/sci/ - Science & Math

>>10538697
>simulation theory blocks your path

>>10538704
Simulation Theory is irrelevant. Any simulation as sophisticated as ours would be for all intents and purposes not a simulation to begin with. ST is a way for rich techdouches to think they're smart when they're just greedy. More futurist "i fucking love science" nonsense.

>>10538697
[Spoiler] You've just described the plot of The Three-Body Problem by Liu Cixin. [/spoiler] Turns out it's a really bad idea.

>>10538714
Again, the argument is moot. Humanity will already be the death of this world. All the threats humans have been using to control the humans who wish to break free from all these hellish systems of control no longer work, because the cures have become worse than the threatened diseases (which mostly never existed).

>>10538697
>It is clear
No it isn't, have some belief

>>10539243
No.

>>10539243
Anyone who has faith in mankind is willfully delusional. The only thing humanity has ever done is invent new problems and destroy the biosphere.

>>10538697
The only realistic option is to find like-minded individuals and build something where you can survive what's coming in such a way that it would be worth going on for you and your descendants.

>>10540483
NO. Outside help must be given. Humans can't even escape their delusions long enough to pull their heads out of their asses to even SEE the problems clearly. Let alone fix them.

>>10540529
What if there is no outside help? What if what we're facing is the same thing that keeps the galaxy silent? The great filter, inevitably faced by all those who gain the sentience to build an industrial society?

>Humans can't even escape their delusions long enough to pull their heads out of their asses to even SEE the problems clearly. Let alone fix them.
Correct. At best, some of us can see the problems coming, prepare to survive them and slip through the filter.

>>10538697
We already did that when we blasted the entire sky with very powerful radio during the cold war looking for nuclear rocket launches. Those were our incomprehensible screams for help

>>10538697
>it can't be worse than what humans are already fucking doing

Your lack of imagination is startling.

>>10540998
>What if there is no outside help?
Then what is there to lose? If there is no attempt, everything will be the same anyway. But if someone IS listening, there is the chance they can offer help. When you're drowning in the ocean, you don't decide to not bother seeking help because there may not be anyone who can hear you. You scream your ass off.

>Correct. At best, some of us can see the problems coming, prepare to survive them and slip through the filter.
While the majority actively attack us for our clearheadedness.

>>10541007
That wasn't an active request for help. What if they won't interfere unless directly asked?

>>10541020
No it isn't. Your lack of awareness of the present is what necessitates a project like this.

>>10538697
The question is moot.

For this to happen, it would require governments to commit funding, in effect saying "Well, WE governments are fucking incompetent and evil and destroying everything, so we'll ask for help. But, please, continue paying us handsomely to rule you." Can't see that happening.

I suppose some rich fuck, or coalition of them, might fund it, but a similar problem arises, substitute " elites" for "governments."

Then, even if it happened, it would be decades or centuries before there was a real chance of anybody hearing us, and THEN they'd have to be inclined to go to a lot of trouble to help a bunch of self-confessed destructive incompetents (and not, for example, want to enslave us as meat animals or any of the dozens of other ways Bad Aliums traditionally mistreat us) and THEN we'd have to wait for them to get here.

All that the best-case scenario, it could take MUCH longer -- assuming there is anybody ot there at all. (I would guess that there is, but lack data. Optimistic guessing is not data.)

So we're likely to either learn to do better on our own, or kill ourselves off, long before any Nice Aliums would ever show up, and long before any Bad Aliums would show up.

SO your signal being sent or not does not really accomplish anything good or bad, probably. Have at it, if you have the money.

>>10539410
>Anyone who has faith in mankind is willfully delusional.

To be fair, we've always managed to survive every challenge thrown at us so far.

Maybe we just got lucky, or maybe the challenges are rapidly becoming more than we can handle.

Or maybe we're better at this than you assume.

>>10540529
Please give examples of what you mean. You have made a strong assertion, but an assertion is not evidence.

>>10538697
Umm sweetie, what do you think nukes are?

Aliens and UFO sightings started because of atomic bomb testing, at least one species detected our planet and realized that monkey-people with ZERO wisdom are becoming important enough to monitor in case they need to snuff us out.

>>10541046
>For this to happen, it would require governments to commit funding
I was waiting for this comment. Because I want to be specific. I am talking about a democratic movement IN SPITE of the will of the world's governments. They will always seek to control the majority and destroy this world. That's why it has to be grassroots and independent. It honestly doesn't take much to construct a beacon. I suspect there are individuals already watching this planet closely for such signals. A wave of them could demonstrate that we are requesting aid. Rather powerful devices could be constructed for only a few thousand dollars perhaps.

>>10541054
This isn't about the survival of humans though. It's about the survival of all life on the planet, which humans are destroying.

>>10541070
>Umm sweetie, what do you think nukes are?
An argument that humans should be allowed to annihilate themselves. If I were to be an outside observer.

>>10541064
Literally everything. All spheres of human life are completely wrong. Politics, economics, religion, mankind's relationship with all other creatures on the planet. It's all wrong and it's headed for disaster even greater than we're now experiencing.

>>10541041
You claim that the situation could not possibly get worse. Nice hyperbole, but nonsense. Imagine a hypothetical Alium society that has evolved a really strong religion that requires that SOMEBODY suffer to atone for the sins of the sentient creatures of the Universe, and wh therefore seek out self-described destructive species and plop them into Weird Alien Goo Vats that keep them alive indefinitely, and in exquisite torture the whole time. That would be worse than most doomsday scenarios you guys have come up with for what we might do to ourselves.

Is that likely? Probably not, but it indicates that we COULD, in fact, make our situation worse by calling for help.

Whether we would be more or less likely to make our situation better or worse we can't know -- we have no data about any other species out there. Whether or not we will solve our problems as they come up, including the ones you are worried about right now, is also unknowable. None of us can see the future.

So, under your plan, we MIGHT be trading a horrible future for a great one. Or we MIGHT be trading a good one for a hellish one. We have no data to guide us in making that choice.

So, if you want to shout 'We are here, we are here, we are here!" in a more focused and deliberate way than we have already, I won;t stop you. But you have no idea whether it is a good idea or not.

In the meantime, it is probably a good idea to at least attempt to solve our problems ourselves -- even if you don't like our chances -- since we have no way of knowing whether anybody capable of helping us, and willing to help us, will hear your message in time to be of any use to us.

>>10541090
>It honestly doesn't take much to construct a beacon. I suspect there are individuals already watching this planet closely for such signals. A wave of them could demonstrate that we are requesting aid. Rather powerful devices could be constructed for only a few thousand dollars perhaps.


Cool. Build yours, let me know how it goes.

>>10541041
> But if someone IS listening, there is the chance they can offer help.
I guess it would be worth a try. Even a response from an advanced civilization which included a dire warning that we need to drastically change course might be enough to wake us up.
Then again, they'd already have to be quite close for any sort of message/action to reach us in time.

>While the majority actively attack us for our clearheadedness.
The psychological mechanisms that lead to industrial societies aren't the same that are required to deal with the problems such societies cause. We may (as a species) simply not be equipped to survive ourselves.

>>10541090
>It's about the survival of all life on the planet, which humans are destroying.

Couldn't if we wanted to. Life is every-fucking where. It is miles down in the bedrock, it is clustered around geo-thermal vents, it floats around surprisingly high in the atmosphere. All sorts of extremophiles exist. Life will survive the worst we can do, though we have the capacity to fuck up the current system massively.

But assume you are correct, the worst case is we wipe out not just ourselves, but all life on Earth.

But note that you've increased the size of the pot -- you still have no idea what the odds are of any outcome, so have no guidance on which is the safest way to bet.

And your bet paying off presupposes a universe filled with life, and with space-faring species. Life will continue.

>>10541090
>Literally everything.

I may have been unclear. You asserted that "Humans can't even escape their delusions long enough to pull their heads out of their asses to even SEE the problems clearly."
Making strong(er) general assertions is fine, but can you discuss an example of a problem that threatens us that fits the criteria you claim?

>>10538697
>it can't be worse than what humans are already fucking doing

>>10541160
>The psychological mechanisms that lead to industrial societies aren't the same that are required to deal with the problems such societies cause. We may (as a species) simply not be equipped to survive ourselves.

An interesting conjecture.

In looking at history, I have often been struck by a different thought -- that we actually suck at long-term planning, at foreseeing consequences, at avoiding pitfalls. But we seem pretty good at dealing with the emergencies that our lack of foresight allows as they come up.

This may make evolutionary sense -- in a world where we are threatened not just by our own actions, but by uncontrollable and unforeseeable disasters, an organism that is good at coping with shit as it comes down the pike might have an advantage over one that relies on preventing disasters in a chaotic and unpredictable Universe.

>>10541160
>Then again, they'd already have to be quite close for any sort of message/action to reach us in time
As I said, I believe they're already watching for such a signal.

>>10541161
>ain't nuffin matter i kin do wut i want
Shut up.

>>10538717
>Again, the argument is moot. Humanity will already be the death of this world.
Are you the vegan douche from the overpopulation thread?
CALM DOWN, junior.
We're already at peak child, world population is doing OK, and per-capita resource use is declining in 1st world countries.
Sure it's sad that there are more tigers in captivity that the wild, and the same may soon be true of polar bears.
I'm sure there are other sad consequences of our current impact, but we aren't going to do anything worse than the biosphere has already lived through.
Worst case, we'll wipe our own species out, so that should work out in the long run.
More importantly, what were you hoping some alien race would do?
Wiping out the human race seems a little like throwing out the baby with the bath water.
Short of that, I guess they could create a a world-wide nanny state, forcing humans to live in a more Earth-friendly fashion, but is that really a good idea?
Better technology might help, but we're already pursuing that path.
I guess there's also some potential for a social fix, but that's also likely to be something we could do on our own.
Aside from waving a magic wand, just what are you hoping your aliens would do?

>>10541160
>> But if someone IS listening, there is the chance they can offer help.
>I guess it would be worth a try.
It might.
It might also invite a species intent on wiping out the human race.
Or some locust species that would do more harm to Earth than we have/would.
It's a complete unknown.
You could speculate that someone capable of reaching us must have survived their own environmental impact, but that doesn't mean their environment survived as well.
We can be reasonably sure they have more advanced tech than us, but we can't tell how they put that tech to use.

>>10541369
>Or some locust species that would do more harm to Earth than we have/would
But that's still increasing. Don't underestimate how much damage humans will eventually do.

>>10541380
>But that's still increasing.
You're missing the point.
No matter how bad we get, some other people might be even worse.

>>10541400
>might
And they might not be. Regardless, it's unlikely to be worse than what humans are both doing and have planned for the near future.

>>10541218
>As I said, I believe they're already watching for such a signal.

Well, fuck, your hunch is scientifically valid!

Or do you have data?

>>10541218
>ain't nuffin matter i kin do wut i want

When you are invoking geological timescales, that’s objectively true.

>>10541405
>it's unlikely

How did you figure that likelihood?

Your hunch is not really a valid measure of anything, however strongly you hold your opinion.

>>10541070
>Aliens and UFO sightings started because of atomic bomb testing
Aliens and UFO sightings took off the same year helicopters became commercially available (1947).

>>10541419
It is, however, a retardedly misstated summation of >>10541161

>>10541419
I suppose any timescale fits that ideal if you're a sociopath.

>>10541327
Imagine the "Mars Needs Women" response we're in for when aliens get our space-porn.

>>10541090
>It honestly doesn't take much to construct a beacon
>Rather powerful devices could be constructed for only a few thousand dollars perhaps.
Nope.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fermi_paradox#We_are_not_listening_properly
with a radio telescope as sensitive as the Arecibo Observatory, Earth's television and radio broadcasts would only be detectable at distances up to 0.3 light-years, less than 1/10 the distance to the nearest star.
And then there's the inverse square law.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inverse-square_law
Any radio beacon capable of reaching any significant distance would be very expensive, and probably have a huge environmental impact.

>>10541405
>unlikely to be worse
You have no basis for making that claim, since we know nothing about your hypothetical aliens.

>>10541475
But we can predict eventualities. The Earth is already in the midst of a mass extinction event caused by 1 species. On the current trajectory, it will be even worse than it already has been. Life is already intolerable for most humans and life is basically not even an option for many non-humans. That's only going to keep getting worse (and is currently).

So, again, I know you want to keep your fiefdom to yourself with a planet full of human and non-human slaves, but I don't.

>>10541218
All I'm saying is that you better have a backup plan for when/if there's no answer.

>>10541206
I'm inclined to agree, we're better at responding than we are at planning ahead, and this may be how intelligence tends to emerge (and ultimately vanish) on life-bearing planets.
Problem is that we're causing too many, too severe problems too fast for us to be able to respond in time. This is likely how the great filter goes:
1) Intelligence emerges
2) Intelligence learns to modify environment:
Age of discovery, age of technology, age of wonders, age of extreme population growth
3) Massively inflated population sustained through environmentally damaging technologies/land use causes mass extinction and collapse (age of consequences)

>>10541496
>All I'm saying is that you better have a backup plan for when/if there's no answer.
Die in an apocalypse of human design? I don't think you realize that's why I've made the thread. I already have.

>>10541369
>It's a complete unknown.
Correct. We just have to decide if we're in a dire enough situation to take such a shot in the dark.

>>10541509
>Die in an apocalypse of human design?
More like figure out a way to survive it. I realize this may be a long-shot, but then again, so is your solution.

>>10541530
My solution is actually less of a longshot. You have no idea how bad things are about to get on this planet.

>>10541542
>something something all one basket
Why not try every possible avenue?

I have some idea actually of how bad it might get, there are still a lot of uncertainties about it.
Can you give a quick rundown of your conclusions on the matter?

>>10541491
>Life is already intolerable for most humans
Then why do so few people kill themselves?

>The Earth is already in the midst of a mass extinction event caused by 1 species
As I pointed out in your other thread, the Holocene extinction has been going on for almost 12000 years, so you really can't blame the industrial revolution, or our current population.
Sure, more isn't better, but it looks like even wiping out 99.99% of the human race and abolishing all post neolithic technology wouldn't prevent what's happening.
You could be a little less preachy about it, though.

>>10541491
>, I know you want to keep your fiefdom to yourself with a planet full of human and non-human slaves,
Still fighting strawmen, I see.

>>10541579
>As I pointed out in your other thread, the Holocene extinction has been going on for almost 12000 years

This isn't the same thing. There have been MASSIVE declines of insects, birds, reptiles, amphibians and mammals over the last half century.
https://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.pone.0185809

>>10541496
>3) Massively inflated population sustained through environmentally damaging technologies/land use causes mass extinction and collapse (age of consequences)
But would mass extinction and collapse wipe out the intelligent species?
The huge amount of people, the amount we're spread out, and the diversity of people make it seem unlikely that a collapse would kill off the entire species.

>>10538697
>And for anyone trying to pull that "space is a night full of robbers" bullshit, it can't be worse than what humans are already fucking doing to this world and themselves.
When we get swallowed alive by dyson swarms from deep space I'll find comfort in the fact you were wrong.

>>10541510
>We just have to decide if we're in a dire enough situation to take such a shot in the dark.
STILL missing the point.
How can you do a risk analysis without any data?
How bad is bad enough to risk summoning someone that might deliberately destroy the entire biosphere when "might" is a completely unknown percentage?

>>10541573
>Why not try every possible avenue?
They've already been exhausted. Hence this.

>Can you give a quick rundown of your conclusions on the matter?
Just imagine all of the current problems getting worse. Nobody is even serious about solving them because anyone with power has a vested interest in not doing so.

>>10541579
>Then why do so few people kill themselves?
You do realize so many people in America specifically are committing suicide that it's causing the average life expectancy of the country to drop. How are you so uninformed when you think you're so smart?

Who said anything about the industrial revolution?

>wouldn't prevent what's happening
You can't prevent what's already happened. I like your "Let's just do nothing because that's the most convenient for me" idea though. Let's flesh that out. Or better yet, not and you can go fuck yourself in the ass with a broom handle.

>>10541591
He doesn't care. That's the point.

>>10541597
Tell it to the millions of animals killed daily for your pleasure. I don't care about you any more than you care about them. Death isn't real unless it's you, right?

>>10541605
Because we DO have data. We can see what humans are doing.

>>10541591
Still part of a mass extinction that began in the early neolithic.
And the point is that even sending us back to a stone age with world populations in the thousands isn't going to stop the sixth mass extinction the Earth has survived.

>>10541626
>I don't care about you any more than you care about them. Death isn't real unless it's you, right?
What are you even trying to argue here?

>>10541542
I admire your ability to make huge sweeping general statements with absolute conviction.

>>10541633
Oh it would certainly stop it. It just wouldn't undo all the damage already done.

>>10541496
>Problem is that we're causing too many, too severe problems too fast for us to be able to respond in time.

An interesting assertion, I tend to disagree -- the major threats I see looming at this point all seem capable of solution, when we get to the point that we have to.

>>10538697
>/sci/ bands together and contacts alien life
>Get in contact with an alien Jeffrey Dahmer.
C-c-cant be worse than ocean acidification.

>>10541654
>C-c-cant be worse than ocean acidification
How would it be? I mean honestly.

>>10541626
>Because we DO have data. We can see what humans are doing.

Let's play "Who can think of the biggest number." You go first.

In case you missed it, my point in joking with you there was that you are claiming the one number you think you can estimate (the likelihood we'll fuck ourselves over terminally) is very high, so we are justified in taking the chance of something else, the likelihood that your action would see us fucked over faster, more thoroughly, etc.

But you have zero data to estimate the second number. "The first number is high" says nothing about the magnitude of the other.

>>10541660
Aliens have a compulsion to acidify oceans on all worlds they come to, plus they enjoy buttfucking the natives with steak knives using salt and alcohol for lube.

That would be one scenario worse than just ocean acidification.

>>10541675
>I'm bleeding heavily and I'm about to be eaten by a shark
>Better not call for help because something worse might happen
Here's a question: which of your family members betrayed you by telling you you were smart?

>>10541626
>Just imagine all of the current problems getting worse.
Many of our current issues aren't getting worse.
In industrialized countries in particular, populations are declining (or only growing through immigration) and per capita energy use is declining.
Assuming modern techno lifestyle hegemony continues, you can't claim all current problems will get worse.

>so many people in America specifically are committing suicide
The U.S. is at a half-century high, sure. But that's not the same as "Life is already intolerable for most humans".
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moving_the_goalposts
...and world rates are dropping:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_suicide_rate
>reported global rate of 10.7 per 100,000 population in 2015 (was 11.6 in 2008).
0.0107% is a LOT less than "most humans".

>"Let's just do nothing because that's the most convenient for me"
STILL fighting strawmen. I'm not saying people should just sit on their hands. I'm just saying you're overstating the case, and resorting to hyperbole. Oh, and that sending out a radio SOS to potential aliens that _might_ do more good than harm isn't a practical solution.

>Because we DO have data. We can see what humans are doing.
Do you even read the posts you're responding to?

>you can go fuck yourself in the ass with a broom handle.
Ooh-la-la! What happens next, daddy? Tell me more!

>>10541647
>Oh it would certainly stop it.
No, it wouldn't.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holocene_extinction
This has been going on since the early neolithic.

>>10541722
Steven Pinker rapes children.

>>10541730
So your claim is that by removing the main causal factor behind a mass extinction event, it won't stop?

>>10541739
?????
This is my last post in this thread.
But just to help you out, I'll state the obvious:
The "main causal factor" of the Holocene appears humans, EVEN AT THE BEGINNING OF THE NEOLITHIC PERIOD.
Which you would know if you had the slightest interest in reading either what I posted, OR the Wikipedia article I linked.

>>10541739
You may have missed >>10541730's concept that the mass extinction has been going on since before we were a factor, and so we are not the sole cause of it, hence removing us would not end it.

If you disagree with that position, make your case.

Or just keep making assertions as strongly as you can, in hopes that your sheer force of moral will can change a lot of minds.

>>10541771
>the Holocene *extinction

>>10541702
>calls for help
>there is possibility that a sadistic rape shark shows up

Overall a dumb analogy.

>>10541771
>The "main causal factor" of the Holocene appears humans, EVEN AT THE BEGINNING OF THE NEOLITHIC PERIOD.
Yeah no shit. Boy you absolutely love to waste your own and everyone else's time, don't you? You're the one who started this idiotic line of argumentation here: >>10541633
> sending us back to a stone age with world populations in the thousands isn't going to stop the sixth mass extinction
Which is obviously wrong.

>>10541778
Are you under the impression that humans have existed for less than 12k years??? No matter what you believe about what happened in the early Holocene, NOBODY denies that humans are causing a mass extinction event RIGHT FUCKING NOW so this entire exercise is just a massive red herring. Damn you're stupid, boy.

>>10541783
The sadistic rape shark is you, retard.

>>10541633
>More than 75 percent decline over 27 years in total flying insect biomass in protected areas
>27 years


>Still part of a mass extinction that began in the early neolithic.

Yeah, this is different.

>>10541626
>They've already been exhausted. Hence this.
I'm not talking about saving civilization. I'm talking about saving yourself and your family by becoming self-sufficient in such a way that you can survive the collapse.

>>10541605
What in the world are you talking about? We have plenty of data showing that we're on an extremely unsustainable path.

>>10541821
>I'm not talking about saving civilization. I'm talking about saving yourself and your family by becoming self-sufficient in such a way that you can survive the collapse.
Yeah I'll just get right on becoming rich. Everyone is fucking poor now, anon. Who the fuck can buy property??

>>10541818
>> sending us back to a stone age with world populations in the thousands isn't going to stop the sixth mass extinction
>Which is obviously wrong.
OK, I said that was my last post, but I've really got to know why you think this is "obviously wrong".
OK, I googled "early neolithic populations" and found out humans may have numbered in the millions, not thousands.
Aside from that though, what am I not making clear?
The current mass extinction has been happening since the early neolithic.
My claim is that even winding back the clock to the early days of the Holocene extinction won't stop it.
What am I missing here?

>love to waste your own and everyone else's time
You're here advocating for humanity to build interstellar radio transmitters on the off chance some (hopefully capable and benevolent) alien race will step in to stop us from what we've been doing for 12,000 years.
...but sure, _I'm_ wasting people's time.

>>10541871
>What am I missing here?
You're missing the fact that it's still happening, retard. Must be nice to be rich and pretend there are no problems.

>>10541831
>buy property
Maybe if you can find others who understand the situation, you can buy a property together? You'll want something outside of a major population center anyways (where land is cheaper).
But it's just as much about developing the knowledge and skill you need to survive. This, at a minimum means to learn to grow your own food, collect and purify water and how to run a very basic (probably solar) personal use power grid.
Of course the requirements will vary depending on just how bad things get in the world.

>>10541904
There is no such thing as cheap land anymore. This is a boomer and rich asshole meme that refuses to die. The only place with cheap land is like the middle of Alaska or Arizona where there are literally no access to utilities and very few resources - basically places people don't live for a good reason.

>>10541898
>You're missing the fact that it's still happening, retard.
I never said it wasn't.
I AM claiming that even though it's gotten steadily worse over the last 12,000 years, you can't fix the problem by having humans go back to the stone age, because it was a problem even then.

>>10541898
>Must be nice to be rich

>>10541818
No, the sadistic rape shark is the alien(s) that show up when you broadcast your location

>>10541932
>I never said it wasn't.
Actually, you've pretty much spent the last hour claiming it wasn't. Are all leftists this fucking dumb? How is socialism supposed to win when you're literally dumber than fucking /pol/?

>>10541940
>implying you're not
Your brocialist horseshit is fooling exactly nobody.

>>10541949
No, it's not. I know because I'm the one who made the analogy. Jesus christ the arrogance of you fucking pigs. Stop spending all day raiding 4chan and get a fucking job.

>>10541918
The main reason that land is so expensive is because of real estate speculation (more so than due to population growth). We're quite likely to see another crash in the not too distant future.

If you can't find suitable land that you (or you plus a group of like-minded individuals) can afford, then you can still spend your time acquiring the required skills and knowledge (setting up a small solar powered hydroponics system would in your apartment would be one example).

>>10541972
Yeah, and when we do, the rich will buy it all up and consolidate their wealth and power, like they do every crash.

>>10541932
It's not gotten steadily worse over the past 12k years, it's gotten exponentially, MASSIVELY worse over the last 50-100 years.
That's the point you're not seeming to grasp. We had a few tens of millions of people causing extinctions here and there, now we have 7.evermore billion + modern pollution and technology very rapidly (decades vs thousands of years) annihilating everything.

>>10541985
Correct. So do what the rich do, but on a smaller scale: get out of dept. Save and don't spend money on stuff you don't need. Wait for the opportunity and then buy.
You don't need much either. A couple of acres of fertile soil (ideally soil that hasn't seen intensive agriculture) that's off the main roads will feed a family.

>>10542004
>Save and don't spend money on stuff you don't need
Did you just give the fucking avocados talk? Real life doesn't work that way.

>>10541960
What? In your analogy you called out for help into an unknown ocean. I added that your call for help attracted a much worse creature. How do you not get that?

>>10541955
>Actually, you've pretty much spent the last hour claiming it wasn't.
Here are my posts, perhaps you're mistaking me for someone else?
>>10541369
>>10541400
>>10541428
>>10541457
>>10541579
>>10541585
>>10541592
>>10541605
>>10541633
>>10541722
>>10541730
>>10541771
>>10541871
>>10541932
>>10541940


>>10541955
>. Are all leftists this fucking dumb? How is socialism supposed to win
https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/non%20sequitur

>>10542010
>Real life doesn't work that way.
Point it that you need to find a way to make it work if you're to have any chance.
If you learn the required skills and manage to get the right equipment etc, you won't need to buy land anyways, since there won't be a government there to enforce property rights.

>>10542016
No moron, in my example a shark attack is already occurring. You're calling out for help FROM it. Try actually reading what you're pretending to reply to BEFORE you reply to it.

>>10541994
>That's the point you're not seeming to grasp.
I grasp it FINE. You're the one missing my point.
Sure, YOU might be comfortable with the first 11,000 years of the current mass extinction event, but if you want to actually solve the problem, we need something better than "muh good old days".

>>10542033
>, in my example a shark attack is already occurring.
Not him, but: the first shark is the current environmental disaster, the _second_ shark is the aliens showing up.
I'm not taking his side on all aspects of this, I haven't been following your part of the thread all that close.

>>10542042
He doesn't care because it doesn't affect him. Daddy's wealth has insulated him from the thing people in the real world call "consequences" and he's turned to champagne socialism to convince himself he has a conscience. He doesn't.

>>10542033
The first reply nailed it. You’re being attacked by a normal shark, and calling out for help brings the turbo rape shark

>>10542042
There probably isn't a timely solution anon.

>>10542055
kek even if that was true, it's not like wealth is really going to save anyone. Well, maybe the ultra-rich can survive another decade or two in their New Zealand bunkers.

If you know a disaster is coming and everyone around you tells you to piss off when you bring it up, that means you're the only one who can save yourself. This contacting aliens idea is great and all, but you don't know that any help will come. You could still have a decade or two to prepare (or even more), so why not at least try to figure it out?

>>10542091
Possibly, but the shark that's already here is killing you now.

>>10542103
It is true, and you know it you fucking faggot. Now fuck off.

>>10542108
If you're going to get all pissy like a spoiled little girl who's daddy didn't but her a Ferrari for her sweet 16 the moment someone tells you that you probably need to actually WORK to ensure your own survival.. well, I guess aliens really are your only hope after all.

>>10542108
>ayyliums pls save me :^(
fucking killyourself retard.

>>10538697
Time travel exists.

Deal with that reality before summoning ayys.

>>10542103
>You could still have a decade or two to prepare (or even more)
Probably considerably more.
Sure, the 10-20 years is crucial in terms of how much damage we do to the Earth, but actual threats to human society are probably much further out.

This is a very serious issue, but statements like these are just foolish:
>>10542103
>the ultra-rich can survive another decade or two in their New Zealand bunkers.
>>10542108
>the shark that's already here is killing you now.
>>10542027
>there won't be a government there to enforce property rights.

Unless there's a nuclear war, I doubt we're looking at a Mad-Max scenario in the next few decades.

>>10542144
>Time travel exists.
This is a brainlet containment thread.
Time doesn't real.
Gravity doesn't real.
Free will is a question of facts, not philosophy, theology and semantics.
The universe is a simulation.
The Earth is flat, but we're too dumb to notice because of the chemtrails.

>>10542195
Well, it's pretty hard to say how much time we have and what it's all going to look like. There's a decent change of a fairly rapid food-supply collapse, which could lead to mad maxish scenario (we could see very rapid methane out-gassing for instance from permafrost and the shallow arctic self).
In any case, it would be wise to at least learn the skills you'd need to grow your own food, considering that grocery stores are stocked on a "just in time" basis.

>>10538697
>waiting for ayys to solve are problems for us

>>10542558
Absolute low t. beta mentality

>>10538697
What's with this obsession over universal genocide?

>>10538697
Perhaps instead of investing lts of time, capital, resources, energy and people into this we instead put use it to solve our problems.

there may not be anyone out there to hear our cries for help, if their is they may not hear us, if they hear us, they might not understand, or be able to help (afterall space is huge, evn if they could reach us, chances are we will be long gone, or have solved our issues before they arrive), if by some miracle there is life out there, and it is more technologically advanced and they can reach us quickly and are capable of saving us, (and these are all huge ifs!) whos t say that they even would want too, such an advanced civilisation would likely see us as unworthy of the time and effort to help, we may be one of many struggling civilisations and are just too insignificant.

plus we are an highly adaptive species, excellent at problem solving and relatively good at working together when it is truly necessary. wouldnt aliens coming and solving all our problems stunt our growth as a species? wouldn't it take away our drive to improve ourselves and to learn from past mistakes?

>>10538697
>Humans construct powerful radio array
>They send out a call for help using array
>Hundreds of years later, radio beam grazes an alien world
>Aliens freak out because the beam could've been made powerful enough to kill them
>They send their own beam in return
>Hundreds of years later, the alien beam hits the Earth
>Oceans boil, ozone stripped, continents burn
>Everyone dies