/sci/ - Science & Math

>>12728533
Time to go back to monke

>>12728533
Greater efficiency, no more pesky unions or whining workers, no more job-site injury payouts, increased revenue, I'd say all around a complete plus.

>>12728612
What about mass unemployment? Jobs will be more high skilled, how will people cope?

>>12728813
Why is robots doing our job a bad thing, exactly?

>>12728813
I wouldn't have believed it two years ago, but we're seeing a massive move toward Basic Income.
Amazon will use government money to pay you to buy things in the near future.

>>12728815
who controls the robots?

>>12728815
You don't have a wage anymore

>>12728820
>government money to pay you to buy things
Sooooo communism?

>>12728533
> fully fledged automation
I work around cutting edge conveyor technology. The fucker still jams up 50x a shift. You know what we use to straighten out all this high-tech, 21st century, fully computerized conveyor?

A broomstick.

>>12728823
I'm a programmer, so I will definitely have a wage.

>>12728822
The corporations, just as they control everything today.

>>12728813
>>12728823
>But how will you make money by letting the slave do all the work for you

>>12728853
The factory owner takes all the money, the replaced ex-worker gtfo without money to live

>>12728533
Its possible for a tiny elite that owns the robots and the land to just trade among themselves and let anyone else to starve. You could say "the unemployed could simply move to the countryside and open a farm" but the rich also own all the land, no, you cant just go to a forest and hunt-gather, you have less resources than cavemen did. I figure you can always fight and destroy the robots and the engineers that make them, you dont have to play by the rules of a system that is actively trying to kill you.

>>12728533
fully fledged automation is the same if you're using trained biological robots or electromechanical ones.

>>12728820
so who gets to use the money? or rather, who decides who gets to use the money?

>>12728870
So long as we have guns, I don't fear automation. Even if we somehow take an unrealistic leap where 80% of jobs are replaced by robots in a single day, I'm confident we will get UBI or something like that under threat of a revolt.

>>12728875
>choosing neo-Luddism over fully-automated socialism

I think that people who think we'll live in a perfect world with robot slaves are fucking retards. The world can hardly sustain 8 billion people as is. Resources are limited. What will instead happen, when we reach sufficient levels of technology, is that the rich (top 1%) will exterminate everyone else and live in a perfect world without the rest of the population who don't do anything just drain the planets resources and pollute everything. Earth is just too small for billions of humans, a population of 10 million is more than enough. And the rich know this. Do you think they'll want to share the planet with 8 billion plebs and subhumans? Fuck no. They want everything for themselves. Once mechanical slaves outperform biological ones, they'll send us to the gas chambers as they'll have no need for us anymore. Not that I blame them, I would do the same.

>>12728886
brainlet here. please explain that image to me

>>12728888
>who decides who gets to use the money?
Amazon. Probably based on irresponsible spending habits. Payment inversely proportional to savings.

>>12728892
Its not my choice, its just a possibility. The rich only need the poor for their labor, they dont need masses of consumers, this is ultra obvious in Brazilian-style societies.

>>12728813
>how will people cope?
death is one
the other is mental institutions

>>12728870
You're missing the point, if automation is fully complete everything will be provided for by "robots" and there is no need for money or work

>>12728892
Muh utopia

>>12728923
Theres also no need for workers to live

>>12728929
You will own nothing and you will be happy

>basic income
Laughable meme, do you think the rich will just donate you money so you can live your basic shitty life while machines do all the work? Why the fuck would they? They'll just keep both the money and the machines to themselves and get rid of us all. In fact the concept of "money" will be depricated because it will be useless since the machines will do everything for them for free. We use money so that we can exchange goods and products with other people. You will not need money when you have a swarm of machines that can and will do everything for you.

>>12728902
Based rich, if that means that every single moron i had the displeasure to interact with here gets brutally murdered I'm all for it

>>12728936
Exactly, I'd rather go back to monke desu. Technology freaks truly appal me

>>12728830
Serfdom, but for consuming instead of labor.

>>12728947
Because people will do like him >>12728890
In other words a revolution

>>12728913
i dont think we are on the same page. the money youre talking about is more like a bonus or some shit, right?

>>12728947
Basic income will be a thing in the transition phase to keep the cattle complacent

>>12728960
Good luck against rich people's terminator squads. And nukes.

>>12728947
>Why the fuck would they?
It's a stop-gap until everything is fully automated. We aren't there yet.

>>12728947
Thats sort of an exaggeration, there will be markets and the rich will trade among themselves. Its unlikely that every rich survivor will also be self-sufficient.

>>12728815
Who will buy the cheap products when no one has a job?

>>12728968
Im a big fan of fighting because you have a chance of winning and if you die theres no problem anymore

>>12728990
kek based

>>12728981
The rich will trade among themselves

>>12728902
So automation, overpopulation, food crisis and global warming will eventually blend up in a big blob and become one big fucking class genocide. Gonna be interesting times

>>12729001
That's why Elon wants a base on Mars for the billionaires to escape to while the nukes do the dirty work here

>>12728923
Great so you’re given the same income as barely functional retards, what a fucking utopia.

>>12728902
This. UBI will be temporary to stop riots. It will also come with mandatory birth control.

>>12728533
People riot and protests gain traction. The value of the dollar would plummet as people against automation who use the loss of jobs as a scrap-goat to justify revolution? That's all assuming the government doesn't provide some sort of incentive not to go full automation for just any business.

>>12728977
You don't have to be self sufficient when machines do everything for you without you lifting a finger. I mean literally everything. All your basic needs and more will be taken care of. Whom are you going to exchange things with when everyone else's needs are also satisfied, all the time? We use money because nobody can sustain themselves, you have to specialize in a field. When you have sufficiently intelligent machine slaves that can do everything for you for free, you are for all intents and purposes "self sufficient" and you don't rely on anyone else.

Think about it logically. If you could get rid of 99% of the world's population and sorround yourself with machine slaves and live a perfectly comfortable life, wouldn't you? I know I would. You could have all the beautiful places on the world all to yourself (and your family and female harem or whatever you like really). I think this what they really mean by world domination.

>>12728533
Fully fledged automation does not imply a developed welfare system, so I guess that companies could go the full automation route without having to bother with the general quality of life outside their domain. Poor people would have difficulty finding a job, because the only ones available require the most specialization. Even without bothering with all this practical stuff- what would the vast majority of society do with so much time in their hands? We're going to end up like those fuckers in wall-e aren't we?

>>12728533
Then I imagine India and all the other overpopulated developing countries are absolutely fucked.

>>12729069
So every rich will have a mini steel mill to make their own I beams? Possible

>We're going to end up like those fuckers in wall-e aren't we?
Yes, but only the rich

>>12729098
Not "every rich", "the rich" as a community. See the Wall-E analogy here
>>12729078
It will be TRUE communism for a handful of people. It would be impossible to sustain 8 billion people or more. Resources are limited as is, the planet is just too small. And people are greedy, they don't really want to share anything unless they have to, especially when it means they can have more for themselves.

Also imagine if you could go any tourist destination in the world without other tourists in sight. Maybe covid is just a preview of what's to come... I imagine the rich aren't really fond of tourists and they'd get rid of them if they could, but they rely on their cheap workforce, for now.

>>12729035
Nigger learn to read

>>12728902
They wont succeed without a fight. We could send robots to kill them.

>>12728912
you don't understand it because you're a brainlet

>>12729188
well fuck you, aint nuffin wrong with being a brainlet

>>12729132
I dont think the rich will just stop using money. You make it sound as if its just going to be like 100 billionaires alone and they freely give each other gifts. If theres at least 1 million inhabitants you are going to need money, which is nothing more than a system to keep track of who did favors for whom.

>>12729173
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kLWvu51Vk4E&ab_channel=S%CE%9BKO

>>12729213
Money is only needed when you're facing scarcity

>>12728533
Retards who dropped out of HS won't be able to do soul sucking repetitive tasks 8 hours a day to survive so they will starve to death or turn to crime. Good riddance.

>>12729132
Also, I thought about this a lot lately, and it seems to me that the obvious conclusion to capitalism is true communism for the rich while extermination for the rest. There will be a point in time when all the means of production will be concentrated in the hands of a select few. If you reach a certain level of technological progress that is sufficient to sustain the lives of the company owners (assuming you diversified your investments into shares of various companies from a wide range of industries), you suddenly don't need to worry about workers or even buyers of your products. If you can produce everything for your own consumption, you're suddenly self sufficient and I dependant from the rest of the world. For example you could own a fully automated farm, a fully automated slaughterhouse, machines that pick you fruits and vegetables, machines that cook for you, machines that clean after you etc. I could go on forever. Now the question, is what does the rest of the population do or what do you do with them? I'm guessing the best option for you is to exterminate them.

The only reason the world's top 100 richest people haven't exterminated us all is because we haven't reached that level of automation yet.

>>12729213
We don't know what the ultimate population number is going to be, but I'm guessing it's going to be fairly low. What could you be even asking as a favor when you have everything you could possibly ask for? The concept of money is useless in this scenario.

>>12729222
I mean it as a tool to keep track of trade, and there will be scarcity in the sense that you need to exchange goods and services with strangers if you are not self sufficient. Unless every rich makes his own steel and grows his own coffee and makes his own jet turbines there will be trade among the rich, therefore money or an equivalent accounting system going by another name

>>12728836
Cool so you need one guy with minimal training and some basic tools to reset the robots when they shit the bed instead of 50 workers doing manual labor.

>>12729233
I said it, an exchange of goods and services is needed unless everyone is self sufficient.
Maybe the russian oligarch provides the steel and bill gates provides the computers and Musk provides the vehicles, or will each of them make everything?
I mean its possible you know? Hard to imagine but with true A.I maybe everyone can have robots growing coffee and making jets just for you.

>>12729247
If its that simple why not just have a robot push the broomstick?

>>12728917
What the fuck is a Brazilian-style society?
What's so special about Brazil?

So do you think automation will have taken most manual labor jobs by 2050?

>>12729256
Because robots are very good at doing simple tasks extremely efficient.
Humans are not as efficient, but they can do way more complex tasks, like figuring out what's wrong with the robot assembly team and fixing the issue.
In order to automate this as well you would need a shit load of sensors and crap that would cost a lot and might also break or real artificial intelligence to mimic a human.

>>12729250
Sure, but I see 2 possible outcomes to this.

Either every company in the world is nationalized (or united-nationalized), or equivalently you'll have a 1/8 billionth share in every company. Nobody will work, machines will do everything and you'll be paid basic income with which you can buy and exchange goods with the rest of the population. But resources will be still very limited and you'll renting a 10 sqm room and you'll own nothing (and you'll be "happy").

Or the top 1% (that's actually still almost 100 million people, so likely way less) concentrates all the wealth in the world and gets rid of the rest of the population and they'll live like kings.

Now, which option would you choose if you were Mark Zuckerberg?

>>12729288
Yes and? I don't think we're talking about the "now" but the not too distant future.

>>12728966
In this analogy, the goods which these 'cattle' provide to justify the costs of their continuance is their labor.
Think if it this way, suppose you're a cattle farmer and have been given a facility which can vat-grow massive quantities of perfect, healthy meat for a fraction of a fraction of the cost of breeding, nurturing, maintaining, and processing live cattle.
Why would you ever keep paying for the cattle? The answer is you wouldn't. You'd sell them off, or if no buyers can be found release into the wild or kill them.

>>12729304
Because it's retarded robots without AI can do a few limited tasks they are built for.
In a factory there are thousands of things that could go wrong you would need to build hundreds of robots or thousands of robots to deal with everything.
Robots are not intelligent there will always be jobs that require intelligence whether human or artificial and AI is a fucking meme and always will be.

>>12729284
Theoretically it'll take all the white collar, lower complexity jobs first, like office work and accounting. Some factory jobs are too hard to automate with foreseeable technology right now, so likely humanity would split into two classes: high IQ complex job aristocracy, and the factory worker masses.

>>12729332
>AI is a fucking meme and always will be.
I don't think so

>>12729200
nobody said there was anything wrong with being a brainlet

>>12729268
No middle class, just rich and poor people. The poor dont consume much and that doesnt prevent the rich from thriving. I bring it up as economically illiterates keep bringing up the idea that rich people have to pay salaries to have consoomers.

>>12729288
So you go from insulting a worker as a random dumbass with a broomstick to saying hes indispensable.

>>12729297
All i said is that to have an exchange you need money. Its just a tool to keep track of who gave what to whom, some people will be deemed as not having given enough... these will have debt. Such is money

>>12728533
You will own nothing, and you will be happy.

>>12729495
At the camps there will be pods and bug soup.

>>12729485
The concept of money only makes sense if resources are limited. But if every person happens to have unlimited access to any resources, you don't need money, you'll just "take" things and so will everyone else.

>>12729469
He's indispensable, but the supply of human intelligence will be way bigger than the demand so the majority of humans will be useless

>>12729518
There are different levels of unlimited here. Are we talking unlimited automated manufacturing and unlimited resources too? Complete post-scarcity?

Can a triple product of vectors like this be expressed as a single triple product?

>>12729525
Yes. 2nd scenario in this post >>12729297
You obviously do need money in the 1st scenario. It all comes down to this. You can either have a society of the few with everyone having access to unlimited access to resources, or you can live in a hellhole with 8+ billion people where everyone only has access to very limited, but equal resources. Which option would you go with, assuming you were a position to make this decision?

>>12728870
Who do you think is buying the factory owner's products if the entire population has no source of income?

>>12729590
There is no need for buyers if you (that is, your machine slaves) produce literally everything for your own consumption. Assuming you are the owner of every factory.

>>12728820
>Amazon gives us money so we can spend it on Amazon products do they can make money

>>12729590
The other rich people you retard. Rich people will specialize in areas to increase efficiency and trade between themselves.

>>12729696
>Rich people will specialize in areas to increase efficiency
Nah, machines will do that for them

>>12729741
Yes Cpt. Obvious

>>12729741
Its landlords then giving each other gifts. Rich people will own robots and some % of the Earth's surface

>>12729590
The government takes the products as tax payment. Or charges taxes and then buys them, functionally equivalent

>>12728815
Most humans go feral if they dont have jobs to distract them.

The laying off of the working class, forcing the workers to either starve or seize the means

>>12728533
Will automation save us?

>>12729696
What makes you think "rich people" ( what you really mean is the capitalist class) will be able to survive the transition period where automation gets advanced enough to be independent and unskilled themselves?

No one is going to say "whelp I don't have a job because the robots took them all, and I can't farm because all the land is already owned guess I'll just lay down and starve"

>>12729888
That's why you exterminate them

Say it with me /sci/
SOCIAL
CREDIT
SYSTEM

Purchasing power is innately a message sent from the consumer to the producer. If consumers don't have enough money to buy back what they've built by working income, Ricardian Economics has failed. This can be solved by shifting the role of credit and debt lenders from the banking institutions to the people.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_credit

No matter how much the cringey autist and elites hammer on about full automation , we're still not gonna see it for several decades. Completely fucking delusional onions nerds and elites shilling hard hoping by shilling itll come quicker.

>>12729919
No one is going to lay down and be exterminated and the average person isn't dumb enough to let it get to the point that it is even possible without a pre-emptive strike.

>this extremely anti-semitic thread on /sci/
Y'all need to go back to
>>>/pol/

>>12729955
The average person has room temperature IQ. You could also genetically engineer a virus to wipe out most of the population... Just some food for thought

>>12728533
Factory workers in reality will be one of the last to be fully automated.

AI or at least Computers will wipe out the call centers, the majority of office work, accountancy and data analysis etc before 2100 but it will not be until post scarcity that robots will be cheaper to do random inane tasks like cleaning flash off the corner of combs than a minimum wage wagey like myself.

If you knew the shit I did every day on the assembley line you would be greatly relieved. A robot would be completely wasted in these tasks as all but the most learning impaired humans are and the latter won't sit down long enough to do it properly.

The middle classes will go first. Even artists and writers will be replaced by procedurally created works of entertainment before the anyone build a robot cheap enough for the assembley line.

>>12728912
They're old worlde terms for the mentally disabled. Ranking them on various levels and suggesting the level of work they are capable of.

>>12729798
>the government pays Amazon to buy products
>it does it using gov's money, which comes from taxing Amazon
>product is given to the unemployed cattle
>The the government taxes Amazon again to have money to give to Amazon and pay for the product for the cattle consoomer
Literally what could go wrong

>>12730269
Seems fair and balanced

>>12728875
If enough people are left out by the system, concepts like ownership wont exist anymore and the world will devolve into anarchy. The elite have an interest in keeping stability and peace. If jeff bezos makes 10 billion dollars more, it won't really change his life, but if 4 billion people want to lynch him, that will. With that said, i dont know the future, so i guess what you said could happen.

>>12728820
>>12728815
why would you have a system where unproductive people are allowed to exist and consume, instead of just killing them
if you are an elite then they present an unnecessary risk for no benefit
the only reason those people exist today is that they are a small minority and the system (white men mostly) can carry their weight

>>12730269
The idea I think is that government itself becomes kind of pointless, since the disruption to society of such a massive automation revolution would cause at least a partial collapse of our hierarchies. But I dunno, Karl Marx was a retard talking out of his butt

>>12730597
In an age of total automation no one is productive, thats the point. The rich just own land and machines, anyone could kill them and go "mine now".

>>12730683
That's why the rich will strike first and preemptively kill us all.

>>12728921
>the wizard!

>>12728533
I'm convinced full automation will eventually lead to communism. Even if everyone but the owners of the machines died, the end result for them would be a communist post-scarcity society.

>>12728830
socialism

>>12731135

This,

Techno Socialist Max bro

Capital becomes meaningless. Political Capital becomes the real currency of the land. Oligarchy cements its place, with a body of puppet elected officials.

The pleabs will love their bread and circuses.

>>12728947
They still need people to buy their goods and services.

>>12728533
Normies think UBI will happen, instead they’ll just get culled off

>>12728533
the day we get ubi is the day I can fuck off from caring about this shit all of it

>>12731903
No

>>12731903
They rich dont need to give you salary money just so that you can give it back to them.

>>12732498
This. Just giving me the product for free would make more sense.

>>12728948
was thinking about the same thing

>>12728917
If there were no consumers, who would buy shit?

>>12728533
1. there will never be "fully fledged automation" because there will always be some demand for human-made things
2. as long as scarcity still exists (which it will) people will always want to trade shit, so there will always be ways of making money

>>12732711
The rich themselves can consume.

>>12728813

By dying and having less kids.

>>12732711
There won't be a need for consumers on that scale any more.

>>12728533
As production ceases to require human labor, the working class becomes available in a way it has never been before. The smarter governments will be the first to tap into this newly found potential, and apply their budgets to offer wages for community service. Because with this they kill two birds with one stone: the working class remains employed, and the environment is maintained as economic growth continues.

Thinking in terms of ''capitalism'' is a Humanist trick to stop people from seeing it is Humanism which is the prevailing paradigm and the cradle of capitalism. There is no capitalism without Humanism. And the dream of the leftists with their ''''''''''''social democracy'''''''is just a despair of having humanism without capitalism.


>Was "classical liberalism" ever a real thing?
no
it was mercantilism, which is the economy part of classical liberalism adapted to nationalism.

classical liberalism is the fantasy of libertarianism today.

-a strong parliamentary republic/state within a tiny scope

-a strong faith of ''''''''competition''''''''''

-a strong faith that competition makes people better

-a strong faith that '''''''''free markets'''''''''''' regulated by the tiny superstrong public servants , to break any burgeoning monopoles

-a strong faith that competition (about material things and about ''''''ideas''''''''') brings appeasement of the '''''''bad'''''''human nature

-a strong faith that once people are educated to libertarianism, throughout the federal/national instruction ( not mandatory to attend public school, but it is mandatory to teach children how good libertarianism is , meaning how good it is to embrace the liberal rationalism of the human rights)

-a strong faith that ''''''''''''rationality'''''''''''' , as liberals define it, is the pinnacle of the human life, with the liberal uber man as ''''''''''the free thinker'''''''''''' (but materially depending on others)

-a strong faith that truth is associated to this normative liberal reason

-a strong faith that only the liberal republic can bring this to the ''''''''nice people'''''''''', who is always right therefore it is cogent to ask the ''''''''''''educated people'''''''' to vote once every few years

-a strong faith that ''''''democracy perhaps is a failure, but any other form of society is worse LOL''''''

>>12728606

>>12732918
1. No
2. Also no

>>12728533
Slavery.
Competition between man and machine, while the machines are owned by a very small oligarchy.
We are the new negro cotton pickers.

>>12728813
this will make low cost college 100% obligatory.
the USA are at higher risk of collapse than Europe because of this.

>>12728822
a very small elite who owns them.
this will lead to class war.

>>12728830
national socialism is a better alternative to communism

>>12728835
What happens when AI gets advanced enough to program?

>>12728923
for this to be true you need an UBI. Or people will become obsolete and will be left to die alone.

>>12733251
It is already programming.
Look at GPT-3
https://www.nytimes.com/2020/11/24/science/artificial-intelligence-ai-gpt3.html
Code monkeys will be extinct in 10 years. Screenshot this.

>>12728533
Unironically do what Andrew Yang says, universal basic income for those who have been displaced and focus on education/retraining for displaced workers

>>12733268
oh fucking paywalls
here an open version of the same article:
https://english.aawsat.com/home/article/2684226/meet-gpt-3-it-has-learned-code-and-blog-and-argue

>>12728612
>no more pesky unions or whining workers
no more workers at all since they're all homeless or dead lmao

>>12728835
>I'm a programmer, so I will definitely have a wage.
KEK
look at this
>>12733268
>>12733281

>>12728890
>under threat of a revolt
that's exactly what will happen.
UBI or something similar or a violent revolution.

>>12728886
this is the dumbest post I've read today

>>12729337
clammy robot hands typed that post

>>12728947
>do you think the rich will just donate you money
they will give their money obtained from machine work or they will die
pretty simple

>>12733270
You are extremely short sighted

>>12731903
no, they don't need most people today already
in fact the most logical move for the world elite in 2021 would be kill almost everyone who doesn't belong to the elite.

>>12733097
>offer wages for community service
Where does the money come from?

>>12733333
Taxes obviously, as taken as a fee for the property enforcement, also DAMN

>>12733341
>the gov taxes Amazon
>it uses that money to pay the cattle in exchange of mandatory corvée to keep public spaces clean and shit
>then the cattle uses the bux to buy shit from Amazon
>then the gov taxes Amazon again and the shitshow goes on to keep the dying capitalism alive
sounds reasonable to me

>>12733388
Sounds kinda marxist but that's one way to put it

>>12733388
>>then the gov taxes Amazon again and the shitshow goes on to keep the dying capitalism alive
I mean if you trace how money/the economy works, it's basically what you just said. Nothing surprising about it. You work to get money to give money back to the same people you get money from, ultimately, just sometimes it goes through a few more hands first.

>>12733333
Great Scott!!!

It will lead to the absolute greatest genocide in all of human history once it reaches a certain point, there's nothing that can be done about it, it's already obvious, surplus population is evident.

>>12728533
there will always be jobs, unless the technological singularity is reached, but that will never happen

>>12728533
>all the people thinking UBI is the solution
What about getting those people to do actually important constructive work instead?
Like writing open source software for example. There's much work needed.

Large-scale automation as a goal is incompatible with our system at least if society is meant to be somewhat stable.

>>12735036
Read the thread

>>12728813
What mass unemployment? People will find new things to do.

>>12735042
Who's gonna foot the bill?

>>12735042
Like sex work. Perhaps the rise of pornography and onlyfans over the past couple years is an indicator we're ascending to a post-post-industrial civilization.

>>12729222 It's not needed in that case. It's just one of the options.
Furthermore, even if it was needed or the chosen option the scope of its application / the areas where it's used and how can differ by a lot.

>>12728836
This guy knows.

>>12735042 Except for e.g. food production related things I'd guess most work that's truly constructive and important and efficient but neglected or preferred by people (depending on education etc) does not generate proper profit or would currently allow these people to be 'employed'.
They can be made to do these things instead of what they did before but that would still mean mass-unemployment.

>>12735062
Sex work can be relegated to sex waifu/robots.

>>12728533
As assisted machinary and technological advances grew people found more and more resting time to explore new opportunities. From hunting and gathering all waking hours to the innovation of agriculture where working hours only required dawn to dusk, which finally lead to powered machinary and engines, reducing working hours even more to dawn till late evening. Automation will give humanity more free time to explore the arts and sciences. Just imagine a world where you had half the worlds population dedicated to expanding science fields.

>>12728902
How are they just going to magically exterminate everybody though? a utopian world like that (and it is in fact utopian) is impossible to achieve. In reality things will remain the same, 95% of the world will be an overpopulatdd shithole filled with third worlders with small oases reserved for the rich and their android caretakers

>>12736057 It's dystopian, not utopian, and achievable with automated efficient but sustainable food production.

>>12735036
>open source software
where do you find it? github?

>>12733388
At this scale of circularity amazon is just an organ of a democratic government. Ministry of distribution or something.

>>12737084 if it was something like that things would be sent without as much unneeded waste & transport, things that can be produced sustainably and/or locally would be at least cheaper than the rest and product info would be actually useful etc

>>12728533
>What are the social and economic implications of fully fledged automation?

Stagnation of culture/technology and retardation of the mind followed by catastrophic collapse.

>>12736057
>How are they just going to magically exterminate everybody though?
If only we could genetically engineer a virus to easily wipe out the population...

>>12737147
>"Comlade Chailman, ale you sule nobody will find out?"
>...
>"Tlust the plan"

>>12728947
Without workers earning money the rich cannot earn anything. Henry Ford realised this 100+ years ago.

>>12737084
Probably a new kind of corporate feudalism

>>12737160
You are very narrow minded and short sighted. Every biological worker is going to be replaced by mechanical slaves that don't need wages. It might not happen until 2050, but this is the ultimate end of capitalism. The only question is what do you do in the meantime.
>inb4 nooooo you will always need human workers just because trust me I know
Laughable argument.

Fully fledged automation doesn't mean nobody works, it'll just mean most if not all manual labour will be done by the machines. There's still gonna be industry but it'll be geared more towards creative, online and service industries. And no, I don't think machines will overtake the service industry just because people prefer to talk to another person. The issue is how do we transistion smoothly to this new economy.

>>12737195
>geared more towards creative, online and service industries. And no, I don't think machines will overtake the service industry
And why is that?

>>12737195
give proof of that

>>12737195

>>12737195
>it'll be geared more towards creative
nope dumbass
look at GPT-3 generating 100k possible solutions to a design problem in like 10 seconds

>>12737195
> people prefer to talk to another person

You're out of your goddamn mind.

I'm hoping that the quarantine lasts literally forever and these food delivering drones become mainstream ASAP.

U are a faggot and big corp ceo matters as always, fuck labourer and tech

>>12737160
The rich can buy and sell from each other.

>>12737337
>my brother has a pencil
>I have a dollar
>trade the dollar and pencil back and forth a few million times
>we're both now millionaires
we done it reddit

>>12737308
you still need a person to interpret these "solutions"

>>12737195
I do prefer to talk to people but companies dont care. I hate it, everything is done online or through apps, sometimes badly written or unsafe. Like once my bank would send me a credit card over the mail, easier they said, more comfortable because i dont have to travel, the paper code never arrived, so i went to the bank to complain, they cancelled the card, i ask for a new one, i ask it to be sent to a branch, i go there but there is no code, the woman tells me i dont need a paper code i can get it online. Then a bunch of services associated with the old card that are supposed to be transferred to the new card get cancelled due to non-payment. I give the phone company my new card, online, but it doesnt click so they cancel my service, i go to the phone company to give them my new card number in person.

>>12737160
The rich won't need human workers, they will live in private compounds where machines are the new slave cast that perform all menial labour, but the specialized jobs will be all done by them.

The poor and uneducated who survived afterwards will just live like Amish in small communities completely ignorant to what the elites are doing.

>>12737352
It doesnt work like that more like: I have a pencil factory thus 1000 pencils, my brother has an eraser factory thus 1000 erasers, i give him a pencil, he gives me an eraser.

>>12737368
TL;DR Zardoz

>>12737371
you now have 1000 complete pencils and no one who can purchase them

>>12737376
Wrong, because i gave one to my brother, and there are likely millions of rich customers that also need pencils. I sell to them, and then i use the money to buy whatever they are selling. Like erasers from my brother.

>>12737381
kill all humans, robots do work , profit

>>12737361
yes, one person comparing the results as opposed to 10000 full time designers doing the actual designs

>>12737382
Its not all humans, just workers.
The rich trade among themselves, which in essence means they barter among themselves. If there are 1000 types of products made by 1000 different companies, they can mutually exchange them using money as a tool to ease the barter. Simplified economy with 4 products: We are on an island, i harvest coconut, you hunt crabs, my brother chops wood, your brother gathers fresh water, we meet each day at afternoon and barter, i give coconuts to everybody, i get water, wood and crab, and so on.

>>12737365
works for me in europe. cards are associated with accounts, not the other way around because we're not mart-sharting mcdonalds mutt monkeys.

>>12737405
My card is associated with my account but the bank fucks up everything on their drive to get rid of physical branches (plus all employees are women). I have to call a different company to deal with card issues, they are supposed to transfer any fixed payments to any new cards, and they have done so in the past, but somehow got confused because i cancelled two cards in a row. I basically cancelled a card once and set in motion a snowball with 5 physical visits to the bank, a visit to the phone company, and im afraid theres still a visit to my health insurance coming soon. This system is an incoherent mix of bug-ridden apps and negligent roasties that answer the phones.

>>12728533
One stray EMP via a solar flare and your world of electronics is bricked.

>>12737417
you have no idea what an EMP is or how they work

>>12728836
I think when people say "fully fledged automation" they also mean a more generalized Artificial Intelligence and Tool Usage that would allow an AI to do even those types of tasks.
Admittedly, going by the technology we currently have it seems a far way off, but it's only a matter of time.
Remember that it took factories decades after the electric motor was introduced to mass manufacturing to move away from the line shaft model.

>>12734956
I don't know why people think this will be a violent genocide.
We've got far more sophisticated methods for that.

It's been proven time and again that once a population has a sufficiently high enough standard of living, its birthrate begins to decline, so all that needs to be done is use our new found production capacities to make a society of completely pacified people, and just wait for them to die out of their own accord.
It'll be a brave new world.

>>12737427 why that? AI is not that important here except for things like automated vehicles which is probably almost solved or could be solved if roads were adjusted. Furthermore, it's not "an" AI but many algorithms.
Probably most jobs will be lost by trimming away unnecessary jobs via indirect automation and efficiency increases etc instead of the tasks themselvesbeing automated.
Lastly, you assume that the next centuries are comparable to the last ones. We don't even know if we'll make it this far as a civilization. And imo automation as a goal (which in addition get well implemented) is important to ensuring that.

>>12737184
As long as the stock market exist this post isn't true. False capitalist economy/Consumer economy is more likely.

What are the social and economic implications of me conceiving a baby brother for you?

>>12728533
we can focus on understanding death

>>12737451
>It's been proven time and again that once a population has a sufficiently high enough standard of living, its birthrate begins to decline
Classic case of correlation is not causation.

The population will collapse to 15m ( of course no jew will die, that would be antisemitism right? )

>>12737184
>Every biological worker is going to be replaced by mechanical slaves that don't need wages.
And what can these people then afford to buy?

>>12737368
>The rich won't need human workers
That was not the question.

>>12738046
??
The post that was being replied to wasn't a question.

>>12737267
Somebody had to lay out that interface.

>>12738040
they wont afford anything. Simple as.

>>12738135
Another robot designed, built an installed it

>>12728533
Ideally - neetbux for everyone to maximize on the opportunity of developing and exploring human capital

Realistically - mass unemployment and a splinter of society where one portion will descend into nomadic and tribal life styles vs the wealth hoarders obsessed with measuring their dicks who will be too technologically advanced to overthrow French revolution style
It will be hell.

>>12728902
Why exterminate anyone? Make a virus that makes people impotent.

>>12729888
Fuck off commie retard.

>>12738480
This. No one will even realize it until it's too late. Those who can afford it will clone themselves, and the rest of humanity will die off. I'm okay with that, not like there's much time left on the clock for the Earth anyway...

>>12738480
I'll have a robot baby lmao get rekt.

>>12738480
Because the risk of said virus reaching the elites is too great.
Just look how bad they were at containing COVID and that thing was literally created in a lab.

>>12738694
>not like there's much time left on the clock for the Earth anyway...
Pure delusion.
The earth will continue existing as long as the sun burns even if mankind disappears. It's been through alot worse.

>>12728835
>I’m a programmer so I’ll definitely have a wage

Anon once your creations can programme themselves you’ll be the first packing your desk. Victor Frankenstein being the first victim of his monster is the only semblance of justice coming from this

>>12728815
It is not, but people think it is because it is easier to imagine the end of the world than to imagine the end of capitalism.

>muh 8 billions
Of which 1 billion only in the first world, and with a rapidly aging population. So a utopia is possible, resources are plenty.
This is why you have to support politicians that oppose third world immigrants. With too many immigrants, no first world utopia is possible, everything becomes a single blob, and then you, and all your future descendants, will be instead damned to live in favelas forever.

>>12741794
>science board
>discuss politics
ok fag, back to >>>/pol

>>12728835
Ok let's say that programmers like you will retain the job. Programmers are a minority of the minority of skilled workers. The problem is still there. The majority of the population except in a few European countries are unskilled workers who can be automated out of the job market without appeal

>>12741619
What cannot continue will not continue, natural evolution will sort it out eventually. Meanwhile?