/sci/ - Science & Math

I would guess it's because humans have bigger, more complex brains than other animals.

>>10838980
I'm leaning towards sleep is a mechanism to prevent us from going insane.
Because we must sleep, all rational thought is limited to just one day.
If it wasn't, we would just hung ourselves.

>>10838980
>Why do we sleep
Because our brains evolved into becoming like that. We evolved into needing to sleep as a survival strategy because of bad night vision and to keep still at night while predators were lurking.
We evolved into sleeping longer than some animals because our night vision is real shitty.

>why do we dream?
Because like the liver and heart, the brain can never truly shut down

There you go. I just answered the unanswerable.

>>10838980
>Why can some people function on less sleep than others?

That's something you can get used to.
We only really need 5 hours of sleep.

>Why can some people function on less sleep than others?
Genetics. There are genes for how long you sleep as well as whether you're a morning or night person.

>>10839382
>Because our brains evolved into becoming like that. We evolved into needing to sleep as a survival strategy because of bad night vision and to keep still at night while predators were lurking.
We evolved into sleeping longer than some animals because our night vision is real shitty.
this is so fucking handwavy

>>10839382
>Because our brains evolved into becoming like that. We evolved into needing to sleep as a survival strategy because of bad night vision and to keep still at night while predators were lurking. We evolved into sleeping longer than some animals because our night vision is real shitty.
this is so fucking handwavy

>>10838980
Look into biphasic and polyphasic sleep. If you can handle a fucking DEMANDING week of a transition period, you can take naps that add up to hours of less sleeping time with as much REM (or even more) than you get from monophasic sleep.

This is a little bit /x/ but Stephen King says it well:

>No live organism can continue for long to exist sanely under conditions of absolute reality; even larks and katydids are supposed, by some, to dream.

We as a species are just more aware and ‘exposed’ to the true nature of our surroundings, and analyse things more. We compensate for that by sleeping more. I sleep 9 hours everyday, although I sometimes wake up after 8 1/2. Its just because I can afford to do so, and I like being well rested.

>>10840160
polyphasic sleep is a meme, which is why my roommate and I tried it ironically and succeeded for over two months. Honestly it's not good for your health in the long run.
If you're not a masochist like me, don't fall for the ubermeme. If you do fall for the ubermeme make sure you have someone with you to go all the way, and be sure to use icewater for your alarm system.

https://www.nih.gov/news-events/nih-research-matters/how-sleep-clears-brain

>>10840271
>polyphasic sleep is a meme
Yeah, you probably rushed into the Uberman with a horrible transition and, I assume, you didn't try out any other schedule beforehand.
>icewater for your alarm
This is how I know you fucked up. Start with something simple like biphasic sleep where you're training to get two three-hour sessions and from there (after adjusting) you can break them into 90 minute sessions and eventually drop one of the 4 sessions to have a total of 3 90-minute sessions. If you want even less sleep, change one of the 90-minute sessions into two 20-minute sessions.

t. Polyphasic sleeping for two and a half years, doesn't into coffee

>>10840737
Not that guy but even if it worked how do you handle going to sleep at fixed times? Usually people take 10-30 minutes to sleep unless is 2 am or well after 16 hours of being awake.
Plus all troubles that life throws at you:
Work, traffic,health problem, dates with people, going out, timezones,travel, emergencies, people can hardly go to sleep at set times now.

>>10840396

I'm surprised it took this many posts to bring this up. Yeah sleep is basically a cleaning mechanism for the brain to prevent Amyloid beta build up.

In other words less sleep means increase danger of cognitive decline as the Amyloid beta build up is one of the main components to Alzheimer's.

I would love to try polyphasic sleep but it just takes me to long to fall asleep, I can lay down as long as 3 hours because I do so and it has always been like that for me.

>>10839683
Yeah, more details would be nice.

>>10840787
Amyloid beta is not the cause of Alzheimer's, it's a symptom and a protection mechanism against misfolded, defective proteins which are effectively prions.

>>10840737
Krabs!

>>10838980
we actually sleep less than many other animals so I think this is a loaded question.

>>10839382
my night vision and orientation is amazing; I can do just about everything in the dark. try again.

>>10840751
>work, travel, dates, emergencies

Youre talking to people on 4channel, a large portion never do these things ever

>>10838980
>Why can’t humans get by with less sleep

Sleep when you get tired. Why is this a hard concept?

Learn from Thomas Edison:
https://www.brainpickings.org/2013/02/11/thomas-edison-on-sleep-and-success/

>>10840787
>>10842769
What does a person's brain start to look like if they are spending inhuman amount of time awake, like say meth addicts awake for weeks at a time.

>>10840751
The whole point of transitioning and training is to get your brain used to less sleep time. This way, you go into REM faster and get deep sleep which is why you feel so rested on such short sleep time. Also, your brain will learn to make you fall asleep faster so as to not miss any precious deep sleep, sub 2 minutes to fall asleep at most.

After about your first month getting used to a different type of sleep schedule, you'll be able to tell how long a perfect nap is for you and you'll learn when and how to schedule naps if you want to eventually change the times you nap.

Also, >>10843694 has a point. I'm a working student and I still have friends, but I admit the biggest drawback polyphasic sleep has is that it doesn't fit the lifestyle of most people: if you work a standard 9 to 5 and like to do everything while the sun is up, then it's not for you.

>>10840737
>Yeah, you probably rushed into the Uberman with a horrible transition and, I assume, you didn't try out any other schedule beforehand.
no... read it again you dumb motherfucker

>>10838980
because there's no evolutionary benefit to getting by with less sleep

>>10845360

my cat is very sleepy if i wake him up

>>10844513
>This way, you go into REM faster and get deep sleep which is why you feel so rested on such short sleep time. Also, your brain will learn to make you fall asleep faster so as to not miss any precious deep sleep, sub 2 minutes to fall asleep at most.

The other sleep phases are important. Sleeping in 99% REM is a bad idea.

>>10839382
Fuck off

>>10839387
>5 hours
This is contrary to most sleep studies, it would take 15 seconds of google to learn this. Anecdotally my cognition is noticeably impaired both to myself and others when I sleep less than 8-10 a night.

>>10846687
I think it's supposed to be 7 hours is normal

>>10839382
> evolve a whole process of brain regulation, dreaming and bodily rejuvination instead of just more rod cells lmao
Nope

>>10838980
Other animals take many naps, that's why they sleep "less".
We too can go with less sleep if we adopt a polyphasic sleeping pattern.
When you get old you need less sleep they say, I don't know if this is because old geezers don't do fuck all day or because of biology.
I think it also depends on mental stress, the brain consumes a lot when focusing on complex tasks.

>>10848688
Nope what?

>>10846379
It's not actually entirely REM, there is non-REM but it goes through the first two stages of non-REM way faster than monophasic sleeping. By the third stage you are already in deep sleep which takes only minutes, then it should take you into REM and start cycling through the sleep stages as normal.

I've been doing this two and a half years (give or take) and I'd consider myself a pretty healthy person, my only "unhealthy" area of life being my social life. I work in a warehouse and listen to music so I don't talk to anybody and I also live alone. I truly wish there were more research in this area but I have to say from my own experience that it has been incredibly beneficial for productivity; however, I do not believe that polyphasic sleep is for everyone.

Darn it all I want to do is know what’s the best for my health so I’m the most alert/receptive to information/whatever.

Can I just get 7hr a night and call it good? What convoluted method is actually the most effective?

>>10845640
he mentions he was successful for two months

>>10851552
That’s unironically better than most of the meme shit you see itt. I just get 9, don’t ever party or socialise and call if a day. Good riddance to those things, sleeping more is always fantastic

humans have larger and more complex brains than any other animal, and sleep is the one state in which basic brain sanitation can occur. the organic waste material that builds up in the brain can't be expelled efficiently in waking states when all areas of the brain need to be active. it's when the brain is relatively inactive (i.e., sleep) when different functions relax and sanitary processes can take place.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6353118/

it's also worth noting that modern industrialized humans sleep far less than any other mammals. ever notice your dog sleeps for +14 hours a day? part of that is because you're a piece of shit who doesn't play with his dog. the other part is that we somehow came to a common understanding that sleep is weak and definitely not necessary (see: high rates of cvd, cancer, stroke, and neurosis in western nations)

>>10838980
Because it conserves energy during a time of the day when you can't do much, helps you consolidate memories, improves regenerative processes in the body and is part of the diurnal cycle system that regulates body functions. Without sleep you are throwing everything overboard

>>10843547
kek

>>10843547
based

fuck diurnal subhumans

>>10839304
Yeah, but insanity comes from brain mechanisms not working correctly. During the sleep, neural connections are strengthened, problems and errors that occured during the day are repaired and normal state of body is restored. So basically, sleep, is just a mechanism to fix and recover our body and brain.
We spend energy on every day activities, and because of that, our mechanisms wear out. Mechanisms that produce chemicals and emotions which manipulate our thoughts wear out too, and work very unevenly, which produce borderline and insanity.
So, insanity is just a result of not getting enough sleep, but sleep is not a mechanism to prevent insanity

>>10840812
seconding this, I feel like i'm used to getting less sleep because of how long it takes me to actually fall asleep. I'd be interested in seeing how the phases of sleep vary depending on the person

>>10851710
What?

>>10840271
What would you recommend, then?

>>10846097
give this man a nobel

>>10839270
It's actually the big brained animals like whales which can do with little sleep, I think.

>>10851555
He also mentions having a bucket of ice water for an alarm system. If it takes that much to wake you up, then you're not doing it correctly.

>>10839382
>There you go. I just answered the unanswerable.
clap clap clap

the body produces enough cerebrospinal fluid to replace itself completely, or flush, every 7.5 hours

coincidentally this is the recommended amount of time needed for a good nights sleep. If we find a way to produce CSF at a faster rate, would that decrease the hours of sleep needed, or increase quality of sleep?? would standing up while sleeping help CSF drain/flow faster and increase sleep, or is the rate CSF exits the brain controlled by increased cranial pressure which occurs from producing more CSF?

feel free to call me out for this terrible idea, I'll admit I'm stupid

>>10839382
>We evolved into needing to sleep as a survival strategy

You haven't explained anything with that statement - just put forth specious logic with no provable hypothesis between a seemingly correlated association of two activities.

>this rock keeps away tigers Lisa!
>but how can you prove that - it's specious logic!
>Do you see any tigers? Therefore this rock must be keeping them away!

>>10855802
It's probably convergent evolution that's a direct result of day/night cycle of our planet. Creatures can only specialize for day time or night time activity, so logically it's smart to rest/repair during the time of day that's a creature is not adapted to.

I best most aliens sleep also, but if they evolved on planet that's tidally locked, and has no day/night, maybe they'd never sleep? Maybe. That's my crazy theory/idea anyway.

>>10855816
Of course, less room for life on worlds like that...

>>10839304
Why?

>>10855816
Actually theres a test for that.
Do deep sea and cave dwelling creatures sleep?

>>10838980
Humans are jelous when somebody smokes meth, because they don't have balls to say no to drugs.