/sci/ - Science & Math

An explosion in the population of Africans (and their subsequent demanding of free shit,) since them mismanaging themselves seems to become everybody else's problem and suggesting population control is worse than Hitler.

Also, the fucking with the ecosystem on a level of all the animals that eat mosquitoes now can't use them as a food source. The effects of that are too vast to even begin to tell, but that will have effects up the chain as the animals that eat the eaters are influenced and so on.

>>10576867
>twitter.com
GTFO Twatter

I hate Twitter and Google both, but I am in support. All hemovore insects must die. Ticks should go next.

>>10576880
>Small elite groups of people mismanage countries for their own personal gain
>Blame entire continent's population who have no control over it

Truth is, not all animals are critical to the food chain.
Mosquitoes don't do anything special like pollination, they are not exclusive prey for any other animals, and they don't populate any exclusive environments.

>>10576897
There is some truth in what you're saying, but in terms of population explosions, I think it's pretty fair to blame the people doing the fucking, for fucking.

Use condoms or get vasectomy ffs

We should send them more video game consoles

>>10576908
Ok, but do they have any effect on the populations of other creatures? Like competing for nesting areas or reducing their populations via spreading disease?

There's hundreds of species of mosquito. How are you going to get them all?

>>10576889
Death to the haematophage horde!

>>10576916
They have a common genus.
Kill the genus, kill all its species.

>>10576916
GOTTA CATCH'EM ALL

>>10576908
But if X tons of mosquitos are consumed by animals per day and you get rid of all the animals you have to compensate for the lack of mosquitos

>>10576930
100X tons other flying insects as food source

>>10576910
Why would the Africans play video games when they can kill/rope/rape in real life?

>>10576910
>I think it's pretty fair to blame the people doing the fucking
Substantial amounts of them live on less than $1.25 a day and have little access to education, they don't have access to condoms let alone vasectomies. They're probably unaware of overpopulation and even then, just like here in the west, no individual would feel particularly responsible for a problem equally caused by every other individual. They'll just be living their shitty lives, working shitty jobs for scraps, and if they're lucky enough to live old enough they'll fuck their wives and have some kids just like everyone else

Historically population booms only really stop when a country becomes developed anyway so if you hate the thought of endlessly multiplying africans then you should learn and hate the things that cause their countries to be trapped in such a mess, usually it's a few shitty dictators and the oil/mining/chinese companies that they work with

>>10576867
God damn it, now Google are going to take the credit. There's been a few articles before about the project, but nothing to make it household knowledge.

>>10576913
Competition for space with other insects might be a thing, but if you get rid of all mosquitoes then you would want other insects to grow in number take their place as a food source.
The animals they prey on won't miss them, and have plenty of other things to worry about.

It's not like there is some super delicate balance with nature in every case. There have been countless extinctions through history and life goes on.
The continued existence of humans will have a much greater impact on other species than the removal of all mosquitoes.

>>10576945
All fair points. The elites especially in Europe are malignant evil scum.

To be fair the biggest problem is deliberately ineffective border control, give it a few months and the idiots in Germany will use the "worker shortage" meme again.

>>10576897
Fine I wont generalize the entire continent
So how come with the tens of different countries having elections every 4 or so years, a leader who fixes their shit still fails to appear and all countries perpetually remain shitholes, almost as if it never was an issue of leadership but the individual living in those countries himself?

>>10576955
>To be fair the biggest problem is deliberately ineffective border control
no? I know you want your /pol/-dream to be true, but even though whether open borders is beneficial or not is up for debate/opinion, it is a completely separate issue from the development status of countries

>>10576880
>and suggesting population control is worse than Hitler
Nobody thinks this, you just have a persecution complex.

>>10576867
Goddamn google, leave the mosquitos alone!

>>10576960
You're right. Government corruption doesnt persist through the ages via fine tuned handling by a group of elites. Any problems a country faces is a reflection of the failures of the people living in that country. Things like classification levels, rigging votes, and establishing laws to maintain power structures that would conflict with the purpose of a democracy are a myth. There is no swamp to drain in the USA.

>>10576965
Yes? I take it you haven't done a lot of traveling so can't really get an appreciation for different people. It's also not really up for debate at all unless you are (or work for) some head of industry wanting hordes of extra consumers and have absolutely no regard for the stability of society or care for the environmental damage that many extra consumers living first world lifestyles cause.

It *is* an issue, considering that once many have the means to move in these nations, they try to move.

I have no patience for this utterly pissant viewpoint which is more concerned with trying to look morally superior and sniffing it's own farts for good boy points instead of thinking about practical results.

>>10576945
>live on less than $1.25 a day
that doesn‘t mean shit if $0.25 would get you everything you need

>>10576897
>it's not the individual soldiers' fault they're invading, pillaging, raping and performing summary executions

>>10576960
>So how come with the tens of different countries having elections every 4 or so years, a leader who fixes their shit still fails to appear and all countries perpetually remain shitholes, almost as if it never was an issue of leadership but the individual living in those countries himself?
Ahh the classic "if X, then how come Y" where Y is an incredibly complex issue that has been debated for decades. Maybe you're right and it is the incredibly simple "they're low quality humans" but let's look at Angola, Africa's 5th biggest economy, as an example:

It got independence from Portugal in 1975 and was ruled by MPLA Commies who then took the China route when they realised they'd be richer if they weren't Commies. 98% of its exports are crude oil and that makes up 3/4 of the govt's income, although the oil industry only accounts for 1% of jobs. The state oil company Sonangol was for years run by a man called Vincente who went to uni at Imperial in London and thanks to him Sonangol had $34 billion in revenues in 2011, similar to Amazon and Coke.
Corruption scandals including western companies, Vincente, and the ruler dos Santos, include (tinyurl) /y6splgnq

About half it's population are below the poverty line and the IMF found the $32 billion went missing from the national treasury between 2007 and 2010
From 1979 to 2017 the country had the same leader, why didn't the Angolans replace him? Were they just inherently stupid?

Well despite an opinion poll suggesting he had approval of just 16% of Angolans he won 72% of the vote in 2012. A man called Kopelipa (who also won big in the scandal linked above) ensured that 3.6 million people were unable to vote, almost as many as the MPLA received. Also, officially the maximum spending during elections is $97k, but the MPLA are estimated to have spent $75 million. It is not easy to overthrow dictatorships even when they have 'elections'.

>>10576982
Nice false equivalence

>>10577006
Any equivalence other than equality could be called "false equivalence". But don't blame yourself for being a retard, it was those nasty Elites who stole your rightfully deserved IQ points from you

Was about damn time. The anti-human green misanthropes naturally will go apeshit but they won once with the ddt ban so it's time to balance things out.

>>10577004
>the solution to everything is more democracy in shithole countries
Fuck off neocon.

>>10577004
Not who you're debating with.
This story sucks, that's a real downer but how do you even fix it. I'd bet my life that if somebody new got in they would immediately just be corrupt themselves and enrich their pals in the same way.

>>10576945
You're wasting your time using facts and logic to argue with someone whose belief is likely based on emotion and willful misinformation.

>>10577020
>>10577020
>Any equivalence other than equality could be called "false equivalence".
Sorry you didn't understand the phrase, here's what it means in this case. You presented not blaming soldiers for the behavior of soldiers as a similar scenario to not blaming civilians for the actions of corrupt governments.You're argument is that if we do want to blame the soldiers for rape and pillage we must also blame the individuals for the actions of their government, I was pointing out that these are not equal scenarios and so that argument in fallacious

>>10577030
>guy he's arguing with literally agreed with the point on the next post

>>10576955
The efficacy of border control makes no difference if the immigrants never desired to leave their home country in the first place. The only true solution is to stop the various megacorporations and nationstates that profit from destabilising these countries from doing so any further. This is clearly not an easy task, but it's the only thing that fixes the dam instead of just plugging the leak.

>>10577022
I didn't suggest any kinds of solutions I just stated what the facts were. What do you suggest as a solution?

>>10576974
Notice how the /pol/friend fails to respond.

>>10577042
But plugging the leak also fixes the damn.

Surely you should have strong borders while waiting to "fix" african nations somehow.

>>10576976
>some head of industry wanting hordes of extra consumers
Much easier to believe that those heads of industry profit heavily from the lack of stability in developing countries.
>once many have the means to move in these nations, they try to move
Yeah, due to the aforementioned destabilization of their home countries by heads of industry. Stop the artificial instability and you stop the immigration at the source. Seems more logical than trying to solve the problem one step removed from the source.
>more concerned with trying to look morally superior and sniffing it's own farts for good boy points instead of thinking about practical results
The same argument could be turned right back around to you, except your good boy points come from a different peer group. As such, it's useless.

>>10577042
We both know there is no way that would happen. As much as we would both like for it to happen.

As somebody who used to work with corporate snakes, I can tell you they have a million and one ways to get their claws into things. Just look at the last century of history, even when they're forced out these big corporate can lobby governments to stage coups.

>personally I hope for an asteroid and in the aftermath we all become city state ancaps/syndicates

>>10576867
>What could go wrong?

Mosquito larva are a massive resource for many higher order animals in waterways. Mosquitoes themselves are also a massive resource for terrestrial animals. Removing trillions of tons of biomass from the world's ecosystem will have devastating results on the ecosystem.

>>10577041
He just shifted the goalpost and raised another commonly held /pol/belief. At best, he's an apologist.

>>10577024
Yeah it's a pretty shit scenario. The worst bit is that China has entered the game and God damn they don't not give the slightest fuck. Companies like the Queensway group and the China International Fund invest massively into things like roads and building towns but the general population can't afford cars or the new houses. They built a town called Kilamba where the cheapest house cost $120,000, so for half the population on under $1.25 a day that's 260 years worth of work, the campaigner who uncovered the scandal I linked above called Kilamba 'a veritable model for African corruption. In exchange for the investment the govt give them contracts so they get all the raw materials that they turn into the cheap phones and shit that we buy. Obviously they don't just do this in Angola but all over the continent wherever they can

>>10577047
Plugging a leak may temporarily stop the flow, but the dam is still left weaker as a whole.
>Surely you should have strong borders while waiting to "fix" african nations somehow.
Regardless of the veracity of that statement, the level of political discourse regarding these two things is massively skewed towards border control, to the point that virtually no politicians with legitimate power even speak of the issues that cause these nations' instability. Ask yourself why this may be.

>>10577056
>Much easier to believe that those heads of industry profit heavily from the lack of stability in developing countries.
Why? If the countries economies are strong, then there's far more wealth to siphon off. I this hard to believe for this exact reason.

Often what I've heard over the years is companies that arrive in these countries looking to make money, find they can't do anything without being involved in corruption. Want to build a factory? Better bribe this official first. Don't want to do that? Don't worry, your competitors will probably do it if you don't.

If these companies are so bad, then how some people want to get into western countries so badly that are allegedly run by them?

>>10577058
Way to bow down to your perceived power of these corporations. Even if there is little hope of achieving it, it's not logical to just give up before trying. Power can always be shifted, if only by one inch at a time.

>>10577056
>destabilization

What absolute meme term is this. You have plenty of migrants coming into Europe from or passing through stable nations (I'll just stop replying if you are enough of a fucking idiot to think they're all from Syria).
It's just that they don't want to stay somewhere that is stable and shitty as compared to western nations which will give them welfare.

This term is one of those ever moving terms which will always apply because it'll never be perfect, it's tiresome bullshit.

Heads of industry also don't entirely depend on this term, since you can't sell home loans, debt and consumer goods to people if the country is a warzone. Why don't you try thinking for once instead of pissing and whining with some /pol/ witch hunt garbage.

I also don't want these people in western nations since it puts more stress on every system of the society I'm in, particularly healthcare, infrastructure and housing prices. Especially considering it's a small country. Their culture is also completely different and I feel no obligation to them at all.

Whatever "anti racist" cred I'll gain from approving of it to you and your idiot friends isn't enough to counteract that.

>>10577065
>Regardless of the veracity of that statement, the level of political discourse regarding these two things is massively skewed towards border control, to the point that virtually no politicians with legitimate power even speak of the issues that cause these nations' instability. Ask yourself why this may be.
Well that's not really an argument against strong borders.

But I can make a very good answer to why politicians don't talk overly about "fixing" the countries from where these migrants come from. Because anything that is suggested is often considered unduly interfering with the affairs of a foreign country. There's also not a lot of obvious stuff you can do.

If you were US president what you *you* do to "fix" mexico and south america? If you had the power, what would you do to "fix" africa?

>>10577066
>Why? If the countries economies are strong, then there's far more wealth to siphon off.
Not if what you want is cheap labor and/or resources. Easier to lowball someone in need than otherwise.
>Often what I've heard over the years is companies that arrive in these countries looking to make money, find they can't do anything without being involved in corruption.
Do you have a source for this?
>Want to build a factory?
That bribe may still be cheaper than the increased construction and labor costs that that factory would cost to build and run in more stable countries.
>If these companies are so bad, then how some people want to get into western countries so badly that are allegedly run by them?
Who's to say that these people even make that connection? They just see a shitty situation around them and want to get out of it, regardless of where that takes them. You can suffer by the hand of a corporation and not be able to tell exactly what's causing your suffering.

>>10577085
>Not if what you want is cheap labor and/or resources.
Why do you want these though? So you can make things that you sell to people with money. Imagine if all over africa was full of middle class people you could sell stuff to? It's not a zero sum game. If you burned everything in the world to the ground so you could own everything you wouldn't be "richer" than owning 1% of a wealthy productive world.

>That bribe may still be cheaper than the increased construction and labor costs that that factory would cost to build and run in more stable countries.
Exactly. That's why it happens.

>Who's to say that these people even make that connection?
The question is for you. If these companies are so evil and destructive, then why to capitalist economies have the highest degrees of freedom and standards of living in the world by far?

>>10577042
>The efficacy of border control makes no difference if the immigrants never desired to leave their home country in the first place.
Right. If an army is threatening to invade your country, it makes no difference if you fortify the border or not, the only thing you can do is send them unlimited amounts of money and maybe carry out assassinations inside their country
> the only thing that fixes the dam instead of just plugging the leak
Freshman-grade rhetoric. I mean, you're comparing your beloved brown invaders to a deadly flood just barely held in control, lmao

>>10577072
>I'll just stop replying if you are enough of a fucking idiot to think they're all from Syria
You seem unnecessarily hostile.
>they don't want to stay somewhere that is stable and shitty as compared to western nations which will give them welfare
So, you're saying that people would prefer to live in a society that will attempt to help them raise their station in life? What point does this even make?
>you can't sell home loans, debt and consumer goods to people if the country is a warzone
Not all heads of industry are involved in those markets.
>Why don't you try thinking for once instead of pissing and whining with some /pol/ witch hunt garbage.
Reads like fartsniffing to me. Your insults don't really do much more than allow you to feel superior over nothing.
>I also don't want these people in western nations
Regardless, is it not better to try and solve the problem at the source rather than forever playing catch-up with border control?
>I feel no obligation to them at all.
You're under no obligation to, but if you want the problem solved, border control is a temporary solution at best. The flood will only ever increase in volume.
>"anti racist" cred
I don't give a single fuck one way or another about any kind of cred. The simple fact is that you're trying to medicate a symptom instead of eradicating the disease. It's useless.

>>10577103
>eradicating the disease
how do you do that?

>>10577073
>Well that's not really an argument against strong borders.
I didn't say that it was, but there's no point in the short-term "solution" of strong borders if there's literally no discussion of a long-term one.
>anything that is suggested is often considered unduly interfering with the affairs of a foreign country
Or the insanely powerful megacorporations make sure that the powerful political leaders know better than to dare threaten them. Probably a disgusting little mixture of both.
>"fix" mexico, etc.
Books could be written on these topics, and I don't claim to be an expert. I'm just saying that I'd like to see the best-equipped humans for the job discussing it in a meaningful way.

>>10577066
>then how some people want to get into western countries so badly that are allegedly run by them?
I doubt they understand the issues that deeply and even if they did, the incredible potential for personal gain no doubt overrules any kind of personal grudge they have.
If they got into those western countries they suddenly have incredible opportunities that they would never get at home. When a poor uneducated African arrives in the UK with no grasp of the language or culture they suddenly find themselves in a scenario where if they could learn the skills and make the right choices they have a chance of being rich, maybe not rich compared to the UK's wealthiest but far richer than they ever could've been at home. If not them, then their children get the chance with the added advantage of actual good schooling and healthcare. Whatever you think about immigrants, if you were a smart person living in a shithole the smartest thing you could do is leave for the West.

>>10577107
So you yourself have no idea how to "fix" any of these countries, but insist that no one should bother with strong borders unless the implement fixed you have that you have no idea what would look like.

Yeah, books have been written on lots of shit. The short version is there's no easy way to "fix" these countries, and any individual idea is rive with massive problems. It's no surprise you don't have any ideas yourself.

It sure is lucky we live in first world countries where these "insanely powerful megacorporations" have gracefully allowed us to have historically high standards of living and freedom, but they are also responsible for all these shit in 3rd world countries.

>>10577089
>Imagine if all over africa was full of middle class people you could sell stuff to
While that may be ideal overall, building infrastructure and repairing the instability sown during the last few centuries is a very large financial obstacle. Megacorporations don't care about a larger profit 50-100 years down the line if it means they have to take massive losses in the meantime.
>Exactly. That's why it happens.
So you agree that it behooves these corporations to set up shop in unstable countries? Does it not then follow that they have a vested interest in keeping said countries unstable?
>why to capitalist economies have the highest degrees of freedom and standards of living in the world by far
One reason may be that, for the most part, these countries developed before the others. They could then use their advanced development to take advantage of less advanced areas. This has been seen time and time again throughout history.

>>10577094
>an army
Massive false equivalence.
>beloved brown invaders
Hello, /pol/. Why are you so afraid of brown people? Do they intimidate you?

Don't be a pussy, OP. ITS GONNA BE RAD

>>10577104
By eliminating the factors that are causing the instability, whatever they may be. Based on my knowledge, which may certainly be limited, the largest factors are megacorporations and predatory nationstates.

>>10577030
The idea that you should just stop your discourse is what's really ruining our own nation. You've got it all figured out right? As long as you've got the moral high ground you can't be wrong and win every argument, and if that conflicts with reality then just try harder until reality itself comports to your very moral ideas.

At what point do societies shift from one of survival to one where they have the education and opportunity not to shit kids well beyond their means? And why have so many other nations been past that point for years, other than African nations?

>>10577058
Can we chill it down a bit with the antisemitism? Thanks

>>10577103
>So, you're saying that people would prefer to live in a society that will attempt to help them raise their station in life? What point does this even make?

- The resources of society are not infinite
- More people = more resource consumption
- Using where they're from as a frame of reference, these people won't maintain the standard of society as it is now (if that place is a warzone, I look to how it was prior to the war).

>Not all heads of industry are involved in those markets.
Enough of them are that outside of war profiteering and perhaps engineering, it's all of them.

>the rest

You can try and help these people if you like, you will be hated for it. Everytime. How many marshal plans worth of aid has been given to Africa now, I think it's just over 4. You give them everything and it's "we're shit because of colonialism" and then they're in Europe and saying it's "payback" even when they're in nations that never fucking colonized anybody.

This sounds really mean to these people, I'm sure plenty are nice. But we are not talking individuals, we're talking population groups. Though I became personally jaded after being very "pro" help and having it shoved back in my face in the most hostile way imaginable by people I thought wanted help.
Now I think no wonder the Chinese just want to plunder the continent.

If you can speak Chinese or have a translated version, you can see how they speak about colonization. They're refreshingly honest about it.

>>10577138
Antisemitism?

I was thinking about United Fruit and BP

We all know here how to fix vast problems of the west yet there are people in charge who are going full retard in all directions of life be it economy, society, ecology or any fucking shit.

It literally makes me wonder if there are no ulterior moves behind our back so they will destroy western countries. The biggest conspiracy such as jew lizard overlords are the most relistic as this fucking point.

>>10577128
>While that may be ideal overall, building infrastructure and repairing the instability sown during the last few centuries is a very large financial obstacle.
It's piss easy to get loans from the IMF or World Bank for these kinds of project, which africa has. Easy because there's basically a guaranteed return so long as the country isn't hopelessly corrupt.

>Does it not then follow that they have a vested interest in keeping said countries unstable?
No it doesn't, because they'd be even happier to have a stable business environment and billions of wealthy people to sell shit to. They're making the best out of what they have. And if they didn't set up shop in these shitty countries, then their economies would be even worse.

>One reason may be that, for the most part, these countries developed before the others.
But the development on the backs of these super powerful mega corporations. Do you not even think a little bit that you might be wrong somehow?

The difference between these countries is some are well governed, and some are not. And corporations that do business there will do what they are permitted to by the government. Even countries that were poor shit holes a few short decades ago like south korea and japan and now top tier first world countries simply from governing themselves well and providing a good business environment. There's no reason the same couldn't happen for Africa. And to some degree, some african countries are getting there slowly.

>>10577127
>insist that no one should bother with strong borders
I don't believe I ever stated that. Is there any reason you believe that both things could not be done? Why is it that the plan always seems to end with the wall and not rooting out the source of the problem as well?
>there's no easy way to "fix" these countries
>It's no surprise you don't have any ideas yourself.
I completely agree.
>gracefully allowed us to have historically high standards of living and freedom
>also responsible for all these shit in 3rd world countries
These two things go hand in hand. We are allowed the standards of living that we have because these corporations fuck over less-developed countries. Megacorporations are not our gods, masters, nor our saviors.

I feel like this discussion has gone from some facts about Angola to people voicing their beliefs and then arguing about different assumptions

>>10577134
Which is basically wrong. So if you actually tried to "help" these countries you'd probably just make them worse.

I guess it's not so simple then right?

This is why people talk about hard borders so often, because even the far left don't want to suggest very invasive ideas on how to help shithole countries besides sending aid.

>>10577155
Hmm? And?

>>10577150
>because these corporations fuck over less-developed countries.
How so?

>>10577132
>massive false equivalence
You're the one who called them a deadly flood, barely held back by the heroic dam-like activities of... what exactly? The CIA?

>>10577155
So it's people having a discussion basically?

>>10577148
>IMF

Are they the ones that gave Ecuador 4.2 billion and in totally unrelated circumstances, they gave up Assange the next day? Or was that the other mob.

>>10577158
There's just a lot of arguing about what people think countries and corporations are like and no actual evidence of what countries and corporations are like.
Likewise a lot of arguments over effectiveness of solutions without any evidence of effectiveness of solutions. It's no wonder the argument never ends when finding some assumption you think is flawed with the opposing view is as easy as having different assumptions

>>10577166
That was them.

>>10577167
You forgot that we are not at UN discussion forum. This site is very close to brain storm. Many differnet causes by different people. About 2% of posters here are right the others are just white noise. Hope you understand how this site work.

>>10576880
End yourself promptly

>>10577144
Please. We cannot lay the blame for this on individual megacorporations. They're just doing the rational thing based on the society they live in. Probably if we send unlimited amounts of money to them, they'll lose all incentive to do whatever's bothering you. It's called BUILDING A DAM and not PLUGGING A LEAK okay.

>>10577168
They sound like very trustworthy group of people to take large amounts from in loans and I see nothing predatory about their lending practices at all.

>>10577173
Fair point, I totally forgot where I was

>>10577179
Perhaps. But they aren't exactly entirely corrupt. Lots of organisations will lend money for infrastructure projects, even private debt markets. Building roads is one of the easiest ways to improve an economy, so getting a loan and paying it off with the increased tax take in the future better economy is a no brainer pretty much.

Personally I think the real best way of fixing it all is to give the UN some actual serious cock and balls to fuck wrongdoers with. Whenever I read about 20th century genocides I always thought that such a thing would be impossible today but then all that shit happens in Burma and outside of voicing their concern virtually nothing happened to stop it, I always thought the UN would step in and stop that kinda shit. Why not have the UN be strong enough that if multinational companies try to fuck over a country they can step in and stop it, not necessarily by force but just make a system where fucking over an african country isn't one that'll make you literal billions of $$$. Make the benefits of being a UN member so good and the price for fucking around so bad that it at least won't get any worse.
The economy has gone totally cross border and global, shouldn't our management of it do the same?

>>10577189
Lots of banana republic dictators aren't totally corrupt

>>10577201
>getting worked up over biased news reporting of Burmese police action vs "rohingya" terrorists
>to the point of begging for a global dictatorship
Not sure if bait or not

>>10577203
Well that's my point. A lot of african countries are simply corrupt and that's the prime reason they are shitholes.

The IMF isn't entirely corrupt, it is a reasonably effective organisation. The Uk and Ireland both got bailouts from it in living memory. Remember international organisations are basically just the member nations that back them. It shouldn't be a shock that the main backers of the IMF might use it to pursue their political goals. The US and UK and others wanting the get their hands on julian assange isn't a big shock. An african shithole looking for a loan to build some roads and bridges isn't going to carry the same political implications.

>>10577210
>believing the UN is just a meeting-place where countries hash out their differences, and sometimes work together constructively to connect supply with need/demand
Holy shit, is it 1955 again? Do people under the age of 70 actually believe this.

>>10577201
Citibank picked Obama's cabinet.
The ties between big finance and government are long cemented. There is something in the human brain that just wants to defer to some big, nebulous authority figure that can solve everything.

Historically, those who want more government control have mocked the notion of a god existing (for obvious reasons), but they themselves seem to always imagine the state as being capable of solving every ill if only it had more power.

>>10577212
Well what is the UN to you?

>>10577207
Sorry for the believing the reports of literally hundreds of journalists over the official propaganda of the govt with a history of oppression of free speech. Anyway, I didn't ask for a dictator or dictatorship I just want an actual effective UN

>>10577213
>those who want more government control have mocked the notion of a god existing (for obvious reasons)
wat

>>10577216
Read more books.

>>10577217
lol. okay.

>>10577215
>Sorry for the believing the reports of literally hundreds of journalists over the official propaganda of the govt with a history of oppression of free speech.

Uh, yeah, about that.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Mockingbird

You'd have to be braindead to think this sort of shit doesn't continue. MSNBC has hired on the former CIA director, for fucks sake.

Guys mosquitos kill more blacks than anything on this planet.

Guys?

Guys, no.

Not Google.

No

>>10577215
>believing the words of "hundreds" of foreigners who weren't there, over millions who were
>equating the first female prime minister Aung San Suu Kyi with the previous military government, which she democratically overthrew
You know, it's starting to sound like you know approximately nothing about Burma and just felt like virtue-signaling on an anime forum for one reason or another. But go on, tell us more about how much you yearn for a strong sexy supranational blue-helmet jackboot kicking in your door next year.

>>10576908
They control human overpopulation.

>>10577223
So because of an alleged CIA operation about media control and propaganda from 70 years I should automatically believe the Burmese military are innocent?
I shouldn't believe report from the Human Rights Council?
https://www.ohchr.org/Documents/HRBodies/HRCouncil/FFM-Myanmar/A_HRC_39_64.pdf

Sounds like the kinda reasoning conspiracy theories use. For what purpose do you vehemently defend the Burmese?

>>10576932
Which now reduce in population to such a degree that they can no longer fill their actually important function, which causes a chain reaction and fucks all the balance in the ecosystem.

>>10577238
No, but you should be skeptical of any story that tugs on your heatstrings and asks you to "intervene" in another part of the world. You can call this heartless, I'll just call you brainless.

There wont be any intervention there because the place has no oil and China's influence is too strong.

As for the people of Burma, I'd ask how much you have to piss of Buddhists to make them want to kill you.

Since it's in the same vein, if you think Venezuela needs intervention just remember the USA is sanctioning it, cutting off supplies to the nation, which is as a result making life a lot more difficult.

>>10577174
>they hated him because he told the truth

>>10577251
Populations decrease as quality of life increases,people have lesser children as they have more safety and health
Please take your racist trash to the politics board
Also I'm not gonna argue with you anymore so bye

>>10577238
>Millions of eyewitnesses, including innocent children, are wrong.
Yeah... that's gonna be a big YIKES from me, chief.

>>10577256
>Populations decrease as quality of life increases,people have lesser children as they have more safety and health
end?

>I called him racist so i win!
If a point of view is "racist" it must be false right?

>>10576867
I wont be able to use them as free fish feed anymore.

>>10577256
>Populations decrease as quality of life increases,people have lesser children as they have more safety and health
and?

>I called him racist so i win!
If a point of view is "racist" it must be false right?

>>10577256
Yes, let's just endlessly force (important word there, force, since it's not charity now and charity is good but forced labor isnt) productive nations to endlessly subsidize the non productive nations and eventually the world will become just one big average and we can all be shitty together.
You've been a net drain since you got here, fuck off asap. It's fuckheads like yourself with no knowledge and hero complexes that have gotten the rest of humanity into constant unnecessary bullshit.

>you'll be back, don't forget, you're here forever!

>>10577250
>No, but you should be skeptical of any story that tugs on your heatstrings and asks you to "intervene" in another part of the world.
The reporting of what did or didn't happen doesn't ask my to feel or do anything, it just states what has happened, and various independent sources say that the Burmese military committed genocide. Whatever I think or feel about that is personal to me and doesn't change what facts they find.

>As for the people of Burma, I'd ask how much you have to piss of Buddhists to make them want to kill you.
>It's impossible for these people to have done this because of their religion
I can't believe I have to point out how poor this reasoning is, but consider the catholics who touch kids and try applying the same reasoning.

>Venezuela
Not that comparable to genocide really


Honestly, what's with the agenda against the Rohingya? Is it anti-muslim?

>>10577274
>believing "various sources" over the voices of millions of Burmese children who were actually there
Yeah, no. You don't get to pick and choose.

>>10577276
source onse these "millions of Burmese children"? I want to be red pilled too!

>>10577276
>the voices of millions of Burmese children who were actually there
Ok then, show me some reliable sources and let me hear these voices, were they the same ones the Human Right Council spoke to when they found that there was a genocide?

>>10577274
It's a combination of me not giving a fuck about the latest slacktivist talking point and actually knowing some of the history of the area. The Burmese would tell you these people are interlopers from Bangladesh and they started fucking up locals, so now they want them gone since if the problem stems from religion the only way for it to end is one or the other religion to leave the area.
You will also see Buddhists citing the annihilation of their faith in Afghanistan as an example of what happens when they do nothing.

As for states pushing angles, you can refer to the story from Gulf War 1 that was about Iraqi soldiers allegedly throwing Kuwaiti babies out of incubators onto the floor, they had speakers about it and everything. Except the story turned out to be absolute bullshit and was propagated by the USA's media to generate outrage in support of a war. Which they got. How many Iraqis died as a result of that war and the sanctions following it and further wars? It's in the millions.

But moral crusaders like yourself, well by golly I bet you felt good telling meal cusses like me how mean I was and you were at least helping.

>>10577277
Have you tried asking... literally anyone from Burma? No?

>>10577279
lol

>>10577283
Should we only ask Serbs about the balkan wars? Only Bosnians? Only croatians? Only Albanians? Everyone will claim that he was innocent.

>>10577283
So you personally spoke to million of children?

>>10577283
You mean online? None of them posted anything I can read I suppose?

When did you talk to people from Burma?

>>10577266
What are your proposed solutions? We kill all the Africans? We don't help them in anyway and isolate them?
You know they got this way because the west was and still is ruthlessly exploiting these nations to the point where the people are dying of poverty and not just the west countries like China are now too joining in this exploitation.
>Yes, let's just endlessly force (important word there, force, since it's not charity now and charity is good but forced labor isnt) productive nations to endlessly subsidize the non productive nations and eventually the world will become just one big average and we can all be shitty together.
Yes because if we help people out of poverty and destitution, it will lead to the whole world becoming "average"
Please tell me what do you think should be done with third world countries
I am asking this in good faith, maybe you can show me why I am wrong

>>10577295
How about having strong borders and helping africa with capital investment, assistance with developing their economic infrastructure, generous free trade agreements etc. Like we do right now, and hope they actually pull themselves together.

What else would you like to do on top of that?

>>10577281
>actually knowing some of the history of the area.
The Rohingya have been recognised by the UN as a human rights concern 1992

>>10577290
>>10577292
Out of arguments, I see.

>>10577299
That's been working fantastically isnt it
And if it isnt to means niggers are just stupid

>>10577303
So it would seem. Notable though... he claiming that hundreds of independent international journalists can be ignored in favour of "million of children" that he apparently spoke to but there is no record online of any of their opinion, or that of their parents apparently.

This may be the worst opinion I;ve ever heard on 4chan.

>>10577308
Well yes it has, because many african countries have developed quite a lot economically in recent decades. I'm not sure what your point is.

I notice you flat out ignored my question though.

What else would you like to do on top of that?

>>10577266
>Yes, let's just endlessly force (important word there, force, since it's not charity now and charity is good but forced labor isnt) productive nations to endlessly subsidize the non productive nations
The other anon never said that. OP never said that. No on ITT is arguing about that or for that. What does this have to do with killing mosquitos and the consequences that may bring?
Not to mention productive nations have economic incentives to NOT develop these places. Remember when China was some shithole that built our products? Now they're the biggest economy in the world and still growing, and they are using Africans like we used Chinese.

>the world will become just one big average and we can all be shitty together.
What's being averaged? Quality of life? Wealth? Economic mobility? I can't read this as anything other than you wanting there to be a global divide between people who live in excessively wealthy countries and people who live in excessively poor countries.
The same system that causes this to happen is also the one that allows Jews to rule you, fool.

>You've been a net drain since you got here, fuck off asap. It's fuckheads like yourself with no knowledge and hero complexes that have gotten the rest of humanity into constant unnecessary bullshit.
You literally support an economic system that gives a few million Jews the literal majority of the world's wealth. Try thinking for yourself and not just getting all your information from /pol/ infographics.

>>10577299
>helping africa with capital investment, assistance with developing their economic infrastructure, generous free trade agreements etc. Like we do right now
We really aren't giving them much assistance though, most of the aid we send them goes to helping those in poverty stay alive or improve their standards of living rather than completely overhauling their corrupt governments that are the cause of the issue. Free trade with corrupt governments doesn't help develop the country but it does make companies and rulers fucking rich

>>10577295
>"You know they got this way because the west was and still is ruthlessly exploiting these nations t"
I want you to hold this thought, keep it in your mind. It's important for later.

>"Please tell me what do you think should be done with third world countries "

Fucking nothing, I'm even open to no foreign aid at all. Every attempt at helping them, or a corporation going over there in good faith and trying to extract resources just get's called "neo colonialism". I don't go to /pol/ any more but fuck me if it wasn't a great place to see just what third world people think of first world ones, they fucking hate us, anon.
When I read things like "we're going to colonize you back and impose our world view" my only thought is "well fuck you too, then". I don't want to fucking live with these sorts of people and their bullshit, so I'll stay over here, they stay over there and I won't send any more fucking aid.

This isn't a gotcha, but if you have ever tried to help a drug addict who doesn't give a fuck, it is absolutely soul draining and it is a very similar feeling. They just want whatever you can give them for free, then it's "Fuck you".

Also, I'm not >>10577299

>>10577303
Just after a single source actually. I take the delay in response to mean there's some difficulty in finding one (1)

>>10577321
>a corporation going over there in good faith and trying to extract resources
This pretty much never happens

>>10577319
>We really aren't giving them much assistance though
Billions upon billions has been loaned to african countries for infrastructure of other government spending and has been forgiven.

>Free trade with corrupt governments doesn't help develop the country
An absolutely absurd claim. You think if your own country ended all trade agreements with all other countries the average person wouldn't get poorer?

My question for the third time, is what you you do on top of all that's currently being done?

>>10577328
>An absolutely absurd claim.
Ever hear of a banana republic?

>>10577325
What does that even mean?

>>10577331
>Ever hear of a banana republic?
Yes. What is your point?

>>10577336
How can you claim something that has happened and still is happening is "an absolutely absurd claim"?

>>10577317
>The other anon never said that. OP never said that. No on ITT is arguing about that or for that.

This is where every discussion on helping these nations goes. It's about sending them money/aid. Follow along.

>Remember when China was some shithole that built our products? Now they're the biggest economy in the world and still growing, and they are using Africans like we used Chinese.

Oh this is so dishonest. Nixon, who opened trade with China, was fucking adored by them. When the Chinese delegation came to the USA under president Carter, they asked if Nixon would be there (Carter didn't invite him), so they said they would just drive across the country to go and visit him.

>What's being averaged? Quality of life? Wealth? Economic mobility? I can't read this as anything other than you wanting there to be a global divide between people who live in excessively wealthy countries and people who live in excessively poor countries.

There is everything in their nations (in fact, more than here) to turn their nations into non shitholes. Hong Kong has no resources at all besides a deep water port, so how the fuck did we do alright.

The west (or rather, it's shitty elites), constantly asking for third worlders to come in will just turn the western nations into reflections of their new people, which is where they're coming from. Predictors of future behavior is past behavior.

I utterly oppose any kind of NWO, with as much freedom as possible among independent nation states setting themselves up as they please. I don't however, want to see the earth turned into some neoliberals fucking paradise with "muh free movement of people and capital" because they want to grow their stupid stock portfolio.
Ease up on the haterade.

>>10577337
What the fuck are you talking about? What has happened?

>>10577321
Stop taking /pol/ seriously
Also
>be /pol/,spew racist genocidal nazi shit all the time
>third worlder says I'm gonna do the same to you as you did to my ancestors
>bitch about them hating us

>>10577351
But it's not on there itself, it's just links to shit on Facebook, Twitter, Youtube or whoever else since that board is effectively just another aggregator. When you're seeing celebrities say it, or glorify it and their fans cheering it it makes me just hope for a giant fucking asteroid, fuck these people, really.

>>10577328
>An absolutely absurd claim.
It isn't. I'm not the guy you've been replying to I'm this guy >>10577004, refer to the thing I linked in there. An american company made billions for themselves, their investors, and government officials and yet the country remains a shithole with the vast majority of the population in poverty. It's incredibly easy for a company to make a shitload of money off a resource rich nation without even slightly helping the people that live there, and so they do, constantly.

There's similar stories for Nigeria or the Congo, the Congo one with a /pol/ bonus because a Jewish guy, a FTSE 100 company, and the British Virgin isles are involed. The Jew is called Dan Gertler

>>10577351
>third worlder says I'm gonna do the same to you as you did to my ancestors
>bitch about them hating us
err.. What's wrong with this? Should I not bitch about people wanting to kill me and my people or something?

>>10577360
Not when you're joking about doing the same to them

>>10577365
"""Joking"""

>>10577116
>if you were a smart person living in a shithole the smartest thing you could do is leave for the West.
That’s exactly the point, friendo. Why is that allowed? If everyone did it then there is no west.

>>10577309
>hundreds of independent international journalists
Who were not present for the Burmese police action. Basically the human centipede of information propagation, with you at the back end.
>>10577322
>literally doubting that Burmese people exist or that they have voices
Not even sure how to respond to this. Have you tried google? Twitter? The phone book?

>>10577359
What the fuck has that got to so with free trade agreements

If a country is an utter shithole and is poorly governed, then yes it will not magically become wealthy with lots of companies coming in and lots of trade agreements. But without going in and replacing the government, there's not much you can do but encourage it.

>It's incredibly easy for a company to make a shitload of money off a resource rich nation without even slightly helping the people that live there, and so they do, constantly.
Never claimed otherwise. But the country must be corrupt in order for this to happen. Companies don't have armies or anything. If they make shit loads of money without the people getting wealthier it's because the government let them.

>>10577365
Why not? I mean, I don't agree with them. But if you happen to think you should kill them, then hearing they want to kill you too would naturally only make you want to kill them more I would think.

>>10577144
Whoosh

>>10577357
Yes, celebrities saying kill and enslave all white people and thier fans cheering it, it's very common

>>10577369
That's a strange way of providing a source???

>>10577369
>Have you tried google? Twitter? The phone book?
I did actually. I didn't find a single person who would back you up.

How about you show me an example? It should be easy for you since apparently there's millions of people willing to prove you right. I'd hate for anything to think you were just completely bullshitting after all.

>>10577373
Are you being deliberately obtuse? Or are you just ignorant and stupid? It's hard to tell purely with text.

We're not even halway through the year and media is saturated with bullshit from the covington kids having a maelstrom of idiots around them online hating them for their race and nobody seems to care.
To the earlier point, why the fuck would you want to live next to people who think it's funny if you die. Fuck this noise, to be honest.

>>10577290
>only I exercise the appropriate level of skepticism and empiricism in forming my beliefs, everyone else is gullible

>>10577339
>This is where every discussion on helping these nations goes. It's about sending them money/aid. Follow along.
The majority of money that goes to these countries comes from private charities. Though even if it wasn't, it's better for it to go to people who could use it rather than Jews who already have tens of millions.

>Oh this is so dishonest. Nixon, who opened trade with China, was fucking adored by them. When the Chinese delegation came to the USA under president Carter, they asked if Nixon would be there (Carter didn't invite him), so they said they would just drive across the country to go and visit him.
What does that have to do with the fact that China went from being our economic subjects, to being a superior economic competitor? One that is trying to cut its dependence on the US as much as possible. That isn't a good thing for the United States.

>There is everything in their nations (in fact, more than here) to turn their nations into non shitholes.
Just because the resources exist and are there for you to extract doesn't mean you have the means to do so.
On the other hand, Goldberg and his investment firm can easily extract those resources by giving Kunta Booga a disgustingly low amount of money for the land and resources.
What is he going to do? Refuse getting multiple times what he earns in a year? If he did refuse, the corrupt Government he lives under would just give it to Goldberg anyway.

Hong Kong was an economic shit hole until after WW2. It was propped up by countries such as Britain and the United States (""foreign aid""), and acted as an trade buffer between communist China and the west. If it weren't for the Opium Wars then Hong Kong wouldn't be highly developed like it is now.

>>10577383
White people truly are the most opposed race on earth
I hope you guys establish that ethnostate you've been working on or you'd be hunted down by brown leftist postmodern marxists

>>10577384
Another cracking false equivalence, this thread is really going places. Eventually we'll get a source on these millions of children I'm sure!

>>10577398
>false equivalence
What was a false equivalence?

>>10577380
>burmese people don't exist
Rather than attempt to spoonfeed an obvious troll, I'll just link back to four different Burmese comics that have already been posted in this thread.
>>10577276 >>10577257 >>10577283 >>10577286

>>10577393
I think you need to relax your Jewhate erection.

>What does that have to do with the fact that China went from being our economic subjects, to being a superior economic competitor?

"Economic subjects"? China was never a subject of the USA, Canada is a lot closer to that definition than the USA. You traded with China (as did others) and now China has done well for it. You're right about it not being so great for the USA though, I really have to wonder where China would be had Nixon just left it in the dust, the potential is humongous, somebody would have come along eventually.

>If it weren't for the Opium Wars then Hong Kong wouldn't be highly developed like it is now.

Hong Kong was always going to be developed purely because of it's location, if anything else.
You guys giving up it's colonial attachment to Britain was a stupid idea, you had every reason to tear up the agreement since it wasn't made with the Communist party that took over.

>>10577394
Ah, I see you are the stupid kind.
I have spoken to enough people online to spot patterns very well, you have your own pet racial issues that you will animate over and then when one is pointed out to you that you dislike, you do what would hurt you in your own case and make a mockery of it.
You're sadly just another piece of detritus with a shitty, vindictive heart and what has annoyed you is being spotted for the moral charlatan you are.

Why would any decent person want to associate with you?

>>10577409
PS: When I say "the agreement" I mean the one to hand it over to the government in mainland China.

>>10577406
>4 """burmese""" people do not think the the government committed genocide. This is better evidence that 100s of independent journalists and their observations.

Imagine going through life being this gullible. I hope you have people in your life who care about you and can protect from people who will take advantage of your supreme guilability. Otherwise your in for a fairly painful life.

>>10577409
>Hong Kong was always going to be developed purely because of it's location, if anything else.
That makes no sense. It's an island and only connects to mainland china with a boat routes and now an insanely large bridge. Certainly areas in the bay would have been more suitable for development, which they have since China's recent economic boom.

Quite incredible you think Hong Kong would have developed just as much as part of China this whole time.

>>10577412
>there are no sources
>I can't find the sources
>the sources aren't plentiful enough
*you are here*
>the sources aren't credentialed enough
>the sources are mistaken
>the sources may be right but we have to weigh the other side of the story
>the sources are right but their story is distorted
>the sources are right but biased
>the sources are right but that doesn't excuse their faults such as racism
>the sources are right but anyway it was white people who caused this

>>10577423
>there are no sources
>I can't find the sources
>The best sources I can find are literally shitty anonymous MS paint comics that could literally have been made by anyone.
*I am are here*.

Anyone who would be here and not feel a sense of scepticism literally has some kind of serious mental disorder.

>>10577421
It's a trade hub, dude. Read it's history.
Though even if none of that happened, the fact that the place looks fucking amazing and is in a bay with all the views guarantees it becomes hot real estate.

>Quite incredible you think Hong Kong would have developed just as much as part of China this whole time.

I don't think that at all, so apologies if you got that impression.
The British were the best colonizers of all the major nations that did it, since their former colonies are by far the most functioning compared to those of other states. It's also thanks to the British cultural influence that there is such an emphasis on personal freedom in Hong Kong as compared to mainland China.

You want to slum it, go to Macau which was colonized by the Portuguese. It's just a giant gambling den.

>many scientist think
My 9th grade english comp teacher would give you a zero if you tried to put some lazy shit like this in your paper.
God bless Mrs. Ellis for teaching me to know better, and for showing us olivia hussy's tits.

>>10577430
>It's a trade hub
Because the british owned it so all trade between china and the west tended to happen there. Otherwise why would you trade there on not on the mainland?

>>10577436
I'm not the logistics man, but I imagine it's to do with the setup of infrastructure being a lot better there to facilitate large amounts of trade. Many warehouses, many places to park your boat and you'll in and get out faster which is a major factor in these decisions. Also, deepwater port.

There are ports all over the place, you don't just have a few big ones you try and have heaps.

>>10577441
>Many warehouses, many places to park your boat and you'll in and get out faster which is a major factor in these decisions.
... Because the british built all that?

Anything you bring there by boat to sell into china has to go back on another boat to get to China anyways. So it makes no difference how great their ports were because you have to boat everything to china after anyways.

>>10577436
>why would you trade there on not on the mainland?
Because china didn't want them trading on the mainland. Never trust the Anglos.
Japan did the same thing with the dutch, only giving them access to a few ports, where the host nation could limit the cultural influence of the outsiders while still reaping the benefit of trade.
Special economic zones like that are usually a win/win for everyone.

>>10577448
>... Because the british built all that?
No?
You have to regularly maintain that shit, it's also been significantly expanded.

>Anything you bring there by boat to sell into china has to go back on another boat to get to China anyways.
Not necessarily, a lot of product is used in Hong Kong and other items are taken over in trucks, or just not taken into Hong Kong's port in the first place.

I feel like you are trying to angle for an argument, which makes zero sense considering I'm relaying what actually happens and goes on and you're trying to say something different has occurred. Trade happens, anon.

Also, what this guy said is accurate. >>10577452

Japan got to be a lot more protective of their nation when Euros arrived. They knew what was coming and industrialized lightning fast and then became a colonial power in their own right (China and Korea fucking hate them for this, btw) China had a lot of other bullshit going on and so got fucked up, but they're doing alright now.

>>10577460
>a lot of product is used in Hong Kong and other items are taken over in trucks
That MASSIVE china-hong kong bridge is only just opened.

I'm saying so much trade happens in hong kong because britain owns it, and if the british never owned it it wouldn't be a trade hub like it is now.

>>10576867
>oh no, they are kind of annoying
There are many types of flies that should be eradicated first. Horse flies get my vote.

>>10577448
Hong Kong is a great port. It's deep water, and sheltered from high seas which is important when you realize the south china sea is like the pacific's gulf of mexico. A big warm water sea fed by ocean currents that kick up a bunch of nasty storms.
You use this as a port to bring in the biggest freighters you can, unload all of that onto the dock, fill it back up with outbound freight, and then all the product you brought in is shipped by road, rail, and back on smaller freight ships that don't need big deep water ports that can handle millions of tons of freight being moved per hour. You just need some peasants with a water buffalo to offload.
I work in supply chain management and inventory control. This is what we do. Going door-to-door is less efficient than having distribution centers and a supply chain.

>>10577427
>n-no, I didn't just get btfo, in fact YOU did
It's all so tiresome.

>>10576945
>Usually it's a few shitty dictators and the oil/mining/chinese companies that they work with
Funny you forgot to mention their abysmally low average IQ, which puts hundreds of millions of people in what used to be considered the retarded range. The Chinese were one of the few the groups that managed to exploit them in modern times, and that's still mostly just for resources. Good luck trying to get them working higher skill manufacturing jobs, otherwise you would have the cheapest labour source on the planet.

Treating Africa like they are innocent kids exploited by the rest of the world doesn't help anyone. If they're going to be helped, you have to deal with the root cause of their issues, which is that they're, in general, a bunch of fucking idiots. Even if modern nutrition brings them up 20 points, there are still almost a billion stupid people that you'll have to deal with for the foreseeable future. These people won't fit well in a developed. Most of them wouldn't even be able to work basic service jobs.

>>10577572
>otherwise you would have the cheapest labour source on the planet.
They WERE the cheapest labor source on the planet for a few hundred years. A global industry and empires were built on it.

>>10576867
>What could go wrong?
new species of mosquitoes that will yeet humans into extintion
good fucking job google

>>10577156
This.

>>10577572
>These people won't fit well in a developed. Most of them wouldn't even be able to work basic service jobs.
so basically like actual blacks in the developed world?

>>10577611
No, they just need aid progra-AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA

>>10577572
>If they're going to be helped, you have to deal with the root cause of their issues, which is that they're, in general, a bunch of fucking idiots
t. Someone who's put zero brain cells into researching the histories of African countries and how they got to where they are today

>>10577589
I'm well aware of that, yet it still did very little for their progression, unlike other countries that were exploited. Shockingly, we don't have much use for simple unskilled labour and haven't for decades. Most manufacturing requires people of normal intelligence, even if it's a relatively simple job.

Consider this, the average janitor in a western nations has a higher IQ than most Africans.
>>10577572
developed nation*

>>10577616
You can cry about colonialism all you want, the fact remains that most colonialist countries were wildly more successful than their counterparts, outside of Africa.

>THEY DINDU NUFFIN

>>10577624
>that most colonialist countries were wildly more successful than their counterparts
Hmm I wonder why, it's almost like the answer to this question might lead me to understanding why many African countries are in the states they are today

>>10577624
I wasn't talking about colonialism, I'm talking about the dictators and corrupt governments of the last 50 years that happily make millions for themselves while doing nothing to improve the lives of the population. The only reason you believe the cause of Africa's plight is low IQ is because you already have racist beliefs, so you choose the hypothesis that exactly fits your agenda.

>>10577630
I think he meant "colonized", which is true

I mean do you seriously think India would be a more prosperous place if the queen of England gave back that giant useless diamond

Or are you going to blame them for random shit like "encouraging" the ancient indian caste system and other unfalsifiable counterfactuals lmao

>>10577634
Low IQ is one cause of corruption. If you can't see or at least entertain the possibility, you are coming into the conversation with a metric buttload of unexamined pre-drawn conclusions which you need to unpack

>>10577634
>I'm talking about the dictators and corrupt governments of the last 50 years that happily make millions for themselves while doing nothing to improve the lives of the population.
So you're telling us that the population was aware of what was happening, knew how to address the problem, and simply decided not to?

>>10577651
>Low IQ is one cause of corruption.
Corrupt individuals given the opportunity for corruption is the cause of corruption. Sometimes dumb people try and be corrupt and they get caught, sometimes smart people do it and they get to stick around. Some of the longest serving heads of states in history can be found in African nations famed for corruption, do you think these rulers are idiots?
>you are coming into the conversation with a metric buttload of unexamined pre-drawn conclusions which you need to unpack
That's certainly a lot of big words. Can you tell what kind of predrawn conclusions you think I have drawn?

>So you're telling us that the population was aware of what was happening, knew how to address the problem, and simply decided not to?
The thing about dictatorships is that they're designed to last. Do you really think it's easy to "know how to address the problem"? Did you ever wonder what all the civil wars and rebellions in Africa were about?

>>10577634
State your full claim here, rather than just cry racism and avoid reality. Are you denying that IQ greatly influences the type of work you're able to do? Do you seriously believe that the average African could work the average western job, despite their IQ being less than our least intelligent workers? Do you deny the associations between IQ and job type?

My argument was that Africa will be limited in their ability to reach developed nation status because of this, even if you managed to transform their infrastructure and governments overnight. Their current plight is low intelligence, not corruption. China is a very corrupt place yet their problems are trivial compared to most of Africa. Even the low level Chinese workers brought to Africa thrive there.
>>10577646
>I think he meant "colonized",
Yes, I did. My mistake.

You may look at this image and see some idiot trying to do the impossible. Me? I see a future rocket scientist.

>>10577688
I get whar you're saying but as for the image itself I find it hard to believe it wasn't staged as a joke... could be wrong though

>>10576880
Are racists actually insane?
They convince themselves about things like "Aficans are overpopulating! They are overtaking whites in reproduction rates and they will never stop! They need to be stopped!" despite all evidence pointing to EVERYONE stops reproducing as much when they get rich enough? And that africans will slowly but surely eventually catch up to modern equivalent wealth (and the according reproductive rates) even if it's the future where by comparison modern standards of wealth are poor.
It's like they make up monsters under the bed for them to be afraid of.
And that's not even getting into gene editing.

>>10577715
>They convince themselves about things like "Aficans are overpopulating! They are overtaking whites in reproduction rates and they will never stop! They need to be stopped!" despite all evidence pointing to EVERYONE stops reproducing as much when they get rich enough?
Uh huh, about that... pic related.
>And that's not even getting into gene editing.
Not even gonna ask what the fuck you're alluding to here.

>>10577680
I did make a claim. The governments make millions while the people suffer. Look at Angola, the Congo.
>Their current plight is low intelligence, not corruption.
Bold claim, here's some evidence to the contrary. Where's your evidence?

In Angola the state run oil company Sonangol had a revenue of $34billion in 2011, more than enough to fund healthcare or education programs for the population, but that doesn't happen. The IMF found that $32 billion went missing from the govt treasury between 2007 and 2010, which is about 1/4 of the money that the Angolan economy generated annually at that time.
There are names to the individuals who benefit from this, dos Santos, Vincente, Kopelipa, Dino. These people are why I think that Angola hasn't improved over the last 50 years when they've had the power. They don't spend the money on improving the lives of the population because they don't have to, and if they did they wouldn't be so rich and powerful.
In the Congo it's a similar story but all the money comes from mining instead of oil. Particularly tantalum (1 in 5 mobile phones has Congolese minerals in the batteries). Along with tons of militias and rebels trying to get their own slice the main names are Kabila, Katumba, Gertler, Mwangachuchu, and Nkunda. These guys control the flow of wealth and most of it goes to their pockets.

>Are you denying that IQ greatly influences the type of work you're able to do?
No
>Do you seriously believe that the average Afric...
If they were raised in the west and given a western education then yeah most of them could do most of our jobs.
>Do you deny the as...
Nope
None of that really matters to a population who are born into poverty in a country where its in the governments interest to keep them in poverty.
That's my claim. You say it's because of low IQ. What exact mechanism of low IQ prevents their success? What jobs and opportunities do you suppose that they miss because of their low IQ?

>>10577739
That graph's not really relevant to the true claim he was making about how if nations get richer their population stops growing

>>10577747
>If they were raised in the west and given a western education then yeah most of them could do most of our jobs.
This is bait. Nobody could be so naive as to still believe this in AD 2019.

>>10577759
I believe it. Show me the evidence that led you to believe otherwise

>>10577715
Throwing free food at them keeps them from achieving sufficient levels of organization to become developed enough to slow down their reporduction

>>10577762
You're the one making extravagant and outrageous claims. The onus is on you.

>>10577752
It's extremely relevant to the claim:
>They convince themselves about things like "Aficans are overpopulating! They are overtaking whites in reproduction rates and they will never stop!
As for your own graph, it shows either that (a) it's bullshit that not even the UN believes anymore, or (b) the UN has given up on black Africans ever reaching "stage 3" and a leveling-off of its population growth even in A HUNDRED YEARS. Lol

>>10577771
>You're the one making extravagant and outrageous claims.
I think you're the one making extravagant claims, but anyway. They're 99.9% identical to us, the only noticeable differences are details like skin colour, facial structure etc. To me the suggestion that their brain are so significantly deficient is a bolder claim than to suggest that they are very alike to us. Yeah their IQs are a lot lower, but that's exactly what I'd expect from nations with abysmal quality of life and terrible access to education.

>>10577781
>(a) it's bullshit that not even the UN believes anymore
It's a generally accepted model with only a few criticisms
>(b) the UN has given up on black Africans ever reaching "stage 3" and a leveling-off of its population growth
Yeah exactly. 'Given up' isn't really the right words but they do accept that many African nations are in the demographic trap
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demographic_trap

>>10577715
It's completely reasonable to be afraid of over a billion unintelligent resource hungry people which are expected to keep doubling in size. If Africans could, they would invade other countries outside of Africa like they have their own. They have already fled to Europe in mass numbers putting great strain on the social systems and culture. They need to place the blame of their wretched state on someone, it's going to be the rest of the world. Anything to avoid the reality that they are their own keepers.

>>10577747
>I did make a claim. The governments make millions while the people suffer. Look at Angola, the Congo.
You claim is fairly inept and your evidence isn't actually evidence, just opinion. Your logic is basically 'these countries are only shitty because of corruption', which is objectively untrue. As mentioned, there are corrupt countries that do far better than African countries. China is actually more corrupt than some African nations.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corruption_Perceptions_Index
Bangladesh is more corrupt than most African nations and they'll reach true developed status long before them. You can also compare GDP per capita and realize that corruption is not the great limiter of economic growth you think it is.
>If they were raised in the west and given a western education then yeah most of them could do most of our jobs.
So you don't believe there is a genetic component to IQ or that it's trivial and easily overcome? It's not, sorry if that destroys your idea of the world. It takes decades to raise IQs and you'll still have billions of people unable to work modern jobs. Sending them off to western countries isn't a realistic idea either. We can only take a fraction of them and most of them would refuse to go back. The ones that do end up exploiting other Africans, which is what happened in Freetown when freed slaves went back to Africa and started enslaving everyone they could.
> What exact mechanism of low IQ prevents their success?
Again, IQ greatly limits your ability to do complex work and think abstractly in ways that could allow you to find opportunities. Someone with an IQ of 70 would have trouble doing simple western job and all jobs are becoming more and more complex. Intelligence is the limiting factor.

>>10577234
They're doing a pretty shit job then.

>>10577747
>>10577807 (me)
I'll also link this website, which explains some of the abilities you have at various IQ ranges.
https://paulcooijmans.com/intelligence/iq_ranges.html

70-79 — Borderline retarded
Limited trainability. Have difficulty with everyday demands like using a phone book, reading bus or train schedules, banking, filling out forms, using appliances like a video recorder, microwave oven, or computer, et cetera, and therefore require assistance from relatives or social workers in the management of their affairs. Can be employed in simple tasks but require supervision.

80-89 — Below average
Above the threshold for normal independent functioning. Can perform explicit routinized hands-on tasks without supervision as long as there are no moments of choice and it is always clear what has to be done. Assembler, food service.

>>10577807
>As mentioned, there are corrupt countries that do far better than African countries.
I claimed that many African nations are shitty because of corruption and shitty governments. I didn't claim that corruption ruins all nations. China for example has its incredibly stable government, technological development, relatively widespread access to education. It's not a counter example to my claim about African nations.

>So you don't believe there is a genetic component to IQ or that it's trivial and easily overcome?
Again, I didn't claim that there's no genetic component to IQ. I don't see why you think that they would remain retarded if they weren't malnourished and had a chance at attending a good school. Consider the case off the Buraku in Japan who consistently score ~15 points lower on IQ tests than the majority Ippan. In the US however the gap completely disappears.
>Sending them off to western countries isn't a realistic idea either.
Didn't suggest that.
>which is what happened in Freetown when freed slaves went back to Africa and started enslaving everyone they could.
I quite often see the /pol/ inclined reminding people of when black people did slavery as if that's making some kind of point?

>Again, IQ greatly limits your ability to do complex work and think abstractly in ways that could allow you to find opportunities. Someone with an IQ of 70 would have trouble doing simple western job and all jobs are becoming more and more complex. Intelligence is the limiting factor.
I'm well aware of things correlated with low IQ, what I was asking for was something specific like I did with Angola and how their leaders have no incentive to develop their nation. Some exact scenario that clearly demonstrates how a higher IQ population would allow the nation to develop. What complex work and opportunities does a child born in the badlands of the Congo miss out on because of their low IQ?

>>10576922
>google is testing genus virus they have been developing for the last two decades by releasing it into the wild
>guise of benevolence, better the world
>in reality the next steps are other species and then races of humans

>>10577873
>I quite often see the /pol/ inclined reminding people of when black people did slavery as if that's making some kind of point?
So you're saying let bygones be bygones, let's never bring up slavery again. Right?

>>10577873
>Consider the case off the Buraku in Japan who consistently score ~15 points lower on IQ tests than the majority Ippan. In the US however the gap completely disappears.
wow

>>10577895
No that's not what I said, I just see so many people bring it up and emphasis it as a hard hitting point when it never seems to be relevant. It wasn't really used in that way here mind you but it's just something I have seen a lot

>>10576867
Aren't their investors technically all bloodsuckers?
Why would they want to kill their relatives?

>>10577873
>I claimed that many African nations are shitty because of corruption and shitty governments.
Your claim was that corruption was the reason for the current state of Africa. Stop moving the goal posts and trying to sugar coat it, this is ridiculous.
>China for example has its incredibly stable government...
Yet China was always fairly corrupt and managed to get that far, along with almost all nations, which disproves your claim.
>I didn't claim that there's no genetic component to IQ
You implied that it was either nonexistent or easily overcome, which is untrue. There is good evidence to suggest it's very heritable.
>I don't see why you think that they would remain retarded if they weren't malnourished and had a chance at attending a good school.
Again, it's partly genetic. What we have seen in western indigenous populations is that their IQs are still fairly low despite being well educated with proper nutrition.
>Buraku in Japan
Is this a joke? They're still just Japanese and had the same genetics. It's a fucking island, it's not the equivalent to comparing two groups on different sides of the world.
>as if that's making some kind of point?
Yes, it is. The point is that all people exploit each other and giving advantage to only a few of them before sending them back to their groups just makes things worse, specifically inequality. This is referring to your suggestion that we could educate them in western countries in order to raise their IQ.
>What opportunities does a child born in the badlands of the Congo miss out on because of their low IQ?
You're framing this incorrectly. A better question would be 'in what ways is a higher IQ culture able to create opportunities and further a complex society?' I shouldn't have to answer that.

We're not even arguing about the same thing anymore, and you haven't refuted any of my claims, just ignored them or took them for your own. You don't have to reply to save your pride, just don't.

>>10577914
it's fucked up that people like this and elon musk aren't considered "real africans", so much hypocrisy in globalization

>>10577941
They are considered 'real Africans', you just live in the US where people are generally ignorant of anything happening outside their immediate vicinity + the fancy parts of Europe.

>>10577949
>source: my feelings

>>10576867
>mosquitoes are eliminated
>without the threat of endemic diseases, the African continent more rapidly industrializes
>China begins to cash in on a massive scale from the infrastructural investments they've made in Africa
>one belt one road initiative finishes ten years ahead of schedule
>China becomes a hegemonic power and overtakes the United States economically

>>10577967
If you're going to let the fringes speak for the whole of an entire society, then you've got much worse problems in the US.

>>10577873
>Consider the case off the Buraku in Japan who consistently score ~15 points lower on IQ tests than the majority Ippan. In the US however the gap completely disappears.
Could be the case that only the high-tier Buraku ends up in the US, like it often happen with the Indians. If that were the case the US Buraku couldn't really be comparable to the Japan ones.

>>10577933
I didn't move the goalposts. Shitty corrupt governments has always been my point

>China
Again, just because some countries are alright with large amounts of corruption doesn't "disprove" that corruption isn't a leading cause of strife in Africa. Can't you see that's a fallacy?

>You implied that it was either nonexistent or easily overcome, which is untrue.
I do think it can be overcome, I haven't seen evidence that it isn't.
>There is good evidence to suggest it's very heritable.
See the image I posted showing the sometimes counterintuitive nature of heritability.
Bringing up the buraku was to point out how lack of education and shitty quality of life causes an IQ gap that is overcome by better standards. They're a good example because there's no genetic differences muddying the results.

> The point is that all people exploit each other and giving advantage to only a few of them before sending them back to their groups just makes things worse, specifically inequality. This is referring to your suggestion that we could educate them in western countries in order to raise their IQ.
I suggested that if they properly educated they wouldn't score as badly in IQ tests, I didn't suggest it as an actual thing we should do, no point talking about the consequences of doing so.

>You're framing this incorrectly. A better question would be 'in what ways is a higher IQ culture able to create opportunities and further a complex society?'
Now that's moving the goalposts, literally telling me a different question that misses the point of what I'm asking. Why do you think that low IQ is the main reason for keeping them down when you can't even explain any specifics of how it does so? I've already given specific examples that the main reason I think that is that many of the nations really are run by shitty corrupt governments with no incentive to develop their nations.

I'm against that. No, we have to develop more bio weapons that specifically target blacks and maybe even Muslims... Is that possible?

>>10577976
>black people constitute the fringes of African society
lol

>>10576945
What happened in Chile in the early 1890s?

>>10577986
>Shitty corrupt governments has always been my point
I'll allow your extension without further arguing since corruption almost always extends into government, seeing as they're usually the root cause. What country hasn't had a corrupt and unstable history? Corruption is the rule, not the exception.
>corruption doesn't "disprove" that corruption isn't a leading cause of strife in Africa
We're not arguing about strife, we're arguing about corruption as the specific mechanism that keeps Africa terrible. You cannot defend this unless you ignore every country outside of Africa that shared a similar history, yet managed to still develop.
>I do think it can be overcome, I haven't seen evidence that it isn't.
How do easily overcome is the gap between someone with an average IQ of 100 versus someone with an IQ of 150? If we just look at how IQ is distributed it's fairly easy to tell that nutrition/education isn't the major influence, outside the need for very basic nutrition in order for your brain to function.
>Bringing up the buraku was to point out how lack of education and shitty quality of life causes an IQ gap that is overcome by better standards.
I actually misread your original post and the "US" part. The Japanese have a higher IQ on average than Americans, meaning that someone of below average intelligence in Japan could be above average in the US. Secondly, immigrants are always a very selected group and are never representative of the average person in their own country. In order for this to be fair, you would have to test there IQ before leaving and after living in their new country, which would likely show very little change, even across generations.

>>10577986
>that misses the point of what I'm asking
No, I made the question fair for the context of what we're talking about, which is that low average IQ keeps Africa from progression into developed nations. I still can answer your original question, but I would just be repeating myself about abstract thinking and complexity. A more intelligent person would likely do better overall, produce more GDP, and be more likely to invent someone or create a business.
>I've already given specific examples
I could give specific examples of all the "shitty corrupt governments" in the rest of the world and they would vastly outnumber whatever you came up with. I didn't make any claims that you couldn't just look up and confirm. There are mountains of evidence in correlation between IQ and all types of related things like life success and risk of violence. The only reason why this isn't wildly accepted is because it's inconvenient and has no easy answer. It's a global version of refusing responsibility for your problems.

>>10576867
>stepping straight into Mao's footsteps
really unexpected move by google

>>10576897
Then by that logic you cant blame slave owners for being efficient with an available market.

>>10576867
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ALvssgCcdPQ

>>10576897
>implying Africans as a whole are useful
If all Africans were to disappear, we would: stop anthropomorphic climate change, basically end world hunger, and curb overpopulation (which is directly related to the previous two) at the expense of what? A few smart Nigerians and a ton of horny wifeless Chinese? Sounds like and overwhelmingly positive to me.

>>10576945
So arguably their economic output makes them irrelevant alone.

>>10579271
based

>>10577072
This entire post is honest and based. I'd imagine it's what most Europeans think but are terrified to speak about because of the social stigma they would receive and because Hitler accidentally a Holocaust.

A long time ago, I was in Burma. My friends and I were working for the local government. They were trying to buy the loyalty of tribal leaders by bribing them with precious stones. But their caravans were being raided in a forest north of Rangoon by a bandit. So, we went looking for the stones. But in six months, we never met anybody who traded with him. One day, I saw a child playing with a ruby the size of a tangerine. The bandit had been throwing them away.

hahaha another bleeding heart lib who will blame anything other than the genetic inferiority of blacks for their misery and failure

>>10577139
not that guy and i wont say i disagree with your overarching point but

>The resources of society are not infinite
>More people = more resource consumption
I think you'll need to do better than that, Europe isn't bursting at the seams and,
>more people = larger, somewhat cheaper workforce
>larger, somewhat cheaper workforce = more spending
>more spending = growth, more jobs, "resources"

also what resources are you even talking about? we aren't that low on the heirarchy of needs

ITT : /pol/itards unable to remain on-topic

>>10579581
>I think you'll need to do better than that, Europe isn't bursting at the seams
what is the name for this fallacy, when problems don't exist until AFTER catastrophic failure
>we aren't that low on the ""hierarchy of needs""
pseudoscience, and anyway the "refugees" are certainly claiming to be

>>10579657
>what is the name for this fallacy, when problems don't exist until AFTER catastrophic failure
I have seen it described as "P-over-P", meaning "Punishment over Prevention".

>>10579582
Thank you for your input.

>>10579657
>>10579667
>what is the name for this fallacy, when problems don't exist until AFTER catastrophic failure
You're too optimistic. Catastrophic failure was achieved years ago, and the "fallacy" has progressed to denying it or covering it up.

>>10577137
Agree, now join my discord to discuss flat earth pls

>>10577715
Your entire comment is literally r3ddit tier copy pasta from that Kurzgesagt video. Unironically kill yourself.

>Thread is still up
Absolute state of /sci/

>>10576867
I'm really starting to feel sorry for mosquitos, everybody hates them but they didn't choose to be this way they just evolved, and now after successfully thriving for millions of years, some stupid kike is trying to exterminate them just because some dumb nigger can't take care of themselves

>>10576867
I hate cats much more than I hate mosquitos.
Mosquitos are nuisance, while cats are a real ecological disaster, the disgusting filthy little shits. All the toxoplasma cat "people" disgust me to no end, putting the welfare of these bags of shit over that of their own species (I call them species-traitors).
As far I go, I always try to do my part and give these festering pests a well aimed kick in the jaw every time I come across one, but only at night as you have to be very aware of our despicable species-traitors

>>10576910
>We should send them more video game consoles
I bet you thought this would sound clever.

>>10579873
worked for you, didn't it?

>>10579883
>I-I was b-baiting, haha

>>10579888
HAHAHAAHAHAHAH

>>10579890
Cope.

>>10579873
>>10579883
gottem

>>10579843
I know someone who uses their rich husband's money to run a private cat shelter. Cats are literally parasites on the economy. She takes expensive allergy shots because she can't be around cats without them. I once asked her if she had to choose between rescuing a child and rescuing a cat from a burning building, she couldn't decide. Species traitor is the right term.

>>10579981
What if the child were black

>>10576880
fpbp

>>10577715
>africans will slowly but surely eventually catch up to modern equivalent wealth
The person who made this comment thinks they are qualified to call others insane. Oh dear.

>>10579944
>>10579888

To the people who believe subsaharan Africans have lower IQs due to environmental conditions: Why do African-Americans score consistently worse than their white and Asian counterparts on average in almost every statistic like academic prowess, income and crime statistics despite living in indisputably better conditions than their African counterparts and also being at least partially integrated into American culture for the past 100 years or so?

>>10576965
>borders is beneficial or not is up for debate/opinion, it is a completely separate issue from the development status of countries
That assumption does not hold for countries with extensive welfare programmes such as Scandinavian countries. Those budgets are 1/3 of the national budgets, and growing.

S top being angry cuz
W e
A re
G ood at science

>>10580230
The japanese burakus must be oppressing them

>>10576939
Can't eat though

>>10576960

>>10577043
>No reply

>>10577065
>the level of political discourse regarding these two things is massively skewed towards border control

Considering the handling of the refugee crisis, this is total bullshit. With the exception of Hungary, every member state did very little to improve border control.

>>10577715
Your error is assuming they have the same average IQ of whites and Asians.

>>10580568
>pls rply
kys bb

>>10577043
Marxism-Leninism

>ctrl+f
>only two posts mention cats
What's up with that, I thought /sci/ was supposed to be smart

>>10580039
You're a fucking idiot.
For comparison, how many hunter gatherer populations can you name?
Oh wait, it's almost like wealth diffuses and even the poorest of the west are no longer agriculturally based, let alone hunting and gathering.
I don't know why you think Africa would be an exception to this trend.

>>10580230
>Why do African-Americans score consistently worse than their white and Asian counterparts on average in almost every statistic like academic prowess, income and crime statistics
Environmental conditions.
> despite living in indisputably better conditions than their African counterparts and
Blacks score better on tests than africans in africa
>also being at least partially integrated into American culture for the past 100 years or so?
Blacks are less integrated into American culture than asians are. The representation in media is as an exotic "other", in a similar manner as to how many europeans are in anime.
Blacks will never be integrated either for that matter.

>>10581038
I agree with you, but this part caught me-
>For comparison, how many hunter gatherer populations can you name?
Siberia, Alaska, Yukon, Nunavut, Greenland, the Amazon, Indian Ocean, Pacific Ocean and probably some others I'm forgetting all still have very primitive tribes.

>>10581048
>environmental conditions
Why do black children adopted into white families still suffer academically? Why do black fathers abandon their children at a higher rate than other impoverished minorities?

>>10581116
>Why do black children adopted into white families still suffer academically?
Environmental conditions.
What, you never considered the fact that BEING black has effects that aren't limited to intrinsic genetic factors?
How...privileged...of you.
>Why do black fathers abandon their children at a higher rate than other impoverished minorities?
Cultural conditions. Welfare state means black women are free to fuck alpha black men and have the government pick up the bills, so the alpha black men are free to do whatever they want sexually which includes leaving.

>>10581038
>thinks the west won't balkanize like countless other societies
>thinks thats because westerners are fundamentally better than everyone else in the world
>calls people racists online

>>10581048
>Blacks score better on tests than africans in africa
That is because you removed almost all the environmental conditions and you just end up with the mostly genetic influences between them and the rest of the population. It is stupid to blame lack of education when you can test for IQ before education even begins. You think the other minority groups in the various western countries also didn't suffer from poor nutrition?

You could raise two different people in the exact same environment and end up with a difference in IQ of dozens of points, yet suggesting that there could be differences in population groups is racist.

>>10577715
>And that africans will slowly but surely eventually catch up to modern equivalent wealth (and the according reproductive rates)

BAHAHAHA

>>10581143
>That is because you removed almost all the environmental conditions
Wait so you admit that the environment DOES have an effect, but then go on to say that all the environmental conditions have been compensated for, when it's incredibly obvious that blacks have not and never have been on a similar socioeconomic environmental level as white americans? And then go on to say the differences MUST be genetic, exactly what white americans where saying when they were actively oppressing and depriving blacks of opportunity. You're using the fact they are a lower caste in contemporary society as evidence that they are inherently inferior.

>>10581170
>Wait so you admit that the environment DOES have an effect,
What? I never denied environment wasn't a factor. I implied that it has mostly been adjusted for in Western nations. There are plenty of countries that have higher IQs on average than countries with a very high standard of living and great education. Take China for example, do you seriously believe that the average Chinese person has better environmental factors than the average Canadian?
> all the environmental conditions have been compensated for,
No, I said "almost". The IQs of African Americas improved for many years, probably due to increased quality of life, and then it promptly stopped growing entirely despite quality of life still rising.
>when it's incredibly obvious that blacks have not and never have been on a similar socioeconomic environmental level as white americans?
I didn't compare them to white people, I compared them to other minority groups who managed to overcome it. That said, the average middle class white person and the middle class black person have a very similar environment but they still probably have a huge gap in IQ.
>You're using the fact they are a lower caste in contemporary society as evidence that they are inherently inferior.
No, I don't believe black people are inherently inferior, I believe they are inherently less intelligent on average, which is objective fact even if you think it's only due to environmental reasons.

Stop hiding from reality because it hurts your feelings. We're going to have to address the real cause of the intelligence gap if we are going to try to fix it. You're much more biased than the people you accuse of racism.

Reminder that we could have eradicated mosquitoes fifty years ago if DDT hadn't been banned.

>>10581237
>That said, the average middle class white person and the middle class black person have a very similar environment
No they don't.

>>10581270
Yes, they do. If the gap exists only because of environment, why is the trend reversed in some countries with worse environments than Westerners?

Do you think Mongolians have a better environment than those in Switzerland? What about Cambodia or Kazakhstan compared to Ireland? Your claim only works if you ignore the evidence disproving it.

>>10581304
They necessarily do not.
A middle class black dude whose grandparents lived through civil rights era, and whose parents where poor and he himself only made it to middle class because his education has been subsidized is a completely different environment some generic white dude whos life history can't really be described in such easily compartmentalized yet still universal terms.

You might be able to to make that argument in a couple of generations, but not now.

>>10581333
What part of a "very similar environment" do you not understand? Having grandparents that were slaves, your fathers occupation, and "racism" have no demonstrable effect on IQ. If you're going to claim otherwise, prove it.

I keep asking questions, you're ignoring them. Do you think Mongolians have a better environment than those in Switzerland? They both have the same IQ. What about Cambodia or Kazakhstan compared to Ireland? Are these differences greater than what you would find in between groups in the same socioeconomic class in a single country? What about the studies that state socioeconomic class and environment do not account for all of the gap?

"However, a surprisingly consistent result is that a collection of measures related to family socioeconomic resources appears to account for a little less than half a standard deviation of the black–white test score gap, regardless of the assessments used or the populations studied."
https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0273229706000529?via%3Dihub

>>10581354
>Having grandparents that were slaves, your fathers occupation, and "racism" have no demonstrable effect on IQ.
Wow I was not aware that IQ was the sole determinant of human behavior and that upbringing and culture doesn't actually mean anything.

>>10581363
We're talking about people in the same environment. If you want to cry racism or cultural differences, you're going to have to prove it's effect on IQ. Prove your claim, despite real scientists falling to do just that.

It's clear you have no intention of honest discussion and just want to reaffirm your feelings.

>>10581381
>We're talking about people in the same environment.
And I'm saying that they cannot possibly be in the same environment.
A middle class black person had a completely different upbringing than a middle class white person, and the older they are the more this holds true.

I don't think we should genocide the mosquitoes.

>>10581392
>I'm saying that they cannot possibly be in the same environment.
Yes, they can. It has been done in adoption studies, yet there is still a gap.

We're just going in circles. No one seriously thinks environment, culture, and nutrition is the sole factor and studies have confirmed this. It doesn't explain high intelligent/poor environment groups that are fairly common. It doesn't explain the natural difference between IQ that vary greatly even between people of the same race, class, and environment. If you could make someone have an IQ of 150 just by making sure they weren't deficient in iodine, exposed to lead, or have some racist person look at them funny within the first two years of their life, everyone would do it. It's obvious that intelligence is mostly genetic and different groups have different genetics, like we have found in most other areas. It's very simple when you're not lying to yourself.

>>10581440
>It has been done in adoption studies,
No you stupid fucking retard the mere fact they are BLACK fundamentally gives them a different environment.
You'd have a better argument doing adoption studies within a race, oh wait but racists don't care about IQ differences within a population.

>>10576867
post the real link you nigger
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/features/2018-11-28/how-to-kill-mosquitoes-google-and-verily-have-a-plan
>>10576880
hmm how about not giving them free shit, though?
i guess mosquitoes are not that bad eh

Mosquito Lives Matter

>>10577715
>despite all evidence pointing to EVERYONE stops reproducing as much when they get rich enough?
memes made out by leftists are not evidence. correlation is not causation nigger. Iceland hasnt got this problem cause it has solved it smartly intead of having jews ruling and importing nggers like you

>>10576867
Funnily enough, very little. Sending these parasitic fuckers into the ground will leave less parasitic pathogens being spread. This will allow micro fauna of all sorts to flourish. Parasites are the one type of animal that should be eradicated from earth. Humans too however, will be parasites to the earth. There must be a better way.

>>10577752
>That graph's not really relevant to the true claim he was making about how if nations get richer their population stops growing
>a made up graph not based in real data making a shitty projection based in absolutely nothing but post hoc ergo propter hoc is very relevant
haha buy some IQ points m8

>>10581468
>Humans too however, will be parasites to the earth.

>>10581478
>he doesn't like nintendo
enjoy being a pariah

>>10581048
>Blacks are less integrated into American culture than Asians are. The representation in media is as an exotic "other"

>>10581449
>mere fact they are BLACK fundamentally gives them a different environment.
No, it doesn't. They changed, the environment is the same. No one treats a two year old black kid any differently than a white kid. They're barely exposed to anything before reaching school age. Even if that was the case, you have to prove that racism is causing a change in IQ. Prove your claim. They already researched this and found that removing stereotype threat does not eliminate the racial test performance gap.
>You'd have a better argument doing adoption studies within a race
No, you would have a terrible argument because you're not getting any information on greater genetic factors, only information on group genetics.
>, oh wait but racists don't care about IQ differences within a population.
You're seriously fucking retarded, I specifically brought that up to show how varied they are, which implies intelligence is mostly genetic.

In before:
>More whining of racism with zero evidence for your made up claims.

>>10581519
Dude the average black-americans I.Q. now is the same as avg I.Q. for European-americans in the 1950's... they're catching up.

Scientists postulate that mosquitos are completely unnecessary to the world. They're literally just a nuisance. They don't hinder populations in dramatic ways, nor are they a necessary food source for any creature. I say good for Google for working to eliminate them. The bastards.

>>10581536
hearty jej
not all anons will realize this is satire

>>10581536
> they're catching up.
Progress has basically stalled out and the gap remains fairly constant.

Even if they do catch up, which I truly hope is the case, you'll still have at least a billion retards for the foreseeable future. They are a liability for the rest of us and they're rapidly becoming completely unemployable as automation takes the basic jobs first.

>>10581566
>They are a liability for the rest of us
This does not infer from the data collected. Could you verify that your reasoning is economical, and not entirely rhetorical?

>>10576867
As an ecologist this rings a lot of alarm bells but as someone who's also worked in mosquito control, their plan is specific to aedes aegypti which in my eyes validates their plan. They aren't planning on eliminating all mosquitoes, they're eliminating one of the worst vectors for various diseases. Aegypti is like the ground zero for most of the zoonotics in the US, and it's not really found in the north. It's the main vector for zika when that started.

The concept of "getting rid of all mosquitoes" is really common and I don't really support that but specifically targeting aegypti is something I can get behind because it's such a common vector for many diseases. You could easily eliminate a lot of deaths from just getting rid of this one species while also allowing the population of less competent vector species to just grow and take their place. Yes mosquitoes suck but it'd be better to target the disease rather than the animal itself.

>>10581589
>This does not infer from the data collected. Could you verify that your reasoning is economical, and not entirely rhetorical?
Very weak bait, unless you completely ignore everything closely correlated to intelligence and stick your head into sand.

>>10577739
Demographic Transition Model, faggot. African countries haven't reached the point where their birth rate levels off, because their death rates are still very high.

I really amazes me how this board can turn any thread into a race and IQ thread.

>>10582077
It's because it's the ultimate question of our era. Niggers have gone too far

>>10581519
>No one treats a two year old black kid any differently than a white kid.
>this is what white people actually believe

>>10582105
This is what rational people believe. Do you think strangers are overwhelmingly committing racist acts against black toddlers? Do you think some stranger making a face at you effects IQ? How much fucking exposure to these things could explain a ten point IQ gap in between groups in kindergarten?
>this is what white people actually believe
My race has nothing to do with it, you fucking racist. I actually identify as a black female.

>>10582141
SILENCE huwh*toid! I feel that my truth is truly true with every ounce of melanin in my body and you can never take that away from me. Expecting standards of "evidence"(read: huwh*tethink) is just a cultural practice of wh*toids. Insisting that I conform my Black Body to your wh*teness is colonialism of the most dire kind.

>>10582141
>>10582172
>I'm racist but there's no possible way that blacks are treated differently in society
cognitive dissonance

>>10582405
Blacks are treated differently =/= toddlers are being influenced by racism and it somehow reduces their IQ greatly, despite there being no evidence at all for such a mechanism.
>cognitive dissonance
Projection, but I'm glad that I reduced your argument to just shitposting and crying racism. Maybe one day we'll figure out exactly why you're retarded.
>>10582172
Based big brain nigga. FUCK WH*TE PPL AND FUCK DRUMPF.

>>10578048
Not that anon. What happened?

>>10577256
Time and time again this has been shown to NOT occur in african populations. Why are you so fucking stupid?

>see thread about wiping mosquito population
>huh seems actually interesting, wonder what other anons think
>click scroll to bottom
>thread is now about black people
Why do I even come here

>>10583490
agreed
except for calling them """people"""

>>10583490
Just avoid any thread that involves Africa, crime, or poverty. It's simple.

We wouldn't need to talk about this so often if 'muh feelings' retards didn't come here and blame racism for all the problems created by just a few minority groups while ignoring any other possible cause. It's like trying to help someone look for their keys, only you both know they are in their hand and they're pretending otherwise.