/sci/ - Science & Math

get irradiated

28 JUNE 2019 - BE THERE

>>10720754
That's a very 90s PopSci/PopMech illustration

>>10720754
>Without any friction from the air or the weather
???
>the rocket is able to travel at up to 18,000mph miles per hour
fucking brainlets

>>10720798
looks like a vibrator

what the fuck did elon's 'fun' mean when it came to the question about the roll? Is he trolling

>>10720799
it's very nostalgic

>>10720802
friction in leo is negligible, although they're going to want to use hypersonic lift to extend range for point to point

>>10720811
he means you're going to pull 8gs on reentry

>>10720819
It was more about friction from 'weather'

>>10720827
it's a spoof of popsci/popmech rags, the complete retardation is authentic

>>10720831
No, it's a real graphic that was in the Daily Mail... https://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-6175787/Elon-Musk-unveils-new-images-SpaceXs-Big-F-ing-Rocket-ahead-lunar-mission-announcement.html

>>10720832
it's in the Daily Mail, the complete retardation is to be expected

>>10720811
Just fucking with the estronaut, it was probably done to get data for future missions.

>>10720798
I love the mock ups but I have yet someone that firmly stands by it not looking like a washed out steel dildo with odd creases and everything.

do NTRs really need to have control rods? Does liquid hydrogen enter the reactor core?

>>10720959
>do you need a way to reduce the heat output of your reactor when you're not actively running coolant (read: propellant) through it????

>>10720798
Is that some new type of dildo?

.

>>10721279
What's this supposed to imply? Trump's statement is on the ineffectiveness of spending to date on accomplishing anything.

>>10721279
I take it the people who post this are either uneducated, only passed English class thanks to Bell curve, or are not EoP. Maybe it is just the old saying, "People only hear what they want to hear," and can't actually read the entirety of the tweet and/or understand it.

>>10720754
Outdated picture, BFR is going to be taller than Saturn V now.

>>10720959
Yes and yes.

>>10720803
>>10720943
>>10721278
>haha penis
you have to be 18+ to use this site

>>10721406
seething

>>10720754
Hop you faggot

>>10720803
ouch

>>10721279
Trump is a moron but surely even an 80IQ redneck could see this meant to say that going to the moon is part of the practice and knowledge needed for Mars? Not hard to figure out if you know how words work.

>>10721279
>when you hate trump so much you deliberately read at a 1st grade level

>>10721772
I don't think that the image is criticizing Trumps oddly formated tweet (of which the Moon is a part), I think it's criticizing Trump supporting returning to the Moon and then seemingly changing his mind on it.

>>10721772
>>defending 1st grade level writing

>>10721779
What part of the tweet makes you think he changed his mind about going to the Moon before Mars?
It literally says the going to the Moon is part of going to Mars...
>>10721805
No matter how poorly written it is, only a truly delusional retard would think he said the Moon is part of Mars, or that he doesn't want NASA to go to the Moon.

>>10721848
>Americans honest defend their highest office speaking like a kindergartener
I shouldn't be surprised, they were the ones who put el donaldo tragica in office.

>>10721848
>What part of the tweet makes you think he changed his mind about going to the Moon before Mars?
Well when Trump started to support NASAs goal to go back to the moon there were ideas being passed around in the American aerospace industry of lunar landers and moon bases. Trump seemed to be for that until the tweet, which implied that he was changing his mind on it. Instead of going to the moon to stay, he now wants to go to the moon to go to Mars.

Granted such criticisms forget that NASAs idea of using the moon as a prelude to Mars was the original intent, but given how often presidents cancel NASA projects for silly reasons people probably jumped the gun on Ol' Orange Man. Or at least thats how I'm seeing it.

>>10721884
>Instead of going to the moon to stay, he now wants to go to the moon to go to Mars.

Those two goals are not in conflict.

The bottom line is, for all the funding NASA receives, we ought to have both lunar and Mars program well underway. Look at what SpaceX accomplished with order of magnitude less funding. Trump is right for calling NASA out on their incompetence.

>>10721884
America Getting to the moon or Mars us a pipe dream anyways. Political corruption means that uts going to be cancelled to put money towards Congress salaries as soon as the next president takes office. China are the ones who are going be landing on Mars and colonizing the moon, they are the only ones who can.

A pic taken tonight of StarHopper. Work continues this evening.

>thread turns into \pol\ when nothing is going on
Making a general was a mistake.
>nobody even bothered to post a link to the launch thread

>>10721909
China are the leaders of space in this day and age and that is fact

>>10721533
dilate

>>10721889
>Those two goals are not in conflict.
I know, but others might not know and thats the point I'm trying to explain.

>The bottom line is, for all the funding NASA receives, we ought to have both lunar and Mars program well underway.
Agreed. Apollo could be remade with a third of the money spent on the International "lets grow crystals in space for 30 years" Space Station.

>>10721927
We should have never ditched the Saturn rocket

>>10721917
By what measure? Their most powerful operational rocket, the Long March 5 is much less capable than a Falcon Heavy, and can't be reused like the SpaceX rocket can. The most notable Chinese space probe only made it to the far side of the moon. Meanwhile, NASA has sent probes to the far stretches of the solar system, and has an active rover (Curiosity) rolling around Mars. And the Euros have done neat stuff too, like landing a probe on a comet.

China's actual space abilities honestly aren't much more advanced that what the US & Soviet Union were managing in the 1970s.

>>10721894
>Political corruption means that uts going to be cancelled to put money towards Congress salaries as soon as the next president takes office.

That is why it is crucial to decouple spaceflight from the corrupt politicians as much as possible. SpaceX and commercial space in general is a step towards this direction. Reduce the role of government to funding only and leave design, assembly, operation and ownership to private companies.

Reminder, its been almost 50 years since we last went to another planetary body.

>>10721987
38 days until 50th Apollo 11 landing anniversary

Starhopper untethered hop would be a nice gift for the occasion

>>10721909
you missed it. its there in the last thread.

>>10721986
>>10721964
SpaceX cannot compete with the Chinese system of space exploration. They have a perfect mesh of private and government sector. China has a tempo of launches and exploration never before seen, it will not be long before they begin moon and Mars landing and operations.

>>10722041
>China have had less attempted launches than the US this year so far and all private attempts and one state launch have failed to reach orbit, all while the crucial next launch of the LM-5 has continued to slip.

Your right Chang, they are truly the masters of spaceflight...

When is Latin America going to start pulling its weight in space.

>>10722062
https://spacenews.com/u-s-brazil-agreement-goes-beyond-launch/

>>10720798
Hope its not a hyperloop prototype.

>>10722062
French Guiana would like to have a word with you.

>>10722209
>the last remnant of European colonialism can into space
the French do good work over there

Give it to me straight. Is the M Engine a meme and a pipe dream, or will we ever get it working?

>>10722420
it's been debunked now for a while, officially
I think they stopped futzing with it

>>10722424
Was there ever any thrust, or was it thermal all along?

>>10722461
I don't remember, it might have been lorentz?

https://www.nasaspaceflight.com/2019/06/ula-new-innovations-vulcan/

ULA Preparing Proven Hardware and New Innovations for Vulcan

beautiful Starship renders over here

https://solarxploration.wixsite.com/concepts/images

>>10722499
>ICPS will feature One (1) RL-10C
holy underpowered, Batman

>>10722580
What the fuck.
When are we going to replace RL-10 with a medium sized hydrogen staged combustion engine? It's not like it'd be any more expensive than keeping the RL-10 dinosaur in production. We'd be able to build engines that were just as, if not more, efficient. The biggest difference is that the staged combustion engine doesn't have a fundamental thermodynamic upper limit on thrust.

>>10722580
It's a slightly beefed-up Delta IV Cryogenic Second Stage. No shit it's underpowered for a SHLV.

It's not meant to be anything more than a stopgap measure anyway. Contrary to what some say, EUS is still a thing. Even the administration is onboard with it now.

>>10721899
god it's so fucking big

>>10722594
Is it still 4 meter? Why aren't they trying to use the 5 meter Vulcan tanks?

>>10722588
The J-2X was a thing for a while.

>>10722605
Because:
1. That'd require some R&D and tweaking when the ICPS is supposed to be as drag-and-drop as possible so the SLS doesn't have to wait on the EUS
2. Boeing and LM would never let ULA bid jointly for the big-ticket SLS procurement items. They'd bid individually - all or nothing. ICPS gets a pass because it's not nearly as profitable, and it was what NASA wanted - something they could use for the initial SLS launches with as little R&D as possible.

>>10722599
UUUU

>>10722614
J-2X was just a gas generator engine though, not staged combustion. It would've had way more thrust than an RL-10 obviously but also significantly lower Isp.

Spektr-RG soon.

>>10722742
Ares I was the real cancer of Constellation. It was eating away at everything else.

The J-2X is a great example. Because of the Ares I it was designed to be a high thrust engine at the expense of its Isp.

Theoretically they could've probably saved it once Ares bit the dust, but they just dumped it at went for the RL-10s, because there was no longer any reason to spend so much money on an engine when the RL-10 fit the same niche just as well.

>>10721592
Are you calling liberals retarded?

>>10720754
>friction from weather
>travel at up to
>london hong kong in 34 minutes
very stupid

>>10722751

Well they are obviously. You have to be pretty mentaly challenged to be a "liberal" these days.

Anyway, here's a vid of the Proton-M with Spektr-RG being loaded for transport:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xakLQ2C3_dE

Launch is scheduled to be for June the 21st which is next week.

>>10722777
>launchpad explosion is scheduled for 21 June

>>10722479
I wish ULA was more independent from its parent companies. They've loosened their leash, but Boeing and LM still really limit what they can do with their tech.

>>10722786
Russia is better at launches and space flight than America, retard

>>10722913
when they're flying an R-7, yeah

>>10722915
Russia has had more launches and more accomplishments in space than NASA ever has had.
The soyuz and its rocket are still the best space fairing vehicles ever designed.

>>10722922
the modern R-7 is an absolute beauty in that perfect sweetspot of "good enough" and so old that even a total descent into technobarbarism couldn't stop it
I completely agree that it's among the best spacecraft ever flown, and that probably ever will fly, but it's capabilities are extremely limited

>>10722041
>Beaten to Mars by fucking India half a decade ago

Yes Zhang, probe on moon, very nice. Don't worry I'm sure you could catch up to the people who literally do not know what toilets are in a decade lmao

>>10722930
It's better than anything NASA or scamX has ever made.
Face it, Russia is better at spaceflight.

Reminder: Dont feed the trolls. They enjoy the attention.

so both the senate and house armed services committees have approved their versions of the space force. it looks like congress might approve a space force this year.

space is so interesting lately

>>10723051
It's not going to be anything exciting I guarantee. All you are getting is a reshuffle of existing air force assets and maybe some extra launch contracts for toys.

>>10723065
oh yeah i know, but i dont think i would've ever imagined that i'd live to see the dawn of space colonization or space militaries

>>10723044
Sethe and cope ameribitch

>>10720799
The best kind yes. Those dreamliners can go almost 10k miles holy shit.

Anyone know exactly what type of solid propellant the Sprint AGM had? Specifically the various constants and properties that can be used to model it? I got bored and started trying to "reimagine" the GyroJet concept and I'm looking for a high-thrust very-fast-burning propellant for it.

Thank you.

>>10723171
Forgot the image. Oops.

Multiple rings for the fuel and oxidizer tanks are in-work in Boca Chica.

Reminder: NASA's budget is about as much as every other countries' space budgets COMBINED.
>yanks with rocket tanks

>>10723179
Ok but if these other countries are spending their money less superfluously than NASA than effectively they could be coming close at effective R&D.

>>10723179
>19 billion dollars a year
>Still can't do anything useful for 50 years since Apollo

Lmao

>>10723175
is the same company building those tanks or is it a different one?

>>10723197
Same one, as far as I know.

>>10723044
reporting them is best of all, cause then they get banned and have to take a 3 day vacation from their rampant shitposting

>>10723196
Blame Senator Shelby and all the other quintuple niggers in congress

i've been thinking about martian infrastructure. what kind of degrees (non-engineering) would be good for it? masters degrees or post-bacc's since i have a bachelors already and won't be able to cut it in an engineering or physics program.

>>10723218
Get an electrical and plumbing certificate if you want a shot at going to Mars. There will be more engineers than they know what to do with and they will need people who can build and fix shit.

>>10723179
yeah but where's ARSE

>>10723188
NASA also shares a lot of technology with allied states and a good chunk of that budget is getting sucked into:
A. bureaucracy bullshit
B. the Deep Space Network
C. all sorts of useful things that only one organization on the planet needs to be bothered with

>>10720997
>>10721401
So it turns out they don't have control rods which go into the core, they have a control drum with little rotating rods on the outside for reflecting and absorbing neutrons pic related. Liquid hydrogen does appear to enter the core. Fuck that. Fuck that. Fuck everything about that. I want to model a solid core NTR reactor core. Multiphase flow with fucking neutron transport seems like it would be a fucking bitch.

>>10723274
full flow turbine with heat from an exchanger

>>10723046
Like a poetry hoverslam.

>>10723046
It's handy how that CGI'd cloud of dust hides the wreckage.

>>10723218
Nuclear/Chemical engineering. Battery + nuclear is perfect combo. But don't take this too seriously, email NASA/SpaceX and find out what sort of degrees/combinations are critical/good for potential future astronauts.

>>10723358
i wanted non-engineering or physics related degrees... i was thinking of degrees like GIS, construction management, environmental health, etc. or maybe something a little more exotic like space systems studies.

>>10723226
>electrical and plumbing
i agree with you, though those are licensed trades and not certs that you pick up at a university (at least, not here in america afaik). right now im just looking at university options.

>>10723404
https://www.nasa.gov/audience/forstudents/postsecondary/features/F_Astronaut_Requirements.html

Am I the only one here who likes spaceship ambience videos? Why can't I ever get a comfy spaceship room? Born too fucking early.

https://m.youtube.com/results?search_query=spaceship+ambience

>>10723453
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=4ZvhXs5Bx3Q

>>10723274
>MAX POWER

>>10721278
>>10720803
It's a bolmph.

>>10721279
>le bad orange man

This dude already did more for space exploration than two guys before him combined. He even offered NASA crazy funds to get Americans to Mars fast but NASA director said it's not a good idea to rush.

>>10723179
>2017

Really wonder how this will look in 2020. China will obviously be at least 3x bigger but ESA really needs more $ if they want to keep up too.

>>10723046
This was clearly filmed using the tank at NASA, you can see the wires and bubbles

>>10723274
that honestly looks fairly elegant for a rocket

>>10723820
Democrats are going to nuke NASA budget sooner or later

>>10723820
Prediction:
>USA. #1. USA. #1.
>Euros still #2
>SCHINA
>Ros-"we swear we're still relevant"-cosmos
>ISRO, aka, "how the FUCK do we manage to buy half-decent aerospace equipment with our budget?"
>Japan is just happy to be here.

>>10721294

Have you noticed all those NASA videos about 've are going back to the moon in a big way!' recently?

I'm just confused, is the focus building a moon base or is it going to Mars?

>>10724283
The focus is on spending a budget.

>>10723814
Congress didn't approve those funds though. I hate that Trump is the one to remember that NASA exists because he is such a divisive president, now, when we inevitably get a Democrat next year, whoever's it is will be hungrily eyeing NASA not as a gov agency, but as a very easy "Orange Man Project" they can destroy for liberal first bumps.

>>10723226
HVAC would be better.
Plumbing won't be needed on Mars any time soon, the first generation of colonists will shit in camp toilets, bags basically.

>>10724317
>dems
>winning
nice joke frind
Trump is winning without resistance, for the dems are too busy being overrun by batshit insane cultists to field anyone capable of challenging him

Spacecraft leaving Earth alert:
NET June 24, 2019 11:30 PM EST | SpaceX Falcon Heavy Space Test Program-2

>>10720803
Is there a market for Rocket dildos?

>>10724322
La creatura...

>The Chinese century has beg-

>It is rumored in Chinese aerospace forum that LM-5 core stage engine YF-77 failed again in a static fire test on 27 April 2019, and it was determined to be caused by a design flaw in the LOx turbopump which could not be fixed. It is also rumored that LM-5 return to flight is postponed indefinitely. If the rumor turns out to be true, Change-5,6, Mars exploration mission, and the space station will also be delayed indefinitely.

>>10720803
Just like every rocket

>>10724608
RIES! RIES!

>>10724744
>HERP! I've farren and I cant get up!

>>10724442
>11:30 PM EST
NIGHT LAUNCH
>NIGHT LAUNCH
NIGHT LAUNCH
>NIGHT LAUNCH
NIGHT LAUNCH
>NIGHT LAUNCH

https://www.nasa.gov/feature/nasa-to-partner-with-american-industry-to-supply-artemis-moon-missions

>>10724854
You burgers are gonna look real stupid when China gets to mars before you

>>10725019
China can't get their rockets to stop exploding, so they've completely given up on their current one.

hopper getting more photogenic as summer approaches, all dat shiny

>>10724744
>>10724854
only japs/koreans can't pronounce the L sound

>>10724306
Not so fast, old space scum.

>>10725033
still looks like some dude made it out of tinfoil in his backyard

>>10725033
Grinding out the welds, smoothing out the wrinkles. She's gonna look fuckin nice all polished up.

>>10725019
China has yet to even get an unmanned probe to Mars, something the US has been able to do since the 1970's; even the Indians managed to get a probe in orbit around Mars before China.

And then there is the rapid development rate of SpaceX's Starship, which is purposefully designed for bringing people to Mars. Does China have any rockets being designed & prototyped for a Mars ship right now?

>>10725118
their spies are stealing US tech as fast as they can, give them time

>>10725145
Makes me wonder what sort of security Space X has set up to keep the chinks from stealing their stuff. I know Ol'Musky has said that SpaceX files very few patents specifically because they know the Chinese would just copy it anyways.

>>10725167
Makes me wonder why copyright infringement seems so common in China. Is it due to the government being lazy in enforcing copyright? Too expensive to enforce it over there? Or is it a cultural thing?

>>10723036
It’s a good design but still old as hell.
When is the last time Russia actually tried to seriously innovate? The 80s?

And what are they going to do when they can’t charge Americans for flights to the ISS?

>>10725216
The Chinese government has an explicit policy of stealing tech from other countries.

>>10725216
It’s partly a cultural thing. They think of it as an impediment to progress/improvement. You see it a lot in their electronics industry.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=eLmaIbb13GM

>>10725145
Because that worked so well for Buran.

>>10725247
You know, that might also explain why the SLS is taking so long & costing so much; it is a giant honeypot for Chinese spies!

>>10725216
Government both gives negative fucks and is the most corrupt organization on the face of the earth
Safety standards, copyright, industry standards, and basic ethics and morality are all alien concepts in that shithole and always have been for as long as such concepts have existed

>>10725265
>Safety standards, copyright, industry standards, and basic ethics and morality are all alien concepts in that shithole and always have been for as long as such concepts have existed
just the same in america
as far as goverment is concerned

>>10720754
it's called a Raptor engine, obviously this is the design choice god will allow to win.

>>10720754
WHEN THE DEVIL CAME

HE WAS NOT RED

HE WAS CHROOOOOOOOME AND HE SAID

>>10725041
You're idolizing HER as a hero of commercial spaceflight. Really.

>>10725324
no

>>10725279
America isn't the most morally sound government, but China is on a whole other level. You can blame Mao's wild ride for that.

>>10725344
their entire history is Mr. Bones' finest
To be chinese is to suffer perpetually

>>10725344
the cia is a close competitor.

seriousyl, the cia is kgb with good propaganda.

in my country for instance they sponsored a dictatorship that tortured pregnant women in the pussy, like, the military was personally taught how to do that by cia personel

when you build a scrapyard starship you don't really know how much it weighs

how do you weigh an object that heavy?

>>10725371
>the cia is a close competitor.
Eh, not really. Not defending the CIA or anything, but When your worst famine is caused by accident and refusal of the party to go back on their laws despite them not knowing how ecosystems work, then you know something's seriously fucked up.

>>10725385
Why wouldn't you know how much scrapyard starship weight if you're the one building it?

>>10725404
it gains and loses mass via oxidation, welding, and grinding/cleanup
also every time you cut a panel you don't precisely know what it weighs, and even if you did it'd add up
so you build a scale
we have pictures of it somewhere, it's little blue boxes that go under the new jack points on the legs

>>10725404
did you remember to weight it before it was assembled?? did you? well youre fucked now

>>10725412
>>10725411
So approximation cannot be taken into account? Or do you mean the exact weight down to the nanogram?

>>10725385
You can measure how fast you're going by using a large body as a point of reference. Do an engine burst, see how fast you're going now. And if you had an accurate measure on how much energy you just expelled with your quick burst you now know how much you weigh
Don't be a retard mate

>>10725411
The amount of weight gained and lost is negligible compared to the fuck ass massive steel plates
they can just guess and it'll be good enough

>>10725417
>Why is the mass of your rocket important

I dunno ask nasa lol

>>10725420
you need to know it down to the kilogram or less, and you put way more than 100 kilograms of wire into welding something that size

>>10725411
It will have a hardpoint to crane lift on the top so you can weigh it that way with a crane, most modern cranes will tell you the weight of what you are lifting.

>>10725425
Given the fact that its being built in open and built by water tower construction guys, you'll have to change the outlook from the tight calculations to loose calculations. Especially because these "rockets" are test rockets designed to test viability of the future designs. SpaceX isn't BOEING or NASA. They're not gonna spend dozens of billions of dollars doing simulation rocket and not doing anything for decades.

>>10725428
no you really don't
NASA clean room rocket memes is precisely that, memes for embezzlement
this trash can ass blaster will prove that fact

>>10725440
the clean room rocket meme lets them get a little bit of extra strength out of their welds due to the lack of dust and dirt

>>10725417
no aproximation you dipshit. WEIGHT WEVERY SINGLE THING B¡EFORE YOU GLUE IT TO THE ROCKET AND IT WILL BE THE SUM OF THE THIGNS

>>10725448
Dumbass, the post above the one you're replying to says the exact reason why that wont work.

When Rocketdyne developed the F1, did they get much help from German engineers? Also, if operation paperclip had never happened, do you think that the US could have reached the moon?

>>10725456
the whole world was working on that shit, it's just that Germans were the only ones who got taken seriously at first

>>10725463
In that case, would you say that the US still would have made it to the moon, but they would take a few more years?

>>10725495
for sure, but the whole "captured german secrets" thing really got the ball rolling for military/political funding
even before that there was a bunch of JATO rocket work

>>10725456
Von Braun designed the rocket, not the engine. Rocketdyne is civilian, so they couldn't have used POWs, so they couldn't have used POWs, IIRC

>>10725445
>>10725448
>>10725453
OK GENIUS HSIT, DO I HAVE TO SPELLER IT OUT FOR YOUO


YOU WEIGHT THE 99,999999999999999999999999999999% that is the mass of the rocket and you estimate the 0.0000000000000000000000000001% that is glue and screw and shits and variations due to temperatures using ultra precise physical laws, ARE YOU HAPPY RETARD

>>10725606
bruh so let's say the rocket weighs 40 tons
they probably put half a quarter ton or more of welding wire into it
you need to know the weight to the nearest pound
get fucked, weigh that shit, it's not hard, they literally have a device ON SITE for that exact purpose already, they just used it to weigh the hopper

>>10725613
you also don't want your rocket exposed to weather conditions and wildlife and all kinds of crap outdoors
like you dont need a cleanroom for everything but you at least need a roof. well, for everything that isnt just a prototype not meant to ever carry humans at least.
boeing doesnt build airliners in the rain

I'm starting to think that MBA used black magic to power their GyroJets because I can't design a motor that can match their performance. Any help? Please?

Can we talk about heatshields?

what is Phenolic Impregnated Carbon Ablator X and is Musky going to use space shuttle style heat tiles on StarShit?

>>10725642
I don't have the knowledge to help you out but gyrojets are badass and I wish you luck

they might have had some autistic wizards work on that project and you might just not have the brainpower and funding to rediscover it by yourself

>>10725645
the ablator is old shit
starship is going to use fuckloads of pores to make the rocket sweat heat off

>>10725657
Wrong

>>10725649
Thanks! They are badass, and I'm trying to fix their problem of being too slow out of the barrel by redesigning them to burn faster, but the designs I have aren't burning fast enough to even match the GyroJets (GyroJets output about 33 Newtons of thrust, mine are barely reaching 20). I think I've narrowed the issue down to two problems, though.

The first is that I don't have the right propellant. The GyroJets are described to be using a "double-based nitrocellulose propellant", but I can't find any data on it. I'm using an ammonium perchlorate and polydimethylsiloxane propellant, but the data I have is shaky. Which is kinda expected, such data is probably restricted somewhat for national security reasons. But what I need is good data on a very fast-burning high thrust propellant.

The second could be that I have the propellant grain geometry wrong. I'm designing an end-burning solid motor, but most depictions of the GyroJet appear to be a bored grain. Which makes sense as bored grains offer much more thrust compared to end-burning. However, they're abit harder to model, and there's lot's of variations in the bore shape.

I might make the switch to bored grain if I get desperate, but right now I'm focused on finding the right propellant. It HAS to be out there, somewhere.

>>10725665
I think the main shortcoming of those (other than inaccuracy) was that they required range to reach a decent velocity

the solution would be using gunpowder or something in the barrel and then the rocket motor as the second stage

>>10725674
>think the main shortcoming of those (other than inaccuracy) was that they required range to reach a decent velocity
Yep and that's why I'm trying to increase the thrust of these little angry metal bees by a factor of alot. 500 Newtons at least.

>the solution would be using gunpowder or something in the barrel and then the rocket motor as the second stage
That's the obvious and easiest solution, even the God Emperor of Mankind approves it. But I want to try to find a way to make them work without the charge (and besides I've already kinda designed a version with the charge).

>>10725681
What if you used a star-shaped bore in the propellant? That should give you higher thrust.

>>10725681
you could just change the shape of your grain, as >>10725855 suggests
increasing initial surface area will increase chamber pressure

>>10725665
Why not fire it out of a cartridge as a first stage then have the jets fire after in a second stage

>>10725352
>some asshole claims he is the brother of jesus
>half of China is destroyed and millions are dead

>>10725855
That can definitely work, however any bore shape that's not a circle is beyond the modeling capabilities of Microsoft Excel and thus would require specialized programs that I don't have. I can maybe try to use pre-existing data and then "stretch" it to match the circular grain, but that's very sketchy and will definitely lead to inaccurate results.

The pic is the best I can do tonight, I'm pretty burnt out right now. The projectile is about 13.9mm in diameter, 40.3mm long , 12.3g when full, 9.85g when dry, and reaches about 352 m/s at the end of it's burn (although this does not take into account drag so the actual number is probably much lower). It's made out of aluminum 6065 and it's shape approximates a G1 Projectile.

Compared to the MBA GyroJet, this rocket has less energy at the end of it's burn but has more energy earlier on. This may be a step in the right direction? I don't know. What I do know is that I need to get better data on propellants.

Goodnight rocketphiles, see you tomorrow.

>>10725865
>Something happens
>half of China is destroyed and millions are dead

Sums it up really

>>10725862
I refer to my earlier post in >>10725681
>That's the obvious and easiest solution, even the God Emperor of Mankind approves it. But I want to try to find a way to make them work without the charge (and besides I've already kinda designed a version with the charge).

>>10725352

Yep.

>>10725882

Zubrin just spent another 44 minutes rambling about his Mars Direct plans again
https://youtu.be/9xN1rqhRSTE

>>10725908
I feel so bad for Zubrin, he has the most solid and realistic plans but they just assfuck him constantly, no wonder he is becoming a bit of a basket case.

>>10725959
he speaks the truth and no one listens

just finished watching Zubrin's rambling
everything he says is the truth but he's wrong about his mini-starship fetish
A. development for it would be prohibitive
B. it wouldn't be useful if Starship Super Heavy is as cheap as Elon claims it will be

>>10725613
>you need to know the weight to the nearest pound

No, because it does not matter whether final payload capacity of your rocket will be 100,000kg or 99,999kg.

>>10726018
hover(slam) testing greatly benefits the finer you know the dry mass of your rocket

Zubrin brings up the amazing point that Artemis killed Orion in mythology
if only we could be so lucky, lol

Daily reminder that manned spaceflight proved mostly useless, happens mostly on the ground today, and 99% of actual exploration of Solar System has been made with boring unexciting beeping robots.

>>10726042
Daily reminder that exploration and science is not, and should not be, the main goal of spaceflight.

>>10726042

>99% of actual exploration of Solar System has been made with boring unexciting beeping robots

Thats why there is so much still unexplored.

>>10726036
Come on, we've joked about that last month or something.

>>10726047
Is there Lando Calrissian on that platfprm ?

>>10726221
yes
I'm not sure how the fuck they expect a flat pad to ever do ANYTHING useful on an orbital station
flat pads are sort of useful on a space elevator (on the counterweight or on the elevator car itself) but outside of that I don't see it

>>10726226
its for helicopters ;)

>>10726255
:^)

>Nearly a week until next Falcon Heavy launch

H Y P E

Y

P

E

>>10725869
I hope to see more of your stuff, please keep us updated on your progress.

>>10726047
>m-muh future of the mankind

>>10726042
>Daily reminder that manned spaceflight proved mostly useless
This.
This shit is a waste of tax dollars that I cant believe the government is funding. Stop this shit.

>>10725960
People from SpaceX contributes to Mars Society and regularly makes contributions. In fact, the leading SpaceX mars mission is a long time Mars Society member. So there's plenty of hopes there.

And by contributions I mean giving regular talks/taking criticisms/questions/research ideas/etc.

>>10726414
mars colony is a fasscinating idea but here are a few issues I think they will face

>weather is likely to be out of phase
>internet connection stability
>mudfarmers may find a way to infiltrate the border
>gravity compensation
>dirt in general will be fucked for a while
>transport
>political stability
>speech pathology and corruption
>mental health
>some stores may fuck you up emotionally at inconvenient time ie. during business hours

>>10726429>>10726429
I'm sure SpaceX with their 7000+ engineers can figure out a way. If you think they're lacking, feel free to apply and contribute there.

>>10726435
Nice thought stopper, a bit overused though.

>>10726378
>m-muh pictures of dead rocks

just face it, possibility of space colonization is why most people care about space and why it is funded to the tune of $ billions per year, and rightly so

>>10726429
nice incoherent mess of a post, wow

>>10726445
Without those pictures of dead rocks, you wouldn't even be able to shitpost about your ISRU, colonization, terraforming or whatever fantasy you have in mind. Good luck landing in the middle of nowhere, my little brave anonymous colonist

>>10726445
I don't remember anyone promising to colonize anything except Musk, yet billions continue to flow

>>10726449
Seethe dronefag

>>10726451
NASA explicitly aims for a permanent human presence on the Moon, while not a colony it is the first step towards one

New signs at the main gate.
Polishing continues on the Starship orbital prototype.
The tall structure at days end.

Pics showing that there is three separate sections of panels being worked on.
I saw a couple of panels being lowered into the container area. More polishing on the Starship orbital prototype. A pic taken late this afternoon of the tall structure.

A pic taken tonight of StarHopper.

https://www.nasa.gov/directorates/spacetech/niac/2019_Phase_I_Phase_II/Lunar_Polar_Propellant_Mining_Outpost/

https://www.nasa.gov/directorates/spacetech/niac/2019_Phase_I_Phase_II/duet/

>>10725882
Even their space program has the highest body count. The long March 1 rockets had a habit of plummeting into villages like ICBMs

>>10725428
no you dont, you need to know with a certain precision and then plan for it. Then once it laumches algorithms in teh guidance computer correct for minimum discrepancies

>>10725440
it made sense when spaceflight was new.

Imagine this, youre building the FIRST MOON SHIP. should you build it in a sterile environment to reduce the possibility of contaminants. How much does it cost? an extra million dollars. Does it help? ehhh maybe. fuck it, this is an important mission and this is uncharted territory, do everything you can to ensure mission success
now its fffierent scenario

>>10725572
was von braun a creative genius or a mathematical genius?

like was he an autist that could do complicated math that would take a computer today?

>>10726633
ask wikipedia

>>10726042
Reminder that the only reason probes have made the lions share of discoveries is because they're capable of being sent to the largest number of objects and do the most broad, easy to do science, that you wouldn't use people for anyway.

Reminder that we will NEVER discover life on other objects, and we will only perform surface science extremely SLOWLY, if we limit ourselves to unmanned probe exploration only.

Reminder that the sum total of scientific discovery of all the Mars rovers combined could be accomplished by one geologist in a couple days.
Reminder that we currently have a heat probe we developed for dozens of millions and sent to Mars that is fuckered at this moment because the self-hammering-self-digging mole doesn't actually work in Mars gravity because there isn't enough friction from the surrounding dirt until the probe gets to a depth of about half a meter, which means we're going to spend about a year screwing around with the robotic arm trying to push on the probe until it can dig on its own, and will likely just end up knocking it over and permanently fucking it because in their infinite wisdom the guys who designed the mole probe and the robot arm claw didn't make it so that they can pick up the mole with the claw.

Reminder that a guy could set up 100 of these thermal probes in one day and if any of them hit a rock or couldn't self-start their dig or whatever he could manually restart them or help them.

>>10726449
>>10726451
Literally what is the point of learning about planets in space if we never plan on actually doing anything with them, just to fill out the science section of trivial pursuit?

>>10726661
Exactly. Stop funding this shit and put the money towards something useful like healthcare or defense

>>10726655
Yeah I'm sure you will map an astronomical body with a manned orbital station, that makes total sense.

>we will NEVER discover life on other objects, and we will only perform surface science extremely SLOWLY
As opposed to literal nothing yielded by manned spaceflight.

>>10726671
>being this fucking ignorant
you're being retarded on purpose

>>10726671
I literally JUST said that probes are better for that you fucking retard. Probes are the best at doing passive science from orbit, because the only thing to consider in that environment is how to design your science equipment, it's an extremely simple environment compared to the surface of any object. Humans are by far superior when it comes to actually doing anything on the ground, because we don't get stuck in soft sand and we can climb up gradients higher than 5 degrees. We can also pick up objects of any shape and can use simple tools to do things that even the most highly engineered piece of shit robot can't even hope to accomplish.

>all these seething sattlite fags
Looks like the 50 cent army is here.

>>10726680
Yet nobody has touched the surface of another planet except robots. Even for something as simple as the moon, it's almost half a century without a single human on the surface. Actual exploration is done by robots, nobody's actually interested in manned spaceflight beyond the orbit.

>>10726689
speak for yourself fuckboy, there's a ludicrous amount of people interested in manned spaceflight past earth
the only reason we haven't is because it has always been expensive as shit to do it
a problem that people are right now trying to fix, specifically so that manned spaceflight can continue

>>10726689
>Yet nobody has touched the surface of another planet except robots
Apollo. In fact Apollo 17 alone (because it landed a geologist on the Moon) garnered so much scientific insight into the Moon that it pretty much eclipses all other scientific missions, including all the other Apollo missions, combined.

>>10726681
You may want to think twice, because ironically Chinese seem to be the only ones trying to do at least something about sustainable colonies these days. Their "lunar palace" (which is basically BIOS-3 copied from Russian Institute of Biophysics and upgraded a bit with the help of Russians) almost reached a closed loop for everything except trace elements. The closest one is EU's MELiSSA, but it's years behind and doesn't have the closed loop. There's practically nothing being done in the US. And neither Russia nor China can put humans on another planet; those who can (US companies and NASA) do almost nothing in this regard.

They don't put money where their mouth is.

>>10726696
>there's a ludicrous amount of people interested in manned spaceflight past earth
There's an insane amount of people doing rocketry, mostly on the ground though. There's no one working on actual problems of long range spaceflight, such as (mostly) closed loop ECLSS, health issues, maintenance of aging spacecraft/habitats, space construction assembly. It's all just on the paper, literally. Meanwhile, retards in this thread shit on ISS, which is the only way to get the required data. And LOP-G looks like literal Salyut all over again, also it's doesn't exist outside of NASA plans.

But yeah, rockets.

>>10726700
I mentioned Apollo 17. It was almost half a century ago, and not on a planet. Soviets wanted to actually explore the Mars and Venus (before the surface conditions were known), but got dragged into a useless moon race instead, accomplishing nothing and dropping both.

>>10726715
>do almost nothing in this regard.
Nigga they just put a moon base in the budget

>>10726730
They put things in the budget many times before, with zero outcome. What experiments do they currently run? If you want a moon base in a decade, you need all that tech available yesterday. If you want a moon base in more than a decade, forget about it.

>>10726740
>you need all that tech available yesterday.
Most of the tech was designed and worked out years ago, they've just never been able to put it to good use until now. In fact, spaceflight is in the best position it's been since the cold war, since noe space is becoming somewhat of a bipartisan agenda.

>>10726745
>Most of the tech was designed and worked out years ago
The US has no working CELSS for example, and it's precisely the kind of tech that takes years to develop, unlike others, and is needed for long term missions. Partnering with MELiSSA is the only option for the closed loop right now, and I don't see any movement in this direction. There are many propositions and concepts in the US, but they will took years to develop.

CELSS is just an example, nothing is ready for a moon base, even assuming you have the infrastructure (rockets, spacecraft etc) and an incentive/means to stay on the surface. You need to survey the site, to design/manufacture the hardware etc. With only a rocket and a spacecraft but nothing else, this is all just talk.

>>10726715
>not on a planet
It's an object with a surface, and thus more readily explored by a manned effort than an umanned one, beyond surface mapping and passive scientific measurement.

Manned missions are not for putting a thermometer on the surface or for snapping pictures from orbit. Manned missions are for digging pits, climbing up cliffs and down shafts, turning over rocks, braking rocks in half to see what's inside, and trekking over a very large surface area very quickly. An umnanned rover can tell you a lot of things about one rock. A manned rover can tell you a much larger relative amount of things about an entire wide area, in the same amount of time.

>>10726661
This is one of the most stupid arguments that children use. I've heard it every year when I was in school.
WHY DO I NEED TO LEARN THIS LOL
WHAT WILL IT DO FOR ME LOL
I DONT NEED TO KNOW HOW TO FIND X IN THE REAL WORLD LOL

No you don't Stephanie, and most people won't need it and be stuck working a bullshit service job because they don't care.
But WHY is it taught? WHY do multiple things with seemingly no relevance get skullfucked into your head?
To change the way you think, to warp your sad little brain and hopefully spark some sort of curiosity so that you will go on and do something with your life. So that you don't go through life thinking like everyone else in a black and white society waiting for that new smartphone to come out so you can satisfy your ego with the newest tech out there and spend $999 on a god forsaken monitor stand.

We explore and teach so that everyone can be exposed to what is out there and show them that their sad existence is pointless in the broad scheme of things. That way, once every few decades, you'll get the Elon Musk or whoever to stand out and go, "FUCK THAT, I'M GOING TO MARS"

BUT MUH HEALTHCARE
BUT MUH DEFENSE
BUT MUH WELFARE

FUCK YOU and your bullshit. Knowledge is the most critical thing in the world and THAT is what we need to fuel. Health is important, but unless we teach and educate the masses, they'll be dumbass vegetables anyways.

>>10726715
>There's no one working on actual problems of long range spaceflight, such as (mostly) closed loop ECLSS, health issues, maintenance of aging spacecraft/habitats, space construction assembly. It's all just on the paper, literally.

If you spent more time researching and less time trolling under your rock, you would find that there are a LOT of technologies that have physical working models that can function correctly.
The only big gap between what exists and a fully functional system on another planet is getting the hardware to another planet.
Pic Related. A digger for mars to produce fuel. It has been in the works for years, along with the rest of the system to convert soil to fuel.

>>10726715
>Chinese seem to be the only ones trying to do at least something about sustainable colonies these days. Their "lunar palace" (which is basically BIOS-3 copied from Russian Institute of Biophysics and upgraded a bit with the help of Russians) almost reached a closed loop for everything except trace elements.

very interesting

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yuegong-1

>>10726824
My point in that other comment is exactly what you're saying.

The ONLY reason for studying the finer details of the cosmos at large, other than being able to predict when and where we get hit by a big asteroid, is to build up a knowledge base that will inspire some people eventually to actually push for human colonization of space. Otherwise, there is literally no reason to care about Mars or Jupiter or any of the planets or any of the other stars in the universe or their planets.

Don't kid yourself into thinking that our understanding of the solar system is going to inspire anyone to develop more sustainable agriculture or whatever else. It won't help anyone in poor countries with huge populations and low living standards, at least not directly. Besides, we already generate so much data about the solar system that the vast majority of people never see or care to search for, that adding to the pile by doing seismic surveys of Mars or another flyby of the Ice giants won't change anything. At most it'd be on some 'I Fucking Love Science' media bullshit and then swiftly forgotten a month later.

Doing things to learn more about the solar system does two things presently; it strokes the egos of egghead 'pure science' types who don't care about real world advancements beyond developing a new probe to throw away on a suicide mission for no gain other than more 'fundamental understanding of our past abloobloo blah blah', and the actual important thing it does is inform people who actually do care about expanding humanity beyond one planet about what other options we have and which ones make sense as our first footholds in space. I'm not saying shit like the voyagers and new horizons and shit were a waste, far from it. I'm saying that if we DON'T eventually take up the challenge of colonizing our solar system, then the efforts we've performed so far in learning about the solar system will have been wasted. Same is true about all the exoplanets.

>>10726836
more like mars nigger lol

>>10726715
Didnt the Chinese just cancel their next space station? I doubt they're anywhere close to a moon landing.

Elon (in E3) recently said that his first gen Starlink are designed to operate under 20 ms. The later satellites are supposed to operate under 10 ms.

People were making claims that it would be 100ms+ but the reality might be lot lower.

>>10726770
who says you have to custom make absolutely everything
shit can be bought off the shelf

>>10726887
those claims were made cause they thought they'd be GEO sats like all the other satellite internet attempts
them being LEO changes everything

>massive metal anomaly five times the large island of Hawaii detected under the largest crater on the moon
>probably just a massive metallic asteroid impact
>...probably

>>10726887
it really depends on how far you are connecting, 10ms at the speed of light is 1500 kilometers two-way

>>10726931
They are waiting for the harvest.

>>10726715
>The closest one is EU's MELiSSA
which also got a lot from cooperation with russian IBP, and partially uses its findings
seems like only russians never stopped doing solid medical and bio experiments during all these years with their Bion and Foton satellites, and space stations, so they influenced this field more than others
it descends from Feoktistov's work in late 50's I guess

>>10726900
there's no "shelf" for closed loop life support though, everything we have is unfinished scientific research
closed loop is probably less important for the moon I guess

>>10726887
>>10726906
People were complaining they would be super visible and mess up astronomy. Honestly I think them being that visible is really cool. Visible impact of human advancement visible to nearly everyone on the entire planet. Wonder what that little island that shuns all contact will make of it.

>>10726931
I always hope it's ayys
ayys means ayy supertech that we can loot and use for ourselves

>>10726960
Problem is that they fuck with telescopes. Same with those retarded space advertisements some vatnik was pushing a while back.

>>10726715
>Meanwhile, retards in this thread shit on ISS, which is the only way to get the required data.

But ISS is not used to get the required data. What closed loop life support development is done on the ISS, especially considering the overpriced cost of building and maintaining the station?

ISS is still the best thing done in space since Apollo ended, and at least it provides permanent human presence up there for two decades, while serving as an anchor for commercial space. But it is a case of one-eyed being a king in the land of the blind.

As for closed loop life support, it is crucial engineering that ought to be prioritized, but I feel like it is something that will inevitably be done when it is needed. It is not rocket science and we know it can be done, pic related. On the other hand, cheap reusable rocketry is an enabling technology that was thought impossible by many before SpaceX came along..

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bottle_garden

>>10726978
We can't forever be staring at the sky, we need to move past that and put more telescopes into outer space for future of space discoveries.

>>10726855
>My point in that other comment is exactly what you're saying.
Not sure what the other comment was, I was just replying to the "why teach it" comment.

I can't argue your points, they are very valid. I also completely agree with you that at present, there is not a need to find a new place in the solar system to live. Hopefully that won't be the case for a long time.
That still doesn't stop the fact that we need to keep advancing, as slowly as it may be, so that one day it will be an option if needed.

I'm a diehard science guy, so my opinions of doing all this are heavily "LETS FUCKING DO IT!" but I still understand it isn't currently a life or death need. If it honestly came down to funding for NASA or healthcare for the country to save everyone from some flesh eating virus, then yes, healthcare all the way.

>>10726978
Its going to be an inevitability that our skies will become crowded.

>>10726982
>It is not rocket science
It probably isn't, but it's tricky enough. The main problem is it can't be accelerated by dropping a lot of money, it's just boring fundamental research with no certain path and plenty of long-running testing to be done, to make sure humans can live in a space barrel for long without adverse effects. It would be quite slow even if parallelized.

>https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bottle_garden
Just a toy. A bottle for humans is orders of magnitude more complex, especially if you want them to remain in good health.

>>10726843
would copulate with the girl on the left (for science ofc)

https://science.sciencemag.org/content/364/6445/eaau1017

Close-range remote sensing of Saturn’s rings during Cassini’s ring-grazing orbits and Grand Finale

Saturn’s rings are an accessible exemplar of an astrophysical disk, tracing the Saturn system’s dynamical processes and history. We present close-range remote-sensing observations of the main rings from the Cassini spacecraft. We find detailed sculpting of the rings by embedded masses, and banded texture belts throughout the rings. Saturn-orbiting streams of material impact the F ring. There are fine-scaled correlations among optical depth, spectral properties, and temperature in the B ring, but anticorrelations within strong density waves in the A ring. There is no spectral distinction between plateaux and the rest of the C ring, whereas the region outward of the Keeler gap is spectrally distinct from nearby regions. These results likely indicate that radial stratification of particle physical properties, rather than compositional differences, is responsible for producing these ring structures.

>>10726941
Closed loop is only relevant for things that aren't surface bases and aren't going from surface base to surface base.

If your base is on Mars your life support system looks like a power source running a compressor to harvest CO2, a pyrolyser to split it into CO and O2, a tank to store a decent supply of O2 and a vent to dump the CO (or a tank if you want to use the CO in your sabatier reactor to make slightly more methane per unit feedstock mass). You separate the CO2 from your breathable air mixture via fractional distillation, and either dump it or use it to make more O2 to breathe or use it to make methane via sabatier. Oxygen requirements for breathing are really minimal, less than 2kg per day per person. Supplying water on Mars is easy and with basic recycling you'd only need to be able to harvest a tiny amount per day on average to supply even a quite large population. You're gonna be mining orders of magnitude more to make your propellants anyway. Food will come from Earth for the most part and isn't really a big concern to make in-situ until the colony is starting to be capable of growing itself, eg making their own habitat spaces.

>>10726324
Thank you for showing interest, it's been fun and interesting. I've gotten a rocket projectile that may be technically better than the GyroJet but not by much really. Really the biggest thing that's holding be back is not having good information on solid propellant performance mainly the erosion rate per chamber pressure (a) which for some reason is hard to find. However this whole thing has shown to me why rocket projectiles aren't common to traditional firearms, they don't seem to be able to deliver a good amount of kinetic energy compared to the amount of complexity and work necessary to deliver it.

There seems to be no good reason to favor rocket rifle over a normal rifle other than maybe reduction in sound for safety, because the biggest source of sound in a firearm is the projectile leaving the barrel and all of that built up pressure behind it exploding out. In a rocket however, there is no built up pressure (other than inside the rocket) thus there's no explosion during any part of firing the rifle. This may make it safer on the ears to fire, and may not require hearing projection. Then again, that's just all speculation.

I'll post another update if I can find a good propellant and data with it.

>>10727168
Why not look at the stuff fireworks use, I would imagine fireworks of all things have the grains down to a science

>>10727168
have you considered pulling a 40k and making it both a bullet and a rocket at the same time?
it would probably make it a hell of a lot more powerful

>>10725642
This is a fact. It's well known that the gyrojet bullets had a boost phase system. Automated solid rocket engine design has been almost solved recently. I'm not sure the approaches for doing have been made public. Some of them assume you can 3d print the propellant to have different burn rates. Leads to some pretty great performance though. Some approaches require ASSLOADS of compute
>>10725665
>>double-based nitrocellulose propellant
aka smokeless powder
>>polydimethylsiloxane propellant
so you want sand in your gun?

you may not like it, but ideal solid rocket motor performance might it looking like an onahole. Seriously. Saw a talk on topology optimizing solid rocket motors and some the the designs that popped out looked a heckuva lot like onaholes. Like imagine you stack up a bunch of different sized garlic cloves, sort of looks like that.

>>10727168
Would an air breathing solid ramjet work?

>>10727198
He has, he mentioned it over here.
>>10725681
>That's the obvious and easiest solution, even the God Emperor of Mankind approves it. But I want to try to find a way to make them work without the charge (and besides I've already kinda designed a version with the charge)
The good news is he is aware of both options.

>>10727193
I didn't think of that. I believe that most use gunpowder which is a pretty fast burning propellant.

>>10727198
Did it (although not to extreme fidelity), but I want to make a pure rocket projectile work.

>>10727208
>This is a fact. It's well known that the gyrojet bullets had a boost phase system. Automated solid rocket engine design has been almost solved recently. I'm not sure the approaches for doing have been made public. Some of them assume you can 3d print the propellant to have different burn rates. Leads to some pretty great performance though. Some approaches require ASSLOADS of compute
I figured, but unfortunately I don't have the assloads of computational power to really make use of more complex grain geometries. The best I can use right now is the circular bore shape. I'll look into using smokeless gunpowder though.

>>10727269
They can work, but the ramjet will only function once the projectile reaches high speeds. As it accelerates to those speeds, it's relying entirely on the solid motor (assuming so boost charge), so the issue of slow initial speeds is still there. Might as well stick to just using a solid motor. Neat idea though, reminds me of my propulsion professor. He specialized in experimental jet engines such as turbo-rocket missiles, he'll get so excited when he's allowed to talk about it.

>>10727316
>>I don't have the assloads of computational power to really make use of more complex grain geometries
if it floats, flies, fucks, or massively computes, rent it. Don't be a pussy, computing power is cheap.
>>circular
no make it shaped like an onahole instead. Lots of surface area in the beginning for a boost out the barrel which then burns down to less surface area for a constant acceleration. If you optimize it right you can decrease the wall thickness of the casing to the bare fucking minimum for MAX PERFORMANCE!

Ion drives sound like scifi desu

>>10727316
Don't give up, im certain in the end you will make it work!

Who here is excited for the solar sail launch on the 22?
https://www.space.com/lightsail-2-solar-sail-planetary-society-spacecraft.html

>>10727397
That looks neat! I hope it goes well!

>>10727397
I'm waiting for the GPIM experiment going as intended. I hope they replace all toxic hypergolics with this in the future spacecraft; this would make many things massively easier than they are.

>>10727330
bruh

>High Voltage Orbiting Long Tether, or HiVOLT, is a concept proposed by Russian physicist V. V. Danilov and further refined by Robert P. Hoyt and Robert L. Forward for draining and removing the radiation fields of the Van Allen radiation belts[35] that surround the Earth.[36] A proposed configuration consists of a system of five 100 km long conducting tethers deployed from satellites, and charged to a large voltage. This would cause charged particles that encounter the tethers to have their pitch angle changed; thus, over time, dissolving the inner belts. Hoyt and Forward's company, Tethers Unlimited, performed a preliminary analysis simulation in 2011, and produced a chart depicting a theoretical radiation flux reduction,[37] to less than 1% of current levels within two months for the inner belts that threaten LEO objects.[38]
Holy crap, a giant flypaper for electrons, this is a great idea. But how realistic is a 100km long tether? Will it rip itself apart, roll into a knot, or stabilize itself in a wrong position under the tidal force?

>>10727316
http://burnsim.com/

>>10727450
you don't need THAT much computing power. Probably just as much as a couple desktops.

>>10726667
>Stop spending money on space and spend it on welfare and warfare instead

nigger jew detected

>>10727500
>Doesn't talk about the materials science

Post starship what exactly does Elon plan to do?
Say starlink in the next 5yr-10yr both gurantee massive new investment potential or revenue to the degree where they have comparable funding to nasa or even half or 1/3 as good.

Where does all of that money realisticly go? The obvious would be starship evolution. It's incredibly impressive high end technology but past that, what an enermous starship fleet.

I just don't buy that they wouldn't expand past that... So my question is what is the post starship game plan? Gathering subsidiaries or just the materials and equipment for mass transit to mars? Lunar outposts building larger barges for equipment?

Subsidizing Mars resettlement? Exploration of mars? Where does all that money go? SpaceX is a for profit company, but their main objetive isn't really profit with musk as the over arching presence.

>>10727621
>post Starship what does Elon plan to do
in order:
>improve Starship
>make enough money to ensure that Starship never dies
>become Fabricator General of Mars

>>10727621
move his company and its smartest employees to mars, become a tech priest.

>>10727622
But still spaceX doesn't have the capital to facilitate an entire ecoystem. What do you mean by fabricator generator?

Even if starship sucks up all of the launch market that's not enough

>>10727630
Starlink
Fabricator General is a reference to Warhammer 40k, it's the head of the Adeptus Mechanicus, who are headquartered out of Mars

>>10727630
Both of those replies are references to 40k

>>10727633
>>10727635
my bad

I have noticed a slight uptick in 40k here. Good.

>>10727358
The part the makes them not scifi is the gigantic disadvantage of minuscule thrust. If we had reaction engines that could function with the Isp figures of an ion engine but even 1/100th the thrust to weight of a chemical engine we'd be able to torch-drive our way pretty much anywhere in the solar system. As it stands in order to truly take advantage of the Isp of an Ion drive by giving the vehicle using it a decent wet/dry mass ratio, it'd take literally thousands of years to use up that mass of propellant.

Basically the easiest way to determine if some technology is real or not is to look for huge downsides. If the thing you're hearing about from someone has no glaring flaws, either they aren't telling you about them or it's not real.

>>10727889
Oh, I know they're real, just from the name to the surface level descriptions feel like something out of a scifi novel

>>10727500
A 100km long steel tether rotating at less than 1 rpm would work, it would have to rotate to keep itself taut/straight. If a spacecraft deployed four 50 km cables from itself and spun up it should have the same effect as one hypothetical stationary tether. If you don't want to use steel, since it's not that conductive anyway, a better option would be aluminum, and if you're one of the retards working for NASA you'd probably design a composite cable consisting of copper wire for conduction supported by kevlar threads for strength-to-weight, because it's the most complex and expensive.

>>10727630
Starlink should generate billions per year even off of rural users alone. If this is true then SpaceX WILL have the capital to do Moon and Mars missions by themselves, even if they are somewhat bare-bones at worst. Remember, SpaceX isn't NASA, who takes every opportunity to throw as much money as possible into holes in the ground. SpaceX at that point will have the largest, cheapest launch vehicle in the world, capable of setting >100 tons of cargo onto the surface of Mars, and won't have to bother chasing every gram of mass in whatever equipment the design to send to Mars.

>>10727903
to make things even easier, SpaceX isn't doing the colony solo, by their own declaration
according to Musk, SpaceX is just there to provide a dirt cheap pathway to mars, with everyone else doing the actual colonization

>>10727903
Yeah I'm rural and I'll be straight on board that starlink service as soon as it's available, I've talked to a few people around where I am and they echo the sentiment, fuck my ISP. Our area is definitely not alone, there will be a mass exodus from other isps, mostly due to their shitcunt behaviour and ripoff plans with low data caps and shit.

>>10727910
>The death of comcast
I'm in tears, I never thought I'd see the fucking day

>>10727903
well my question is what do they do with that amount of money. Obviously keep building star ships and evolving the design but aside from that what's their next big project?

Will they build the habitats themselves or give it out awards. It just seems like a territory that musk already thought about and he prolly considers starlink cash crucial. But it can't all be dumped on starship that seems improbable

>>10727924
They plan to offer cheap transportation so mars base(s) can be focused on by others without having to worry the base makers having to worry about making their own rockets

>>10727924
AFAIK they plan on using the money to build out Earth to Earth Starship travel, which means building launch facilities all over the place, and thousands of Starships. If E2E doesn't work out, then they can either spend the money on doing shit on Mars/Moon directly (like shipping over bulk construction materials for example) or on developing new technology for Starship or even on developing Starship 2.0, which could be to Starship what Starship is to Falcon 9. Very very last case maybe they take Starlink revenue excess and use it to prop up Tesla, or simply save their money so that they have a comfortable safety net in case shit goes sour.

>>10727924
Build 1000 starships

>>10727932
I'm pretty sold on most of the capabilities of starship but I just can't see e2e taking off in a big way.

>>10727935
Super time sensitive cargo (human organs for transplants for example), bulk cargo flights (pretty sure a starship can haul more cargo end to end than a 747), and pretty much anyone who needs to get to the other side of the planet in a hurry would make use of it.

Plus there'll be the whole novelty of sub-orbital flight that the masses will love. Depending on how cheap Starship flights get per person it might end up being better to fly one from say, San Francisco to Melbourne vs taking a super long haul jet.

>>10723179
Well of course the united states want to go to space.

>>10727959
the US government is broke though so any NASA manned missions are pipe dreams.

>>10726667
Like the US needs to spend any more fucking money on defense

The DoD got 30x times more money than NASA last year. They got an increase from 2017 that was 2.5x the entire NASA budget.
You could double NASA's budget and we'd never notice the cost.

>>10728057
Just make space a part of the DoD, problem solved

>>10728057
NASA provides nothing. healthcare is useful. government funded spaceflight should not exist.

>>10728133
>healthcare is useful
try telling the US government that lel

what do we think of india's plans to build their own space station in LEO?

from NSF:
>A detailed project report on setting up an Indian space station will be submitted to the government after the Gaganyaan mission in August 2022
>Estimated to be set up around 5-7 years after Gaganyaan (2030)
>It will have a weight of around 20 tonnes
>Will be parked in a low earth orbit of 400 km
>Will support astronauts for 15-20 days

>>10728141
>india
>the country that cant even de-orbit its own satellites without causing a massive debris field
lolno

it says india will use the upper stage of the PSLV rocket to develop the docking technology for the station. 2030 is far away but india doesnt yet have a launcher capable of launching modules of significant size.

https://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/india/2-days-after-space-station-news-isro-calls-for-docking-experiments-on-pslv-stage-4/articleshow/69800354.cms

>>10728166
what orbital inclination is this station supposed to be going into anyways?

and the air force is building a new laboratory in new mexico for space control...aka how to conduct space combat operations

>researchers would address threats from other countries and from space like asteroids
>"Every satellite that we have up there needs to be resilient"
>If we happen to be in a conflict with a peer competitor, our satellites have to have the defense capabilities when we need them the most."

https://www.airforcetimes.com/news/your-air-force/2019/06/13/kirtland-air-force-base-gets-upgrade-for-space-defense/

>>10728174
i dont know, i didnt see anything about it

>>10728133
>NASA provides nothing
except something like $14 ROI ever dollar we give them

>>10728239
a whole $14 dollars for how many millions? you prove my point. give it to someone who can use it like healthcare or the military.

>>10728242
$14 for every dollar
that's 1400% return
You fucking idiot

>>10727628
>tfw Musk founds the Brotherhood of Steel

>>10727628
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wy-sVTaZRPk

can we discuss the physics behind using Starship to go for a gravity assisted loop in the inner solar system and then coming back to earth and kinetically bombarding Chicago?
how much energy could we get, how much mass would we lose on re-entry, and how big would the crater be?

this is for the advancement of humanity of course

>>10728447
why limit ourselves to Chicago, let's go for every major metropolitan area on earth, excepting Tokyo

>>10728466
Sieg Zion

>>10728472
Sieg Zeon

>>10728064
space force

>>10728560
Kessler Syndrome

so I heard you guys were formenting rebellion against the earthsphere in here

>>10728560
>Rearrangement of existing assets

Your fat fuck country is charged over a trillion dollars to develop a fucking plane, let alone any super speshul space assets.

>>10728833
Dont forget that we run the space race and that its AMERICAN companies that are duking it out in the new one

>>10728836
Stay delusional magapede

>>10728840
>magapede
the fuck is that even suppose to mean

>>10728841
Back to rebbit

>>10728833
Space Force is a great way to siphon off some spaceflight funding from the bottomless military budget.

>>10728142
>deorbit
don't be retarded on purpose
the designated shitting orbit came from a proper anti-sat weapon system

>>10728447
Chiraq is a blight

https://spacenews.com/smith-to-continue-to-press-for-change-in-national-security-space-launch-program/

based Adam Smith

want me to make a new thread?

For Father's Day we should celebrate the father of rocketry.

>>10729454
Sure! Make it father's day themed.

>>10729456
here's an another father
turns out rocketry is an adopted child of a gay pair

>>10729460
new thread >>10729526