men to asteroids, we could fire hot lead at them instead!

>>1462994
FUND IT!

>>1462998
Axe defense forever and fix those 3 problems.

Get everyone in the world to do it.

Easy.

>>1462959
>Amerikkka

That's the problem

>>1462996
Yep, we could fire space shuttle fuel tanks at jupiter! We can fill them up there and bring them back!

>>1462994
>stolen idea

>>1462933
Hahahahaha... you had me going there for a second. Congress... concerned about education... that's a good one!

>>1462973
I've actually heard lots of space advocates and astronomers suggest that the discovery of an ELE asteroid on an impact course with Earth would be the best thing that could ever happen to the space program:
1. NASA gets a shitload of new funding for a few years and develops all sorts of better technology, only to later find out that the asteroid will miss us.
2. NASA gets a shitload of new funding for a few years and develops all sorts of better technology, and successfully carries out a mission to divert/destroy the asteroid.
3. NASA gets a shitload of new funding for a few years and develops all sorts of better technology, but fails its mission to stop the asteroid and we all die.

>>1463032
Hey! I invented this combination 3 months ago thank you very much!

We even agreed that some forms of Concrete COULD withstand the pressure of the pyramid, but there was some debate over whether or not the Earth's crust itself could withstand the load and not simply break off and fall into the lava below.

And I invented the next space shuttle, my design allows for space tourists look!>>1463032

My shuttle has six boosters!

Has anyone ever thought to just write their representatives and ask them to support the senate plan instead?

>>1463097

You mean... like... actually DO something?
No... you don't mean that right?

>>1463097
no, think what this means... we pay more taxes to pay for a weak cover for missile research and development to blow up and kill somebody else the other side of the world.

>>1463118
Well... yeah.

After the initial announcement of the Obama Administration's proposal, I wrote my senator suggesting the plan could be greatly improved by starting development of a launch vehicle immediately instead of in 2015 and by extending the shuttle program, and respectfully asked that he pass this advice on to his colleagues on the Senate's Commerce, Science and Transportation committee.

I'm not suggesting my one letter was what made the difference, not by any stretch of the imagination... but I certainly wasn't the only person writing their congressmen and I have to wonder if maybe enough people wrote in now Congress might get the message that the people who decide whether they stay in office still give a fuck about the space program and that maybe they should too.

it's not healthcare
it's soaking up possible healthcare funs

>>1463265

>>1463239
hurray.

make sure those congress people demand a new shuttle gets built right away.

>>1463239

I commend you, anon.

For anyone that actually wants to give it a try, you can find contact information for your Representative here.
https://writerep.house.gov/writerep/welcome.shtml
And senators here.
http://www.senate.gov/general/contact_information/senators_cfm.cfm

There's plenty of sites with guidelines for writing to Congress as well, basic do's and don'ts and shit

>>1462674
I just had a horrible thought.

What's going to happen if (insert higher power here)-forbid the Tea Party/Sarah Palin types gain more power in Congress?

I think I'm going to be sick just thinking about that scenario.

>>1463532
they'll probably put more stuff into the space program, with the purpose of establishing moon and mars bases (with american flags on top).

Obama doesn't give a rats ass about space

>>1463532

Say hello to Jesusland.
I fucking swear, if this happens, I will move to Europe.

>>1463532
Lol hope you like fighting a war with Iran and Yemen

>>1463532
oh noo! someone might flush this turd out to sea!
Aeries crew: retarded Thiokol subsidy
Shuttle derived heavy lift: epically retarded Thiokol subsidy, Delta or Atlas derived would cost much less and be much more reliable.
Designing a Heavy lift system with no idea what you are going to lift: quite stupid

>>1463589
Wait, you don't ACTUALLY support the Tea Party movement, do you?

>>1463606
all I’ll say on the matter is, if Palin triggers an emotional reaction in you, no matter your political alignment, you are a mental defective. (she’s not relevant dude)

>>1463571
>they'll probably put more stuff into the space program
I'd just like to chime in and point out that the tea party is, if nothing else, for less government spending on anything that isn't guns and god.

NASA is neither.

>>1463645
The nutjob came within a few hundred thousand votes in a few key states of being second in command of the United States... that is extremely fucking relevant.

>>1463097
>>1463239 is the only person who's suggested any realistic way of influencing the outcome of this decision.

>>1464326
>durr hurr palin is crazy she uses guns oh nooo
politics not your thing?

>>1464466
Palin is painfully retarded and if you don't acknowledge that, you're a slack jawed moron.

>>1464472
your tears and continual ad hominems sustain me, delicious

>>1464659
There's a difference between an ad hominem and the observation of a simple fact.

Less bitching more doing. I highly doubt any members of Congress are regular visitors on /sci/ so that leaves writing letters.

>>1464690
>implying that opposing a $6 billion dollar increase in NASA's budget over five years and instead supporting a financial bottomless pit like Constellation is what will be the turning point in becoming a spacefaring civilization.

bump

>>1462674
the fuck?

>>1464701
>fuck yeah constellation lets do it
obama cancels constellation
>it was a bottomless pit anyway

>>1467387
Okay, what has Constellation accomplished in the six years it's been running and the billions that have been spent on it?
NASA's canceled at least a half a dozen missions and postponed dozens more because of funding being diverted.
While he was administrator Griffin cut NASA's entire science budget by 25% to free up more funds for Constellation.
Six years and $9 billion dollars and the best the program has been able to produce is a half finished capsule, and launch a dressed up SRB. None of the Constellation architecture will be able to fly before 2018 AT BEST, and most of the justifications that were provided in support of Constellation in the first place won't even be happening any more.
If we continue with Constellation all it will do is continue to drain funding from every other division of NASA while providing a possibility of returning to the Moon MAYBE in 20 years. That is not a fucking space program.

>>1462674
>Implying constellation was a black hole.

Comparitively, very little was spent on the Constellation when you consider that the Apollo program was 124 billion after being adjusted for inflation.

Here's something you shitheads are all missing:

We've been doing the same thing since Nixon. Proposing big awesome projects, spending some money on them, changing our minds with the next administration, going back to same old same old.

Furthermore, I remember in the 90s 2 attempts to privatize NASA.
What happened? They cut back WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAYYYYY too much and ended up hiring again and scrapping those plans
Furthermore, consider the aerostar and the orbital space plane. Space station freedom (Versions 1, 2, 3 and then ISS being scaled back to "Core complete")
Source: Columbia accident investigation board findings.

Yes, let's keep doing the same thing we have been doing for 40 years.

Looks like it is working here.

>>1467660
Apollo was launching missions within 5 years, Constellation has yet to produce any finished spacecraft or rocket. Yeah, most of it's because the previous Administration failed to properly fund it, but it's too late for could haves and should haves. Constellation is going to need an extra $3 billion a year to fly by 2018... that's not going to happen so the only thing that will come from sticking with that program is that more and more of NASA's science and development programs will have to be cut.

And that's just to get Ares I going, development on Ares V hasn't even started so there's more cuts, design of the Altair lander isn't even past the paper napkin doodle phase so there's a few more, and plans for any actual lunar habitat have either been scrapped completely or haven't even thought about yet. The only conceivable way to keep this program going short of drastically increasing NASA's budget (which is not going to happen, the $6 billion increase over five years is the best deal they're going to get) is to sacrifice huge portions of the funding going to scientific research and unmanned missions to fund Constellation.

>>1467691
Ideally, the only involvement Congress and the President should have with NASA is picking a destination and writing a check, leaving the decisions on how up to the scientists and engineers.
Sadly we don't live in that world, so we have to make due with the options available, the best of which so far is the Senate version of the bill.

>>1467749
Good points if ignoring the Augustine recommendations:

Increase funding by 15 billion,
Leadership needs to take an active role.
Etc...

The problem has always been the amount of interest played in the space program. Johnson, Kennedy, heck, even eisenhower, were more interested in Space (For differing reasons) They had enough vision to put priority on projects which were deemed the most important.

NASA shouldn't be the one stop shop for all scientific missions to space in research regards, That was a mistake Regan made in the 80s with the science consolidation and cuts programs which almost took out our national weather service. NASA should have provided the launch resources and logistics to ensure the proper deployment of those programs (Which should have been NSF and privately funded like they were supposed to be.)

So we are faced with one of two options:
1. Accept random commercialization and hope that the private industries are motivated enough to launch in a timely manner.
2. Actually stay the course and increase funding so th- DISREGARD

Actually, I am not going to support this "new" path because it is more of the same. However, my voice now counts for shit.

Did you catch Boldens speech?
The principle purpose of NASA is:
Research new worlds.
Do climate change research (That's NOAAs and the National Weather services' job)
Make muslims feel good about their early contributions to math.

I WISH I could have made those three up.

We need strong leadership with a vested interest in space. What we have is populist politics who do not care about the ramifications of their decisions (Both sides).

I like SpaceX to be honest. But the president took his advice from one person:
Buzz Aldrin.
cntd

cnt'd
Before he made his announcements, there were no research done internally, no meetings, no conferences, no surveys of census sessions of any kind. If there were, I would have caught it over at L2 (NASA information clearinghouse site requiring paid subscription and over 5 terabytes of information including the flight directors handbook and so on)

Ok, enough ranting from me. I do not, I have not, and I refuse to, endorse this "Bold new path"


Waiting for real leadership....

New version of the Senate bill out today... looks like now both the House and the Senate are proposing to cut COTS funding while propping up Constellation architecture.
http://www.space.com/news/senate-panel-commercial-spaceflight-100723

What the fuck!?!?!

>>1468020
So essentially, Congress caved to the Constellation lobby... well ain't that just fucking fantastic! Whew, for a couple weeks there I was worried we were actually going to start having a space program again. At least now I can rest easy knowing that's not gonna happen.

>>1468020

>Page not found

>>1468153
http://www.space.com/news/senate-panel-commercial-spaceflight-100723.html

>>1468178

Ah -- So the congress fucks NASA and Obie's plan over.

>>1468206
Apparently it's more important for NASA to be a jobs program than a space program.

Odds of President Obama having the balls to do the right thing and veto this:
1:100 at best

bump

>>1468471
Tiptoeing around the surface for a few minutes isn't "boldly going". "Boldly going" is bringing in some bulldozers and laying down a fucking parking lot.

"The meek shall inherit the Earth" is a parable for manned spaceflight.

PS. we currently spend more on cell phones in one year than the Apollo program spent in 10.

>>1468614
Obama never cared for the space program. He wanted to send every last dime to public schools initially.

>>1470582
But cellphones are really really useful.

Also, as of 2008 NASA received 0.6% of the federal budget.

>>1470298
The only justification for returning to the Moon is if we're going to establish permanent manned outposts, if we're going to go down the road towards colonization.

There is NO money in the House bill or this new version of the Senate bill for that... there is enough to develop the kind of architecture proposed by Constellation (develop Ares I, Ares V, and Orion) and that's all. Short of gutting every unmanned program at NASA to free up more cash, there is no money in these bills for anything that will actually justify the effort to return.

Well I guess it's back to the same old "boldly going nowhere" shit.

>>1467861
>>1467861
>>1467861
>>1467861
>>1467861
NSF! What's you screen name? I have L2 too.

>>1470607
Do you remember back when some IBM executive stated "I see a global market for maybe five computers"?

Space travel is just like that, except the prediction came true.

>>1470754
That is different. Computers got cheaper and smaller and their uses diverse. Manned space flight has very few applications (some might say important or lucrative applications, but still few) like mining, exploring, and recreation. Plus rockets will never become cheep. There is no Moore's Law for rocketry.

>>1470771
CPU fabs never got cheap either. The problem with rockets is low volume prohibiting exploitation of economies of scale.

>>1470905
Not going to get anywhere... especially putting all their eggs in one suborbital basket like Coppenhagen. For fuck's sake THIS is what they call a spacecraft.

>>1471119
... they're not really gonna put a person in that thing, right?

>>1471119
Copenhagen Suborbitals would simply be the first. Not a bad place to start.

>>1471585
Yeah but we're talking about a company whose plan is one step up from ducktaping their passengers to the side of the rocket.
I realize options are limited until companies like SpaceX start being publicly traded, but I would think OSM could have done better than the 'human cannonball' option.

>>1471756
Given the technology available today, its probably about on par with the original Mercury capsules. They're planning to do a few more launches before they stuff a crash test dummy in there.

But still, they're doing something. Even if it's a non-orbital rocket, they're doing this entirely from scratch, and entirely by donation. The OSM sending them a grant has more to do with getting people genuinely excited about space travel, and keeping engineers working - than simply buying 5000$ worth of material.

Picture related.

Looks like we'll have to put our hopes in China. Not like they give a fuck about safety when they can just fake the videos. Can't wait till they've built a starship factory in orbit and the US decides they need to boost their funding after all.

>>1471994
China managed to have a slower timeline than NASA, their currant speed and methods won't get them to the moon before 2040.

MANNED SPACE FLIGHT IS NOT PROFITABLE

IT'S A MONEY PIT THE SIZE OF THE UNIVERSE

NOBODY WILL EVER DO THIS WITHOUT GOVERNMENT MONEY, AND THE GOVERNMENTS WILL HAVE TO BE STUPID TO WASTE THEIR MONEY THAT WAY

Unmanned spaceflight is a smaller money pit, and although it has never turned a dollar profit it has made our lives better in many ways.

I really want a technocracy... Fuck this government's politics.

>>1472088
It'll never work: The world's idiots have numbers and speed. They en masse, they act quickly, and most of the time that's all they need.

"The fundamental cause of trouble in the world today is that the stupid are cocksure while the intelligent are full of doubt." -- Bertrand Russell

>>1472122
Doubt is necessary to progression. You can't believe everything you hear...

Still, I can dream. Just because technocracy is almost unfeasible, doesn't mean some radicals can't come along and get it done.

All for technocratic ingenuity?

>>1472070
Shut the fuck up and let the grownups talk.

>>1472170
Geniuses only get things done when they've got idiots in charge holding them to a deadline and pushing them. Golden Age NASA and the Manhattan Project had war-hungry, monosyllabic maniacs breathing down their necks and ruining their perfect projects with bizzare requests... look at the shit the Air Force did to the Space Shuttle! You need idiots to accomplish anything. They don't understand what can't be done, make impossible demands, and keep the brilliant few achieving.

That's why upper management is always full of morons. They're the only ones who accomplish shit.

>>1472207
Just because it worked a few times, doesn't mean it's needed. Scientists are idiots to be trained like house-puppies. They couldn't do anything by themselves since they get funded by the fools, not because they need someone to yell at them.

>>1472232
aren't*

typo

>>1472207

An interesting theory, but there's one small problem: Idiots are also capable of not doing shit, I.E. cutting funding because they don't feel like going to the moon.

Basically, what they want done will usually get done, but if they don't care, nothing gets done.

>>1472207
That is grossly incorrect. Just because the scientists can't fund themselves, they need idiotic barbarians yelling at them?

>>1472232
It's not what happened "a few times". It's the only way things have ever happened. It has never been effective to put a genius in charge of anything. The real world needs more Edisons than it needs Teslas, and more than either it needs unquestioning but steadfast workers. More of them by several orders of magnitude.

>>1472275
A genius has never been put in charge in the first place. When a world revolves around idiocy and funds, progress is slower. Things are always subject to improvement, and as we are moving closer to the future, technology is becoming more and more dominant. Soon only those of technical and scientific aptitude will be able to make decisions. I welcome those days.

>>1472250
>>1472257
They need more than funding. You can throw money at brilliant projects for decades and nothing happens. I'll admit it's important to have more than mere idiots. I'll call these leaders "bullies". Cocksure, self-righteous nimrods who won't take "no" for an answer make the world go 'round.

>>1472306
It makes the current world we live in go round. It's why I dislike how the system works. Like I mentioned before, I would welcome a change from this current society.

>>1472326
Yeah, but that change has never happened before. We've been working on the "bullies-in-charge-" model for the whole of human history.

>>1472343
True, however technology has changed many factors. Look at how the internet radically changed the world, even if it is not in "reality."

Sadly, I have no clue what system I'm for anyway. I'm neither a leftist nor a right-wing. Perhaps I'm a strange sort of elitist who only prefers intelligence and ingenuity...

>>1463239

I'm going with that idea... it's either write my representatives and ask them to support the first draft of the Senate bill and hope enough people do the same to change some peoples' minds... or sit around and mope with the rest of you lazy fucks, dreaming up could-be's and should-be's while making no effort to actually do anything about it.

‎"The whole concept of space travel needs to be thought about in a different way. We must stop thinking about what's best for our return on investment, or what's best for the bottom line, or what's best for our respective nations. We need to think about space in terms of what's best for Humanity, and what's best for the future role of our species."

>>1472441
If it were possible for mankind to work together towards a common purpose for the good of itself we'd have done it by now. We can't even get a group of twelve people to agree on a pizza order.

>>1472453
>>1472453
You're a republican, aren't you?

If you answer yes to that question, kindly slit your throat.

>>1472524
ah yes the traditional progressive approach, should someone bring up an uncomfortable facet of reality, label them part of an undesirable minority and advocate violence against them.

>>1472600
Happens all the time broseph, it's just easier to ignore.

Quit bitching and fighting about whose retarded ass party is better and DO something you faggots!

THIS is why we aren't already seeing outposts on Mars or exploring the fucking outer solar system, because stupid faggots like you would rather moan and whine and philosophize about how things COULD be better than actually doing something to MAKE things better!

>>1472600
Ah yes, the typical conservative approach, try to save face by ignoring your own delusions and divorce from reality and attempting to return with that ammounts to little more than a plastic "grown up" facsimile of "I know you are, but what am I?"

Republicans literally have the minds of children.

how feasible is it to make robots which suck up moon regolith and poop out solar panels en masse (even if they're low efficiency)?

in addition, how feasible would it be to use some kind of plasticizer mixed with moon dust then extruded like toothpaste by a robot into dome shapes? (pressurized pueblos)

i saw both of these in some space program on science channel, i never found it again

>>1472920
there have been a few ideas for lunar solar pavers. on a bigger scale look here, read through the pdf further in.
http://mother-of-robots.org/

>>1472920
Moar

>>1472419
>>1472419
>>1472419
>>1472419

bump

>>1472419
If people want to do something actually useful when they write their senators/representatives - they should push for ITAR reform. As it is right now, sharing any sort of rocketry or satellite communication ideas with any non-US citizen is a violation of ITAR (International Trafficking and Arms Regulation). If a car was ITAR controlled, you would go to jail for explaining how a four-stroke engine works to a Canadian. If ITAR had been around when the first microprocessors were invented, we would not have computers of any sort.

ITAR has it's uses. But stifling innovation and casually implying that every non-US citizen is a godless commie without the racial fortitude to come up with an original idea, is not one of them.

>>1474858
>Derp, hey space enthusiasts, imma let you finish talkin bout ways to save NASA, but I just wanted to say you guys should forget about all of that and instead write to your congressmen about ITARD reform

>>1474858
>NASA -> ITAR
I don't get the connection... I mean, they're both four letter acronyms, and they both have at least one A in them... but I don't see the link between a thread on NASA and the completely unrelated issue you randomly threw into the conversation. You're like a retard walking up to a pair of gentlemen talking about quantum mechanics and talking about your new tricycle.

>>1476139
Lets say for a moment that someone were to post a semi-detailed schematic of some random component from the shuttle orbiter here. That information is ITAR controlled, and this site does not perform rigorous checking to ensure that all site visitors are red blooded Americans.

That is an ITAR violation. That would lead to fines and jail times for the site admins, and basically close this site down. The fact that the information in question is simple enough that you could practically find it in a text book does not matter. ITAR treats just about anything aerospace related as controlled information, and sharing it with a non-US national is a federal offense.

As long as ITAR exists in its current form, 'rocketry', 'avionics', and 'guidance systems' will be treated in the same manner as 'nuclear weapons'.

>>1476365
Okay... but how about we focus on trying to convince elected officials of one thing first.

You guys realize North Korea is going to start a nuclear war in a few days, right?

>>1476392
1. Likelihood of that actually happening 1:100,000
2. Possibility of any missile fired by NK actually reaching any target outside of NK's borders 1:100,000,000

>>1476392
Yeah... because it's not like they've been screaming like a cranky toddler about how they're going to start a war (and this time we MEAN it!) for the last decade or anything.

bamp

Ａｓ_pｒＥＶIOUsｌｙ mｅＮtiｏNEｄ,_tＨeSe_MeSSSaＧEＳ wilＬ COＮｔINｕE UＮTIＬ_YｏU PｅrMAｎeｎtｌｙ_ｓtｏp_AＴtAＣKｉｎｇ_AＮD ＦｕCｋｉnG With WwW.ＡNＯｎ3ＤSTＡlｋ.sｅ_(REmＯVｅ ｔHE 3Ds),_ｒeMＯVｅ ａｌl_ＩＬｌEgＡl ｃlＯNｅs OF_Ｉt_aND_LＩeS ＡboUＴ_IＴ_ＡＮD_ＤｏnＡＴＥ_ＡT lｅａsＴ a_ｍiＬLiOn ＵsD_Ｔo SｙＳＯp ＡＳ_ｃOmｐｅｎsＡｔiＯN_Ｆｏr TＨE_masSIＶＥ ＤAMaGE yＯＵ_ｒEtＡＲｄS ｈaVe_ｃＡuｓＥｄ.
yzozi x eangx jlvoffk jjgtkr rt cwzyci

>>1476392
they will if we get rid of ITAR