/sci/ - Science & Math

>>12332095
Maybe the immune response triggered by the vaccine is so powerful that it causes the effect in the user?

Just get sick and then get better.
If you can't then fuck you.

>>12332095
A lot of retarded drunk boomers handle that pretty much every day. So they'll be first in line.

Great normies won't notice a difference in their lives.

>>12332095
I will take the bill gates microchip if it means I can go to real class

>>12332095
Seems like a standard immune response that you want, or at least expect, to occur. You're trying to get the body to react and develop antibodies, people will perceive their body's immune response as the usual fever/malaise etc. symptoms that they associate with the immune response that triggers when they get a common cold.

>>12332095
>big company is getting harassed and forced into gibs over having some great marketing people
Fuck this gay shit
>mild hangover
That means it's working, wow seems like it's a huge fucking nothingburger

>>12332863
wtf i love big pharma now

>>12332095
I'd rather get immunized by natural means than being a guinea pig for some Turkish guy's science project that skipped all the normal safety protocols. Come back to me when this shit is proven safe.

>>12332905
>>12332095 (OP)
>I'd rather get immunized by natural means
Rather than under the direct supervision of trained professionals, seems much safer!
>guinea pig for some Turkish guy's science project
Nothing relates to this at all, Pfizer is a big and reputable pharma company who produce a plethora of products that are used daily by a lot of people in the western world
>skipped all the normal safety protocols
No proof or evidence for that
Why bother saying things that are clearly complete horseshit?
You are very well aware of your hyperbole, what makes you think this is a reasonable approach?
>Come back to me when this shit is proven safe
And how is that supposed to happen without testing?
What a selfish, ignorant and childish approach, "things should just work as I am unwilling to participate or invest anything myself in the progress"

Why are you on this board out of all with that entitled attitude?

>>12332853
That's with traditional vaccines

>>12332935

First ever targeted mrna vaccines have a study <1yr

>>12333041
Vaccine, and drug development in general is quite different these days due to computational modeling. covid vaccine has been getting BIG money behind it; enabling researchers to run large QM/MM simulations to optimize the drug past what you could do previously, or have the resources to do for lower profile stuff.

>>12332095
>vaccine reported side effect comparable to a 'hangover'
So it's worse than covid itself?

>>12332113
I don't see how that s supposed to be comforting

>>12333041
>That's with traditional vaccines
And with this vaccine too, it elicites an immune response and the development of antibodies, there is anything novel about that part of its mode of action. The novel part is how it gets into your body and makes the things the immune response it going to react against.

>>12334592
Every vaccine does it. It's your immune system that you're sensing.

>>12334627
>Every vaccine does it.

Wrong.

>>12332661
This

I often get an effect like that for about ~12 hours after I receive a flu vaccine.

Isn't this pretty normal? It's just a mild immune response, since it's expecting and preparing for a full-on pathogen infection. Then the infection never comes because it's a dead/neutered virus or just a part of it, so it lowers the defenses.

>>12332095
COVID vaccine reported side effect comparable to a 'hangover' similar to a night of drunken butt sex with Duffman

>>12332935
Pfizer is not reputable.

>>12334779
>I receive a flu vaccine.
Why would you do that?

>>12335075
Neither are you, nor is you opinion about which company is reputable, relevant, even more so as you fail to provide any reasoning supporting your claims.

>>12332935
Its crazy what a bunch of scicuxks are on this board. Literally defending a giant pharma company. Guess what retard you know it isnt proven safe because weve had covid for like a fucking year so even if this vaccine came with the first covid patient wed still only have a yyear of results at the very very most.

>>12335606
>Neither are you
So you admit they aren't.

>>12332095
Their CEO sold his stock the day after that news article was released. I wonder why?

>>12332723
Normie wants to mingle with tards

>>12334631
It's been rebunked. All vaccines trigger an immune response, that's how they work. An immune response may be perceived by the subject as a fever or malaise typical with other immune repsonses that occur when infected with pathogens, like the common cold.

>>12332095
wait for the bill gates version, it'll be way more dangerous but the media will never tell you so it win't be true
https://www.brighteon.com/8c770254-e4d5-4d0c-a7af-44278da17fa0

>>12335609
Pfizer are modern gods that master the biosphere and bend it to their will while you shitpost in your underwear. Bow down, sing hymns and immolate an ox's thighbone in obeisance to them.

>>12332661
Fucking this lmao, why are people so dumb

>>12332661
>>12337096
>risk heavy unforeseeable complications and side effects for months plus long recovery time
vs
>controlled stimulus of the immune system, pathogen degrades quickly, administered by experts
Gee, I wonder who's the real retard here?

>>12337154
>risk heavy unforeseeable complications and side effects for months plus long recovery time
Only for the weak. The rest of us will be fine.

>>12336521
His SEC filing says "This sale was effected pursuant to a Rule 10b5-1 trading plan adopted by the reporting person on August 19, 2020." So he must have had a good idea that the stock would be doing well now way back in August. Or he thought he'd be needing cash.

>>12337189
>Only for the weak
Well, the last months have shown this assumption to be wrong. Anyone can get it.
So again, why take an unnecessary risk?

>>12337255
Basically a 360 noscope. Nice.

>>12337255
Translation:
He pushed that "were saved, hooray, best vaccine" propaganda just in time for his planned sale. Gotcha.

>>12332095
yay an excuse to get fucking wasted

>>12336521
>>12337382
Correct.

>>12337308
>Anyone can get it.
Get it? Yeah, anybody can get it and shrug it off. Only the elderly are LIKELY to be harmed by it.

>>12335606
look up the shit Pfizer did in Africa in the 90's and 00's.

they've paid out more in medical damages than any pharmaceutical company.

>>12332661
Lmfao for real though

>>12337535
>Get it? Yeah, anybody can get it and shrug it off
No, anybody can get serious long-term effects, even mild and asymptomatic cases.
E.g. losing the ability to procreate:
https://www.thelancet.com/journals/eclinm/article/PIIS2589-5370(20)30348-5/fulltext

>>12337806
anybody "can" get serious long term effects,
anybody "might" get serious long term effects,
but the vast majority of people who catch covid
will simply shrug it off.
CULL THE WEAK

>>12337541
>look up the shit Pfizer did in Africa in the 90's and 00's
i am sure it was very based
someone has to figure out the sciences, only understandable that they would pick the place where test subjects are the easiest to acess
>they've paid out more in medical damages than any pharmaceutical company
maybe thats the case, but any company has to pay for "damages" eventually
not surprising, since pfizer is such a big company
only makes sense that they also pay a substantial amount of fines, when some risk calculations went a bit wrong

>>12337930
what if you get culled?
you might be the person with permanently impaired breathing, fatigue symptoms and neurological issues as they are not exclusive to serious cases
what an ignorant approach of you to close your eyes in face of danger and pretend that the truck wont hit you anyways

>>12332113
this happens with regular flu shots, too -- i usually feel a little crappy the day after i get my flu shot (but nowhere near as bad as if i had actually gotten the flu)

>>12332095
Hah? only 90%? try 92% american dog!

>>12337806
>No, anybody can get serious long-term effects,
Only the elderly are LIKELY to experience any serious consequences.

Do you know what that word means?

>>12337154
The vaccine may do the exact same thing since most of the actual damage from covid is autoimmune and you need to trigger a strong immune response to make a vaccine work. The med companies are racing for the billions of helicopter dollars. It doesn't matter that in 4 months we find out the vaccine is fucked. It matters that they go to market first with enough doses of something that plausibly works.

is this the vaccine that permanently alters your cells to reproduce the part of corona which just happens to be identical to the part of rabies which causes the behavioral changes?

>>12332095
red wine and cheap tequila are the only real cure for covid

>>12332095
>>12332661
the actual takeaway is that wiggers should stop being homofags and eat exotic animals

COVID came from Southeast Asia, where bat diversity is the highest. That's why they have literally 0 deaths.

After that it spread to China, and after that the west.

The further away you are from the epicenter of formation, the more you suffered. So people should unironically play around with and eat more bats, racoons, etc. Wiggers of course will never do this, and they'll keep getting plague'd just like when they got BLACKED in Bubonic times.

>>12337930
Fucking idiot. I just showed you that it's not just "the weak". So again, why take the chances?

>>12338024
Can you read?
>even in young and healthy individuals
>even in asymptomatic cases
Why am I even asking, of course you can't.

>>12340005
>LIKELY

>>12338777
The left wants me to eat bugs. The right wants me to eat bats. I just want to grill for gods sake!

>>12340010
>RETARD

>>12338777
That explains why Brazil has barely cases... oh wait.

>>12337806
>anybody can
>literally almost no one does, meaning it's not "anyone"

>>12340203
No one eats bats in brazil

>>12332095
Eve sounds like she had a silver spoon in her pussy.
She clearly has no idea that not everyone needs to take it for it to be effective.
Also the people that don't take it and get sick, will also stop the spread.
>HURR LOCKDOWN IS MANDATORY THEREFORE TAKE SOME UNKNOWN SUBSTANCE INTO YOUR BODY
it's not the same thing and these dribbling reporters know that it's not. Their job is to bait and rile people up for profit.

>>12332095
The fatality rate is comparable to the yearly flu. 99.99% in the 0-49 years old range survive according to a study from Europe.
Entertain the thought of this being a deadly pandemic drill, with the possible benefit of erradicating the yearly flu which actually takes all the lives reported EVERY SEASON. If so, this is a giant opportunity for humankind to prove what coordinated awareness and collaboration can achieve.

>>12340268
>I pull stuff out of my ass because the truth scares me

>>12340410
>The fatality rate is comparable to the yearly flu
After over half a year, still nobody cares about
>muh fatality rate
This has never been about death.

>>12340410
the fatality rate is not even the key issue, read the thread
the important part are the long term impairment and consequences

>>12332661
very american post

>>12337096
>>12337641
>self-centered kids drop their wisdom
It's more about the sudden surge of ICU beds and hospitalizations crushing the capacity of health care infrastructure so that usually non-lethal stuff like ingrown toenails starts to kill people.
>>12338777
The whole 'it came from people eating bats' was debunked in the first weeks, but dumb fucks keep repeating it so it becomes """knowledge""".

>>12340410
>this is a giant opportunity for humankind to prove what coordinated awareness and collaboration can achieve.
Yeah, like Syria with 2 million people on the move was a great rehearsal for the expected 100 million climate change refugees later in the century.
[spoiler] absolute shit show [spoiler]

>>12332095
>distribute untested vaccine to hundreds of millions of Americans and Europeans
>Covid crisis averted
>life goes back to normal
>twelve months later
>"Oh shoot you guys, turns out the vaccine causes male infertility. Whoops! Sorry folks, that's on us."

>>12340570
If only there was some kind of physical barrier you could erect, possibly along a country's border, to keep fugees out. Too bad there's no such thing.

>>12340471
>>12340546
Classic goalpost moving. For months we've been told we have to "stay home, save lives!" and now that it's apparent that you're wrong you have to change your reasoning to long term impact in order to justify more government control.

Granted, I am somewhat concerned about long term effects, but given how people only started trotting them out when deaths became a poor arguing point I have a tendency to not trust you.

>>12332095
>Vaccines cause myelitis
NO FUCKING SHIT? STOP THE FUCKING PRESSES.

LISTEN EVERYONE. VACCINES CAUSE TRANSVERSE MYELITIS. WE HAVE TO STOP USING ALL VACCINES.

Wheres my Nobel Peace prize?

>>12340546
>the important part are the long term impairment and consequences
What are the long term impairment and consequences of the fucking flu? Just vanilla influenza.

>>12340570
>Yeah, like Syria with 2 million people on the move was a great rehearsal for the expected 100 million climate change refugees later in the century
Why would they want everyone below the tropic of cancer to move into latitudes that:

- is colder
- requires higher fuel consumption just to live in
- don't have as favorable climate conditions to grow food
- is already crowded as fuck, causing housing prices to be sky high
- has a lower solar energy potential

Wouldn't it make more sense for people above the tropic of cancer to move down, causing the amount of fuel consumption to decrease? Compare the CO2 emissions of the average canadian to the CO2 emissions of the average filipino.

>>12332095
90% effective on a disease that has a 99.98% survival rate?

>>12338777
We should kill all flying mammals desu, human niche construction demands it.

>>12340410
An mtDNA flu vaccine might actually do it, the current flu vax is only around 50% effective which means elimiation isn't possible. Custom mtDNA vaxes will probably cure most cancers too. COVID accelerated the human healthcare process.

>>12332095
Thanks trump!

>>12340285
At least 60% of the population needs to take the vaccine for it to be effective. Good fucking luck reaching that without a big celb PR push.

>>12332095
Just for you understand what 90% effective means:

If you have 2% risk to get covid19, with the vaccine, you only have 0.2%.

>>12341038
Shhh England doesn't want Mediterranean weather like it had in the Middle Ages, they'd rather hamstring their economy than turn their misrable dreary island into where they all go on holidays.

>>12341705
Not sure that's true. The sample size ended up being pretty small, but it could be in 90% of people, they won't get it at all, and in the other 10%, the vaccine failed to give any or adequate protection.

>>12340911
>Classic goalpost moving
How? Do you even know what that word means?
>For months we've been told we have to "stay home, save lives!"
How does that relate to what I said?
>change your reasoning
No.
>to long term impact
That has always been the narrative. I was talking more about keeping infections low to lower the mutation chance.
>but given how people only started trotting them out when deaths became a poor arguing point
In the beginning it was long-term damage plus deaths. Feel free to go back what Chinese whistleblowers warned us about back in January. The stuff about testical damage is only coming to the front light right now in the west.

>>12337964
Then that's fine, I don't want my countries economy crippled for decades on the off chance I catch a virus that has a tiny tiny chance of being more than a sniffle

>>12341999
90% immunity will block the chain of transmission meaning that not only will 100% will not be exposed to the virus (as your interpretation premises), but that the pandemic will end.

>>12342105
I think you misunderstood what I said. It was purely about vaccine efficacy if exposed. The question is what 90% means.

Scenario 1:
10 people get exposed. Risk of getting infected is 10% if unvaccinated. Vaccine reduces it to 1% for each person.

Scenario 2:
10 people get exposed, all vaccinated. 9 people have 100% protection, the 10th person has no protection.

Both would fit the description of being 90% effective.

>>12332095
Don't be a human lab rat. Vaccines have hurt people in the past (research the Cutter Incident). You can find out more about vaccines here

https://vaccinechoicecanada.com/

>>12342126
The premise is naive if it doesn't take into consideration that a 90% effectiveness ends transmission because 9 out of 10 attempts of COVID to reproduce itself fail. There is a magic threshold that a 90% vaccine is well over that ends the pandemic and means people will no longer be exposed to it. A pandemic isn't a individual event, it's a social event of groups and nations.

>>12332723
i dont understand
how would you power the microchip
how would you make also a radio transmitter that is powerful enough to penetrate the human body and reach, for example, a cell tower
and the microchip needs to be so small it can fit in a hypodermic needle (or nasal spray, whatever). it would need to be aerosol sized.

This shit doesn't make sense.

>>12341999
That's not how it works

I hope it takes at last another 6 months for the pandemic to end

I'm not ready to stop my comfy shut in neet life that I use the covid shit as an excuse for

>>12332095
I’m told it’s the equivalent of a mild hangover

>>12332095
guys it's covid aids.

>>12342149
>>12342126
Do the 90% over multiple generations.

10 people get exposed who each go on to expose 10 others.

If the vaccine is 90% effective, then only one person in the first group is infected, who goes on to only infect one other person, 2/110, or 99.98% effective. Over three generations it's 3/1110 or 99.997% effective. Over four generations it's 4/11110, or 99.9996% effective, and so on.

Without the vaccine all 10 people get infected, who go on to infect 100 more people, then 1000 more, then 10000 more, or whatever natural reproductive rate you want to insert.

covid is such a retarded meme
fuck boomers

>>12342194
It will easily, the vaccine rollout is going to take at least 18 months.

>>12342149
You're still talking about something totally different. I'm not talking about herd immunity, I'm talking about efficacy at the individual level.

>>12342181
How does it work? I looked at the results and how they came up with 90%. 94 of 44,000 participants became ill. 90% had received the placebo. But we don't know if they were exposed at the same rates. Vaccine effectiveness is usually described, for example, as effective in 75% of people, meaning 75% will get a very high degree of protection, and the other 25% will not. I was specifically arguing against the point made by >>12341705, which made it sound like the vaccine simply reduces chance of infection by 90% across the board. That doesn't match how effectiveness is described pertaining to vaccines.

>>12342279
>Without the vaccine all 10 people get infected
But not being vaccinated doesn't mean a 100% infection rate even if exposed.

>>12342351
>But not being vaccinated doesn't mean a 100% infection rate even if exposed.
Okay, insert your own numbers to both sides then. The first post assumed that by "exposed" it means exposed until ordinarily infected so that the vaccine effectiveness equals the exposure-to-infection rate (i.e 10 "exposed", 9/10 are immune, 1/10 are infected). If exposure means less than 100% ordinary infections then the vaccine will be even more effective by that measure.

>>12342351
>I'm talking about efficacy at the individual level
But pandemics aren't an individual event. It's not a meaningful metric absent the second-order implications of how it affects transmission.

>>12342382
>But pandemics aren't an individual event.
But the post I responded to was talking about it at the individual level, at least that's how I took it.

>>12342377
>The first post assumed that by "exposed" it means exposed until ordinarily infected so that the vaccine effectiveness equals the exposure-to-infection rate (i.e 10 "exposed", 9/10 are immune, 1/10 are infected).
Okay, that's how I would state it as well, but that's not how the original post i was responding to >>12341705 stated it.

>>12337154
>eat the bugs
>get chipped
>what are you afraid of goy?

>>12341913
>you will NEVER look like this
Somebody please shoot me. Please.

>>12337535
And who is "likely" to get hurt by the vaccine.

It's like the yards saying because something is "natural" means it is safe.

>>12342960
Who cares?

>>12342691
>memespeak
>pretending that's an argument
>high IQ

>>12342984
Every non-sociopath

>>12343308
boomers deserve bat flu

>>12332935
enjoy your narcolepsy you subhuman retard
all big pharma companies are insanely corrupt

in my country of sweden, the swine flu vaccines pushed by this guy gave people narcolepsy and resulted in at least one case of murder-suicide of an entire family
but he actually learned his lesson and the general plan has been to do basically as little as possible, which is working out fine

>>12332095
Flu vaccine has shit side effects too. As do other vaccines. Can't wait for the news to 180 on everything on January 20.

>>12344013
>Can't wait for the news to 180 on everything on January 20.
Why would it?

>>12342161
piezo
there are sensors right now that you can deploy via catheter into the pulmonary artery that feed BP and blood flow metrics into a handheld sensor
>>12344051
>vaccine deployed
"holy shit the vaccine works wonders, time to forget about covid"
>vaccine delayed
"holy shit we don't even need the vaccine, covid is going away on its own all thanks to Biden's measures and certainly not to people not over-reporting deaths and over-cycling PCR tests any more!"