/sci/ - Science & Math

It was either the politicisation of science or the scientification (forgive me for that) of politics.
Don't delude yourself into thinking that both choices were equally as likely.

Because leftist academics want to use science to socially engineer the planet in their fucked up perverse image to have the state as the father figure and provider in a quasi technofascist control grid...

>>12497667
How much is money worth?

>>12497667
i think it's because more and more women are entering STEM. if it was still predominantly males, you would never see anything like what we have today; papers being censored due to "sexism" or "racism" etc.

>>12497719
this

>>12497667
it is easier to change public policy through academia than it is to get elected. this breeds subversion
colleges must be de-funded. the "scientific" state must be separated from its church

It is seemingly impossible to fix this outside of genocide and blunt population and political control, due to most people being limited by their genetic capacity, regardless to race or sex. I would argue that anyone above 145IQ from proper assessment would be able to pursue 99% of all topical fields to any variety or height. Since the threshold of being 145IQ or higher is in the hundreds of people per each individual, it would be socially unacceptable to put forth that we must cull large swathes of the population. To be honest, I have never met an individual who is insecure in himself or herself when they are higher than three or four SD above the mean. Never. Although anecdotal, I gather that society is driven by the mass insecurity of those 110-130IQ. A collective worldwide of "crabs", to where aversion of inferiority comes with selfish manipulative tactics to hinder others. You are living in a world full of idiots.

So then, in order to fight back you must accept the role of the villain, and subdue, subjugate - enslave the global population. If progress is to be made on account of objectivity instead of feeling and fear, then you must rule inversely. People on here will say that this is foolish or pretentious, but if you are to help humanity, it must be brought to heel. This is largely parallel to the upper elite, meaning those who control a nations finances and mentality, i.e propaganda/philosophies, can shape its destiny. If you can subject a populace to your ideas through voluntary, or involuntary means, then you would be able to achieve anything physically possible.

Unfortunately this understanding is met with a defeatism in those 160IQ or higher, as often they recognize that it is likely an insurmountable task, and you would have to deal with Machiavellian sociopaths who only garner their self interests to your altruism. Thus the only conclusion is to live a life of solitude and personal happiness, lest you be destroyed by those who cannot see.

>>12497667
>Politicization of Science
>American Mathematical Society
If you spent thirty seconds rubbing your two neurons together you might've been able to deduce that the problem is academia, not "science". But your mistake perfectly illustrates the real harm of the past couple decades: uninformed laypeople conflate the opinions of experts on social issues with those experts' expert opinion, the thing they've actually studied for years. This allows you to dismiss out of hand effectively every scientific finding that inconveniences you or someone who can influence your thinking.
How very convenient that this mass anti-science hysteria started ramping up just as climate change was becoming an increasingly obvious and urgent threat.

>>12497736
Good post.
t. 160+ IQ

Because you have people on one side trying to be super woke and people on the other saying shit like >>12497736 where they unironically call for genocide before obliviously complaining about having to deal with sociopaths.

Both of those people will abuse science to fit their views regardless of reality.

>>12497717
4$ = 4$ wetard cant work that out? are you like a women or something?

>>12497767
lol found the insecure crab

>>12497754

Best reply yet. However, I'd argue that those who think they're pro-science are often just as unscientific. They only agree with science that aligns with their political views. Same is true for some academics who discuss social issues on say Twitter. You can't select which science is true, and my comment on the "left" and "right" is a way to say that both sides of the political spectrum, or at least the stereotype of the people who hold those views choose which ideas suit them. I don't believe in the social reasons for inequalities propagandised by the left (because economic studies show this isn't true) but I do believe in more established ideas like climate change (although I don't trust the projections of climate models due to the inaccuracies in extrapolating chaotic structures).

>>12497849
>They only agree with science that aligns with their political views
This is true, but is merely a specific case of a more general and obvious truth: people only agree with things (of any sort) that align (or at least do not directly conflict) with their ideology.
The problem then becomes the sheer number of topics that have been subsumed by our major ideologies, and which seems to be increasing every day.
>climate change
>the genetics of race
>COVID-19
>antivax (before this year part of the fringe but now increasingly subsumed into major political ideologies thanks to the above)
>gender and sex (already a weak "science" as sociology/psychology but now entirely divorced from any grounding in evidence or reason)
The list goes on and you probably know it as well as I do. The unfortunate (or fortunate, depending on your where you look) fact is that science can have impacts beyond science. A reproduceable scientific study proving that there is a genetic basis for the apparent intelligence deficit among those of African descent compared to other races would likely lead to widespread and disastrous social consequences. People would misread such evidence in whatever way benefited their ideology and would thereby become ever more entrenched in it. I believe that this reasoning is a significant part of why such a study would be squashed before it even began - the value of the knowledge gained from it would be vastly outweighed by the social harm caused by it.
I'm too drunk now to remember what point I was trying to make but in summary: good science is ruined by ideology because ideology takes what it wants and ignores the rest. Fuck ideology.

>>12497667
Somewhere along the line, being an adulterer, promiscuous, having children out of wedlock, aborting healthy children and abandoning your family is FAR LESS socially reprehensible than being a racist or a sexist.

>>12497680

I heard something around the grapevine and deduced through readings that they are rescheduling haplo groupings. For example I1B became E1B and E1B moved into the R because of the Islamic wars. So what became I1B? So it seems some countries have decided to not politicize this phenomenon. And decided to round the edges. Of course it becomes a more hush underground in the war on territorism. It’s scientific and political and I can only imagine it has left a multitude dead. The situation is akin to a grave robbery.

What do people get? Why is it that they want to get it real bad? Who are the ultimate top officials in this transition? Is telling the people the same as asking them to kill themselves?

>>12497667
The west is in crisis at so many levels. Science is the only place we can look for answers (religion is too far gone), but the answers doesn't align with what we want.

science has always been political, if you think otherwise you have the mind of a literal child

>>12498035
if the easy answer is uninteresting you should try harder

>we to math to escape politics
Me too bro. I realize now it's not possible to escape politics. The far right is home now.

>>12497667
>How do we stop blah blah blah?
Don't.
Accelerate the downfall, enjoy the collapse, and help to rebuild afterwards.

I'm a physicist and I'm going to do exactly this. Help in any way I can with Women in STEM bullshit, sexism crap, while fully knowing it's complete bullshit.
I will make it collapse faster so I can still be alive to see if be rebuilt.

>>12497667
>I can link studies in the replies
please do

>>12498145
This, the AMS posts liberal propaganda constantly. I can't be assed to search through all of it.

>>12497667
the girls in stem fields have already been filtered. the males havent. simple as.

>>12497667
Kick women out of unis, there ya go solved.

>>12498252
No. Kick stupid people and pseudoscience out of uni.

>>12497667
When political activists are trying to get everyone to do as they're told it's useful to have the Seal of Scientific Approval on their side, but if the Seal doesn't approve a bought or activist shill works just as well.

Welcome to Clown World.

>>12497942
What's even wrong with being racist? I think dogs are better than cats, labs better than chihuahuas.

>>12497736
It's not impossible. You just need to have your facts lined up and ready to shut down stupid lefty opinions. Like pic related.

>>12497719
Universities shifting their business model from quality to quantity explains a lot.
This shift happened mainly because anybody with a pulse can get a student loan and attend a state university.
It allowed the universities to make more money but they had to cater to the demands of more dummies.
The dummies didn't even need to be the majority of the potential customers in order to get their demands catered to.
As long as the majority wasn't against the crazy demands being catered to, a minority rule took place.
The smart choice for any sane person in the majority at the time would be to not rock the boat and gtfo in 4 years instead of threatening to drop out if the the demands were catered to.
Once the crazies' demands allowed crazies into positions at the universities, they held the door open for more crazies while also wielding the power disincentivize dissent.
The sane people that were just apathetic now have fear to motivate their non-resistance / compliance.
At this point, the problem is too far gone and the only solution is to cut student loans and let new universities or uncompromised universities outcompete the dumpster-fires based on merit.

Loan-Fueled Mobility -> Desegregation (of IQ) -> Tragedy of the Commons (Apathy) -> Minority Rule -> There Goes the Neighborhood -> ???
??? = White Flight (New Merit-Based Universities) or Gentrification (Retention or Recapture of Old Universities)

Yep

https://globalnews.ca/news/7535754/university-waterloo-discrimination-brain-injury/
>University discriminates a man by judging him with the same standards used for everyone else.

>>12497667
>Why the fuck is science getting so political?
Measuring people's skulls in order to gather buttress a presupposed moral and intellectual hierarchy of peoples is pretty political to me. Probably not always so contested among western race "scientists" in the 18th and 19th century but certainly political.

>>12497667
Look at types of power
Coercive Power
Reward Power
Referent Power
Expert Power
Legitimate Power
(debated 6th)
Informational Power

Pretending to expertise is a form of power in order to gain legitimacy power which can grant other powers depending on position obtained.
Science is politicized because its a source of power progression.

>>12498527
>be most advanced civ around
>go to some shithole tribal region that still hunter gathers
>conclude your civ is superior due to intellect required to advance from hunter gatherer tribe to contemporary tech
>????
>get called political by cucks in 21st century who deny iq differences

>>12498527
Science as a methodology and practice isn't political. The application of the data can be political. But finding correlations with cognitive ability and skull size in itself isn't political.

>>12498529
Can you reference books that go over these five(six*) types of power?

>>12498527
some people say blacks are stupid. Others say they aren't. Well, let's measure their brain volume and find out. That way we can stop arguing and just move on.
>NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO. Don't end the argument!!!! They are just as smart! Just believe me! Don't look for evidence!
Heeey. Their brain volume is measurably, and objectively smaller than it is for whites. Well, I guess that settles that. We can see it with our own eyes now.
>NOOOO. RACISTTTTTT RACCCIIISSIISSSSST. STOOOOP IIIIT.

>>12498549
These appeared in papers
French, J. and Raven, B. (1959). The Bases of Social Power. In Studies in Social Power, D. Cartwright, Ed., pp. 150-167. Ann Arbor, MI: Institute for Social Research

raven added 6th later:
Raven, B. H. (1965). Social influence and power. In I.D. Steiner & M. Fishbein (Eds.),Current studies in social psychology (pp. 371–382). New York: Holt, Rinehart, Winston.

>>12498563
Thanks.

>>12497667
>How do we stop propagandisation and politicisation of things that should never be politicised?
by starting to remove leftist politicians and "academics" from office

>>12497784
I think he meant how much is your salary anon

>>12497667
>Do you see this as a problem?

yes

>How do we stop propagandisation and politicisation of things that should never be politicised?

we don't

>I'm predicting the downfall of Western society by both the absolutely retarded extreme left controlling everything, and the equally retarded right wingers.

yep, just letting it happen and starting over from scratch is the only way to resolve the issue

>>12498662
My salary is a billion bucks ayear bunkertranny

>>12497788
Hey, crabs are beautiful creatures with hardened exoskeletons that protect our soft inner flesh. There's a reason so many species try to become crabs again!

>>12497667
It always was. You only began noticing it recently.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ebqAH5mLZNk
(check the second half of the video for the reasons)

>>12497719
> It's not the jews.
> Totally not the jews.
> You know who to blame?
> The women!

>>12498690
>Hard on the outside, soft in the inside
that's why they are insecure :(

>>12498706
you have the same egalitarian problems in East Asia right now, as well as In ancient Rome and The Arab empire in the tenth century (pic related), despite no Jewish influence.

Stop scapegoating Jews, bring back patriarchy.

>>12498035
not true, if you think otherwise, you have the mind of a literal retarded child.

>>12498089
fuck off, I’m not waiting 150 years for cultural shifts until i can be just left alone and do physics.

>>12498769
> East Asia
> no jewish influence
you what?

>>12497713

As opposed to the right who want to use science to socially engineer the planet in their fucked up perverse image to have the state as the father figure and provider in a quasi technofascist control grid?

Guys don't like doing mundane tedious bullshit.
what a surprise.

>>12498813
And what about South Korea, Japan and the other 2 historical answers?

>DUUHH IS THE JEWWS DUH DUH

>>12498769
>Stop scapegoating Jews, bring back patriarchy.
Feminism is primarily a Jewish endeavor.

>>12498431
>Florida lowered spending and have the highest rise of any state
How does Florida do it?

>>12498885
What egalitarian problems do they have?

>>12498769
>East Asia
>no Jewish influence
I guess you missed the BIG thread a couple weeks ago.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.haaretz.com/amp/jewish/.premium-this-day-mother-of-equality-in-japan-born-1.5412910
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.wsj.com/amp/articles/a-jewish-dynasty-in-a-changing-china-11590688537
https://www.thatsmags.com/shanghai/post/31322/meet-roberta-lipson-a-trailblazer-in-china-s-healthcare-sector
https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.scmp.com/magazines/post-magazine/books/article/3091585/last-kings-shanghai-history-sassoons-and-kadoories

>>12499004
Low fertility rate, over-saturation of workforce due to influx of female workers after they're been aloud to work, the "girls for STEM" thing op is talking about and the anon >>12498706 i responded to saying its jews not women

>>12499104
I made pic related in the context of another post I was responding to on an older thread, pretty much women in the workforce = women opting out of motherhood = low birthrate, which has its own problems. Also More women in the workforce does not translate into a more productive workforce, despite a 2x bigger workforce because of diminishing returns in terms of capital accumulation and employer productivity, women don't work as hard as men, 2x workers means the value of work is halved, ect, thus bottom right were the rate of GDP increase is unaffected by the influx of women workers. these are problems caused by egalitarianism/feminism and a lack of patriarchy, not the joos.

East Asian countries have a much worse fertility problem because they do not accept immigrants, in the west we have 'solved' our problem by maintaining a growing population with immigrants.

>>12499104
Obvious (((american))) influence.

>>12499117
>fertility problem
If you knew what was coming, you would understand that it's not a problem.

>>12497915
>the value of the knowledge gained from it would be vastly outweighed by the social harm caused by it.
Theres already harm being done because of legislation written under the pretense of egalitarianism among the races. But of course that is conveniently not an issue for you

>>12498948
Given their open criminal disclosure programme is the reason we hear about "florida man" so much I might assume they have a similarly open rationale in their educational system though I only have an inference to go by and know nothing of their actual system
sunlight is the best medicine

>>12498084
lol what

>>12498769
https://relampagofurioso.com/2016/05/30/jd-unwin-detailed-how-feminism-would-destroy-culture-30-years-before-womens-lib/
https://archive.org/details/b20442580/page/564/mode/2up

>>12497667
>Why the fuck is science getting so political?
Men are political animals. There is simply no way around it. They will force on you their unsolicited and biased political opinions at every chance they get.

>but as a true physicist
No true Scotsman.

>you should avoid ego and opinion and focus on absolute truth
>implying humans will ever transcend "ego" like some sort of Buddha
>implying we will ever access to any "absolute" truth, even in physics or math

>How do we stop propagandisation and politicisation of things that should never be politicised?
Why do you think science is inherently apolitical in the first place? The Manhattan Project was as much a scientific endeavor as it was a political one. There is literally NOTHING that cannot be weaponized in one way or another, be it in actual welfare on in information warfare; and how to make use of weapons is a decision in the hands of politicians.

I'm not saying you're wrong in being flabbergasted by "girls for STEM"; I'm just saying that crying about it won't change anything, and there is no point in your appeal to purity about "true physicists" and mathematicians having to be apolitical. Everybody has their own personal agenda to further their self-interest; you simply happen to believe that if you could sideline and ignore political issues you could focus more on your scientific endeavors and thus shine brighter than you would otherwise, but reality obstinately refuses to bend to your wishes for a scientific utopia. In other words, you're being just as political as your opponents.

>>12497754
>climate change was becoming an increasingly obvious and urgent threat.
academia has done a number on you, leftie basedjak

It's all a racket. It's to milk money from saps and taxpayers and funnel it into corrupt hands.

>>12499246
Remember the words of Smedley Butler.
>War is a racket, it always has been
The front lines of this war simply changed.

>>12498554
and eastern asians have bigger skulls/brains than whites.

>>12498438
top-tier based post
In regard to your future projections, I think it's more likely that Western society will just be totally overrun and destroyed by meritocratic Chinese institutions. The US government and societal order will totally collapse before the university system sheds its tenured communists.

>>12499332
>meritocratic
>Chinese
for fuck sake, kid, you're completely clueless
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fjcygESVnvE

>>12499357
>posting literal neocon shill daytime sitcom
>hurr durr chinese so uncreative, white peepo numba #1 numba 1 I say!
>kid
>manipulative alliteration
sensiblechuckle.jpg

>>12499416
As expected, chinese shill has nothing to object, only some FEELINGS.
But nobody can be expected to respect your feelings: even hydras have some.

>>12499258
skull volume correlates most with visuo spatial but less well with reasoning

>>12499357
Maggie was a smart cookie. She was a research chemist after all
Why is parliament so stuffed full of career politicians now? I think there's like 30 people tops with a scientific or business background in house of commons.

>>12499620
Career politicians tend to be sociopaths. As a result, campaigning has turned into a gauntlet that only a sociopath would be willing to run. Reasonable people don't want anything to do with it even if they would be good office holders.

>>12499217
This is not what OP is asking about. Why is it that these unsolicited and biased political opinions can override established scientific and mathematical results? I am sure this isn't the first time it has happened, but why and in what way is it happening right now?

You're right that the political has a relationship with any human endeavor. After all, politics is just a word for the craft of organizing our collective behavior. This is different from science and mathematics as we know them. Science has historically been a discipline in which we seek truth about the natural world, and mathematics about the platonic realm. That's a very different goal. Science can only be political in its direction. Science can be used for bad, for good or for nothing at all.

>>you should avoid ego and opinion and focus on absolute truth
That is the unofficial slogan of the cult of science, and I think that's a good cult to have in this world.

>>implying humans will ever transcend "ego" like some sort of Buddha
Maybe not, but it might be good to strive for it.

>>implying we will ever access to any "absolute" truth, even in physics or math
We verifiably have this in logic. Possibly in math. We approximate it in science and it works quite well.

>The Manhattan Project was as much a scientific endeavor as it was a political one.
Yes, but swap science with engineering.

>Everybody has their own personal agenda to further their self-interest; you simply happen to believe that if you could sideline and ignore political issues you could focus more on your scientific endeavors and thus shine brighter than you would otherwise
Luckily it is the case that science can be a worthwhile endeavor not only for the individual, but also for society.

>>12497667
EVERYTHING is political. Science is no except and has always been.

>>12499357
These regimes still care about technological progress.
The humanities might be gutted in "totalitarian regimes" but STEM will still be valued (unless it is some anti-tech theocracy).
To tout "the freedom of ideas" as if everything under that umbrella contributes to innovation is disingenuous.
If anything, our system right now over-values the race, gender, and queer studies and bludgeons the idea of meritocracy or any scientific finding that suggests groups aren't equal (by any metric that disfavors the "victim" groups).
It is because we had too much freedom of ideas that we now have a backwards totalitarian system that doesn't value science or tech merit.
The slowdown in progress due to the shift in values won't be seen immediately because there are still many people in industry and high places in universities who got there through the old merit system but as they are phased out and replaced by the new defective crop, there will be marked decline in quality output.

At this point the choice is between our current backwards totalitarian system that doesn't value science or tech merit and the chinese system that does.

>>12497667
As long as you support antinationalists you shouldn't be surprised if those antinationalists you put in positions of power use that power to weaken and sabotage the nation.

It's your own fault, and that of your ancestors, for being individualists.

Give me examples of actually useful and hard science with supporting evidence (no wishy-washy shit like psych or sociology) that is currently being quashed/sidelined by PC fanatics.

>>12499767
Why bother with an education then when we can just narrate reality by making models that agree with our opinions...
Oh...

>>12499630
it also doesn't seem to pay well enough to attract competence

when the govt owns science, what do u expect?

>>12498769
>despite no jewish influence
IMPLYING

>>12499104
Puppet/satellite states. Does that term ring a bell?

>>12499872
>These regimes still care about technological progress.
Sure, they eager to buy or still it from you. Putin said exactly that: "why do we need to develop our own science if we can buy everything on the west"
> It is because we had too much freedom of ideas.
Did you have freedom to point out the jews and what they were doing to you? You did not and you still don't. But now you know about them, and what are you going to do about them?

>muh grades
Irrelevant

>>12499872
Can this man's separately indented one-sentence truth bombs be stopped?

>>12499956
It's not the only potential issue. You also have dressing up politics as science.

>>12499956
Cosmology is fucked up by christians for one.
James Watson's situation tells that genetics is fucked up too by a similar crowd (commies hate genetics so much, that since they prohibited it in soviet union, Russia still didn't recover and doesn't have any actual textbook in the field.

>>12500064
People have been dressing up politics as science or narrowly interpreting some scientific result in a way that fits their priors for about as long as science has been around, but how about you provide whichever present day example you're thinking of and explain why it's important.

>>12500097
What on Earth are you talking about

>>12500115
>What on Earth are you talking about
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ebqAH5mLZNk

>>12500004
>Putin said exactly that: "why do we need to develop our own science if we can buy everything on the west"
That's right, goy. Putin gave you a compliment. No need to worry about Russia's technological progress. You're still in first place by a long shot. You have enough of a lead to take your foot off the accelerator. Russia and China aren't taking advantage of all of your publicly available academic papers and patents while keeping their advances to themselves. You've been working so hard to stay in the lead. Aren't you sleepy. You should take a nap.

>>12500128
>Hawking at the vatican
shit I never properly thought about that before, explains the whole epstein island thing too
Weirdly Fred Hoyle reminds me a lot of my grandpa.

>>12500144
China is twenty years behind. Russia - fifty.
Their own scientists despise their authorities.

>>12500128
>theories about things that can't be observed in real time make me uncomfortable so I'll just ignore them
Holy shit what a retard hahahaha

>>12500176
Citation?
Citation?
Citation?
Didn't they get Covid vaccines out first?
Didn't Russia need to buy rockets from us to send stuff into space for the last 2 decades?
Don't we have the best computer scientists?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_Collegiate_Programming_Contest#2018_World_Finals

>>12497736
>It is seemingly impossible to fix this outside of genocide and blunt population and political control
Technically there is a way - another age of great wonders and travel. Like when America and India were opened by sea travel from Europe and all the countries rushed to try and get something for themselves with settlers competing against each other and everyone clashing.

Problem is we need to go to space for that. And our current tech in not enough. Even if we make good enough engines the medical/genetic sciences are not enough to support people up there right now.

>>12500238
t.

>>12497667
I blame the media, including social media for increasing polarization. I think people sometimes forget that these institutions are made up normal people who are just as influenced by propaganda as everyone else.

>>12500238
>Didn't they get Covid vaccines out first?
Would you take that vaccine?
Russian space programs are the residue of the nazi program, they didn't even managed to repeat the shuttle.
And computer scientists are all self-educated, their government will take the credit, but it has nothing to do with their ingenuity.

>>12500213
Even if that's what you think he said, it's not what he was telling. If that's the only way you can understand that sentence, the retard is you.

>>12500281
>Would you take that vaccine?
I trust Russia's inactivated adenovirus vaccine more than I trust our mRNA vaccines.
Theirs doesn't inject a payload into your cells to hijack the functionality.
Theirs is also logistically better since it only requires 0F temps instead of -94F.
>Russian space programs are the residue of the nazi program
Lol, and ours isn't.
>they didn't even managed to repeat the shuttle
And they saved so much money doing so while missing out on nothing. Also remember, they beat us at the space station game.
>And computer scientists are all self-educated, their government will take the credit, but it has nothing to do with their ingenuity.
Theirs are better at self educating than ours. Is their culture better or is it their genetic stock?

>>12500337
> Is their culture better or is it their genetic stock?
Lack of the normal market, so they have to participate in stupid special olimpics instead of making the billions.
You bastard make me proud of being russian. Thank you, I guess.

>>12500337
Frankly Russia's space program is not even half of what it could have been. There are a shitton of projects left over from USSR than never were pursued due to lack of funding. For example the project for returnable boosters that Elon actually made to work was gathering dust on the shelf at least since 2008. And with old engineers dying off it's hard to say how things will go in the next two decades - and losing people who can give you the order of the values you will be calculating for like half a week simply from a glance just from sheer experience is a hard blow.

>>12499104
I don't think you are helping your argument though, the problems in Japan and South Korea are much less pronounced then in the USA. Japan is still a largely patriarchal society. According the the World Economic Forum Japan ranks 121st in gender equality among 153 countries and Korea ranks 108th. These countries don't have the same influx of migrants despite their very low fertility rates. Looking at other factors, while important, doesn't mean certain ethnic minorities aren't disproportionately in favor of given policies.

>>12500176
lmao
until 2020 the US had to pay to use soviet rockets to get their astronauts to space

>>12500325
>I don't like the big bang
>It seems to me that it is not likely to be correct
>There's too many assumptions for me to like it
>It's too far removed from astronomical observation
>We can't observe what happened 10 thousand million years ago
>But we can observe what happens in the center of a galaxy (???) today
>I prefer always to choose the alternative that allows one to carry out observations now
>I don't like the idea that something is dependent on a cause that I can never verify, because in the past it's all over and done with
Putting aside the fact that there's oodles of evidence for the Big Bang accessible to us today, his notion that a theory is more deserving of belief if it only deals with events directly observable in the present is laughable. He also doesn't elaborate on what "assumptions" he thinks BBT has too many of, but that sounds to me like a simple misapplication of Occam's Razor.
I'm not even going to touch all that conspiratorial garbage he spewed in the second half of the video but it sounds exactly like the kind of peurile whining you hear from flat earthers about being denied access to "study" their retarded ideas. Rubbish.

>>12497667
Everything is political. Science has always been political. You are only noticing this now because it is going political in the direction you don't like.

>>12500432
>He also doesn't elaborate on what "assumptions" he thinks BBT has too many of
Probably because it's obvious. dark energy, dark matter, now when those observations he was talking about approach that "horizon" behind which should be no objects according to bbt, they prepare the grounds for the explanation of why their theory is still correct (which is an extremely unscientific behaviour) by assuming that space expands faster than light.
> I'm not even going to touch all that conspiratorial garbage he spewed in the second half of the video
Don't. You don't seem like someone who hava any idea about what he speaks about, neither will you contribute something useful or at least entertaining.

>>12500458
It's going in a direction that harms science itself.

>>12500458
yeah nobody knew there were political biases to academia when the church was censoring authors, when Socrates was put to death and when anything against ethnics was hailed as truth.

The question is why in the past few decades has it been increasing?

>>12497754
Liar! Or, you missed the part where they said normies have to go back to the stone age while the (((Elite))) get all the technology and rights. OMG! Why are the Plebs revolting? Call them racists and anti Semites quick. Call them climate deniers, jus like Holocaust deniers. Now the Plebs are getting restless and the Elite is realizing that Trump was not enough to take the pressure off.

>>12500494
>now when those observations he was talking about approach that "horizon" behind which should be no objects according to bbt, they prepare the grounds for the explanation of why their theory is still correct (which is an extremely unscientific behaviour) by assuming that space expands faster than light.
I spent a few minutes attempting to parse this word vomit and was mostly unsuccessful, but it sounds like you're claiming that DM and DE are arbitrary "band-aid" solutions custom-made to patch up supposed holes in BBT, and do so by making dubious (according to you) assumptions like the ability for space to expand faster than light could cross it.
None of this is at all compelling because DM and DE are solidly grounded in observational evidence, even if we aren't yet certain of their ultimate cause.

>>12500546
because it turns out science pretty much backs up straight white men being better at almost everything, and increasing political power of minorities and women demands censure of inconvenient facts to make power grabs easier for them

>>12499970
Not above the table but you can get rich under the table, which once again is the type of thing that attracts the ethically challenged.

>>12498686
Kind of
>>12497784
See, this is the Burger educated in full effect

The comment was referring to the profit motive which skews much towards propagating education at the patronage of intensely wealthy people's views and philosophies.

Science can therefore suffer.

Take the unreformed Economics education parroting no alternatives to neo-classical and Monetray theory
Or the money being poured into by philanthropist trans rights billionaires and certain pharmaceuticals

MONEY is a gas

>>12500573
>DM and DE are solidly grounded in observational evidence
Only because your school teacher told you so, not because you actually researched this topic by yourself.
www.youtube.com/watch?v=EAb2OCxxXUM

www.youtube.com/watch?v=oqgKXQM8FpU
www.youtube.com/watch?v=B1mwYxkhMe8
yet www.youtube.com/watch?v=GatiekRziok

>>12497788
Is he wrong tho

>>12497849
I'm high off da good kush but I think you forgot a comma after "who hold those views"

>>12497849
Yoo economic studies actually proved it wasn't true? Big if true. How

>>12497942
Faagoooootttttttttttt (don't mean it as a homophobic insult)

>>12497667
well it isn't about science entering the political world but it's interpretation! Think of statistics - they evaluate them on a daily basis. One little mistake in interpreting them might result in an extraordinary law

>>12498948
I think cuz they were just really stupid 1990 cuz swamps and crap or something and then people start moving in that aren't retarded + the internet

>>12499104
Lot of things just wrong/contradictory in this post but I'm high and going to bed

>>12499184
This

>>12499191
Wut? I think it's implied that that would be a problem for him

>>12499207
>Escape politics
>Far right is my home now
Lol

>>12499611
But does it still correlate with reasoning?

>>12499872
I disagree with you about too much freedom of ideas created a backwards totalitarian system. Right now progress is slowed because of a lack of freedom of ideas. We aren't allowed to question differences in race, sex, sexuality, etc... because of a lack of freedom of ideas. I believe that when people started suppressing other ideas to promote the idea that everything ever is equal is when the progress slowed down. So no I don't think that too much freedom of ideas created this "backwards totalitarian system" it was a lack of freedom of ideas. Idk this whole thing is a paradox or something. Idk what u meant by backwards totalitarian system like what is that is that like totalitarianism but controlled by the people? Also sorry no commas

>>12500238
>we

>>12500281
>speculation

>>12500627
Fagooootttt

>>12499743
>We verifiably have this in logic
How do you "verify" anything? Logical positivism is dead and should stay dead.

>>12502046
>Faagoooootttttttttttt (don't mean it as a homophobic insult)

100% guarantee that YOU have inserted objects up your ass for sexual enjoyment.

>>12499332
>meritocratic
>chinese
LMAO

>>12498827
That's not denial

>>12498827
If you're picking sides in politics in 2020 you already lost. Both the left and the right are trying to destroy you, both figuratively and literally. They hate all the things that matter to the layman, just for slightly different reasons. The left wants to dismantle and destroy every aspect of your cultural and ethnic background for the sake of a global socialist utopia, and the right wants to do the same to save 5c per roll of toiletpaper.

>>12499184
>it's not a problem.
then why is East-Asia trying so hard to solve it, and why is the west importing so many immigrants?
Its a problem because in affect, Modern welfare/healthcare states are ponzi schemes.

>>12497667
>American
there's your answer
no degeneracy in slavland, come here

>>12499184
>If you knew what was coming, you would understand that it's not a problem.
if you are referring to artificial wombs, or large scale automation to compensate a dying workforce, I don't think they will be becoming a thing soon, and there is no good reason to think they are

>>12502246
>If you're picking sides in politics in 2020 you already lost.

I don't, I'm not a part of your world.

>>12502627
You don't know what is coming.
>>12502704
I am referring to cellular rejuvenation techniques.

>>12497754
>just as climate change was becoming an increasingly obvious and urgent threat.
found the retard

>>12499416
seethe more insect

>>12502105
I don't remember the data, but I recall something about Jews having relatively small skulls despite their high reasoning ability.

>>12497667
Your entire post is predicated on the notion that science is not inherently political as is, which is a hilarious notion.

>>12499242
>>12503226
Plastic company shills are out in full force today. Really, they have you working on a Christmas Eve?

>>12497713
the same academics that cant even land a fucking job, to add

>>12497667
>How do we stop propagandisation and politicisation of things that should never be politicised
There is a solution. Some might even call it final.

>>12499872
>there will be marked decline in quality output
This can be seen with many social media sites and incompetent millenials in charge of state/private business

>>12503979

>>12503116
That isn't coming either champ.

>>12497736
>I gather that society is driven by the mass insecurity of those 110-130IQ
To paraphrase Carlin, all you have to do is realize the average IQ is 100... and half the people are stupider than that.

>>12500390
>Japan is still a largely patriarchal society.
relative to Western countries, yes.
relative to how patriarchal they where before they had a fertility crash, not even close. (same for Korea)


>the problems in Japan and South Korea are much less pronounced then in the USA
no they have a worse fertility rate and an older population, as well as a larger class of celibate/single men and women. As for the shrinking population are economically productive, they are already and becoming more and more overworked.


>These countries don't have the same influx of migrants despite their very low fertility rates
yes, that's why their population is aging.

>>12497667
because profit and recognition is handed out by select institutions that are both politically funded and run by deans who are politically appointed. You cannot run afoul of that political system because you will get neither profit nor recognition. The solution is remove politics but in the near future this won't happen.

>>12505508
It's already here.

>>12497667
I made a thread about this before and it got spammed with people calling me an incel, telling me to go back to /pol/ (which I rarely visit), and then it got deleted. People were so mad that they called me a liar when I said I was a STEM grad with a job in academia. You're fighting an uphill battle OP. We're witnessing a mass brainwashing of the population on a scale that hasn't been seen in ages.

>>12497667
> Why the fuck is science getting so political?
> getting so
Science and politics have always gone hand in hand.

> I can link studies in the replies
Nut up or shut up.

>>12497667
Yeah... sad indeed...
But who cares, true mathematicians don't need universities, with internet we ought to be able to be independant from universities that gives you : offices, chalks and coffee.
Remind you that ancients mathematicians like Descartes, Pascal never learnt or gave courses at universities.

For other STEM go to China.

>>12505843

Somebody gets it. I can't stand academics in pure fields spewing political vomit on the masses through Twitter.

>>12498706
Women are a conduit through which the jews exercise their influence.

>>12506213
You'd need a benefactor or a job. The latter will take time away from maths while the former is difficult to impossible to find.

>>12498428
Whites better than niggers.

>>12497736
There's no such thing as general intelligence. Half the '160 IQ' individuals you fetishize are raging spergs, and most of the rest are straightforwardly defective in other ways. If it was easy to create populations of geniuses then selection would have already done so.
Also the sort of central control you propose always ends in abject disaster. Maybe if we can create AGI that's orders of magnitude better at it than any human or human bureaucracy it's worth trying, failing that you're just going to beat Mao's high score.

>>12498813
Maybe the worst logic ive ever seen. I’ve never met anyone even half as stupid as a /pol/ user

>>12507124
Your post is cringe and filled with jealousy of those who are higher intelligence than you. Stop polluting the thread.

>>12497667
Science is depoliticizing, not the other way around. We're giving marginalized groups the opportunities to further science politics have denied them. I think removing roadblocks to the advancement of knowledge is good.

>>12507124
lol found another insecure crab

>>12503320
do they really force you to shill this climate conspiracy on a Mongolian horse milking board just in the hopes of getting more government subsidies?

>>12502627
A population reduction will lead to a reduction in housing costs, increase in salaries due to restricted wageslave population and a reduced environmental impact
Absolute horror, how will Japan ever survive without importing half a billion of pajeets?

>>12507124
>no such thing as general intelligence
please be bait

>>12507510
>marginalized groups the opportunities to further science politics
We have lived in an unprecedented era of meritocracy, there are no "marginalized" groups, if they perform bad it's because they are biologically speaking trash.

>>12503313
This is the only decent post in the thread. The entire reason academia is failing is no one fucking reads or understands the philosophical canon whether they are stem fags or philo majors themselves. Knowing about the ethical divides between rationalists and empiricists, and the irreparable damage Foucalt and Derrida have done to the western world and such should be commonly known and discussed fact. If you don't understand the basis of the intellectual structure you are thinking in, you aren't thinking very effectively at all.

But there is no money in it and of course the institutions peddling their garbage philosophies don't try to get you to understand anything so you have to go out of your way to read it all and most people are simply unwilling. So we get things like PHDs regurgitating 80 iq fallacies they heard on TV about wage gaps and 97 percent of climate scientists agreeing even though such statements would be below the logic levels of 1800s school children in a rhetorical setting. There is no workable solution besides cataclysm or breakaway civilizations there is no force that is going to dislodge the technocapitalist demiurge and make people suddenly read books even though they remain completely uncensored for all to read free of charge.

>>12497667
It's neither the politicisation of science nor politics becoming more scientific, it's corporate mission creep permeating both sectors to the point where they are now fully integrated into the corporate sphere of influence and every decision is based upon short term profit margins.

No thought is given to the greater good anymore, it's all about instant profits, whole countries are measured by quarterly reports.

Profits are up this quarter? Good governance.
Profits are down this quarter? Bad governance.

This is how many companies are run in 2020 and how they've been run for a while now, on boom and bust cycles.

Business is doing poorly? Make cuts.
Business is doing well? Make cuts.

Few businesses look at the big picture anymore, instead of investing and trying to compete for customers the goal is to find the acceptable bare minimum required to still be profitable.

Countries are ran on the basis that more people = more demand and more demand = more revenue.

They don't care that many people's lives will ultimately worse as a result of this mindset, more people equals more taxation and more consumers and that's all that matters.

>>12497667
Because scientists are people. People are political.

>>12502246
There is no real left and right in politics, both sides are captured and work towards the same goals at different speeds and sometimes different angles.

I think that's why they despised Trump, because despite his wealth he wasn't "in the club", he's just a rich arsehole who didn't like the way the country was going and had the money to break into the system, I think in 2016 they learnt that they'd become complacent and overconfident and when they lost the election they decided never to do that again.

You see it often in the US and UK, politicians from opposing sides singing from the same hymnsheet, you'll often see Bush, Clinton and Obama sitting at the same events side by side and parroting the same lines, in the UK we see Blair, Cameron, Major and Brown wheeled out to push the same agenda.

The only people who really buy it all are leftists who unironically parrot the policy and talking points of Wall Street and the corporate lobbyists.

>>12497719
More women are being forced into STEM because diversity in the workplace creates a weaker and less militant workforce. Women are far less likely to go on strike than men are due to being more likely to be mothers and therefore more risk averse, different races are far less likely to trust one another and wish to form effective unions.

It's divide and conquer, this is the goal of diversity quotas, nothing to do with equality or fairness and everything to do with bringing down costs.

>>12507964
then do it, point us, the unenlightened and unwashed masses down the pathway you the enlightened have apparently walked, I guess there's no exigence for the rest of us. You're not just saying this for your own self-confidence are you? You aren't just going to say "start with the Greeks", "just read all of human philosophy bro" even though apparently those philosophy majors that did couldn't come to your enlightened opinion, right? You are at least going to give somesort supposed guidance to come to the right opinion that most people are simply unwilling to come to right? I mean what type of masochist would believe he himself held some ultimate understanding of western philosophy yet refused to reveal it outside of briefly mentioning some authors not even give more than a hint to what the enlightened understand they have done. I guess they enjoy their esoteric KNOWLEDGE of their world burning around them, if only i and the other unwashed could.

I wouldn't really know though, I don't even get memes about such topics let alone a midwits guide, or retards manual of any good use.

>>12497736
>be a villain
enjoy getting jfk'd if you're into into cumming in cunny

>>12497736
>be a villain
enjoy getting jfk'd if you're not into cumming in cunny

>>12497736
i fucking love this board

>>12507964
>>12508625
whole lot's of wurds that basically amount to
>>12507964
>people are stupid
and
>>12508625
>you're stupid
god damn guys simplify your fucking shit and stop trying to stroke your fucking intellectual egos

>>12508672
Holy shit
Shut the fuck up and go back

>>12508715
hello crabbi

>>12508715
i aint goin nowhere nigger

>>12508719
“I fucking love this board”
Why would you even post that, it’s so fucking childish

>>12508740
because i liek expressing my love for intelligent anons. not anons liek you, that seem to enjoy being whiny little faggots

>>12508742
Shut the fuck up you kid, you’re definitely a loner working a fast food job
That post wasn’t intelligent at all, it’s just “weak people should be controlled!!! Will to power!!” Spread out to multiple paragraphs

>>12497736
this deserves a (you)

>>12508748

>>12508765
Shut the fuck up dude
I’m tired of people jerking off their own egos and intellectual “skills” by saying things that can be said in two sentences in an essay instead, and then idiots like you thinking it’s smart

>>12508769
>I’m tired of people jerking off their own egos and intellectual “skills” by saying things that can be said in two sentences in an essay instead
although you're a whiny faggot, i do agree wholeheartedly with this statement.

>>12508773
Yes I’m a whiny faggot
It’s what is needed to get these pseuds a reality check

>>12508769
>tiny sootencuss isd intullugunt big pawagarphs noot!!!!!
Lmao you must be an actual midwit like he was talking about. You get caught in the fishing net of <130IQ?

>>12508748
>>12508769
>>12508775

You're a fucking retard lol.

>>12497667
Get off your high horse junior, what do you get out of putting down women in stem, of course politicizing science is a terrible mistake but why speak ill of women, all it takes is for someone to have an interest

>>12508775
he did a number on you for you to get this angry over some paragraphs huh?

anons let this be a warning to you

>>12507124
>There's no such thing as general intelligence
actual retard.

>>12508867
The more freedom women have in a society, the less likely they are to go into STEM fields. The response to this has been to try to shame them into STEM while demonizing those with actual interest in those fields. The result is lots of miserable women in careers they weren't really interested in and lots of guys who were interested in them being shutout so they become video game playing NEETs instead. The net result is that industry hasn't gotten the doubling of the workforce it desired but instead is getting a lower quality workforce that it cultivated. Congratulations on fucking yourselves.

>>12497736
320iq
terrible

>>12509430
This. Btw this is OP's source for the graph: search "gender differences in grades nature" and select the one called "Gender differences in individual variation in academic grades fail to fit expected patterns for STEM". For some reason 4chan thinks the article's link is spam even through Sci-Hub.

>>12497667
This post wasn't meant to degrade anyone. It's to show the political nature of science and how it's ruining things. I believe in equal opportunity, not forced diversity and giving unfair advantages to specific races, genders, whatever-the-hell else. Science is open to anyone who can provide the research, and work for objective truth. It is *not* to push some stupid agenda.

>>12498769
>no Jewish influence
it's called the USA

>>12509460
You're right, the US did force japan to give women voting rights.

there was a brief period where science wasn't politicized. post church secularism to pre hitler. the nazi's pretty much torpedoed human biodiversity out of accepted science.

>>12497719
Pretty sure there's less women in STEM than ever.

>>12510141
That depends on which country you're in. A few got the hint once they noticed given the freedom to choose, most women preferred non-STEM fields. In countries like the United States and Canada, they're still in full "evil men are blocking women desperate to be in STEM fields from getting in" mode. The social pressure on girls to pick a STEM field for the good of feminism is intense. The outcome of this isn't going to be good.

>>12510141
are you retarded

>>12510159
Are you? The more wealthy and free a country become, the less women get in STEM. Countries like India and china are the one with the most women in STEMs.

>>12509455

>>12510151
I'm in the UK I tried to raise the issue with female family members and it erupted into a huge row that obviously women were still oppressed.
Shit's grim.

>>12510175
pakistan has one of the highest rates of women in stem

>>12510151
>The social pressure on girls to pick a STEM field for the good of feminism is intense. The outcome of this isn't going to be good.
idk, i feel liek shit is on track to getting better. the only reason it seems so bad is most of the US just wants to be left the fuck alone and just tries to ignore the insane retardation and attention seeking while the liberal elites and their genetically defective mutant henchman endlessly shove words and accusations into a void they truly believe is something moar than an abyss of nothingness.
basically, we're patient, but holy fuck if you push hard enough you're gonna get a bad fucking reaction

>>12510507
maybe pakistani women actually have value

>>12510546
Read this >>12509355 what's your take?

>>12510567
lol this is my take

>>12509355
What the fuck?

>>12497667
Jewish people, science was one again figuring how the world works then jews use it to try to rationalize their civilizastion destroying ideologies.

>>12499956
The nuclear field has been stagnant for decades, not entirely, but certainly appreciably due to political reasons

>>12497667
science is not political

>>12497736
this is a pretty good post I don't see what the asshurt is about

>>12497667
>I'm predicting the downfall of Western society by both the absolutely retarded extreme left controlling everything, and the equally retarded right wingers

Then you're part of the problem for engaging in this retarded centrists stupidities. Fascists and long term sane people have been WARNING you for the past decades about this aspect of leftists.

Meanwhile, you are seeing the politicization of science being done by zealot leftists and you say stupid shit like "both da right and da left are da same"!! If that were true, we would see journals advocating for the truth and other rightists causes, but I don't see them.

You little faggot. Read up on "Lysenkoism", that is the future you heading towards.

>>12497667
Everything is getting more and more politicised. We live in hyper partisan times and I think it will only get worse.

>>12497667
nerds with low social clout are natural simps

>>12513305
What do you think of Juche philosophy?

>>12513366
I just read the Wikipedia article so I don't really have an opinion on that. Why?

>>12497667
>science in the usa
hahahahaha

>>12497667
I know your OP wasn't directly referring to the image, but any body who tries to pass this shit is an article deserves a bullet for such shit sample selection.

>Artificial educational barriers for women, meaning only the best will actualise education oppurtunities i.e going to university.
>The sample doesn't take into account women below this barrier
>the graph just compares a standard sample of men to a positively selected sample of women.

I loathe myself for choosing to study economics, but when I see STEM people post shit like this it makes me feel like i'm maybe not that retarded, relatively speaking.

>>12514941
You also have much more men who see careers outside of university as an option though this might not contribute much

>>12497942
This. Cheating on a married man is probably causing more psychological harm than raping someone, suicide rates and symptoms of ptsd considered.

Makes perfect sense from an evolutionary standpoint as adultery is a tremendous threat to the reproduktive success of males and negative emotional responses to the stimuli would therefore be extremely adaptive.

Caring more about your extended family than any random person is no worse than caring more about your family than others.

>>12497667
Science isn't political you are just anti science.

>>12497736

blessed post

t. 250 IQ

>>12498035

>science has always been political, if you think otherwise you have the mind of a literal child

This is true because there is not really a fact / value is / ought distinction. There is merely a conglomeration of wills competing for power, survival, and dominance with hierarchical chains of subordination which emerge from competitive social games. The facts of the world only contextualize and limit the behavior of these games. The validity of an ideology actually does rest upon its truth value, there's no such thing as an ought

>>12497667
>Why the fuck is science getting so political?
Anon it was political from the start, didn't the trial of Galileo teach you anything about the consequences of integrating new ideas into old/ established systems?

>>12497667
Because it's getting expensive.