/sci/ - Science & Math

>>12539188
Based edition. Will colonies have unique aesthetics or will they likely just be dull and utilitarian?

>>12539188
First for THE NATIONAL TEAM!!!!

>>12539202
Wow ha ha space is hard! Better divert everyone’s tax dollars to every state in the USA and funnel billions into bloated architecture and logistics :^D

>>12539198
If SpaceX is the first to make a colony, they'll probably make it aesthetically pleasing, kind of like Dragon V.2

>>12539198
If it's SpaceX, they will deliberately spend money to make it cool. Especially the bars.

>>12539202
>notional

>>12539202
>2028
>costs more than the entire American Space program after Apollo combined
>finally lands
>get arrested
>Astronauts get deported by the People's Republic of China

>>12539198
At some point NASA will probably want their own satellite colony to attach to the spacex one. They will likely offer to build and pay for their own hardware and habitats with gooberment money. You can bet your ass it will be the most dull and utilitarian part of the colony. Also if roscosmos ever joins us it will either look like the ghetto part of town, or it will be sexy soviet wave. It will most likely be the former, not the latter

Daily reminder there is no evidence AGI is possible. It is equivalent to belief in God, only there’s no logical arguments for it.

>>12539224
lmao no, after spacex owns the solar system nasa will be defunded or dissolved

>>12539198
You can have both utilitarian and aesthetics. See SpaceX/Tesla.

>>12539225
>spaceflight general

>>12539225
The existence of generalized intelligence suggests the possibility of AGI. For humans not to prove the possibility of AGI simply by existing, you'd have to prove something innate and unique to human consciousness that could not be replicated.

>>12539225
Ah the 'everything I don't think is possible is fallacious and equivalent to belief in God' poster. Getting a fresh start on shitting up this thread, I see.

>>12539225
How exactly is AGK impossible. It actually seems rather simple, just have a machine aware of its own existence.

>The prophesies we're true

>>12539240
>It actually seems rather simple
That’s been said about a fuckton of things before which weren’t and aren’t actually simple.

Reminder that Musk will always be subservient to the all-mighty and all-powerful Federal Government of the United States of America. They could shut him down with the snap of a finger and the signature of a few disgruntled oligarchs

>>12539245
Ok but what’s so hard about AGI? I’m not very versed on the subject aside from PopSci shows

>>12539237
>The existence of generalized intelligence suggests the possibility of AGI

No it doesn’t. One substance being able to do a thing does not suggest any other thing can do that thing whatsoever.

> For humans not to prove the possibility of AGI simply by existing

Complex organic life being conscious does not suggest in any way that a computer could be conscious. That’s a bizarre non sequitur.

>>12539246
Sir I believe you have a poor understanding of the US legal system

>>12539202
And to think if Congress hadn't been greedy little shits about their shuttlestack contractor jobs we could've had a kerolox Saturn VI SLS to do direct lunar ascents again.

>>12539253
This doesn’t mean it’s impossible either, and even then, how can you prove something is conscious or not?

>>12539253
Why can't we make an organic computer? And why do you think meat has some magical property that silicon doesn't? You keep making claims that rely on completely unfounded midwit assertions.

>>12539246
>They could shut him down with the snap of a finger and the signature of a few disgruntled oligarchs
They could try it. China would welcome him with open arms in that situation, as they have with Tesla.

>>12539252
>Ok but what’s so hard about AGI?
No coherent pathway to it exists in the field. Modern neural networks are ultimately just programs that get fed training data of, say, dog pictures, and use that training data to produce “new” pictures of dogs which can be more and more convincing the longer it trains. There’s some very loose resemblance to a biological nervous system but it has none of the nuance or dynamic ability.

>>12539253
Let's break this down. What makes meat special?
>complex
Modern computer chips are so finely and intricately made that they have to account for quantum tunneling effects.
>organic
So is carbon special in some way?
>life
Is self replication required for consciousness? Homeostasis? What about "life" do you think has magical properties?

There is no reason to believe an organic computer is inherently superior to a silicon one.

>>12539216
Its a real word for hypothetical bullshit that will never ever happen

>>12539259
>Why can't we make an organic computer?
Oh, we can, and I think biological living machines are vastly more likely than some goofy C3-PO or Skynet shit.

> And why do you think meat has some magical property that silicon doesn't?
The empirical observation that silicon is shittier at forming compounds to an extent that makes life based on it unfeasible, and the fact that transistors are not analogs of neurons.

>>12539225
>>12539237
>>12539238
>>12539240
>>12539245
>>12539252
>>12539253
>>12539257
>>12539259
>>12539262
For fuck’s sake. Make an AI general you retards. Go away.

>>12539225
>freewheel apologist

Post more colony designs instead.

>>12539270
>What makes meat special?

Neurons are made of meat and non-carbon based meat is conjecture at best. Transistors don’t operate like neurons.

>>12539275
Who the heck is Freewheel?

>>12539276
Funny enough Robert Zubrin’s original Mars Direct presentation from 1990 proposes a vehicle capable of sending 16 people to mars at a time. He sees 16 flying per transfer window, so 100 people/year on average. He found that after 50 years of 100 people per year (200 every other year) there would be 10,000 or so people on Mars.

>>12539285
A fictional deity that exists outside of physical world and is responsible for intelligence being special and unreplicable by artificial means

>>12539297
Sounds based. Bet he’s friends with Yaldabaoth

>>12539297
What if the real reason intelligence is not replicable by artificial means is we're giving ourselves too much credit for non-instinctive behavior?

>>12539302
What if the reason is something incredibly obvious like “dur the brain is like computer and computer is like brain” is a retarded analogy that should stop being made?

>people banking on a successful mars colony
>We still don't even know if gestation is possible in mars gravity

The real use for all of this mass to orbit is for resource extraction, not Redditor Lebensraum.

Is there a specific name for the ion engines SpaceX uses on Starlink sats?

Zubrin smelling fiends rise up! What kind of cologne does he wear bros, do we have any evidence? Can someone tweet at him? Fyi guys, Zubrin is totally down with doing rando interviews with people he barely knows. A 4ASS-sponsored interview is absolutely in the cards bros. All it takes us one crazy anon. We can crowdsource questions for him. You already know what I'll ask him ;)
1) Choice of cologne?
2a) What do you smell like without cologne?
2b) What do you smell like after a week without bathing?
3) Are your hugs warm?
4) Are your handshakes strong?
5) Would you be willing to part with an unwashed shirt that you have worn?

>>12539202

>>12539225
there is a PANDEMIC!!!
Trust science

>>12539329
>We still don't even know if gestation is possible in mars gravity

Figure out whether or not it is. If it isn’t, then have kids in orbit in centrifugal space stations. Problem solved

>>12539332
WTF anon

>>12539293
I really hope Zubrin lives to see the beginnings of Mars colonization.

>>12539337
Just live in the stations then.

>>12539332
At least this is /sfg/ related. Thank you based Zubrin-smell-poster.

>>12539343
Mars has the resources, so you can just go down on work shifts

>>12539337
I almost hope it requires 1G because it would mean instead of some gay Expanse setting where everyone starts political slapfights and borderline speciation based on the gravity their mom got knocked up in we have the potential of a spinny-grav space empire stretching across the galaxy with planets for resource extraction and long term terraforming.

>>12539333
>expendable
Please tell me those are edits

>>12539348
Mars resources are stuck at the bottom of a gravity well, asteroid resources are not.

>>12539349
I’m really pissed I waited so long to watch The Expanse. The world building is exactly what I want out of space sci-fi.

>>12539356
Season 1 is the only good season

>>12539355
Fuck off, belter. Those resources are necessary for the eventual terraforming of Mars.

>>12539349
Same

>>12539353
Yes. The original has expendable launch vehicles in the first panel, then Vulcan in the rest because I guess it’s not expendable or some shit.

I talked to Tory Bruno about the C1000 plan and it’s actually a great idea.

>>12539356
What kills me is that instead of taking the setting for how it was and letting it evolve naturally he had to inject OOGA BOOGA SPACE MAGIC and WORMHOLES into it. If I wanted a setting with spin-grav human ships and gate based FTL I'd rewatch Babylon 5.

>>12539358
2 and 3 are pretty good. 5 is great so far. 4 is just awful. Sadly I can't even blame the adaptation for it, it's a faithful adaptation of a terrible book.

>>12539349
That could be solved by disabling the mechanisms that make our bodies go to waste when not under exertion. Imagine getting /fit/ once and never having to do PT again.

>>12539358
I’m just getting into season 2, and enjoying it so far. I definitely see it going after the whole alien virus rabbit hole, which is a shame, but the world more than makes up for it so far.

>>12539356
Why the fuck did The Expanse have to have DUDE WORMHOLESSSS in it? Ruined it for me even though it’s still fun. Why can’t we have good interplanetary Sci fi that doesn’t move at a glacier’s pace?

I really liked Call of Duty: Infinite Warfare, though

Why don't we just put astronauts on Artemis 1? It has a launch escape plus it is overdesigned and tested so it is inherently safe. What is NASA so scared of bros? Not like a single unmanned launch proves it's safe lol. Shuttle flew people on the first launh, and that was way more dangerous. Is NASA pussies now?

>>12539365
Physical fitness would stop being impressive if it was easy to get fit.

How the FUCK is anyone going to survive on Mars for more than a few months? The effects of microgravity are catastrophic and cumulative. Human fetuses will not gestate properly either.

>>12539365
That would be fantastic.
>Earth-grav station for mothers and small children
>GAINZSTATION 13 for teenagers at 2.5g getting them in flawless shape
>they stay in flawless shape for their entire adult lives even floating in the void
All you'd need is sleeper ship tech with ~0.2c cruising speed for interstellar colonization to be eminently feasible.

>>12539362
>then Vulcan in the rest because I guess it’s not expendable or some shit.
muh SMART
>I talked to Tory Bruno about the C1000 plan and it’s actually a great idea.
In person? Lucky. Tory's a cool guy but he's trying to steer an asteroid with an ion drive when it comes to ULA corporate culture.

>>12539368
The authors ran out of ideas so switched to dollar-store stargate/revelation space combo

Andy weir wrote a book called Artemis. I heard it sucked. so why are they making it into a movie?

>>12539364
Yeah, I’d love to see a show set a bit before the events of the series. It seems like the most realistic space colonial future presented in popular media, and I’d love to see more of it. Hell, just take Firefly, but make the crew belter smugglers trying to keep their independence in the face of increasing bureaucratic pressures from both Earth and Mars.

>>12539368
Writing good interplanetary scifi that isn't just "Star Trek without warp drive" gets really difficult because the authors actually have to know their ass from their elbows when it comes to the physics and engineering challenges of space life, AND have the ability to write an engaging plot. That's a very small population of authors.

>>12539377
Nah over the phone but still it was really cool. You can tell that he legitimately loves space but he’s stuck in charge of an organization that is okay with being second best. He had nothing but good things to say about Boeing and all that which sounded like he had a gun to his head but still, he’s genuinely excited about Vulcan. He also said that Hydrolox will reign supreme in the Cislunar domain mainly because you can actually mine it on the moon while methane is impossible to make there.

Good guy, through and through. He gave me a free gift from ULA because I put a picture of Vulcan on my Prom poster for my gf

>>12539356
>The Expanse
>The authors describe their racial blend as "aspirational." "Part of the mandate when you're writing a future is to write the kind of future you want to see," says (((Abraham))). "Not that we're utopian, but the idea of a future where it's less mixed and interesting than my immediate day-to-day life would have been weird."
>The people who make it out into space, it's not just going to be Neil Armstrong, clean-cut, classically white Americans.

https://www.theverge.com/2016/2/25/11103434/syfy-the-expanse-series-diverse-cast
Enjoy your reddit tier anti-White propaganda lmao.

>>12539380
The Martian made a lot of money, and studio execs have a tendency to bet on previous success.

There is no way SN9 will launch. It literally fell over. Elon is doing this to flex for an ego trip, same with all his nonsense twitter ramblings about no landing legs. Fool

>>12539389
The writers are cucks lmao

>>12539387
>He also said that Hydrolox will reign supreme in the Cislunar domain mainly because you can actually mine it on the moon while methane is impossible to make there.
Well he's right about that. It will also probably dominate the outer system for the same reason, along with LH2 nuclear for higher Isp burns. Starship is entirely and completely the Conestoga wagon of Mars colonization, and that's fine.

>>12539389
I'm starting to wonder if the lack of modern scifi with the USA led by good, competent, white men is due to deliberate (((publisher suppression))).

>>12539387
hello fellow redditor

>>12539373
Why is it a problem?

>>12539385
It also doesn't help that all our planets are shitholes except earth

>>12539393
>There is no way SN9 will launch. It literally fell over. Elon is doing this to flex for an ego trip, same with all his nonsense twitter ramblings about no landing legs. Fool

>>12539393
>there's no way this rocket that's sitting on a launch pad undergoing preflight testing will fly

>>12539393
thunderf4gg0t please go

>>12539400
The late 20th century planet probes were fantastic for science but terrible for science fiction. On the other hand you can probably get some mileage out of "The morning star is literally Hell" if you want to play up the religious angle.

>>12539403
You could've said the same thing about SLS

>>12539400
Good thing our shithole planets have moons that aren't

>>12539394
here's your Martian Marine Corps LMAO

>>12539411
The gas giants' moons are absolutely shitholes. The definition of "not a shithole planet" is "walking outdoors without a space suit and touching the ground with your bare skin won't horribly kill you."

>>12539413
she is a strong woman. i want her to crack my skull like a nut between her thighs. humina humina!

>>12539329
Test it then. Take 5 female astronauts, impregnate them and stick them on the ISS for 8 months. Then bring them down and let them give birth. Study the children through adulthood

>>12539415
>>12539413
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u2sRgwMHLG0
ahahahah what the fuck is this literal reddit tier crap holy fucking shit people actually watch and enjoy this retarded fucking show

>>12539414
Lol, by your definition then every other celestial body we know of is a shithole. You have no conception of how impossibly rare the conditions to comfortably support human life are

>>12539421
yep. everything after season 1 is objectively shit, faithful or not (the books arent good btw). best part about season 1? tom waits

>>12539424
>Lol, by your definition then every other celestial body we know of is a shithole.
yes

>>12539425
>Have a great character
>He fucking dies right off the bat
Many shows do this but he was literally the deuteragonist of Leviathan Wakes.

>>12539425
Should have kept him and killed off captain faggot of the Don Quixote

>>12539432
Who wants to bet that Roci gets blown up in the last book

>>12539425

>>12539425
when his ghost started glitching back into reality i realized how much i missed him and how much shittier the show was after he was gone

>>12539424
the rest of the solar system, in it's current state, is kind of a shithole

>>12539246
China would be glad to take the SpaceX team, they happily drop rocket stages on villages do you think they'll give a single fuck about "Planetary Protection".

>>12539424
Every other place in the solar system is a shithole, which is why colonization of anywhere is hard as fuck.

>>12539246
Lol the American government will put untrained nogs on the moon just for the sake of diversity
>ayo where da popeye chicken at in dis mothafucka?

>>12539454
Genius, really.
>fill up a freighter with astronogs
>shove them out the airlock in poorly donned biodegradeable space suits suits and let them all die
>shove them into the recyclers later
>lie to everyone back home and say the population of Space Wakanda is all healthy

>>12539421
it's not perfect but overall it's kino

>>12539421
Eh it's pretty reddit teir, but the space shit is closer to reality than any Starcringe trash.

>>12539460
wow very based show, pajeets and other nonwhites running the UN gassing other pajeets and nonwhites who were born on the wrong asteroid!

>>12539446
>>12539451
>>12539426
So something either has the most perfect environment in the universe or it's a shithole? There's no middle ground anywhere, and subsurface oceans/dense nitrogen atmosphere/geologic activity/habitable climate/mineral composition mean nothing? Why bother going anywhere with this mentality

>>12539474
The Expanse is a dystopia and much more enjoyable when you accept that. Naomi is the author's social justice self-insert and survives through sheer grace of plot armor.

>>12539476
>So something either has the most perfect environment in the universe or it's a shithole?
By the standards of mass colonization, yes. Early colonists will be people who understand they're going on one way trips to live out their lives in horrendous shitholes because the other aspects of living in space make up for it in some way.

>>12539465
classic star cringe doesn't have a cast of literal ogros de las americas shitting it up. Lmao nonwhites will NEVER be as kino in uniform.

>>12539476
Venus is literally hell, Mars is a fixer upper, the Jovian moons and beyond are cold and dark. Mercury is a forgeworld and solar fortress. Luna is boring and dead.

>>12539474
90% chance that humanity looks muddy brown as a whole in the next 100 years, except for the ((((elite)))) who are still 100% ashenkazi.

Nothing wrong with it, as most mutts are Catholic

>>12539476
Adequate atmospheric pressure is a bare minimum to not be a shithole.

>>12539483
Ted Cruz on the left

>>12539368
>glacier's pace
The Expanse had reactionless drive to begin with, it was never slow.
Without wormhole you didn't have other system at all.
The trick to have a Space Opera with long travel isn't to avoid FTL, it's to build your FTL in a way that everything else don't need have impossibly fast engine.

Typical example is to have jump point you have to reach with normal propulsion, like say "The mote's in god eye".

>>12539511
>The Expanse had reactionless drive to begin with, it was never slow.
It's a fusion drive with some handwaving efficiency multiplier. Water propellant.

https://toughsf.blogspot.com/2019/10/the-expanses-epstein-drive.html

>>12539511
FTL isn’t inherently soft Sci fi, but it is definitely very very speculative. Very speculative Sci fi would be interstellar vessels with humans. Speculative Sci fi would have colonization of other worlds as we are still not 100% sure if it’s doable.

Also the Xeelee books are a great hard sci fi series that really abuses the fuck out of the laws of physics while staying at the very least speculative

>>12539511
Firefly for all its cringe did this ok. It was set in some other star system with about 3 stars and dozens of habitable planets and moons.

>>12539515
I always got the sense that nuclear salt water (or lithium salt water) was the closest real life equivalent to an Epstein Drive.

>>12539246
Ayo wait up fascist no whitey on the moon allowed. We all in this together.

>>12539522
What would a “realistic” rocinante look like? Would it have giant propellant tanks and huge radiators but otherwise look the same?

>>12539486
Cloudtops of venus are the closest thing to earth conditions in our solar system

>>12539520
Yeah, it was helped by the sheer volume of potential locations. You could probably write a similar story in our solar system if you can come up with a convincing way to convert icy Kuiper Belt objects into habitable environments. Digging O’Neil cylinders into the thousands of rocks out their would create an effectively limitless number of places for the characters to visit.

>>12539529
O'Neil cylinders lack romance. It's like visiting an apartment block.

>>12539525
Yeah, the lack of fuel storage and heat management systems is the only thing really lacking (assuming Zubrin’s musings on NSWR turn out to be sound) for a realistic vehicle imo.

>>12539534
This.

>>12539529
I don’t know why having stories set on the surfaces of various celestial bodies can’t be engaging. Imagine having a D-Day story but set during the Liberation of Mercury campaign in the great Titan - Coalition War of 2243

>>12539526
There's many reasons we don't have giant floating cities on Earth. All of them apply to Venus, and then some.

>>12539539
Yep! Reason #1 - no CO2 atmosphere
Oh wait

>>12539529
The Oort Cloud extends over a light year from the sun, right? What are the odds of turning on your interstellar drive and bonking into some random comet at relativistic speeds a couple years later?

>>12539536
I prefer this guy's 6Li-D fusion NSWR variant. Linking the Atomic Rockets quotebox because the original article is on Linkedin.
http://www.projectrho.com/public_html/rocket/enginelist2.php#lswr

>>12539525
Rule of space
>if most of the mass isn't radiators or fuel tanks its magic

The various ships depicted is like a man imagining how he'll cross the atlantic - on a horse that can walk on water. Yes... it kinda works if you had it it... but its retarded.

>>12539539
It's not necessary or practical on earth.

>>12539329
It's mind boggling how some can suggest doing that without proper studies.
>>12539417
That's utterly unethical and wrong. Full stop.

>>12539510
kek

>>12539539
Ever heard of cruise ships?

>>12539515
That's bullshit under a more "real" name.
Ship should have half of their mass in propellant, not counting the radiator for those energy source.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JWZqp0QoXcw
http://www.projectrho.com/public_html/rocket/enginelist3.php#epstein

>>12539517
Of course it's not realistic. Just like planning your space battle to have crewed spaceship, ship that use armor and limited firing range. There's plenty of reason to think space warfare with conventional vehicle may not be possible.

>>12539520
>Firefly
As good and deserving of twenty season it is, was purely soft-SF so it didn't matter to bother looking drive efficiency and FTL
It might have well been (more) like Cowboy Bebop with alternative space gate, minus the need to cover the entire length in rings.

>>12539542
Reason #1: the logistics of getting things to a giant floating city don't make any sense
Reason #2: giant floating cities are dramatically limited in their local resource production to basically atmospheric capture and sunlight, exacerbating the first problem

Benis Cloud City on Venus would require importing literally all raw materials from Earth because the surface is inaccessible

>>12539545
There are degrees of magic. "Assume we have bulk room temperature superconductors" is low magic. Star Trek is blatant wizardry. Star Wars is literal magic with spaceships instead of horses.

>>12539543
The Kuiper Belt is significantly closer than the Oort Cloud. Regardless, between the lack of volume density and the existence of radar, a ship shouldn’t have to worry too much about impacts with big objects like comets.

>>12539552
Surface of Venus is perfectly accessible with remote mining gear. The economy of Venus can be targeted at exporting gases to Mars.

>>12539556
>Surface of Venus is perfectly accessible with remote mining gear.
Electronics literally do not work on the surface for more than a few seconds before being destroyed by heat and pressure. Those are going to be some mighty long robot arms.

>>12539551
>purely soft-SF so it didn't matter to bother looking drive efficiency and FTL
True, but the setting (tons of habitable moons in a trinary system with no FTL) would’ve held up pretty well if they chose to go that route.

>>12539559
The key modules can be refrigerated in various ways. You're talking like Thunderf4g, snap out of it.

>>12539559
Good thing all your electronics involving semi conductors aren't mounted on them.

>>12539547
And? You have a better suggestion faggot?

>>12539559
>how can a dozers work on mars if there's no oxygen to burn the diesel fuel?
>spacefag colonialists btfo!
>subscribe please!

>>12539556
>Surface of Venus is perfectly accessible

>>12539547
Dumb moralfag holding back real research

>>12539561
Firefly’s setting is a neat compromise. As far as we know interstellar travel and colonization is indeed possible. Maybe not FTL, but definitely by fusion engines or even Orion drives

>>12539564
>moralfag
>suggestion

Other than "do as I say"?

>>12539566
What's the issue?

>>12539547
>That's utterly unethical and wrong
That's how you know the Chinese are already working on it.

>>12539534
>>12539537
That's only if you build all Colony all on the same model and expect them to be mining outpost.
If you start moving asteroid or the colonies around to put them where you want, you'll have gigantic space HUB with billion of habitant and the freedom to have any themed interior you dare make.

Imagine Space Dubai except that instead of building a Ski slope in the middle of the desert, you have a pseudo-Alpine colony a train away from a tropical sea one.

>>12539539
Yet
But fuck Venus

>>12539568
As far as I’m aware, the ships that colonized the system in Firefly were either generation ships or sleeper ships. It never really specifies beyond the fact that the system was settled a long time ago by people escaping a resource-deprived Earth.

>>12539579
>Imagine Space Dubai
Purely artificial and devoid of meaning? I'll stick with my shithole planets and moons thank you.

>>12539576
heat, pressure, and corrosion mostly

>>12539580
>humans strip mined earth to build o'neil cylinders which then got dropped on the marsfags

>>12539579
O’Neil cylinders are boring though. Your audience won’t like it they’d rather have grand views of the planet scape and whatnot

>>12539586
Do you think ayys would be horrified by a colony drop?

>>12539581
>and devoid of meaning
What part of "LIVING IN SPACE" did you not get?

>>12539202
You came in second. So you're already doing better than the actual national team bid. Congrats. Don't expect 8 billion dollars though.

>oneill niggers are back
nigger nigger go away

>>12539591
you cant live where there is void. there's nothing there dumbass :)

>>12539362
"expendable launch vehicles" is the name of the program that Atlas V and Delta IV were developed under

>>12539584
>Pressure
Not relevant if you don't need to maintain 1 atm interior
>Heat
Can be managed
>Corrosion
The surface doesn't have much sulphuric acid, and suitable materials are immune anyway.
The density of the atmosphere means your probe can easily float back up using gasbags when necessary.

>>12539591
Planets are in space.

>>12539584
>heat
Problem for semi conductors and conventional greases neither of which have place on the surface of Venus if long term operation is intended.
>pressure
Problem for 1 atm pressure vessels, which have no place on the surface of Venus.
>corrosion
I'd ask "by what?" but then another one is better - earth equipment does not corrode?

>>12539587
A cattle ranching cylinder catering to rich clients that want authentic free range beef in the outer system would be a pretty non-boring habitat to visit. Maybe make it run by Mormons to give it an extra southwestern vibe. Alternatively, visiting such a location after workers have rebelled and taken it over to live off the “land” would be similarly enticing, while very different.

The life of a designer is no parade of victories. There are innumerably more failures. But they must not stop us.

They must not stop us.

>>12539593
It's the only way to live in space. When we put together the mass of the asteroid belts and the planets we have enough construction material to build enough O'Neil cylinders to sustain TRILLIONS of people for astronomical periods of time. It's literally that simple - just build them. The earlier we start the better.

>>12539561
Of course if you go with things that are impossibly improbable in the first place, let me tell you about my story of 2 aliens race who both have their homeworld planet (with 100% compatible biology) in the same star system and whose technological advance developed at the same rate.

I'm not saying you can't justify that setting with something else like an AI terraforming planet before letting the meat lose, but that's going to monopolize a large fraction of your story.

Even if I love Cowboy Bebop Live, the resources to terraform so many planets/moons would have changed the setting quite a bit.

>>12539602
>communist mormon space cowboys with literal space cows
>cylinder stops rotating because of [plot point]
>hahaha the cows are confused

>>12539611
Why can't you have a whole bunch of habitable moons around a couple Lukewarm Neptunes

>>12539608
There's nothing in space, that's why it's called space lol

>>12539602
>theme parks in space
Cringe
Authenticity or bust

>>12539608
>TRILLIONS of people
Why the fuck would we want that

>>12539349
Cultural and evolutionary deviation would still make a BVSED INTERSTELLVR EMPIRE impossible, at best you could keep a solar neighborhood together, any colonies beyond that will just become aliens. Assiming ftl information is impossible of course.
Best course for space colonisation is to never let a single human go beyond the sol neighbourhood and just send out automated ships to bring in resources from the rest of the galaxy.

unmanageable quantities of floating cow shit getting sucked into the air recycler it's a catastrophe aaaaaaaaa

>>12539621
>never let a single human go beyond the sol neighbourhood
You'd like that, wouldn't you
Globohomo shill
Keep all the goyim within an easy torchship journey.

>>12539619
It wouldn’t be bad so long as we spread them out into the frontier of space. Gotta find a way to keep them all from wanting to come back to Earth, though.

>>12539628
>Gotta find a way to keep them all from wanting to come back to Earth, though.
Like sending them to another star system that they can make their own, full of rich planets to tame and settle.

>>12539621
>send out automated ships to bring in resources from the rest of the galaxy.

You, can you repeat that? You want relatistic kill vehicles made out of that tasty silica rock you've been lacking on the market lately flung at the only place where your civilization exists? By automated berzerker probes?

This... this is the power of /sfg/.

>>12539619
That's the purpose of the Dyson swarm. The breed absolutely trillions of seething humans, power machinery to generate food and entertainment for them to shovel down their throats until they die and are replaced by more like them in an endless cycle until the sun burns out.

>>12539624
Yeah, come to think of it, animal husbandry in any kind of environment with recycled air is gonna fucking suck.

>>12539581
>Purely artificial and devoid of meaning?
There's meaning living on a Purely artificial moon based colony?

>>12539587
Bullshit, that's only because it's extremely costly for movie maker to fake one.

>terraformed planet : let's just film this on some other country on Earth, please pretend to not recognize the place or worry about the 1G gravity

>space colony : ok, so we need millions of budget to make a 3D O'neill 2km2 background and twist the roads so they curve upward, we need a scientific consultant at all time to stop us anytime we are doing something unrealistic, every single part of the plot have to be validated scientifically and ... ok fuck that, we'll pretend the colony is entirely made of small box so we can reuse the same.

With the proper design you could have AVATAR air battle happening in a O'neill colony. Including genetically engineered dragon.

>>12539590
they might even be horrified by the concept
or it could be totally normal and they're wondering why we aren't bombing each other with our Orion drives
different strokes, after all

>>12539632
just throw it at luna for easy retrieval later, she's served us well as an asteroid catcher for the last few billion years

>>12539627
>implying the globohomo will let us even leave the earth
You will eat the bugs and be happy.

>>12539635
At least the rocks were there before me, not placed by some landscaping software.

>>12539614
You can, it's just ridiculously improbable for it to happen without the intervention of an intelligent species.

>>12539645
In Firefly it was implied to be a built system, by some mysterious precursor race.

>>12539635
Practical special effects are dead, anon. You'll just get it uploaded in your brain dreams through your neuralink amidst the cancelthought updates.

>>12539590
They should be unless they are suicidal which is possible but not that likely.

>>12539621
The only worthwhile resource in the rest of the galaxy is hard lightyears between you and the globohomo AI driven nightmare growing ceaselessly back in the home system. That's not something you can import.

>>12539635
>There's meaning living on a Purely artificial moon based colony?
The meaning comes from maintaining your own life in the face of docility conditions and slowly making more of the universe livable for mankind. Survival has to be a non issue for existential crises to become commonplace like they have in modern industrialized countries.

>>12539562
>refrigerated in various ways
Mind listing those that don't involve unobtainium?

>>12539645
>ridiculously improbable for it to happen
The universe is literally fuckhuge, anon. No issue to have 0.5g+ moons circling a warmer gas giant especially now that we know those aren't limited to the outer parts of the solar systems only. They won't even need magnetic fields as the gas giant will offer the atmospheric erosion protection through his own (no need to deal with handwaving why the moons aren't tidal locked).

>>12539332
A legend is born

>>12539649
>some mysterious precursor race
I don’t remember that part. My understanding was that they were all terraformed by the various companies that own them. In at least one of the episodes, they talk about poor people being dumped onto barely habitable worlds because the owners cheaped out.

>>12539649
It only go from impossibly to ridiculously improbable since a precursor race would need believable reason to build those, on specs, and then hide forever. Only considering mankind worth as a species rather than as sentient individual to be protected.

>>12539661
It's been years since I watched it so I probably remembered it all wrong

>>12539655
>coolant is moved through key locations with some pressure tricks and other black magics involved
>the heat it carries is expelled through radiator whose temperature exceeds ambient
>the system consumes energy to move heat from one spot to another

>>12539653
how about tonnage at a significant percentage of c heading towards the globohomo AI driven nightmare?

>>12539655
Absorption based cycle
Evaporation
Standard compression cycle with the radiator temperature turned way up

>>12539666
This is why they'll try to keep anyone from leaving the star dome. If anybody does it, their utopia is gone.

>>12539656
>The universe is literally fuckhuge, anon.
Meaning it's impossibly improbable for several moons to come already inhabitable (or close) so close to the homeworld.
That's the difference between "our planet had to be inhabitable or we wouldn't be discussing this" and "look, another inhabitable world just nearby"
Also technically many of the moons in Gas giant orbit will end up in the giant's Van Allen belt so you'll need to empty those first.

>>12539661
I think there was a part about the system itself probably being artificial because it had too many moons to be natural, but the terraforming was done by earth companies.

>>12539329
>>We still don't even know if gestation is possible in mars gravity
We know gestation is possible in 0g

>>12539373
>lifting for others
NGMI

>>12539380
>finished listening to rev. space
>got an ad summary for artemis
>"criminal misfits must work together to save the galaxy"
It's fucking space suicide squad, fuck that shit. The martian was alright.

>>12539329
>We still don't even know if gestation is possible in mars gravity
So true. There's no ethical way to find out, either. Animal models don't tell us anything.
The only option is to give up on human space colonisation and redirect that energy towards earth-based social programs

>>12539670
Ganymede and Callisto in particular are completely fine, in fact the latter is quite comfy as far as interstellar radiation goes.
They would could have been interesting places if Jupiter was closer.

Europa and Io are sealed deal though, I admit.

2 out 4 being habitable sounds like a deal to me.

>>12539675
Maybe it's Usual Suspects in space

>>12539670
Venus and Mars were both likely habitable in the past

Just do this lol

>>12539421
Wow, this actually looks like the best television series from 2002 I’ve ever seen

>>12539667
>>12539665
The coolant and radiators that can work at like 600-800°C are going to be a headache, but it's probably solvable. But first of all, what energy? You're going to need gigawatts if you're talking actual industrial mining, not just some shitty probes, and most of it will go towards cooling, not the actual operation.

>>12539683
>A
>FUCKING
>Ramp

>>12539654
You literally can't find more docile than making a self-contained colony that can't deviate from specs and get more inhabitable area than all of the planets surface & subsurface put together. Even before you start disassembling planets.

>>12539643
Someday you'll swear those procedurally generated rocks to are more real than boring rock picked on a random planet

>>12539650
>tier 3 client
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IFe9wiDfb0E

>>12539686
You'd be scooping raw ore with the surface modules and floating up to airborne processing platforms in the lower cloud decks.
The entire thing depends on floating stations.

>>12539683
why tho

>>12539677
You could drain the radiation belts of jupiter

>>12539686
>power
Now that's actually the problem, not getting the equipment to work.

I'll handwave something about beamed power from the rich solar arrays bathing in the skies before the nuke fags come crawling in about high temp reactors and umbilicals.

>>12539692
Initial upward velocity = higher payload margins

>>12539697
congratulations you've invented a shittier first stage, you should work for ARCA

>>12539697
But the velocity given will be minimal and most certainly offset into the negative when the structural mass costs involved in the ordeal are calculated?

For this to have any chance to work the sled should be really fuckhuge and give not only altitude but also speed in the mach region.

>>12539676
I'm pretty sure the only option is creampieing girls repeatedly on Mars

>>12539677
>Ganymede and Callisto
If that's your low bar for habitable, then outer space is also habitable. All you need is a 100% artificial habitat and the right economy.

>>12539680
>Venus and Mars were both likely habitable in the past
I see where you got that
https://www.nasa.gov/feature/goddard/2016/nasa-climate-modeling-suggests-venus-may-have-been-habitable
At best, if true. It only bring up how these planet might have been habitable during a time when Earth or other planet weren't (yet or anymore).

>>12539632
>This... this is the power of /sfg/.

>>12539627
>globohomo future
motherfucker there's 10 000 places you can live in in sol alone, and the distances to centauri and the rest would still make globohomoism impossible, but they're still close enough for us to remain the same species.
But sure, go ahead and send out colonies to 100s of LY away, and then let them send out colonie of their own, and then act surprised when one of them ends up RKMing all the others.
>>12539632
>automated berserker probes
t. 70s sci-fi writer whi thinks any robot = AGI
hard coded drones aren't going to RKM us, ex-human ayylmaos with ambition will.

>>12539707
The ramp would be used many many times so the fixed cost per unit would be small, making the investment worth it.

>>12539725
what if instead of a ramp, it was a giant turboramjet spaceplane that got to mach 4.5 and like 20km

shut up everybody it's time for 150 tons of balloon probes on Starship
https://science.nasa.gov/science-red/s3fs-public/atoms/files/Venus%20Flagship%20Mission.pdf

>>12539721
>motherfucker there's 10 000 places you can live in in sol alone
since you said "10000 places" i'm assuming you included asteroids and comets, unless you're talking about hypothetical dwarf planets in the oort cloud, or rogue planets passing through the oort cloud. i'm assuming you weren't, in which case there are trillions of "places" in sol to live

>>12539721
Oh ok I see
I thought you were saying to keep everyone in the actual solar system and never go as far as Alpha Centauri for eg

>>12539188
>pic
What is it about old sci-fi that makes it so comfy? I really enjoy these kinds of pictures.

>>12539621
>>12539632
>>12539666
>>12539668
>automated berzerker probes
I remember the time when self-replicating berserker probes was discussed here as part of "kill alien first before they kill us"
And oh boy how that could go wrong!

>send self replicating killer machine to kill all alien and protect a specific genre of human
>3000 years later the killer machine come back to check if illegal alien sneaked in
>human evolved, modified themselves a little and no longer fit the data stored in the killer machine
>killer robot refuse upgraded definition because it must be enemy hacking and exterminate mankind
>all that left is a self-replicating machine killing every other species more efficiently than a Dalek

>>12539756
Soul
vs
>>12539413
Soulless

>>12539734
>Asteroids and comets
fuck that, mine them and build spin stations. 10 000 was a number chosen at random.
Amyway, biology and culture are unpredictable. We can hope that we're the first spacefaring life in this galaxy, so we might have a chance at surviving, so long as we don't plant alien civilisations ourselves.
>>12539750
Oh yeah fuck that, the entire solar neighborhood should get human'd, if only just to prove we can.

>>12539198
geez, I'd prefer this

>>12539727
Or you could take this to it's logical extreme and make essentially a two stage air launch. You would need a a bigger unmanned version of the Virgin Galactic space plane.
Yo dawg, I heard air launches, so I put a rocket on your space plane so you can launch while you launch.

>>12539760
Kinda true. Sad.

>>12539734
Not him but unless you are human goo who consider that multiplying and owning everything is the sole reason for existence, you could life comfortably for millennia in the same solar system before encroaching on others private property.

Economy and access to the cheapest resources would be the main source of conflict, not the need for habitable space.

Also as noted by >>12539763 we will eventually master biology enough to be able to create any species we want, all that keep us from living together isn't biology but our ability to cooperate with other.

>>12539771
You'll need a bigger plane

>>12539770
Just begging for microgravity with all the shit in there

>>12539198
That table is perfect for banging your shin on

>>12539770
Very interesting. I posted this photo in a thread a while back. I fucking love this look, but I don’t know if it has a name.

>>12539790
70s retrofuture

>>12539771
>Virgin
haha, just like you

>>12539797
Dilate

>>12539796
Niche and based. In my opinion the interior look of Starship will tell us a lot about the aesthetic to expect in terms of the mars colony. I wish elon would fucking share some official mockups. Will it be white and modern like a tesla? Or will he keep the raw steel/metal look

>>12539811
I hope starship interior is a comfy shade of grey like this
>>12539770

>>12539811
>>12539814
Ehhhh expect Starship’s interior to be bright and shiny like a Tesla except the car is made of 120 tons of stainless steel and is able to fly through space.

It’s insane to think that Starship is an actual spaceship and not some dinky capsule. The only thing like it is the Shuttle.

>>12539824
wrong, the shuttle was a dinky capsule bolted to the front of a cargo bay

>>12539549
a cruise ship in space, now you're talking

>>12539814
Yeah I agree

>>12539827
I want big ships in space!

>>12539825
The orbiter was an integrated system (cargo bay doors had radiators inside them, for example) and the Shuttle's cockpit alone had two levels. It totally counts. Buran would have too if they'd ever flown it with crew.

we should hit a planet with a really big rock to see what happens :)

>>12539825
>>12539825
>shuttle
>capsule
lmao

>>12539850

>>12539850
Well isn't this convenient

>>12539825
>mfw

>>12539860
Alota honkey

How reliable was this sumbitch? What if it had continued service?

Why are the delta V values for Venus landers so retardedly high? Is it just because they're round trip calculations and the surface conditions are "fuck you"?

>>12539890
yes

>>12539890
1) Close the the sun
2) Big ass-planet

>>12539854
Oh, so how big was its pressurized volume again?

>>12539510
kekked

>>12539890
Venus rotates super slowly so it takes a lot more delta V to brake from orbital speed.

>>12539725
You'd need something like a nuclear reactor to power the catapult tho.

>>12539969
>Venus rotates super slowly
This is such a fucking buzzkill planet-wise. 30-hr rotation max or fuck off.

Who is ready for cabin fever?
https://www.theguardian.com/science/2021/jan/03/i-lived-like-an-astronaut-for-months-in-isolation

>>12539534
You have no clue how much you can do with an apartment block.

>>12540043
Ok I happen to own one
Give me some ideas

>>12540052
Get better, more interesting tenants and have a common area.

>>12540057
Ok, will do. Mine can't go into space, it has to stay on the ground. Is that still ok?

>>12539293
I am sure suiting up and bouncing around on Mars would be fun. For the first week or two. Then living like a rat, growing shit food, in the full knowledge that there actually fuck all on Mars except dust, rock and some ice, would make you reflect upon your life choices.
>But mah base for exploring other shit!
Exploring more lifeless rocks. Sure sounds fun. Let the fucking robots have it.

>>12540066
Yes. For now.

>>12540068
Well there is plenty of interesting geography and biology on Earth, but do you ever visit it?

>>12540068
The plus side is no jews trying to turn your children into trannies.
Do you get this? We're only going there because we have no choice.

>>12539559
Conventional electronics made of silicon no, but there is electronics made with other materials able to work in very high temperature, some sensors like that already exist in jet engines.
It could be possible to develop robotics able to work at those temperatures, the real problem is developing it requires a lot of research and investments and that is the most unrealistic setting, because Venus doesn't seem to justify such an effort.

>>12540074
This, but with less cucking.

We have the chance to build a better society on another planet. We should do it.

>>12540092
Yes. We'll take from Earth what is worthwhile, and make something better. A second New World.

>>12540092
>Looks like the whitey are trying to self segregate again
Meh, they always do, nothing that a whiff of gray goo cant solve..

>>12540113
>dumb popsci bullshit
>implying it's even possible for them to ever reach Mars without whites

>>12540113
/pol/ is this way >>>/pol/

>>12540068
If you’re a 40 year old virgin with no one in your life and nothing to amount to, I would gladly go to settle Mars. You would have a purpose and actually contribute to the early days of making life interplanetary. I’m sure convicts and street beggars thought similar about settling the New World.

>>12540121
Plenty of whites willing wipe out their own just to spread diversity. Or haven't you noticed?

Sorry, O'Neill cylinders aren't happening. And by the time they are possible it's just machines left. And machines dont need a big gay park to roll around in the grass. they're not faggots like you

>>12540068
You don't understand how fun it is to look at rock for all of your life.

>>12540071
>biology
You mean the thing rather lacking on Mars?
Even if you make a big jungle biome later, the first decades are going to be horrible.

sn9 bros, we got too cocky

>>12540143
what am i supposed to be looking at

>>12540068
Just accept that your meme cylinders are gay and nobody wants live in some soulless tube unemployed because it has no economy.

>>12540150
a dent

>>12539859
So, I'm a fucking retard.
Is this a real photo, or is it shooped?

>>12540143
Don’t worry that’ll buff out real good.

On a serious note it shouldn’t be a problem and if it is then they should rethink their design as a minor dent shouldn’t compromise the ship.

>>12540152
>soulless tube unemployed because it has no economy
You are right, no point going to Mars since it can't sell anything back to Earth.
Better make Space cylinder at Lunar lagrange point L1 so it serve as a station for all the worker mining the Moon and asteroid with huge profit, allowing them to increase their living space exponentially.

>>12540068

Are there any even slightly realistic ideas for how to make Mars more livable in a reasonable timeframe? Like having the biggest chinese style polluting smokestacks dumping as much co2 as you physically can into the atmosphere?

>>12540156
we've had bigger dents before and every single time they were literally nothing

>>12540052
>>12540066
Ha ha, now take the stories you hear and write them as IN SPAAAAAACE! There you go, the great American... space... novel!
>>12540143
That'll buff right out when they pressurize.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-97wvMn0HfA

forget thundercuck
this gay is the ultimate cringe
angry astronaut sometimes talks bs but overall he is based af

>>12540304
I understand your frustration, but please understand: nobody asked.

>>12540304
I don't concern myself with youtuber trash, why do you?

>>12540304
Why are you posting CSS here? Fuck off retard

>>12539188
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DryVpT49Eys

KINO
I
N
O

>>12540189
>in a reasonable timeframe
>Chinese smokestacks
Not really, the best first step is make sure the Martian atmosphere is protected from solar wind loss so that pressure and temperature can reach habitable levels for algae/molds/bacteria to take hold and start photosynthesis and breaking down the Martian soil.

>>12539246
GOD BLESS AMERICA!

>>12540304
musk and angry astronaut on suicide watch

>>12539413

>>12540318
i know
>>12540324
>implying youtuber trash is not important in our time to shape the opinions of people
>>12540325
your comment makes it sound like you support this retard

>>12540383
>>implying youtuber trash is not important in our time to shape the opinions of people
Yes, normies don't look at this shit.

>>12540373

>>12539355
Asteroids are also stupid far away. You won't be throwing rocks anytime soon.

The average distance between asteroids in the belt is 300,000km.

>>12539517
Ryk Brown's wrote a pretty good sci-fi book called Arrival. It's fairly realistic and a pretty good story on how spaceborne people would react and adapt to an actually terrestrial world.

>>12539586
>building ENTIRE WORLDS with plenty of resources spent on each
>lol just drop them on some chumps we disagree with
The only valid reason I'd see that is if the cylinder was the property of some chumps you dislike and you were crashing it on one of their planetary bodies, like marscunts hijacking one of titan's cylinders and well, kaboom. Titanfags hijack a mars cylinder in retaliation.

>>12540189
>melt ice caps with nukes
>atmospheric pressure increases = liquid water
>some plant life that can survive the conditions and the almost 100% co2 atmosphere is introduced (optional, or accidental)

There you go, terraformed Mars as far as it gets. Blue, some green, lots of wind and bad weather. Your biggest problem will be taking away the nukes from the zogbots who want to use them to instill fear and goy holocaust when needed.

>>12540410
Translates to what changes in velocity assuming reasonable timeframes are involved?

>>12540157
Real
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deep_Space_Climate_Observatory

>>12539890
What do you mean retarded high? Venus is probably the easiest place to land on in the solar system, softly at least. The delta V was just tad big higher than going to Mars.

Or do you mean... ascent?

>>12539683
>t. Wilee E. Coyote

>>12540503
>ACME Orbital

>>12540507
>A company that makes everything, including orbit.

>>12540482
Sure, if you use aerobraking. It's getting back off that's the painful part, thanks to that thicc atmosphere. You might even need a 3-stage rocket.
>Earth: 9400 to low orbit
>Venus: 27000 to low orbit

>>12539866
should've been our Soyuz

>>12539683
we GUNDAM now

>>12540513
Why didn't they just keep running the saturn 1b?

>>12540507
Who would win in a space race? ACME Orbital or Virgin Orbit?

>>12540533
Super pricy, thing was basically a sports car. Everyone got swept up in the space plane craze and more efficient equivalent launchers eventually showed up. Saturn family might have been badass but it didn't exactly get the best mileage

>>12540544
With ACME, you can achieve orbit using products not related to spaceflight.

Will spaceflight still be cool when it's a normal every day thing?

>>12540550
it'll only not be cool when there's no longer a huge amount of risk involved

>>12540549
But would you survive the trip?

>>12539399
Go to the gym, faggot

>>12540533
Expensive as fuck. It cost $400 million per flight in today’s money, which is more than the Delta IV Heavy while lifting less payload.

>>12540550
People still admire commercial pilots, and they fly every damn day

>>12539547
>That's utterly unethical and wrong. Full stop.

That’s your opinion my dude. Science is more important than some dumb “ethics” I say

Experts who study AI and have worked on it for decades:
>AGI is possible, and it's coming soon. Here's proof.
Random anons:
>No, AGI is impossible. That would mean I'm not special, and I won't believe that.

>>12539476
>So something either has the most perfect environment in the universe or it's a shithole? There's no middle ground anywhere, and subsurface oceans/dense nitrogen atmosphere/geologic activity/habitable climate/mineral composition mean nothing?

I dunno I want to see some planets with active biospheres that are incredibly toxic or otherwise inhospitable to us

>>12540573
Of course, cartoon-physics guaranteed or your money back to your next of kin.

>>12539634
Just use the poo to grow plants then feed the plants to the cows and to us

Infinite cycle of dung

>>12540573
>boing-starliner.gif

>>12540597
>Experts who study AI and have worked on it for decades

“Experts who study AI” have been expecting AGI within the near future since at least the 1970’s. It’s the fusion meme, only even less credible because we have at least a few pathways to achieving net energy fusion, whereas there is no currently understood path to making AGI, just neural networks which can make decent photos of dogs.

>>12540597
>spaceflight

>>12540624
I’d wager that AGI is a different problem because we have no idea how to tell if it worked. Also how do you define AGI? What are your criteria? We have machines that can pass a Turing test.

>>12539224
NASA will definitely try to build a dinky science outpost too

>>12540641
>I’d wager that AGI is a different problem because we have no idea how to tell if it worked
Compare it to humans. Conceivably, a machine could be conscious but not be anything like a human, either because machines can be conscious but not like a human is, or just because that’s not the sort of conscious machine we made. If it isn’t like humans, then it’d probably be harder to tell it’s conscious at all, and we should kill it as soon as possible, probably with thermite bombs placed strategically on its processing units that go off at the touch of a button. Isolated circuit system, of course, so that the machine could not intervene in the act.

> Also how do you define AGI?
Conscious non-organic entity.

> We have machines that can pass a Turing test.
The ability to generate convincing conversion means little.

>>12539202
Or just chuck four starships at it for 1/10th the cost.

>>12539225
Somebody's never played AI Dungeon.

>>12540672
>we should kill it as soon as possible, probably with thermite bombs placed strategically on its processing units that go off at the touch of a button
Why?

>>12540672
But how can you tell if a machine is conscious? Would you regard simple self awareness as consciousness, or more? An Octopus is self aware, but is it conscious? Even ants have basic self awareness

>>12540698
>Why?

If it isn’t human, it should not exist, or it should be in complete submission to humans.

>>12540713
Brainlet take. Killing a conscious being that hasn’t wronged you is murder and makes you a bugman

>>12540685
Literally just a neural network that chews through gorillions of bytes of training data and uses it to produce “new” things. No different from making dog pictures.

>>12540512
Pure rocket propulsion for Venus is not particularly good idea. That DV map seems very suspect to me, however. Low Venus orbit most certainly does not involve 27000m/s. It's a bit lower than Earth's. They are doing some ass pulling involving atmospheric drag and losses I guess when there aren't even any engines that can operate at ~100atm ambient.

>>12540719
>nooo dont kill Skynet nooooo

“Murder” is a legal term and is applicable only to killing other humans. A machine is not a human; especially one that isn’t human-like in its manner of cognition. Destroying such a thing is logical self-preservation.

Is there any idea of when esenain will fly?

>>12540709
>But how can you tell if a machine is conscious?
How much like a human is it? Exact same standard by which we judge other animals.

> Would you regard simple self awareness as consciousness, or more?
The ability of a system to differentiate itself from its surroundings and other systems doesn’t actually indicate conscious experience.

>>12540734
Sometime in January. We don't know when yet.

>>12540734
2 weeks maybe. Who knows.

>>12540685
>"AI" dungeon

If this is the AI of the future neither I nor you have to worry about it unless its piloting the boing 837 aimaxx we are on.

>>12539683
>hey guys look at my silly contraption to help the first 150 mph

Meanwhile it imposes a hard upper limit in rocket size
Same reason all meme assisted launch devices are garbage

>>12540734
Static fire tomorrow probably. Then we'll see a flight maybe a week after.

>>12539758
Kill or be killed mate

>>12540751
Or unless it's the AI responsible for overseeing all of the Neuralink implants.
>muh full dive vr sword art online
No, you're going to have one giant dreamlike trip where nothing cohesive happens, everything only partially makes sense, and you have simultaneously absolute control and next to no control, sometimes flipping between the two extremes completely at random.

>>12540777
>AI responsible for overseeing all of the Neuralink implants.
Please no. A new kind of terrible schizophrenic dystopia was born with that post.

>>12540787
What else are you going to have? A simple algorithm?

>>12540793
I'll be satisfied with a gun suitable for high dosage lead injections of any suspected trespassers interested in implant work. UN directives or not.

>>12540721
You just described 90% of human artists.

>>12540801
>tfw no blue helmet planters for my front yard

>>12540775
Except in this case it's
>berserker drone
>Kill yourself
literally

>>12540734
Why doesn’t spacex use launching platforms where it sits atop a kind of grate so that when it launches or tests its engines the force and heat goes into a trench rather than into the concrete?

Sorry I can’t remember the name of what it’s called, but both the soviets and nasa used them so why doesn’t spacex especially given that it launched chunks of concrete before damaging the engines.

>>12540816
Mars won't have flame trenches.

>>12540816
That’s called a flame diverter and SpaceX is unironically cutting corners because they decided that they don’t need one. It’s a big investment but still , not having one bit them in the ass with SNATE’s static fires

>>12540734
why does nasa need a 2 billion dollar 10 story tall crawler again?

>>12540823
Concrete transportation system.

>>12540304
He's literally a TSLQ fag, ignore him.

>>12540410
i thought its more like a million kilometers between every kilometer sized asteroid?

>>12540845
Maybe? I'm sure alot of asteroids are smaller than 1km so maybe thats where they got the 300,000km number from.

>>12540816
starship is designed to land and launch on and flat terrain

>>12540839
A what?

>>12540819
I suppose the other anon does have a point that when it launches from Mars or the moon then they won’t have one of those and it’s better to test it out here to prepare for anything that could go wrong with launching from the ground.

Also why doesn’t spacex have landing legs on the starships, all the designs show it without them so what happens if it lands on some uneven terrain on the moon, what stops it from tipping over?

>>12540859
What happens if the terrain isn’t flat? t>>12540872

>>12540872
>Also why doesn’t spacex have landing legs on the starships
Those are supposedly coming. Elon has said he wants a wider stance and auto leveling for landing on unprepared terrain on Mars. That probably means ITS style.

>>12540872
starship will have landing legs, they just haven't finalized the design yet

>>12540885
the terrain has to be reasonably flat. Starship isn't going to be landing on the slopes of olympus mons. Luckily on most planets there are regions of fairly flat space.

>>12540894
Kek, mount olympus is a shield volcano. The slope of the flank is so gentle that you could probably land a starship on it.

>>12539790
I’ve heard it called cassette futurism before. It’s basically just the Alien aesthetic.

Hey guys, about to make a drive over to the Mormon outskirt colony. Anyone want anything? Knitted sweater? Some nutmeg? I could probably trade some fuel for a wife or two if y’all want?

>>12540143
SN8 had those a number of times

>>12540885
Land carefully. The legs should be able to take few degrees in addition to some unevenness - obviously they won't be stiff boards and will have some suspension movement.

>>12540924
There's a pic with the big styles like that. Steampunk, dieselpunk, retrofuturism, cassette futurism, cyberpunk, and some others. Don't have it on me though.

Will copenhagen suborbitals make it?

>>12540942
No suborbital is going to make it.

>>12540945
Not as a company, just a group of people trying to send somebody into space. I take it you don't know about them?

>>12540942
Would you /sci/?

>>12540977
Remind me of this

>>12540979

>>12540942
Isn’t that the company where one of the main guys cut the head off a woman on a submarine?

>>12540928
You know some kind of Mormon colony might actually happen.

1 or 2 years ago the Mormon church was found to have over a hundred billion dollars stockpiled for no apparent reason and it wasn’t used for anything.

If musk starts pumping out hundreds of these rockets the Mormons might just start buying some or paying him to take their colonists up to start something as they are definitely rich enough.

>>12541017
They might be saving up to buy an orion drive to get to proxima centauri. Kek maybe joseph smith translated this with his seer stone and we just don’t know about it

>>12541017
100%. Their portrayal in The Expanse is pretty spot on. They’re also one of the few Abrahamic religions to have their own cosmology (including beliefs about humans living on other planets).

>>12541026
>They might be saving up to buy an orion drive to get to proxima centauri.
top kek

>>12540987
they aren't a company, and that was a long time ago, near the start of the project. its mostly completely different people now

>>12541017
>>12541026
i think a mormon colony will happen by the time there is 50000-60000 people on mars, so by the 2050s, and by "happen" i mean start

>>12541017
What's their end goal? Is there any chance at all that the LDS won't cuck out like the Catholic Church and embrace race mixing and mass migration? Because frankly Romney is not a promising example.

>>12541048
its a lot harder for the LDS to completely cuck out considering the book of mormon has clear racial scripture in it

What's with these Luddites who think AI will never happen? Are they all Christian and think consciousness is a magic trick?

>>12541057
is this true? I thought they were cool with le epic based black men in Utah.

>>12541081
I’ve lived in both the Deep South and rural Utah, and in my experience, Mormons are some of the most blatantly racist people in the country. One of my friends was one of maybe 5 black people in the entire town, and there’d be people staring at him basically anywhere he went. Salt Lake is much more like most major American cities, obviously.

>>12541033
The Quran offhand mentions aliens once or twice

>>12541074
There is literally no evidence that a machine can be conscious. Your brain is warped by decades of sci fi

>>12541081
It's not true anymore, the mainstream LDS church is 100% on board with lgbt and blm shit now. It makes sense since they are more a corporation than a religion, and if they want to get tithe money from brown people across the globe it's kind of hard to do that while also being racist. I live in Utah and the amount of mormon dudes I see with mexican or asian wives is staggering

>>12541017
>church
How would religion survive in a world of technology?
A quick search tell me catholic probably wouldn't go against genetic therapy, if only because science can fix people while their prayer do jack shit.
But genetic improvement (to survive on other planet) will be out of question and if they do, knowingly, it question their entire religion.
All religious are hypocrite you'll tell me, even the one who genuinely don't know why it contradict their beliefs.
But on the long term, would they worship Earth and treat like miracle any stuff they didn't see in their colony like thunder? Or would they finally understand their religions are all fantasy book that don't have any value now that Science is a thing?

>>12541116
There's no evidence you aren't a meat automaton either, but we put up with you.

>>12541121
>Religion must be racist or I don’t like it

>>12541116
Your brain is a machine and I assume you have a conscious

>>12541122
*tips fedora*

Atheism is a dead end.

>>12541116
Who said anything about consciousness? AGI is about capability, not whether the lights are on.

>>12541137
>brain is machine hur dur

Nope. Retarded analogy.

>>12541074
We have at least one primitivist polluting this thread.
It doesn't matter to them if AI are possible, they just act as if saying stuff made them true and I wouldn't put it past them to lie on purpose in the hope other believe it

>>12541122
Buzz Aldrin got communion on the moon. I am not worried about the Catholic Church's ability to survive in space. I'm not worried about Judaism either - the faithful are used to wandering without hope of return, and the happy merchant types will become Ferengi. Even Buddhism is flexible enough to adapt to new science and technology. It's only the textual literalist faiths, Protestant churches and Islam, that will have problems.