/sci/ - Science & Math

>>10610850
no one knows with certainty. We dont even know what is happening to the brain/consciousness during normal activity...

Psilocybin basically just overstimulates part of the brain. In low doses it can be used as a brain-booster. It is still a mycotoxin, so usage is not recommended, given the propensity of mycotoxin to be carcinogenic and/or mutagenic. I don't know about other psychadelics.

>>10610850
>what are psychedelics really doing to the brain/consciousness?
Show you glimpses of the shamanic realm

>are they just mimicking the symptons of schizophrenia or is there more to it?
There's so much more to it that our knowledge of it is comparable to a drop in the ocean. Psychedelics literally take you into another dimension. Regardless of how many people deny this having never experienced it. They deconstruct reality and show you another type of existence. No bullshit. Anyone that's ever broken through can attest to that. You can't reason about that reality because the rules that we're familiar with don't apply. All you can say about is is that it's weird and crazy. And no rationalist will ever except that as an explanation. So the only thing to do for a strong realist is to give them a strong dose of some psychedelic. 90% chance they will come out of it transformed and they will suddenly understand how unfathomably limited our everyday perception really is.

>>10610850
Read DMT: The Spirit Molecule by Rick Strassman MD. DMT is found in the urine of a psychotic person but not their blood. Strassman theorizes that DMT is released from the pineal gland, into the cerebrospinal fluid and into the brain, which is why he theorizes DMT to be one potential schizotoxin.

>>10610882
Ive heard of mescaline and mushrooms being harmful to people with pre-existing liver disease but that's it. Not known to be cancerous or cause organ damage in healthy people.

>>10610850
when I take shrooms my brain just starts making patterns with everything

>>10610850
it causes the synaptic receptors of the brain to jump around and connect to other parts of the brain that they normally wouldn't. it's what causes strange effects of the drug.

Essentially opens up a fuckton of new connections in the brain, what's interesting is it's empirically the only thing that seems to help with DPDR but has very little chance of being acknlowdged as medically viable despite having literally no health risks or addiction risks

Soapboxing a bit here

>>10610915
Psilocybin isn't well studied as a poison. Nobody wants to fund that research into it, and nobody wants to do that research either. Psilocybin and penicillin are more-or-less don't look too closely at this territory amongst mycologist since a lot of our funding is because of the benefits these mycotoxins have.
Ever hear of ochratoxin a? It is one of the most powerful antibiotics, BUT it causes dna mutation in animals.

>>10610850
Memories are stored in the brain through the connections. Psychedelics reduce the threshold to activate those connections and the communication pathways in the brain become extremely sensitive. Different areas become hyperconnected and cause neurons to fire together in places that normally wouldn't so people get experiences like hearing colour, tasting sound, seeing patterns in things, objects melting into geometry, seeing thoughts visually, and so on.

>>10610937
Like in psychosis?

>>10610850
They unlock the full potential of your brain.

>>10610950
>it's empirically the only thing that seems to help with DPDR
psychedelics gave me DPDR

>>10611145
never had psychosis but ultimately what I've experienced taking psilocybin is dilatation of time, and brain just makes connections with everything. I was talking while playing piano and my brain somehow linked both of them together so it was like I was speaking through the piano

>>10610950
>opens up a fuckton of new connections in the brain
Can it help me build muscle?

>>10610850
It just over-stimulates the part in your brain that sees patterns. Hence you see shit where there is none, and think there is a deep deep meaning in like, life, man.

So there is nothing? This universe and reality are just that and nothing else exists? Just this cruel and cold universe, everything wants to kill us, elements just bumb into each other randomly creating molecules,working together to live for the sake of living?
There is...nothing?

>>10610904
Is the pineal gland the "pilot" moving this meat mecha? Is it the part of us that sees through the eyes and it's aware of its surroundings?

>>10610850
For anyone interested in this topic:
I recommend Andy Clark "Surfing Incertainty" and Thomas Metzinger "The Ego Tunnel.

>>10610850
Poison. Negatively affects the function of the brain.

>>10610850
I've never done drugs but I assume drugs are way more intense than schizophrenia would be lol.

>>10611311
Nah. Consider that a almost half of the human race has a fully calcified pineal gland by the end of adolescence.
It's kind of neat that it's evolutionary antecedent is from eyespots. Some reptiles still have a parietal eye on the top of their head.

>>10611319
done most drugs and so far psilocybin is the only drug that could alter my psychology of self, leaving sequels even after the effects wear off.

>>10611306
>Babby's first existential crisis
You'll be fine. It's not nothing, it just means you're starting to think like an adult and are realizing there's no one there to hold your hand.

>>10611383
how did smartest humans like Newton,Einstein,Tesla coped with this?

>>10611088
Yes people need to realize it's a good antibiotic BECAUSE it causes dna mutations (that kills the bacteria)

>>10611264
have u tried roids?

>>10611396
>Newton,Einstein
By revolutionizing the common perception of the universe?

>>10611396
>>10611429
literally this

>>10611236
Literally this. You don't know what it's like to truly have focus until you take a hero dose of lsd or shrooms

>>10610850
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CNR4o5JZEi0&t=42s

YW for the best answer.

>>10611396
Lol this is the point where you should abandon your childish ideology (natural science) and begin the hardest of pursuits (philosophy)

Newton < Liebniz
Tesla <<<<<<<<<< Kant
Einstein < Nietzsche

>>10610895
This. Took acid many years ago. I transcended, but when people asked how it was, words were worthless compared to what I experienced.

I don't know. Maybe you shouldn't be doing so many drugs and then you wouldn't even be asking these dumb questions.

>>10611088
There are people like McKenna who have probably eaten more than their own body weight in psilocybin mushrooms yet have had no organ failure or physical disease. There are thousands of people who have done this and I've never heard of any (non-psychiatric) adverse effects in healthy people after eating mushrooms.

>>10611358
Define "fully calcified" and post whatever source claims that this affects half of humans. The pineal gland is responsible for melatonin release, and suspected to be responsible for DMT release upon death or near-death.

>>10610850
i got rid of a 5 year depression, utilizing psilocybe Cubensis and the support of family/friends.
in my opinion family is most important, psychadelics just lets you reflect on things in a different way.

>>10610850
>do DMT
>lose grip of reality
>listening to music in my headphones
>when I close my eyes, that certain beat loops
>literally DJ the music with my blinks

Such an amazing drug. Everyone should do it once in their life, but I'd argue at a mature age.

>>10610904
isnt schizotoxin just some made up word created by drug communities like bluelight?

>>10612425
It's been a word used in scientific literature for at least 4 decades.

>>10610895
>There's so much more to it that our knowledge of it is comparable to a drop in the ocean. Psychedelics literally take you into another dimension.

There's no value outside of subjective experience. And even then, such an experience gives you no further insight about reality.

>>10610950
you cant be soapboxing if youre using fucking acronyms no one understands

>>10611140
>seeing thoughts visually
Isn't that normal?

>>10611268
>the part in your brain that sees patterns
how convinient

>>10612908
not in the way he means it

>>10612947
Explain please.

>>10612947
>>10613176
What the hell, this is my normal:

https://psychonautwiki.org/wiki/Conceptual_thinking

They give you access panel to depattern, repattern, ie brainwash.

One theory is that they suppress the Default Mode Network in the brain, which has several consequences from simple visualization of thoughts and ideas all the way to ego dissolution. Tim Ferriss had an interesting podcast with Michael Pollan about this, it's number 313.

>>10612687
>There's no value outside of subjective experienc
Why not?

>>10612687
Isn't your regular knowledge also ultimately from subjective experience?

>>10611306
yeah lol

>>10611306
Yes indeedy. Props for having arrived at the correct view, fellow internet poster. I remember when I first came to these conclusions on my own just by using simple rational thinking. Quite an exciting moment. It's a shame so many people merely form their ideas from what they are told is correct.

>>10612908
Not regular visualization. An extreme example would be your cognition being disconnected from gross reality and replaced with a geometric gearbox of the inner workings of your mind that you intuitively understand and navigate.

>>10613466
I don't know how I wouldn't be a total slave to my instinct and intuition without being able to do that.

>>10610895
>fries brain
>hurr durr dimensions n shit

>>10613635
What are you doing on a Vietnamese fishing forum?

>>10613654
What do you mean and what does it have to do with introspection?

Psychedelics are for new age hippie faggots. What you see on the drug isnt real or insightful, ITS JUST A DRUG. granted it doesnt fry your brain, but the cons outweigh the pros.

>>10613925
I guess greeks, nords, and several other civilizations were just new age hippies right?

>>10612696
If you don't know what it means it likely doesn't apply to you

>>10612687
>posits objective truth
>says only the subjective exists

>>10612361
He died of brain cancer

>>10610850
what about jumping genes/horizontal gene transfer? gene transfer from food is a huge factor in driving evolution. we are full of plant and other genes.
can you become a mushroom?

>>10611264
yes, via dna methylation

>>10612418
Nah we should all be taking the soma periodically from near birth til death

>>10614208
It could be from all that naptha (petroleum byproduct) he was possibly smoking due to DMT production methods
>>10612418
Nah we should all be taking the soma periodically from near birth til death

>>10614208
You're seriously fucking retarded. Cancer, heart disease and stroke are the most common causes of death in first world countries. There is no correlation between brain cancer and mushrooms, one single person dying of brain cancer isn't a correlation. It doesn't take a genius to realize this.

>>10614071
Citation please. And look at their societies, no wonder they were so degenerate.

>>10614242
DMT isnt soma

>>10613317
>>10613289
>>10614200

Reality relentlessly forces you to make use of logic and to seek objective nature in order to survive. It is the only thing that empirically works.

Subjective experience eventually leads you to that truth as well. You are cornered to live by logic and materialism. Whatever subjective "truth" drugs teach you are meaningless as they have no empirical use.

>>10613337
>simple rational thinking

That's your problem.

>>10611678
how is kant above telsa?

>>10613252
explain

>>10615838
all the psychedelics are on the same vibe

>>10616446
Tesla is somewhat stupid compared to the greats of science: I don't know why people put him up there with Einstein and Newton. Perhaps they like the myth of the crazy scientific genius.

A huge portion of everyone is post-kantian now in how they think of things. For example, someone like Steven Pinker (a brainlet, but whatever) has revived many Kantian theses (such as the Democratic-peace theory).

But perhaps the easiest argument for Kant's dominance is that most of the great scientists and mathematicians of the early 20th century, even though they despised Kant, nevertheless were caught in a strange family-romance of struggling to prove him wrong. Boltzman and Mach spent years just REEing about him.

>>10616520
He lighted up the world, his inventions are incredible. How could you put Kant above him?

>>10616520
What did Kant do for humanity? Even philosophically speaking

>>10616558
>He lighted up the world
not necesscarily a good thing

>>10611251
Never mind, this is even more fucked up than psychosis

>>10610850
>>10610850

OP I want you to be able to skip like 80% to 90% of the bullshit involved in speaking about this subject, if you happen to check on this thread again anyway.

Read the research papers written by RL Calhart-Harris David Nutt from 2014~ to 2019. The earliest stuff they wrote up is mostly a hypothetical framework based off early tests. They have a very interesting perspective on psychedelics that, although it isn't superbly tested, is compelling, modern, and novel in its own right. It would serve your curiosity a lot better.

here are some links entailing chaos, order and harmonics within the brain connectome.
it thinks my the post is spam so youll have to type them in manually from the image.

>>10616558
>>10616563

He synthesized early modern rationalism and empiricism, set the terms for much of nineteenth and twentieth century philosophy, and continues to exercise a significant influence today in metaphysics, epistemology, ethics, political philosophy, aesthetics, and other fields. The fundamental idea of Kant’s “critical philosophy” – especially in his three Critiques: the Critique of Pure Reason (1781, 1787), the Critique of Practical Reason (1788), and the Critique of the Power of Judgment (1790) – is human autonomy. He argues that the human understanding is the source of the general laws of nature that structure all our experience; and that human reason gives itself the moral law, which is our basis for belief in God, freedom, and immortality. Therefore, scientific knowledge, morality, and religious belief are mutually consistent and secure because they all rest on the same foundation of human autonomy, which is also the final end of nature according to the teleological worldview of reflecting judgment that Kant introduces to unify the theoretical and practical parts of his philosophical system.

Outside of philosophy he exerted a huge influence on the development of cognitive science, logic (via Frege) and political science. Moreover, much contemporary jurisprudence and international law is irredeemably Kantian.

Lastly, he exerted a seminal influence on eighteenth century thinking (including obviously the sciences)—the scientifically fruitful time period of the Enlightenment got its name from Kant's essay "what is Enlightenment?"

>>10616733
Actually I am not certain of that last point.

>>10616733
>, which is also the final end of nature
How?
And I dont see how that is influential. Ive never understood how Kant is above Deleuze or Hermes for example.

>>10616775
>He synthesized early modern rationalism and empiricism, set the terms for much of nineteenth and twentieth century philosophy, and continues to exercise a significant influence today in metaphysics, epistemology, ethics, political philosophy, aesthetics, and other fields.


Even if Kant weren't right, your question was "influential," so I think the first sentence is enough.

By the way, I am a lazy fuck, so I just took that first paragraph from the SEP article on Kant, which I would read if you are interested.

https://plato.stanford.edu/entries/kant/

What have you read by Kant though?

>>10616798
critique of pure reason briefly a few years ago and just random articles. whats so special about syntheizing the two? most philosophers are just copypastas from indians, heidegger schopanheur you name it

Why are there so many psych users on /sci/?

>>10617286
i'd say 4chan in general. the fucking site is filled with posts about their retarded pills

>>10617286
/psy/

>>10611088
A ton of pharmaceutical are based on mycotoxins.

>>10617286
Really just in general nowadays
We're apparently in a "psychedelic revolution" like in the 60s
Also shitloads of celebrities being advocates for them.

>>10617286
psychedelics increase trait openness via increasing neurite formation in frontal regions. Trait openness is a very good quality in science. Coincidence that people who like science also have high openness? I think not

>>10617286
excuse the cliche.

In a world divided psychedelics can bring unity.
It is a result of the current state of the world we live in.

>>10617322
This is the second coming of the 60s but will likely be longer lived.

>>10613337
Shut the fuck up you pompous twat.

>>10617286
No clue
It all starter with a extraction of LSA from baby hawaiian woodroses and now i somehow i have a whole stash or psychedelics ranging from ETH-LAD to 4-AcO-DMT
I might try freebase DiPT or DMT soon

>>10611145

ive had drug psychosis before and it is NOTHIING like taking shrooms or acid. people that say tripping is like psychosis or schizophrenia have no idea what they're talking about.

>>10616651
>>10611251

???

when i play guitar its like im speaking through the guitar and when i listen to someone play the guitar (only) its as though they are singing through the guitar. isn't this normal or a symptom of autism lel.

>>10611316

>shrooms
>negative effect

i beg to differ

>>10613223

its called autism, we both have it.

>>10610895

eh, only once on a shroom trip something extreme happened. it was a bad trip and i felt like i was going to faint/pass out (never ever happened before), so i kinda tilted my head back and put my legs up to get the blood to rush back into my head then i curled up because i felt so horrible and i remember closing my eyes and seeing something EXTREMELY bizarre. something so far from anything in reality its nearly impossible to describe. it was terrifyingly weird and interesting at the same time. the best way to describe it...it was like a giant silver sphere with a fuck ton of horizontal and vertical red lines that started to morph and change all in sycn with each other and the red seem to "bleed out" onto the the rest of the silver surface of the sphere. i cant explain the rest of what i saw happening for those 5-10 seconds, it was just terrifying and strange. i did shrooms many times in the past but never experienced anything like that before. all my previous trips were very pleasant and had cool and enjoyable visuals.

>>10617889
>>10617896
Yes, it is pretty much agreed on they make pople autistic.

>>10617931

>pople

Heh, you undid yourself kiddo.

>>10610895
I hate people like you. Always some annoying burned out failure talking about how everyone else through the entire existence of humanity is wrong. Get a job pal.

>>10617933
how? it's a typo

>>10617950

Not very intelligent, are you? Heh.

>>10617931
libtard reckt

>>10617953
I literally just didn't press the 'e' key enough. Really if you don't have anything better to say just stop posting please.

>>10611678
Couldnt be more wrong. Imagine sitting in the dark (because the sun is down and no light bulbs) and thinking great Im glad I picked the guy who has a theory of life.

>>10612425
Ya "F" big pharma man

>>10613337
You're such a cuck

>>10617961

>claims that magic mushrooms cause autism
>accuses others of shitposting

>>10614386
This is the problem with the drug community. You make a LONG post about how nothing unusual happened to this guy who did drugs for his entire life. A guy later points out that his cause of death was far from normal and the first response is "youre a fucking retard". You pretend to have the facts and sound intellectual but the second someone debates you and with 5 words crushes your theory you go into a child argument

>>10617984

the anon you're replying to is right though. what is your problem?

>>10617837
This guy thinks he's smart. Little does he know he'll continue his search of nothingness until his brain can no longer function and live out the rest of his days in the New Mexico desert avoiding tiny black helicopters while wearing a tin hat.

>>10617988
He's not right at all. He presented an argument that turned out to be false and was proven wrong.

>>10617994

Wrong how?

>Someone takes loads of mushrooms for years
>dies of heart disease or diabetes

>HURRDURR IT MUST'VE BEEN THE SHROOMS

You're a fucking idiot. You're purposely ignoring the other fuck ton of factors and variables. You're just a salty little pencil neck nerd salty that no one ever shared drugs with you.

Does microdosing work?

>>10613337
le cuckmaster supreme

>>10611306
What's the name of that painting?

>>10618009
I was spot on with you. Enjoy the failure of a life you're pursuing.

>>10618009
"salty little pencil neck nerd salty"
Someone sounds "salty"

Drugs do not give you further insight about reality.

"Oh but subjective experience is all that matters!"

Do you really think you're *that* special?

>>10617990
I don't think I'm that smart, but i've yet to experience any negative side effects from taking all those psychedelics.
Psychedelics helped me learning how to socialize with others and deal with problems I have had in my life.
Why should I stop taking them?

Conciousness isnt even real.

Free will is fake.

>>10617974
I didn't say they cause autism. I said that they kind of simulate autism. (instead of psychosis, as people used to assume before autism was,even known)

The real red pill is that there is no such thing as consciousness

We're basically robots controlled by our genetics.

>>10618138
The real question is why you think you'll turn out different then all the rest of the burnouts who made that same choice. Insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting a different outcome.

>>10610850
i like to pointlessly wonder how psychedelics alter the "quantum measurement" issue where conscious observers affect the outcome of experiments, would the double slit experiment work different with a bunch of shroomed out scientists running it (assuming they could competently operate their various apparatus)

>>10618131
calm down copernicus

>>10618144
>Conciousness isnt even real.
correct

>>10618187
>where conscious observers affect the outcome of experiments,
they dont need to be conscious retard

>>10614386
>>10618213
Same fag

who else chad datura here

>>10618009
brain cancer is not a common disease retard
given the amount of acid and shrooms he did i would be suprised if he didn't die of brain cancer
McKenna was delusional schizo who never contributed in any real way to humanity, yet the druggies rip off ideas in order to justify his insane ramblings
at least retard died and rid the world of his cancer, man fuck that schizo faggot

>>10611145
I took about 500 micrograms of acid one time and it was absolutely like psychosis. I completely lost my grip on reality. Thought that I had broken through an illusory reality - seemed incredibly obvious. Thought I was the only thing in existence (god) and that my whole life thus far had just been a weird experience I'd put myself through for fun, because being in perfect paradise all the time got boring.
I did and said some really embarrassing shit that night. I wouldn't recommend ever taking more than 200 micrograms, or possibly any at all.

Yes, you can obtain fundamental truths and insights from use of psychedelics and whatnot. The way I view and interact with both myself and the world was completely changed by my experiences with LSD and psilocybin
No, they are not actually bestowing this information upon you. They are not supernatural and are not giving you any information, and it’s very easy to trick yourself into thinking that you’re receiving information from something beyond yourself

Your whole life has been presented to you through the filter of your brain
Life seems and feels a certain way to you (what does it feel like? You tell me, you’re feeling it right now)
The way it feels is, if not caused, undoubtedly influenced by your brain
Any changes to the way your life has immediately felt to you have been slow, gradual changes over long periods of growth
Psychedelic drugs completely alter the way your brain processes the information of both the world around it and itself, and consequently your experience of life itself fundamentally changes while they are in your system
You can’t possibly know what this is like until you try it. Time will be presented differently to you. Space will be presented differently to you. Your sense of meaning and semantics, your self, even your own thought process will be presented differently to you
For the first time in yourself you will be able to compare two completely separate “feelings” of existence itself and by comparing and contrasting those two states, life changing realizations can be derived
Personally, my biggest realizations (to the extent that I can put them into words) were that 1), my experience of the world (including time, space, etc) has little to no correlation with what the world itself is and 2) the self, MYself, is fundamentally unknowable.

These are all insights that can be achieved through meditation without any substances at all, by the way

>>10618144
Says the ant from the mound, “the great mountain has been conquered”
Consciousness and free will are near-completely separate concepts with little to say about each other. Free will is a dead end of thought, not worth focusing on. Consciousness, or more generally, phenomenological experience, is infinitely more interesting

>>10611306
There are things we don't know 100% with certainty and probably never will. It's why religion is so prevelant and always will be. If you want to believe there is a higher dimension(s) to reality and that we can have experiences that tap into those dimensions via meditation/drugs then it is no different from believing an all powerful God exists and is judging our actions. Just be open to the idea that your faith in this religion is not an absolute truth, but that it gives you what you need to live the life you want to live without causing unjust harm to others.

Note to everyone taking psychedelics:
The “hunt” is a trap that you need to keep yourself out of. That feeling that you’re “almost there,” just one more trip/higher dose will surely make everything clear, etc. It’s a road that takes you nowhere but misery and self-delusion
The hardest thing I’ve ever had to do was face the fact that we are incapable of fully figuring this all out. The mind can not know itself all at once, and reality can not be known without a complete mind that fully understands itself, the reality it is swaddled in, and the system that mind and reality create together. It’s ostensibly like the incompleteness theorems, if that’s a helpful analogy. Reality can only be known through mind, but mind can not fully know mind (the process of knowing is a feature of mind and by extension just as impossible to decipher)
The answer is to let it go and ride out the surreal miracle of being whatever it is we are. Take drugs and enjoy them if you like, but do not fool yourself into becoming their slave

>>10618322
>Thought I was the only thing in existence (god) and that my whole life thus far had just been a weird experience I'd put myself through for fun, because being in perfect paradise all the time got boring.
I had this thought myself a couple times. Weird to see it's not only me.

>>10618322
I’ve been through the same thing and that still isn’t what psychosis is. It’s complete self-enclosure in a grand narrative while in a state where your sensitivity to meaning, profundity, and majesty are extremely amplified. In such a state, you’re still thinking “logically,” but it’s logical within the bizarre new system of meaning and form that psychedelics place your “observing center” within.
If you’re anything like me, those trips are also intimately linked with a feeling of shame of being so taken with pseudoscientific thought for the duration of the experience. One time reality itself seemed to arrange itself into this bizarre 3-manifold with rigid scientific, skeptical thought on one end and pure imaginary, esoteric, psychedelic thought on the other, with me caught directly in between them. That’s why I don’t consider it psychosis, the sober part of you is still there and capable of giving input.

Plus there’s just too much cohesion and continuity to the psychedelic thought process

>>10618372
>(god) and that my whole life thus far had just been a weird experience I'd put myself through for fun, because being in perfect paradise all the time got boring.
>I had this thought myself a couple times. Weird to see it's not only me.
only one of you is god, please duke it out and post results

Psychedelics are a somewhat risky way to "rearrange" ones brain "circuit" so they can tackle problems from a different angle they were incapable of seeing before. But the risk is that they can also have adverse effects that leave your mind more susceptible to paranoia and delusions. These adverse effects may be due to external conditions more so than internal, or a bit of both, but the fact is the drugs can still make the situation worse. And for those who don't get those effects, they can still run into the addict trap. They continue to seek out these experiences to establish some sort of higher thinking but have long since past that need for a "rearrangement to solve problems" and are just doing it for the feel good effects.

There is still a place for these drugs for a seldom used medication for the purpose of helping us see our hard to solve problems from different angles, but the most important aspect here is honesty with yourself and others. Much of our problems can be solved by being honest in all things and allowing ourselves to deal with the hard truths of our precieved reality. Honest communication with others can be far more beneficial than said drugs to overcome problems of perception, but the key here is honesty, off all things.

>>10618372
>>10618417
no man, if you are god putting yourself through the existence game, then there is only one conciousness, who randomly gets to live each life. You were your mother, brother, your dog, etc. All part of making things interesting for someone who can do anything

>>10610850
there is more to it

>>10618417
There is only one god
And she is the girl reading this

>>10618459
Your god is a tranny

>>10618510
It was a joke and you ruined it

>>10618515
Well anyways it doesn't matter in which body god finds itself. You are already inside god, controlling a body from its position, but only restricted to this body.
On the other hand, you got your cute female penis fantasies which god is totally okay with :) rejoice

>>10618173
Have you actually ever used a psychedelic in your life?
Or are you just shitting out some views you have on psychedelics?
If you haven't you're just a ignorant idiot who spreads your own misinformation.
So which is it?

>>10618577
That was more of an angry statement with a "so which is it?" placed at the end. I have not used drugs at all in fact because due to genetics I am predisposed to anxious feelings so the consequences are not good. I've had friends use and mess up their lives to the point where they're now chasing the feeling to be back to normal. Keeping busy seems to help. I also lost my brother to drugs. He used them in college with friends for a while and eventually had a trip so bad he developed schizophrenia. He became a totally different person overnight and we worked for years trying to help him but eventually had to let him off on his own and figure it out. I was the one who found him dead one evening so I feel like I've got a pretty solid understanding of the severity of what you're messing around with.

>>10618138
You'll end up a schizo at some point.

>>10618766
It's sad but likely with the "I'm invincible" attitude. The harsh reality is what the family has to deal with if he develops schizophrenia. The suicide rates are very high so your in constant stress worrying about them.

>>10618757
Well I'm sorry for your loss, but the thing is that drugs aren't for everyone.
Often on shrooms i end up cleaning my room and think of the actions I've done this week and how I could execute them better next time.
Also you can't chase a psychedelic "high" because the 5-HT2 receptors build up a tolerance so fast that you would need to take twice the dose 2nd day to get the same effect
>trip so bad developed schizophrenia
He probably wasn't mentally well even before the trip
Psychedelic can trigger schizophrenia yes, but the person must be prone to it.
>>10618766
I don't even have paranoid thoughts so how the fuck should I even develop it?
Also it's easier to develop it by smoking weed from what i've read

>>10618805
>Often on shrooms i end up cleaning my room and think of the actions I've done this week and how I could execute them better next time.
You don't need to self-induce brain damage for that.

>>10618805
you are right. i straight up mega dosed acid my first time and ended up really good. spinned me out of depression and lead me to seek well being. last year instead i dissociated after hitting the bong and it took me few months to get psychologically sane again

>>10618805
Most people I know who have used hallucinogens started with pot so it becomes pretty dangerous quickly. I'll never wrap my head around how people can play around with something so fragile as your own brain. Its insanely dangerous with no possibility of a great outcome. Also any normal person finds more efficient ways to do things in a normal mindset I dont know why you would link that to being on drugs. Honestly though I fear for you and the people close to you if you keep it up. It's just an unnecessary danger to put yourself through.

>>10618807
>classic psychedelics cause brain damage
Okay, sorry but your mental institution just called they want their retard back.
Read some fucking studies before making such strong opinion about something.
>>10618815
Don't worry I know how to take my drugs

>>10618823
Well I'm out. I cant say I didnt warn you. You're clearly smarter then me and everyone else out there that have seen the ugly side of what you're doing but who the hell are we? We're clearly "retarted" as you put it. Do what you want to your body and your family but dont fucking advocate this bullshit. Nothing makes me want to eject a whole 9mm clip into someone's head more then them selling or talking up hallucinagens.

>>10618830
https://www.nature.com/news/no-link-found-between-psychedelics-and-psychosis-1.16968
This is /sci/ so where is the science backing up your views?

>>10616818
the perennial philosophy belongs to no one.

>>10617286
The opioid crisis is probably doesn't help.

>>10617296
Underrated post

>>10611306
Are you studpid? There is an uncapturable amount of meaning in everything anon. Grow appreciative not nihilistic. I dont do drugs but i've done acid litterally once and its reminded me of that

>>10611678
based

>>10617837
if youve never done dmt before fuck tryna make dipt lmao. dmt is an amazing experience that i think everyone interested in altered states of consciousness needs to have at least once in their life, when they are ready for it of course

>>10620135
Have you done any other "base" tryptamines beside DMT?

I've vaped 5-MeO-DMT more times than i fapped

Bumping interesting thread

Neuroscientist focused on psychedelic research here.

In short, psychedelics are thought to increase the 'complexity' or entropy of cortical information (higher processing), and increase the bottom-up connections from the striatum/thalamus (emotional brain) to the cortex.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/29548884
Subjectively, this results in a flattening of beliefs or a relaxation of priors within a bayesian framework.(https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prior_probability))

In terms of visual distortions, I found this to be a really good account.

https://plus.maths.org/content/os/issue53/features/hallucinations/index

>>10620976
>Increase complexity of higher thought
>boost bottom-up processing
>stop relying on assumptions

In other words, it shows you autism.

>>10610850
PDs utilize rhythmic and cortex pattern recognition. They effect dopamine in a way that is advantageous over the dimensionality when it comes to experience. If you see little icons and/or swirling energy, that's due to states that we can create with the eyes (using dopamine, or sensory command chemical, or sense neuronal fluid) becoming easily accessed from drug effect. It's likely half the mind and half the breed of PD. You experience a chemical reaction and vessel experience which can have acute effects on your mind such as background encircling power.

>>10620986
complexity in terms of a lempel ziv compression of functional connectivity over time from fMRI data
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/29548884

Boost bottom up connections* as in greater effective connectivity demonstrated via DCM from fMRI data
https://www.pnas.org/content/116/7/2743

Graph-theory based models of cognition still do rely on a bunch of assumptions, but it's still nice to keep up to date with current literature.

Can't do much about the autism though.

>>10621004
I mean this is very much alike to the processes that are enhanced in Autism, meaning that taking LSD is alike to being autistic.

>>10621004
I mean this is very much alike to the processes that are enhanced in Autism, meaning that taking LSD is probably alike to being autistic.

One time while I was tripping with friends in my girlfriend’s dorm, we couldn’t find a lighter in the room, then my friend bumped into a desk and I thought it was knocking at the door. I asked if someone could answer and my friend said “don’t worry, it was just me” and knocked three times on the desk to demonstrate. At that exact moment, there were three actual knocks on the door, we all looked at each other, nervously opened it, and it was my girlfriend’s suitemate (who none of us had ever talked to before) with a big box of lighters, offering them to us for free.

I know it was probably all a coincidence but come the fuck on, man

>>10610850
DMT expands your consciousness, enabling it to perceive a higher dimension the human mind doesn’t have the hardware to comprehend

>>10618823
I agree with this anon, if LSD et al. caused physical brain damage it would be very well known by now given the hippies ate so much more of the stuff (average dose was way higher back then). To say it drives people crazy and ruins lives as if it were as harmful as Alcohol is completely dishonest.

>>10621536
What the fuck does the word “dimension” even mean to you people

>>10621556
Bad trips and quality controls will

>>10621634
Both of those risks can be limited or eliminated by being smart and responsible
Also, bad trips can be the most useful kind there is. I had one nine months ago and while it took a while to recover, I came out the other end completely changed for the better. I haven't touched any psychs since then, I need all the time to process what I went through that I can get. I'm sure I'll feel ready at some point but for now I wouldn't mind if that was the last trip I ever had. It really set me straight

>>10621645
>>10621634
never done any drugs, what is a bad trip like?

>>10621668
Psychotic episode
https://logosmedia.com/Entheogens_WhatsinaName_PsychedelicSpirituality_SocialControl_CIA

>>10621668
Can't speak for others, and I've only been through the one, but I can do my best to put it into words.
It was the highest dose I had ever done (two gel tabs, which we later learned were 250 ug each). My friend and I were planning to get a good night's rest and drop in the morning but we got stupidly impatient and cocky and dropped it at 1 AM when we couldn't fall asleep. For three hours it was the most beautiful experience I could ever imagine, it was like the entire universe was being resolved into a majestic, perfect ending. It felt massive and utterly important.
Then we made our second stupid mistake of the night and smoked some weed at ~5 AM. Immediately knew it was a bad decision. If you don't know already, LSD (especially when mixed with marijuana) can give you "thought-loops" where you get stuck in a cycle of thoughts and actions and it genuinely feels like time itself is looping. I started to get stuck in a loop that was getting shorter with every iteration, and as the loops started nearing what felt like being infinitely short, I experienced a kind of ego death where the world, time, and myself all fell away and I was experiencing nothing but a dancing, fractilic flower that was absolutely permeated with feelings of dysphoria and deep unease. At one point my friend grabbed my shoulders and had to tell me "anon, none of this is profound. It's only a drug. You'll be okay" which was the most painful thing I've ever had to convince myself of. It literally felt like an eternity that I was trapped there, until I was suddenly on the other side. Went home, had my girlfriend come over, and sobbed into her chest for twenty minutes.

>>10621684
I had a similar thing. First time in Dam doing truffles, did them in a nice group in a park in the day and had a fantastic time. Next evening had some shrooms and had a great first few hours before people went to bed I was kinda left to my own thoughts. I would lie in bed listening to music and go through good and bad cycles lasting maybe a few minutes each, the 'good' part was more just relief from the bad though. The bad wasn't just mentally scary but physically unpleasant, the bed got super uncomfortable, felt like I was lying on spikes or something horrible like a bed of mangy mushrooms; my music starting sounding dreadful; the visuals made everything look really deadpan dirty and ugly. I was into speedsolving Rubik's cubes so I tried during the good trip and I'd be in great form but during the bad I would lock up and make mistakes. I just started reminding myself that however bad I felt it was just a drug and it was guaranteed to wear off given enough time and I should just focus on waiting it out, that helped a lot.

>>10621684
Oh I almost forgot, I also ended up convincing myself that God was speaking to me through my friend's mouth at one point

The trip was deeply helpful, though. Before it, I had really fallen into the trap of thinking that there's some profound answer waiting at the bottom of the drug and that just oooone more trip would surely let me see it. The bad trip basically grabbed me by the scruff, shoved my head in the mud, and said "listen fucker, you're as fundamentally unknowable as reality is and this drug is not going to change that. Shape up and grow out of this before you lead yourself down a very dark and lonely path. You don't know shit and never will. Be glad you exist." That realization let me mature quite a bit

serotonin flush basically
tripping and scizophrenia does have similar fMRI
tripping causes release of serotonin
doses taken at low levels have an SSRI effect.

serotonin flush becuase of how you feel after tripping, and esp after habitual chronic tripping,

>>10618420
SSRIs help in new neuron growth.

SciShow Psych has some videos on youtube about hallucinations, and some on depression and anti depressants.
wish they would do more on extreme states.

>>10621533
I swear this kind of tom foolery always happens when I trip. I get that it makes you more susceptible to interpreting things as meaningful and can make you more aware of coincidences but those things really just don't happen in sober life nearly as often

>>10621668
I bad tripped on 500 micrograms twice. It wasn't the whole trip each time, but it was enough to give me terror. I've also witnessed people bad trip on 500 micrograms and 300 micrograms once each. Can't really put it into words, it's difficult to comprehend such experiences, let alone remember them properly years later. But, when you're entire existence is warped and fucked, like, every bit of information pouring into your consciousness is distorted by psychedelia, it becomes easy to think "how do I know what's real"? You're fucked at that point if it bothers you. It can drive you insane if you don't manage to just go with the flow. Fortunately it's a drug with a finite lifespan and it ends, despite what you may convince yourself of.

>>10612182
think about what you're saying and the fact that human language is engineered to be able to explain anything, including the effects of acid on brains.

>>10610882
This. Psilocybin causes massive amounts of adrenaline and serotonin to be released. Serotonin potentiates connections between neurons, lowering the activation thresholds, which causes different areas of the brain that don't normally communicate to start communicating. Adrenaline stimulates and activates neurons sensitive to it which intensifies cognition and gives that 256K HD look to reality.

>>10611396
often badly. don't look towards geniuses for life advice. we don't remember them for being particularly happy.

>take 4 hits of LSD
>still no visuals

I got a fair amount of "warping" on things though my family couldn't even tell I was on something other than mum remarking that I was sweating a lot after a while.
Meanwhile, my mates who took the same stuff were seeing all kinds of crazy shit on 1 hit.

it just fucking sucks how anti depressants/psychotics are trip blockers and you have to wait a fair while for them to get out of your system

>>10622902
are you a lot taller or heavier than your friends?

>>10622904
I'm 95kg and 6"2'

>>10622907
I very specifically asked relatively to your friends so this is not an answer. maybe your friends are all 6'3 and severely obese.

>>10622910
Oh right, no we're all about the same height, shortest would be like 5"11'

>>10622903
>go to Amsterdam for ayahuasca retreat
>was on duloxetine at the time
>dulls the trip

Still vomited and shitted constantly though.

>>10621634

I knew someone would take the bait. If by QC you mean "They say it's LSD but it's not" there are obviously ways to obtain it that don't run that risk as highly or people wouldn't be talking so much about psychedelics these days. You are right about bad trips, I agree with you, they can obviously be traumatic experiences at their worst. That still does not make the classic psychedelics (LSD, Psilocibin, DMT) as harmful as Ethanol. Ethanol can wreak havoc on the liver, the brain, the heart, the kidneys and the pancreas. It has some kind of correlation with increased cancer risks depending on how often one doses. With the classic psychedelics the risks are mostly mental, barring Serotonin Syndrome (rare, usually caused by poly-drug abuse) and maybe heart attack/stroke risk (A 27 y.o US woman back in the mid-late 70s was admitted to a hospital for a stroke while on LSD). The classic psychs don't have low LD50s either.

>>10617286
psychs are the reason I even lurk /sci/ made me interested in the world

>>10622958
>What is HPPD
>Alcohol strawman
Booze does not revise people in the profound way PDs can, addictions are not the end level of misuse. Your caveats are attainable, although not for all users many are brainlets, etc and will not guarantee a benign experience.

>>10618757
Basically you have no idea what the fuck you're talking about. It's like a psychologist diagnosing someone they've never met

>>10622656
>>10612182
Im with you guys in the conclusion but NOT in the way you reach it

You cant explain what its like because you've had novel subjective experience. Language is useless for novel subjective experience.
Language can currently describe existing experiences and combinations of them. Some new experiences can be communicated by the combination of known things. But something like psyches that create new experience from the ground up, would require ground level language. Its possible, just not yet. Once we have words to describe the building blocks of experience, theoretically those blocks could be combined to create any description of any subjective experience.

>>10622902
The visuals are what a) people who have never done LSD and b) "woooah trippy" brainlets think that LSD is about. It isn't, in fact LSD visuals are quite tame (definitely still there and definitely unique, but tame), even during heroic doses. LSD is interesting because of its effects on your cognition and the internal hallucinations. For me, I rarely see much other than vibrant colors, ramped up pattern recognition (wood grain seems to be a mirrored, repeated texture, for example), and subtle celtic-like patterns in the sky. The interesting part is the vivid internal hallucinations I get of complex topological surfaces and 2-manifolds with infinitely dense fractilic patterns on their surfaces. The structure of my own thoughts is represented to me spatially. It's all internal, it's not something you're ever actually seeing with your eyes

>>10622656
>human language is engineered to be able to explain anything, including the effects of acid on brains.
What the fuck are you talking about
Language is a clumsily amalgamated process of trial and error that hopes to be able to let someone induce similar thoughts to their own within someone else's mind

>>10618372
>>10618322
That's the kind fo thoughts we all have to cope with having to to live in this horrible world.

>>10624297
Existence is anything but horrible, friend

bruh they tryin to legalize them thangs oucheeeea

Tripping in college permanently made me conscious of just how close I am to not existing at any point. It's near impossible to put into words, but it's like life is a veil and I've been made aware of just how thin the border between myself and complete annihilation and unexistence is. Like I could turn my head and see the void and lose myself at any moment

>>10617903
Saw what I can only describe as 'infinite space' once in a pitch black bathroom, proceeded to have a panic attack while tripping balls, and then developed OCD like symptoms for the following 6 months. Golden teachers

>>10622902
>>10624163
I'm getting convinced that psychedelics is a group of chemicals that have one thing it common, which is they can restore consciousness in people who don't have it. If you have it, psychedelics have little to give you besides some boring visuals and feeling a bit giddy.

>>10624487
absolute 'cidlet

>>10624487
I'm getting convinced that you're a p-zombies trying to convince yourself that you're one of the "real ones"

>>10624587
>>10624630
It's obviously the other ones, who get so fascinated if shrooms show them what it means to have consciousness. Having consciousness is sort of magical and (so far) unexplainable indeed, but only a p-zombie would find it so fascinating and different from its everyday reality.

>>10624687
I completely disagree that psychedelics generate consciousness or can show one without it what it's like to possess it. Psychedelics dramatically and violently alter the phenomenological landscape you inhabit, making temporary changes the magnitude of which has only been experienced before in the slow, gradual change from infancy to personhood. By feeding the conscious mind something so suddenly different, it allows one to compare and contrast the similarities and difference between the two in order to more accurately understand what is carried over between those two states of mind/being.

I once had a few co-workers who would just drop acid, get drunk, and go clubbing every weekend. When I asked one what acid was like (before I had ever tried it) she just said "mannn it's awesome, you see some crazy colors and shit and your body feels hella good."
Maybe it's a baseless assumption but if trip reports can in any way indicate sentience or a lack thereof in the reporter, it seems far more likely that those without it would only report surface level "trippiness" and not find anything particularly significant or profound about the experience at all.

>>10624729
That doesn't make sense, obviously those who don't normally posess conscious experience woudl find the experience profound, while those who are conscious all the time wouldn't find anything of much spiritual significance in it.

>>10624746
You'll find my response to both of those points within the post you just responded to

>>10624773
Ok, let me break it dow for you:
p-zombie, sober: has no consciousness, feels nothing unusual.
p-zombie, on psychedelics: has consciousness, feels sort of funny
Conscious person, sober: does have consciousness, feels nothing unusual
conscious person, on psychedelics: Still has consciousness, feels sort of funny.

p-zombie on psychedelics - p-zombie sober = gets concious, feels sort of funny
conscious person on psychedelics - conscious person sober = feels sort of funny.

See the difference? What the hell do you not understand?

>>10624773
It's pretty obvious that the experience of the p-zombie gaining conscious would far overshadow the other effects, while to a person who already is conscious, only the "secondary" effects would be noticeable.

>>10624815
Once again, I seriously doubt and see absolutely no reason to believe that a psychedelic could somehow bestow consciousness upon a p-zombie, even if only temporarily

>>10618386
In regards to the standard definition of psychosis:
>The word psychosis is used to describe conditions that affect the mind, where there has been some loss of contact with reality. When someone becomes ill in this way it is called a psychotic episode. During a period of psychosis, a person’s thoughts and perceptions are disturbed and the individual may have difficulty understanding what is real and what is not. Symptoms of psychosis include delusions (false beliefs) and hallucinations (seeing or hearing things that others do not see or hear). Other symptoms include incoherent or nonsense speech, and behavior that is inappropriate for the situation.

What I experienced was exactly like psychosis.

>>10610850
>what are psychedelics really doing to the brain/consciousness?
Getting you high as fuck baby boi

>>10618035
Feels Guy by wojak

>>10610895
Brain damage can also feel like "another dimension". I hate druggies so god damn much, you're no different from the toxic religious people you love to shit on.

>>10611306
Basically yes. Someone post that one "are you having an existential crisis" flowchart.

>>10611396
Newton was a hardcore Christian. He calculated Doomsday for 2060.

>>10610850
The brain is incredibly complex.
If you take compounds that can mimic neurotransmitters they're obviously going to cause a spanner in the works that effect how your consciousness is constructed.
I think DMT is the most interesting. It really seems to transport you to another dimension and many users seem to have the same experiences and meet the same entities

>>10610937
I get this too. I feel poisoned and get shifting swirling geometric patterns when I close my eyes.

>>10618035
based

>>10618148
You should keep serious answers like this to yourself, you'll feel embarrassed later when you find later/better answers.

I'm not going to try to get super specific, but based on current understanding, the fact that a similarly shaped molecule to one that "my own body" produces is able to mimic and take the place at a receptor site and then there's a cascade of odd effects and especially time distortion that feels connected to ability to concentrate for 'longer' than usual (even if from an outside observer's POV nothing is happening different on the SI unit time scale), this speaks to me personally of a vast ocean of possibilities we have not yet considered in the realm of personal experience.

I've done LSD and mushrooms each probably 100+ times, often in public, often in large doses, and have only lost my shit 4-5 times - for the most part, seeing Gustav Holst's the Planets at Walt Disney concert hall on an eighth of mushrooms and similar experience has been extremely affirming, although when I get too deep into MAOI enhanced tryptamine usage I'm often presented with the feeling that I'm accessing patterns of neuron activity that humans were not exactly programmed to receive left to their own devices, but that last idea might be underestimating ourselves.

>>10624832
There are reasons to believe that, namely that many people reject that consciousness exist and what they describe on psychedelics sounds like if they tried to describe conciousness, perhaps somewhat distrbed by the side effects of the drugs, as if they never had it.
>>10624848
By that definition all neurotypical people would be psychotic.
>>10625056
That is the attempt to illustrate the world moving relative to your head bobbing when you walk? In that case it's a really poor one.

>>10624832
There are reasons to believe that, namely that many people reject that consciousness exist and what they describe on psychedelics sounds like if they tried to describe conciousness, perhaps somewhat distrbed by the side effects of the drugs, as if they never had it.
>>10624848
By that definition all neurotypical people would be psychotic.
>>10625056
That is the attempt to illustrate the world moving relative to your head bobbing when you walk? In that case it's a really poor one.

>>10622934
>shitting your date with mommy aya
bad anon

bump

>>10613641
Shouldn't it be the limit as x approaches 0 rather than infinity?