/sci/ - Science & Math

Because Americans are too stupid, don't care, have a slave mentality(ironic) and are loud.

They only care when it happens to them

>>11670723
It doesn't make any sense...
I thought countries like Morocco would be fucked because of the virus...
but they realized that their medical capacity was very low, and they had to lockdown everything

as a result, they dont have more than a few hundred deaths iirc

and now they're starting to re-open the economy

When will Ameri-tards learn?

>>11670716
America will re-open because it's an oligarchy run by the richest parts of corporate industry.

Conservatives believe that America is free because people own guns and don't pay much in taxes, but they're literally clamoring at the doors of state capitols for legal permission to literally sacrifice their lives by starting a service job during a deadly pandemic. The overwhelming majority demographic at these anti-lockdown protests are fat, obese white men, who stand to roll a 1/10 chance of death should they actually contract the virus.

>>11670734
>fat, obese white men
fat, old white men*. corrected for redundancy.

>>11670737
Wow that's pretty crazy bro

But I don't recall asking

>>11670741
asking what?

>>11670744

>>11670716
>>11670723
>>11670734

People who give up liberty for safety deserve neither - Ben Franklin

If you are scared stay home you fucking pussies, don't worry about what anyone else is doing you retarded fucking cucks

>>11670752
>People who give up liberty for safety deserve neither - Ben Franklin
there are literally thousands of laws on the book that restrict certain aspects of your civil liberties for public safety

Ben Franklin wouldn't have sided with anti-lockdown protesters. his son died from smallpox and he lived the rest of his life in regret for not innoculating him.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2653186/

"In 1736 I lost one of my sons, a fine boy of four years old, by the smallpox taken in the common way. I long regretted bitterly and still regret that I had not given it to him by inoculation. This I mention for the sake of the parents who omit that operation, on the supposition that they should never forgive themselves if a child died under it; my example showing that the regret may be the same either way, and that, therefore, the safer should be chosen"

>>11670744
based.

>>11670766
civil liberties are for citizens not sovereigns bitch I dont give a fuck what is on the books, they don't apply to me and you are a fucking moron if you think Ben Franklin thought the Constitution was just for "when things are like cool and shit bro but not when they're like not cool and shit bro". You are stupid af stfu

>>11670771
>I dont give a fuck what is on the books, they don't apply to me
no sovereign citizen has ever actually read the constitution. you morons cite shit like the magna carta to traffic cops and wonder why you get tazed and sent to the county jail for disorderly conduct

this is my favorite video. go recreate it so that I have new content to watch
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RfVbiefMdNU

>>11670779
kys

amerisharts only think about sharting their pants in public so they try to maximise this by going outside, and they get aggressive if their sharting is slowed

>>11670782
if I kill myself then I can't watch you get tazed on youtube in a couple of months

>>11670716
>>11670723
>>11670734
>15 posts, 6 posters
samefag glownigger confirmed

>>11670789

(>>11670734) reporting in. the others aren't my handiwork, sovereign shit-tard

>>11670791
Oh so let's see you just made this thread and started same fagging it and had a response/argument ready to go for when someone inevitably posted that Ben Franklin quote, which I am sure you have to run into with your psyop attempts on other social media platforms.

You also know about "sovereign citizens", which is an oxymoron btw, I am not a "sovereign citizen" I am just a plain ole sovereign, one of the people, just like the Constitution specifies. Did you think people would believe this all just one big coincidence? ROFL, How fucking stupid you think the people on this board are? Bad question most of them are stupid af I know, but not everyone. How did you think you would do these things and not get spotted immediately? Jesus Christ this is you tax dollars at work anons.

>>11670791
Oh and I forgot I prefer this video myself you fucking retard

https://drive.google.com/open?id=1v8BNuxyK7odm2LH2EPRH8bZv9wk8DN7t

take your rookie ass back to boomer faceberg and twatter

>>11670730
American think everything is a conspiracy and that the government is out to get them.

>>11670850
Actually that is just smart people, because smart people like read and shit and know history and there is not a smart person who ever lived that trusted government and for good reason, and thtey wrote lots of books about it in fact. Being a zoomer retard not surprising you wouldn't know this

>>11670716
What mental image should this closed eyes tongue out face up image invoke?
What did she mean by this?

>sovereign citizens
can we not go this low? thanks

>>11670812
Him adding in that Ban Franklin's kid died from not getting vaxxed was a nice touch too anon don't forget that. The fact that he apparently found all that information within 8 minutes of your post is quite impressive as well.

>>11670915
>>11670779
http://esotericawakening.com/critique-and-inspection-qa

>>11670771
>civil liberties are for citizens not sovereigns bitch I dont give a fuck what is on the books, they don't apply to me and you are a fucking moron if you think Ben Franklin thought the Constitution was just for "when things are like cool and shit bro but not when they're like not cool and shit bro". You are stupid af stfu
holy fuck i love this anon

A vaccine isn't really in sight, so a lockdown can only function to keep hoapitals under capacity, right? And last I checked hospitals are still doing fine, so the only real benefit of locking down harder would be to delay cases until we have a better understanding of treatment.

>>11670716
MER and SARS are still reported Internationally. And still don't have vaccines.

The guidelines for both are simply hygiene and social distancing when you're sick, that's it.

Meanwhile, you so much as cough and the whole country has to shut down.

>>11670716
>Why don't people understand that the whole point of a lockdown is to ensure the spread of cases of a disease?
Do you mean to slow the spread? Because that's the important part.
It's not about waiting for it to be eradicated because it never will be without a vaccine. It's not about infecting less people—the time for containment was when China was still lying about the disease and hundreds of thousands of people were moving through Wuhan daily. Now it's about making sure nobody dies for a lack of available health resources like ventilators and hospital beds. "Flattening the curve" does not mean containing or stopping the spread of the virus. A flattened curve has the same exact number of infected spread out over a longer time for the specific purpose of not overburdening healthcare infrastructure.
The lockdown is no longer protecting healthcare infrastructure (it is, in fact, destroying it) nor is it ensuring fewer people get infected because that was never the point in the first place. It is now a placebo which is incredibly dangerous because there is no statistic or metric that can be studied to lift the lockdown if nobody understands its purpose.

op is a female

I won’t argue that the handling of this has been relatively not great but how exactly do you guys think this would’ve/should’ve gone?

America, specifically NYC which is the epicenter of the outbreak, is probably the world’s single largest transit and commerce hub. The inflows and outflows of people in a place like New York from all over the world in a single day are just insane and all of it runs on an infrastructure which necessitates free and open mobility. There was never any chance of containing a virus to just a few hundred places in a place like New York City and nearly as little chance of being able to contain and treat it. You can’t just build up the necessary conditions to contain something like this overnight. If you’re going to take an issue with something, don’t take issue with the treatments. Take issue with the American “immune system” that makes it so susceptible to an outbreak in the first place. It just doesn’t make any sense to me. Everyone seems to want this system in the first place and then bitch and blame when it goes wrong.

>>11670716
IT IS JUST A FLU
YOU FUCKING ROASTIE

>>11671394
>It just doesn’t make any sense to me. Everyone seems to want this system in the first place and then bitch and blame when it goes wrong.
When this is all over we should compare rankings of efficacy of covid response with rankings of civil liberties afforded to citizens. I'm confident there's an inverse relationship that needs to be understood is no mistake. Seeing people sincerely and unironically attack civil liberties lobbies and say things like "we need big brother during a pandemic" kills me. No suspension of civil liberties is ever temporary. See: PATRIOT act, just entering it's 15th year past when it was supposed to be phased out.

>>11670716
>averge corona death is around the life expectancy
and that's all you need to know about this "pandemic"

>>11670716
Covid 19 has a .01-.03 death rate. Not worth shutting the country down even at 100% infection.

>>11671447
>Covid 19 has a .01-.03 death rate.
source?

>>11671420
Well, I wasn’t referring to civil liberties so much as I was referring to a system, largely an economic system, that is dynamic, international, and depends On (not allows) movement. How many international tourists flow through New York on a daily basis? How many people from out of state are there on business? You get my point but it begs the questions: what exactly do you consider civil liberties and are you implying that those should be automatically off the table for discussion?

>>11671388
This. When all is said and done, the lockdown fetishers are going to lose all of their credibility. They've cried wolf so loud without considering the context in which the wolf exists, once the true nature of the wolf if known, no one will take cries of wolf seriously again, which will be a problem should we ever get a truly deadly pandemic that can kill billions.

>>11671445
We need a better metric than just death count. Expected lifespan reduction per capita would be a much better metric to understand the true impact on society and its members. If it turned out to be something like three days per capita, almost no one would say the lockdown is worthwhile.

>>11670716
It needs to be done slowly, yes. I agree, but it needs to start sooner than later, I mean it already is happening, but we should be coordinating more effectively. Yes.

>>11670716

butt then again how to gain herd immunity when you are isolated?

>>11670730
Sweden didn't lock down and is fine compared to Denmark. Virus is a globalist hoax kiddo.

>>11670716
>these eyebrows
i puked

>>11671523
>what exactly do you consider civil liberties and are you implying that those should be automatically off the table for discussion?
The problem is civil liberties (ie right to assemble) have been suspended without any clear and obvious metric to determine when they should be restored. Exactly the same thing as what happened after 9/11 and now mass government surveillance has been normalized. If they get their way this lockdown will never lift and large gatherings will never be allowed because the vague, omnipresent threat of virus transmission is a suitable justification to revoke hard-won freedoms indefinitely. And then when any large gatherings can be broken up under the guise of public health safety we lose the right to peaceful protest and religious expression, both hinging on government approval when they should have no say in the matter.
This is the future that has already happened with privacy and is slated to happen with assembly and soon the only way to regain power over the government is violent revolt.

>>11671769
Ever heard of vaccines?

>>11671891
It literally isn't and it was just deemed a failure...

>>11670943
it's almost like there's a search tool that's free on the internet

>>11670716
The virus is killing off the old and weak.

The last half is in hiding.

They were gunna die anyway.

>>11670771
>I'm right you're wrong
>The person I'm citing as proof of my argument isn't even proof
>xd muh liberties

fucking end yourself you disgusting waste of space

>>11670716
Your picture is gay zoomer shit.

I know what you mean, finish the job.

Well, like a spark in a petrol garage. If we re-opened in a years time, it will only kill the weak and old anyway.

Rather than the economy tank, just let it do the job now.

>>11671447
Not true

Case fatality rate can't be found until well after the disease has ended its course

SARS was thought to be a death rate of 2% but then 10 years later was found to be at least 10%.

>>11672127
by who?
https://www.foreignaffairs.com/articles/sweden/2020-05-12/swedens-coronavirus-strategy-will-soon-be-worlds

>>11671956
>just lock down until there's a vaccine
Do you seriously think this is feasible? What if we don't have a vaccine until 2022, 2025, even 2030? Just shut down the world until then?

>>11670716
>Why is it so hard to understand
pic related

It's truly shocking how easy it is to brainwash people, or at the very least confuse them enough so they don't know what reality is and become delusional.
We are living in an era where a most of the news people consume is state run propaganda designed to brainwash and gaslight people till they don't know what is real anymore.

We are truly living in a dystopian nightmare. NOT HYPERBOLE!! Let that sink in. It's fucking real, and it's happening right now!!

>>11672182
>It's truly shocking how easy it is to brainwash people, or at the very least confuse them enough so they don't know what reality is and become delusional.
>We are living in an era where a most of the news people consume is state run propaganda designed to brainwash and gaslight people till they don't know what is real anymore.
You are right, but it's the vehemently pro-lockdown people who are being brainwashed.

>>11670716
we have stayed locked down longer than the incubation period 2x.
You need a lesson in science, anything still spreading would spread regardless.

>>11672196
It's useless trying to convince people like OP. They won't be happy unless we lock down entirely for the 2+ years it will take to develop and distribute a vaccine.

>>11672189
>but it's the vehemently pro-lockdown people who are being brainwashed.
I know you believe this, but can you apply any logic to your assertions besides they 'NO U' or "i know what you are but what am I' kind of arguments?
What is the logic behind your statement plz?

>>11672204
>What is the logic behind your statement plz?
I'm not entirely anti-lockdown, I don't believe in just reopening 100% and carrying on "as normal".
But it's blatantly obvious to see that the mainstream media is pushing this extremist pro-lockdown agenda, based mostly off of dubious non-science, eg. acting like the death rate is still assumed as 3%, acting as if the death rate is uniform across the board for all age groups regardless of underlying conditions, leading to utterly braindead analogies that get 100k retweets and facebook shares like that shit about "durrrr if I gave you 100 skittles and told you 3 of them would kill you, would you eat any of the skittles".
They also latch on to absolute outlier cases, eg. the tiny minority of people who experienced strokes with covid, and publish it as "COVID-19 NOW CAUSING STROKES IN YOUNG PEOPLE" with no context. The media's agenda for whatever reason seems to be to make out that covid-19 is the black death, it causes every possible symptom, it kills anyone of any age group, and if you catch it at any point you are dead. They are actively trying to send the populace into a frenzied panic.

We need a measured lifting of the lockdown, gradually, in steps. Broadly I agree with my country's (the UK) policy with different levels of lockdown to be lifted, slowly, over a few months. But even with that you have the majority of people here going fucking insane and demanding "NNNNOOOOO WE MUST LOCKDOWN BARRICADED IN OUR HOUSES FOR 2+ YEARS UNTIL THERE IS A VACCINE!!"

I'm just sick and tired of this shit. Everyone is manipulating the statistics, everyone has an agenda to push with this virus.

>>11672196
The main misconception that lockdown is a feasible way of eradicating the virus is the problem. This has never been the point. The optimal way to achieve enough herd immunity (the only way to eradicate a virus without a cure) is to expose as many low-risk people as possible, below the maximum load of the healthcare infrastructure to avoid incidental deaths while shielding at-risk people as much as possible. It has nothing to do with "money > human lives" or any of that retarded rhetoric. If the people who endlessly quote "Numbers don't lie! Science doesn't lie!" (which is hilariously naive—politicians have been using numbers and science to lie since the beginning of time) actually took a minute to think about the best path forward they would come to the same conclusion.

When lockdown countries are hitting second and third waves and destroying their economies with knee jerk reactions, Sweden is going to be business as usual. This is the point of their strategy and it will be the clear and obvious best approach in retrospect. It will save the most lives, both from the virus and incidental deaths associated with a collapsed economy and lockdown related social and metal issues.

I'm thinking "flatten the curve" is too mathematically difficult for people to grasp that the flattened curve has the same area as the peaked curve.

>>11672204
Is that Ben Stiller? Are they secretly the same person?

>>11672189
but it's the vehemently anti-lockdown people who are being brainwashed.

ftfy

>>11672153
https://www.msn.com/en-gb/health/medical/sweden-admits-a-big-failure-to-prevent-elderly-deaths-from-coronavirus-as-toll-passes-3000-with-90percent-of-victims-over-70/ar-BB13Klva?li=BBoPRmx

>>11672241
Refer to my response here >>11672220
The mainstream media has for the past 3 months been actively perpetuating these two myths
>1. that the virus is a black death tier superkiller, thus that we have to stay barricaded inside like nutcases or else we will die
>2. that locking down until a vaccine (which could take upwards of 2 years, or could never come at all) is feasible
I'm not saying "REOPEN EVERYTHING NOW", but the mainstream belief now has become the opposite: "CLOSE EVERYTHING FOREVER UNTIL THERE IS A VACCINE". Which is absolutely ludicrous.

Sadly we are in the middle of political strife and the virus struck while no one trusts anyone and no one was prepared. It's funny since we would normally be doing fine in this situation but Corona chan struck at a moment of weakness as far a cooperation goes. We'll endure but at least a million will die before this is over.

>>11672252
failure to reduce exposure to at risk populations doesn't imply a failure of the strategy as a whole.

>>11670716
Depends on how much you drink daily.

>>11672225
>I'm thinking "flatten the curve" is too mathematically difficult for people to grasp that the flattened curve has the same area as the peaked curve.
calfiorain governors road map is so retardedly tight for big cites. based on his model cities would basically have to have zero new infections. thats retarded.
The problem is like a good liberal he is taking advice experts, in this case from doctors who are thinking like doctors. a 0% infection rate is great for a doctor treating a patient, or a doctor running a hospital, but its not the right political solution for a state
for the record: I love most of what liberals do and consulting experts is usually the right course of action in most use ceases, just not here,

>>11670850
The government actually is out to get them most of the time though, just not with every single thing they do
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PtIi8QR5Mzs

>>11672220
>"NNNNOOOOO WE MUST LOCKDOWN BARRICADED IN OUR HOUSES FOR 2+ YEARS UNTIL THERE IS A VACCINE!!"

I'm in America and I haven't heard this sentiment. Everyone wants to get out of their houses but they all want to do it safely and they're pissed cause the government isn't making that happen.
It's like we had an unspoken contract with the government. We self isolate for 2 months while we bend the curve and give you time to get your shit together and create a plan to reopen. We did our part, we locked ourselves up for 2 months, now where's the plan to re-open? Trump has axed the plans to reopen safely, for god knows why, and is blaming everyone else for being chicken. It's almost like Trump WANTS there to be chaos, panic, confusion, sickness, and death because it's like he thrives in an environment of chaos. Theoretically if things got bad enough Trump could just cancel the election and declare himself president for 4 more years. Sometimes I wonder if he's trying to make the pandemic worse so he can cancel the election.

>>11672348
Trump left it up to the governess, which in such a huge and plotically divided country was the right choice. Some of the democrats right now are so rabid they would have done the opposite of whatever trump said. If he said open they would fight to close, if he said close they would fight to open.
I am not even joking, some of them have really lost their powers of reason

>>11672348
>We did our part, we locked ourselves up for 2 months
Way too many people didn't do that

>>11672371
and you think they will if we go for another 2 months?

>>11672348
>vaccine
good luck
by reducing transmission below r0 it will eventually go extinct. doing this would also wipe out the flu. but fucking liberals and their 'freedom'

>>11672379
this is why we need the robot dogs with tazers

>>11672348
>Sometimes I wonder if he's trying to make the pandemic worse so he can cancel the election.
Just to add:
Trump is most comparable to Nixon. He thinks like him, acts like him, and is accused of many of the same crimes as Nixon.
Nixon also prolonged the Vietnam War purely for political reason. If Nixon prolonged a war for reelection reasons, why can't Trump prolong coronavirus for the same reasons?


This isn't far fetched or impossible stuff. It's literally happened before in American history.

>>11672379
No, but I'm just saying, when people talk about quarantine and how the USA is affected by all this compared to other countries, I've seen firsthand how stupid and noncompliant people have been. I guess you might as well re-open if nobody's taking it seriously anyway. Lots of people still don't even wear masks

>>11672405
>how the USA is affected by all this compared to other countries
But the US has better per capita rates than most of Europe, no one seems to understand the U.S is bigger and has more people than Italy and Germany and France and England combined, you cant just compare Germany total numbers to US total numbers.
I thought /sci/ was supposed to be smart.
we arent the best but we are no where near the worst of euro country .

>>11672405
at least the compliant people can hide from the diseased people. Tell everything to open up and people will be pressured into running around and getting infected.

>>11672438
a staged reopening with spot local shutdowns is the best answer, dare I say, all reasonable experts agree.

>>11670730
>and now they're starting to re-open the economy
So what? You can't not get a second wave if you are still getting new infections. Immunizing 0.01% of the population in a country doesn't prevent a new wave of the disease.

>>11672141
hahahaha why so salty desu uwu

mummy mummy I'm scared make everyone do what I want!!!!!!!!!!!

stfu you punk bitches the supreme court just overturned the Wisconsin lock-down order, you whiny fucking autists. I can't wait to cough on all of you and your grannies fucking faggots hahaha you're all gonna die dow

>>11670716
>>11670723
The CDC has already admitted that an actual lockdown is more dangerous. It's even on their website.

>>11672529
I only get mad at monkey tards who put me and my trans gf at risk

>>11672561
Cough on me and you'll suffer lol

try it nigger

>>11672182
>We are living in an era where a most of the news people consume is state run propaganda designed to brainwash and gaslight people till they don't know what is real anymore.
Actually social media mass hysteria.

>>11672611
I guess in your world all the old and weak die

>>11672580
Bait

I'm just pissed that that we're going to be suffering a longer "lockdown" because idiots couldn't stay in and read books.

Its so fucking surreal

>>11672629
Curious about your world view on mortality.

>>11672715
One where we take science seriously

>>11670716
No the whole point of a lockdown is to avoid overwhelming the health care. Corona is not going anywhere until the vaccine is created which may never happen. How long are you planning to stay locked? We all are gonna get it.

>>11672731
Drawing a concrete conclusion from an interpretation of a statistic in a developing situation is not science. In fact, it's anti-science.

>>11672766

>>11671949
Ok. But you still haven’t elaborated in what you believe are civil liberties and why (other than the “right” to assemble). I’m asking you to defend why you believe these are “rights” and why they shouldn’t as you say, be suspended without clear metrics for restoration.

>>11670752
>People who give up liberty for safety deserve neither - Ben Franklin
Big words from a guy who lived in a world with no electricity. Or telephones. Or cameras. Or cars. Or airplanes. When "gun" meant a single shot muzzle loaded musket.
Just something to think about.

>>11672842
kys

>>11672581
>>11672584

>>11672842

>>11672310
Gates Honored Doctor: "We’ll just get rid of all the whites in the United States for not taking vaccines"
https://videos.utahgunexchange.com/watch/gates-honored-doctor-quot-we-ll-just-get-rid-of-all-the-whites-in-the-united-states-for-not-taking-v_nKKO7iblWtgtBmK.html

>>11670716
Define 'too soon'

Is it when you have your first day with no cases? Is it when you get the vaccine? You also know that each day you continue the lockdown, you are increasing the number of lives put in danger for other reasons, such as poverty, depression, etc.

When you take it all into consideration, the decision is not as simple as 'we gotta save the old peeps'

>>11672842

>>11671501
>>11672148
https://newyork.cbslocal.com/2020/04/27/coronavirus-antibodies-present-in-nearly-25-of-all-nyc-residents/

>>11672842
Multi-shot rapid fire guns date back to the 1500s. Franklin and the framers of the Constitution were quite aware of the variety of firearms available beyond your limited knowledge.

>>11670716

Torching the economy was the final selfish act of the fucking Boomer.

>>11670752
If you a scared motherfucker go to church. If you a gutter motherfucker do your dirt. If you a down motherfucker put in work. If you a crazy motherfucker go berserk. - Benjamin Franklin

>>11672826
you are a stupid motherfukcer and anyone that waste time explain anything to you is as stupid as you are.

>explain why the government shouldn't be able to do whatever they want to you

There really are people this stupid anons and you think NPC is just a meme, just lolz. The government isn' t the real enemy all they can do is write shit down on paper on call it a "law", it is stupid motherfuckers like this you gotta be looking out for

>>11672225

Based

>>11673925

>>11672127
>it was just deemed a failure by my propaganda masters
Zero self-awareness.

>>11672182
This. Libtard media is basically 100% propaganda.

>>11670734
>incel rants about white people again
Why haven’t you committed sudoku yet?

>>11670766
>Ben Franklin wouldn't have sided with anti-lockdown protesters. his son died from smallpox and he lived the rest of his life in regret for not innoculating him.
why the non-sequitur? are you retarded?

>>11670771
You don't belong here.
Not this board; Earth.

>>11672842
Cringe Central

>>11672141
It’s clear your porn cartoons have rotten your brain and ability to think.

>>11672361
This. Liberals will always claim to want the opposite of whatever Orange Man says because Orange Man Bad. That's their short-circuited "thought process".

Basically pic related.

>>11674245
>literally describing conservatives too
>LOL LET'S DO THIS TO OWN THE LIBS!
>LEFTISTS LIKE THIS SO WE HAVE TO HATE IT TO PISS THEM OFF
Retard.

>>11672629
In the real world? Yes.

>>11674253
Your post is exactly what I'm talking about. Thank you for proving my point.

>>11674259
Get some self-awareness, you fucking dunce. You're in dire need of it.

>>11674260
>just more insults
Not an argument. Thanks for playing.

>>11670752
>People who give up liberty for safety deserve neither
That's not a quote of Ben Franklin it's a paraphrase and the actual context of the original quote makes it clear that he means almost the opposite.

>>11674263
see
>>11674260
Enjoy your last (You), cretin.

>>11673907
>Multi-shot rapid fire guns date back to the 1500s.
You're wrong about that.

>>11674273
>still hurling insults
It's clear you have nothing substantive to say, so why keep embarrassing yourself?

>>11670716
Covid is not going away. You can have an enforced lockdown until there are 0 cases for months and the second you open your borders you will have a resurgence. There is no vaccine coming in the near future.
The point of lockdowns were to avoid hospital backlogs which never happened and the average age of victim is older than the average age of natural death. Think about that for a second.
People who die of covid19 would likely die of influenza.
What is the point of crippling economies worldwide? Why not be smarter about slowing the spread? People also die as the direct result of recessions .

>>11674302
How about you prove literally any single sentence of your post.

>>11674308
every single sentence he said is correct to my knowledge
why don’t you point out which sentence you disagree with?

>>11674312
Nice dodge. Pick the one you think is easiest. I'll wait.

>>11674332
ok, how about the first one?
https://www.cbsnews.com/news/coronavirus-may-never-go-away-world-health-organization/
are you familiar with the concept of natural reservoirs?

>>11674341
Oh wow good choice, unfortunately all you proved is that you are more hyperbolic than cbs news.

>>11674332
He's not the one who made that post. I am.
I'll give you one. If you continue to be a dick I'll go out of my way to give the rest but I'm kind of busy.

>People also die as the direct result of recessions
1. ONS (2011). Trends in life expectancy by the National Statistics Socio-economic Classification 1982–2006.
2. U.S. Department of Health and Human Services (2012). Health, United States, 2011.
3. Ruhm C.J. (2005). “Commentary: Mortality increases during economic upturns. International Journal of Epidemiology, 34(6), 1206-1211.
4. Gerdtham, U.G., & Ruhm, C.J. (2006). Deaths rise in good economic times: evidence from the OECD. Economics & Human Biology, 4(3), 298-316.
5. Ruhm, C.J. (2000). Are recessions good for your health? The Quarterly Journal of Economics, 115(2), 617-650.
6. Granados, J.A.T. (2005). Recessions and mortality in Spain, 1980–1997. European Journal of Population/Revue Européenne de Démographie, 21(4), 393-422.
7. Stuckler, D., Basu, S., Suhrcke, M., Coutts, A., & McKee, M. (2011). Effects of the 2008 recession on health: a first look at European data. The Lancet, 378(9786), 124-125.

>>11674343
I accept your concession

>>11674346
>Mortality increases during economic upturns
>Deaths rise in good economic times
>Are recessions good for your health?
Is this some sort of reverse psychology thing?

>>11674308
The 2008 financial meltdown caused a 4.8% jump in suicides in America

>>11674365
Suicide is a retard people problem and is illegal (even though this doesn't actually matters imo it's not seen in the law as something you can defend)

People can stay inside and read books
Opening the country puts innocents at risk

>>11674365
>The 2008 financial meltdown caused a 4.8% jump in suicides in America
Haven't suicide rates been decreasing for years.

>>11674346
Lol nerd so autistic.

>>11674371
>t. basement-dwelling incel who leeches off his parents projects his situation onto everyone else
Oh boy

>>11674371
>innocents at risk
wouldn't those people be staying home anyway?

>>11674371
>People can just stay inside and read books bro
>It's not like they need to pay the bills or anything bro
lmao why are bernouts always the most out of touch

>>11674391
What if we just stopped paying bills until this was over.

I get the feeling that the pro-lockdown panic people are all neets who feel their pathetic lifestyles validated for the first time in their lives.
Someone still needs to produce the things that you leech

>>11674396
I get the feeling that you are just trying to project undesirable characteristics onto people you disagree with.

>>11674399
well It's kinda obvious you don't have any financial responsibilities or you're sucking on the public tit

>>11674395

>>11674371
>Suicide is a retard people problem
If this was true there were be threads about it here non stop cause this place is the biggest collection of retards on the Internet, like you

>>11674458
Literal third grade year tier insult

>>11674465
HAHAHAHA HOES MAD NIGGA

>>11674253
Back to pleebit libtard

>>11674290
>he doesn't know about the puckle gun
go read some books autistic little faggot anon

>>11670716
>a lockdown is to ensure the spread of cases of a disease
No, it is to just slow the spread to flatten the curve.

>>11670723
>have a slave mentality(ironic)
How is not wanting to be herded into your homes en masse and rely on government dependence is slave mentality?

>>11670752
Oh Ben Franklin said that? I change my mind then

Cigarette smoking is responsible for more than 480,000 deaths per year in the United States, including more than 41,000 deaths resulting from secondhand smoke exposure. This is about one in five deaths annually, or 1,300 deaths every day.

Lets lockdown the economy until everyone has kicked the habit

>>11674962
kills more than flu

opinion DISCARDED

>>11674975
>opinion
U.S. Department of Health and Human Services. The Health Consequences of Smoking—50 Years of Progress: A Report of the Surgeon General. Atlanta: U.S. Department of Health and Human Services, Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, National Center for Chronic Disease Prevention and Health Promotion, Office on Smoking and Health, 2014 [accessed 2018 Feb 22].

>>11670752
Finally found intelligent life. People really don't give a shit to freedom these days it's sad really.

Don't worry though I'm sure the Patriot and the EARN IT Act will keep you secure lol

>>11670716
>the whole point of a lockdown is to ensure the spread of cases of a disease
>lockdown ensures spread of disease
>>11670723
>calls americans stupid
>has zero reading comprehension
Absolute idiots ITT

>>11674245
>implying he is not retarded
and so are you.

>>11675241
>Absolute idiots on this board
FTFY

>>11670716

>>11674403
Wrong again bub I'm an essential worker.

>>11672968
>>11673484
>>11673542
>>11674213
If we're going to talk about safety then it is pertinent to evaluate threats to said safety. The technological advancements since the 18th century have brought with them dangers both physical and immaterial, that Benjamin Franklin could not even have fever dreams of. Using his quote as a value statement on safety in the year 2020, is like asking Grugg The Caveman's take on genetic engineering.

>>11673907
>Puckle gun
>It was never used during any combat operation or war. Production was highly limited and may have been as few as two guns
An obscure prototype.

>>11675403
you are stupid stfu, the
>muh things were diff then let's revalute giving up our freedoms in a new context
argument is some of the stupidest libtard whataboutism for smooth brains there is.

>>11670716
I hope you also understand that we need to get people back to work before the economy crumbles.
if there is no production of essential and non essentials is killed off then more people will get killed off.

>>11675366
being on a beach could actually help kill the virus because of the UV rays and heat.
stop being a smooth brain, but I still think people should stay at there property most of the time.

>>11674395
What if services just stopped being provided until this is all over?

>>11670867
Not trusting the government and believing conspiracy bullshit with 0 evidence are two different things

>>11674557
Not him but I think he refers that Ameritards are basically media's bitches and most of them don't even think anything for themselves

>>11677122
Like an incel retard like you would the know difference, stfu stupid little shit

>>11670716
The purpose of the lock down is not to stop the spread of the disease but to slow it down so that the health care system can process cases at a reasonable pace and else they would be overwhelmed. It has less to do with citizen safety then with the ability of medical care systems to be flooded with covid cases.

>>11670716
Most people are fucking retards and cant understand basic concepts

But, but... Muh freedoms. Muh constitutional rights to assemble...

>>11672153
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/total-covid-deaths-per-million?tab=chart&year=2020-04-27&country=DNK+FIN+NOR+SWE

>>11677504
Has anyone done a study on how absolutely brainless coomposters are?

>>11677504
but muh muh safety, the government daddy will keep me protected from germs

you are an idiot and should be gassed

>>11671394
>There was never any chance of containing a virus to just a few hundred places in a place like New York City and nearly as little chance of being able to contain and treat it. You can’t just build up the necessary conditions to contain something like this overnight.

>>11670734
And yet almost everyone who's died of it has disproportionately been black or some other flavor of turd, huh, that's pretty crazy

>>11676272
>I hope you also understand that we need to get people back to work before the economy crumbles.
>if there is no production of essential and non essentials is killed off then more people will get killed off.
We aren't having a discussion about how to keep the economy running in the middle of a pandemic, but a shouting match with a bunch of pear shaped boomers in militia cosplay screaming at covid-19 and hoping it folds like a blue-dog democrat so dear leader can win an election.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iXatarwVI7k

>>11675366
>lives in the most infected country of the world
You could've just said "I'm a retard", you know.

>>11670752
>People who give up liberty for safety deserve neither - Ben Franklin
Based. We should legalize recreational nukes to ensure total liberty

>>11678338

>>11670744
based

>>11670716
>Why don't people understand that the whole point of a lockdown is to ensure the spread of cases of a disease?

Why does not this bullshit meme die? Countries that actually handled this crisis well (east Asia, eastern Europe) are right now in a state where the virus is basically extinct on their soil, and almost all new cases, of which there is only relatively small numbers, can be traced to foreign import.

>>11670716
They do understand, they just don't care.

>>11677680
Your graph is very outdated.

USA has now 3229 active cases per million, and 4487 total cases per million.

>>11676281
Wait until you see the video. The tards didn't went to the beach to use the UV light against the corona virus. They wasn't even wearing masks.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gmm2se1HXOM

>>11678545
https://durangoherald.com/articles/324539
>County Coroner George Deavers said the person tested positive for COVID-19, but an investigation by him and the pathologist determined the cause of death was ethanol toxicity. The person’s blood-alcohol content was 0.55, or almost seven times the legal driving limit of 0.08 in Colorado, Deavers said. A BAC of 0.3 is considered lethal.

Yeah, bs statistics

>>11672225
>Sweden is going to be business as usual.
Sweden has 3 times the deaths of Norway, Denmark, Finland, and Iceland combined while having a population that is 5 million less. Stop comparing Sweden to the UK, moron.

>>11671891
>Sweden 4000 deaths
>Denmark 543
>Denmark has a much more dense population

>>11678338
Radiological weapons are indiscriminate. Same goes for bioweapons.

>>11678963
Why? You've cherry picking as much as the person you're implying is cherry picking. Also the Swedish approach is to intentionally front load their infections instead of dragging it out over a prolonged period. You won't know if their approach is better or worse until the virus burns out or there is a vaccine/treatment.

>>11678974
How am I cherry picking? I'm comparing 5 countries that are culturally, genetically, and governmentally similar. All countries are following what is dubbed the "Scandinvean model". Comparing Sweden to the UK is maximum retardation.

>>11678511
All of those countries because authoritarian Singapore are monocultures. You can't have an effective containment program in a diverse multicultural society where the populous has no group identity to desire to protect. So you have to go the Singapore route, which only works in a small city-state. For large multicultural countries, you're pretty much screwed. Containing the virus requires changes to the foundational structure to such a degree that you end up destroying the very thing you try to save.

>>11678976
Are you mentally retarded? Sorry to resort to name calling but your cherry picked attributes of commonality are just that, cherry picking to justify cherry picking. Congratulations on being a Millennial and try to use Appeal to Meta as a valid logical argument but sadly it's actually a logical fallacy. Try again without cherry picking the results you want.

>>11678963
Once again, "flatten the curve" reduces the daily rate, but doesn't reduce the overall number of infected. A low daily rate means nothing if it goes on for a whole year with multiple spikes while a high daily rate country attains herd immunity after two months.

>>11678984
>URRRR CHERRY PICKING BRO
Okay retard. Explain which countries are more similar to Sweden than Norway, Denmark, Finland, and Iceland? In terms of demographics, populaion density, governmenal policy, cultural norms, etc, etc. Go on dummy, I'll wait.

>>11670716
>Why don't people understand that the whole point of a lockdown is to ensure the spread of cases of a disease?
Are you sure you know what the word "ensure" means?

>>11670771
quality post

>>11678545
India never ceases to amaze me

>>11670716
>lock down NOW!

>>11679416
democracy in India is one of the wonders of the 20th century

>>11678511
>Countries that actually handled this crisis well (east Asia, eastern Europe) are right now in a state where the virus is basically extinct on their soil, and almost all new cases, of which there is only relatively small numbers, can be traced to foreign import.
You mean countries that locked down early and hard?

>>11670716
>environment becomes unstable
>people have the desire for understanding and certainty, for control and security and the desire to maintain a positive self-image
>by denying the loss of normality people feel like they have agency ("i know whats going on/It's not real/...")
We lost something, so there is grieving. Notice how it's always losers who fall for conspiracy theories.
Simple as, sneed & seed.