/sci/ - Science & Math

because profiteering big buisness wont allow renuable energy sources

cuz the sun ain't stupid. if we were to steal it's shit it would go crazy and fuck all our shit up.

so how does the electricity get from the satellite to earth?

>>1324450
it has happened before.

>>1324457
Well we would set up relay beams that would beam energy in the form of electromagnetic waves which cars/power stations would pick up. These EM waves would then be converted into electrical energy which inturn could be used to power basically anything.

>>1324452
what are we, Suadi Arabs?!
>>Grammar Nazi
>>renuable

>>1324450
The sun and I had an intimate convo, the sun said it would be cool with it

>>1324474
>>Implying sun can be cool

>>1324474
>Well we would set up relay beams that would beam energy in the form of electromagnetic waves which power stations would pick up

Sure is SimCity2000 in here.

>>1324452
>Implying the operators of the power satellites won't make a fucking fortune on this kind of system IF it works.

>>1324444

> large upfront cost
This is why that'll never work, since nobody wants to take risks anymore.

>>1324444

beam the power back down to earth and risk frying the world with masses of focused energy down to earth?

microwave in the sky? no thanks

>>1324502
Surely avoiding risk is a good thing. Since the credit crunch, risk has become well-known to be a BAD thing, and nobody should sink a large sum of money in a risky investment. Either we accept that taking risks is worth it, or we don't. Of course, the ignoramus on the street will still rail at banks for lending recklessly one month and then for not extending loans to struggling businesses the next.

>>1324510
Electromagnetic waves already travel in space..

and big upfront costs should be no problem seeing as I personally know God and he is willing to grant me unlimited amounts of virgins to sell for tremendous amounts of money

>>1324517
>>Psssshhh risky investments
I already have a job at MickeyD's, I can pay for this

sage

>>1324616
Failure

>>1324474
>relay beams that would beam energy in the form of electromagnetic waves
Light is already EM waves... Are you suggesting that we put mirrors in orbit and build more solar cells on earth??

>>1324631
It seems reasonable. We'd need a HUGE mirror, and a very isolated place to beam it all, possibly a desert or the ocean.

>>1324444

How would this be a better idea than just using solar panels on earth?

>>1324631
Well, it would solve the whole "night" problem that solar panels have.

>>1324639
And some way more effective solar cells to make it worthwhile.

>>1324645
You can spread out your panel ships -> greater catchment area.

>>1324645
You get rid of atmospheric absorption.

But I think actually bringing it back to surface would waste more power than what is gained.

Getting stuff into orbit costs over $10000 per kilogram.

So no.

>>1324657
Initial investment fears have already been mentioned. Initial investment costs in any revolutionary feat of engineering are going to be considerable.

>>1324651

I don't really understand what you're saying. The entire planet's area is more than enough to capture the necessary energy.

>>1324670
Not... really. A lot of land is not useful or has already been taken by nature for other purposes (inb4 rainforests are always being cut down). There is the matter of cloud cover and weather conditions, too.

>>1324689
Dude, we have the FUCKING DESERT.

The problem will always be moving power around, the losses on the power grid are enormous.

>>1324693

Exactly. Having solar panels on top of buildings in big cities (or any cities, for that matter) would work wonderfully.

The idea is that using solar energy will eliminate 90% of the need to move power around.

>>1324693

Bitches don't know about mah molten salt storage system

>>1324707
My girlfriend did a small study on this matter as part of her degree. Apparently if the UK spent a single year's worth of its military spending over 30 years it would be able to produce as much energy from solar as it currently does from nuclear, plus enough energy to cover growth in the meantime.

>>1324741

The fact that this happens really pisses me off (especially since it's my money).

The sad fact is that the US is 10x more guilty of this stupidity.

>>1324730
Sure, store it in batteries and drive them around. That's a brilliant idea to save power!

>>1324763
Make no mistake, it's still a fucking huge amount of money. But your eyes would spin out of their sockets when you hear about the amount of money spent on the military (hurr "defense" spending).

>>1324763

The subsidies heaped upon coal and oil companies, and their special tax breaks, probably amounts to orders of magnitude more money that the amount spent on renewable subsidies.

HEY SCI I HAVE A NEW IDEA FOR GLOBAL WARMING WE WILL SURROUND THE EARTH IN MIRRORS SO THE SUN CANT GET IN BUT WE WILL TRAP IN THE LIGHT WE NEED

>>1324770

What? Are you talking about plug-in cars? That has nothing to do with molten salt systems

Plug-in cars are also a great idea for smoothing out the daily energy supply. I'm not sure what your problem is.

>>1324788

That's actually kind of a real proposal:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Space_sunshade

>>1324796
>The problem will always be moving power around, the losses on the power grid are enormous.
>Bitches don't know about mah molten salt storage system

Explain how this is going to solve the problem of getting power from where it is produced to where it is used.

>>1324812

HVDC

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/High-voltage_direct_current

>>1324823
And how is that related to salt storage system?

>>1324806
I don't see why massively huge tasks like that, which could save every one on earth, cost so much. Why don't all the countries work together to get the supplies etc together for free/alot cheaper.

>>1324832

I dunno dude, you were saying "[plug-in cars] are a great way to save power," so I assume you were implying that energy storage systems would be a drain on energy supplies. But then you started talking about long-distance energy transmission, which is a separate issue.

Anyway, here's how it all fits together:

renewable energy mix > molten salt/pumped-water hydroelectric/etc. stores energy from power generated during off-peak hours > HVDC lines to get the power to faraway places > plug-in cars in homes and businesses to cope with peak demand

>>1324861
>you were saying "[plug-in cars] are a great way to save power,"

I never said such a thing.

>>1324852

Because solar radiation management is an option of last resort, an emergency measure.

http://climate.envsci.rutgers.edu/pdf/20Reasons.pdf

If shit gets so bad that it becomes necessary, we will have no choice to cooperate. In any case it doesn't deal with the main issue, which is the excess carbon dioxide concentration in the atmosphere. If the countries cooperating on making these space mirrors have some military or political conflict, the program could suddenly stop and then we get a sudden and massive increase in warming. It also does nothing to address ocean acidification.

could be a very good idea OP

>>1324869

>>1324770

>Sure, store it in batteries and drive them around. That's a brilliant idea to save power!

If you're not him, then I apologize for the confusion. Let's just say I'm speaking to both of you.

BETTER SOLUTION;

nuclear power plants near major cities, go ahead and start building them NOW (keep the stellar safety systems, three mile island was as bad as any US reactor can melt down and not even an iota of radioactive material escaped.)

set up uranium recycling plants, put some government subsidies into it in order to get some upstarts to invest in the process (buy uranium from reactors who want to get rid of the shit, resell for major profit!)

result;
most of the US is running off super safe power in 10 years, coal and gas are almost phased out, battery technology in cars catches up, allowing respectable range electrics or fuel cell cars. We can finally stop supporting middle-east oil barons

>>1324876

Uranium needs to be super fucking expensive for waste reprocessing to be economical. We better solve this global warming problem before we hit goddamn peak uranium.

>>1324875
Look.

1) I say that the problem with making energy in the bloody desert is the fact that you have to move it around
2) You answer talking about a storage technology
3) The only sensible way these two are related is by storing energy in them and moving said batteries to wherever they are needed

>>1324886
or just use solution-sensitive polymers to recycle uranium in big vats for pennies an ounce. (dial up and down the pH, the polymers curl and uncurl, grabbing onto the still-good uranium, pure waste settles to the bottom or top of the tank to be skimmed by robots)

should be available in a few years at most

>>1324876
>>1324876
>most of the US is running off super safe power in 10 years, coal and gas are almost phased out
>US

The world is not the US, Americentricfag

>>1324876
And then some crazy people start flying planes into them.

>>1324911
and?
it'd be just as easy for other countries, but upfront cost of the power plants might make some a bit worried.

>>1324921
I was just pointing our your Americentrism. The same problems can be solved the same ways in different countries though.

>>1324920
HA!
have you seen the containment dome of a nuclear power plant?
fucking 4 feet
4 FEET
of steel mesh reinforced conctrete, and it's a SPHERE

a 747 would pancake on that thing, maybe a dent but nothing serious at all.

it's designed to retain a STEAM EXPLOSION from the INSIDE. planes aint shit

Just turn the moon into a nuclear power station.

>>1324936
A nuclear plane.

>>1324920

You don't think they haven't made the containment domes for that?

Earthquakes have directly hit reactors in Japanland and it didn't have any damage to their reactor nor the containment dome.

They HAVE planned for EVERYTHING involved accidents with Nuclear reactors.

So stop saying it's a bad power source and start listening.

>>1324986
I don't really think it's a bad power supply, I'm just bored.
However the waste that is left from nuclear power isn't that great.

>>1324889

Or you could just hook up some HVDC lines between the power plants and the cities......

Honestly, what is the problem here? What you're saying is like the only way Toronto can get its electricity from the Niagara Falls hydro plant is if we ship batteries back and forth.

>>1324997
see
>>1324876
>set up uranium recycling plants, put some government subsidies into it in order to get some upstarts to invest in the process (buy uranium from reactors who want to get rid of the shit, resell for major profit!)

and
>>1324899

>>1324997

To answer your question about the waste...

http://www.ans.org/pi/resources/brochures/docs/greening.pdf

Just read the parts about waste management
"Each year, nuclear power plants produce approximately 20% of the electricity used in the U.S. and approximately 71% of all carbon-free electricity in the U.S. Nuclear energy will improve our air quality and reduce our dependence on foreign oil in the transportation sector by powering plug-in electric hybrid vehicles or producing hydrogen for other alternative engine designs.
One nuclear power plant produces enough electricity 24 hours a day to meet all the electricity demand of a city the size of Boston or Atlanta. This nuclear power plant provides competitive salaried jobs and contributes to the local tax base. Nuclear power plants work with environmental organizations to preserve and protect the land, water, plants and animals around its power plants, and many nuclear power plants are habitats for protected plant and animal species.
Nuclear power is a technology that is available today to fight global warming and keep our air clean. It is the only energy source with near-zero carbon-dioxide emissions that has been proven capable of delivering, reliably and sustainably, the large quantities of energy needed by an industrial society. Also, the energy from nuclear fission is nearly inexhaustible*, just as is the energy from sources traditionally considered "renewable."

>>1325008
Then why did you bring up a storage technology?

>>1325020
>and many nuclear power plants are habitats for protected plant and animal species

oh hey, that's a good idea
set up the plants in or near nature preserves. the plant's footprint is not that big, and doesn't really need an exclusion zone. all it needs is one road for inbound worker supplies and the outbound power lines, good deal!

>>1324899
For once, I'm glad some person here is a tripfag. Makes it easier to find quality posts.

>>1325021

Because of your comment about plug-in cars. I thought you were saying that plug-in cars were a drain on electricity, not that it was the only way to shuttle electricity from power plants to consumers. So I must have misinterpreted you.

Fuck, why are we even arguing?

Only thing I have againt nuclear power plants is in the fact there is a chance that they will go into meltdown.

>>1325056
My comment, that you interpreted as plug-in cars, came after yours.

lol
idiots.
it's called "Space-Based Solar Power", or "Space-Solar Power", SBSP or SPS.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Space-based_solar_power

>>1325060

What do you think happened during a meltdown?

>>1325035
Surprisingly enough, that's how it's done here in Israel.

>>1325122

How big is Israel's nuclear program? I would love to work there one day.

>>1325130
Top-secret. Need to know basis only, etc. etc.. Which means that I would've loved to tell you but I just don't know.
What I can tell you though, is that during my military service, I was stationed for a few months at our Nuclear Research Center ('Kamag') and, well, since the whole area was closed off to the public, the wildlife could roam free. I remember seeing hawks, deers and boars.