/sci/ - Science & Math

>>10747041
Biggest issue would be the risk of the gas giant entering a volatile cycle and rapidly expanding, swallowing the moon and suffocating the inhabitants. Furthermore, if there were multiple moons there would eventually be collisions with other moons due to orbital alterations.

>>10747352
Volatile cycle?

>>10747352
this is now a schizo thread

Tidal heating is a bitch

>>10748780
Elaborate.

>>10750251
Seconded

>>10747041
Extreme radiation.

>>10747352
>I'm going to pretend like this would be spontaneous.
Why you fucking schizo?!

>>10747041
Earth might get tidally locked. The giant could obscure the sun for long periods, especially if all orbits were co-planar. The radio noise would be unbelievable as would aurora borealis. Radios might be useless. Too close in and the planet would be fried (ref Io around Jupiter)

Jupiter has 4 large stable moons, I guess that is a reasonable number. Also such a gas giant could support at least one planet in Lagrange points L4 and L5.
We might not have a moon for ourselves, unless it was co-orbital in reality.

>>10748780
Only if you are too close.

>>10751168
Radio, yes. Not sure about ionizing radiation.

>>10748765
Second.

>>10752126
>Too close in and the planet would be fried (ref Io around Jupiter)

But not all the gas giants in the solar system have magnetic fields like Jupiter's. Saturn's is much less intense, and those of Uranus and Neptune much weaker than that.

All are stronger than Earth's, though.

>>10752126
>Not sure about ionizing radiation.
Look at the flux tube with jupiter and io.
Honestly the bigger problem would be that gas giants are comet and asteroid magnets, and it would increase the probability of impact events.

>>10752349
>Uranus and Neptune
Aren't those classified as ice giants these days?

>>10752405
>Look at the flux tube with Jupiter and Io.
Essentially a huge continuous spark. That still isn't quite ionizing radiation though the spark itself will ionize and fry anything.

>>10752415
It's plasma, ionized gas. Zipping through a stream of electrons isn't going to be a great day, whether its from beta decay, or just highly energetic electrons

>>10752126
Source on that map?
That's really fucking cool. Reminds me of Gundam or something.

>>10752126
>No Tycho Under
0/10 moon
Would not liberate with ancap revolution.

>>10752446
Sure: https://www.deviantart.com/ynot1989/art/2051-Luna-and-Orbit-667008997
I collect a lot of images, but sorting them is a hassle.

>>10750251
>>10751140
Lots of geological activity and instability if there are any other large moons. Getting stretched and pulled by other large bodies warms up the core.
It's why Io is so volcanic, and Europa has sub-glacial seas.

>>10752519
What if there are other Earth-like moons?

>>10754583
Where? In our solar system - unlikely. The closest you have is Titan, having lakes, the temperature is just a tad cool. Outside our solar systems it is quite possible but I don't think current technologies allow for detection of that.

>>10754583
They'd suffer the same problems. Your innermost orbital body is going to feel more of the tidal stresses than the outermost, but the tug and pull from all of them are going to be influencing them.
Ganymede is bigger than the Moon. Shit, it's bigger than Pluto and Mercury. It's almost as big as mars - and that is enough to keep Io and Europa warm. Something earth sized squishing another earth sized planet is going to be a bit more drastic.
Other incidentals in a system like this, even if your planet is tidally locked to the gas giant (it should) your earth sized moon is still orbiting, probably in a resonance, and when it comes by you're going to see some shit. Every third Lunation/Year you'd have some huge tidal waves that would make it hard to permanently inhabit the coast. The surfing would be absolutely gnarly though, and pros would travel across the Human Empire to shred the waves of a double spring tide on Swayzee VI in the Keanu system.
Erosion would be a big problem.

>>10756104
What effect would that have on the moon's magnetic field?

>>10757399
Long shot: gravitational kneading keeps the core liquid and thus allows the dynamo to operate. The lunar core is tiny and dynamo is frozen.

>>10754583
theres no if

>>10747041
Well the sun is made of gas and plasma, and a planet is literally a star's moon, so we literally do live on a gas giant's moon

>>10757555
Another thing to think about is that if these giant moons formed around not-jupiter they probably wouldn't have a ton of heavy elements since most of that should have been gobbled up by the gas giant during formation so your dynamo might not have enough iron and nickel for a strong magnetic field.
If they were captured by the gas giant later you should be fine.

>>10758185
Most gold (and other heavy elements) on earth probably arrived with meteors after the planet had gotten a solid crust, as the initial heavy elements sank to the core. With some luck that could also happen to our hypothetical moon.

For instance Psyche is thought to be the core of a planetesimal and rich in metals. A lot of uranium is thought to be useful to keep the core liquid too.

>>10758753
Huh

>>10760165
People plan to grab Psyche. It would annihilate the Chinese stronghold on rare earth metals and has enough gold and platinum to obliterate the previous metal market.

We have known uranium reserves for 200 years at current use, and with the proposed 10 x increase in nuclear power that would become a big issue. Again Psyche might contain enough uranium to keep us going for centuries.

>>10760259
>previous
*precious, I meant. BTW seems to be a lot of articles about that the last few days.

>>10750251
volcanoes and earthquakes

>>10747041
I can imagine that living on Europa or Enceladus would be some sort of frozen hell, like living on Antarctica, but with giant extraterrestrial cephalopods trying to hunt you.

>>10760259

what's to stop the chinese from hunting aquatic alien life to extinction for some bs holistic medicine.

They are already ruining our world whose to say they wont to it to others.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T8OCR1suKcs

>>10761342
It is disturbing how obsessed they are with "traditional medicine" that always seem to be centred on impotence issues. It is so insane I have considered putting out the rumour that ordinary local weed is an aphrodisiac and then see Chinese eradicating it.

>>10748780
Tidal heating could allow otherwise uninhabitable moons to support liquid water

>>10761837
Like Europa?

>>10761837
Wouldn't it be covered in ice, though?

>>10764400
Sure. The oceans are deep underneath the ice. The ice provides thermal and radiation protection.

Another problem is the risk of more meteorite impacts reseting life to simple lifeforms.
The Gas giant would attract a lot of objects within the system.

>>10761342
>what's to stop the chinese from hunting aquatic alien life to extinction for some bs holistic medicine.
Based Chinese

>>10747041
Titan would be relatively habitable. You'd need oxygen, water and protection from the cold, but it'd be easier to live there than many other places in the Solar System.

>>10766846
Supposedly there is ice on Titan but it is frozen so hard it is more like concrete. With a power source you can thaw it, drink and electrolyse it for oxygen. It is so brutally cold you need a lot of power.

>>10766898
Doesn't Titan have an atmosphere?

>>10767958
Yes. Wiki:
>The atmosphere of Titan is largely nitrogen; minor components lead to the formation of methane and ethane clouds and nitrogen-rich organic smog. The climate—including wind and rain—creates surface features similar to those of Earth, such as dunes, rivers, lakes, seas (probably of liquid methane and ethane), and deltas, and is dominated by seasonal weather patterns as on Earth. With its liquids (both surface and subsurface) and robust nitrogen atmosphere, Titan's methane cycle is analogous to Earth's water cycle, at the much lower temperature of about 94 K (−179.2 °C; −290.5 °F).

So a space suit for Titan would need a lot of insulation since the presence of a dense atmosphere would cause quick cooling.

Isn't gas giant radioactive as fuck? The moons would be sterile.

>>10768973
I think I heard something a bit different somewhere...

>>10770440
Please go on?

>>10761837
Radioactive cores could also do the trick. If a moon captured the core of a shattered planetesimal, it would gain a lot of heat from radioactive decay.

>>10773377
Wouldn't the radiation be a problem, though?

>>10752349
What would that cause?

>>10774710
Depends. If uranium sinks to the bottom with potassium, there could still be a crust of silicates that would shield oceanic life from the radiation. Heat would still flow through the crust.

>>10776223
As mentioned earlier, Jupiter and Saturn as gas giants. These are expected to have a core of metallic hydrogen, an exotic material that might be superconducting and most likely is highly conductive and when rotating generates a large magnetic field. Saturn, being smaller, has less metallic hydrogen and thus a smaller field is generated.

Uranus and Neptune as ice giants and might not have any significant metallic hydrogen.

>>10777102
Couldl something like that be close enough for a moon to be in the habitable zone?

>>10777976
The question is a but ambiguous.

A: gas giant (and thus the moon) in the habitable zone around the star): yes, that is possible. "Hot Jupiters" is the term for gas giants found close to a star but we do not understand the mechanisms here. Also it now seems our Jupiter was once close to the sun and then migrated out, causing the late heavy bombardment.

B: a gas giant itself setting up a habitable zone, far from the star: probably not, though a much larger gas giant close to nuclear ignition might do. Mass would have to be about 25 x that of Jupiter. Radiation might be too rangerous.

>>10778657
What about ice giant stability?

Assuming this thing is tidally locked, half the planet is facing the gas giant. Which would cause far shorter days on that side, not to mention the horror of staring up in the sky at this monstrous thing looming over you.

>>10779448
I am not sure, but I never heard of instability about Uranus or Neptune. Of course something rather cataclysmic must have happened to tip a planet 90 degrees but I have no idea if that was internal instability or external forces. The energy involved must have been enormous, the greatest cow tipping ever.

>>10779591
Horror?

>>10778657
>was once close to the sun and then migrated out
How long would it take for that to happen just with tidal orbital decay? Like how the moon lengthens the rotational period of the Earth.

>>10781165
Not sure how a moon would get a gas giant to migrate outwards, not sure if anyone know yet.

>>10779591
Not sure it would be a horror view but it sure would influence the weather a lot.

>>10747041
how could you live on a gas giant stupid? you would just fall right through it, it's gas, not solid

>>10784786
Clearly you have not read books by Clifford Simak.

>>10751168
Ouch

>>10786602
If the radiation is too much you could argue it is not in the habitable zone which was the original premise.