/sci/ - Science & Math

>>11000676
i think a quadruped will be the superior frame for a while

>>11000676
Move without relying on cleared roads. How many animals have evolved that use wheels to move?

>>11000676
Jog. Jump up 4 foot steps
to name a couple

Oh I don't know, maybe run upright or walk down the stairs

>>11000676
Use things and spaces meant for humans

>>11000704
>>11000706
Missing the point

>>11000676
There's a bunch of good reasons why special forces operating is remote, rough mountainous terrain use packmules instead of wheeled vehicles like quads or similar autonomous wheeled vehicles.
Legs are just better in all ways.

>>11000676
go over almost any terrain efficiently. Wheels are more efficient on flat ground, but legs are more efficient over everything. Adds extra degrees of freedom for the base. Can keep the base relatively stable while traversing obstacles.
>>enough traction
if you have to fucking bulldoze through obstacles you're not doing things very efficiently.

>>11000704
>>11000706
>>11000676
They have one with wheels.

>>11000676
Replace amazon warehouse jobs

>>11000729
using tools is a fundamentally different than walking.
>>11000759
Not really. Amazon's warehouses are all flat, meaning that wheels can be used. The real problem is being able to pick up fucking anything without human help, without damaging the object, faster or cheaper than a human can.

>>11000729
That can still be done with a robot that can transform into several configurations. They will be far superior to android-chassis robots.

>>11000676
Robot gf

>>11000768
Transforming wastes space and tends to make for more fragile robots tho

>>11000759

>>11000771
Not using wheels for general travel is a waste of energy. Being only one shape limits ability. Transforming does not waste space and you know nothing about fragility when it comes to anything but your own ego.

>>11000759
>>11000766

>>11000769

>>11000759
Humanoid is a bad form factor for warehouses.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-k3mVnRlQLU&t=2m45s

>>11000706
>>11000729
>i want legs because legs are more human!
This is how you sound.

>>11000779
Yew, the mechanisms that allow the robot to transform don't occupy any space whatsoever and things with lots of needless moving parts are well know by their resistance

>>11000785
>that file name

That's as retarded as people laughing at cars in the 1890s

>>11000808
Sometimes I forget most of the world doesn't have robotics in school starting in elementary.

>>11000812

>>11000806
Anon, do you have ANY idea how inefficient that is? At that point you might as well just use a quadcopter.

>>11000821

...I am a highschool dropout in community college. Why don't we have flying cars?
A passenger jet cost 8,000 dollars AN HOUR to fly.
How the fuck do you not see the point in using wheel based locomotion as the preferable method.
A basic if/else with >, < and = statement could be used to understand that basic concept on choosing which mode of transportation with the functions of walk, drive and flight.

>>11000821
IS THIS WHAT YOU WANT!?!?!?

>>11000874
Fedor's trash, so no.

>>11000819
*unzips dick

>>11000676
The hype is that the secret government application as always ~30 years ahead of the private sector application.

>>11000931

>>11000676
a bit of both

>>11000812
its the joke that usps workers demolish packages

>>11000944
>doubles as battle bot
>chops your dick off

>>11000931

Same thought... soon... very soon.

>>11000676
Not a damned thing.

>>11000792
the robot is already hotter kek

>>11000874
knowing russia that's a midget in a costume

>>11000676
>wheels can scale a wall
>wheels can jump over obstacles

>>11000702
tank tracks then

>>11000806
That's cool and all but now lets see it go up stairs.

>>11000766
they also have troubles recognizing objects and dealing with novel situations

>>11000676
walk over a strip of spikes

>>11000676
These robots can't do any real human intellectual labor so to me they mean nothing. Until we invent strong AI and put it in them, they're just cool toys. Robotics is a waste of time until then(and the then, if even possible, is decades out).

>>11003788
>These robots can't do any real human intellectual labor so to me they mean nothing

I do NOT want my wife-bot to do intellectual labor!
I want it to cook, clean, mow the lawn, make the bed, clean the toilet, etc. (Most importantly to master the fluttering tongue blow-job)

>>11000747
Imagine a dozen of these coming at you with mounted miniguns.

>>11000676
>These robots can't do any real human intellectual labor
They can still do physical labor so have lots of applications still.

>>11004536
like what? Robots are very limited in the physical labor they can do and many tasks that we find basic are extremely difficult for robots to do. I want to say that this is because robots don't have 'motor skills,' but we might actually need a relatively high level of intelligence for many physical tasks.

>>11000702
I suspect that has less to do with how well wheels work than it does with problems in getting nutrients/oxygen across the rotational discontinuity.

literally just bigger robosapians

>>11000676
>what can limbs do that wheels with enough traction can't

climb a tree.

>>11000700
>Not a hexapod for guaranteed stability

>>11004671

>>11000933
>if you are neutral in situations of injustice you have chosen the side of the oppressor
incredibly cheap words
>it's better to let other people decide what injustice is for you rather than remaining neutral
>if you have any uncerntiany you will be labeled an oppressor

>>11004697
looks like a bunch of limbs to me m8.

Run up your stairs and shoot you.

>>11004735
is it infinite number of limbs?
or is it zero limbs?

>>11000779
Legged robots can be pretty efficient:
https://spectrum.ieee.org/robotics/humanoids/building-robots-that-can-go-where-we-go
The robot on the left can walk for about 5 hours straight, even if the terrain's a bit rough. The big advantage of legs though is that they're robust. Legged robots can autonomously navigate rougher and a wider variety of terrain than wheeled robots can. A robot getting stuck and having to be reset by a human is a waste of energy.
>>11000768
a humanoid like robot won the DARPA challenge. So in practice they aren't superior. It could transform between sit and scoot and stand up though

>>11000702
how would animals ever evolve wheels
the intermediate structures you'd need would be a useless wasted investment

>>11004858
They would only evolve that way in an environment with a very large flat area of land, like the humble tumble weed.

>>11004865
how?
how would you make a rotating axle not attached to the body from something that's not a rotating axle or attached to the body.
It's not like limbs where small nubs were still useful then grew longer to become more useful.

>>11004868
>or
*and

>>11004136
I can re-enact my favorite moments from Metal Gear

>he wants a robot gf on a wheel
sick fetish tbqh

>>11004858
There's literally a pulley system in the human eye that serves no purpose until it's in its final form. The superior oblique is a muscle anchored behind the eye that loops through a pulley cartilage structure located on a separate organ. It changes the direction of muscle pull 90 degrees at the expense of added friction. The intermediate structures would clearly be wasted investments and actually be less efficient: the cartilage pulley would have no tension and just be a wasted growth constricting the muscle movement.

>>11000772
>dat ass

>>11000676

>>11004974
>serves no purpose
Are you sure about that?
https://www.bmj.com/rapid-response/2011/10/29/paradox-superior-oblique

>>11007619
Yes I'm sure about that. Your link is explaining that the structure/muscle does serve a purpose, which is what I said. It would make more sense if you did not selectively cherry pick what I said, which was:
>serves no purpose until it's in its final form
It currently is in its final form thus serves a purpose. It would serve no purpose if you had a pulley that does not change the direction of muscle pull, it would only hinder the muscles performance. Theres two separate organs involved too, one wrapped around another, so it's paradoxical how this could evolve yet always maintain some sort of benefit at each piecemeal step.

>>11003351
See
>>11000806
>>11000747

Maybe read the thread first next time

>>11007862
>BD wheelbot doesn't climb stairs
>fanbot needs fucking fans to do anything
Why don't you watch the videos before linking them?

>>11000785
I like how it watches the boxes after it throws them, gives it personality somehow.

>>11004753
it's one flexible wheel in that mode. a wheel is a cylinder and so is a snake, snakes would roll if they were smart enough.

>>11004974
the pulley muscle twists the eyeball in its socket, they have 5 or 10 degrees of twist if you look closely in a mirror while tilting your head left and right, they try and stay upright.

>>11000676
walking vs segway

>>11000747
This one is cool but it seems very energy inefficient. Every time it makes a quick move it has to swing it's body around to compensate.

The walking ones have to constantly adjust to keep balance too, as do humans, but the adjustment motions are very small compared to the wheeled robot.

>>11000702
>>11004858
You guys need to simplify how you think of wheels.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bzAF7WuXhKA

>>11001700
incel

>>11008226
>>11004697

>>11004804
>a humanoid like robot won the DARPA challenge
Most of the failures are not failures because of the form factor, but failures because their AI is shit.

>>11008148
The one hopping on the table could work just like atlas with some minor changes and locking wheels. Simple shit.

>>11008239
Locking wheels would have another contact point. Like typical feet with heel and ball. That is where the stability comes from with non-wheeled travel.

>>11008716
The robots in the DARPA robotics challenge were remotely controlled by people.

>>11008752
There's always a balancing AI involved. Or similar programming that is. That is much the same as the algorithms and everything involved in quadcopter flying. You may control the quadcopter, but you don't control its balance, you merely tell it where to go.

>>11008764
And what about robots that don't actually need to balance falling over?

>>11000676
Walk up stairs, climb up the mountain with minimal space, rocky terrain. Manipulate objects with dexterious motions.

>>11008785
Are you just an idiot?

>>11003788
So that's why we sent all those manned missions to the planets of the solar system?

>>11004689
>hexapod

>>11008785
Huh

>>11008729
Not with only 2 wheels though.

>>11000676
ITT: Retards who didn't read the literal Press Releases explaining this shit.

THEY ARE DESIGNED TO USE HUMAN SPACES ALONGSIDE HUMAN BEINGS. THEY HAVE TO DO EVERYTHING A HUMAN CAN DO. THAT'S THE GOAL. TO REPLACE EVERY <100 IQ GOYIM WITH ONE OF THESE. THAT'S THE FUTURE.

Every time I think about how dumb people are I realize... it had to be this way. Humanity had to be destroyed to create the New Race.

>>11008939
You don't understand what is being discussed. Please, stop posting, for your own sake. Cringing this hard is an ultra yikes from me.

>>11008952
So is RoboSimian. Only it is also able to take on non-human shapes to do additional jobs humans are not properly shaped to do. We have all the tech we need for this stuff, we unfortunately will never have the energy density for power packs to have this stuff realized in any manner worth using outside of things that can get done within 90-120 minutes if lucky.

>>11000676
Get unstuck.

>>11000676
Move through a human centered world without impediments.
Of course the Ghost in the Shell thing of putting wheels on the legs is best, but hey, one step at the time.

>>11000676
Extend

>>11000676
They're better in the absence of well paved roads or sidewalks.

>>11004865
>>11004868
It would be impossible to evolve rubber.

>>11004868
A ratchet-like structure to pull the 'wheel' forward, not too different than how skeletal muscle works already, just on a macro scale. The 'tire' could be similar to paw pads in your mammal of choice. Throw in some cartilagenous hubs and you're good to go. Ignoring the fact that legs work well enough already and have redundancy in case one gets fucked, wheels would still severely limit the variety of terrain that could be traversed.

Tl;dr wheels are definitely possible, but who fucking cares because legs are better.

>>11000676
How about go up stairs or climb rocks or basically move anywhere that isn’t a road or other flat surface?

>>11008991
>we unfortunately will never have the energy density for power packs
and you base this knowledge of the future on what, exactly.

everytime someone had said this or that thing is impossible, some clever people prove them wrong. it is hard to say what discoveries in this field remain.

>>11008991
>>we have all the tech we need
we don't have the AI necessary so that they can do anything useful
>>treads
are god awful. You need a crazy amount of power just to fucking steer
you see the robot on the left here? >>11004804
5 hour battery life. Honestly legs aren't that important. The real issue is figuring out the AI so that robots can use arms and hands to AUTONOMOUSLY manipulate things.

>>11000676
use things designed for humans you absolutely stupid brainlet

>>11000676
Nobody wants to fuck a robot with wheels.

>>11011186
>and you base this knowledge of the future on what, exactly.
Real world physics.

>>11011350
>5 hour battery life.
5 hours of only standing, doing nothing. Less than 2 hours actually walking.

>>11000676
Kick your ass, nerd.

>>11012950
>Real world physics.
Such as?

>>11000700
I agree.
>>11004689
Don't think it is needed for most applications. Maybe I am wrong, maybe the applications will arise from the opportunity.

You have to ask yourself two questions. The first question is:

>are these military robots for killing

The second question you have to ask yourself is:

>are these robots the current closest things we have to sexbots

And unfortunately I think you'll find the answer to both questions is yes. The current best version of a sexbot is also a killbot.

>>11000676
this should worry all truck drivers
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8bX48KVeN2U

>>11015454
>posting things that inadvertently back up the other person's claims
Stay in school.

>>11000676
>I Honestly don't understand they hype
It can walk into your house and kill you, unlike a wheeled robot.

>>11000676

better space usage and space adptability. If possible both leg and wheel are desiderable

>>11000676
>>11003366
/m/ here
Tank track were created because the mass of the vehicle was too heavy and sunk into the ground. Not because they were superior in everything.
The downside this technology is that it also reduce the grip you can achieve and the control you have over it, it take a lot of room on a vehicle and require many consideration over your clearances.

Limbed locomotion allow to control the geometry of your vehicle, giving more possibilities to traverse obstacles, allowing to change your clearance at will and chose where you apply your grip. Done right it's also capable of movement in any direction which is a requirement if you intend to navigate in complex indoor or in area that weren't cleared for you.
A wheels or a track system are limited in clearance by their size, only crossing obstacle half their own radius/height. With limbed locomotion it can potentially only be restricted to how far your appendage reach.

>>11016839
>inadvertently back up the other person's claims
Surely you can at least explain why.

>>11018126
>Li-Air numbers are estimations, and should be regarded as unproven
Li-Air are also fuel cells that need new fuel, instead of being merely recharged via a wall outlet.

>>11018131
>unproven is equivalent to impossible
I thought maybe you had something better than that.
>Li-Air are also fuel cells that need new fuel
So?

>>11018174
>I thought maybe you had something better than that.
Hey, it is text written right on that image. Read it for yourself. The entire image is meant to drum up grant money with high hopes, nothing more.

>So?
Then your ICE with gas tank is also a, "battery."

>>11018203
None of this has much to do with why "real world physics" says we'll never have "power packs" good enough.
>Then your ICE with gas tank is also a, "battery."
Yeah, so? You're saying the problem with using ICEs on robots is because THEY TAKE FUEL? Is that really your position?

>>11018229
>None of this has much to do with why "real world physics" says we'll never have "power packs" good enough.
Actually, it is everything. The, "fake projected numbers to inflate grant money," numbers in >>11015454 are not even remotely enough for the application. The best it could be used for is a no-work robot that can do nothing but move itself around. The energy density just isn't there for actual work times doing jobs that actually matter. This isn't the Avenger's universe. There's no Tony Stark and no miniaturized Arc Reactor. Yet, that is the type of thing you fill your brain with and regurgitate like the turbo normie you are. If you want a better answer than that you will need to get your thumb out of your ass so you can use google, google scholar, and/or finish high school.

>ICE reply
Did your brain fallout?

>>11018256
Cool, now I get what you're saying.
>Did your brain fallout?
Did yours? It's a simple question. What does being not-a-battery have to do with it?

>>11018266
Because, you need to refuel the fuel cell. If you add an ICE to it, it will no longer be human sized, while still having good work use. The ICE energy density is nearly good enough at least, which is why we can have all manner of other robots that work quite well right now. It is the form factor that causes the problem with ICE for humanoid robots and smaller non-flying robots. Oh and they are noisy as all fuck.

>>11018309
>Because, you need to refuel the fuel cell.
Yeah but why bring that up to begin with?
>If you add an ICE to it, it will no longer be human sized, while still having good work use. The ICE energy density is nearly good enough at least, which is why we can have all manner of other robots that work quite well right now. It is the form factor that causes the problem with ICE for humanoid robots and smaller non-flying robots. Oh and they are noisy as all fuck.
Exactly. So what does that have to do with Li-Air?

>>11018317
>i'm trolling and nobody can stop me

fuck off

>>11000768
>transforming robot
>doesn't turn into a truck, sports car or fighter jet
Fuck this gay future.

>>11018362
This , sci-fi has spoiled everything seems so mundane to me now

>>11000779
>build fruit-picking and gardening robots
>no longer have any excuse NOT to expel all the mexicans
Stop it, Trump, I'm tired off all this winning!

>>11000933
holy shit tutu desmond just like macon
are your schizominds fused together???? you both live in georgia too.....

>>11000702
1, humans

i never thought leg as a means of transport for robots was so well developed, i'm really impressed, i wish i had been interested in this kind of stuff when i was younger so i could have gotten an education for it.

>>11000676
they are more similar to humans

>>11000702
Unironically us

>>11004697
Looks like one of those megaman legends robots.