/sci/ - Science & Math

>>12228843
You clearly aren’t depressed enough for you to feel it. Also don’t take anti depressants—our anguish is our silent glory

>>12228922
>You clearly aren’t depressed enough for you to feel it
ive been depressed and alone with it for years, my BDI score is 44 and i made plans to kill myself but i don't want to do it to whats left of my family.
If the next ones don't work i'll just give up on them, i'm just puzzled cause some people seem to be helped by them so well but i just feel tired all the time not even having the energy to do the chores that keep my mind distracted anymore

>>12228922
>our anguish is our silent glory
This is how mentally ill people think. It's toxic.

>>12228843
because only a minority percentage of depression is caused by an imbalance, which antidepressants are to fix. if they don't work on you, than your depression is due to other factors that you need to face and address since it's not a chemical imbalance for you

>>12228940
Antidepressants are toxic.

>>12228950
That does make sense, although most of those other factors are largely out of my control.
Never heard this from my shrink surprisingly, they just want to cycle my meds instead, till i find one that works

>>12228922
>Also don’t take anti depressants—our anguish is our silent glory
I had OCD, PTSD, very clear depression, and I did this for years. I highly recommend not doing it. I thought I was passing some great test by accepting the pain, humbling myself and growing by perservering. It's not a great test. You're just running in a circle for years. It's a gigantic delusion. You're waging a war in your mind which nobody will ever see. You're relegating your life to a psychological hamster wheel. I wasted several years of my 20s thinking all of it will pay off. It doesn't pay off. You eventually, finally, give up after years of daily hell, accept an SSRI and see a psychologist, have your realization that all of it was a delusion, cry over wasting all of that time willfully living in hell, and begin life as you should have years before.

>>12228979
your shrink is no different than a mechanic, you are a way for them to make money.

>>12228843
>the brain is an unidimensional system

>>12228979
you caring about those factors are in your control though, aren't they? why do you need to be in control of them anyway?
your overthinking and believing outside factors to be a definition of your life are your problems. start exercising, don't compare yourself to others or vice-versa, make lists of tasks for you to accomplish everyday, and set goals to start aiming towards. congrats, you're now on your way to fixing your depression.
every therapist / psychiatrist that is worth anything says that antidepressants are only for chemical imbalances. true therapy and restructuring your thoughts and actions is what works on a majority of depression cases. most people just blindly follow the therapist they have rather than changing til they find one that fits for them and they don't advocate for what's best for themselves since they don't know any better.

>>12228843
cuz it doesn't get you high
ketamine gets you massively fucking high hence it's super effective for depression
amphetamines get you high but for a certain group of people it normalizes them

>>12228934
I’m joking about that first part. I covered myself in gasoline multiple times and flicked a lighter as a sort of spin on Russian roulette. But I had an epiphany that, while it didn’t make me feel better, solved my suicide dilemma: continuing to live is my revolt against all the powers that oppressed me. My life is awful and would drive any sane man to self immolation; the cosmic, societal, and psychological forces created suicide inducing circumstances and a loathsome inescapable character. At first I thought that burning myself to death would be a revolt against this life and would be a culmination of my life of anguish but then I realised it was the opposite: that choosing to continue and live was the revolt against all the forces that command I kill myself. Now I see there’s no good reason to kill myself unless for glory but that can only be gained in truly intense anguish, one that transgresses the sanctity of consciousness, or glorify something else—like art or a statement. So unless you do something worthy of glory or have something worth saying, you have to live your anguish until you or it ceases. Our souls are already burning—go find a hobby and stop being such a baby; this anguish is what gives us purpose. I don’t know your circumstances(though I am interested in the genesis of your plight) I do know your character: you’re a nigger and fiend, reflect on your rationale and see how silly you’re being. Killing yourself only makes the bad feels stop because your brain is dead, but this consciousness, that can only be called god given in the freedom it allows, means we are not bound by anything but that said consciousness, which is infinitely cultivatable. The freedom we possess in our thoughts and mind cannot be tarnished by your petty woes—you make me sick.
>>12228940
anti depressants are gay—it’s for people who smoke weed for their anxiety

>>12229042
I'm still here aren't i, i didn't go through with it despite planning it. Most things i try seem to fall flat, and i do try a lot of things. Every old and new friend i make and get to know either goes his own way and chooses to forget my existence, perhaps because they don't see much to gain from being friends or simply choose to be with their better friends.
I already decided suicide is not the way to go so no need to call me a nigger, as i have decided not to be a quitter despite the prolonged desperation.

mental illness is fun, stop being a fucking bitch and enjoy the ride.

>take sertraline in a psych ward and within a day i feel good, have emotional depth, can think clearly, sense of humor and energy
>retards think I've gone manic because I'm so excited that after literal decades of depression I can finally feel like a human being
>switch me to risperdal, an anti-psychotic
>turn back into a lifeless robot with no focus, energy and only anger and apathy as emotions
>finally get those fucking retards with medical degrees to give me sertaline after switching between different dosage of a few antipsychs which all of them did nothing beneficial at best, at worse mafe me even more of a zombie
>take sert for 30 days and it does jack shit
>quit cold turkey and get a little bit of vertigo for a few weeks
Fuck the medical industry. They're all idiots and I wouldn't be surprised if the meds they give you arent sometimes swapped for literal sugar pills

>>12229065
Sorry for calling you the n word and fiend. Forget friendship and companionship—get a pet if you feel that lonely—focus on cultivating your consciousness. When I was trying to talk myself out of setting myself on fire I’d think about what I wanted in this life: and now that’s why I choose to revolt against this suicide inducing life. I want to live in Vermont or somewhere snowy like that where I read a lot and have a beautiful library in my house. A life where I wear a lot of black and eat cheese and dried meats. When I wanted to die I was still full of ambition and vanity—I wanted money and respect and a job I could brag about; I wanted a hot lover and powerful friends. I almost had those things so when through the faults of myself and other actors and systems in my life took the means to achieve what I had reached for my whole life away from me I thought that the only rational action was suicide. What I yearn for now is simple and lame, to live somewhere snowy and to read a lot, but it’s that simplicity that the secured that life. There will always be somewhere snowy and I’ll always be able to read. I can think and imagine and learn—what more do I need? I’ve suffered so immensely, some of these pains appear to me even in dreams, haunting me, that I can’t help but allow myself to compromise ambition and swallow my anguish wholeheartedly. Of course I don’t know what you suffer from but what’s left of my pride suggests that it can’t be worse than mine. I don’t mean to compete but rather you take this advice knowing it comes from a place of empathy: think about what you want, but more so what person you want to be. One can fill their hearts with the simplest things. Even jogging can give your purpose; classical music; literature; science; exerting your humanity through petty selflessness; the struggle itself can be enjoyed.

>>12229129
>within a day i feel good, have emotional depth, can think clearly, sense of humor and energy
>think I've gone manic because I'm so excited
You did.

>>12229165
It wasn't mania, moron. I exhibited no clinical signs of mania except being excited that I could finally think and feel properly. I've experienced mania before, btw, both on weed and lsd. What happened to me on sertraline was nothing like mania.

>>12229176
You don't see effects from SSRIs for weeks. You were manic.

>>12229192
It did nothing after trialing it for weeks. My personal subjective experience of mania beats out your assumption on reading my account of the situation. It was not mania

>>12229192
Is there anything wrong with mania?

>>12229204
(((They))) say its bad for you

>>12229197
Your mentally ill introspection vs basic assessments made by psyche-ward professionals. There are degrees to mania, such sudden elation is one of them; I also think you manic

>>12229212
>vs basic assessments made by psyche-ward professionals
who are paid to tell you you're crazy. next.

>>12229218
Methinks you’re experiencing an episode right now

>>12229151
Thank you friend, our dreams aren't so different. Reading and learning is nice, and maybe one day i could be doing it living in a small cabin somewhere rural and hilly. I hope you achieve yours.

>>12229212
'Basic assessments' made by fucking retards who only interview you for 30 minutes before kicking you out of the room and bringing in the next patient. They're lazy, you have nothing but conjecture and assumptions. It wasnt mania retard

>>12229197
If it did nothing after weeks then it clearly was mania and not the SSRI.
>>12229204
See a psychologist.

This is revealing to be a schizo thread so it's time to leave. Feel free to wallow.

>>12229222
ive been experiencing "episodes" since i was 10. im 30 now. i cant get enough of it. hope it never stops.

>>12229229
>See a psychologist.
for what? to listen to him tell me a bunch of shit i already know? fuck off with that shit.

>>12229229
No, it was a cascade of serotonin my brain was clearly lacking. You only parrot information from the so called experts without even personally knowing how it works. You do realize ssris have immediate effects to them right? They don't just magically take 4 weeks modify your reuptake, from the first pill you can see an effect as it immediately gives your brain more sertonin to work with.

>>12229223
Then what exactly is the problem? Why did you plan to an hero?

>>12229258
A very hard series of losing all my friends and a few others close to me in a short period of time, feeling of abandonment, insomnia, discovery of having blood cancer and a bunch of other things

>>12229265
The blood cancer sounds sad. That others stuff isn’t worth sweating over. I still have reoccurring dreams about all my “friends” telling me they didn’t like me and I’m awoken by memories of exclusion and rejection. I’ve also had insomnia my whole life and it’s sabotaged a lot of things so I know how you feel. Loneliness isn’t a good reason to kill yourself and sleep comes eventually—remember that when temptation comes. I hope you don’t live in America because the bills for blood cancer might actually be suicide worthy lol. Having no friends or people to talk to can be crushing but you acclimatise after 3-5 years, that’s why you gotta find a hobby that you can occupy yourself with; even consuming lowbrow media can fill the hole

>>12228843
Because they don't cure your disease, they're only a crutch in the case you keep throwing so much shit at yourself you cant get out of bed and can't stop crying out of nowhere.

Once you feel insipid, you have to work things out yourself, or with the counsel of the psychiatrist. The brain is too complex to say you'll get the meaning of life from chugging down pills, if you don't make changes to your worldview you won't make any progress.

>>12228843
You think people had to ask this question more or less often back when patented medicine was all about cocaine, cannabis, caffeine, and heroin combinations?

>>12229005
>begin life as you should have years before.
You just have a new circle of delusion to run for the next few years of being tortured by psychologists with neuroleptics.

>>12229010
Nah, mechanics actually fix the cars, its more like a politician or marketer who is there to make money by selling you ideas.

>>12229197
>. My personal subjective experience of mania beats out your assumption on reading my account of the situation.
Multiple psychologists diagnosing you with mania during in treatment beats out your anecdotal personal subjective experience.

>>12229204
Other people inevitable get harmed and inconvenienced when random maniacs over act and step out of line.

>>12229283
>sleep comes eventually
Sometime it comes in the form of death, many insomniacs have had organ failure and death from their disease.

>>12229504
No, it doesn't. First of all, I wasn't diagnosed with mania, the 2nd psych I talked to after leaving that ward, who had decades more experience than the team in that psych ward, correctly surmised what had happened to me there wasnt mania. Secondly, they cant diagnose you for shit by interviewing you with mostly rigid questions for 15-30 minutes you fucking retard. Eat shit and die you pseduo-intellectual assuming fuckface. You know nothing.

>>12229522
>. First of all, I wasn't diagnosed with mania
Enough so to change your meds.

>>12228843
because you arent depressed from the shit inside your head
its the world you live in that causes you to be sad
fucking with your hormones artificially would obviously only rarely work then

>>12229513
those random maniacs need to learn how to control their shit

>>12229614
If they could control their over activity and delusional excitement, they wouldn't be in a manic state.

>>12229621
bullshit

>>12229621
dietary control and code of conduct are all that is needed to keep the energies from adversely affecting others

>>12229625
Mania is literally defined as the inability to control yourself in those ways, though, and is the first step to a full blown psychosis.

>>12229635
Definitions of anything vary from person to person, professional to professional, and organization to organization. In my opinion, mania is just simply extremely powerful emotional energy. It is also my opinion that psychosis can be based in reality with practice.

>>12229634
>code of conduct
Why would a maniac conform to some earthly code of conduct when they have the entire universe in their brain telling them exactly what needs to be done in any given moment?

>>12229637
>In my opinion
That is bullshit, use a professional definition from an organization filled with people who study it rather than being a maniac who assumes your unchecked personal opinion is better than all those people's professional definition.

>>12229643
To not get locked up, killed, or ruin your status in a society that seems pretty worth conforming to. I like grocery stores and having shelter with walls and a door i can lock.

>>12229647
No.

>>12229651
Then you will stew in your own bullshit until you harm or inconvenience someone else again and are locked up by professionals with more established and consistent definitions.

>>12229652
Incorrect. Stop being a whiny bitch.

>>12229539
Stop speaking like you have any experience what-so-ever. This is embarrassing.

>>12229650
God died for your sins, stepping a bit out of line to save the soul of America or family is worth it to your typical maniac.

> I like having shelter with walls and a door i can lock.
A maniac would be perfectly fine breaking down those walls and busting in that door for an opportunity to wake you up from your comfortable sheeple sleep.

>>12229653
I have my own personal definition of whiny that hasn't been met yet, so I will do whatever the fuck I want until you can force me to do something else.

>>12229657
Not all maniacs are the same. You're generalizing. Don't do that.

>>12229656
Stop speaking like you didn't get labeled by a bunch of professionals as a bipolar maniac.

>>12229661
I ain't interested in forcing you to do anything, you can do whatever the fuck you want. I sure as fuck do lol

>>12229663
I didn't say all maniacs, I said a maniac and it would be a generalization on your part to say all maniacs don't do that.

>>12229664
I didn't though, I left with schizophreniform and depression, which after some time the specialists who treat psychosis even questioned if what happened to me was even psychosis. Eat shit faggot, you know nothing.

>>12229668
>and it would be a generalization on your part to say all maniacs don't do that.
It would, and i didn't and am not.

>>12229667
> I sure as fuck do (whatever I want) lol
Nah, basically admitted, you can't even control your own mania since your own strong emotions are in control.
>>12229625
>>12229637

>>12229679
>implying i'm not an oscillating conduit for varying emotional energies of which i have the power to organize

>>12229668
you said
>your typical maniac
implying there is a "typical" maniac. Which seems like generalizing to me.

>>12229674
Show us your diagnosis paperwork.

Psychosis is part of the diagnosis criteria for schizophreniform diagnosis anyway and if they are pairing that with depression, it is bi-polar by definition, just a more complicated version with more steps.

>>12228843

Good Goy!

>>12229687
There is a typical maniac, though or you wouldn't be able to have behavior based diagnostic criteria that can be used to create behavior profiles, diagnosis is a form of generalization and being a maniac means you fit the criteria of multiple generalized traits of mania.

Generalizing things on average is much different than saying all conform to that thing, but the words I used like God and soul saving also have multiple meanings that can be adjusted to fit many levels of mania anyway.

>>12229694
Good post.

Because they literally have said "We are not sure exactly about the mechanism. I found a strong one that did it for me (to be honest after 2 years I could feel stable effects). They gave me Duloxetine SNRI & it stopped the panic attacks.
It stopped my losing control but not too much about daily stress, burnouts & episodes of manic depression here and there.
Sleep was better. It's been a decade.5 I take it.

If what I hear about mescaline & mushrooms is true ((they)) are playing us for money instead of curing us with these medicines. Even lsd studies show incredible permanent effects.
But NO, we will treat you some of the symptoms so you will take the pill Jew forever.

>>12228940
I was going to say cringe, but that applies as well.

i mean if you take antidepressants but your life its still horrible in the day to day basis you aint gonna get much better

This thread is very mentally ill. I don't know who takes the cake: self immolation guy or manic dude

>>12230943
fight me nigga

>>12230952
Fighting the disabled is unbecoming

>>12228843
Emotional state is a complex network within the brain with multiple nuclei that uses a variety of neurotransmitters to function. Anti-depressants are a single molecule that affects a single neurotransmitter across the entire brain rather than a targeted region using a cocktail of neurotransmitter modulatory compounds. There is quite a lot of genetically encoded similarity between our brains but the ultimate composition will differ based upon the environments and experiences we grew up with, so an SSRI might be effective for one person yet ineffective for another. Anti-depressants are a one-molecule-fits-all pharmaceutical solution.

>>12228934
Because you're not just depressed because of a chemical imbalance.

You're depressed because you've had shit stuff happen to you and your mind has, predictably, struggled to cope.

The best thing for this is talking therapy of some kind, in combination with antidepressants. Not just pills

>>12228934
Anti-depressant will give you a break from feeling sad, but the thing you're sad about is still there you just can't access those feelings.
But taking a break from being sad is valuable, makes you realize HOW upset you are.
Take a diazepam or valium, not so much you fall asleep, and you'll realize what things are putting you on edge (because suddenly you won't be on edge).

With those two pieces of information (1) how sad you are, 2) the things bothering you in your day to day) you can get your feet under you.
Talk to somebody, doesn't have to be a health care professional; in my case suicide prevention hotline was very helpful because the guy on the other side had no vested interest (I wasn't paying him, wasn't his family member, etc) and could be rational and caring.
We only talked for like an hour or so but he made me realize there's good things about me, and things I'm good at, and those things are worth pursuing.

Also the whole planet being depressed as fuck over COVID really brightened my day, finally millions (or even billions) of people now living abnormal unproductive lives for months

>>12228922
>>12228843
Depression is just the lack of desire, your lives are just meaningless because youre too lazy to give meaning to it

>>12229005
the fact that sunbathing at midday reduces depression incidences tells me this is a nutritional problem like all other mental illnesses

>>12228934
There are other options out there for treatment besides antidepressants, you know. SSRIs are just a first line of treatment. This is a bit out of date and more treatments are available now, but it's a useful jumping off point for your own research and what things you might want to bring up with your doctor or psychiatrist.
https://slatestarcodex.com/2014/06/16/things-that-sometimes-help-if-youre-depressed/

>>12232803
I study in a university currently despite all of my shit so its hardly meaningless

>>12228843
Because they're a piss-ass substitute for the real cure, which is cognitive therapy, aka learning to deal with your own shit.
"""Antidepressants""" were originally intended to be short-term use only until cognitive therapy could start solving the underlying problem(s). But back in the 90's HMO's decisions were all being made by bean-counters, and shoving pills down someones' throat and sending them home was cheaper by far than hours and hours with a therapist. Nevermind that the shit is toxic as fuck over the long term so long as it save them money. So now the whole pharma-medical industrial complex makes billions every year off this shit regardless.
Meanwhile smart people realize that antidepressants are garbage and learn to deal with their problems rather than have their brains rotted away by shitty chemicals.

>>12229005
Hey anon, thanks for sharing your thoughts on this. I'm going through something very similar at the moment (PTSD and extreme contamination OCD, along with associated issues of anxiety, depression, feelings of guilt etc.). I've been battling on essentially without medication for several months since the event which lead to the PTSD, but even before that event happened I have struggled with these issues in some capacity throughout my life, particularly with obsessiveness. Same sort of age, in my mid-twenties and very conscious of the fact that I'm burning through the prime years of my life with all of this going on without genuine signs of improvement. I've seen a psychiatrist who prescribed an anti-psychotic (very low dose which I took for a couple of weeks, didn't seem to do much desu) as well as an SSRI (sertraline). I've been hugely reluctant to start taking the SSRI due to the number of negative side effects I've read about, and I have this idea that I can just push through it all on my own - i.e. continuously battle through this mental hell and eventually "conquer" all of my mental issues so that I can live a normal life like other people. After reading your post I'm now strongly questioning that idea. I'm not convinced that the psychotherapy I'm currently getting will help "fix" me in a meaningful way (I went to a psychotherapist for 8 months or so a few years back too, honestly don't think it did much back then either as I have a very rigid mindset), and this does not seem to be a situation I can handle on my own. So then, really what else is there? Maybe an SSRI is the way to go? The psychiatrist also made a provisional diagnosis of high-functioning Asperger's, which is perhaps a root cause of my inflexible thinking.

That's where I'm at with things. A few questions about SSRIs:
1. Which SSRI worked best for you?
2. How long were you/will you be on it for? Is it a lifelong medication for you?
3. How bad are the withdrawals after you stop using it?