/sci/ - Science & Math

>>12445726
The fact that this entire picture's premise depends on 9 pages in Nature Genetic's 2018 journal is a good indication that it's hokum

Because genetics isn't as simple as just finding the "smart person" gene

>>12445752
not an argument

>>12445726
You find more recent data and check the current state of the field

>>12445783
>not an argument
Neither are p hacked infographs

>>12445781
Yea about it's not about 1 gene...

>>12445790
It's not sufficient to discredit it as such.
what do the later review studies say?

Man this is just so fucking stupid. It's a list of genes and they are pretending it has something to do with intelligence just because they happen to relate to the brain? Fucking morons I swear.

>>12445945
just test the correlation of the genes against educational attainment?

>>12445726
>brain evolution stopped 200,000+ years ago
>genes don't influence intelligence
>there's no gap
Proving any of those would do it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cqkaxSEWy3E

>>12445726
>how do you debunk this
You can’t, it’s a fact.

>>12445726
With HRT and dresses

>>12445726

>>12446246

>>12445726
"Debunk" in modern parlance means "arbitrarily decide not to believe". You're alreafy doing it.

>>12445726
You do the fucking legwork to see if it has merit or not

>>12446138
>brain evolution stopped 200,000+ years ago
>genes don't influence intelligence
>there's no gap

[Citation needed]
Man, modern educational brainwashing has really done a number on people, hasn't it?

>>12446138
>>brain evolution stopped 200,000+

organisms never stop evolving-- unless they go extinct.

>genes don't influence intelligence

TBD, although, since they pretty much influence every other phenotypical trait-- why not intelligence too?

>there's no gap

There is...and the gap is still there when adjusting for income/ socio-economic factors.

>>12446530
>socio-economic factors is my story and I am STICKING TO IT NO MATTER WHAT!
Yah that was already thoroughly debunked. You are a liar and fraud

>>12446138
Good thing you can objectively prove the opposite of all the things.

wetard

>>12446731
what? he said what you're saying, read it again.

>>12445752
not an argument. What's your problem with Nature Genetics?

>>12445781
you are right, there are literally hundreds of genes that increase IQ and are only found in Europeans and Asians.

>>12445945
>genetics are irrelevant for the phenotype
please get out brainlet

>>12446805
Retinal genes rekevant for intelligence?

>>12446816
a single SNP has usually multiple effects, the goal of the game is to find them all now.

>>12446816
which rs are you specifically referring to? let's see

>>12445726
maybe if you knew how correlation and causation tied into this you could give it a shot yourself
or you could realize you have no argument and just say "corr =/= cause" every time theres stats you dont like

>>12446830
I'm just quoting the /pol/tard that wrote the infographic.
It's funny how it says the genes are linked to the brain, the cerebrum and the telencephalon. That's how you know you're dealing with a real genius.

>>12446863
yeah he said three times the same thing... maybe the one that produced the picture was just given the list of SNPs and copied everything without checking the synonyms. Maybe he was not educated in neuroscience and was only tasked with producing the final image.

>>12446868
Yeah, literally has no clue what he's dealing with, but sure as hell looks impressive for retarded /pol/tards.

A better way to prove this would be to make a complete table with all the individual sources for each variation... many of these SNP's are pretty obscure it seems.
If I have time I will do it, I want to strengthen the arguments of the European nationalists as much as I can.

For example the third one in the list (rs229168) has been linked to math skills by one paper

https://www.dnatoz.com/snp-gwas.php?snp=229168

>>12446899
the paper, feel free to dig into it
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/30038396/

>>12445726
>How do you debunk Nazi tripe
I'm sure approaching a scientific question with this mindset is going to yield totally unbiased results

>>12446913
I second this, OP shows his bias even before actually beginning to attempt a "debunk"

>>12446913
>>12446924
OP is a /pol/tard you dumb fucks.

>>12446929
Does it matter that it's bait when people actually think like this?

>>12445783
>>12446800
>not an argument

>>12446929
>OP is a /pol/tard you dumb fucks.
I would not be so sure about that, /sci/ has been literally invaded by bunker/discordfags lately

>>12446924
Naw, I'm pretty sure he's just false-flagging it to lure people into looking at his infographic of numbers. He's gone a bone to pick about genetics and he'll get you talking about it with bait.

But no joke, the current trend of denying race exists is.... simply bullshit. Race is real and comes from the period in time that pockets of humanity didn't interbreed and experienced genetic drift and gained all the traits that everyone has used to differentiate different people's.

That said, the intelligence differences in the studies likely isn't that big of an issue. Social factors REALLY DO influence test scores. Poor people are really damn fucked up in a lot of different ways. Children of poor people can be raised in good families with some money and.... no they can't score just as well. But they can do better. There really is a genetic component to all this.

The biggest problem is that EVERY damn attempt to really do anything about it causes more problems then good. Eugenics is horrific. So bad even the big brained people will fight against it. They'll stand alongsize the masses and denounce all the nazis and cia agents and $YOURRACEHERE-power types. You have to promote it on the downlow. Keep the real fucking retards from having too many kids. Abortion, plain and simple. If they don't want kids, we sure as fuck don't want them to have kids. Promote sex ed and birth control. Treat women like people. Let them have kids when they want and not when some young dumbass gets in their pants.

>>12446964
>Abortion, plain and simple. If they don't want kids, we sure as fuck don't want them to have kids. Promote sex ed and birth control.
Never gonna happen in America.

>>12446975
pft, a little less then a million this year. Do you think it's NOT happening in the USA?

That and birth control has brought the birth rate in the USA down from 3.65 per woman in 1960 to the current 1.77.
We ARE controlling who has kids and how many kids.

Are you retarded or have you missed the last 50 years? (damn shame you weren't aborted).

>>12447002
Republicans are literally fighting against it. Abortion, birth control and sex ed.

There is a racial intelligence gap, and a not insignificant proportion of this is due to genetics.

The evidence for this is so overwhelmingly strong that anyone who rejects it is doing so based on ideology. The claim that 100% of intelligence differences are based on environmental factors is about as strong as the claim for creationism and global warming denialism, and all share in common that they are political views, not scientific.

Below is a good, succinct thread explaining why.
https://twitter.com/a_centrism/status/1211170458902487042?s=21

Only 14% of experts believe that environmental factors explain 100% of the racial IQ gap. A majority believe that genetics explain most of it.

Again, the 100% environmentalist view of racial IQ gaps is not a serious theory in the slightest. I am not exaggerating when I say that it is creationist, flat earther, global warming denialism tier nonsense.

Race and IQ is the global warming of the left.

>>12446530
Anon, that's the point he was making
are you autistic by any chance?

>>12447035
this desu

>>12447005
........Higschools currently teach sex ed nation-wide.
Abortion is legal in the first two trimesters. 6 months to find out and decide.
Condoms are everywhere.

WTF is wrong with you?

>>12445726
Non-racist proposal: Deport all retards to Africa, allow immigration of the small high IQ nogs. The future world will be a genius castizo vs an ultra retard mulatto
Just discriminate on the basis of intellect, not of race, and if nazis are right then it still overlaps with classical Nazism 98% of the time.

>>12447405
Abstinence is what's being taught in some states.
There are literally attempts all the fucking time to limit abortion. Now there's even a pro-life majority in the supreme court. Bye bye Roe v. Wade.
Birth control is more than condoms and Republicans are literally against funding contraception.

Why are you pretending Republicans are not working to make abortion illegal and defunding contraception?

>>12447482
>Abstinence is what's being taught in some states.
pft, where?
>attempts

>Why are you pretending Republicans are not working to make abortion illegal and defunding contraception?
Because they're failing at it?

>>12446964
>Race is real and comes from the period in time that pockets of humanity didn't interbreed and experienced genetic drift and gained all the traits that everyone has used to differentiate different people's.

So if this is real why not just let society do its thing until people racemix so hard this wont even be a thing anymore? Evolution will still do its thing. Why is racemixing so bad?

>>12447527
Sex ed is not even mandated in many states. Are you not aware of this?

Also, there are at least 20+ states that teach abstinence-only.

>>12447573
There are a lot of possible reasons one might be against race mixing, here are a couple possible ones that first come to mind.
-Improved national unity and social cohesion from a homogenous and "unique" race from which you can derive national identity
-Introducing elements into your gene pool that are on average inferior to the current constitution is probably not beneficial
-Pride
-Tradition
I would wager that in the average persons mind the social aspects of race mixing are more important than the genetic aspects.

Now obviously whether the pros outweigh the cons is always dependent on the particular situation at hand and obviously the values of the observer but even having to ask "Why is racemixing so bad?" shows a significant ignorance of differing world views this globe of ours holds, all 7.8 billion of them.

>>12446950
I'm not any of those people, but it really isn't my man, no matter how many basedjacks you produce

>>12447573
>So if this is real why not just let society do its thing until people racemix so hard this wont even be a thing anymore? Evolution will still do its thing. Why is racemixing so bad?

It's really not. Outbreeding is actually extra healthy. Everyone has fucked up genes. But we have two copies in case one is bad. It's when those errors overlap when they HAVE to be used. You and your siblings have the same errors, which is why inbreeding is bad.
You inbreed for freaks, you outbreed for health.

Who said racemixing is bad?
But you've got to let do what they want.

>>12445726
Luckily for you, you don't need to "debunk" it anymore. Uncomfortable science is getting purged instead.
https://archive.is/beD9M

Because we're heading for another dark age, once again led by a religion. Only this religion is really fucking gay.

>>12447683
Outbreeding is not a valid argument for populations the size of races.

>>12447697
Argument for what? Outbreeding is healthy.

Pft, you're never going to outbreed a whole race.

The dude asked me why racemixing is bad. I told him it's not.

>>12447713
Yeah but it not being bad is not related to outbreeding. Outbreeding is not more healthy than inbreeding in the case of races, because races aren't closely related enough. Hell, even having children with your first cousin causes about as much inbreeding depression as having kids when you're 40. Racemixing is therefore probably about as beneficial in terms of outbreeding as having children a couple of weeks earlier.

>>12447690
This is such an interesting thing to think about, what happens to the copyright after it gets purged? I would definitely be interested in a journal specifically for publications "banned" for wrongthink.

Another example with a paper on greater male variance: https://quillette.com/2018/09/07/academic-activists-send-a-published-paper-down-the-memory-hole/

>>12447726
>Outbreeding is not more healthy than inbreeding in the case of races,
. . . .you mean two people of different races breeding? .... yeah, that's outbreeding. Two people from diverse genetic backgrounds don't have genetic fuckups in the same spots.

Races DO have medical trends. Like how blacks are susceptible to.... sickel-cell. If they breed with a european, they wouldn't have that problem. Probably. Less so.

Having kids when you're 40 is bad. Having kids with your cousins is also bad. (siblings? Real bad. Cousins half as bad.)

>>12447762
>Races DO have medical trends. Like how blacks are susceptible to.... sickel-cell. If they breed with a european, they wouldn't have that problem.
1. At the cost of 10 IQ points. 2. That's not how inbreeding depression works, because you have to examine new conditions that arise in the offspring from the recessive genes. In the case of an existing disorder, like if the black father has sickle cell, then yeah, breeding with a white woman will result in healthier kids: but from the white woman's perspective, the kids are less healthy.

That's why you consider inbreeding depression and not outbreeding boon.

Inbreeding depression has tiers that range from lifecrushing for the kids to completely negligible, the example was to illustrate how even at the stage of first cousins, the effects aren't all that bad. People have kids all the time when they're 40, because its bad but not THAT bad. If you carry these stages down to race, the downsides of less diversity when not racemixing are so minimal as to be basically 0.

>>12447690
Dead link?
URL isn't working for me

>>12446929
>OP is a /pol/tard you dumb fucks.

>>12445726
>I can't debunk this, please do it for me!
If you can't refute a nazi, maybe that nazi isn't wrong. Or maybe you just suck at this.
Maybe even both.

>>12447573
This destroys the diversity of the human species.

>>12447482
This post came out of a delusional parallel universe. Pity this anon for their schizophrenia, it must be terribly unpleasant to live with.

>>12445945

>>12447871
Far right white ethno nationalist here.
He's right.
Abortion is the only culture war item Republicans push because it's the only one that actually doesn't ultimately help whites, though many are convinced it would.

>>12446803
>only found at high rates in Europeans and Asians.
FTFY

>>12445726
What if it's genetic combination that makes penis small?

>>12447731
I wonder how reliable a source Quillette is, I know they are politically charged but I don't know if they would lie.

>>12448035
Nah, there are intelligence genes exclusively found in Europeans, such as CCR5-delta32, which is traceable back to a scandinavian man 2k years ago. It's actually NEVER found in sub saharans. Your correction is false.

>>12449449
Surely with all the gradual gene mixing there must be some instances of this gene in the african population? even if the level is so low as to be undetectable

>>12449472
>african population
For such a gene to make it to an "African" would bring their African status into question

>>12449472
>>12449478
Well, a minute amount of the gene can be found in North Africans and the levant, but there's a large rift between North and sub saharan Africa, very large. Coincidentally near 0 mixing has gone on between those groups until very recent history, we're talking the 16th century to present. So no, it can't even be found even in undetectable amounts.

>>12449515
I was just being cautious but if you can back this up with facts then I'm all for using it.

>>12445726
Why would you even want to?
Anyone who's interested in having an actual conversation isn't a drooling /pol/tard that has to cobble together tenuous connections to white people genes and IQ scores to cope with the fact that they provide no intrinsic value to the world.

>>12449695
I'm sorry but did you just deride white people using the internet?
Ooooof.
Maybe use smoke signals or chiseled rock next time if you don't want to be cringe and have more of an impact.

>>12445726
Arrival of Europeans was to the Africans equivalent of what today would be arrival of aliens to humans

>>12449715
Thanks for demonstrating why you don't argue with retards

>>12449695
>you, personally, have to meet my arbitrary criteria of accomplishment before I'll let you justify the continued existence of your race
This is why I smile when people shoot leftists.

>>12449734
Na man, Africans were retroactively traumatized by the colonialism they would face in the future casing them to be held back.
You're just ignorant.
Study some Critical Race Theory.

>>12445726
You can't. Besides, it's not "nazi tripe," it's data from surveys of the human genome.

>>12449736
>Arabic
They were indian vedic numerals, they were only called arabic because they came via arab traders

>>12449736
Are you implying that only whites took that survey?
Do you think you just did a "gotcha"?
kek, stay mad.

>>12446527
You have poor reading comprehension.

>>12447482
>Bye bye Roe v. Wade.
Not going to happen, SCOTUS won't revisit it.

>>12445726
You don't. Nazis aren't open to dialogue and are just out to annoy and waste your time. Sartre's words on anti-semites apply.
>Never believe that anti-Semites are completely unaware of the absurdity of their replies. They know that their remarks are frivolous, open to challenge. But they are amusing themselves, for it is their adversary who is obliged to use words responsibly, since he believes in words. The anti-Semites have the right to play. They even like to play with discourse for, by giving ridiculous reasons, they discredit the seriousness of their interlocutors. They delight in acting in bad faith, since they seek not to persuade by sound argument but to intimidate and disconcert. If you press them too closely, they will abruptly fall silent, loftily indicating by some phrase that the time for argument is past.

>>12449874
>all cries for censorship come from the left
>"Nazis aren't open to dialogue"

>>12449885
I'll take that back once I meet a non-troll Nazi. Until then, I'll take a not-wasting-my-time position.

>>12449874

That's a great quote.

>>12449903
>you're only censored because you're categorically wrong, were not hiding anything
Does this really work on people? Holy shit.

>>12449903
well I'm not him but personally I view the idea of nationalistic socialism as probably one of the better options.

>>12449935
Absurd! Bad faith! Frivolous! Irresponsible word usage! Not serious! I win!

>>12449407
I looked into it after hearing about the story its definitely legit see https://fr.arxiv.org/abs/1703.04184v2
The article has since been revised 13 times it seems like they are walking on eggshells trying to get the point across "correctly".

Combine something like these cases with the grievance study affair where an author was able to publish completely bogus woke papers (In one instance he literally took Mein Kampf and replaced jews with white male patriarchy) and it gets even more terrifying https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grievance_studies_affair

On top of all this the majority of studies cant be replicated the whole this is just a shitstorm recipe for disaster

>>12449874
>quoting a marxist as your argument for why the other guys are the bad guys

>>12450313
>(In one instance he literally took Mein Kampf and replaced jews with white male patriarchy)
I remember that one, it was funny at first but also really realy depressing

>>12450313
I see, good to hear.
Too bad I still wouldn't be comfortable using Quillette as a source to back up my arguments due to their general image as a politicized right wing news outlet.

>>12450367
What about the profusion of biased leftwing sources people use all the time?

>>12445726
OP, they cherrypick their data to match their rhetoric and agenda.
Furthermore racism has become so deeply systemic, especially here in the U.S., that it's easy as pie for them to cherrypick any data for any """point""" they want to make, and then you have to work your way backwards through a million different institutions and legislative choices and what-not to show that racism exists and is in fact systemic. In the post-Trump era it'll take DECADES to unravel all of it, and that's just on the government end of it, then there's the corporate and financial end of it.

>>12450501
ywnbam

>>12450501
There certainly seems to be rampant and blatant systemic racism against whites