/sci/ - Science & Math

First for memes

*boop*

So when are we expecting SN8 to fly?

>>12264839
>expecting
last year

>reality
in ~1-2 weeks

Was didn't the Saturn-Shuttle happen, lads?

First for the AMERICAN rocket, no foreign garbage, or billionaires here, just pure American design and power

>>12264820
space mommy

starship big

>>12264820

>>12264844
The idea with Saturn-Shuttle was you'd replace the S-IC with a flyback booster after a few years and they decided it'd be a waste of money to implement a version of the Shuttle that only flew a few times.

>>12264820
I get very feminine energy from that photo. He should hit the gym and stop drinking milk like a soiboy.

>>12264859
Any updates on her engines' status? Last I heard they were still sitting on a flatbed

>>12264860
Hi sci I'm a lurker, I've been trying to understand why header tanks exist the last couple days but can't figure it out.
Is it just so bubbles don't come through the turbo pumps or something?

I like how the LOX header fuel line is like a spine for the starship.

>>12264849
>>12264809

DC-X did indeed flip itself horizontal and back, see 1 minute in here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wv9n9Casp1o

>>12264852
That rocket is worth more than the GDP of many countries. Very bad news!

>>12264884
when low on fuel, fuel would slosh around in the big tank and won't go down the drain

As for the header tank in the nose specifically, it balances the ship for its skydive so it's not too rear heavy, and I heard from one anon it helps cool the nose on re-entry

>>12264884
Header tanks are purely for landing and prevent sloshing from underfilled tanks, also less volume to protect against boiloff

>>12264884
You’re obviously not a very good lurker because this was explained earlier today and earlier this week in these threads. I’m not explaining it to you.

An article from New Zealand about ground stations that will work will be doing business with Starlink.
>Awarua is one of four satellite ground stations that SpaceX wants to use for specific radio bands, according to a US Federal Communications Commission document. The other three locations are at Brewster, in the US state of Washington, Cordoba in Argentina, Tromsø in Norway.
>Having a ground station at the South Pole would be optimal, McNeill said, but the complication of having long term staff in the hostile environment means Awarua is as close as a ground station can get to icy ideals. With satellites frequently set to orbit over both poles, it makes the location incredibly attractive for leasing land to set up antennas for commercial customers.

>NZ Intellectual Property Office records show SpaceX applied for three trademarks for use of the Starlink name in NZ in January. One application was for class 9 goods relating to commercial satellites, and the other two were for class 38 and class 42 services relating to satellite communication services.
>BusinessDesk found through an Official Information Act request that all three were rejected in the same month due to similarities with trademarks held by Subaru since 2012 for its Subaru Starlink in-car technology system.
https://businessdesk.co.nz/article/technology/whats-elon-musks-starlink-doing-in-new-zealand

>>12264507
Excessively over exaggerating propellant boiloff. Wank all you want to a depot (singular) - you will see it neither from shelby nor from spacex.

>>12264852
SLS is SHIT and orange tank is BAD

>>12264908
>An article from New Zealand about ground stations that will work will be doing business with Starlink.
An article from New Zealand about ground stations that will be doing business with Starlink.*

20km hop when?

>>12264907
we got a badass here

>>12264880
Looks like 2/3 have been removed.

>>12264907
...why even reply then asshole

>>12264917
after the 15km one that comes in a week or so.

>>12264925
>>12264918
Its okay I'm from /biz/ everyone is assholes there.
Thanks to the others who replied I'm happy with those explanations. Can't imagine the thermal effect from the top lox tank to be much, but still cool.

>>12264925
Lurk. Moar.

>>12264931
I'm not the lurking anon. When lurking fags ask questions usually they get really good answers and we all learn something

>>12264926
kek
do you know for which days they have permission?

>>12264938
No NOTAMs yet and we're sure to hear because it's going to be a big one this time... A lot bigger than the usual static fires or even small hops. It's gonna carry a lot of fuel and the feds aren't going to be happy about that.

>>12264880
>>12264922
Believe only one was removed. The brought one new engine out there yesterday and added the one they removed to the vehicle. Still haven't installed the new one, probably waiting to finish the nosecone.

>>12264839
Given the engine removals and nosecone tanks, there'll probably be a few more tests before it flies. Mid-November is my guess.

>the nosecone is still supported by the crane
Are we sure it's been stacked yet? There's a lot of work being done on it right now.

>>12264957
Its obvious they're still working on it. Look at the cranes.

Starship Launch System

>>12264852
FUCK HYDROGEN

>>12264859
i am so glad this garbage can will get us to mars

>>12264880
SN39 was removed. SN36 was transported to Texas and is new there. They were both taken away from SN8 to the build site down the road. No one knows what they're doing.

Umm based?
https://twitter.com/GOP/status/1319715289328766980

>>12264974
>manned
sweetie, the correct term is 'crewed'

>>12264974
Pretty sure the first one can be done or just about done by the end of his second term, maybe a cargo flight to Mars in preparation of a mission too if we're really lucky.
Nice

Starship presentation next week
>Good point. Probably next week in form of a written piece on SpaceX website.
https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1319729145421598720

>>12264974
>manned presence on the moon
>manned mission to mars
>manned
based

>>12264969
The first stage is actually called superheavy, but when we stack them I call the whole thing “Starship.” 1200 metric tons of subcooled methane and oxygen. You see, you can chill the fuel and it makes it more dense so I get more fuel per given unit volume. And they aren’t wings, they are fins. The cylinder is actually a lifting body but y’know, I still don’t call it a spaceplane. Yeah it’s basically my ride to Mars

>>12264974
>there is only one conpany that can pull ofd a manned landing on the moon and a manned mars flyby within Trumps 2nd therm
We're going to see a lot more shit blowing up in Boca Chica...

>>12264984
A written piece update? Or a written piece update on Starship update with actual presentation livestreamed?

>>12264927
No, I'm saying that Starship hanging out in LEO won't experience more than a few hundred kilograms of boiloff per day, out of tens of thousands of kilograms of propellant. We know that Starship will need to experience effectively zero boiloff on Mars, which sets a limit as to how much thermal flux is required before boiloff becomes a big deal. Low Earth orbit is a slightly more intense thermal environment than Mars simply because the surface of Earth is big and radiates more heat than Mars' surface, due to being warmer. Therefore, at most you're looking at very manageable levels of boiloff.

>>12264974
Biden should copy paste this in one way or another + add nuclear/electric cars if he is to be smart.

>>12264984
>>12264991
No idiots learn english. He's going to write a piece, next week, on his website, that will tell us the tentative date for the future presentation lmao

>>12264884
How are you gonna get the propellant to the engines at the start of the backflip maneuver if the propellant is all settled on the side of the tank, anon? That's that the headers are for. They're also arranged in a way that offers an advantage in terms of center of mass balancing.

>>12264989
There's good reason for a manned planetary flyby to ever happen, on the same grounds that we never (intentionally) did a manned lunar flyby.

If you want to demonstrate long-term habitation outside of Earth's magnetosphere then just hang out at Earth-Sun L1 for a couple of years so you can get back to Earth in a few weeks if something goes wrong. If you want to do any useful exploration then wait until you can get in orbit.

>>12264995
We can't be sure because Nov is almost up. So if he's doing a written piece update next week, then it could mean Starship update is either postponed to mid Nov or more. Musk is really waiting for the 15km imo.

>>12264884
see with your own eyes: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PPnCKK1isMI

Spacex put cameras in their F9 LOX tank and the feed sometimes comes up on stream. You can see in the video the fuel sloshing around in the nearly empty tanks.

But unlike the Falcon 9, Starship isn't going to be vertical all the time. On reentry it will be horizontal and then flip vertical for propulsive landing. The LAST thing you want is to flip vertical and for the engines to not light because the fuel is bouncing around in a nearly empty massive tank. The header tanks avoid this by allowing the tanks to be "full" even when they're actually nearly dry.
Watch this to get a better idea of how this works in action: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1PC47YrDtFs

and more LOX tank feeds: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mVAGoWJuDKk

>>12264999
*There's NO good reason

>>12264890
Based, I was gonna post this but I was away from the thread for a bit.
Did DC-X have header tanks? If not I'd put the likelihood of Starship backflipping successfully at close to 100%, Starship has more control authority but less room for error unless they decide to backflip early, so it kind of evens out.

>>12264999
>There's good reason for a manned planetary flyby to ever happen, on the same grounds that we never (intentionally) did a manned lunar flyby.
It'd be cool though and thats reason enough

>>12265003
Yeah it'll be in november, he is autistic and probably wants to do the presentation in front of SN8 after it has landed. Although didn't he say himself that he expects it to crash?

>>12264992
A tanker with no cooling system to reduce boiloff would increase it's payload (fuel) capacity.
For the fuel depot the additional mass is a non-issue once it is in orbit anyway.
This would also make launch schedules a little more flexible as you could launch 2 starships 24 h appart and fuel them at the depot.

>>12264929
>the thermal effect from the top lox tank
Thermal effect?

>>12265006
Simpler explanation: A header tank in freefall with your ass first is "full" and primed as far as gravity is concerned.

>>12265010
Yes that is what I'm thinking. DC-X was pretty simple from the looks of it and if it can pull of that maneuver then I am confident SN8 could do it even if it is twice the velocity and twice the pitch speed. It has fins and engine gimbal- and maybe even RCS (?) Anyone know if it will have RCS I would assume so

>>12265017
he probably wants to have SH1 finished so he can show off the full stack

>>12264978
No it's manned, they're actually only sending white men between the ages of 25 and 35

>>12265025
Yes it has RCS. I just asked the labpadre chat they follow this shit like zealots. In that case it will definitely be able to stick the landing so long as the fins don't get sheared off like some other anon said

>>12264890
Each DC-X prototype would cost ~$200 million dollar each today.

>>12265041
that's pocket change compared to SLS.

>>12264988
>And they aren’t wings, they are fins.
They are neither wings nor fins, they are drag flaps. Starship controls roll yaw and pitch by varying drag. Starship would be a lifting body if it were capable of maintaining aerodynamic control in nose-first flight, but it actually can't. It only has control authority if it maintains a ~75 to ~105 degree angle of attack to the air stream, which means that any lifting body effects are insignificant compared to body drag. There is still sufficient control over which side of Starship has more air mass shunting off in order to allow for downrange landing site targeting as long as the initial orbital inclination is within a few degrees of accuracy.

>>12264974
Well if he says he'll do it, he definately will. When has he ever broken a promise before?

>>12264995
He literally said the update on Starship would be in the form of a written piece on their website, dude

>>12265010
>>12265025
The thing is DC-X was expressly built to be a small-scale demonstrator of the landing maneuver that an SSTO would need to perform. SN8 has a tougher task ahead of it because it was designed to be the upper stage of an orbital rocket first and foremost and it's the full-scale article.

>>12264999
>just waste a few years doing nothing productive while exposing a few people to the risks associated with taking a significant chronic dose of cosmic and solar charged particle radiation
Fuck you we're doing straight to Mars with a crew of six in a habitat designed to support 60 for redundancy.

>>12264999
wasn't apollo 10 an intentional lunar flyby?
there was even a rumor about nasa not fueling the LEM so the astronauts won't be tempted to land

>>12265072
Apollo 10 was a test of LEM maneuvering and rendezvous in lunar orbit, so they kinda had to be in lunar orbit for that. The part about them not putting enough fuel in the LEM to land it is true though.

The only manned lunar flyby to date was Apollo 13.

>>12265081
They had enough to land. They wouldn't have gotten off again though.

>>12264974
based and spacepilled

>>12265084
talk about an incentive to prevent mutiny lmao

>>12265061
No he didn't.
Read the tweet he replied to.
>guy: when will you give us a date
>elon: next week on our website

>>12265018
>A tanker with no cooling system to reduce boiloff would increase it's payload (fuel) capacity.
Neither Tankers nor Starships will require active cooling, for the reasons I said. Elon has tweeted before about how they aren't doing active cooling if they can get away with it (this was back during the carbon fiber era), and since they're using steel with its good infrared reflectivity now instead of composites I'm inclined to think they are getting away with it.
>For the fuel depot the additional mass is a non-issue once it is in orbit anyway
For Starship even if it lost 500 kg of methalox per day due to boiloff it wouldn't matter because it would still be cheaper in the long run to eat the boiloff losses over a months-long refueling campaign than paying for the development, construction, and eventual replacement of a permanently orbiting depot with zero boiloff.
>This would also make launch schedules a little more flexible as you could launch 2 starships 24 h appart and fuel them at the depot
They will already be able to stretch fueling out across months of time easily, even if I'm wrong about them being confident in already getting close to zero boiloff by default. First of all, their Falcon 9 upper stages contain liquid oxygen and no active cooling and they don't get significant boiloff. Starship will be better, because it will have bare steel rather than just white paint. Starship is also bigger, meaning it has more volume per surface area and thus the same heat flux per unit area will cause proportionally less boiloff.
Having a permanent depot locks you into an inclination which wont' be ideal for Mars transfers from window to window because of the differences in how Mars and Earth orbit the Sun (solar inclination, orbital ellipses, phase angles).

>>12265072
yep, apollo 10 did a flyby

Pet rats on Mars to boost morale when?

>>12265063
On the other hand Starship is also built better and is better in general, has much more control authority which is really all that matters.
Two things need to happen for Starship to stick the landing; First, it needs to not break up during descent, which should be easy to avoid. Second, it needs to initiate the flip early enough to be able to kill rotation, kill horizontal velocity, and then kill vertical velocity as it touches down. If SpaceX has any brains they're gonna add four seconds to the time that the computer tells them they can get the landing maneuver completed by, and obviously SpaceX has brains. Rather than looking just like the 3D renders I imagine the actual SN8 landing is gonna look like the render was set 200 meters higher than ground level, with a nice controlled descent. After they land it and replace the legs they can go again and reduce the margin on each landing burn until it's what they want.

>>12265072
Apollo 8 was the first time we sent humans around the Moon and even that wasn't a flyby, they injected into orbit and went around a few times before boosting back to Earth.

>>12264974
I thought the left loved space exploration. Why do they oppose this?

>>12265053
All those times when the republican house and republican senate wouldn't do it

>>12264820
jesus christ i hate these people
HATE
what the fuck is up with all these anti-space people.
I literally looked at multiple billionaire accounts. THIS ONLY HAPPENS UNDER ELONS TWEETS.

There is something about the fuckers on the left, that is absolutely terrified about space colonization. My theory is cuz the left knows deep down they'd get left on earth and would have nothing to offer anyone in space. Its the utimate why are you going to college in another state type cope.

>>12265115
Whitey on the Moon mentality

>>12264969
>>12264859
>my ancestors :)

>>12264994
Theres nothing smart about triggering his base so close the election. Theres tens of thousands crossing their fingers to see Space Force disbanded by the end of the year and Artemis will likely take a hit too.

>>12265125
Cant disband Space Force when its a bipartisan agreement in the congress.

>>12264999
I know military test pilots are badasses and everything but would they really risk their life to see the L1 point and not mars out the window

>>12265081
That image is so kino

>>12265115
Came across a video where detailing why the left thinks the way they do, essentially it boils to the fear of being left behind. They never want to say fuck it and live by themselves its always why dont we invade traditional white spaces.

>>12265094
>Could you give us an update on the date for the Starship presentation?
>Good point. Probably next week in the form of a written piece on SpaceX website

>an update on the date: next week
>Starship presentation: A written piece on SpaceX website
Why the hell would Elon wait a week to drop a presentation date, as an update to their fucking website no less? They're going to add a section to their Starship webpage which is going to have some nice numbers and stuff, basically Elon's previous presentations except without him stuttering through them.
If you want to believe you're getting a real world presentation, I guess you can cope.

>>12265134
I seriously wish we could turn back social norms 200 years but keep our current technology

>>12264969
Still looks a lot better then mk1

>>12264929
>Can't imagine the thermal effect from the top lox tank to be much, but still cool.

Remember that the lox is up against the bare metal that's against the heat shield. Starship is basically a flying fuel tank instead of a tube that contains fuel tanks.

>>12265061
>>12265094
>>12265135
So no presentation then?
https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1319738772158754817

>>12265130
An L1 mission would suck, unless maybe there was some man-tended solar telescope to work with, but seeing Mars out the window for a few hours just isn't enough to make it worth more.

Fortunately I think the first people to enter Mars's proximity are also gonna walk on it so we can get back to using astronauts for what they're best at which is surface exploration.

>>12265120
>People are dying out here in europe, and y'all worried about some sailing program?

>>12265120
>THIS ONLY HAPPENS UNDER ELONS TWEETS
Twitter is melting down right now over >>12264974

>>12265111
Will the Starship have to pull a suicide burn like the F9? Not sure if a single raptor at minimum throttle > the weight of a dry Starship. If the answer is "yes" then that complicates matters significantly. If "no" then they could just do as you said: try a safer and more gradual approach at first and then optimize it later

>>12265115
The left fucking love science but they hate applying it, they want us to be searching for some beautiful deep hidden truth in the universe rather than what's really going on, which is that governments fund labs to do research because "hey they may figure out some quirky physics shit that makes fusion easy, in which case we got it first so we get to dominate the globe now".
Scientific research is fundamentally the same as a caveman figuring out a repeatable process of smelting and casting copper, it is a method of doing experiments to generate knowledge that can be applied to improving capabilities. That last part is what leftists want to deny; They want humanity to consist of cavemen who write out how to make pottery and smelt metal and do agriculture and so forth on rock walls in charcoal pigments so they can sit back and admire how much shit they know, without ever actually applying it.
Long story short, leftists want to send out one or two robotic spacecraft into the solar system every two to five years, perpetually, and never EVER actually go there and apply our survey information to do things like mine the ore deposits and set up factories and continue to grow and live in absolute resource abundance. No, that would 'ruin' everything, just like the invention of farming 'ruined' hunter-gatherer tribes.

>>12265115
parties have been realigning at deep levels for some time now. After a party's fundamentals have changed policy will follow suit as well.

>>12264981
pretty sure if he lights a fire under elons butt the moon base thing can be done.

>>12265153
No presentation. Probably some cool renders, a picture of SN6 painted white with the white nose cone on top, a video of Raptor test firing? Oh and some more concrete numbers for things like all up mass, payload mass to certain orbits, reusability rates, etc.

>>12265115
Because it's not 1965 and NASA centers aren't all in democrat-run states anymore.

>>12265159
>Will the Starship have to pull a suicide burn like the F9?
Hoverslam, you mean. Time limited, yes, but not a suicide burn. Anyway, no, Starship doesn't need to do a hoverslam, it can go TWR less than 1. This should be obvious, since Starship has already performed two hop and landing maneuvers. Granted those had one engine not 3, but there's no reason why they couldn't shut off one of the engines during landing if they needed to drop the TWR.

https://twitter.com/alexwitze/status/1319746663473315840

>OSIRIS-REx has so much stuff it collected the diaphragm is stuck open and pieces are escaping into space. -@Dr_ThomasZ

RIP

>>12265120
It's because left liberals only care about disaffected groups, progress is a lie. If something benefits everyone equally, or benefits the wealthy first and the poor second, they don't want it at all. Even action on climate change fits that ethos because their chief interest is the ecosystem or impoverished agrarian communities in places like africa. If they cared about it as an existential threat to everyone and themselves they would start begging for nuclear power or climate engineering, or just out right resort to violence for preservation, anything to stop it and forget about their idealized vision for the world.

>>12265115
No. They hate it. Specifically they hate it because they think its a waste of money.

>>12265165
Reminder that that is not meant to be a moon base, but a reusable lander. The fact that it completely dwarfs Gateway is absurd, but that has no bearing on its actual use.

>>12265175
Fucking eggheads, when will they learn?

>>12265179
>NOOOOO YOU CAN'T DO MANNED EXPLORATION ROBOTS DO EVERYTHING SO MUCH BETTER AND CHEAPER

>can't even pick up a rock

>>12265165
>>12265178

>>12265153
>when the design clarification is orange

>>12265175
So are they finished? Sounds like InSight 2.0.

>>12265170
>This should be obvious, since Starship has already performed two hop and landing maneuvers
wow, yeah that question was fucking retarded. Thanks for humoring it regardless.

But anyways, great. It feels more plausible for them to have a successful first landing now.

>>12265182

Why is he betraying spaceflight for points with the libs?
https://twitter.com/SciGuySpace/status/1319731875519279104

>>12265178
lunar mobile base...see what i did there.
now the press and austists can go fuck themselves.

>>12265192
because he's a lib

>>12265175
when you focus on considering every single possible minutiae you can forget to consider the obvious

>>12265161
Also leftism categorically opposes Christianity as a traditional institution and since many Christians, particularly the more fundamental ones, have a reputation of being "science-deniers" they can position themselves as their counterparts, constantly pointing out how much they trust the experts and their secular, enlightened way of arriving at truth. Science as a prop to signal moral superiority is more important than the process itself

>>12265191
the station is pretty a cramped changing room for the flight to the moon. OLD SPACE IS DEAD. The fact is he could launch a couple empty sections and retrieve the rocket section and it would STILL be larger than the gateway.

>>12265192
His hate for Trump is greater than his love for spaceflight

>>12265192
Part of me wonders if the "Trump will fire Jim" rumor is just a smear.

>>12265192
What the hell else are we gonna do about Covid? Cure the flu while we're at it, it's all coronavirus.

>>12265192
Blinded by ethnic self-interest

>>12265191
where's this from? is there a longer vid?

Toot Toot
SLS spare orange part delivery

>>12265209
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TUWMgshx-Hw

~2 min mark

>>12265181
MANNED EXPLORATION TOO COMPLICATED

*fails to open lens cap*

AND UNSAFE TOO

*inputs ft/s instead of m/s*

A PROBE CAN DO EVERYTHING A PERSON CAN BUT BETTER

*underground instrument flops on the surface*

THEY'RE AT THE FOREFRONT OF EXPLORATION

*takes a decade to travel 13 miles*

THERE IS LITERALLY NO BETTER WAY TO DO THIS

*holds back space exploration by supporting anemic launchers*

Speaking of Berger, he's in the OSIRIS-REx call right now. He asked if the entire sample will escape. The answer seems pretty vague, though there's a lot of technical talk so maybe they just don't know yet.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n274YX4xk_0

>>12265115
If you make everyone involved non-white and tranny circus freaks and they'll change their tune in an instant.

>>12265213
aeiouwu

>>12265205
Liberals can't predict trump because in their head canon he will do something just because they are afraid of it

>>12265205
>>12265205
why would he do that Jim has been great for space.

>>12265203
that faggot doesnt know what he is talking about. its not like we are doing shit from scratch, its all about adding more fuel and getting it to the moon. Im assuming musk gets whatever kinks worked out in 2.5 years and sends a platorm to the moon.

then it will be scores of leftists seething about how this was done so fast and the astronauts safety wasnt taken into account.

honestly fuck these people


the left has gone straight up ludites

>>12265143
I want 90's / early 2000's social norms just with better fashion and modern tech

>>12265213
wtf am i watching

>>12265192
He has a point about the low chances of not reaching the Moon or Mars by 2024, but the exact due date isn't important. Setting such a date so soon is much better than setting one years from now because it encourages enthusiastic speedier work. Having the goal be "a couple years to a decade" away encourages complacency and lack of urgency. More work has gone into returning America to the moon within the last four years than the last five decades partly due to that enthusiasm set by the 2024 deadline.

>>12265198
Man it's pretty cringe to bring up religion in any aspect, desu. Attacking or promoting it. Just silently follow the values you want to value and don't fall for dogmatic shit, whether it's coming from an extreme leftist or a muslim or an oldspace guy who's telling you hydrogen is the best fuel. Think critically and reject everything that aims to misdirect.

>>12265213
>envisage the aroma

>>12264852
>Posting the shoop

>>12265233
Even worse are the "Mars mission in two decades" type goals that aren't even really goals at all.

>>12265217
No joke, how do you accidentally design a box who's only purpose is to collect rocks by blasting them into a chamber such that the lid can't close if you blast rocks through it? I swear to god if this turns into Insight Heat probe 2.0 I will bomb NASA's JPL in minecraft.

Can we please stop pretending that statements made by dems and left-leaning institutions based on the east coast have never mattered even one Iota to what actual left space policy is. East coasters both dem and repubs have always been ambivalent to hostile to the space program. It is the deep south R's, Rocky Mountain Dems and West Coast dems that set space policy agendas. The Sanders and AOC's will always bitch about space because East coast urban centers never have had strong ties to aerospace, while the Wyden's, Feinstein's, and Shelby's actually care and set the agenda. East Coasters don't matter to actual space policy, so stop pretending whatever they say will have a positive or negative affect on it.

>>12265182
>>12265191
I really hope that Starship succeeds. Not just for SpaceX's sake, but also for oldspace getting humiliated by the scale difference and reworking themselves to be better.

>>12265233
Why not? Starship has 4 milestones left, one if which will be accomplished this year, after which it can launch anywhere. Bellyflop this year, superheavy hop with all engines next year, full orbital next year plus the fuel exchange maneuver after that. All this can be done by next year.

OH NO NO NO NO NO

>>12265253
WHY THE FUCK DIDN'T THEY JUST DESIGN IT TO JUST CLOSE RIGHT AFTER COLLECTING THE SAMPLE AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHH

>>12265251
Even Elon said that fuel transfer won't be tested until 2022. I don't think it's possible to be ahead of his schedules.

>>12265253
>OSIRIS-REx is a NASA asteroid-study and sample-return mission.
>The mission's primary goal is to obtain a sample of at least 60g from 101955 Bennu, a carbonaceous near-Earth asteroid, and return the sample to Earth for a detailed analysis.
>The cost of the mission is approximately US$800 million, not including the Atlas V launch vehicle, which is about US$183.5 million.
One billion fucking dollars.

>>12265234
What does it mean to have a belief without ever choosing to act on it? It may as well not exist. Sounds like something someone would say who wants to assert their will on people who won't fight back.

Anyway, I don't see what that has to do with my post at all

>>12265245
my father was an engineer(he is dead), Having been around his colleagues it made me realize while they are "smart", many ignore things which would be obvious to the common man.

>>12264860
One of the coolest things is seeing all the vids etc people are making. It's clearly caught the imagination of a lot of people

>>12265262
This is in the same tier of missions as New Horizons and Juno.

>>12265258
Once the bellyflop is done, there's nothing else to test on starship, maybe tests on pressure of new alloys, after that they'll concentrate on superheavy which is less complicated then they can start taking it orbital

>>12265256
probably some diversity hire

>>12265265
Engineers are weird. I know a lot of them because of work and I find that, while they are smart (in that if I gave them a very random calculus problem they could solve it), they aren't actually "smart". They are socially fucked up and build everything according to the philosophy that "it'll just work cause my physics says so."

>>12265278
Lol this is implying that there are other people who build things better than engineers, thats how engineering works

>>12265262
OSIRIS-REx: $983.5 million for 60 grams = $16,000,000/gram

Entire Apollo program adjusted for inflation: ~$280 billion for 380.95 kilograms = $735,000/gram, or about 95% less.

>>12265251
My personal doubts are mainly from two reasons. The first is that this year had many issues with prototyping Starships, and I'm expecting SpaceX to continue to encounter issues along Starship's development. I'm not saying that I doubt that SpaceX can fix those issues, but I'm expecting those issues to slow them down as they fix them. The second is that human rating is going to take time even if crewed Starship is for space transfers only and if SpaceX finds some way to speed up the process by going around NASA. Failures resulting the harm or death of passengers is disasters to the image of any transporting company, and I expect that SpaceX will be cautious.

>>12265262
>One billion fucking dollars
Great, SLS will have to make do with just one layer of paint.

>>12265278
My favorite phrase from a brilliant and hands-on engineer that I worked with is, "Theoretically, there's no difference between theory and practice, but in practice... ."

>>12265175
what are they gonna do then? can they open it and let some stuff out or did they just have that one opportunity to collect

I don't know where else you could shove it but why the fuck is the oxygen header tank above the crew cabin at the tip.

>>12265303
If I remember right, it was for weight distribution.

>>12265289
Imo the hardest parts have already been solved, if they can solve the bellyflop milestone the next hardest part will be the heat tiles, after that, everything will accelerate

>>12265248
That's just local special interest shit though that gets us nothing but jobs programs though

You need a president with the "space is cool" or "fuck you because america" axioms, typical short term or even near future reasoning just gets in the way. There wasn't enough special interest in apollo before it existed, it had to be paraded and the public conscience liked it. Only a president that likes blowing money on moon shit just for the sake of dick waving can campaign with it. Even if biden liked space more than we think he does there's extra pressure from his constituents to look responsible for the disaffected and it will be last in line to get money. I like to hope "strong space" is second wheel to "strong military" in trump's head, whether it makes sense or not doesn't matter.

>>12265192
>based on all the butthurt libs replying to this tweet nobody cares about space policy

>>12265285
> implying there are other people who build things better than (nasa) engineers


there literally are though.
an engineer who works on boats or cars would probably be saying WTF to alot of (non rocket) nasa stuff.

>>12265251
You don't even need belly flop for the moonship, so maybe that can proceed in parallel before they pull off landings.

>>12265153
Imagine getting to talk in person with Elon whenever you want.

Alright that’s it when is the civil war. Just remember this: when we have nice ass cities on the Moon and Mars, (((these))) people are blacklisted and aren’t allowed to come after we busted our ass making it nice

>>12265316
>onions boy

>>12265309
My point is, engineering philosophy of testing until you're right is universal, nobody gets it right on the first try

>>12265115
>>12265120
People are completely stuck in their mindset that literally nothing outside of earth is tangible.
People were raised these past 50 years in the believe that space is a meme. So they treat it like just a stupid distraction for rich people.
If deep space colonies became real they would have to adjust their mindset. People hate changing their mindset.

>>12265316
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=goh2x_G0ct4

>>12265316
Ceresrael, NOW.

>>12265316
I refuse to believe this is real.

>>12265176
>>12265161
>>12265120
Jesus you people know nothing about people outside your bubble. The left doesn't hate science or progress, and it's not just about helping minorities. That"s just the narrative being pushed in this tiny echo chamber that everyone just swallows based off twitter screenshots.
The vast majority of all scientists and science educators are liberal (and I mean real scientists, not gender studies professors) and do care about space exploration.
They few twitter users that think space is racist are a tiny minority, and their posts only get spammed here because we're so close to an election and the people posting those screenshots want to swing your vote.
The left does not hate space.

>>12265278
I hear this kind of story a lot, that engineers lack common sense

and will try to suck your dick when you aren't looking

Can't wait to start dropping O'Neill cylinders on people at this rate.

>>12265332
cope harder

>>12265332
>>>/r/space

>>12265316
>nasa announces weed on mars monday
>this tweet has been deleted

>>12265192
>>12265120
>>12265316
>>12265324
>>12265328
AYO HOL UP

>>12265328
>lib celeb getting mad about something related to orange man
Just learn to accept it

Sorry for shitting up the thread further, but I got to ask this. Where the hell are these anti-space people getting the idea that the "elite" will flee the Earth to space? It can't just be because one movie had the concept. Why do they think that the rich would run away from the source of their income to live conditions that make Antarctica look like a pleasant vacation destination?

>>12265332
Anti-space is becoming the common liberal's mindset. The hate for trump leaks out and people oppose anything he stands for. I guaran-fucking-tee you if trump was anti-NASA the liberals would be pushing for "woman on the moon!" and suddenly all liberals would be pro-NASA pro-science. They are all baizuos

>>12265341

>>12265344
But where's the tweet, I can't find it.

I'm so happy we have SpaceX so we don't need to pander to v*ters. The world will be dragged into the space age, kicking and screaming if needed.

>>12265307
I mean yeah that's true that special interest job's programs are what mostly come from those states, but that's the only true reliable way to generate funds for a project that doesn't do "apparent" good for the public. We all know differently, but the average joe and jane doesn't give a fuck. That's why it has to be ideologically couched through various lenses be it patriotism, global warming, military readiness, or internal cooperation. As it stands right now we don't make a lot of money off of deep space operations, now we all know that's going to change with cheaper lift options and more infrastructure.

However until that happens we have to either rely on presidents who care for dumb reasons or special interests. I guess my main point though is that we should try and not go all ideological here. Like I get that it's satisfying to make it "left degenerate bad, right good" or something like that, but that doesn't really paint an accurate picture of what's actually driving current space operations. Space is a bipartisan issue driven by special interests, trying to coopt it as a hammer to hit your political rivals over the head is counter productive whether is the left with global warming stuff or the right with the whitey on the moon stuff. Trying to use the opinions of morons who think burning coal is the bee's knees or NYU Grievance Studies major's who think whitey on the moon is a good reason to never return just isn't worth anyone's time besides shooting political hoops.

The most important political space discussions are on how the current stakeholders will adapt to the changing environment and be supportive of the new disruptions being introduced by Elon

>>12265348
because it fits their 1980s rich-businessmen-want-to-destroy-the-environment narrative. what's actually going to happen is that poor people are gonna live in o'neill cylinders while rich people live in a planet-wide nature preserve.

>>12265120

>>12265350
>I guaran-fucking-tee you if trump was anti-NASA the liberals would be pushing for "woman on the moon!" and suddenly all liberals would be pro-NASA pro-science.
Reminder that the Democrats increased NASA's budget when Trump threatened to cut it. They literally just do the opposite of what he does.

>>12265245
plan B: send entire thing into earth orbit and have it be picked up by starship

>>12265316
>Seethe Rogen

>>12265332
>Jesus you people know nothing about people outside your bubble. The left doesn't hate science or progress, and it's not just about helping minorities. That"s just the narrative being pushed in this tiny echo chamber that everyone just swallows based off twitter screenshots.

I don't habitually browse /pol/ or any political communities that you would call an echo chamber, sometimes I go to liberal reddits to check their pulse. But I still see the asymmetry and contradictions in things vocal liberals care about because they are just that, vocal. I don't encounter their opinions by avoiding to them.

They would probably see the same problems in me if I shared my opinions with a bigger audience. I'm surely as much 60% water and 40% bullshit as they are.

>The vast majority of all scientists and science educators are liberal (and I mean real scientists, not gender studies professors) and do care about space exploration.
>They few twitter users that think space is racist are a tiny minority, and their posts only get spammed here because we're so close to an election and the people posting those screenshots want to swing your vote.

Liberals are a highly heterogeneous coalition group and the presence of one subgroup isn't indicative of the whole. Funny how in the same post you told us scientists and educators represent liberals but liberals tweeting back at the GOP don't. Shut up retard.

Also something something spaceflight

>>12265348
>It can't just be because one movie had the concept.

When you're dealing with a denomination this dumb they might judge more stuff than you think based on how closely it aligns with a contemporary work of fiction.

>>12265354
I kind of see your point

If we were months away from fusion and trump promised it, it would become an overnight political battle to kill fusion

>>12265316
CANCEL NASA BECAUSE COVID WILL KILL US ALL

>>12265289
The fact you assumed SpaceX will attempt to human rate starship through nasa at all tells me your analysis as a whole is probably wrong. I believe there is a high chance SpaceX gets humans to Mars by 2029.

>>12264953
engine removal? ok i want all those fucks that said the honk wasnt an issue to apologize

>>12265356
They still don't realize it's rich elite Jews who are the issue, not the generally wealthy.

>>12265334
Sieg Zeon!

>>12265411
Space is not gib.
Everything not gib is evil.
Space is evil.

Bah, all of this anti-space shit fouling up my thread.

>>12264853

We need more people like her in general.

>>12264860

Nice, saved.

>>12265356
>what's actually going to happen is that poor people are gonna live in o'neill cylinders while rich people live in a planet-wide nature preserve
A Gundam future doesn't sound so bad.

>>12265332
>The vast majority of all scientists are liberal
I wouldn’t say the vast majority, but definitely the majority. Probably like 70-30, and I assume it varies greatly by field. You’re definitely right about ‘science educators’ though.

>>12265436
Space politics is relevant to the thread anon and jannies don't remove it unless it starts getting really out of hand.

>>12265120
Stop posting this

>>12265356
I think this is a pretty likely future, with living on planetary bodies eventually becoming a sort of status held by the rich elites mainly and the vast majority of humanity living in space habits. Probably at least 1-2000 years away though.

>>12265424
Yeah, and it wont be due to the fact that dems or lefties actually hate fusion. But rather due to previous politcal moves and sentiments that have built up over the past decade. Frankly this level of total polarization both in the halls of power and in the general public is probably extremely unhealthy. I mean in this thread alone anything on the "bad" side is bad and anything bad is attributed to the bad side. This clearly cant stand and its not representative of actual reality.

>>12265411
>Mars is a very RED planet XD those martians must be right-wing or something lmaoo UwU
Yes.

>>12265449
>mean in this thread alone anything on the "bad" side is bad and anything bad is attributed to the bad side

Communists and racial egalitarians are bad and fuck up everything they touch, yes.

>>12265436
me like mommy

>>12265332
Left and liberal are not synonyms.

And left thought is (supposedly, traditionally) centered on the radical view of economic justice and class struggle (((definitely nothing to do with race though))), and this overwhelmingly means visceral disdain for anything space-related if done outside of their ideal communist society.

But yeah, economic, social liberals, which a lot of scientists are, should nominally like space.

>>12265447
This general is about hating people who don't like spaceflight or hating people who like orange rocket

>>12265411
I don't think those people have the faintest clue how little is spent on NASA and how much is spent on jobs, healthcare, education, stopping spread of kung flu and other bullshit every fucking year.
And even if you try to tell them, it's like trying to show a dog a card trick. Trust me, I've tried.

>>12265455
You just proved his point, anon.

>>12265356
>>12265439
Well, there goed the OYW.
Earth federation won't like some guys behind the moon claiming independence and a total war breaks out.
But hey, at least we do have a final solution for australian shitposters...

>>12265460
Why should scientists normally support transgenderism and homosexuality? In Germany in the 1920s these concepts were all promoted by Jews, not scientists.

>>12264820
So what's Shotwell about? I know she's great but you never hear anything about her because everyone is focused on Musk. Though there was that amazing story about her raising hell and throwing out some oldspace spies

>>12265448
If we assume biologically normie humans, the more Earth-like the environment the more desirable, which leaves you with Earth and habitats where you have fine control over conditions. More likely income will track more closely with how dense the population of space habitat you live in is, with the rich living in vast space-villas. Planets are largely relevant for their usefulness and thus the second you have large habitats they become the hubs of the working class.

>>12265411
>>12265316
Their souls are weighted down by gravity, the will neve be free.

>>12265449
>Frankly this level of total polarization both in the halls of power and in the general public is probably extremely unhealthy.
At least two or three decades ago, the other great pwoers realized that only one nuclear power could topple the USA without being reduced to radioactive ash in return, the USA itself. There has been a long and subtle campaign fought to turn us against each other, one with useful idiots on both sides of the aisle, since initially these divisions allow the people at the top to increase their power.

>>12265134
It's worth remembering that the modern left does not resemble the left that existed some years back. My grandfather's generation were treated worse than animals when working down the mine and the only defence they had was unity. My belief is that he'd be disgusted by the modern left who have hijacked the fundamental principle of workers' rights and perverted it into something truly loathsome and unrecognisable. My poor grandfather who died slowly and painfully of blacklung didn't seem to benefit much from 'white privilege'. God how I truly despise the left. I'll shut up now I've got that off my chest

>>12265467
I don't think they should. I agree with you, I think western, liberal mindsets were exploited by them.

>>12265464
AHHHHH I cant stand these motherfuckers....
we genuinely need a eugenics program at this point im thinking elon should say fuck it and work with the chinese the west could devolve into congo land for all i care as long as man is an multiplanetary species.

>>12265485
>>12265485
>It's worth remembering that the modern left does not resemble the left that existed some years back.

i know this,
when i meant left i mean progressives.
i consider myself right wing and i have little issues with classical liberals.

how i explain the right,classical liberal, progressive dichotomy

the right wing and classical liberals are in a car with $20 bux arguing about what to eat at mcdonalds but the progressive is in the back and is setting fire to the back seat of the car and saying he wants to goto paris on that same $20.

the only logical solution is to pull over and bludgeon this fucker the dea

>>12265518
*this fucker to death

>>12265518

>the only logical solution is to pull over and bludgeon this fucker the dea

Oh no, an ULA sniper got to hi

Wish the starship update would drop. Next few days will be internal nosecone work and engine swaps

>>12265546
surely they're not waiting 5 days for just a cryo test

>>12265497
Why do you think Elon wants genetic engineering? The catgirls are just a cover story to make the more politically moderate normies like him.

>>12265556
Expectations
>teehee look at this kawaii catgirl genetically engineered for domestic ownership

Reality
>Khan, begin total extermination of all subhumans

>>12265603
Elon
>Let’s make a virus that eliminates all people of Ashenkazi descent

>wait till they find out about moon covid

>>12265608
>Turn on news
>virus affected jews
>switch channel
> chyron reads Entertainment and Media industry in total collapse
>switch channel again
>hundreds of thousands of missing child sex slaves suddenly free

>>12265553
This is the first time doing the LOX header tank right?

>>12264947
>It's gonna carry a lot of fuel and the feds aren't going to be happy about that.
Well the FAA isn't. Jim is probably going to be watching the stream with us.

>>12264969
i wonder how soon before we see the dildo version of this in some thots butthole

>>12265650
no soon enough

Don’t all the 600hz fags realize the raptors were taken out because they have to do a crying test of the header tank?

>>12265666
>crying test
Don't torture my rocketfu, Satan!

>>12265666
Cryo*

Thoughts on Vulcan?

>>12265303
git's only up there for cargo delivery missions as far as we know.

>>12265672
It's a complete joke until they start doing partial reuse, then it's only half a joke.

>>12265666
>cope
checked hellposter, also nope, only 1 raptor taken out. they're keeping the others for cryo. just admit you fucking lost, 600hz bros win every fuckin time.

>>12265672
The second stage is where the interesting stuff will be.
>designed for indefinite refueling and reuse
>can be used for fuel depots or tugs
>variants can be made to serve as the basis of small craft and landers

>>12265686
Sure, Tory

>>12265650
>elong musk

>>12265680
All the raptors have been taken out, imbecile. Seethe.

>>12265686
didn't ACES development get put on hold or am I misremembering?

>>12265686
>can be refueled and repurposed later
is that a cope/excuse for leaving upper stages in orbit?

Who 600 hz here?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f9XSC84SnOc

>>12265696
ACES is dead.

>>12265696
It was put on hold, but they've revived the Cislunar 1000 thing now that Shelby's ability to cancel depots has been blunted
>>12265697
only when the upgraded stages are ready

>>12265672
Fake and Gay

>>12265694
oh dear, sounds like they have to replace all 3, even worse news for you. they all ate their turbopumps, 600hz reigns supreme. gonna be at least a month till hop now. screencap this

>>12265721
>months to replace some engines
that's not how it works around here jeff

>>12265702
Based, 600hz fellas be risin' up

>>12265706
Cislunar 1000 is popsci garbage, and ULA will never enable a single thing on that chart

>>12265702
Ah yes, the EEEEE

>>12265666
>th-they only removed the raptors to pressurize the header tanks
AHAHAHA, yeah okay retard. Enjoy your crying test you absolute sucker. 600 hurts don't it SpaceX stan?

>>12265739
>People shitting on SpaceX in SFG
Wtf?

Why do we even need to explore space when earth is perfect? I get that satellites, microwaves and teflon are useful but we already have them. Where are the benefits? What's in it for us? It's not like FTL travel is possible anyway so why bother?

>>12265702
Count me among them. SpaceX is strugglin.

>>12265744
because it's cool

>>12265706
>It was put on hold, but they've revived the Cislunar 1000 thing now that Shelby's ability to cancel depots has been blunted
Based.

>>12265744
FTL is for pussies, we be generation ship boiz. Also fuck urf

>>12265744
Earth is good now but that won't last forever. Abandoning space expansion is condemning the species to guaranteed death.

>>12265672
what's the point? It's less able than the Falcon Heavy in reuse mode.

And what's going on with the BE-4? Does anyone know how development is moving or no?

>>12265755
>we be generation ship boiz
Not even, we just need about 0.2c out of some meme drive and you can get to another star in one generation. Then we build laser light sail routes so you don't need an interstellar turbo-yeet to travel back and forth, just a few years of time and some sails.

>>12265761
IIRC Vulcan was being dreamed up before Falcon Heavy flew. Oldspace is just slow.

>>12265761
Tory reported (In August) that BE-4 is having issues

>>12265761
Still running engine rich despite being severely underperforming compared to Raptor

>>12265742
Paid BO shills

>>12265761
BE4 is cancelled, turbopump issues. Raptor is cancelled, 600hz issues.

>>12265749
Correct answer right here

Since when did sfg become legitimately anti SpaceX

>>12265779
It's still not. You're seeing shilling.

>>12265779
Get with the times pops, this is a ULA general now

They really to tune that 600hz burp to 432hz for that delicious healing factor.

>>12265744
>It's not like FTL travel is possible anyway so why bother?
Ok, Einstein, sure it's not.

>>12265783
>6 years ago
AHHHHHHHHHH I REMEMBER WATCHING THIS IN 7TH GRADE HAHA

>>12265721
This is SpaceX, not BE or even B*eing.

>>12265765
Is there a Delta IV heavy girl?

>>12265791
Lucky bastard. The biggest aerospace thing I saw in 7th grade was 9/11.

>>12265791
Bro don't you have standardized tests to be studying for?

>>12265797

>>12265765
>heavy
>not thicc
2 nukes weren't enough

>>12265805
She's bigger than her sister.

>>12265670
>600 hz braps in your face

>>12265814
imagine the sensation

>>12265768
Cry more lmao

>>12265779
>some people dont worship ol musky
First of all, half are just trolls. The other half are just keeping redditors in check

>>12265779
Because for a mission as big as space you need perfect product delivery. And only ULA can guarantee that.

>>12265838
How long has NROL-44 been on the pad at KSC?

>>12265739
>he doesn't know about the thrust sim

>>12265803
haw

>>12265814
Based, one day

>>12265805
Anything based on Falcon has to be tall and slim by definition.

>>12265836
those with an irrational belief in the idea that oldspace has a future are the r*dditors. you're at least right about the bait though.

>>12265841
>needing the thrust sim to pressurize the header tanks which dont experience those loads
You have to go back!

YEEEEE MOONBASES
https://twitter.com/GOP/status/1319715289328766980

>inb4 retards claiming Biden will win after promising to literally end the oil industry last night

>>12265849
Yeah those are the trolls. And you reply to them

>>12265851
learn to lurk fag

>>12265851
are you new here?

>>12265047
If they control both pitch and roll, wouldn't that make them Elevons?

>>12265854
>>12265849
Well maybe not you specifically. The royal you

>>12265783
What the FUCK this was in 2014???? I would have told you it was three or four years ago, max

>>12265850
Because there's definitely no forces on the ship when it makes its landing burn, right? There's definitely no plumbing whatsoever between the thrust puck and the headers.

>>12265863
They also control yaw and can translate the entire ship. Conventional aircraft terms don't work.

>>12265866
STOP REPLYING TO HIM

>>12265866
There is, but brainlets can’t comprehend that.

>>12265234
Religion is good, and should be promoted. Secularism kills society.

>>12265783
Ultimately, what did this accomplish?

>>12265875
blessed post

>>12265882
MONEY

>>12265882
The hype at the time was that they were testing Orions heat shield at lunar re-entry speeds but they have since completed redesigned the thing so it was literally pointless. Nothing about the Orion they flew has anything in common with the production version

>>12265874
>>12265866
t. armchair rocket scientist

>>12265851
>inb4 retards claiming Biden will win after promising to literally end the oil industry last night

Why don't republicans just make climate engineering their platform? Fossil fuels are off the hook and won't fight it. Sure it's more to the national debt, but republicans don't give a shit about the debt in practice and the money isn't for gibs. You get to build something cool and flex against nature. It would be like shooting down an asteroid. If it wasn't necessary at least you learned how to modify your planets temperature. You could also tie it to the potential use as a weapon. Imagine putting china in a perpetual winter lmao

>>12265425
The engine that did not honk was removed for being sus

>>12265897
They don't want to reveal how much weather manipulation the glowies can do already.

>>12265898

>>12265897
There's several promising carbon sequestration techniques out there too. Planting massive kelp forests in particular.

Of course if you just had cheap-as-fuck electricity you could just Sabatier all the CO2 out of the atmosphere.

>>12265903
>Of course if you just had cheap-as-fuck electricity you could just Sabatier all the CO2 out of the atmosphere.
Fracked LNG is so fucking cheap you'd need something like $0.001/kWh electricity to compete, but that's definitely true for other countries.

>>12265897
We literally need fossil fuels to have modern industrial civilization.

>>12265903
>Sabatier all the CO2 out of the atmosphere
>immediately release it back to get the fuck out

>>12265892
It was also ludicrously expensive.
Better mount an RL-10 to these CBCs and use them as expendable ultra high energy kickstage for Starship...

>>12265913
[farting mecha-squid intensifies]

>>12265742
It's SpaceXfags who believe the engines are in perfect condition vs SpaceXfags who think the engines ate themselves at a rate of 600 oofs per second, no boing shills here

>>12265913
>here's your electric rocket bro

>>12265912
Or just invent fusion...

>>12265744
Because 100 quintillion people in the solar system is a bigger number than 10 billion people

>>12265838
>perfect product delivery
Perfection doesn't exist, which makes it all make perfect sense now.

>>12265919
Lemme know when that works out lol

>>12265863
Nope, see >>12265868

>>12265744
>Why do we even need to explore space when earth is perfect?

To get away from fucking retards like you.

>>12265927
it better. even if we could burn all fossil fuels on earth at once, it aint gonna be enough to power a truly expansive galactic civilization

>>12265912
Sure, but only because modern industrial civilization doesn't have widespread use of high-temperature-output-primary-loop nuclear reactors.

>>12265919
Fusion doesn't make petrochemicals.

>>12265946
you can make petrochemicals from the fucking air if you have enough energy to throw at it

>>12265946
Energy from fusion can and will. Instead of carbon capture we can convert the entire atmosphere into crude. it's fuckin genius

>>12265942
No, because we use petroleum for fertilizers. We’re able to feed so many people with the amount of land we do because we make fertilizers from petroleum, and without this, fertilizer would get significantly more expensive if not unaccessible, and we’d have to return to an 1800’s level population if not lower.

>>12265744
Get the fuck out of this thread.

>>12265928
>see the post that already replied to me
t...thanks

>>12265954
nitrogen fertilizers are synthesized using the haber-bosch process and have been for more than a century. if you had cheap energy all you would need to make fertilizer would be air and water.

>>12265975
>nitrogen fertilizers are synthesized using the haber-bosch process and have been for more than a century

Using fossil fuels, yes. We get the hydrogen from natural gas.

>if

>Looks like something from your moms sock drawer
based

>>12265672
Looking forward to the Reunification!

>>12265981
Your argument is literally "We can't use [cheap energy] to make fertilizers because we need to use [cheap energy] for that. If we have economic fusion power, we can run high temperature electrolysis machines to generate as much hydrogen from water as we need, to feed Haber-Bosch reactors and Sabtier reactors to make all our nitrogen fertilizers and chemical fuel supplies, respectively.

>>12265986
It's not about the energy, fucking retard. It's about the chemical components.
>lots of hydrogen
>lots of carbon
You can either get these things from the ground or you can rely on living sources to slowly filter them out of the air and water. Kelp is the only thing that grows anywhere near fast enough to be a viable option and nobody's worked out the proper refining methods for kelp into petrochemicals yet.

>>12265986
>IF we have economical fusion power

That still doesn’t allow you to get the vast amounts of hydrogen we need.

>>12265989
>what is hydrolysis
>what is CO2 and a billion different methods of capture

>>12266000
>>what is CO2 and a billion different methods of capture
Most of the planet's carbon is still locked up in the ground. If it weren't, CO2 levels would be higher than they were in the Cretaceous. It's more efficient to extract it that way.

>>12265766
well shit. Is there something specifically challenging about methane engines that we don't know about?

>>12265767
>engine rich
this will never not be funny

>>12265995
https://www.usgs.gov/special-topic/water-science-school/science/how-much-water-there-earth

>>12265161
Jesus, you people do realize that the USSR was leftist and that fucking Xi sees himself as a marxist?

>>12266004
you can shovel in trees or wathever you have lying around too and as long as you aren't digging it up from underground it's not gonna increase overall CO2 levels, but getting all the carbon you need is easy as fuck no matter what method you're using if you have tons of energy to throw at it

>>12265882
it solidified once and for all that hydrogen 1st stages are a complete joke

>>12266012
>Xi sees himself as a marxist
Jesus christ the chinks are fucking delusional

>>12266016

>>12265995
>most abundant element in the universe
>where we gonna get it?
bro.......

>>12266012
>Jesus, you people do realize that the USSR was leftist and that fucking Xi sees himself as a marxist?

Never compare the Soviet Union and China to the fucking mongoloids that pass as leftists in the west.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baizuo

Very different kinds of people.

>>12266010
>is there something specifically challenging about methane engines
That there's only a few of them in development and no one's comparing notes. Also despite doomsayers, Raptor is progressing pretty smoothly - seems happy at 250 bar, slowly working its way to not shitting itself at 300

>>12266024
It may be abundant in the universe but that doesn’t necessarily mean abundant where we can access it. Earth is hydrogen and helium depleted because they’re light enough to escape earth’s gravity.

>>12266030
nigga what do you think water is made of

>>12265995
What part of high temperature electrolysis of water do you not understand, exactly?

>>12266025
>if chinks make fun of something stupid, they CAN'T be stupid themselves
chicom delusion

>Hur dur destroy all the water on earth to make fertilizer

>>12266030
Anons, imagine being this retarded

>>12266038
??? how the fuck much fertilizer do you need nigga

So elon basically confirmed that the starship update is going to be a write-up posted online

What was the point of painting this? To give the painters something to do?

>>12266040
We use like 20 million tons annually

How long do you fags give it until normies give up on Coronavirus and accept it’ll be endemic?

>>12265182
>double-teaming Gateway

>>12266038
We'd run out of nitrogen first, duh

>>12266044
>The ocean accounts for 0.022 percent of the total weight of earth, weighing an estimated 1,450,000,000,000,000,000 short tons

oh no, we'll use up 0.000000001379% of the oceans EVERY YEAR

>>12265982
Looks like an ICBM

>>12265192
Well then fuck this guy

>>12266042
Iteration, probably.

>>12266044
Do you realize that Earth's atmosphere contains about 4x10^15 tonnes of nitrogen?
Do you realize that Earth has ~1.4x10^18 tonnes of water?

>>12266044
Yeah, and? You do realize the Earth has just a smidgen more water than it does natural gas, right?

>>12266044
even if that was 20 million tons of water used every year that fits in a cube like 260 meters across, we ain't gonna run out of water any time soon

>>12266057
>>12266053
Not to mention that the hydrogen we use to make ammonia to make fertilizer doesn't disappear, it hangs around in the biosphere for a while until it finds it's way back out into the atmosphere/hydrosphere as water again, which we can reuse.

>>12266051
Potassium is the real short straw.

>>12266029
250 bar is still a respectable chamber pressure and could be sufficient for some mission profiles.
But given that Raptor is still in development, I'm pretty sure they are at the very least going to get it run near 300 reliably.

>>12266012
Marxism Leninism of Soviet bloc is fascist nazi ideology by modern standards, in USSR homosexualism was crime.

>>12266064
Phosphorus is a bigger issue if you want to fertilize several earths surfaces worth of acers.

If you dream of space exploration you're a traitor to the human race
>yearly NASA budget alone is around 40 billion USD
>globally more than 200 billion is wasted on space exploration every year
>that's less than what the west spends on aid to developing countries
>ensuring that no child starves to death would only cost 30 billion

Escapism is the most dangerous of all ideologies. The manchild dream of leaving our planet behind is what lets people rationalize destroying the Earth and ignoring the plight of the third world.
The super rich and their chosen followers escaping a ruined planet is starting to become a real danger. If we don't act now it might be too late. They're already lobbying for stealing more tax money the public desperately needs to fund their way out.
And no, they won't take you with them, /sci/.

Did they weld or attach nosecone?

>>12265192
>>12266055
to be fair sounded more sensible right after.

>>12265192
He's right though.

>>12266042
So that it looks based.

>>12266042
Other companies make mockups too. It's so that NASA and the astronauts can get a feel for the spacecraft and make suggestions. The companies will then take their suggestions into consideration before final product delivery.

>>12265262
At least the based Japanese did it right with Hayabusa.

>>12266093
Only thing he's right about is no humans on Mars by 2024

>>12266084
>>ensuring that no child starves to death would only cost 30 billion
No way it would cost that much to put a machete through the skull of every starving child

>>12266042
Pictures for website

>>12266101
Hayabusa was kino

>>12266077
>you will never be a space trucker hauling silicon-30 to the mercurian phosphorus forges and loads of phosphorus back out to the rest of the solar system

So why hasn't this fucker flown yet?? Every piece is made. Literally every piece.

>>12266100
>minecraft nozzles

>>12266104
http://www.fao.org/newsroom/en/news/2008/1000853/index.html

>>12266084
>ensuring that no child starves to death would only cost 30 billion
That's thinking short-therm.
We have an issue with overpopulation, especialy in countries where hunger is a big deal.
It sounds cruel as fuck, but mass-sterilisation would solve the issue by keeping the population levels sustainable.
Providing more food would only grow the population size and make it worse each generation.

>>12266100
Astronauts looking at starship and making suggestions:
>this is the coolest fucking thing I have ever seen Elon thank you

>>12266104

>>12266107
shooting the shit over CB radio about ufos with the rest of the space trucks in your convoy that all left in the same transfer window

>>12266108
This rocket is going to look like SHIT lmao

>>12266108
it's been flying for years anon. you just haven't noticed

>>12266084
Funny bait. Fuck third worlders lol

>>12266111
>2008

>>12266112
We don't have an issue with overpopulation, countries we can't do anything meaningful without political suicide due to "muh neocolonialism" are. The only thing to be done is to develop an independent state off-Earth capable of glassing their major cities.

>>12266113
>hey I called Buzz and some of the guys
>we sprang the old NERVA prototypes out of lockup
>they're in the truck over there with TIKI BAR ACCESSORIES written on the side
>think you can put some real engines on that baby rather than chemical RVacs?