/sci/ - Science & Math

Just imagine, they might be forced to be watch cheesy movies.

>>1093368
Its*

>>1093368
Study the history of the American Colonies. Then read "The Moon is a Harsh Mistress" by Robert Heinlein.

Is this sparta?

I never really thought about this but you're probably right. There will be no real government oversight. Corporations will be able to send willing employees into space, create a stable, oppressive atmosphere and effectively breed a workforce of slaves.

Fuck.

>>1093419
I always forget about the colonies as analogues to space colonization and yet they almost always apply.

>>1093454
Just as there is almost no government enforcement, there is almost no enforcement from the original corporation. The goal will be a profitable venture, and the facility has to be more than self sustaining to do that. Being able to maintain their lives without the corporation, if the corporation mistreats the workers or pushes them too far they just say "Fuck you!" and ta-da, they are a neat little new city-state. Now, the corporation will have to weigh the cost-benefit of going and enforcing their mistreatment, or being diplomatic, or just writing it off and using the thus far earned profits to set up a competing colony to out-do the rebels.

>>1093492
You have no idea how to manipulate people. Check out the Niger river delta. Shell doesn't hire any locals. The locals get pissed that all of their oil is being exported and they don't get a dime, so they get rowdy. This frightens the workers who go to Shell for protection, they do what they are told out of fear of the environment around them. It's a beautiful system.

In space it will be even worse because there is no harsher of an environment than space.

Capitalism sucks, it always becomes corporatism. Corporations are essentially dictatorships.

But space colonization is impracticable until we find something useful in space or until theres so many fucking people that the oceans are literally filled with our piss.

This thread is written primarily by children.

>>1093492
Fuck the Principality of Luna, I want my $100 billion investment back. I'm bringing in mercenaries to pop the dome, suffocate them all, and bring in less in some more desperate workers to replace them. All the news reports on Earth will read about the tragic accident of how a few bad eggs who wanted more rights committed an act of terrorism and inadvertently punctured the habitat. The UN will then lossen up the already lax restrictions on space business ventures so corporations can better control their workers to make sure tragic events like that don't happen again.

Fuck space.

>>1093550
in sweatshops.

>>1093525
>But space colonization is impracticable until we find something useful in space
Cuz fuck trillions of dollars worth of minerals, amirite?

>>1093554

Well you damned common store system and "rights of the people" commie nonsense WASN'T WORKING! We killed the lazy bastards, increased production, and now we have the resources. You want this platinum, you're gonna fight through an accelerator cannon to get and find our own forces here waiting for you. We have the money, we can ship some backup here too.

>>1093572
Several hundred million tons of nearly pure iron-nickle mix. Instant steel, just melt, stir, and let cool.

>>1093525

Helium 3
Tritium
Iron
Nickel
Platinum
Cobalt
Titanium


I don't think you understand the scale of asteroid mining, son. There's an asteroid out there that has 1.7×10^19 tons of nickel-iron ore in it. That's enough to satisfy world demand for the next 3 million years.

There's no profit in space. Any minerals in space already exist on Earth at much lower prices. The only space-based industry is low orbit tourism for wealthy billionaires.

>>1093614
Oh, and that's just the composition of a few of the smaller near earth asteroids, several million tons of iron-nickle... one of the larger ones, 500 million tonner, has a small platinum impurity of less than a percent. The low end estimate is 1 million tons of platinum. ...you hear that, 1 million tons of platinum. the value is 30 fucking, trillion, fucking, dollars... fucking... Apparently 100 billion is just too much to pay for 30 trillion.

>>1093572
Yeah because its less expensive to go into space, gather that shit, and bring it all back in once piece,, Rather than it is to get/make the shit on earth. The resources might be there, but they are impracticable to gather so they still are useless

>>1093614
because earth isn't 60% iron by mass?

>>1093632

PROTIP: If you bring that much platinum to Earth, the price of platinum will drop to pennies. That rock that used to be worth a trillion would now be worth about 2 million. You'd lose all your money.

>>1093640
Good luck extracting it from the earths core.

>>1093633
On earth, the big corps make billions, and then spend those billions, hunting down those resources, locating, surveying, and digging them up. In the end, we get a few thousand tons. For the same price they could get millions of tons from the asteroids. ...million is more than a thousand. You don't seem to know that, though.

>>1093640

Far far far far far easier to go into space than to go digging into the Earth. We've made it what, 8 miles into the crust?

>>1093655

You don't bring it in all at once. You bring it in in shipments.

>>1093655
see
>>1093664

>>1093674
Far easier to send PROBES into space, you mean.

Getting the sort of equipment required for mineral extraction, and getting it back to Earth fully loaded, might not be so easy or cheap.

>>1093655
I am aware of the price drop. And that's kind of the point. It'd make earth platinum worthless because with 1 million tons of it ready to go, we could undercut the price of every market here on earth. This will end earth platinum production for some time, as whoever holds that 1 million tons will control the price. The rest of that rock with the 1 million tons of platinum has about 100 million tons of iron and nickle as well. No money is being lost on this venture. Instead, platinum becomes as commonplace as aluminum for household applications.

>>1093688

Still immensely easier than going into the fucking planet to extract resources. Don't you understand the problem with going into a planet? The deeper you get, the more weight you have on you. You get down past the convection zone you'd have to be talking about millions of pound of pressure per square INCH!

>>1093707
Not if you dig straight down

>>1093674
And that was a specialist job, digging for digging's sake. As tough as it was, that is easy compared to actual mining. Mining the not very dense rocks of space would be easier. They are spongey, more spread out and softer, compared to earth rock. Processing will be pretty simple to, easy to heat up and separate the materials. There are multiple designs for freefall smelters, bring several of each type and use each one for the best application, one for platinum, one for nickle, one for iron, one for straight steel conversion. Damn, we already have all the tech for this, let's just go already.

>>1093720
...yes, yes if you dig straight down. That is exactly what happens when you dig straight down. But digging straight down gets you no resources, you're gonna have to dig sideways at some point and have a mine, and then you're spending billions to keep a mine open at incredible depths for just a few thousand tons of iron.

fuck off, my moon.

>>1093720

Until you break through the crust at which point that deep hole you just dug becomes a very active volcano.

>>1093740

look, we even have a base already.

gtfo the lot of you.

>>1093750

Nice base... we'll take it.

>>1093755
Who the fuck is "we"? Am I missing something?

>>1093763
Well seing that swastika building techniques are moralbanned in designs these days (although they tend to be very good designs in general), i would say nazis own the moon

>>1093755

well "we" have saucers with shooty death lazers.

WHAT NOW!?!?!?

>>1093763

Can't start a 100 billion dollar space program by myself, can I? A third of that cost is paychecks.

>>1093771
I am sorry, what was that? Did you just say you could convert my KKVs into Plasma bolts as they streak towards you? Thanks.

>>1093781

what part about a fleet of shooty death lazer-saucers don't you understand?

>>1093750
I didn't even notice it was a Swastika.

>>1093789
Also, if you look closely at the front, you can clearly see a red banner, with what seems to be a nazi swastika on it.

lrn2nazis

>>1093789

can't wait for Iron Sky.

>>1093794
It's quite the base. Layout aside, I'd live there. However I have my doubts about the crater's "right" side having almost no tracks in it.

>>1093788

What part of "hypersonic tungsten bolt" are you missing? And you're going to what, heat them up before they strike?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4KEueJnsu80

been there, done that.

>>1093805
The base is fucking huge. No need to go off roading and fucking up a transport. I believe thats a punishable offence.

>>1093828

well, you dont have any of that "hypersonic telphone pole" shit now do you?

but we have shooty death lazers in the here and now.

HA HA!

>>1093568

in space stations orbiting saturn

>>1093828
>hypersonic
>in space
Caught ya.

>>1093771
this movie could be awesome

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cXajDfvQ1Z8&feature=channel

turns out that the director is a /b/tard.

this could be fun.

>>1093832
Holy crap, I love this movie now.

Also, am I a racist if I thought the bird crapping on the statue was uncalled for?

>>1093844

Just need a naval rail cannon to launch a 10kg slug, it'd be about the size of a crowbar. Then launch a few tons worth of them. Enjoy.

>>1093851
Hypersonic sounds cool... you know what i mean, bunches of thousands of... checking my notes... OH FUCK AWESOME! I can get the bolts over 10km/s with assistance from high orbital velocity! We are gonna be doing one thing, and one thing only! Keelin' naht-zees!

>>1093873
Nope

>>1093382
icwhatyoudidthere.jpg

First corporations set up bases on the Moon, but later find a Nazi Moon base on the other side of the planet. Who wins? Will the lowest bidder, oppressed workforce of Earth bound corporations overpower the master race?

>>1093902
No, he will join them!

First corporations set up bases on the Moon, but later find a Nazi Moon base on the other side of the world. Who wins? Will the lowest bidder, oppressed workforce of Earth bound corporations overpower the master race?

>>1093419
Fuck.
Anarchist.
Ideals.

>>1093907
Who is he?

think.... Antarctica

>>1093931
Santa?

>>1093954
That's the Arctic. Antarctica is the the one on the other side of the plant.

>>1093979

>>1093913
Anon was asking "if its a fight between a corperation's slave and space nazis, would he win?"

And if it were me, Mr. Idecidewhodies, someone smart enough to be bestowed the ability to choose who has the right to live, i would choose to join the nazis.

Venus Project can fix this

>>1093994
Looks like mister "I decide who dies" is about to meet mister "Orbital Carpet Bomb Strike! I choose you!".

>>1094010
Well then hes not fighting, is he? hes getting owned.
If it were actually some sort of "fight", you should have the ability to surrender and offer your services to the other side.

I guess it depends on your definition of "fight" tho.

>>1093988

>>1094022
Damn, you are smart... hey, while you're in the Nazi base, to prevent the orbital bombardment... put a canister of CO2 in the O2 supply, cut the CO2 filters, put on a spacesuit, and then open a door. Air loss kills some, they seal it, begin air replacement... and it all just spirals downhill from there. It'll be hilarious.

>>1094031
Whatever. Seeing that Iron Sky is yet to be released by those amazing finnrolls, neither of us have much of any idea of the base structure.

I also doubt the nazis would let a captured person wander the base alone.

>>1093633
You're assuming there's a reason to haul it back to Earth.

>>1094216
Demand.

>>1094222
Fuck Earth. Are they going to pay you in space dollars? Just where do you "drop off" a giant hunk of steel 13km across? Are you going to carve it and think you're beating the prices of mining on Earth? Are they going to rocket launch your money up to you? Industry will follow to where the resources are. The demand will also be in space.

>>1093621
fuck yeah I wanna be a space miner
loved doing that shit in SWG

I SHALL FIGHT AND DIE FOR THE CORPORATION

I doubt we'll ever see the private sector able to do something as amazing as space colonization.
As it is even Intel can't afford to do research that won't turn a real profit more than 7~10 years down the line, and with a limited investment.
The truth of the matter is that the private sector has never been much good for research; I doubt that will ever change as long as its profit-bound.

If you leave it up to the corporations we'd never have a space program until it became profitable to go there.

Really the only thing that will promote space travel in my eyes is war and competition between countries.

The space industry will only boom when it becomes an industry. Right now space only costs money. Once someone can turn a decent buck on space, we will see growth like never before.

Corporations are better driving forces at colonization than anyone else.

Look at the fucking Hudsons Bay Company. They practically created Canada.

>>1094274
One day Earth will be mined out. On that day demand will increase enough to make space mining profitable.

>>1094360
No. Efficiency of space travel will make it profitable before the earth's lacking of resources makes it necessary

>>1094367
No. Fuel will run out before mining becomes profitable or space travel becomes efficient. We will never colonize space.

>>1094382
I'm trying to be optimistic goddamnit

>>1094382
I'm trying to be optimistic god damn it

>>1094367
Rockets will never be cheap.

inb4starshipenterprise

>>1094395
Well don't. There is no getting around things getting a hell of a lot worse on Earth before humans start venturing into the unforgiving realm of space.

>>1094402
You seem to forget that the space nazis figured out anti-gravity in 1945 in Antarctica and have already colonized the dark side of the moon

The private sector will destroy the planet long before the public sector can come up with the fancy new toys it needs to colonize space.

>>1093368
they will obey the laws of nature

>>1094382

Godammit /sci/, why are you so full of depressing fatalists? Jesus, it's like your lives are so horrible you can't even consider the possibility of something good happening.

>>1096881
Don't worry, though vocal, they still are in the minority.

As a balancing force, I'm super-idealistic and believe we will keep on spreading and changing for the better, transforming everything in our space of influence into SCIENCE and AWESOME, all the way to the end, when we and all out brother intelligences escape the dying cosmos or revitalize it.

And then we'll do it all over again but do it in EVEN MORE AWESOME WAYS!

but a worker who thinks that their job is all that there is will judge life relative to his job and not be depressed

>Corporations oppress workers in industrial space colonies
>Viva la revolucion

>>1096924

Thank you.

>>1096924

>>1096881
It's the optimists that will cause the gawdam problem!

Everything will be all right.
Everything will be all right.
Everything will be all right.
Everything will be all right.
Everything will be all right.
Everything will be all right.
Oh shit, everything isn't alright.
Too bad I didn't listen to the realists who wanted to actually work hard to solve the problems of the future beforehand.

>>1097077

Everything will not be allright, but it will not be as bad as you fuckheads think.

The Company is in control. All is well.

>>1097077
an optimist is someone who thinks working on a problem will solve it, so they aren't worried or depressed, they're working.
Pessimists think the problem is insoluable and so spend all their efforts poopooing people who are thinking of it as solvable.

>>1097077
Did someone say thatbeing idealistic means sitting with your thumb in your ass, expecting everything to go the way we want?

Fuck no!

I'm a fucking eudaimonistic idealist! That means I'll work till my spine pops and my brain liquefies if that's what it takes to make a great future come about for ALL OF US.

It's the fatalistic assholes who will be sprawled on the floor, saying there's nothing worth doing because nothing matters and everything is shit and ugly.

Fuck that shit!

In the old days such people would have let themselves be eaten by sabertooths while the idealists realized that "Hey! Gize! Look, if we sharpen these sticks, they could, in theory, penetrate that things thick hide! LET'S GO GET 'IM!!!" and many died but in the end, the heroes got all the bitzhes, all the newfangled beer and the lions share of the meat.
And it was the sabertooths that went extinct. NOT US.

So stop cutting yourself and BE AWESOME

>>1097121

Approves of your attitude.

>>1097121

I approve.

>>1097121
That's the TRUE /sci/duck spirit bro!

>>1097121
I shouldn't be suprised the word "eudaimonistic" exists, but yeah, that's that.

>>1097181
Why would you be surprised? Unless you are simply unfamiliar with the term?

>>1097177

What's the source of that pic?

>>1097121
So what are you going to do about it?

>>1097194
it's an incredibly specific, esoteric term, like, i dunno, gravinertial tensor or something. I mean, i know the language is completely open source, but it still amuses me what pops up from antiquity from time to time.

>>1097208

bump for this.

>>1097208
It's a member of a future Daft Punk.

Earth runs out of resources. Space mining becomes profitable.
Corporations take advantage of workers. There are no governments in space.

The future is going to suck, but at least humanity will endure.
>NOTHING THAT SAFEGUARDS HUMANITY CAN BE EVIL, NOT EVEN THE MOST STRENUOUS INHUMANITY. IF THE HUMAN RACE FAILS IT HAS FAILED FOREVER.

Pessimist means a person who sees how a situation is bad. Optimist means a person who see how a situation is good. Fatalism is a philosophical doctrine emphasizing the subjugation of all events or actions to fate or inevitable predetermination. Idealism is the act or practice of envisioning things in an ideal form

>>1097121
None of that matters if nothing matters and it would be much easier to just masterbate, do drugs, and convince myself to be happy with that until I die than that shit you just said. Try refuting the idea that nothing matters before you say it is good to try to 'do things'.

>>1097212
In my function as a teacher, I will try and instill at least some measure of this striving to everyone I teach. Make them use their brains and learn to enjoy it.

In my function as a private person, I will do the same.

In my function as a head of business, I strive to be as successfull as possible without alienating people, thus increasing the impact of what I say.

>>1097305
Knowing nothing matters is important or it isn't.

If it isn't important then who the fuck cares?
If it is important that it is just as important surviving so that someone is around to know nothing matters, thus humanity must endure because if we die then no one will know nothing matters.

>>1097305
I would refure it, but if someone is so fatalistic, it is sometimes better to just let them go and try to diminish their impact on the future of other people.

>>1097317
> I will try and instill at least some measure of this striving to everyone I teach.
Striving? Striving towards what?

like in Moon?

>>1097339
Do you not believe in determinism?

>>1097355
Towards whatever they will.
People will always be interested in different things, so guiding them to a path is not the way to go.
Making them think, making them realize themselves what they are the best at and encouraging them onward on that path is both easier and more rewarding.

>>1097401
Words to live by, because you cannot live without them.

>>1097395

who does

>>1097395
No. Every human has choices.
In a bad spot one can either bawww and hide under the covers or do their FUCKING DAMNEDEST to make it out.

I used to be fatalistic too, but when I hit rock bottom, I finally realized this. Took me 35 years of SSDD before I finally took myself to task.

And I can tell you, the years after it have been fucking good.

>>1097432

P. much same here.