/sci/ - Science & Math

borrowing the autolysis genes from elephants

>>11912874
>autolysis
How can elephants do this thing?

What is the difference between autolysis and autophagy ...

Why cure cancer when you could cure aging instead?

>>11912941
>could cure aging instead?
injecting a particular gene (don't remember which one) you can reverse aging
the problem is doing it without causing cancer

>>11912870
All solid tumor cancers need new blood vessels to grow, eat foods that are anti-angiogenic like turmeric and green tea, and this should help fight it.
Also take metformin + berberine + aspirin + curcumin everyday, eat a low protein mostly plant based calorie restricted keto diet, get a lot of sleep and reduce stress, do hardcore prolonged fasting and take full spectrum cannabis oil.
Also immunotherapy>chemotherapy.
There are many more supplements you can take but I'm too tired to try and remember them..
Also the source is my ass

>>11912870
Nanotech or immunotherapy if I had to guess

>>11912870
i truly beleve the future generations will laught at us and see us as fucking retarded chimps for using "chemo" to treat cancer.
thats the biological equivalent of nuking a city to kill a couple people.
its insane.
>>11912876
i beleve the immune system plays a major role in it.
>>11913414
no
>>11913565
this is pseudo science, there is no known way to dodge cance, your best bet is screening.
most cancers are slow growing and can have a full recovery if taken care of early.

>>11912870
Getting rid of the western diet and studying blue whales.

>>11913576
>Nanotech
this one seems very likley

>>11913704
>your best bet is screening.
How do you screen for certain kind of cancers without TAC harmful radiations?

>>11914187
MRI are not harmful

>>11914212
>MRI are not harmful
it' always radiation you are giving to your body.. you can't never know what will it do to your body... it's less harmful than CT scans but it's always harmuful.... if you want to catch it early you should be doing MI scans every year

>>11913704
>this is pseudo science, there is no known way to dodge cancer
Very wrong, there are many know ways to decrease risk of cancer, and there was very little pseudo science in the stuff I told you.

>>11914235
>it' always radiation you are giving to your body
maybe you should check how MRI work

>>11912870

>>11915528
>maybe you should check how MRI work
don't be so sure about what is harmful and what is not
100 years ago cigarettes were supposed to be healty and they were sponsored by phisicians

>>11914843
>there are many know ways to decrease risk of cancer
fasting is indeed one of them.. but it's unpleasant
why don't nwanotech speed up?
nanotech is the only way

>>11912870
Mapping everyone's unique and individual genome and throwing millions of dollars of research at each case, using similar cases of similar genomes with the same type of cancer as stepping stones.

Most cancers are caused from an imbalance in your bodies fluids/nutrients/all that crap. Maybe you had too much glutamine and that caused a cell to not properly replicate the growth inhibitor.
Maybe you got a cell with a blocked receptor thinking it doesn't need an actuator for seeking a protein that feeds an inhibitor that keeps another inhibitor in check, and good luck rooting through all that before it spreads further

>>11916173
>Most cancers are caused from an imbalance in your bodies fluids/nutrients/all that crap.

>>11914843
The easiest way is to kill the source.
The source is YOU (No, not you but a human body).

>>11916173
>>11916177
what causes cancer ?
Smoking and other things is only 10-20%
It seems casual
Can we say that stress plays a role?

>>11916173
>Most cancers are caused from an imbalance in your bodies fluids/nutrients/all that crap.
how to avoid that?

>>11916235
Have you heard of mutations?
Mutations are good and bad. Mutations are the reason why natural selection takes place and also directly correlates with the success of species.

Mutations happens in many ways. Some are UV, toxins, random mutations.
UV is from the sun and is literally unavoidable.
Toxins are mostly from foods and thus can be avoided/
Random mutations are, well random. You occur because cells sometimes incorrectly read and write your DNA. Normally when such inconsistencies occur, apoptosis happens. Sometimes, these rogue cells are able to circumvent this process and grow and multiply, unbounded and unguarded. This is cancer.
Your body is 99% capable of avoiding cancers. 1% slip out and are the reason why cancers are widespread.
Genetics do play a role. To what extent is actually unclear.
The underlying mechanism if cancers is fairly complex.

You might find it interesting that it is generally expected that, the larger the animal, the higher the probability of that species suffer from cancer. In reality, this is untrue and it's actually lower for elephants than humans. This is also called as Peto's paradox.

>>11916265
I asked about stress. What could you tell me about that?

>>11916235
wtf are you talking about? 90% of lung cancer are caused by smoking

>>11916365
no only 20% of people who smoke develope a cancer

>>11916235
>>11916365
>>11916445
X% of people who smoke get cancer is not equal X% of all cancer out there is from smoking
>>11916235
but to answer your question anon
I think it's mainly smoking, air pollution, garbage food, obesity, stress, microplastics in food and water, and exposure to radiation and general various carcinogens if I had to guess..

>>11912870
raw meat, hence the bear

>>11916552
>stress
how can stress relate to cancer?

>>11916568
Constant stress and cortisol hurt the function of your immune system.

>>11916663
>Constant stress and cortisol hurt the function of your immune system.
How can you check if your immune sistem is not doing good?
Can frequent sickness be a way to understand?

>>11916946
yes.
Also get your WBC and RBC count checked on a yearly basis.

>>11916445
Are you for real?!
https://www.cdc.gov/cancer/lung/basic_info/risk_factors.htm

>>11916327
Stress is linked, but not directly. It's one of the causes, but nothing says that if you have stress, you'll also get cancer. In fact the opposite can happen too.
My grandmother had literally zero stress (she stayed at home, never worked). But she still passed away from pancreatic + lung cancer.
She also had diabetes which was probably the one of the reasons for pancreatic cancer. Her lung cancer most likely spread from pancreatic tumors.

>>11917078
>>11916552

>>11912870
Electromagnetic fields, or biomimetics and synthetic biology. Herbalism and fasting as well, stuff like baking soda and forcing CO2 into superficial tumors. mmWaves for superficial tumors as well.

See also Novocure and tumor treating fields.

>>11912870
Dichloroacetic acid (DCA)

Or any other agent that causes cancer cells to commit apoptosis by turning back on the mitochondria and thereby releasing cytochromes.

But of course big pharma prefers expensive treatment

Pic related from a mysteriously discontinued Canadian study

>>11916235
Try growing a plant near a WiFi router. It won’t grow. Here’s a very big reason. Also carcinogenic microtoxins are abundant in drinking water, air and many consumable products.

>>11912870
Nanotech or regulating body acidity since acidity seems to cause cancer

>>11917137
I'd like to try it, but I don't want wi-fi and don't have the means to build an anechoic exposure chamber.

>>11917088
You're wrong too.
Statistics and studies shows that smoking does cause cancer

Best way to avoid cancer is to die young


Immunotherapy suffers when it comes to solid tumors (as opposed to liquid i.e. leukemia) if the TME is poorly oxygenated i.e. poor inner vasculature/high necrosis, and this also fucks w/ tissue penetration of anticancer drugs (i.e. periphery of tumor which is more mitogenic will uptake tumor drug and die leaving vasculature to provide for growth of more peripheral cells).
Infiltration of "good" immune cells increases efficacy of immunotherapy as they help denote where a response should be directed. Tumors have a nasty habit of co-opting surrounding stroma to produce signaling used in long-term wound healing and to shut down key aspects of inflammatory response that triggers cytotoxic immune response while keeping aspects of inflammatory response which are beneficial i.e. hyperactive fibroblasts. This collagen production can also increase interstitial pressure making passive diffusion of drugs more difficult. There's also evidence that the hypoxia can increase interstitial pH which not only adds charge to drug, hindering membrane diffusion but can also cause issues w/ immune cells and other things.

Good news: there seems to be a key component of the major histocompatibility complex which does not appear to be easily "mutated away". There's a 2020 paper (I think in nature) that goes over this much better than I ever could

>>11917266
The paper I'm referencing is:
"Genome-wide CRISPR–Cas9 screening reveals ubiquitous T cell cancer targeting via the monomorphic MHC class I-related protein MR1"
Published in Nature Immunology 21, 175-185 (2020)
it's the closest we've come thus far to a "silver bullet" which i always regarded as a fantasy mickey-mouse pipe dream bullshit notion

>>11917266
I think we're 10 years away from a better treatment
i can't beleve we still use the same garbage we did in the 50!
chemo is literal poison

>>11917317
The reason chemo is still in widespread use is despite the risks, hazards, and scorched-the-earth mechanism of action, it's still got the best track overall record even compared to cutting edge treatments, particularly when you exclude liquid tumors as immunotherapy techniques such as CAR-T are more effective for liquid tumors. Like it or not, chemo is in use for a very good reason.

>>11917182
Holy hell you're retarded.

>>11917048
>get your WBC and RBC count checked on a yearly basis
why this?
I have red that you can'y detect tumor by blood analysis

>>11917098
>fasting
it's unpleasent way
>>11917098
>Electromagnetic fields, or biomimetics and synthetic biology
E magnetic field is different from modern radiation? Why?
Why synthetuc biology?

>>11917123
>Pic related from a mysteriously discontinued Canadian study
how do they induce tumors in rats in order to study?

>>11917123
>Or any other agent that causes cancer cells to commit apoptosis
for example?

>>11917147
>body acidity
what you mean? do you mean gastric acidity also or is it an acidity in the cells?

>>11917293
so is CRISPR the way to go?

>>11918344
Lower WBC means you have a weak immune system.

>>11917147
>>11917147
>Nanotech or regulating body acidity since acidity seems to cause cancer

>>11916124
There's no radiation involved you retard

>>11917362
>CAR-T are more effective for liquid tumors
why?

>>11918580
>There's no radiation involved
What do you know about magnetic fields and what they cause to the dna eh? There aren't enough studies about MRI scans consequences

>>11918693
Agreed. But the benefits outweigh the risks.

>>11918710
>the benefits outweigh the risks
yeah but they inject that substance and it has been shown that substance stays in the brain even 10 years after the Mri

>>11918780
Which is better?
10 years of benign fluid floating in your head
OR
10 years of pain and suffering from cancer?

>>11912941
Cancer might be the cure to aging if you can manage to direct it constructively and turn it off when you need to.

>>11912870
Bleach or maybe they could shine high doses of Uv inside the body

>>11918242
Great argument you dunce.

>>11917362
i'v seen somewhere that there is immunotherapy for prostate cancer is already available and working, and soon therapy for liver cancer will be available too

>>11918783
>10 years of benign fluid floating in your head
who says it's benign?
Who says that it can't alter the dna in your cells?

>>11918985
>munotherapy for prostate cancer is already available and working
% of remissions at stage 4?

>>11919250
It sure as hell can. But my question is, do the risks involved, outweigh the benefits?

>>11918783
Why did you make such a stupid post? Most cancers don't last 10 years. And why were you incapable of acknowledging the retention of contrast agents without tacking on "benign"? Gadolinium is not benign,you fool.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Splitting_(psychology)
Here you go, this is you. Grow up. Learn to think and converse with others properly. If you can't even admit to the well established toxicity of gadolinium, you have absolutely no business talking about risk assessment. It's not risk:benefit, it's risk:risk. Risk of doing something vs risk of doing nothing.

>>11919250
Gadolinium acts as a calcium channel blocker, and being highly paramagnetic, probably exerts various other effects as well. It's mostly retained in the cerebellum and spleen.

I regret believing in the medical system greatly. Bear in mind, whenever you got to a doctor, this guy's thought process is what you're dealing with.
>>11919267
Look at how you can't tack him down, and he keeps looping back and double down. Very poor, narrow thinking.

>>11913565
Stop reading women's magazines from the checkout lane. All of this is irrelevant hocus pocus nonsense

eating curry does not prevent cancer retard

>>11919290
>diet doesn't matter.
Get out. Like the other guy, you don't belong here. Learn how to think. Starting here, you traumatized little thing:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Splitting_(psychology)

>>11919257
stage 4 prostate cancer isn't really prostate cancer anymore. its multiple cancers

>>11919293
>you said my magic herbs and extreme medical diet wouldn't cure cancer, so you're saying diet doesn't matter at all!
Your entire shtick here is pilpul and fallacy. You collect arguments and throw them at the wall to see what will stick, and that doesn't make anything you say true, nor does it make you intelligent

>>11919305
And yet you still cannot engage with the topic. I bet you've never read a single paper on phytochemistry or pharmacology.

Let me be the bigger man here and give you some help:

First, let us define curry.
I'm going to assume in general the core elements are turmeric, cumin, coriander, ginger, and perhaps cayenne.

Next, we're going to go on over to pubmed.
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/?term=turmeric&sort=date
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/?term=cumin&sort=date
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/?term=coriander&sort=date
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/?term=ginger&sort=date
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/?term=cayenne&sort=date

From here we'll review the data on their constituents, any human trials available, and the related pharmacology and pharmacokinetics. If possible we'll try to establish a dose response curve (which will likely be nonlinear).

Lastly, we'll weigh this against what we know about tumor initiation and tumor promotion, weigh it against other dietary and lifestyle factors, and so forth. From this, we'll find a net benefit to a consistently healthy, high quality diet. We will learn to think with this nuance instead of being retarded and filling every space we lay eyes on with our substanceless retardation and half measures. We will learn to make our case, or shut our mouths.

Have fun.

>>11919275
>Gadolinium
Then tell me an alternative method of detecting cancers?

>>11919374
Iron, manganese, other methods which identify markers of abnormal metabolic activity. Gadolinium is not special in these regards, it's simply paramagnetic.

>>11919381
Could you please link a study or a paper which involves the use iron or manganese?

I think we know how to reverse most cancers already but so much money is made from treatments.

>>11919381
Alright I found some.
Then why is Gadolinium popular if it has supposedly known health risks?

>>11919275
>Grow up. Learn to think and converse with others properly
Why are you telling me this? I've experienced cancer vicariously and I know how fucking painful it is.

>>11919416
>Then why is Gadolinium popular if it has supposedly known health risks?
I'm not going to start listing previous medical "mistakes" where an intelligent subset knew it was mistake from the getgo, were ignored by the idiots and industrialists, then a decade or two later it became a symbol of man's arrogance and folly (only to begin the cycle again). Thalidomide, diethylstilbestrol in milk, radium in water. I have come to think most people cannot view the world this way, because it is far too terrifying. they want to think it's all int he past. Not so.

>Why are you telling me this?
Because it's what you need to hear. So have I, by the way.

>>11919436
>I'm not going to start listing previous medical "mistakes" where an intelligent subset knew it was mistake from the getgo, were ignored by the idiots and industrialists, then a decade or two later it became a symbol of man's arrogance and folly (only to begin the cycle again). Thalidomide, diethylstilbestrol in milk, radium in water. I have come to think most people cannot view the world this way, because it is far too terrifying. they want to think it's all int he past. Not so.
So your claim is that our life is filled with 'toxic chemicals' that humans have over time taken for granted and now it's labelled as safe but in reality, it never was? And in this due process man is touting scattered benefits over its now shrouded risks?

>>11919436
>So have I, by the way.
wdym?

>>11919456
>So your claim is that our life is filled with 'toxic chemicals' that humans have over time taken for granted and now it's labelled as safe but in reality, it never was?
In large part yes.

>wdym
> I've experienced cancer vicariously and I know how fucking painful it is.

>>11919461
>In large part yes.
But you do know that nature is constantly trying to kill you? We have developed resistance to fight them but some battles are lost.

P.S. No, I'm not trying to conflate 2 different ideas.

>>11919461
>vicariously
is it painful? why?
could you explain?
don't they give you morphine?

>>11919797
I don't really understand the question.

>>11919803
you told
''how painful cancer is''
And asked you is the suffering so unbearable that you can't cope with morphine?

>>11919968
Once metastasis has reached the point where your spine has begun to break down and looks like a sponge and your organs are peppered, there's not much you can do. Who wants to live on painkillers anyway?

>>11919990
>Who wants to live on painkillers anyway?
Once the cancer is at that point is basically a death sentence. At that point the only thng you want is to pass away peacefully and not being in pain
Since you had a death for cancer in your life and you could observe... then is it painful to pass away in that way or painkillers help you? at which degree?
For example I have red horrific stories about bone metastasis

>>11919990
>Who wants to live on painkillers anyway?
me

>>11920008
My father never sought out painkillers until the very end. I actually suspect he was killed by the amount of Dilaudid they gave him.

Anyway, I don't know what the point of this conversation is. People's behavior will differ.

>>11920038
>I don't know what the point of this conversation
Just to understand how much the efficacy of palliative care. sorry for your loss anon.

>>11918354
Literally stitch a tumor from another source on the rat.

>>11918359
Certain Indian peppers, such as long pepper.

>>11920193
why do animals don't get tumors so often?

>>11920038
>I actually suspect he was killed by the amount of Dilaudid they gave him
That's usually how it happens, OD is better than septic shock

>>11920288
Not their decision to make.

>>11920245
>>11916265
>You might find it interesting that it is generally expected that, the larger the animal, the higher the probability of that species suffer from cancer. In reality, this is untrue and it's actually lower for elephants than humans. This is also called as Peto's paradox.

>>11920300
it's because elephants have that gene that makes autolysis

>>11920300
Humans are an abnormal animal.
>No neu5gc
>No vitamin C produced in the liver
>Shitty ass diet combined with uniquely foolish behaviors and environmental toxins
>Vaccinations (deactivating the immune system early in life, viral contamination like SV40).
>Electromagnetic fields (tumor promoter and initator)
>Lack of eg B17, which other animals get from grasses, seeds, soil microbes, etc.

The list goes on. Study would be most productive between small long lived species (like parrots) and large long lived animals like bear, elephant, and whale. With humans we have no control group. Everything has had some weird shit done to them.

>>11920529
>Lack of eg B17
how is this lack related to cancer?

>>11920698
Cancer cells express an enzyme in high levels which cleaves off the cyanide portion, thus killing the cell. Not unlike how the body turns synthetic B12 (cyabnocobalamin) into regular B12.

>>11920724
(and that enzyme is nagalase iirc)

>>11920529
>>Electromagnetic fields (tumor promoter and initator)
need sauce for that one

>>11913565
steve jobs?

>>11920736
https://www.mediafire.com/folder/dj875cd10yb72/EMF
See the top text file "-Documents, links[...].txt". Ctrl+f "NTP" (National Toxicology Project). There's also a cancer section and DNA damage / repair enzyme inhibition section further down. Should be enough there for an introduction into the topic. The other files are supporting documents which are not trivially available elsewhere.

>>11920724
so basically b17 (the vitamine in the meat) is supposed to prevent cancer
but meat itself causes cancer
so....?

>>11920744
So Mri scans are dangerous?

>>11920760
To my recollection only grass fed meat will have B17. Grains don't provide it. I don't recall if this is a direct matter, or a biogenic avenue via a ruminant's intestinal flora. I think the former though.

>>11920761
MRIs are definitely biologically active, but I'm not sure about any long term dangers from a single scan (say at 1.5 or 3T) for the patient. Chronic exposure to the static field for the technicians and staff is more obviously dangerous.

The contrast agent is probably the most immediate danger. Regardless, when they say something like "you come out the same way you went in" (compared to ionizing radiation) it's definitely false, and having had both a 1.5 and 3T MRI I can say that I did notice a temporary change of mental state. Literature on temporary remission of clinical depression in patients, and working memory impairment in staff that are around the permanent magnets all the time, is not that far fetched when you consider the broader literature on these fields.

>>11920529
>>Vaccinations (deactivating the immune system early in life, viral contamination like SV40).
Killing yourself early in life? Doesn't vaccinations help add antibodies to the immune system so that it can fight diseases like polio and other shit for which if you don't vaccinate,you'll suffer from it's effects for life.

>>11921252
Nope.

>>11921254
Then what does a vaccines do?

>>11920779
which tecnique of screening does exist which is not so invasive?

>>11921266
Puts who knows what into your muscle tissue alongside potent immune stimulants with the goal of creating an antibody which may or may not do what you want and only what you thought you wanted (ie without side effects). Data has shown for many years now that antibody levels rapidly drop after vaccination and are often trivial after 7 years. Children who are malnourished and living in squalor have a higher total death rate (generally of other diseases) compared to children who were simply left alone. Other than this, vaccines are treated as a Holy and protected class that can do no wrong, which is simply irrational and not supported by data and a position which obviously has no place in science. Vaccination is a pseudoscientific quackery built on a priori notions and perhaps even narcissistic and psychopathic arrogance. Nothing more, nothing less. I regret (and at times resent) being vaccinated, and would not vaccinate my children nor would I offer any support of any kind to the practice. It's a cult ritual and it's long since time to stomp it out so we can move forward and towards treatment modalities that actually work without causing more harm than good.

Strong, unpopular opinions? Sure. But there it is.

>>11921293
Depends what you're looking for. IR (thermal) and body voltage related methods exist now. In the future, magnetic fields and perhaps in limited cases, mmWaves are feasible. eg in mammography, instead of bombarding (young) women's breasts with 2 years worth of background radiation all at once, you can use RF or low frequency magnetic fields to detect tissue with abnormal properties.

>>11921325
What about polio? It has no known cure either than vaccines.

>>11921328
Papers were published during the polio days reporting sodium ascorbate (with if I recall copper salicylate) injections would cure polio and even partially reverse it when into the flaccid paralysis stage. Polio itself only became an issue after environmental toxicity reached a certain level (diethylstilbestrol in milk and in pregnancy, mercury from various sources, organochloride pesticide exposure, etc), sugar in the summer months, and other vaccinations suppressed the immune and elimination systems. Polio rates were steadily decreasing before the last blip, the polio epidemic (see eg "Cutter incident"), which just happen to coincide with work done at the Rockefeller Institute for Medical Research on weaponizing it.

>>11921347
Early work on the matter, just found by quickly googling.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2133810/

>>11921347
>>11921352
So why do we still vaccinate?

>>11921353
Money and power.

>>11921354
Don't NGOs provide vaccines, or so I've heard?

>>11921354
(also saving face of course, implicitly)
It's part of a broader religion.

>>11921357
They have many strong, if not primary interests in vaccination programs. They also profit heavily indirectly, which is how charity can cause your net worth to increase once you're at a certain scale and level of diversification.

>>11921360
In that case these NGOs should provide treatment at the same cost as vaccines.

>>11921360
>Apart from such considerations, the experimental work, at this stage, left us with certain definite questions that called for further investigation. Obviously, there was a need, first, for determining whether the more viru- lent and more invasive RMV strain of virus was equally susceptible to inactivation in vitro by vitamin C as was the Aycock strain.
Literally from the paper you linked.

>>11921387
I'm not sure what should be done about the NGOs, ideally people just stop listening to them and their proxies and treat them as what they really are. In the active sense, the simplest (and most tempting) approach would be to simply seize and repurpose the assets of those who are using them as a front, as well as holding anyone involved responsible for fraud and damages.

>>11921395
I don't follow.
>Early work on the matter, just found by quickly googling.
You'll have to look furthe if you're interested.