/sci/ - Science & Math

stop deleting the thread

>>10535538
I just saw one time they did that.

>>10535537
>the entire OP removed again
Kill yourself shitlord

>>10535422

This is an interesting point. Why is the Arab world not interested in Space exploration and what part have they played in Space history.

>>10535615
Hint: that's not the same OP as the thread that got deleted. I don't know what triggered the mod.

Will we ever have spacewalk suits that aren’t bulky and stiff?

>>10535661
If material science catches up, sure.

tfw getting into astrophotography is expensive

>>10535636
simply put, their sand cult says space bad
so either they're going to shit about in their shitholes and die off, or turn secular and no longer be a perpetual nuisance to humans

who here /wants to get into aerospace engineering but too fucking stupid to do so/

>>10535661
The technology already exists but your average space suit costs more than your average yacht so building new ones to replace old ones has been an enormously ponderous process. There's like less than ten functioning US suits right now, some of them are being repaired, fewer have functioning PLS systems, and only four of those (I think it's four) are actually in space on the ISS right now. There are better designs right now but not enough demand for space suit manufacturing to be much of any kind of industry, which inevitably means very slow design evolution, and very high per-unit cost.

>>10535681
Delet you fucker

>>10535687
How much of a technological jump would it be for SpaceX to develop a spacewalk suit, considering they already have pressurization suits for Dragon? Totally different?

>>10535705
No clue really since I don't think there's too much information about the SpaceX flight suits, however theirs (like all flight suits) isn't fundamentally the same thing as an EVA suit, there's no PLSS, there's no hard components outside of the helmet, and it's only function would be to prevent the astronaut from dying in the event of depressurization, it's not intended to spend long periods of time in hard vacuum, so the requirements aren't as rigorous, basically it just has to hold one atmosphere of air inside and circulate that to the wearer. EVA suits on the other hand have a hard cuirass made of some composite material onto which the PLSS, helmet ring and other hard components of the suit are attached, a special undersuit is worn to regulate the astronaut's body temperature so they don't overheat, and the whole suit is protected by several layers of insulation (for heat) and kevlar to protect against cuts.

I think though that it's safe to say any modern suit will have significant advantages over the EMU, considering that it's design is closing on half a century old, I'd expect the PLSS to be reduced in size, and the dexterity of a modern suit to be greatly improved.

>>10535661
>>10535728
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mechanical_counterpressure_suit

Research has gone on for decades for spacesuits that only need to provide air pressure around the head and give the rest of the body full range of movement. MIT has just about cracked it, the thing works pretty damn well in a vacuum chamber (except for the hands and feet), but God knows how long before one's actually certified for use in space.

>>10535674
>simply put, their sand cult says space bad
Really? What part of their religion says that space travel is bad? This is the first time I'm hearing about that.

>>10535733
This is what I would go with if I had to design a new suit, gloves can be handled by just making them tight fitting like the rest of the suit with a padded cuff where they lock on at the wrists so the tension doesn't chafe or bruise the skin. It will still need a hard cuirass though to act as the attachment point for helmet, PLSS, and the accompanying control box, emergency oxygen bottles, and other assorted stuff. A counterpressure garment will definitely act as a good base though, and it's what I was thinking of when I said I'd expect a modern suit to have much better dexterity.

>>10535747
Is it not easier to have everything done through umbilicals? Minimize the stuff in the suit as much as possible

>>10535746
None of them, Space colonization is generally not that popular, that's also the reason why neither USA or Russia did shit into that direction. The new era of space colonization will be brought by sci-fi obsessed billionaire-nerds like Bezos and Musk, Governments won't do shit.

>>10535791
It is strictly easier because you just have to put the necessary connecting ports into the suit, but it also greatly limits what the suit is actually capable of doing. Obviously a tether only suit can't walk very much on other planetary bodies, and you can't go more than a certain distance from your tether point. I'd build my hypothetical suit with the option to use a tether rather than a PLSS, and have the PLSS be something that can clamp firmly to the hard cuirass. That way the suit can be more adaptable to different needs.

>>10535746
>>10535803
You can't pray towards Mecca while in space.

>>10535834
Nah some people figured out where you point. Remember reading about it once

>>10535834
You pray towards earth, what's the issue.

>>10535852
But what if you fall past the event horizon of a supermassive black hole?

>>10535911
Then figuring out how to pray towards Mecca would be among the least of your concerns.

>SpaceX likely to win NASA’s crew competition by months, for billions less
ouch
https://arstechnica.com/science/2019/04/spacex-likely-to-win-nasas-crew-competition-by-months-for-billions-less/

>>10535994
Eric Berger is an embarassment.

>>10536002
Why? I don't know anything about him.

>>10535537
Why hasn't Blue Origin made orbit yet? They were founded 2 years before SpaceX and have the world's richest man bankrolling them. How embarrassing.

>>10536029
they don't have a sense of urgency to their work.

>>10536029
They didn't get 10 billion government money. They are an actual private Company and not NASA's retarded little sidekick.

>>10535537
Earth is flat

>>10536109
What about Rocketlab then?

>>10535994
SpaceX anti shill crew on suicide watch

>>10536004
he's a retard, such sensationalist headlines before the competition is even over is foolhardy

>>10536109
Didn't they get a giant contract for New Glenn from the air force despite not reaching orbit yet and Bezos having more money than god while BFR went unfunded?

NASA administrator literally CONFIRMS only expendable rockets have the upmass capability to make real sustainable spaceflight possible.

We've been telling you fanboys for years now how reusable rockets are a meme that actually reduces payload simply by the nature of wasting fuel for things that aren't payload.

How will muskfags ever recover?

>>10536163
that's why you've just got to make them 'UGE
Big Jim is talking about current rockets, and he's right, the F9 doesn't have the volume nor the mass for building things in space, and especially not for beyond earth orbit things

>https://www.nbcnews.com/mach/science/nasa-s-17-billion-moon-rocket-may-be-doomed-it-ncna991061
>"I'll never forget being at Marshall with the leadership team the day that SpaceX announced the Heavy," said Lori Garver, NASA's deputy administrator from 2009 to 2013. She recalls NASA officials telling her: "Lori, you have got to tell your friend Elon he can't do that. He's in our lane. You made us get out of low-Earth orbit, so we've given him that lane, but this is our lane. We build the big rockets."

FH is kill they are going to nationalize and then scrap it. You don't fuck with the government especially when they tell you not to do something and you do it anyway.

>>10536029
Spacex received 4 billion dollars subsidy for the falcon 9 according to former nasa administrator while Blue received nothing from the government.

>>10536172
I guess it makes sense large rockets are super expensive the smallest you can use for given task the better.

>>10535221
>Falcon Heavy launch that will likely be the first to recover all three first stage parts
I wouldn't bet on it, seriously.
It's gonna be the highest speed core yet to try and land.

>>10536163
>NASA administrator literally CONFIRMS only expendable rockets have the upmass capability to make real sustainable spaceflight possible.
Where does he say this? Are you talking about Falcon Heavy needing to be partially expendable in order to carry Orion to TLI?

>We've been telling you fanboys for years now how reusable rockets are a meme that actually reduces payload simply by the nature of wasting fuel for things that aren't payload.
This is true, but the loss of payload can be acceptable if the cost per launch is reduced enough. This is what reusable boosters promise. The real issue is that the cost of recovery and refurbishment may not be cheap enough to justify reuse. Unfortunately there is only one thoroughly studied example of such a vehicle, the Shuttle. And that vehicle's design was hampered such that it couldn't really strive for the goal of reuse.

While I have doubts that reusable rockets are viable now, I think that they are the future of spaceflight and that they should be tried for now.

>>10536163
FH was never meant to do that.
All it was supposed to do was send a dragon capsule to Mars or around the Moon.
But they said fuck it and when for Starship instead.

>muskfags
>SpaceX anti shill crew
Reminds me of Xbox vs. Playstation fanboys, but on a higher level.

>>10536176
>FH is kill they are going to nationalize and then scrap it.
What makes you think that? Because I doubt that the US government can do that to such a well known and popular company like SpaceX without everyone to the right of Stalin freaking out.

>>10536188
if you're throwing the rocket away, it's better to go small
if you're reusing it's very important that you go big

>>10536176
*hand rubbing intensifies*

>>10536210
yeah, isn't that because orion is a fat piece of shit, not because Heavy isn't strong enough?

>>10536222
just like your fucking /v/ console wars bullshit, it's all horseshit

>>10536233
Its abit of both I think. Although I don't know what exactly makes Orion so heavy. Its twice the mass of the Apollo capsule while only being a little less than three tenths greater in diameter. Falcon Heavy is definitely hampered in the amount of mass it can carry, it can't carry the theoretical maxium. Although that is due partially because SpaceX didn't want to develop Falcon such that it can do that.

>>10536188
I'm sorry dude, but if what we've seen of Starship production stays as is, then it basically only costs you the engines.

>>10536252
lol, no. just contruction of the hopper has certainly already cost tens of millions.

>>10536225
If they take SpaceX we can finally commence it.

>>10536299
Yeah, no.

>>10536299
wow, holy shit tens of millions, that's literally pocket change compared to usual rocket costs

>>10536299
A finished Starship could cost a full billion and still be less than half as expensive as SLS.

>>10536321
Friendly reminder that the SLS will cost $1.5B per launch at best.

>>10536225
Lol, no.
When this whole EM-1 thing started, some sources told they had a proposal that was sent to NASA.
If anything, it's SpaceX throwing ropes at NASA.

>>10536334
It already cost more than ten times that, for no launches.
If it doesn't launch at least 10 times with no extra money being spent, it will be much more cost.
And that doesn't include Orion.

>>10536356
I have no idea how the people working on the project justify to themselves to work on a project like that.

>>10536394
Cute.

>>10535813
What about a half-curiass? Something that basically terminates at right around where the ribs are, and uses straps similar to a climbing harness to keep it from sliding around much?

>>10534698
Who the fuck cares about the NASA administrator's views on climate change?

It was Obama's NASA chief who said "NASA's priorities are fighting climate change, getting children excited about science and reaching out to the Muslim world."

Sending shit into space didn't even make the top fucking three.

>>10536394
Why does it have two sets of ears?

>>10536452
why do you only have one?

>>10536445
>getting children excited about science
I mean, fostering a positive public option on spaceflight makes sense as a goal for NASA considering how little the public cares about space. Apollo only had a 50% approval rating at best.

>>10536094
Yeah, SpaceX had a deadline they were contractually obligated to work toward. Blue Origin doesn't have the same kind of time pressure.
>>10536159
Nothing for rockets yet, but they do have a contract to supply BE-4 engines to ULA for use on their Vulcan rocket.
>>10536247
I think part of the extra mass was for extra endurance (oxygen, water, food, lithium hydroxide). Orion can perform missions as long as three weeks, so it's carrying almost as much in terms of consumables as the shuttle per person (maximum mission duration of about 18-20 days).

>>10536209
They’ve also had a year to upgrade the cores to block 5 and conduct a shit ton of new landings.
I think they have a good chance.

>>10536512
don't forget, the ASDS stream is now fixed for good. Won't be a dropout during landing

what should we name it /sci/?
https://2007or10.name

http://www.planetary.org/blogs/guest-blogs/2019/or10-needs-a-name.html

>We’re asking for your help to pick a suitable name for 2007 OR10 to submit to the International Astronomical Union (IAU). The IAU formally bestows permanent names upon solar system minor planets, but the discoverers have a roughly 10-year period after the body has a well-determined orbit to suggest a name for the IAU to consider. We have 3 naming suggestions that fit the IAU naming regulations and are associated with mythological creatures and figures that reflect aspects of 2007 OR10’s physical properties. The option with the most votes will be the one that we will formally submit to the IAU for consideration. Head to http://www.2007OR10.name and vote for your favorite naming suggestion. Voting ends on 10 May.

>(225088) 2007 OR10 is a binary trans-Neptunian object orbiting the Sun in the scattered disc, approximately 1,250 kilometers (780 miles) in diameter. It is the fifth-largest known body in the Solar System beyond the orbit of Neptune, and is the largest known body in the Solar System without a name. According to estimates as of September 2018, it is slightly larger than Charon, and is hence almost certainly a dwarf planet. It has one known moon, which is probably less than 100 km (≈ 60 miles) in diameter.

>>10536529

>>10536468
NASA should be doing work, not fucking around trying (and failing) to get normalfags to care about something they couldn't even be arsed to be invested in at the height of the space race. They also shouldn't be wasting their fucking time jerking off climate change evangelists, as if that particular doomsday cult needed any more government fellatio. They should have all of their energy devoted to what everyone actually did love them for, putting huge fucking telescopes in orbit, landing living breathing human beings on other planets, and designing the giant rockets that got them there, to ensure that the USA can get to space.

>>10536333
...of course that's just the cost per launch (none so far!), not the billions in development.
>>10536512
As long as they remember to fill up the Bic lighter this time.
>>10536529
Orten is a perfectly cromulent name.

>>10536548
>billions in development
SLS cost, in case it wasn't clear.

Could the SpaceX fags stop ruining every single one of these threads with their endless circlejerk and shitting on everybody who is not SpaceX Jesus fucking christ

>>10536568
Calm down. Its not that bad.

>>10536568
?
if you think that SLS deserves to be coddled then I have a bridge to sell you.

If a vocal subset that loves SpaceX doesn’t like SLS, but the majority in general doesn’t like SLS either, then that doesn’t make the SpaceX crowd special in any way.

t. unironic spacex fanboy

>>10536568
I wonder who could possibly be behind this post?

>>10536574
This. You don't have to like SpaceX to dislike SLS.

It had it's chance to be a useful launcher and it blew it. It can be redeemed if it launches EM-1 by 2020 and starts flying manned missions right after that. But there's even doubts that it can.

It took NASA less than 8 years to go from rockets that could barely leave the pad to manned Lunar flybys. Now NASA struggles to end a robotic mission to the Moon. Very disappointing.

>>10536299
It was built by a fucking water tank company lol

>>10536735
>Tom & Bob's Big Tanks and Spacecraft Co.

>>10536744

>>10536744
That is a desirable end goal though isn't it? To have spacecraft become pieces of equipment as common and mass produced as a water tank.

>>10536764
Sure, I thought the gif made that clear

I thought you guys would want to know that:

>"Raptor isn't leaving because of any issues during testing, more just needs facilities that SpaceX Boca Chica doesn't currently have for some routine post-test analysis."

This is coming from a very reputable L2 source btw.

>>10536438
>I have no idea how the people working on the project justify to themselves to work on a project like that.

>>10536911
I meant the engineers in the project, not the managers. I only work in a small design team and I feel awful if a week goes by without any meaningful work done so it's hard for me to imagine working on a project that has barely done much for years.

>>10536937
That's one of the signs to me that there aren't a ton of great engineers working on that project. Good engineers don't like to sit around on their asses, they want to get stuff done. If a project is designed to be stagnant, it will drive away the good engineers.

I apologize lads, the FH launch thread will be up in a few hours. Wanted to post it at -24hr but something came up

Next hop when?

>>10537068
The county estimate is two months.

What's the estimated FH launch time tomorrow?

>>10537213
6:35 PM eastern

>>10537216
Ah, I'll miss it. Maybe next time.
Thanks anon.

>>10536356
I would like SpaceX by that time to try out a Sea Dragon type rocket and be able to launch an entire fully fueled SLS, into orbit, for less money than NASA could from a regular launch

>>10536176
>He's in our lane. You made us get out of low-Earth orbit, so we've given him that lane, but this is our lane. We build the big rockets."
this is embarrassing if true

>>10537037
Isn't that the bizarre heli-rocket SSTO? I'd rather spend 4 mils on something a bit more feasible.

>>10536984
I mean, a stagnant project is inevitable if you still get paid bonuses even if you're late. Like how NASA treats Boeing.

Seriously. I have no idea why NASA did that and expect Boeing to be on time.

>>10536568
I don't give a fuck about new sheperd. I am not sure what the rocket's purpose is, or who the market base for that dumb fuck experience is. So other than the Be-4 Blue Origin is kinda boring. They have built 1 great rocket engine and they are backed by the richest man in the world

>>10537234
considering the ars technica article that said Boeing lobbied heavily to get all of the commercial crew funding just for Starliner, it's almost certainly true.

>>10537234
They're a government entity, and the entirety of the US government inhales Boeing's cock.

>>10537424
CC really should have gone to Dream Chaser and Dragon

Falcon Heavy webcast stream
>Scheduled for 4/10/19, 3:35 PM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TXMGu2d8c8g

>>10537461
At least Dream Chaser got in on the cargo game. That almost ensures they'll have a man-rated vehicle in this decade.

>>10537519
I'm glad that at least somebody's doing the spaceplane meme correctly

>>10537520
Dreamchaser on top of a falcon 9 would be pretty spectacular.

>>10537524
dreamchaser inside a Starship

>>10537461
Isn't there an X37B set to launch on a Falcon soon? Close enough?

>>10537530
Oops meant to reply to >>10537524

>>10537530
Already done more than a year ago:
>https://www.space.com/38067-spacex-launches-x-37b-space-plane.html

>>10537561
why was it in a fairing?

>>10537640
aerodynamic profile?

>>10537660
it's a spaceplane, it can take some aero forces

>>10537640
My guess would be that the fairing prevents the aerodynamic surfaces on the space plane from moving the aerodynamic center of the rocket stack far enough forward to destabilize the rocket.

>We build the big rockets
>Le SLS face

>>10537695
>we pay Boeing to pretend to build the big rockets

>>10537695
>b-but our rocket penor is biggur!

friendly announcement from your resident SpaceX launch thread poster; the FH thread will be up in a ~bong. Stream itself goes live in 19 bongs

Don't forget your snacks!

>>10537738
currently cooking up launch-day snacks right now

Another friendly announcement, the design for Nuclear Sea Dragon is done. It just took me a while to get the calculations done both due to classwork and me struggling to accept the numbers I got because Sea Dragon is too damn big.

Working on the art for it now, anyone want to suggest some style you like?

>>10537868
FH thread

>>10537664
Of the rocket, you dingus

>>10536452

>>10537508
It's 00:35 in Europe.
I have to wagecuck the next day
Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaa

Phobos crosses the sun on Mars. captured by Curiosity

>>10538081
I sure am glad that Luna is big enough and close enough to give us full eclipses, unlike that weaksauce shit

>>10536163
it's just further-off tech. if we ever get fusion, or master other forms of propulsion, or find a better fuel source, or economize one of our current fuels - reusable rockets become the absolute future.

you stupid fuckers need to go watch some Isaac Arthur.

>>10538092
Isaac Arthur is a retarded shitheel who doesn't know anything and fails to present any of the very real negatives to all the dumb shit he shills to redditors

>>10538052
That's 22:35 Universal Yuropoor Time

why the fuck did the mods post that sticky?

>>10538158
We’re going to the moon, bruh

>>10538186
I really hope so and that the project doesn't get quietly forgotten in 3-4 years like all the rest.

>>10538158
Reminder to gas your local janny

>Posting a sticky of ancient news while letting that one shitposting cunt run rampant for hundreds of replies per thread

FUCK

JANNIES

>>10538200
well at least the cunt's contained to the sticky
how kind of them

>>10538196
Yeah, this. I don't get the excitement around this announcement.

>>10538081
Sun must be tiny on Mars or Phobos is super low. It‘s just a pebble.

>>10538223
Bit of both actually

>black hole
>falcon heavy
>meme moon lander
gonna be a comfy next two days, lads

How the FUCK do they always determine faults when rockets explode. I know theres a number of factors like launch footage and telemetry to study, but how do they possibly narrow down the exact reason when all thats left is 100,000 pieces in the Atlantic? Are there any good books/videos about it?

>>10538639
Jew moon takeover when?

>>10538900
Sensors, yo. Pretty sure the Falcon 9 alone has several thousand sensors of all types. They figured out how the AMOS-6 booster went up by looking at the audio sensor data and determining when the noise from the event reached each individual sensor. From there, it's simple math to find the bugged part (the COPV) and a little bit of logic to determine what caused it to blow the fucking rocket up.

>>10537738
I've got my rocket crackers and a nice Trippel ready to go.

BTW, latest news is that they will be making an attempt at first flight on the Stratolaunch carrier plane today, for twice the Heavy!

>>10538900
google "fault tree analysis". It is an entire field of study, basically advanced logical deduction. Our rocket club is getting a lot of practice in this ourselves, since our last flight catoed.

>>10540058
>>10539833
cool, thanks guys

>>10540096
Muskbois, are you ready?

Balls will of cum ready to burst at liftoff?

>>10537846
No preferred style, I wanna see what your interpretation of the Sea Dragon looks like, we've pretty much all seen the classic design already

>>10537072
that makes me a sad panda

>>10535537
I made small edit to your pic op

>>10540663
what are you even trying to say you sperg

>>10540027
aye

Suppose a planet orbiting a brown dwarf close enough to have liquid water covering a sizable portion of it's crust.

In the advent of a solar flare, cooking the surface of the crust, what happens to the oceans, rivers and lakes? How much water could be expected to evaporate? Would rainfall always follow closely a solar flare or would that moisture linger?

>>10541506
this concept is still kooky as hell to think about. I hope they succeed

>>10538052
Down some monsters and say you had intense headaches last night when your coworkers ask you about your more disgusting than usual appearance.

dust devils

>>10541700
Wait can you get a negative appearance ???

where all my elon bois at?

>>10542600

>>10542608
Why doesn't it have two sets of eyes?

>>10542653
anon, I...

>>10542676
God I hate cats.

>>10540027
No way! I love this ridiculous beast

>>10542830
my favorite part of starolaunch is how their only orbital rocket provider bailed on them

>>10542838
because it was a vanity project. Allen died so the yes-men folded it

>>10542859
Will it at least see a test flight though?

>>10543273
yeah & then a couple Pegasus XL launches, probably

muskyboys literally BLOWN the fuck out.

>>10543368
don't you mean 45th weather squadron BTFO? SpaceX can't control the weather.

>>10543372
>SpaceX can't control the weather
>Elon Musk starts another company
>It's goal is to be able to control the weather
>Elon frames this as a precursor to teraforming Mars

>>10537037

>>10543506

>>10543512
Flying Windmill

>>10536529
>shamelessly copypasting my response from another thread
holle>vili>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>gonggong
chinese just sounds bad, and we already have a dwarf planet with four repeating letters

>>10543383
the great filter lies ahead of us, and it is climate control technology.

>>10543669
Holle is by far the cutest, therefor it's the best.

>>10535845
>>10535852
You're supposed to pray at sunrise/sunset. Those lose all meaning in space.

>>10543881
In case it ever gets discovered it should be tested on a distant depressing desolated land. Like Australia.

>>10543887
Here I was thinking Holle was a name proposed for M87* (short for Bllack Holle, of course.)

>>10543887
Vili would be best for a binary system so Ve could be the smaller of the two (them two and Odin are bros in mythology). 2007OR10 has one known moon that could work, but there's probably better fits for the names out there.

>>10541639
Solar flares won't cook planetary surfaces, they blast them with intense UV light. Surface temperatures would not change by more than a percent or so. Over geologic time scales the strong pulses of solar wind caused by flares could lead to significant or almost total atmospheric erosion for smaller rocky planets (an Earth sized planet or a super Earth will have enough gravity that they will retain their atmospheres anyway with or without a magnetic field, see Venus for an example).

>>10535728
Most suits do not hold one atmosphere. More like 6 psi.

>>10535733
MCP for the win.

(1/2)

Here you go guys, the biggest of big, the most absolute of units. A Nuclear Sea Dragon.

Originally I had planned on both stages being nuclear, but I couldn't find a way to make the first stage an open-cycle gas core NTR simple enough for Sea Dragon. So I just used a modified "standard" Sea Dragon first stage with a nuclear upper stage.

The upper stage (Township) is meant to be like a wandering space station. Traveling around the Solar system to perhaps trade with settlements it finds or make the settlements.

>>10544199
(2/2)

More info on Township and it's engines.

If you have any questions about it, then feel free to ask, but I'm going to bed so I won't be able to answer them until tomorrow.

Goodnight /sg/, I hope you like this.

>>10544199
>>10544205
anon I hate this

>>10543368
I knew i'd forgotten about something today...

>>10544223
He hates it!

Is it safe? Are janies still here?

>>10543889
It doesn't, you just have to pray every 45 fucking minutes

>>10544199
>>10544205
>ywn witness the launch of a NUCLEAR SEA FUCKING DRAGON
why even live

>>10543506
>>10543512
>kerbalwing.webm

its all right i guess i mean lots of colors and stufff aliesn to talk to but yea but its a sad shit show

today's the day......

We need bigger telescope.

>>10545757
So how's the bay supposed to open?

>>10545780
>So how's the bay supposed to open?
An unrepresented hinge mechanism. The bay in the render is, likewise, missing the door; it's not a section drawing.

>>10545238
>why even live
So you can be one of the engineers who make Nuclear Sea Dragon happen.

>>10544223

>>10545837
I-I'm an astrophysicist tho

>>10545965
>I-I'm an astrophysicist tho
Sell Congress on the idea of an instrument so big that only Nuclear Sea Dragon could launch it.

>>10545965
It's never too late for a degree change.

Or do this, >>10545974. You'll pretty much get a bottomless check if you can convince Shelby that Nuclear Sea Dragon uses Shuttle derived hardware.

>>10545986
>You'll pretty much get a bottomless check if you can convince Shelby that Nuclear Sea Dragon uses Shuttle derived hardware.

>>10545757
oh damn it is official!

https://twitter.com/NASAGoddard/status/1116310431969239040

one less SLS payload

>>10545757
>>10545991
boeing btfo once again
literally can't stop losing

>>10545991
So SLS has -1 payloads now?

>>10545991
Interesting responses below that tweet. Starship not only fits 8 meter diameter LUVOIR-B, but also just fits a 15 meter diameter LUVOIR-A. For comparison, JWST is only 6.5 meters.

>>10546006
Oh, no. it's gonna launch before JWST.

>>10545780
All the concepts for the cargo starship show the top half just hinging open like the fucking Spectre from "You only live twice". Someone in the comments also points out that such a cargo Starship could also fit the 13.2mx4.2m Hubble telescope for a potential retrieval and repair mission, which opens up the possibility that (in cases where it's more cost effective) large highly valuable satellites which have encountered failures or reached the age where their equipment has failed out could be snagged and returned to Earth for refurbishment or modernization.

>>10545757
>delay JWST so much the entire mechanism is pointless

Ebin. Nice way to waste 20 billion $.

>>10546022
Now that is definitely some sort of sea creature.

>>10546022
modernization would be too much effort for too little gain since you'd need to revamp everything across the board
would be better to just chuck them in museums and put fresh new shit up there

>>10546006
>15m space telescope

Fuck, I want to sleep for 20 years.

>>10546034
>waste
those dollars were embezzled like they were meant to, so in NASA and the contractor's eyes, it was a great success

>>10546022
Hubble is too outdated. We can make much better mirrors now. Just put a new one there. Few giant space telescopes working together would be completely insane.

>>10546049
call me when we have a gravitational lensing telescope thingy

>>10546063

>>10545757
In 10 years we will be getting color images of exoplanets.

>>10546022
The 1970s called, they want their Space Shuttle idea back.

>>10546040
>Too much effort for too little gain.
That's basically the SOP for our current space program right this second. It would definitely be more economically efficient to just gracefully retire Hubble to a museum once it's lifespan is over, but if you tell NASA you'll replace all the old equipment on Hubble with spare space shuttle parts they'd cum their collective pants and give you a few billion dollars.

>>10546109
>"I want to feed the people of the world... using legacy components
>Breaking News: NASA Solves World Hunger
>"We had to bankrupt a few countries to bail out Boeing a couple times, but we at NASA think that it was worth it."

Mirrorlets, when will they ever learn?

>>10546040
>>10546109
Guyz, it would still be nice to have it operational for lower tier observations.
That way you can use JWST for something that actually uses its powers.

>>10545757
holy shit

>>10546157
Could this technique be used on closest exoplanets?

>>10545757
It looks like it could easily fit 1.5 larger one too.

>>10546216
Not unless they give off lots of x rays

>>10546157
And it was a woman that did it.
>>10546223
Did you mean Radio?

>>10546231
>And it was a woman that did it.
I was being sarcastic by the way.

>>10546231
yeah

>>10546216
Not with these kinds of telescopes, but the idea of using multiple telescopes to generate composite images isn't new. I think it's already excepted that if we ever want an actual detailed image of any extrasolar planet the only ways to do it are to either go there yourself and get close enough to use a normal method, or composite together several enormous telescopes to get the necessary resolution. It will be a great excuse to eventually start mass production of space telescopes, with our current limit on payload volume and weight it would probably be easier to launch many networked normal sized (Hubble or JWST sized) telescopes rather than wait for a vehicle big enough to launch just a few monster sized telescopes. There will also have to be a change in how space telescopes are built, having hard plate objective components is a significant waste of mass and puts a hard limit on how big an individual objective piece can be (it's diameter will eventually get wider than the fairing of the vehicle holding it). A soft objective mirror made of some kind of highly reflective smooth metallic foil can be both much lighter and get packed into a much smaller space, needing only the structural skeleton to expand it once the telescope is in position. Even that could be reduced by replacing metal with a soft robotic inflatable skeleton, a small amount of some non-volatile gas could get pumped into it to inflate the semi-rigid structure and unfurl the objective mirror.

>>10544199
>>10544205
333 people in a single rocket holy fucking shit

Imagine if they were actually launched that way too from the start instead of boarding after, what an absolute unit of a beast.

Thanks for the creation and visualization of this glorious rocket anon, god tier OC here, this thing could probably lift the entire ISS in one go, my god

>>10546419
Easily, the ISS only weighs 450 tons.

>>10546429
That's one and a half-ISS in a single fucking launch holy shit.

We really need someone to make a big dumb booster like this already, looking back we will ask why we ever built the ISS in pieces flight after flight when it could have just been lifted off in one go and assembled like a pack of space legos

fuck why even do that when the 2nd stage could just become its own space station as in the Nuclear Sea Dragon design

>>10546446
The problem is one of politically justifiable application and initial investment. A project (especially one involving nuclear material being launched into space) must be sufficiently politically justifiable, IE politicians must be convinced that it's so important it MUST be done that way, and frankly most politicians are provincial fucking retarded semi-NEETs who's pressing primary desire is only to justify the necessity of their continued employment by the state. The other problem is initial investment, which will inevitably be as massive as the rocket itself. Yes, once you start mass producing such rockets (as any superheavy lifter should be produced) the launch and construction costs will plummet, but building the test rocket will be an unprecedentedly large investment in a space enterprise, the first of it's size. That problem might be even harder than the political one, if there's one thing that's harder than convincing politicians something is necessary, it's convincing them to actually spend the money to get it done correctly, and likely no private enterprise will even bother to look at the idea because the initial investment is a dice roll with their entire future on the line, they'd have to dedicate their entire value to the endeavor and if anything significant fails it would spell instant financial death for their entire business.

>>10536744
Formerly Sneed

>>10538099
you are the first fucker on the internet I've seen to shittalk Isaac like this, whats the matter, go to popular and now you hate him?

>>10545757
How do you get it out of that bay?

>>10546535
He's not wrong, though.
All he talks about is retarded high tech stuff we don't really know are possible.
Also he talks like a retard.

>>10546545
hinge

>>10546419
That's only if you were to launch rigid module cans too, if you launched say 33 B330 expandable modules instead you could generate 10890m3 of usable pressurized space in orbit once all of the modules are fully expanded. That's more than the usable internal volume of 11 International Space Stations.

>>10546545

>>10546022
>Hubble telescope for a potential retrieval and repair mission
Hear me out guys. If you service the parts that failed and the ones that can be serviced in orbit. The cost will be still smaller that a new telescope with the same size. Just send it back in orbit and you just pay the ground crew for the mission. It is not a problem that is outdated technology. You still can do good science on it.

>>10546419
>333 people in a single rocket holy fucking shit
Why do you think it's called "Township"?

>Imagine if they were actually launched that way too from the start instead of boarding after, what an absolute unit of a beast.
I think it would be too heavy to launch due to it being weighed down by the massive balls of all of the passengers.

>Thanks for the creation and visualization of this glorious rocket anon, god tier OC here
You're welcome, and thank you. It was fun to make. Especially designing the upper stage engine.

>>10546475
I hate how much political bullshit like this gets in the way of space development

>>10546638
At least the Shuttle had a chance to be useful, unlike....

>>10546638
It's an inevitability of being human, especially in a situation where something has wide reaching effects on many humans. Also what project created the concept of these enormous absolute unit shuttle boyes?

>>10546549
>we don't really know are possible.
Thats the whole point, its futuristic and sometimes fantastical speculation, if that doesn't get you going then you lack imagination

>>10546648
>1.104t vs 2.950 tons
Fucking Liquid Hydrogen is such a meme.

>>10546554
godamn, expendables really could change things for the better, do away with the limits of cans and take space stations into a new and better direction, its crazy how its just one company exploring them right now, and even that was thanks to NASA's initial exploration that was defunded, fuck.

>>10546692
I mean, OK, but my brain is just processing everything that could go wrong while I watch his videos.
Then he just makes another video, assuming previous one was truth, and proven hardware.

>>10546716
So suspend your disbelief then and treat it more like hard sci-fi wankery

>>10546720
Well, that's what I do, but there's nothing in there that will actually happen.

>>10546720
I normally go to Atomic Rockets for hard sf wank material.

>>10546698
>Chad Propellant-1 vs Liquid Hydvirgin

>>10546745
Maybe it's supposed to balloon up to space, what the shit?

>>10546743
A bit too hard sci-fi for me, the article about space battles disappointed me, no stealth in space etc..

>>10546698
the fact that they're using it all just shows you clear as day that it's pure pork and corruption, for no sensible rocket man knows that the small boost hydrogen gives is not at all worth the mountains of bullshit it brings
>oh you wanted to use that part again, did you?
>HA HA HYDROGEN EMBRITTLEMENT FUCK YOU

>>10546763
I understand. I don't like how dismissive of "less hard" elements the author is, like his attitudes towards interstellar travel.

But as a propulsion nerd, his engines list and material is a blast to look through.

>>10546749
It's the most efficient of the hypergolics that is also (relatively) safe to use. Some meme lithium/fluorine propellants could be more efficient but fluorine is hyper lethal, corrosive, neurotoxic, and volatile. The problem with LH2 is that because it's got such low density it's propellant tanks must be significantly larger to carry as much of it as denser stuff like Methane or RP1. It's also got an extremely low boiling point, which means that to convert it into a liquid it has to be cryogenically cooled at extremely low temperatures, and to keep it at those temperatures for any useful period of time it has to be very well insulated against even the slightest bit of heat. This means LH2 tanks are both physically bigger and probably use more insulation than other cryogenic propellant tanks, the result being that while theoretically the most efficient propellant assuming that it just gets magicked into the combustion chamber, in practical reality it's tanks are heavier, engines that burn it have less raw pushing power (because of it's very low density) which is bad for in-atmosphere flight, all of this leading to the fact that for anything other that interplanetary flight LH2 kinda fucking sucks, and even for interplanetary flight it fucking sucks in another way because little trickles of heat will boil it off requiring you to either carry a very robust cryogenic chilling system with you to keep re-cooling it or to bleed off your boiling propellant resulting in waste.

>>10546763
there ISN'T any stealth in space
if you want to have a ship capable of doing anything to the enemy, it will be shitting heat, and in the empty void of space, that heat is very, very visible
only way to really get around that is if you design the ship straight from the ground up specifically to be stealth, and in doing so, it will be shit at pretty much everything

>>10546807
Nice writeup, but hydrolox isn't hypergolic.

>>10546807
Yeah, I know all that, thanks for posting.
But still, a similar sized heavy lift rocket is capable of less than fucking jet fuel tech from the 60s.
I guess Hydrolox only makes sense for upper stage things.

>>10546822
This.

Although you can maybe get away with "Effective Stealth" by jamming every type of sensor known on the battlefield like what the Minbari do in Babylon 5. The enemy will know that you're nearby but they won't know exactly where you are until holes start getting poked into them.

>>10546826
hydro anything is hot garbage, for the simple fact that it automatically means the item will not be reusable, and reusability is the king of the show

>>10546832
you can't jam thermal radiation, and all that jamming equipment creates heat, and needs energy which means more fucking heat

>>10546834
Well, yeah, I never implied re-usability.
Fun fact is, it looks like they want it for gateway.
So they're gonna fail at it because it was already written.

>>10546853
God I hope NASA is lurking this board right now.
We shouldn't have to tell them.

>>10546824
Oops, should have just said bipropellants.
>>10546826
And only for upper stages which aren't going to be operating for long stretches of time. The LH2 has to either be re-chilled, spent entirely, or wasted in offgassing if it stays out there for long, and as the other Anon is pointing out the exposure to LH2 will permanently reduce the working strength and flexibility of many of the components that work with it to the point that those components will be useless for rocketry a second time even if they are retrieved. Building a heavy lift vehicle which uses an LH2 first stage is like trying to run an 18 wheeler with a formula 1 racecar engine and once you turn the engine off the whole block is permafucked and can never be used again.

>>10546844
I'm sure there's a way to dazzle thermal sensors with lasers. And that extra heat output won't matter if the enemy can't see it accurately.

>>10546886
laser dazzlers run into the same problems trying to hit your enemy with actually hot lasers do

>>10546882
See >>10546871
It's common sense, really, but it doesn't looks like it applies to NASA.

So when are the Hebrews doing their moon shit, and does anybody have a stream link

>>10546886
Yes but that's not stealth, stealth is passively being very difficult to see compared to the average combat vehicle, dazzling is actively impeding your enemy's ability to see, it's more along the lines of E-War than Stealth, although both have utility. A ship can have Stealth insofar as it can have things like an energy absorbing coating and be shaped to have a lower RCS, internal heat sinks and an ability to enter a passive low heat generation mode, cold gas non-combustion based reaction control thrusters, etc. That's stealth, pointing a laser at your enemy and toasting his sensors is E-War.

>>10546904
Who cares, it's gonna be fake as fuck.

>>10546904
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HMdUcchBYRA about 30 minutes to stream start, I think the landing is about 20 minutes after that

>>10546899
I mean, if there's no stealth in space, then you should be able to target your enemy easily. Plus, precision isn't necessary, you can blast a relatively wide cone of dasslers along with radio jamming so that the enemy can't call for aiming assistance from his friends.

>>10546914
Thank you for the clarification. My military theory is abit weak.

>>10546914
I got you senpai
Give me 20 min to design something
brb

>>10546937
there's no stealth in space but dodging is real

help me handle the blackpill on space exploration /sg/. feels like we havent made progress in a while. im starting to think the space program is underfunded and left on the side of the road now that the military has got their missile tech

>>10546962
there's plenty of money, the issue is that it's being spent by the bureaucrats in Congress instead of scientists
also the bureaucrats bungled the launch vehicles which fucks up the whole launch economy and makes all the prices go sky-high which does a feedback and then there's no science
newspace has cheapened launch costs which brings everything back into focus and we're GOING BACK TO THE MOON WOOOOOO

>>10546962
There is no blackpill, don't be a doomer faggot. There are now multiple promising private space enterprises developing capabilities to send humans to space and heavy launch vehicles to deliver significantly large payloads with them. JWST is going up soon, Bigelow despite having trouble back in 2014 is currently sending up a B330 in 2020-2021 to the ISS and possibly another to lunar orbit sometime around 2022. Starhopper has been doing stuff for some time now and will probably be performing un-tethered flights in the next few weeks/months, and I wouldn't be surprised if a the superheavy booster and at least a cargo starship are ready sometime during mid to late 2020.

>>10546962
>feels like we havent made progress in a while
You mean in terms of manned space exploration since Apollo? This is true. However NASA has done other great things after Apollo. Not in any particular order...
>Cassini, which revealed alot about Saturn and it's moons
>Hubble, the best space telescope
>Curiosity, a mutlistage craned complex lander what had to do things autonomously, and it stuck the landing
>Voyagers, a chance planetary alignment which would allow a quick and cheap exploration of the Solar system (in deltaV terms) and not one but two probes were made in quick order

And more. And that was done on a budget that's laughable compared to Apollo. While these don't have the spectacle of a manned mission, they're still impressive in their own ways especially considering the budget.

The failures of NASA today (like SLS) is mainly due to the recent recession, which hit the whole government badly. After that it became more important to maintain jobs to avoid an economic crash. However, things are looking up. Commercial rocketry has shown that more can be done with even less. Recent space achievements from other nations has injected some motivation into the US to take space seriously again.

We're never going to see the kind of progress from alcohol rockets to moon machines in 8 years like Apollo again. That was more of a freak event in spaceflight history, but there will be progress once the monopoly on spaceflight beyond LEO gets taken out of the US government's hands. And it's already happening.

Keep faith.

>>10547006
Makes you wonder how the first space programs of other alien races (if there are any) went, if they had similar grand feats and long lulls, or if they expanded gradually never stopping, etc..

Elon should watch this.

>>10547006
This is just wrong. We have spent MORE on manned spaceflight since Apollo than during Apollo, inflation adjusted. Also, Pioneer program during Apollo had much higher launch cadence than post-Apollo unmanned probes.

There is a black pill to swallow here and that black pill is that post-Apollo NASA is shit.

Only recently are things changing for the better with commercial space companies.

>>10546914
When you orient toward your enemy you have a reduced profile and no radiation from the radiators.

>>10547047
>That description

>>10547034
It is not just Pioneer, there is Mariner, Surveyor and Ranger programs. NASA launched dozens of space probes at various targets during the 60s. Modern unmanned missions hardly compare. They are more complex which is to be expected after 50 years, but also chronically overpriced, delayed, and infrequent.

>>10547047
>tfw wanna get into this game but its like Orbiter tier and the spaceship designs all end up looking the same, boring cylinders with radiators extending

>>10547075
>like Orbiter tier
I've never played Orbiter. What does this mean?

>>10547060
You will never see it cumming...
>>10547075
Look at the bottom right on the pic. The Concave option for the armor makes a big difference.
I have zero creativity in me so I only mode the game and play around with modules.

>>10547091

>>10547098
comfy

Israel has a great KSP stream going on right now

>>10547245
I wonder if they have an explosion animation ready.

>>10547280
Lol

>>10547245
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t7GUHd554NY

>>10547297
no, that's a restream and keeps playing ads
you want this one https://youtu.be/HMdUcchBYRA

they lost telemetry for a bit then got it back, I'm preparing that big f just in case

>>10547304
maybe it was a DSN swapover or something

>engine problems
TOGA! TOGA!

They might crash.

this thing gonna crash

>engine issues
engine is back on?

RIP

press F

time to get the lunar reconnaissance orbiter to do a pass by and get pictures of the crash site

Awwww.

Not bad for a first attempt.

>clapping
they crashed
big F, big accomplishment
only the fourth country to ever impact the surface

>>10547360
That's just because japan missed and put their shit in orbit instead.

>>10547303
Ah FUCK.
Oh well at least somebody is trying, they'll just have to run more extensive tests on the next engine, and hopefully they can identify what went wrong, assuming it was a fixable error and not simply one of those unfortunate failures close to the start of a component's lifespan.

>>10547347
Oh shit, here it is already!

>>10547303
What the fuck they're singing a prayer or whatnot now.

>>10547409
this song they're singing is very sad
all sorts of

>>10547400
Is this even meant to get a second attempt? I thought this was just a limited scope one-time moonshot thing to drum up publicity.

>>10547360
At least we have a photo.

>>10547409
Well, it jews, what you expect. Lead engineer of the project is creationist and don't belive in evolution.

An inertial measurement issue just before the initial loss of contact and the engine shutdown makes me think maybe one of the smaller engines exploded and sent the thing into a spin.
The main engine shut-down to prevent an uncontrolled acceleration towards the surface while it tried to recover, but by the time it did it was too close to the surface to stop and cratered.

>>10547421
nah they had three missions planned

>>10547428
i agree. creationism means youre a bad aerospace engineer. they are directly related, actually.

>Looking at the lander.
Was there anything but legs ,fuel tanks and a go-pro on this thing?
Was it supposed to do science?
Well at least they got a selfie before it crashed.

>>10547421
bibi said "if at first you dont succeed, try try again" after if failed
they're doing another

>>10547465
Nah, pretty sure it just had a thing with "Israel was here!" on it.

>>10547465
Yep, it carried a magnetometer and a new retroreflector for precision distance calculating. In addition it was carrying a copy of all wikipedia, the PanLex database, a rosetta disk, a digital copy of the torah, some childrens doodles and a children's book, some memoirs about muh six borgillion, the israeli national anthem, flag, and declaration of independence, all digitized.

>>10547554
>a digital copy of the torah
Yep, that definitely made it too heavy to land.

>>10547465
yeah there were a few small instruments
>>10547467
they had three of them planned

>>10547360
>fourth
You mean sixth?
Or even seventh, because SMART-1 was officially operated by ESA, despite being built in Sweden.

>>10547573
yeah I got the number wrong
it's between seven and nine, if you're counting the people who crashed their probes into the lunar surface

last image 22 km above lunar surface

How long until the lunar reconnaissance orbiter gets a pic of the crater?

>>10547911
Actually sent another very shortly before impact.

>>10547930
fucking cool

>>10547918
We have to figure out where it crashed first.

>>10547944
something sea serantitits

>>10547930
Where the curve?!?

>>10548414
can you see a curve from your living room window?

>>10548414
That would be the problem, yes.

>>10548419
Only curve I can see is my curved dick.

>>10548430
it's the same from the surface of the moon

>>10546034
If James Webb works it will prove the approach needed to make that ABSOLUTE UNIT a reality. It's James Webb on steroids!
>>10545757
>>10546545
The unfolding mirror mechanism will tear apart the cargo bay in a fit of steroid induced rage.