/sci/ - Science & Math

>>12646950
Explain how you'd "create" energy with magnets

the magnets must surely lose some magnetism over time when they do this

>>12646955
I put the ball in the front and it accelerates the ball like a projectile

>>12646962
Yes, and you never questioned one who told you.

What if I told you magnets gets stronger over time?

>morpheus.jpg

>>12646950
The magnetic field does no work, so you can't pull any energy out of that. Yeah you can get a ball to roll or something, but tie that to a generator or something and watch it get stuck.

>>12647218
what if you use a big enough ball, on a very slight incline, which rolls to the bottom once its done and falls into a slope that pushes it back to the entrance of the magnets with a small electric pusher which is powered by a generator attached to a wind turbine that is blown by air current created by the balls movements

>>12647231
No, it's that ball has to go it's track in the guide of magnetic line, because it's between south and north, therefore you'd have to have them in perfect balance to produce magnet out of going a metal trough it if metal is there.

>>12647218
The ball can be accelerated and shot out — not just roll.

No one can answer this because jr is free energy

>>12647231
I get exactly what you are saying. Like when your mom queefs on my nuts while I am banging that little anal slut. It give me motivation for a deeper stroke. Overunity expected

>>12646950
Same reason a bow isn't free energy. The energy comes from the guy pulling back.

>>12646950
You need to hold the magnets together. That causes a potential energy to arise, and it's that energy that's converted to kinetic energy of the ball. In this experiment, the ball would accelerate by pushing the magnets apart, and you'd feel it in your hands. But you'll keep your hands locked in to keep the ball moving straight. I.e. the excess energy comes from you holding the magnets.

>>12646950
Creating that system with your hands creates potential energy and letting the ball roll realizes that energy. There's no way to repeat the process and achieve a net gain of energy without exerting the same amount or more to restore the original amount of potential

>>12646968
The same could be done with a ramp. Getting the ball back in front of the magnets without using energy is the hard part

>>12646950
cool, a ball rolls... until it stops at the end of the track. now all you have to do is make it cyclic to get free energy out of it. how do you reset the system to it's initial state without doing more work on it than you extracted from it?

>>12646955
Faraday's law, retard.

>>12647346
ok what if i nail the magnets to the wood.

>>12647540
it can accelerate into another ball at the end which flies with energy.

why can no one provide a clear cut answer to this. this "the energy comes from you holding the two rails together" is idiotic. i could just nail those the board. retards

>>12647562
you wouldn't be able to give the other ball enough energy to transport it back to the start, using only the energy from the initial ball accelerated by the magnets

>>12647299
Sure, make a generator out of it and get work out. You can't, motion alone is not work.

>>12647586
>use magnets to spin magnets
>put wire around it to induce voltage
Pretty simple

>>12647581
because they are retarded
here's a clear cut answer:
this situation is analogous to rolling a ball down a slope. if you place it at the top of the slope, it'll roll down, generating energy (kinetic energy), yes, however then you need to move it back to the top, which requires energy (equal to the energy generated by rolling it down, some of which was dissipated as heat, sound, etc.)
rolling the ball down the hill you're converting gravitational potential energy to kinetic energy
moving the ball back to the top of the hill to go again requires you to convert some form of energy into gravitational potential energy
and no, gravitational potential energy isn't just some abstract and meaningless concept, it makes sense logically - gravity exerts a force on all objects, to go against gravity you need to exert a force that counteracts this (which requires energy)
as an example, the normal force of a table counteracts the gravitational force of an object on the table, preventing it from falling through

in the magnetism scenario, like with the gravity scenario, you have to counteract the magnetic field (~ gravitational force) using energy in order to reset it

>>12647614
The grid already has too much energy, retard. They will use pumps to refill damns to burn off extra energy during low demand times.

Same thing with magnets. When there is low demand on the mag-gen grid just use the excess to move your ball back up the hill

>>12647614
thanks

>>12647625
resetting the "mag-gen grid" requires energy equal to the energy it generated - no net energy generation
(this is also ignoring the fact that you will lose energy to heat, sound, etc. while generating it, so in reality it'll be a net loss, not a net zero)

generating energy from burning fossil fuels differs from this in that you don't reset it, you just bring in new fuel
you convert the chemical potential energy in the fuel into electrical energy (through a process of intermediary conversions), and then discard the fuel which no longer contains any chemical potential energy and get more fuel which does
as an analogy to a gravity based system, it's like finding a rock on a cliff and pushing it off, gaining the kinetic energy from that, and then instead of pushing the same rock back up you go find another rock on a cliff and push it off too, and so on

>>12646950
scale it up and get rich selling electricity back to the grid.

>>12647608
Go ahead, make my day. Become a trillionare and solve climate change. The second you hook it up, the motion will stop. I guarantee it.

>>12646950
Try to extract useful work out of it
Not holding my breath

>>12647560
Energy gets dispersed across the nails, likely loosening them over time. The surrounding environment would heat up due to friction. Likely not by much, since these are small energies.

Eventually the magnets would lose their magnetization.

>>12647231
Wouldn't it be easier just to get some wagie to move the ball?

>>12646962
That timescale thats mostly beyond human lifespan. I think it loses less than 1 percent in 100 years. Assuming no artificial environment/event to degrade the magnets.

So in essence, magnets could be "free" energy.

>>12647958
are you this retarded? Build your shit device and watch it fail. Add some fake mechanism to it and blast it on youtube like all the rest of the schizos.

>>12647958
>So in essence, magnets could be "free" energy.
no, they couldn't.
outside of cosmic timescales, energy is conserved. you can't just create it from nothing.
whatever free-energy device you build will not work, but please, go ahead and prove me wrong.

I thought this board was just retarded, but I can't figure it out either.

I guess it's because it takes work to pick up the ball and place it back at the start of the rail, but I don't see how that work could be comparable to the kinetic energy it acquires. It gets even more complicated when you consider that forces between metals and magnets are not conservative, which means the idea of potential energy shouldn't even apply here.

>>12648033
>>12648036
Maglevs exists dumb ass. Its not free as in free beer, but its "free" as in close enough to requiring very little energy to push ton of mass. Combine that with vacuum tube and you get a means of transportation that doesnt have to deal with resistance very much.

This type of concept has been explored in research across the countries over the years in many ways.

>>12648038
There are actually similar builds that ive been working on since 2007 that actually do generate "free" energy.

You know those flashlights that build a charge and light up just from shaking a magnet inside of a coil? Same method.

Imagine a bicycle rim with magnets surrounding the entire outside, positioned according to effect. Now on the outside of the wheel, we place a stationary wheel on the outside that surrounds the entire wheel, this stationary wheel also has magnets positioned to repel/attract. In this wheel, we install a mechanism that moves a piece of this outer stationary wheel after one full rotation, we're creating magnetic drag similar to the lenz effect, right before a full rotation, the RPM of the inner wheel will slow due to the moving mechanism, then speed back up once this stationary piece goes back to it's original location.

This creates an endless spin for the inner wheel. Similar work has been done with the Searl Generator, but that's more of a concept than an actual free energy device. To make this generate energy, we need to add coils between the magnets of the inner and outer wheels to pick up the magnetic charge (same as the shake flashlight). We run into some issues though, we need to direct this current into a mechanism that will power the inner wheel to spin, this will increase speeds beyond natural repulsion and give us a greater output, and the best method of doing this is not with copper wire, but gold, or supercooled copper by means of dry ice/nitrogen.

I have a project in my garage that has been spinning for a little over 6 months with no external power input, but the power output is little more than enough to power a standard house lightbulb. Yes, "free energy" is real, and does exist behind the 2nd law of thermodynamics, but the power output is too low to be used in a practical mean. For now. Perhaps a larger machine or stronger magnets, or superconductors, hell maybe even capacitors, may prove fruitful.

Am I wrong to think the situation would be essentially the same if all of the magnets were unmoving negative charges, and the ball were a positive charge? That would make it a very straightforward conservative system, as >>12647614 suggested, but magnets aren't nearly that simple.

>>12648058
To follow up, most of the youtube videos on free energy are 100% scams, rejects trying to cash in $50 on youtube views. And most of the people in this thread denying your ideas are jews shilling for big oil because they were told laws of thermodynamics are set in stone, they are not laws, they are standards of current understanding. Our physics are being re-defined every decade, and magnetic generators are the biggest enemy (aside from water powered cars) of the global elite who hold the world by it's balls with electricity and oil.

>>12648058
Pics or it didn't happen

>>12648058
>I have a project in my garage that has been spinning for a little over 6 months with no external power input
Bullshit.

>>12648064
>water powered cars
The inevitable conclusion of this shit thread has come.

>>12648088
>>12648097
Dont dox me u virgins

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7pshopTNkPA

>>12648114
Wait, you're on the science board, and you're telling me seperating hydrogen to burn from H2O to propel an engine is not possible?

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

What a smoothbrained faggot.

>>12648114
Why do we have high school drop outs on this board? You know we DO have water powered cars on the road right now, right?

You do know you can switch most vehicles over to burn hydrogen, right?

You do know a man was poisoned and killed by the government for refusing to sell his patent on this because it would cripple world governments and is documented fact, right?

Go back to /b/ you fucking retard.

>>12647530
/thread

>>12648115
If it isn't getting any power what are all those fucking wires doing?

>>12648120
Hydrogen =/= water

>>12648152
i have other videos that explain, but those are output from the coil i was using to feed back in. The initial spin was started with my finger.

>>12648156
Then unplug them and show it still working.

>>12648154
Yes, I'm confused on how you learnt to read/write english if you're having trouble understanding that separating hydrogen from water is somthing easily done by the dumbest of rednecks.

>>12648160
>separating hydrogen from water
Makes it not water.

>>12648164
Uh, yes.
I'm still missing the point?
You're consuming water to create hydrogen.

>>12648054
OP claimed "free energy", which means you can produce energy for free. What you describe is a system which has very low energy loss, which will maintain motion for a long time, but that is not free energy since when you try to extract energy from the system you will slow the motion. Regardless, OP's image isn't maglev, it's just an inhomogenous magnetic field producing acceleration on the ball. It isn't lifting the ball up, the ball just rolls in a channel so will lose some energy due to friction there.

>>12648167
And how do you do that?

>>12648168
>>12648054
To add, creating a very low friction system that maintains motion for a long time is "free energy" in the same way that your bank account is "free money": when you extract money from it your account balance goes down.

>>12648169
Electrolysis is the process of using electricity to split water into hydrogen and oxygen. This reaction takes place in a unit called an electrolyzer.

>>12648175
Congratulations, "water" powered cars are actually just electric cars.

>>12648178
please feel free to look up the amount of electricity needed to separate hydrogen from water, and kindly shut the fuck up retard.

>>12648183
So you're saying there is a car where all you do is just put water in it and it runs and then when it is out of water you just put water in it again and it runs?

>>12648189
Yep

>>12648191
Prove it.

>>12648121
I guess, but a slope is not a free energy source because gravity is a conservative field. How can you say the same about the forces between the ball and the magnets, if magnetic fields are not conservative?

>>12648193
magnetic fields are conservative

>>12648199
They are not you fucking moron

>>12646950
Free energy doesn't exi...

>>12646950
You need more magnets for free energy.

>>12647530
>put ball on loop from your hotwheels set
>ball now returns to its starting position by itself
>???
>profit

>>12648120
Oh wow, I didn't know there were still HHO cranks out there, you're a rare breed these days

I understand that magnets are a zero sum game but I’ve read this whole thread now and I fail to see how OP’s image isn’t an example of, in some capacity, ‘free energy’. The ball would accelerate and shoot out like a projectile. Nothing was done; the ball was placed at the front of the magnets. I understand it’s not a repeatable cycle that can be harnessed but did this apparatus not just fire a projectile using nothing but magnetism? How is that not energy ?

>>12648058
100% schizo bs

>>12648192
That guy is retarded. That shit doesn’t exist. Do you know how that hydrogen is compressed into those tanks? Ignoring the illegal lithium isotope you need to fucking do it in the first place, you run a gasoline generator for 8+ hours lmao

>>12648239
It's not free energy because resetting it consumes more energy than you get out of it. If you define that as free energy then everything is free energy and the word has no point and a new definition which I now call free-free energy must be created.

>>12648259
>find hole in ground
>throw rock in
>it shoots it back out

You’re just arguing semantics. Perhaps it’s not a sustaining system; but in practice it’s free energy.

>>12648278
>in practice

>>12648278
Wrong.

>>12646950
assuming that is free energy, then everything is free energy, dumbfag

>>12648239
you are harvesting energy stored in the magnet, you're not using free energy.

you do so because magnetized the ball for a second, thus giving some of the magnetization of the magnet to your ball. the magnet will lose magnetization over time and you'll have to use another magnet. guess how much energy it took for the magnet to be magnetized in the first place ?

also you're not spending much because you're only giving an initial speed to the system.

>>12648278
do you include the demagnetization of your magnet and the energy required to magnetize one or do you just assume that you have free infinite magnets for life ?
you are a fucking retard, and the people on this thread are even bigger retards because they somehow only managed to bring up the "resetting again would cost more energy" argument

>>12648239
magnets are not even a zero sum game
if you move an object through a magnetic field you create a current which in turn creates heat loss. also, magnetizing an object means taking potential energy from the oriented dipoles within your magnets, which means that AT some point your system will stop working as the energy to remagnetize your magnet is equal to the energy that you've spent in your system. But since you have lost part of that energy through eddy currents, you will not be able to remagnetize your dipole at the same level, thus getting weaker magnets overtime and making you a nigger in the process.

t. phd in applied electromagnetics

>>12648309
Magnets don’t store energy.

>>12648314
This is a stupid argument and you know it. Magnets demagnetize over hundreds of years. There are way better arguments to make than >hurr durr magnets weaken over time

>>12648344
magnets demagnetize over hundreds of years if LEFT ALONE you retard

keep moving shit in a magnetic field all day and your magnets wont be worth shit in a few years

again, its natural to assume that you can get infinite energy if you have INFINITE MAGNETS

>>12648337
magnets store potential energy through their oriented dipoles, please shut the fuck up

>>12648353
cont. again, im not saying they are bad at storing enough energy to blast shit away for a long time, im just saying that they're storing it because someone PUT said energy in it.

its like someone put tons of MWh in a battery, gave you that battery, and because it doesnt seem to empty itself quickly you now believe you have a source of free energy. how retarded is that ?

>>12646950
Can you make the ball run the course repeatedly without using energy?

>>12648120
there has been breathtaking advances since Stan Myers was murdered.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F3DfryeUUuU

Just fill the tank with salt-water & the car does the rest.

>>12646955

>>12648120
there has been breathtaking advances since Stan Myers was murdered.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F3DfryeUUuU
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E_e9WAO1IO8

Just fill the tank with salt-water & the car does the rest.

>>12649025
Do it, nigger.
Do it right now.

>>12646950
Please, read ANYTHING about how physics works before posting. That way we don't have to waste brain cells on this garbage.

>>12649041
Congratulations again, this is just a battery in absentia. Where the chemical separation (charging) happens at the gas(salt?) station. The car isn't powered by H20 it's powered by the salts. The H20 is just a solvent.

>>12649478
>Congratulations again?
wtf are you rambling about this post is my 2nd post in this thread.
if you're having a debate with another anon then take your shit out with him.

If you want examples of HH0 internal-combustion-engine vehicles then go & fuckn google it yourself.
I couldn't care less.

>>12646950
Don't bother asking, free energy is not in the best interest of the j00s.

>>12649519
You're a retard and no cars are powered by water.

>>12649446
I don't have to read shit you stupid redditor. If I put a ball in front of this, it gets shot out. That is free energy. Go fuck yourself

>>12649851
>no cars are powered by water
of course not, its the Hydrogen that goes bang.
or its used in an electric fuel-cell.

water don't go bang, bro.....
did you actually think thats what the other anon meant?
you really this fucked in the head, bro?

>>12648120
>HHO saves fuel on classic cars
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RS3LWAkoM7Q
kek Nostalgia.

>>12646950
energy had to be put into the magnets in the first place. magnets are not free energy, nor stay they magnetic forever.

>>12648228
This is how you find out it won't work.

>>12650117
that fucking oxy-hydrogen gas rusts your motor block to shit

How is picrel not free energy? it's literally in the name

>>12650301
yep, it sure did.
even more so once the Japanese imports got popular with their light-alloy engines.
thats why you only did it for fun on old bombs.

if you look around you should be able to find custom-build engines made to withstand water.
not sure if they're still around, never saw one IRL.

>>12646950
>free energy
isn't this akin to the idea of a perpetuum mobile?
some motion produces endless motion is the wrong paradigm

standstill produces endless motion

some motion is not directly linked with endless motion
standstill on the other hand is directly linked with endless motion
people wrongly assume that standstill means there is nothing happening

according to Nietzsche (Eternal recurrence) & Camus (Sisyphos) enormous amounts of energy are needed to transition & uphold the state of standstill

>>12646950
what is it about idiots and pseuds and magnets?

>>12648323
*diff anon
sorry for butting in
>magnets lol windings lol that shit is pointless.
>t. phd in applied electromagnetics
jeez, you guys always this pessimistic with designers of alternators?

(disclaimer: I am in no way encouraging OP)

How are you all this retarded? When you place the ball in the field, or otherwise configure the field, you are increasing the potential energy of the ball. Just because you can't see the potential energy being converted I to kinetic doesn't mean it's just coming from nowhere. Pushing the ball into the starting position cannot be done without an external force to push against the repulsive magnetic field.

>>12650282
ITT: people claiming to have proof of free energy can't even assemble their own models out of toys to test their hypotheses

>>12650472
>their own models out of toys to test their hypotheses
*diff anon
sorry for butting in
out of old toys?
wtf are you talking about?
Every single design I've ever seen ever is utter shit designed by a fuckn idiot >>12646950 >>12649025.
one look at them and its OBVIOUS they won't work.
a fuckn child could see it.

Everyone has their own blue-prints on how to generate electricity at an "extremely" low cost but the type of Rare Earth & high permeability/permittivity Materials & precision EDM cutting, mill and Lathe work your talking about is fuckn expensive.

$150,000 prototype minimum
Patents are the stupidest approach possible.
The electricity itself is worth thousands of trillions of dollars per year in the USA, alone.

Coca-Cola is a trade secret & is still going strong a century later.

Patents will only result in China ripping you off.
Non-Disclosure-Agreements are useless unless you can legally prove that co-incidental similar design on the other side of the planet is directly connected with the company you trusted with your blueprints.

(disclaimer: I am in no way encouraging OP)

>>12648116
negative brain cells
>>12648120
still breathing over here. Also seems to need to be refueled and not just recharged. Guessing the salts can be separated at some factory. You know what that makes this? A 240 pound battery pack. Fucking crank.

To the retards who think we can use magnets to make perpetual energy WITHOUT an input of electricity, design something in paint and let us roast you.

>>12649025
The ball would stop at the last magnet, like in the video OP posted. If by some luck you actually got the polarities right, you'd not have enough kinetic energy generated to make the ball travel all the way up to the generator and push through its turbine. Even if you did for the first couple of goes (when you most likely pushed the ball in with your hand), it will still eventually fail.

>>12650611
Even the linear design is retarded. These people are completely clueless.
Think like a tether ball, but the rope is rigid. Pole is affixed to some bearing surface at the green locations. Ball is the magnet, but it could be a bar. At the ball layer, mount magnets in whatever bullshit infinity stone orientation and distances. Always find ball reaches equilibrium at location with maximum average magnetic field strength.

These retards always do the mistake of orienting the circle against gravity to make the gravity/magnetic interaction some sort of convoluted source of energy. This thing could easily be turned on its side with no effective change and find a result where resting position now factors in some gravitation potential offset.

>>12650722
Brainlet here, it's because the idea is to harvest usable energy from gravity.
If it's on it's side then it's too obvious it doesn't work because friction clearly is taking away from any kinetic energy the magnet might be imparting.

>>12650741
So it is supposed to generate energy but it can't even overcome friction from bearing surfaces? Sounds fake and gay to me.

>pop a sleep pill half an hour ago
>I can still play one last battle before having to go to bed
>battle drags on due to a fucking AF camper
>fuckit, I'll try diving on him
>miss entirely, smash on the runway
>wtf
>mfw the sleeping pill is at full effect already and I have lost all coordination and responsiveness

>>12650722
You'd have to angle the magnets to push it on its axis, and their push alone isn't enough to create continuous motion, because their pull still takes effect on the ball. Also, you've interchanged gravitational forces with friction forces.