/sci/ - Science & Math

SLS is America's launch vehicle and will fly before SpaceX has a working raptor

Was it worth it?

>>12353601
Should have been expanded.

Rolling for columbia repeat

>>12353585
raptor has already flown and only eats itself sometimes

>>12353585
>Senate Launch System
Yes and it better does its job before it's too late

>>12353601
>>12353610
Yes, and the new one will cost 1/10th as much.

>>12353601
Only by accident that COTS allowed SpaceX to grow on these contracts

>>12353621
hey why did it steal a module :(

>>12353621
I love this stupid ass animation
>put module on top
>change mind
>put module on side
>put tower on top
>steal Leonardo module while everyone's watching the tower unfold
>peace out before anyone notices

>>12353612
SN13

>>12353639
Commercial space, man.

>>12353601
>$150 billion
The last time the annual US defense budget was that low, Ronald Reagan had just been innaugurated for his first term. Yes it was worth it.

I can't believe that 42 might be the answer. Fucking Elon and his meme numbers.

>>12353639
That one isn't old, it shouldn't burn up with the rest of the old ISS.
>>12353640
It's pretty great

>>12353640
The best part is it's clearly much faster than real predicted speed so there would be a lot of awkward standing around for the multiple minutes it takes the arm to steal Leonardo.
>so
>uh
>rob any good space stations lately?

>>12353650
none of it should burn up wtf? shit's valuable materials for in space construction

>>12353657
we're a wasteful bunch

>>12353657
Not really, with the poor location. There is much more available mass in high orbit that could be dragged by very small sail-based salvage satellites.

>>12353661
Imagine how big a photon sail you could fold up into a cargo Starship for a 500kg payload.

>>12353577
Spacex is already mogging every other launch provider to death with the F9, and at this point it's a mature vehicle. Everybody is scrambling to catch up to old news.
Who can ever hope to compete?

>>12353656
>multiple minutes
Days, it would be a whole hassle and probably require ground control to at least not actively try to prevent it

>>12353670
>The USSR is already mogging every other country to death with the Кocмичecкaя пpoгpaммa CCCP, and at this point it's a mature space program. Everybody is scrambling to catch up to old news.
>Who can ever hope to compete?

Why can't Italians into making reliable rockets?

>>12353674
They are italians.

>>12353673
It took us ten months longer than the Soviets did to put a man in orbit and then we never lost the lead after that. Foreignspace is over a decade behind with reusable booster development.

黒人

>>12353679
If not for SpaceX, USA would be behind Russia, China, Europe and even India when it came to $/kg.

>>12353679
one single accusation of racism can do wonders to open up a market
it'd be a shame if someone decided to cut the head off of the proverbial snake
according to my more reserved associated, government handouts can only last so long
we'll see what happens :)

>>12353680
The word you are looking for is Kuronbo, not Kokujin.

>>12353683
SpaceX could only exist in the USA. Hell, even Rocket Lab is now incorporated here, and the only serious runner ups in small launch are US companies as well. hopefully Blue Origin will get their ass in gear too. it'll just be American companies playing and competing on cost in their sandbox while everyone else scrambles to remain relevant. it's beautiful

>>12353683
Perhaps our own economy is our greatest weakness. The US government demanded hydrolox boosters (can’t remember if it was DoD or air force or pentagon or whoever). But we generate so much money that the USA is perfectly fine spending $5 thousand a kilogram to launch a spy satellite up on a ULA rocket. So there’s no room for sudden R&D cause why the fuck would anyone want to make it cheaper? Elon Musk and the rest of the folks at spacex are extremely based and we are very lucky they’ve been succeeding with their goals since falcon 1

>>12353695
SpaceX could exist in Europe too, plenty of talent and capital to draw from, US was just easier with existing infrastructure and government gibs.

>>12353699
>SpaceX could exist in Europe too
It couldn't. Elon has lived in South Africa, Canada, and Europe. Only in the US could he build SpaceX.

>>12353699
Using the system to fight the very beast it feeds. Outstanding move not even joking

>>12353699
it's not about talent, it's about investment. Venture capitalists have mostly steered clear of foreign launchers. Plus the regulatory environment is retardedly prohibitive. SpaceX didnt get any govt gibs until they made it to orbit.

>>12353689
Type that again without crying.

>>12353674
Rockets don't have rear view mirrors.

Top kek, two recent events in one

>>12353708
*ends your ignorant country's legacy of monochromatic space colonialism built on the backs of the vulnerable and the oppressed*

>>12353710
all rocket cameras point backwards

Somebody post Mary's latest picture of SN9's heatshield, it makes me hard.

>>12353674
You know what they say Vega stands for, means fix it again Tony

Is the Ariane 5 based or retarded

>>12353732
Mommy.

>>12353732
Based if it were cheaper and launched more often

>>12353732
>Mini SLS
Extremely based, proves SLS will BTFO all other rockets

>>12353736
UUUUUUUUUOOOOOOOOOHHHHHHH

>>12353736
oh, i'd sniff that

Why is there still a launch thread?

Weebs should die
Pathetic losers

>>12353746
The launch thread is now eternal. /sfg/s takeover of /sci/ is nearly complete

Jesus christ. “We expect operation by 2030” means it will get delayed to 2035 or 2040. Ariane 6 is going to crawl out of the den with absolutely no reusability options, and lord knows how long it will take to get it. Falcon 9 will be long gone by then.
I feel like every major rocket company was beginning to plan for the next 10-20 years just as Falcon was just learning to fly. No one was taking it as a serious threat. Now the falcon has made costs go down and starship is crawling out of the earth in a swamp in texas with pocket change. These big rocket companies have already invested billions on their shitty new rockets though and they are scrambling to throw parachutes on all of their engines just to get achieve a fraction of what falcon can already do, and has already been doing for a while now

>>12353764
/sci/ is a festering garbage heap anyway lmao

>>12353771
Hopefully Spacex dominance will pressure old space to do actual work and get shit done

I wonder if anybody has ever played a roguelike in space.

>>12353780
More like pressure oldspace to up their bribe game and get senators and such to pass laws cucking SpaceX

>Methane? Oh that's terrible for carbon emissions, we are trying to combat climate change here. Why don't you develop a environmentally friendly and sustainable hydrogen rocket then get back to us :^)

>>12353797
everybody is doing methane now, actually. They should be using propane but only one company has seen the light so far.

>Tesla is making the machines that Moderna and co are using to produce their mRNA vaccine
>Elon is proud and happy about this

I wanted so bad to believe he was different from the others bros... Now I guess you will have to be vaccinated and brain chipped to get off planet.

12353803
Shitty bait full of logical fallacies

>>12353806
Give me a (you) at least and refute what I said you fucking nigger.

>>12353797
I mean in the sense that Ariane was developed to give Europe independent acces to space, maybe seeing the huge advantage Spacex has will give force ESA (and others) to get their act together

>>12353585
We don't have a commercially available heavy lift vehicle. SLS may someday come about. It's on the drawing board right now. Starship is real. You've seen it down at Boka Chika. We're building the core stage. We have all the engines done, ready to be put on the test stand... I don't see any hardware for a SLS, except that he's going to take four RS-25s and put them together underneath the ET and that becomes the SLS. It's not that easy in rocketry

>>12353803
thunderf00t debunked this

ol Chris playin a tune on Mir
https://youtu.be/p4DdmOUvNp8

>>12353823
>le give a attention mustache man
Something about him rubs me the wrong way

Speaking of Tesla, it's going to be added to the S&P 500 by the end of the year so if you have a pension there is a high likelihood you'll own some Tesla stock by proxy.
>>12353803
What are you talking about? Tesla builds printers for CureVac, which is low on the list of vaccine makers, not Moderna.

>>12353823
Man, Mir was a shithole.

>>12353833
but it had soul

>>12353771
>june 2015
meanwhile...
https://twitter.com/ArianeGroup/status/1327158496928952322

THREAD THEME
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QEJ9HrZq7Ro
Von " "Once the rockets are up, who cares where they come down..." Braun

>>12353706
>SpaceX didnt get any govt gibs until they made it to orbit.
Incorrect. The first three Falcon 1 flights carried government payloads.

>>12353854
piece of shit jew cockass should be gassed

>>12353861
the first Air Force one is famous for bouncing off of one of the bunker roofs on the island

>>12353824
he's a leaf
they're the uncanny valley of foreigners

Why does Vega keep failing? It hardly seems that complicated a rocked

>>12353861
i kinda doubt that money had a material impact, spacex was trending toward bankruptcy all the while flying those. real gibs only came in the billion dollar nasa contract granted after their first successful flight.

>>12353920
There is no talent in Europe, there is no motivation, there is no free capital. It's over

>>12353922
Was that really gibs if NASA got a good ROI? They've given more money to ULA/Boing! and delivered three fewer crew capsules (read: zero) to the ISS.

>>12353926
But Ariane 5 is pretty reliable, so was 4. Maybe it's just Italy

What does /sfg/ think about Momentus? Chis Hadfield is on the board of directors and they're going to public soon so I may pick up a few shares.

I've only rarely seen them mentioned here but the market for last mile delivery seems to be very large with the constant Starlink launches. I don't however know how to separate the good space tug companies from the bad.

This talk by Lori Garver was fucking awful, and gives insight to what NASA's about to go through the next four years. What a witch
https://youtu.be/KTuQyGH8GWg

basically exactly our fears, that NASA should focus on climate observation sats to the detriment of human AND robotic/interplanetary spaceflight. absolutely horrid. oh and dont worry, she makes sure to sprinkle in hate against those she calls "white males" in the industry. grade A cunt

>>12353937
They're all bad until you have orbital propellant depots and reusable SEP/NEP tugs.

>>12353937
not convinced by the whole space tug concept yet
on the other hand, that one company that proposes ready made satellite components is easier to imagine to work out

>>12353947
Why do they need to be reusable when piggybacking off rideshare with a disposable tug is much cheaper than a dedicated launch? I'm not falling for the d*pot meme.

>>12353951
To me it seems like something pretty obvious to do, especially if starship succeeds. Starship cannot send five 10-tons payloads in different orbits, with tugs that's more realistic

>>12353946
That's a lot off bullshit in less than 15 minutes. It's the smug looks she gives while sentencing human spaceflight to death that gets me

>>12353956
it's worse than that, she hates spaceflight period. robots, humans, she doesnt care. she thinks it's not important to learn about othet planets, lamenting that "we've spent as much money learning about mars climate as earth" (citation fucking needed).

>>12353960
Who cares lol
NASA doesn’t do anything useful

>>12353960
>>12353956
>>12353946

isn't the wailing and lamentations premature?
she's not confirmed to be the next administrator is she?

>>12353952
>Why do they need to be reusable
Same reason rockets need to be reusable.

>>12353946
>AWS
Elon is finished. Jeff has captured Nasa

i hope charles bolden comes back

>>12353973
Charles Bolden is real, you've seen him down in Michoud

>>12353972
she's always had a soft spot for ol benoz

>>12353977
guarantee you she only liked the quote because of the 'boys and their toys' part
ugly cunt has penis envy
all these shriveled hags do

>>12353981
she quoting herself there, btw

>>12353988
kek i missed that part
what a sack of shit

>>12353970
Rockets didn't have to be reusable until SpaceX disrupted the industry and I see no reason why the same type of thing wouldn't go for space tugs. The hardware itself doesn't seem to be that expensive compared to something like a rocket engine and bringing tugs back to the point in space where they can pick up the next satellite may negate a lot of the savings from reusability because of higher fuel costs.

>>12353988
it there a bigger egomaniac redflag than quoting yourself unironically?

>>12354007
Thinking your on the "right" side of history.

>>12353736
Cut it out.
>>12353920
Jewish brown immigrant GIBS
>>12353946
>>12353956
What the fuck.

>>12353601
20 years in operation and kept the Russians from sending their talent to every banana republic there is to make ICBM tech? Yeah, I'd say it was worth it.
But I wish they would have done more than just fuck around in LEO for 20 years.

>>12354050
Bu-but thousands of experiments done!

>>12354072
How many nobel prizes?

>>12353937
I think they're well positioned (they're the first tug operator slated to launch with SpaceX iirc) and their electrodeless microwave plasma rockets are good, solid tech: not much to go wrong, usable thrust and pretty capable (loaded dV ~2km/s with up to 7km/s planned). SpaceX is going to be a huge part of the tug market and they could always design an internal tug on the cheap and shit on the market but of the ones that exist today I like Momentus.

>>12354080
But what will they tug?

>>12354080
Interesting, thanks.

>>12354084
Whatever needs tuggin'. Right now if you put up an auxiliary sat on a Starlink launch for example that's great if you want to be in the altitude and phase that that particular Starlink mission is on but anything else and you're fucked, or at least have to develop your own system.

>>12353621
if it's built by starship it'll probably be even cheaper than that

>>12354116
Starship can lift the tonnage of the ISS in 3 trips.
Imagine what they can do with a cargo starship.
ISS 2.0 would dwarf the current one.

>>12353723

>>12354139
I fucking LOVE hexagonal patterns.

>>12353771
one of the best things about the F9 is that it forces everyone else to actually attempt to min-max their designs. No more using hygrogen 1st stages for no fucking reason.

>>12354135
>Starship
Speaking of... does anyone have an update on closures and upcoming tests? I don't feel like staying up all night for a mere chance at what turns out to be a WDR.

>>12353799
>propane
why would they go back to using a fuel that leaves a bunch of soot? The great thing about methane is that it burns clean which should greatly decrease the amount of refurbishment needed.

>>12353803
apparently mRNA is better? Don't know much about this stuff. Elon seems to think that it has other applications as well.

>>12354151
no new closures so far

bros...

>>12354139
I count 73 tiles. Fully covered, it would have 10,000+ tiles. Hope it doesn't turn into a nightmare.

This reminds me of Evangelion, don't know why, but it looks based, despite the smell inside.

>>12354179
I wonder what their original carbon fiber body would have required in terms of shielding. One of the reasons they went with steel was that it required less

>>12353969
It's either her, or Kendra Horn, who is deep in the pockets of Boeing. Horn wrote a bill that would have handed most of Artemis over to Boeing.

>>12354200
Insane.
Boeing and most politicians need to be purged from the spacesector for at least a decade.

European Vega rocket suffers major launch failure, satellites for Spain and France lost
>https://www.space.com/vega-rocket-launch-anomaly-november-2020

Why are Italian rockets so shit? That is a 50% failure rate in the last two years.

>>12353799

>Year 2022
>SpaceX built their Starships
>Biden wants to only fly corona climate change missions but cries for a Mars mission are too great
>He decides to send a mission destined to fail to prove his point
>Gov rounds up /sfg/ to build this colonial base cause there’s no way in hell they would succeed
>NASA launches starship and its condemned passengers
>Word of touchdown gets there
>Now wait for the body count...
>Video log aired everywhere
>/sfg/ build a full town in about 2 weeks due to collective experience base building in galacticraft
>Biggest delay was everyone arguing how it should look
>Massive termite mound hive city with tubes was agreed upon
>Bio section looks live vault 22, /an/imals and /out/ists fighting the newly evolved Martian forest predators
>/diy/ nuclear breeder reactor was just brought online
>Video shows an anon running a bar dubbed the Frogs and Feels tavern
>One anon butts in on the camera “Has Elon made those gene engineered waifus yet? We need some of those!”
>Proonterfag was building a new section “AAGGHH IM PROOONTING!”
>Elon was furiously taking notes at the press conference
>NASA and Biden had to pick their jaws off the floor
>Boeing: *Wake me up.jpg* *CANT WAKE UP.jpg*

They need to fill up a few Starships with coal so the Martian colony can have coal power

>>12354257
Euro here, italians are all about show, but they lack execution.
You can see this in many Italian brands.

>>12354257
Well, it was a Ukrainian engine upper stage that fucked up.

>>12354292
Why are aussies like this

>>12354305
Mining is the only industry they have

>>12354305
They need to dig down into the ground to escape the surface world where everything alive wants to poison or eat them.

>>12354305
Pollution from the coal wouldn’t matter on Mars and the coal plants can work 24/7 at night and even in dust storms !

>>12354257
what was the cause of failure exactly?
maybe it's another poo code issue

>>12353679
Never lost the lead?
The soviets still got every first after that until the moon.
Then after that they got the first space station too.

>>12354200
there's a non zero percent chance that it will be neither of them

>>12354316
too bad there's no coal to mine on mars

>>12354364
You don’t know that

>>12354364
>Produce methane
>Feed some to methyloccocys bacteria
>Feed that to population/livestock
>Livestock piss feeds plants in biomes
>All dead shit/sewage goes into HTL reactor
>Converted to crude oil
>Make oil into plastics and shit
>leftover nutrient water goes into bioreactor to make methane
>Repeat for infinite oil
You may not get coal, but you'll get oil

>>12354304
Sauce? I think the Zephiro second stage is Italian as well. Besides, why would Ukraine be in an ESA project?

>>12354383
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RD-843

>>12354300
Ducati comes to my mind...

>>12354316
Coal doesn't even compete on earth anymore, let alone shipped to Mars when you could have shipped 100 tons of solar panels instead. I don't know what the lifetime output of a given mass of solar panels is vs. the same in coal but it's safe to say many orders of magnitude higher, when you need overnight power you go to batteries and when you need extended power you switch to using methane which you're already generating in situ

>>12354146
Is that you, tile fucker?

>>12354183
>>12354183
SpaceX:
>deploys lance of private enterprise
NASA:
>raises fed shield
>mans money printers
>"RENDER UNTO CAESAR!"

I think I know which side she's on.

>>12354389
This is the old SS-18 Satan engine.
LMAO Soviet ICBMs were a bluff.
Avionics are made by Avio though.

>>12354400
fuck libs and their "class". They're perfectly cool butchering innocents so long as the president is ""classy"" about it

>>12354395
No, I just like hexagons.

>>12354379
Did somebody say infinite oil?
Wanna buy some freedom?
No, you can't say no.

>>12354400
The left trying to make spaceX succes part of Obama's legacy is so revolting.

>>12354393
>Coal doesn't even compete on earth anymore

Wrong.

> let alone shipped to Mars when you could have shipped 100 tons of solar panels instead.

Solar panels are dogshit.

> when you need overnight power you go to batteries

Batteries are dogshit.


Renewable energy is a scam and will never work lol

>>12354421
Doesn't sound like you're trusting the science anon

>>12354421
>no argument

>>12354415
Throw in some Mars adapted Transatmospheric interceptors, then we'll talk business

>satellites vega lost last night were valued at $400 million

>>12354443
what's up with recent vega launches, anyways? Has something fundamental changed within the ESA?

>>12354400
>thank to you & POTUS44 support when we really needed it in the early days!
Does she mean the wonderful support in stopping NASA's moon and Mars plans in favor of a half-baked asteroid mission idea, climate research, and Muslim outreach?

>>12354421
>Arguing for coal on Mars
Lmao low IQ, Mars will be a nuclear colony

>>12354429
Science is a corrupted institution and doesn’t have my trust.

>>12354453
They uprated it for payload capability and put on a bigger fairing.

>>12354460

>>12354439
It’s mostly a meme, but non-intermittent energy sources are always preferable to solar, which, even on Earth, operates at peak output less than 30% of the year.

>>12354463
>spacex is forcing companies to push past what they're actually capable of
devious

>>12353803
Just don't get one, I haven't been pricked by a needle in almost 20 years.
>hurr durr muh superspreaders
lel I hope so, fuck all y'all.

>>12354478
>ship chemical energy at great expense
>window is only open every 2 years so you better ship considerably more than you even think you'll need
>render off-world colony dependent a constant stream of urfjew power
>need far more shipments than solar
>this is better because it's "non-intermittent" compared to the thing you launch once that makes power for you for decades
Fucking retard.

>>12353717
*ends your ignorant country's nothing*

>>12353937
>they're going to public soon
dropped

>>12353799
Propane is highly likely to be sooty under extremely fuel-rich burn conditions, which means no FFSC cycle allowed, which means you're either using gas generators or oxygen rich staged combustion, with the former being lower efficiency and the latter being a very hard engineering problem (because you'd have the fuel pump separated from the oxygen rich preburner by a rotating seal). FFSC allows for the maximum performance of a chemical rocket engine across the board, which means even though on paper propalox beats methalox in a 1:1 comparison, methalox is actually superior in real life because it can use the higher-max-pressure, lower-turbopump-temperature, highest-combustion-efficiency engine cycle.
Of course, that's IF propalox does actually get sooty under fuel rich conditions. If it doesn't, and FFSC with propalox is possible, then yeah propalox would be the best hydrocarbon-oxygen bipropellant option.

Looks like starship development slowed down significantly.
Any news on next road closure

>>12354582
>Propane is highly likely to be sooty
You take that back. Sweet lady propane is clean burning, I tell you hwat.

>>12354583
Nothing shows here, so probably not. I'd guess they aren't going to do any static fires till next week at least.

>>12353851
>welding without gloves
based, but what's with this weird manufactured 'out in a field with a box of scraps' hype? They're blatantly doing a "look ma, me too!" thing, trying to emulate the excitement for Starship development.

>>12353803
>Now I guess you will have to be vaccinated and brain chipped to get off planet.
Before you even get a chance to fail to make the cut to go into space, you'll have to pay them just to walk in so you can get injected, inspected, detected, infected, neglected and selected. Expect your grandparents medical history to keep you from heading out.

Will KSP2 be as kino as the original with mods?

>>12354637
Probably never, but few things can match modding autism

>>12354637
I hope so, my potato PC barely handles KSP1 with settings low so I've been planning to get the console version, but worry about the lack of mods available there.

>>12354648
I know next to nothing about KSP2 aside from keeping up with the delays. Can someone fill me in on its intended specs? I know KSP is a lot more complicated than it needs to be internally, causing it to crash and heat my computer up like an oven even on simple flights. I would THINK that if they were designing a whole new game from scratch that they are planning on optimizing it and making it more computer friendly. Hopefully mod friendly too. I’m so sick of my computer fans spinning at 0.3c just trying to get a rover to Duna

>>12354637
KSP 2 is never happening

>>12354660

That's why we have SimpleRockets 2

Its here

https://youtu.be/Ta0bnutAVLc

>>12354686
I've never played Simple Rockets, how does it compare to KSP?

>>12354582
>Of course, that's IF propalox does actually get sooty under fuel rich conditions. If it doesn't, and FFSC with propalox is possible, then yeah propalox would be the best hydrocarbon-oxygen bipropellant option.
If we set aside fouling concerns and assume FFSC is reasonable with both, propane gets better density and probably moderately outperforms as a booster, methane better ISP and probably moderately outperforms as a second stage. But even then, is it THE best option? It really depends what your goals are. Higher energy transfers, ISRU goals, vertical supply chain integration (there are rumors that SpaceX is looking at fracking, make of that what you will), these things all bias towards methalox away from propalox.

So the Vega failure was due to human error
>Analysis of the telemetry from the mission, along with data from the production of the vehicle, led them to conclude that cables to two thrust vector control actuators were inverted.
https://spacenews.com/human-error-blamed-for-vega-launch-failure/

>>12354748
Live by the JOBS, die by the JOBS

>>12354748
>protonmcrash.jpg

https://www.washingtonpost.com/technology/2020/11/17/nasa-boeing-lunar-lander-probe/
Can any paypig post the full article? It's about how Boeing's VP of space got Loverro into trouble

>>12354748
This however strikes me as debatable:
>This was clearly a production and quality issue, a series of human errors, and not a design one,
It's not like this is the first time a rocket was fucked by someone messing up an installation. Shouldn't part of design be to tardproof the systems such that you can't functionally crosswire or invert anything, or at least shouldn't there be diagnostic systems on board that check for that kind of thing?

>>12354771
>google
>cached
>paypigging averted

>>12354457
It was a joke, and you completely missed it. How do you feel?

>>12354771
https://archive.is/dUrIj

>>12353803
good
anti vaxers like other conspirecy nuts are an actual security threat and cannot be allowed even near a spaceship
same as flat earthers

>>12354774
It's an evolutionary race, anon. Every "idiot-proof" design drives the creation of greater idiots.

Holy shit hahah look at the crew for Resilience's next scheduled flight

>>12354748
mama-mia

>>12354874
>israeli jews
>just wanna oppress palestinians, sell software and armaments, and jew in space
>american jews
>oi vey colonialist, you have to die down here with us
I kinda like israelites ngl

>>12354257
>15 successful launches and only 2 failures, both in recent history and an indication of some underlying issue in quality control assurance and readiness procedures
>hurr durr why so shit

>>12354874
Why do they have to do it through Axiom, why not just through SpaceX?

>>12354892
>15 successful launches
Am I supposed to be impressed?

>>12354892
are you actually trying to imply that a double digit failure rate for a commercially operational system is something to brag about?

>>12354898
Oldspace considers 4 launches a year to be a dangerous amount of overtime for their workers

>>12354774
Question: Why can't they add some escape chutes for the payload?
In a high altitude emergency separation, just decouple from the rocket, deploy some small control surfaces to keep the orientation, let the payload aerobrake on a controlled free fall, and open some high-speed chutes at a pre-programmed altitude near the ground.

I mean it is better than losing valuable cargo. Taranis had been in development for years, and scientists were excited about the data it might yield. The Ingenio was Spain's second observation sat, which at a cost of 200M won't be replaced anytime soon.

>>12354748
How the fuck did that not get picked up during checks?

>>12354922
Unless you're gonna heat-shield the payload, it's gonna burn up that way.

>>12354922
too nyoom nyoom fast

>>12354874
If israel starts supporting humans in space, nasa will follow

>>12354922
1. chutes are not simple, look at the CCrew testing. Elon considered parachutes the hardest part, Boing had multiple partial failures as well.
2. you also need to ensure overall payload survivability through re-entry and splashdown which is not trivial, costs a bunch of the mass budget in secondary systems, and could complicate satellite deployment
3. on average a rocket failure is probably just as likely to render that stuff vaporized or inoperable anyway

>>12354898
No. I did not say anything about being impressed, but the issue is likely within pre-flight configuration and not design flaws. Actually, I just catched up with the news and the control actuatiors being inverted. Definitely not a sufficient readiness evaluation procedure.
>>12354901
No. It's a serious event and some are already speculating baguettes or krauts will buy it for cheap when it gets inevitably worse. A shame since it was already crippled when it got into service with Ariane.

>>12354656
>fans spinning at 0.3c just trying to get a rover to Duna
It keeps my rig at 100% even inside non 3D screens such as the R&D building.
Even the start menu is eating CPU as if there was no tomorrow.
Let's hope KSP2 is a bit more forgiving.

>>12354956
it lags on 2d screens because it's just a card in front of the 3d view, it still renders the whole thing

>>12354929
It was already flying at that speed to begin with. It can only speed down after propulsion is gone.

>>12354947
This might be a dumb question but assiming every parachute failed on a Dragon return, do you think there is programming to let it fire the superdraco's for a propulsive soft splashdown? I feel like they could have added the programming but I just don't know

>>12353601
if it wasn't built the cash would be rolling around in tax returns, it was worth it

>>12354967
>It was already flying at that speed to begin with.
....in space, you're talking about when it drops back into the atmosphere at near-orbital speed, aren't you? That's too fast and it will heat up anon.

>>12354971
I think such a system would have to be cleared with NASA first and then NASA would probably deny it or require human-rating propulsive landing of the capsule. Yes, despite the fact that it would be certain death otherwise, because bureaucracy doesn't care about that.
That said, the parachutes are really good now. Let's say the chance for a false trip of such a system cannot be ensured to be much lower than the chance of a full parachute failure, then the system actually is more dangerous than nothing at all.

Looks like the lack of a flame diverter really fucked SN8 over.
>About 2 secs after starting engines, martyte covering concrete below shattered, sending blades of hardened rock into engine bay. One rock blade severed avionics cable, causing bad shutdown of Raptor.
https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1328742122107904000

>>12354418
well if they do that it means that they can't cancle them because that would be canceling Obama's legacy

>>12355004
Should've gone with the classic fool proof Titan I deflector design, at least for static tests.

>>12355004
Time to speedrun a flame trench then.
That will cost Spacex a month or two of development.

>>12355004
Oh no no no expendable launchpad bros, we got cocky

>>12354947
>>12354930
>>12354929
The Vega has 3 fucking solid stages. There is no question a escape system should be devised. This time the failure must have happened while in space, since AVUM takes over at 200 Km. Nothing that heat shielding can't solve. It is not a huge payload.

>>12355004
Well, well, well..... the hubris got to him lmao
Bring in the boring company to build a big ol' trench in the swampy clay

RIP US space program


https://spectator.org/biden-space-program

>>12354774
Shit like this is why molex type connectors were invented to only go in one way.

>>12355026
Forgot pic

>>12354922
The cost in weight and money of that kind of safety system on every launch easily overcomes the cost of losing few satellites on failed launches. It's not economical basically. Even the launch abort system on human space flight is uneconomical but it's added for the sake of media.

>>12355017
Time to build a real stand, Musky Husky. That fucking jack might have worked for one single engine, barely at that.

>>12355004
>lack of a flame diverter
How is Starship supposed to take off from Moon or Mars?

>>12355017
>Added water-cooled steel pipes
How will this help with the concrete blowing apart?

>>12355048
It will take off right where it lands. On the way down initially, it will presumably blow any rocks way the fuck away

Our aerospace problems have become geology problems

>>12355004
Should have upgraded the launchpad.
Works in KSP.

>>12355017
I love Elon's junkyard but this response is hilarious.
>sir, the engines are showering the engine bay with high velocity shrapnel
>well, which part broke first?
>the avionics cable sir, b-but the whole situation is--
>armor the avionics cable, case closed

>>12354874
If Tom Cruise is really the first celebrity in space I'm gonna be so mad.

>>12355004
>Avionics cables moving to steel pipe shields & adding water-cooled steel pipes to test pad
https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1328743239327866881

>>12355063
>armor the avionics cable
Makes sense. Neither Mars or the moon will come with landing pads

>>12355074
You know what, you make a good point. I'm back on team expendable launchpads.

>>12355017

>>12354894
Probably because SpaceX are too busy hammering out the specifics like insurance and so on and have Axiom do that shit for them? They just lease out a capsule and a rocket for them as well as capcom and leave all the lawyer shit for the lawyers.

>>12355084
thank you mr. steel, very cool

>>12355068
Alan Shephard was the first celebrity in space :)

>>12355085
*too busy to hammer out specifics like that.

>>12355073
OH NO NO NO HE STILL HASNT LEARNED

>>12355094
First celebrity who was a celebrity before he was an astronaut, buddy.

>>12355029
>boomer news

>>12355048
At least for the moon it would use the forward thrusters at the top of the ship, so no chance of debris kick up.

>>12355017
Destroyed by a fucking concrete slab which wasn't even moving

>>12355074
This design is unsuitable for that in it's current form.
Reminder that Apollo got away with TO because the descent engine stayed on the ground and a separate ascent engine took off the descent module. These were hypergolic because of the high risk a liquid engine didn't start.

I mean, it's easy to laugh at something that obvious but really, it was just a bunch of Raptors.

Really makes me wonder how the hell are they going to handle Superheavy with it's 27 monsters.

uh oh starship update bros, we got too cocky...

>>12355112
>This design is unsuitable for that in it's current form.
How so?

To be fair, he did say this.

>Elon Musk
@elonmusk
·
34m
Maybe making some notable changes. Will wait until figurative & literal dust settles.

>>12355116
With an ocean launch platform there's no rocks to blast.

>>12355118
Starship is cancelled. Smaugship is now starting from scratch

>>12355124
Fishes might jump out of the water.

>>12355027
I doubt they'd get permit for this, when I look at the footage I can't square it with all the ''wild life protection'' shit they had to agree to when they got the land.

>>12355128
he smokes pot

>>12355017
Yup... Boeing wins this time

>>12355131
Where we are going there are no fishes. Well, there won't be any after.

>>12355124
They will have to test it somehow, eventually. In Boca.

>>12355128
HE SMOKES POT!

>>12355128
HE POKES SNOT!

>>12355124
based

>>12355144
environmentalists today are seething that boats disrupt whale calls. IMAGINE their seething when elon starts brapping superheavy into the sea

>>12355128
MUSK IS A HACK FRAUD SHUT IT DOWN

>>12355128
EH KOMESS TOP

>>12355017

>>12355160
Really should not be an issue, the props from boats and sea vehicles produce constant hum that just bounces against each other, endless church reverb. Far bigger issue than a wet fart once in a while.

>>12355160
Not that environmentalists will care but superheavy will do the sane thing and launch from a platform, not half-submerged like seadragon. The transfer of soundwaves from air to water is extremely poor, nothing more than a few feet down will probably even notice.

>>12355128
NOOOOOOOOOO HE SMOKES POT!!!

>>12355063
It's entirely possible the cable severed because it was the only thing not protected adequately against the type of impact the rock shards created, it's a perfectly reasonable first move to armor the bits that are exposed if you are trying to create an engine that can survive more extreme conditions.

>>12355128
"HE SMOKES POT!"

>>12355004
>>12355017
>>12355063
Don't they do some risk assessments while designing cable routing

>>12355188
NOOOOO ELON NEEDS TO OVER ENGINEER THE PAD, DONT YOU GET IT?? IT'S NOT THAT EASY IN ROCKETRY

>>12355192
They've done zero risk assessment for the current stage they're at. They've just crammed everything neatly into the skirt and called it a day.

>>12355192
Unironically I'm pretty sure the risk assessment strategy right now is to eyeball it, put it together, and fire it up. With the going rats for steel and raptors, it may very well be cheaper (and faster) to do that than pay eggheads to work their autism over the problem.

>>12355192
Probably but they are moving so quickly that it seems their favoured approach is ''let's just get this going by small margins and we'll find out how and what fails'' instead of thorough pre-planning.

>>12355128
HE SMOKES POT! AAAAAAAH MY CAPSULE! NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

>>12355204
rates*

>>12355128
OH OH HE'S GONNA SMOOOOOOOOOOOKE (POT)

>>12355211
For a second I thought you said he was going to contract some Skaven to build the rocket.

>>12355218
If not for ITAR, he would

>>12355197
He probably needs to do that too to be fair, it's best to try to create a pad that will cause no troubles and would be feasible to build on mars but it's still best to assume things don't work out to your plans. Something like concrete shattering is quite probable event considering on mars you won't have the same production standards and environment as on earth and you probably want to use the minimum amount too.

Elon is gonna get someone killed. How terribly reckless, he doesnt care about employees, just a rank capitalist. i should throw hardened concrete at his stupid head

>>12355098
Don't see why that matters but ok. American celebrity culture is so weird

>>12355231
Ok honey, now get your laptop class is starting soon. I told you if you don't pass algebra this year, we'll take away your video game privileges!

>>12355231
26 | she/her | eat the rich | gulag me daddy | marxist

>>12355223
>SpaceX has terminated your employment

>>12355231
I miss when commies were pro-space

>>12355246
why does thou quote me

Remember when SpaceX fired the guy leading Starlink because he wanted to launch more test sats first before full production? Elon is savage

This must be the most autistic general on here. Every obvious bait post gets at least a few (yous) and oftentimes a lot more

>>12355254
Probably was a right call, it's not like those sats are Hubbles. You can get them out of the orbit within a few weeks.

>>12355084
I hate boomers constantly Fellating troops. As if there’s really hails of bullets coming to shoot your kids and the soldiers are stopping them.

>>12355128
Did anyone actually say this or are we creating boogeymen again?

>>12355258
dont reply to this obvious bait

>>12355094
that would be Yuri Gagarin, unless you think he wasnt a celebrity too

>>12355271
See >>12355164
It was something actually said by boeing

>>12355280
Ha! That’s fucking great. Between that and the space is hard rhetoric I’m in awe at the finger pointing. Grown ass men too.

>>12355276
Couldn't care less who is or isn't a celebrity or how famous space tourists are. Was just making a point to the original poster

>>12355297
seems like you got out-smartassed

>>12355276
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PAo923d38zE
It's a shame that the age of heroes is over. We really need a new larger than life hero like Yuri. Obviously his fame wasn't really his doing but the propaganda machine associated but that's what the world needs to be inspired.

>>12355297
And he made a point to you

>>12355271
full quote from the washington post
>One industry official said executives inside Boeing “can’t accept” SpaceX is flying people first. “People are annoyed by Elon — how does this guy who smokes pot beat us?” said the official, who spoke on the condition of anonymity because that person was not authorized to speak publicly. “We have a lot of humble pie to eat here.”

>>12354885
>just wanna oppress palestinians
how is that a bad thing?

>>12355199
>>12355204
>>12355205
Yea, looks like it.
Hope it won't bounce back in their head

>>12355004
>>12355017
who else called it? >>12336019

>>12354971
since they wouldn't have any fuel left when returning that wouldn't help much

>>12355303
If someone comes along and provides more evidence that backs you up it's not really getting out-smartassed. Glad we agree either way

>>12355017
engine doomer bros... we got too cocky...

>>12355118
wonder what they're changing around

>>12355337
you didnt call shit. it wasnt lack of flame trench that caused the issue, it was a lack of steel pipe shields around avionics. dumbass :)

>>12355192
sounds like they were hoping that the special covering over the concrete would help. Guess it didn't

>>12355347
it's a hard life being a raptor doomer. i guess as long as sn8 hop gets delayed to Q2 2021, i dont really care how it manages to achieve it

>>12355314
Reminder that development for CCrew started in 2011. Capsules were given a few years to be designed. SpaceX has now launched a proof of concept, a test mission, and a crew to the international space station. Starliner has yet to even dock once with the ISS

>>12355128
HE SMOKES POT

>>12355017
this sort of wacky development will work until SpaceX kills 3 people, or cause a hydrazine vent, or falls into something, or makes a 10 billion dollar satellite explode on the launchpad

>>12355128
HE SMOKES POT

why don't they just put some steel OVER the concrete

>>12355381
guess you're new here, welcome to spacex flight general! now get out

>>12355381
HLS moonship will be certified by NASA. Also who gives a shit if people die. Airplanes have killed people; lots of them in fact. If we want to make space travel commonplace we need to accept fatalities the same way we do for cars or boats or trains or airplanes. Cope oldspace fag

>>12355381
come up with something more original
>>12355231

>>12355381
SpaceX doesn't use hydrazine in anything bigger than the SuperDracos on the Dragon capsule.

sounds like the 4th stage didn't even start?

>>12355251
I miss when commies didn't have trust funds.

>>12355381
this is SpaceX, not ULA

>>12355413
They plugged the wires in backwards

>>12355413
How does a hypergolic engine fail to to start?

>>12355426
A million things can go wrong on the way up. A cable can have rattled itself loose from vibrations for instance.

>>12355413
I wonder how many failures from ESA are due to the fact that like a dozen Euro companies spread across the continent are building the thing. Surely even with checklists and inspections, there are things bound to go wrong when the work is scrambled by language translations and shipment delays.
>>12355426
kek

For anyone who missed it in the last thread: Supposedly the team launching the satellite on Vega last night worked 12 years on the thing and have been waiting for it to get to space lmao

>>12355407
>who gives a shit if people die
people and governments do, which is why NASA is now deserted. Unless you think there's unironic short-term profit in space outside of government contracts lmao

>>12355417
ULA might as well be the Mongolian space program, they arent going to take off any time soon

>>12355426
"Ivan I am going to sleep. Do remember to plug pipes on, yes?"

>>12355444
>sPAIN

>>12355444
That's just plain sad

>>12355068
Why? What's wrong with that?

>>12355450
$cientology victory.

>>12355413
>4th stage
Wtf you don't need more than 2 stages.

>>12355454
The first three stages are solids. That many stages are necessary

>>12355426
I'm kinda new to all this, but "integration" makes it sound like the 4th stage wasn't connected correctly. For something as important as engine ignition they should have backup processes at the ready.

>>12355444
yup

>>12355454
Vega is mostly SRB

>>12355436
>I wonder how many failures from ESA are due to the fact that like a dozen Euro companies spread across the continent are building the thing. Surely even with checklists and inspections, there are things bound to go wrong when the work is scrambled by language translations and shipment delays.
About the same as NASA and its suppliers.
And the language barrier isn't a problem really, for example there are more bilingual people here in europe then monolingual.
Everybody who is anybody in any technical job can speak english next to his own language.
Sure my english may look bad to bongs&burgers, but i literally never bothered seriously learning the language, it just that easy to understand.

>>12355068
i know, it shoulda been mrbeast

>>12355453
Ehhh I have a theory that his Scientology shit was just a phase and he's done with it now. But that spooky organization gathers dirt on you and forces you to stay so he's sorta just in too deep. I like Cruz. I don't like his movies but I admire his effort and love of schlocky film with stunts. The latest mission impossible was boring but looked beautiful

>>12355460
why dont you just use an ablative srb at that point, consuming the walls as fuel?

>>12355462
Assuming Ariane 5 fucking obliterated after takeoff with JWST inside, would this general freak out and get pissed or just laugh. Or both

>>12355128
>”Execute Order SLS...”

>>12355453
Where's your outrage on Islam's very recent victory?

>>12355472
That is a relatively new technology, and isn't used for ICBMs of which the Vega is mostly derived from

>>12355327
anon, that was the point

>>12355474
pls don't jynx it

>>12355474
Pissed because then failure can easily be put on the frogs while a new JWST is built. It needs to fail in space in order to show how flawed NASA's development of the telescope was.

Please tell me that with all the shit the biden administration is cancelling they at least cancel SLS too?

>>12355474
I'd be disappointed, but my keks would pierce the heavens

>>12355491
this is the correct take

>>12355474
It would be another nail in the coffin for the europoors which will be funny but it would also be a setback in space exploration which would be sad.

>>12355462
>We worked 12 years on the project
>Oh noes it's lost
>posts smiling turd emote

>>12355493
They can try!

>>12355493
They can't because SLS is written into law by Congress

>>12355502
explains a lot, don't it

>>12355474
God I hope so, I hate that fucking boondoggle piece of shit so much.

>>12355474
Hopefully it happens and it wakes up some people at ESA that shit cant go on like this.

>>12355505
The fuck, in what world is that even legal?
How fucking powerfull is boeing really?

>>12355504
how is he drinking
how does that fridge work on a vacuum

>>12355518
>The fuck, in what world is that even legal?
the jobs world

>>12355517
lockmart is trying their best :(

is the reason jwst is taking so long because not even the US govt needs a telescope that big, so lockmart been dragging their feet to help out the scientists?

>>12355525
Forget the Mtn Dew, shouldn't you be more worried that the Moon is on a direct collision course towards the Earth since it's way closer than it is normally?

>>12355491
Oh nice this was the best reply. Funniest thing would be failure of the complex sunshield deployment. I hope it pulls a skylab and everything works perfectly except the shield. Bonus points if they deem it a failure because of it's "non-serviceable position" and Musk offers a FH flight with a little arm to go pull it into place

Hasn't someone photoshopped cuck hair on JWST before? I feel like the posters here are missing a great opportunity.

JWST?
More like JUST lmao

>>12355265
There's a reason that image became a meme

>>12355068
As long as they film it for later use in a mission impossible movie then it's all okay

>>12355572
Oh yeah, I read that they're apparently having it for a movie. If that's what they're doing it for I'm not nearly as mad.

You anti SpaceX niggers trying to bait as many of the new fags or lurkers sure have dedication.

>>12355068
He's taking the fight to Xenu to protect humanity

>>12355577
it's called a cover story lol

>>12355563

you can't even burn coal on Mars, idiots, there's no free oxygen

>>12355586
what if i just breath real hard onto the coals

>>12354719
DENSITY IMPULSE
E
N
S
I
T
Y

>>12355585
is there a pic of the rip?

>>12355591
Nigga you breathe out oxygen? You a plant?

>>12355599
The only rip there is it's launch window, which is never going to materialize.

>>12355599
Wut. There was a rip on the sunshield?

>>12355017
>REGENERATIVELY COOLED LAUNCH MOUNTS

>>12355474
>Assuming Ariane 5 fucking obliterated after takeoff with JWST inside, would this general freak out and get pissed or just laugh. Or both

NIGGA have you been reading what we wish to happen to Tha that fucking thing? LOL

>>12354257
Should have opted for Falcon 9

>>12355391
he literally said that's what he's doing, he's going to do a regen cooled steel blast shield

Y’all ever use the Outer Planets mod for KSP?

>>12355665
always. Neidon is beautiful

>>12355636
Different anon but I also misinterpreted what he said. I took it as “we are going to add steel around our cables AND make them water cooled” I was so confused
But I’m still perplexed as to how water cooled steal pipes in or above the ground will help. Will starship be firing directly over the pipes? They won’t have that shit on Mars....

>>12355665
>>12355677
I should get back into KSP. Whats the latest version and what'd they add?

Realistic timeframe to landing on mars?

>>12355688
>Water cooled steel pipes to test pad
they are going to lay a bunch of small pipes over the concrete so that there's no gaps in between them
then, they will pump water through the pipes before, during, and after any launch or static fire
this will keep the steel from melting and completely protect the concrete from Raptor

>>12355690
latest is 1.10.1, next update more RCS ports

>>12355690
>>12355706
video games aren't spaceflight, please go away
actually, /vg/ is much slower after the new boards got added, I bet ksp would survive there now, I'll go post if you make one

>>12355694
2035 is my guess.

>>12355710
/kspg/ died a long time ago and this is the only place where it belongs

>>12355717
they unbanned it lol

>>12355192
Starship development is one big continuous risk assessment

>>12355375
Starliner will never launch astronauts

>>12355694
I think by 2035 we will at the very least have cargo on Mars: multiple demonstrations of the ability to land and deliver shit to the surface and deploy hab concepts and solar panel farms, and we will probably have just seen a proof-of-concept manned starship land with a dummy astronaut and come back to Earth with a safe landing. I can't say when the first human will actually go there though

>>12355719
Based

>>12355694
unmanned cargo ship as a proof of concept in 2024 by spaceX. carrying heavy but cheap cargo essentially as a mass simulator (construction materials? steel? solar panels?) After that I really have no idea, there's not really much reason to go to mars if you don't have payload, and the payload is going to take like a decade to make. I imagine people won't fly (to mars) on starship until at least 2030, maybe it gets used for ISS taxi or JWST repair by 2026? It's really up to other people to make stuff to send so Nasa and whoever else has an interest needs to start making:
>habs
>power sources
>communication equipment
>mining equipment
>processing and manufacting tools
we're talking 20 years worth of equipment development. maybe they send a "scouting" mission with people prior but it would basically moon landing tier. Could also see elon seeding a beefed up starlink to mars early so who controls both transportation and communication but it would need to be in a higher orbit so people can actually use it before it deorbits

can someone give me a qrd on why JWST is shit?

>>12355739
just ships some fucking MREs and caterpillar loaders dude

>>12355718
It was unbanned, but it kept dying

>>12355749
yes due to gacha games
they all left and now /vg/ is slow again

>>12355743
Development began in 1996.

>>12355754
gacha general are all over the place in /vg/. The new mobile board explicity forbids any generals so they all stayed in /vg/

>>12355759
I dunno dude, /vg/ is slow now

>>12355743
>>12355757
Oh and it was projected to cost 500 million and be launched by 2007. The cost is now over 10 billion and the launch is at least 2021...

>>12355761
that's because they increased the board's thread limit. So it takes a while for threads to reach page 10 after bump limit

>>12355767
oh okay
anyway /vg/ is slow now, fuck off please

>>12355763
Sapace is hard ;^D

>>12355763
>>12355773
Reminder that NASA and oldspace unironically believe this

>>12355128
HE SMOKES POT

>>12355759
>The new mobile board explicity forbids any generals

>>12355747
delivering heavy machinery would be awesome in a dummy payload, but unfortunatly you need to redesign all that stuff to work in martian atmosphere, gravity, and dust which turns a cheap payload into a very expensive and time consuming one. Better to just drop off 100k kg of stainless or other refined materials instead

...or a cybertruck with autopilot to go drive donuts around curiosity

>>12355793
>you need to redesign all that stuff to work in martian atmosphere
work's already done on that, NASA got the estimates from CAT a while back

>>12355453
I thought this was a /sci/entology board.

>>12354748
>>12354927
>crazy_ivan.mp4

>>12355502
Still got paid. What can you do?

>>12355815
Well, that picture is about getting what you pay for and considering how much you pay for an ESA rocket, it's hardly applicable.

>>12354748
ULA Sabotage Squad strikes again.

>>12355759
coomer animufags are worse than onions disney capeshitters at this point
how the fuck do you even get this mentally ill?

>>12355118
Wooden Starship confirmed and proven, its over.

Today, I will remind them

>italian
>reliable