/sci/ - Science & Math

>>10512898
When there are no more white males. It's just one of many strategies to reduce western birthrates.

>>10512898
how big is the one on the left's dick?

I hate how traps all have massive dicks - way bigger than mine. Fuck this world. It cant be real.

>>10512898
It has to start first

>>10512898
Hopefully soon, once we've torn down the images of gender fed to us by the media.

>>10512898
it won't and its only further progressing. My prediction is the technology for these things will continue to advance but the public image of it wont be so popular as it is now. Trans is a very niche thing that is just a really popular facade for the left right now soon it won't be as prevalent and vast. It will still be around just not as popular as it is now, we just have to get use to it

Ignore it. Otherwise you'll go mad. You can't argue with them as they disregard logic and define term whichever way they like.

Never argue with an idiot

>>10512898
it won't, gender IS a social construct, now if you're talking about how people are being absolutely retarded about it then hopefully soon. I personally don't like the idea of having mixed sexes in a bathroom with kids

Op we are running head first into the Cyber punk era. You haven't seen nothing yet.

>>10512898
When you find the genes for wearing pants instead of skirts present your findings until then fuck off.

>>10512917
>gender IS a social construct
Yes, just like my drugs I take.

>>10512937
>Yes, just like my drugs I take.
what does that even mean? and if you are saying is is not a social construct then you literally do not know what gender is. This isn't up for debate, gender is masculine and feminine while sex is male and female. how bout you take a sociology course before talkin shit. should have been required for a bachelor's

>>10512941
>what does that even mean?
It's like saying sexual hormones doesn't change behaviors. Geez, learn bio medicine and biology.

>how bout you take a sociology course before talkin shit.
How about you learn about cultures and their evolution.

>>10512898
After the society collapses

>>10512959
nigga, it seems you still don't know shit. gender is not defined specifically by behavior but by how the community perceives that behavior.
>How about you learn about cultures and their evolution.
I'm going to tell You to do that, since you don't get that is some cultures can have different definitions on what is considered masculine and feminine. While evolution is has to do with the biological difference known as, SEX

>>10512959
cringe, stop typing

>>10513002
>>10513003

>>10512916
>Never argue with an idiot
Well I gonna take that advice.

>>10512917
Some things have a constructed gender. Romance languages assign everything a gender. There’s nothing feminine about una vela. But sex being different from gender is some bullshit invented by cultural studies pigs in the last few decades and it’s stated by people like you as if it’s an iron law of nature known since antiquity.

People on /sci/ and /pol/ wilil always yell that gender is just what sexes are naturally inclined to do. For instance, more females are inclined to cook than males, therefore cooking is a female trait. This seems like a good start, but then when I ask what use does the color blue have for males, I don't get an answer. Certainly if all gendered topics like trucks, fires, cars, etc are based on sex, then why did the color blue only recently be switched for males?

I just want an answer. Does the color blue have anything to do with my penis? No? then some aspects of society MUST be taught, and therefore saying gender is sex is not accurate.

>>10513684
gender doesn't exist retard. social norms are just that, social norms. a man who dresses in pink is simply a man dressing in pink.
now stop listening to senile /pol/ boomers.

>>10513684

brain wiring, you dipshit.

>>10512898
It'll end when when every single one of those freaks is dangling from a tree. Leave a like if you agree and don't forget to hit that subscribe button!

>>10513711
please stop you are ruining my immersion, i am not okay with this like and upvote system

>>10513711
>>10513721
samefag

>>10513726
For someone who browses the science board you're not very smart.

>>10513684
>>10513704
https://www.newscientist.com/article/dn13596-male-monkeys-prefer-boys-toys/
While there are some social norms that are arbitrary, i believe gender and gender role are natural, and society just amplifies the natural tendencies we have towards male and female.

A society that dedicates itself to pandering to weakness and mental illness is unable to defend itself from outsiders. Islam will roll through the western world, cleansing it of all this gender bending nonsense, while taking out all non religious institutions in the process.

ITT: retards not understanding technological progress has made gender roles obsolet

>>10512898
When reddit dies

>>10512898
Its a political tool, it will stop when its no longer useful or politically useful to stop it.

>>10512898
Never

>>10512902
Hopefully artificial wombs will be advanced enough soon so that they can be used for reproduction instead of females.

>>10513918
Humans will fuck for fun instead of making babies. You'll still be able to make them the old fashioned way as well.

>>10512898
It's not. It's just going to keep progressing until it becomes as normal as black people voting. Doesn't matter anyways since trans are such a small minority. If right-wingers actually put as much effort into things that actually matter as they do trying to oppress trans people that could probably make substantial gains against the left.

>>10512917
Yeah, lets focus on trans which are basically a non-threat and ignore the real threat which are homosexuals of the same sex. Sometimes I wonder if all the outrage about trans using public bathrooms is actually from homosexual pedophiles.

>>10512898
Gender is a social construct though, like political identity.

>>10512902
Reduction in Western birthrates happened before the social construct bullshit, the source is further upstream

You know what I'm going to progressively give examples and then ask you when you would consider someone female

>A person with XY chromosomes that identifies as a heterosexual male
I'd say almost everyone considers this to be a man even the most extreme "gender neutral" proponent
>A person with XY chromosomes that identifies as a heterosexual male but has long hair, a feminine face and wears female dresses and make up for fetish reasons
The majority of people would still consider this a man
>A person with XY chromosomes that took female hormones, bone reconstruction surgery, fat injections and sex organ reconstruction surgery that identifies as female
I'd say 60% of people would still consider this to be a man
>A person born with XY chromosomes but due to very advanced nanotechnology has every Y chromosome replaced with an X chromosome so that all cells are reconstructed to be XX producing a fertile female body
I think almost everyone would consider this a woman.

This shows me that it's not prejudice or hate that causes people to reject this "gender" stuff but instead the limitations of our current technology. It needs to function like a female on a biological level before people will consider it to be a female and the origins of that person is not really relevant to most people.

I don't think transgenders exist yet. Instead they are mutilated people claiming to be another gender which they aren't (yet). Once we have the technology to completely reconstruct someone into the gender they want to be on a genetic level is when we can consider transgenders to be real.

>>10512898
What do you even mean? Gender will probably never go away as a concept. It’s not like we’ll just wake up one day and all feel androgynous.

>>10514024
Gender is not genetics nor is it anatomical. You’ve lost before you left the gate.

>>10514031
I actually disagree with you. Once people will mind-upload themselves into a giant computer farm I think over time the notion of gender will fade as it will not be relevant anymore. Instead we'll all just become "intelligences"

Some people are trans-gender
I am trans-humanist. As I don't identify as a fucking smelly ape and only identify as the software running on this shitty biological computer.

>>10514033
everything with a Y chromosome is a male
XY=male
XX=female
XXX=female
XXXX=female
XXY=male
XXXY=male
XYY=male

Everything with an Y chromosome grows a penis and testicles and produces sperm of varying fertility. Everything without an Y chromosome doesn't produce sperm.

>>10514061
I think that we’d continue to identify with certain archetypes of what’s “feminine” or “masculine” even then, only with much more freedom and fluidity.

>>10514064
“everything with a Y chromosome is a male”

Nope. Women with Swyer syndrome are women.
I’d like to note that the XX/XY sex determination system is only one of many amongst life. Some mammals do not use it.

“Everything with an Y chromosome grows a penis and testicles and produces sperm of varying fertility”

Wrong. Women with Swyer syndrome do not have penises, sperm, or testicles. They have a vagina and uterus.

“Everything without an Y chromosome doesn't produce sperm.”

Birds have ZW (female) or ZZ (male) chromosomes, and the males definitely produce sperm, so, uh, no.

Why do you obsess over literally the gayest of shit? Who cares?

>>10514064
Also, you are, again, conflating gender with genetics and anatomy. Karyotype is literally irrelevant.

>gender is a social construct
Nos this shit again...
You're either male or female when you're born, that's it. Anything else are just sick fetishes.
And no, outliers doesn't change this fact.

>>10514090
“You're either male or female when you're born, that's it.”

Lol. http://www.isna.org/faq/conditions

“Anything else are just sick fetishes. ”

Prove it.

“And no, outliers doesn't change this fact.”

By definition, they do. An outlier existing at all disproves your claim that “you’re either male or female when you’re born.” Making bare assertions is really sad. :-)

>>10514090
So would you rather have a hyper fem faggot guy than a trans woman?
Is that somehow better?
Wouldn't that make men look worst?

You know what makes me absolute mad about this it's because they have the right idea but come to the insanely wrong conclusion.

>I am not my body I'm only my brain so I don't necessarily have to identify with my body just like I don't have to identify with my car when I am driving it since I'm only my brain that controls my body anyway
This is correct and actually rational but then it develops to
>So let me conform to the body standards of something else by wearing makeup, dresses and doing all kinds of bullshit that has nothing to do with my earlier statement of not identifying with my body
This is what drives me crazy. I get the not identifying with your body part as it's technically not even you but just a "mech" your brain occupies. But then turning around and putting on makeup and dresses is what confuses the fuck out of me.

Can someone explain this retarded shit to me? Shouldn't freedom from the body mean you shouldn't give a shit either way and just focus on intellectual pursuits while neglecting your physical body or something?

>>10514105
“Can someone explain this retarded shit to me? Shouldn't freedom from the body mean you shouldn't give a shit either way and just focus on intellectual pursuits while neglecting your physical body or something?”

Attempting to conform with the norms of your chosen gender is literally the only way to get a “Hello, Mam” instead of a “Hello, sir”.

>>10514112
Why do you want the "hello, mam"?

>>10512898
Never, if I want to identify my gender as a 14 year old anime girl, then it's my legal right. There's nothing wrong with feeling like an anime girl on the inside, while having an alternative biological identity on the outside which may, or may not match the identity of a 14 year old anime girl. The problem is that the human race has an inability to become contrasting identities in mental duality. If you can't be a burly, muscular man, while at the same time being a 14 year old girl, then you're quite a mentally weak faggot

>>10513923
Perhaps they will make bionic anus that would not be susceprible to the many accidents that can happen during gaysex and with extra nerve ending for more pleasure on the recieving side, perhaps even array of subintestinal clitorises. Or at least extra sphincter deep in the bowel so your dick won’t run into turd ever again

I don't understand gender identity.

Why not just fuck whatever you find attractive and leave it at that. You're an individual labels don't matter. Do whatever you want to do but don't expect other third party people to identify with your choices just like every other thing in life.

This obsession with labels is absolutely insane. If anything we should try to break that mold and just look at people on an individual case-by-case basis.

Transgenders go wrong the moment they expect unrelated people to conform to their personal wishes.

>>10514138
Some people would prefer feminine pronouns to masculine ones, as befits their gender identity.

>>10512898
>Can somebody tell me when this gender social construct bullshit will end?
When you stop constantly fixating on it, moron.

>>10514179
Why identify with gender at all? You already established that it's a useless social construct, why abide by it instead of just shedding it in its entirety?

>>10514105
>You know what makes me absolute mad about this it's because they have the right idea but come to the insanely wrong conclusion.

It seems false assumptions have led you to the wrong conclusion.

>But then turning around and putting on makeup and dresses is what confuses the fuck out of me.

They do that for same reason females do.

>Shouldn't freedom from the body mean you shouldn't give a shit either way and just focus on intellectual pursuits while neglecting your physical body or something?

No, they're not free of their body. It's the opposite. They're trapped in the wrong type. It's like a cat brain in a dog body.

>>10514174
>Transgenders go wrong the moment they expect unrelated people to conform to their personal wishes.

But non-trans expect unrelated people to identify them as their prefered gender so we shouldn't exclude trans from the same expectation.

>>10514186
It's not a useless social construct though. It's useful in a similar way political identity is.

>>10514186
The fact that it is not based on genetics does not mean it is useless, anon. Your identity, history and entire self of being is a social construct, but I would not discout its usefulness so lightly.

>>10514174
>Transgenders go wrong the moment they expect unrelated people to conform to their personal wishes.
It's a question of identity. We are someone if and only if both ourselves and society recognize us as something. And more often than not, it is the social that has the power rather than the individual side: I can call myself a physician only under specific circumstances, recognized by society as valid enough for me to be a physician. If I call myself a physician while lacking in said characteristics, I would be laughed at if not arrested.

This is of course not to say that identity is a highly personal issue, but we go to immense lengths only to "acquire" what it takes to be recognized as someone, be it extensive surgery or years spent studying. If this is such a common phenomenon we can only conclude that it imperative for a person to be recognized socially. The whole point of having an identity is to offer the other (intended as another participant of the same society) a hook to know how to behave around me (and they do the same for me). Identity is worthless if it is not recognized and accepted and so being guidance for the actions of others for or against ourselves. To say that "I refuse to call you miss or sir" means that you are denying that person their agency in self-determining their own identity. You are rejecting their effort, their introspection, their self.

The same can happen the opposite way, society labelling you with an identity that you do not find yours, and it is something we dwellers of this icelandic tea blending forum are familiar with, with the whole "you're a fascist!" craze. And it is equally disempowering (and gives ammo to /pol/ which is a bad thing under any circumstance).

>>10512903
I'm with you man, i hate it

>>10514254
>But non-trans expect unrelated people to identify them as their prefered gender so we shouldn't exclude trans from the same expectation.

it's the other way around. non-trans people should also not expect to be identified by their preferred gender.

Once we stop letting women participate in politics and social sciences again

>>10514262
Political identity is also useless.

>>10513737
Your link doesn't prove anything.
most of the differences between perceived gender can be explained by the fact that we are a sexually dimorphic species. how we see the world obviously affects how we interact with it, our tastes and preferences, and everything else.

>>10512902
If you think so...

Like when you talk like this I have feeling I will be last white male, because I'm not going to commit suicide because nigger fucked your wife.

>>10514484
No one cares about the continued existence of “white males”.

>>10512898
The gender social construct is just another form of the "poor rich" paradigm that humans have NEVER ended. It's a product of pure materialism so as long as such humans exist then the cycle will continue. Retards will always believe they were "deprived" of something they never had, obviously because they want "more". It's only a question of "wants" rather than "needs".

>>10512902
Who do you think is getting the majority of transition surgeries?

>>10512917
>it won't, gender IS a social construct, now if you're talking about how people are being absolutely retarded about it then hopefully soon.
This is a redundant statement. The recognition of "genders" is inherently retarded from the standpoint that we're all human beings. Humans only have the illusion of a duality that we've dubbed "male" and "female" but it's not an actual duality of "human". Basically as long as we keep referring to ourselves as a "particularized" human based on such illogical reasons then that's what we'll be.

>>10512941
And both are "human".

>>10513770
>Retard who believes you can make something that has no basis in reality "obsolete"

>>10514096
>groupthink that agrees with me
Nice

>Prove it.
Prove that a human needs to change sex in order to be self-sufficient. If it takes away the self-sufficiency of the human then I would wager to say that it's pretty "degenerate" to the human.

>By definition, they do. An outlier existing at all disproves your claim that “you’re either male or female when you’re born.” Making bare assertions is really sad. :-)
All this proves is that gender/sex doesn't matter. So why would you overcomplicate/destroy what is not flawed? If you're a "human" that's what you are. Focusing on the duality drives you further from that.

>>10514105
Yes
>Can someone explain this retarded shit to me?
Materialism. "I want", "I don't have", "I was deprived of something I was absent of" type of "thinking". Jealousy too.

Please keep this shit to /pol/ if you're unable to distinguish between gender and sex. Gender is like personality. It's your fucking act. It's made up behaviour to fit a social standard of sexual acting. While sex is not something you can just act up. Logically speaking, if personality doesn't end, gender won't either. It's such a fucking drag at all times. This goes on and on and on. It's like hearing your wife argue. Nobody cares about "THE PLAY" IRL. It's all egoic bs that serves no purpose, but to keep you dopaminated. Now now, don't get upset. If you're deep into your act, there is still a solution, but it hurts. It can be like Loki's mask, a psychotic obsession about your act. This is what our society is experiencing firsthand. Most people cannot think logically so they will never understand that their programming is just programming and not something mandatory for anyone to follow. Best way to get rid of an act is to produce dissociative shows for people to watch. Literal programming to get rid of identity, which would bring forward a societal idenity crisis. That would be tragic. Is this something that we want? Yes, of course. If we were so anal in programming culture for 99% of people then we must be anal in deprogramming them for the greater good. Why is it that people are so confident in their identity? It's as if they religiously created an identity to fit in as to not experience a void. I guess some people just need a hole to be filled at all times.

>>10512959
Imagine being so stupid you try and debate the definition of a word
>https://en.oxforddictionaries.com/definition/gender
"Either of the two sexes (male and female), especially when considered with reference to social and cultural differences rather than biological ones."

>>10514757
Personality doesn't even exist. Maybe I'm autistic as fuck but I don't put up an "act" when going outside or speaking to other people. I legitimately tell whatever the fuck I want and I wear whatever the fuck I want to wear.

Gender shouldn't be a thing just like personality isn't a real thing. It's purely genetic behavior and a "personality" can be seen within newborn babies before they become self-aware. Gender and sex are a single thing because they are both determined by genetics.

People acting like another gender than they really are are just people using social engineering to what they think is a smart move.

>>10514024
What you described would be a true transexual not transgender, gender is used specifically with regards to cultural and social discussions. Therefore if it is the cultural norm for women to wear dresses and makeup and a man chooses to as well he is, in some capacity, transgender.

>>10514769
>I legitimately tell whatever the fuck I want and I wear whatever the fuck I want to wear.
That's literally what personality is, brainlet.

>>10514769
Genetics are code for your body to grow and manage its upkeep. They do in no way generate non-verbal or verbal language or determine which role you decide to appropriate. If everything was instinctual we wouldn't be thinking. Some cultures still practice gender-specific rites of passage. Now this is just begging the question: is gender conditioned socially? I believe you can answer that. Now, you may be mistaking genetics for neural conditioning. While genes are the patent, conditioning still happens and shapes patterns within the patent. Personality exists in that way. If you grow in an environment that allows you to develop a certain trait, you are going to have that trait. Read some neuroscience.

>durr hurr b-but gender means whatever we feel like

If "gender" is everything, subjectively speaking, then it is nothing. It is a chaotic, meaningless term. It's original usage was directly coupled with sex and an extension of your sexual biology, semantics do matter because the new usage means nothing at all.

So congratulations, you co-opted a whole term. But no one gives a fuck because we still know it's just a cover for your mass delusion and degeneracy.

>>10514815

>>10512898
The emasculation of males is a calculated move to curb any threats to the current global socioeconomic and political system.

>But when Cyrus had marched away from Sardis, Pactyas caused the Lydians to revolt from Tabalos and from Cyrus. ...So he marched on Sardis and besieged Tabalos, having shut himself up in the citadel. 155. Hearing this on his way, Cyrus said to Crœsus as follows: “Crœsus, what end shall I find of these things which are coming to pass? The Lydians will not cease as it seems, from giving trouble to me and from having it themselves. I doubt me if it were not best[157] to sell them all as slaves; for as it is, I see that I have done in like manner as if one should slay the father and then spare his sons: just so I took prisoner and am carrying away thee, who wert much more than the father of the Lydians, while to the Lydians themselves I delivered up their city; and can I feel surprise after this that they have revolted from me?”... Crœsus answered him as follows, fearing lest he should destroy Sardis: “O king, that which thou hast said is not without reason; but do not thou altogether give vent to thy wrath, nor destroy an ancient city which is guiltless both of the former things and also of those which have come to pass now: for as to the former things it was I who did them and I bear the consequences heaped upon my head;[158] and as for what is now being done...But the Lydians I pray thee pardon, and lay upon them commands as follows, in order that they may not revolt nor be a cause of danger to thee:–send to them and forbid them to possess weapons of war, but bid them on the other hand put on tunics under their outer garments and be shod with buskins, and proclaim to them that they train their sons to play the lyre and the harp and to be retail-dealers; and soon thou shalt see, O king, that they have become women instead of men, so that there will be no fear that they will revolt from thee.”
-Herodotus' Histories

>>10514798
>read some neuroscience
Learn basic endocrinology

>>10514815
Typical amerilard not even familiar with the concept of linguistic gender which is where English took the word from. Basically you're a fucking retard and gender has never meant sex.

>>10514987

>Duhhh duh english definition doesn't matter cuz of the origin XDDD<div class="like-perk-cnt">&#x2714;&#xFE0F;</div>

>>10515004
>classical Latin gener- , genus race, kind, also grammatical gender (see genus n.). In sense 2b either influenced by, or perhaps independently , either Anglo-Norman and Middle French gendre progeny, offspring (1265 in Old French; gendrer gender v.1) or gender v.1 Compare Old Occitan gendre (1350), Catalan gènere (13th cent. as †genre ), Spanish género (a1400), Portuguese gênero (15th cent.), Italian genere (end of the 12th cent.). Compare later genre n.
The English use in sense 1 follows the Latin use of genus , which in its turn is a rendering of the equivalent ancient Greek γένος genus n. The formulation of the three grammatical genders (τὰ γένη τῶν ὀνομάτων, ἄρρενα kαὶ θήλεα kαὶ σkεύη ) is ascribed by Aristotle ( Rhetorica 3. 5) to Protagoras.

Hard to believe people have been using the same word to describe the same thing for almost 1000 years, sorry you got confused and mixed up some basic dictionary definitions.

>>10515024

http://webstersdictionary1828.com/Dictionary/gender

The usage you are using has nothing to do with its association with humans. It's pretty clear that a boat isn't a fucking person with gonads and a brain. Talk about grasping at straws. Then again, you are mentally ill so I could see why you'd make an utterly incoherent argument.

>>10514298
Bingo

>>10514298
>We are someone if and only if both ourselves and society recognize us as something.

And argument completely discarded Benji. People do not necessarily recognize what they are, and society does not always have the necessary information to define, likewise both have personal motivations which would concurrently lead to a mislabeling based upon those motivations.

Remember when people were defined by what they could do? Everyone's last name was a form of employment or trade. If you weren't useful and productive no one gave a fuck what you were rambling about... loons were loons and beggars were beggars. Now these people force you to give them attention for their delusions and insanity and your utility to society is completely overlooked. We are truly in the decay stage.

>>10514441
O know that for pathetic postmodernists like you everything is useless, yet we can't live by this idea.

It ends when we make them dead.

this thread is<div class="like-perk-cnt">&#x1F4AF;</div>

>Gender is a social construct, bigot!

There are reason people stopped using the definition.

>>10512898
Dumb fad for dumb 20 somethings<div class="like-perk-cnt"><img alt="" width="451" height="75" src="//s.4cdn.org/image/temp/dinosaur.gif"></div>

Trans women are women, you fucking Nazis.<div class="like-perk-cnt"><div style="text-align:right"><img alt="" width="32" height="32" src="//s.4cdn.org/image/temp/verified.png"></div></div>

>>10515064
not him, but political identity in the day-to-day is absolutely useless. Being convinced otherwise ((("""everything is political"""))) is nothing but a commie scam which suddenly makes them and their dogshit relevant in every conversation.

Also who made up the rule that pronouns refer to gender and not sex? Since gender is fluid and arbitrary and blah blah blah, you'd want the pronoun to refer to a constant (or for most intents and purposes, constant) value.

>>10512898
give it a couple of more years to enter mainstream culture and expose all their insanity
All this tranny shit is the modern day equivalent of a frontal lobotomy.

>>10515188
this<div class="like-perk-cnt"><b style="font-size: 14px">Coin Flip: Tails</b></div>

>>10512898
You need to pray harder<div class="like-perk-cnt">&#x274C;</div>

>>10512898
Once we purge the Nonbinary menace and allow for LGBT people to co-exist peacefully with the straights. The Log Cabin Republicans will prevail!

>>10512902
Literally redpilled

>>10514085
Male and female are the only genders, but gender dysphoria is a real condition. People exhibiting this condition should be institutionalized.

>>10515637
ahem
fuck niggers<div class="like-perk-cnt">&#x1F436;</div>

>>10514096
>appealing to authority
>muh exception
are you sure you are in STEM nigger faggot?

>>10514798
>Read some neuroscience.
you mean pseudoscience like psychology? HAHAHAHA read some epigenetics, pseuointellectual bufoon

>>10512941
No. Gender is and always has been just a synonym for sex. That's it. It's another word for the same thing. This is the historical reality. It is the liberal agenda that hijacked the word and started rebranding it as a social construct.

>>10512941
>how bout you take a sociology course before talkin shit
HAHAHAHAHAHAHA woman/tranny arguments everyone

Some of you will read these but ignore what is actually written or twist it to your specific view because you're irrational. 1/2 definitions from 1989

>>10512917
XX, XY. The roles have been selected for over millennia.
Mental illness is a spectrum.

2/2 definitions from 1989

I like older books, they can't be modified.<div class="like-perk-cnt">&#x1F49B;</div>

>>10516216
u know wthat the short form "GRAM" means ?
a few lines under the description is another description of the word gene and then it's says "BIOL."

do u understand what this dictionary tries to tell you?? or r u just stupid?

>>10516216
>;the quality of being of the male or female sex.

>>10516215
>Thread about gender
>Talks about biological sex

>>10516702
They are synonymous.

>>10514484
nigger fucked your wife regardless

>>10516702
Definitions of "gender" that are not equal to "biological sex" are instead equal to "fashion".

>>10515061
This is definitley the decay stage. But I'm not sure where we should go? Where can we escape this?

>>10516216
Language changes.

>>10516750
A cell thinks the body is decaying, it will breed and give another body, biologicals don't change, only machines change.

>>10516757
Elaborate. Are you saying we should fix this from the inside?

>>10516766
There's nothing to fix, you are a cell of a body, and that body is a cell of another body, only the machines are complete beings.

>>10513918
day by day we're getting closer to a brave new world scenario yaay

>>10516755
Yes, for narcists and attentionwhores they want to distinguish themself from normies and are even asking for newer pronouns like Xe, Ne or Ze.

Normies are already telling you to fuck off with this crap.

>>10516216
This explain a lot, the feminist attually hijacked the term. Conserved it please and upload more of those older books.

>>10512902
Oy vey! This is science board, not /pol/ goyim!

>>10512898
propably never
here in russia its just rising

>>10516876
>the majority is on my side!
Says every side.

How can gender be a social construct if you never choose your male or female thought process after birth hmm?

>>10516213
>>10516216
Never trust historians, only trust historiographers.

>>10516755
So does history apparently. How do you account for the fact that transgender is no longer considered a mental disorder?
>Oh well you see this book learned idiot that belonged to a low percentage of the population and had some connections and made a few changes to it
>Oh well you see these doctors can make a hell of a lot more money mutilating you improperly and then drugging you for the rest of your life,

>>10516880
>despite making up only 1.2-6.8 percent of the population...

It's so funny how such low portions of the population end up squealing the most.

>>10516916
>social
>you

doesn't matter what you think, what matters is what's popular.

>>10514757
This is embarasing

>>10512898
>People say gender when they're really referring to sex

>>10517542
So tell us, how many genders are there and who decides which ones are real and which ones are made up?

>>10512898
Before we have any sort of reasonable discussion you must first ask for my pronouns cissy.

>>10516216
Gender was another word for sexual dimorphism. Feminist ruining again, thank you.

Edgy alt-righters and edgy conservatives not understanding what it means to say "gender is a social construct"

they're not saying biology isn't real. it is a biological fact that there are two sexes, different chromosomes, different genitals, sexual dimorphism

The social constructed part is the traditions that give us archetype mental images of what "boy" and "girl" are

when you imagine "girl" you conjure up a specific mental image. imagine long hair, more decorative clothing, groomed eyebrows, a bubblier personality, but those have nothing to do with biology

when you imagine "guy" you imagine a confident person with short hair, uses the word "Bro", disciplined and serious, but those are cultural too

if a human was detached from cultural and didn't adhere to gender, they could have an culturally androgynous appearance. like, a male who likes science, doesnt like sports, wears cute sweaters, has long hair, that male doesn't look like a "bro" or "man man guy >:-)"

For a board that's ostensibly devoted to science, there are a lot of science deniers here.

>>10516213
>>10516216
>Quoting a dictionary definition to prove your point
>From 1989
lmao

>>10515896
What are you trying to say? No one is claiming that the Romans had social constructivism theory. Of course we've only been able to properly talk about this subject within the last century. Does that make it invalid?

>>10519066
Well of course, it's like the anon above said "Why don't you take a sociology course before you talk shit". The problem is that he never stopped to think about who's teaching the course, and whether or not they're an ideologue.

It'll happen when scientist grow some balls and realize just how destructive leftist ideology is, and start choking any "scientists" tainted with leftism. To take higher position and to enforce expulsion of these anti-logic people. If they aren't met aggressively, they think this gives them a carte blanche to do anything they want. Their cult goes unquestioned.

If they can deny race, and bullshit about genetics, why can they not bullshit about gender? What you gonna do about it?

>>10515896
Not really. Gender started diverging as something different from sex at least as far back as the 50's.

>>10514012
>Reduction in Western birthrates happened before the social construct bullshit, the source is further upstream
ummm no? it started JUST when hippies and leftys started

>>10512902
>no lefty screeching about this
wtf?? sci used to be full of redditors

>>10514757
So acording to are a man because you act becasusee you follow social norms that guide MALES. But at the same time those rules make no sense to you and are 100% social.
So acording to you, genders dont even exist, so so do not transexuals.
kill yourself please
soon

>>10520563
bullshit. it was used by almost everybody as a sinonym untill like 2015

>>10520379
>It'll happen when scientist grow some balls and realize just how destructive leftist ideology is, and start choking any "scientists" tainted with leftism.

It already happening, they are getting silenced or unnotified by the media. Except when the study fits their ideology. Example which I always find suspicious: One study where the results are equals while many other studies are showing huge differences and still traditional, that is in the gendered toy experiments to children.

But things are starting to getting right. Media are starting to come back to senses when the ideology broke shit. Daily Mail are now reporting the negative what the ideology is doing before they pushed the ideology to people as positive.

Beside the word "gender" describe the males and females sexual dimorphism without saying the "sex" word to sex stricted religions like Christians which also means clear sexual intercourse.

>>10520577
It's not bullshit. It started diverging decades ago but you only notice it now because the distinction has become so common in recent years.

>>10516916
The social construction is in the categorization.

>>10513917
Where did you get this off from? I'd like to browse/read it sometime.

>>10512941
When the correlation between two separate categories is >0.99, do you really need two categories?
Yes, there are a few people who really have both sexes and are thus special cases. Everywhere in the world, sex and gender correlate to such a degree that they're inseparable. The people who claim they want to be the other sex are mentally ill and need help.

>>10513261
This is the only reasonable idea where 'gender is a construct' makes sense: as a grammatical structure

>>10513684
Saying that because boys wear blue and girls wear pink gender is a social construct is a huge leap. In terms of behaviour, there is clear research indicating that Roy selection for example is clearly hard wired into the sexes. Gender doesn't exist outside of grammar.

>>10516748
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gender

cant wait for the ol' "wikipedia is just liberal propaganda!!!"

>>10516748
It's not that difficult, anon. Gender is the mental representation of one's own sexual identity, that goes through the social construction of the meaning of gender.

>>10520563
mental illness

here's a the 2019 list of genders
https://dudeasks.com/how-many-genders-are-there-in-2019/

>>10520946
I feel like this list is written by a bigot. I'm pretty sure the list was bigger in 2018 so he is oppressing some people on purpose with this list.

>>10513949
>the real threat which are homosexuals of the same sex.
Careful /sci/, we have a real wordsmith here

>>10514100
>So would you rather have a hyper fem faggot guy than a trans woman?
>Is that somehow better?
>Wouldn't that make men look worst?
It's not about what you or I want, it is about irrefutable biological facts.

>>10514105
The idea that your brain and your body are separate entities is fallacious. A large part of the nervous system is in your gut and there are structures in neuronal learning that happen outside of the brain.
Your initial assumption is erroneous and as such your entire argument is null and void.

>>10514174
It's about constructing identity. People who are dumb, are incompetent and have no hobbies have a hard time deriving an identity. So their sexual preference becomes their only anchoring point in the world. It's quite sad.
Healthy people have an identity comprised of many different things, their sexual orientation being just one small part.

>>10514237
>No, they're not free of their body. It's the opposite. They're trapped in the wrong type. It's like a cat brain in a dog body.
>trans people are literally a different species
Can we deny them human rights, please?

>>10514298
You are right but if I become a doctor and go through the studying and the physical training, there is good reason to call me a doctor when I graduate. I can prove that I learned the ropes.
When I on the other hand simply refuse to acknowledge my own biology and insist that I am a woman when I am really a man, the argument becomes much tougher. And the category of man or woman is much too important to simply dissolve. It's not like we're talking about very close shades of green here.

>>10520988
Replace brain with "nervous-system" and it would be correct again.

>>10512898
If people at least listen about the insane stories about John Money, the godfather of the gender studies. Nobody, would believe this bullshit.

>>10521206
He was one of the most extremist position, people can put some sideway and still can claim it is true.

>>10521006
Mind you I am not defending tumblerinas and their 100k and counting flavors of gender. Those exist only for digital masturbatory exercises. I am defending people that do feel gender disphoria and seek to change their gender accordingly.

To say that trans-people do not do enough to be considered men or women is quite absurd. Not only do they have to deal with the psychological burden of being "wrong" for themselves and for society, but they go to insane lengths to prove themselves "worthy" of their gender by training their body to move correctly, adjusting their voice, spending a lot of time on makeup and appearance, going through painful and dangerous surgieries to comfom to the idea of femininity or masculinity they feel they need to adhere to...
And while they deal with all of that, they also have to fight in the public discourse for their rights. And likely lose family and friends that do not want or are not willing to follow them and accept them.

As far as I'm concerned, if you make an effort to be of this or that gender, that's good enough for me.

>>10512898
Comings & goings in pseudoscience fads are difficult to predict, but not always inexplicable, especially in retrospect. Usually what happens is that as believers increase, their obnoxiousness to discourse becomes infamous, and rejection makes them begin to doubt in the same herd-mentality way they believe almost everything else they do. This fad is probably a misdirected reaction against increasingly arbitrary rule by fewer and fewer persons, as democratic institutions, and the rule of law, unravel. That part of it resembles something closer to home, which is reaction against controlling styles of parenting, and dogmatic religion, where the arbitrariness of nature in imposing identity, is conflated with human authority. Another cause of it is simply resentment, which is failure to accept inequalities imposed by nature, thence deny varieties thereof: One can have a sense of injured merit only insofar as one takes the idea of merit far to seriously, in failing to notice that prodigies get their virtuosity at lower cost to themselves, and usually to everyone else as well. I'm a gay man with a masculine outlook who doesn't have to make much effort to "pass" where discretion is of use, and while I enjoy the advantages of that, it's only too obviously not to my credit, anymore than my aptitude for diction is. It would be to my discredit for claiming that it is, since that would be insane, and as such signal a deeply untrustworthy character.

>>10512898
Within 5 years. All politically driven leftist bullshit usually ends in 10 years when it just can't surpass reality wall. Same happened with alt-globalisation movement which claimed poverty increases rapidly in 3rd world thanks to capitalist megacorp exploitation when in fact it halved in 20 years. Everyone should keep name lists ready to vanquish agitators when truth breaks free this time around, there is no reason to allow lefties get away with these kinds of insanely harmful stunts every fucking time.

>>10521247
Don't get me wrong, I am not trying to negate their struggle. I know there is a silent portion of trans people that is disgusted by the tumblr people. But still I think that if you feel that everything about you is wrong except for the way you feel in terms of what your sex is, the easier answer is to try therapy to come to terms with who you are instead of attempting to mutilate your body to the point that you are completely fucked up, body and mind.
Adding to that the fact that post op trans people still have a ~40% suicide attempts rate, it just doesn't seem to work!

>>10521424
Exceptionally mentally ill homosexual should die, and they castrating themselves and then killing themselves is the only good thing to come out of this insanity.

>>10521424
>>10521424
>I know there is a silent portion of trans people that is disgusted by the tumblr people
That is not a portion, it's the entire trans community, the actual community of people in the flesh going through all of this and more. Tumblr is nothing more than the left's version of /pol/ with the same spirit of transgression for the sake of transgression that breeds the idiocy we all have to deal with.
>everything about you is wrong except for the way you feel in terms of what your sex is, the easier answer is to try therapy
This is not what gender disphoria is at all. Sure some people feel disgust with their body, but the vast majority does not, it is much more psychological than physical. There are, after all, trans-people that refuse to go through surgery, but they are no less men or women as of consequence, their gripe is not with whichever fleshy bits they have between the legs but with their own identity, which is a reflection of the social identity they have acquired in their lives. The need for going through surgery arises later, it is the manifestation of an accepted new identity that they feel the need to 100% adhere to, most often then not for social reasons (the aforementioned need to prove themselves, for example).
> post op trans people still have a ~40% suicide attempts rate, it just doesn't seem to work!
This is a wide held, and wrong, belief that sucide is a response to an internal state. Sure, a few suicides are motivated by personal issues, but they are not the majority and it is not the case for trans-people.
Suicide has almost always a social origin. Trans-people are much mroe likely to suicide because they are much more likely to find themselves rejected by their communities, friends and family; likelier to be abused and oppressed by "degenerates!" screaming people; likelier to find themselves without financial support and a job (for the aforementioned reasons, among others).


And fuck the 2000 word limit.

>>10521439
>>10521470
Thank you for proving my point.

>>10521470
>Trans-people are much mroe likely to suicide because they are much more likely to find themselves rejected by their communities, friends and family; likelier to be abused and oppressed by "degenerates!" screaming people; likelier to find themselves without financial support and a job (for the aforementioned reasons, among others).
Incorrect. They are severely mentally ill and thus prone to an hero. Their suicide rates do not vary between high acceptance countires and low, of course since this is a political jig above all else, case is made as long as insane homosexuals neck themselves it proves society is [insert buzzwords here] and thus feminist communists are absolutely needed in very lucrative levers of power to make poor insane faggots safe. This whole circus has no other purpose than to game power and insane homos are just a pawn used by psychopathic left for powergain.

>>10521516
/pol/ fuck off.

>>10521527
Where is the lie?

>>10521536
I can't be bothered to write the 4000+ words needed to properly debunk your post. It takes an order of magnitude or energy to debunk bullishit than to spew it.
What about you providing proof?

>>10521470
>>10521474
yes, you basically proved the point and adding to that : almost every pedophile case in the church the perpetuator is homosexual. this is not just coincidence many pedophiles were molested a kids and they themself continue the cycle, its a downward deviancy cycle. this is a big social issue.

>>10512898
Never. The idea is out there now and those it has infected won't change their minds about it now. Soon there will be more genetic manipulations of unborn babies and also artificial wombs.

>>10521546
Then I declare myself a victor and you I declare a fucking retarded leftist, as if there were any other types of lefties. Anyone can verify that it doesn't matter if insane homos are castrated or not, filled with hormones or not, accepted or not, they still kill themselves about the same. People abusing them for sake of gaining power obviously benefit greatly if they manage to create more of these sad creatures which they insidiously claim to protect and care about.

>>10520623
https://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/national/longterm/unabomber/manifesto.text.htm

>>10521554
>>10521558
All right mr /pol/tard. You have yourself a mighty win conquered with sweat and blood and facts and logic. Now do please post a screen of your inevitable thread where you drecee your victory, I would be delighted to read what you and your (((friends))) will write.

>>10520865
In other words, fashion.

>>10521554
>almost every pedophile case in the church the perpetuator is homosexual

Source?

>>10521591
theres a VERY clear problem with male homosexuals withing the church, I'm purposely citing to make clear the gender, they are male homosexual pedophiles:

""""A Church-commissioned report in 2004 said more than 4,000 US Roman Catholic priests had faced sexual abuse allegations in the last 50 years, in cases involving more than 10,000 children - MOSTLY BOYS."""

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-44209971

McCarrick, who retired as archbishop of Washington DC in 2006, was forced to resign as a cardinal last July after a man publicly alleged that he had been sexually abused by the cleric from 1971, when he was a 16-year-old altar boy in New York.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2019/feb/16/pope-defrocks-ex-cardinal-theodore-mccarrick-over-abuse-claims

Cardinal George Pell was convicted of abusing two choir boys in Melbourne in 1996.

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-44209971

All of Chile's 34 Roman Catholic bishops have offered Pope Francis their resignations in the wake of a child sex scandal and cover-up.

"This will change things forever," tweeted Juan Carlos Cruz, who was abused by Fr Karadima in the 1980s.

José Andrés Murillo, another victim, said Pope Francis should accept the mass resignation offer.

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-latin-america-44169484

>>10514888
damn, thankyou for that

>>10521470
>This is not what gender disphoria is at all. Sure some people feel disgust with their body, but the vast majority does not, it is much more psychological than physical. There are, after all, trans-people that refuse to go through surgery, but they are no less men or women as of consequence, their gripe is not with whichever fleshy bits they have between the legs but with their own identity, which is a reflection of the social identity they have acquired in their lives. The need for going through surgery arises later, it is the manifestation of an accepted new identity that they feel the need to 100% adhere to, most often then not for social reasons (the aforementioned need to prove themselves, for example).
Yes, it is a psychological issue, which necessitates psychological action, such as therapy. Physical changes are counter to your own point.

>This is a wide held, and wrong, belief that sucide is a response to an internal state. Sure, a few suicides are motivated by personal issues, but they are not the majority and it is not the case for trans-people.
>Suicide has almost always a social origin. Trans-people are much mroe likely to suicide because they are much more likely to find themselves rejected by their communities, friends and family; likelier to be abused and oppressed by "degenerates!" screaming people; likelier to find themselves without financial support and a job (for the aforementioned reasons, among others).
Citation desperately needed. The fact is, trans people are ten times more likely to kill themselves, even when they are in a stable social environment, and even post op. You disagree with said well known stats, the burden of proof is on you.

>>10521560
thanks!!

>>10521678
The fact that most victims are male has nothing to do with the sexuality of the person, since pedophiles are attracted to age instead of sex.

https://psychology.ucdavis.edu/rainbow/html/facts_molestation.html

>>10522114
>age instead of sex.

no, in this case, like I pointed out with sources, the "attraction" is gender base too, male to male. if this had nothing to do with homosexuality we would also see more uniform data: male to female, but the big majority is homosexual, male to male.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gXGlawiibK8

>>10512898
Just ask the same question you would ask yourself when evaluating any idea for its merit.
How is this useful? What does it allow us to do?

And the answer is very clear, it allows us to speak of gender as something more than an inherent thing assigned at birth. This mean we can engage with the idea what it means to be a man or a woman in society. You can't talk about these things when you insist on XX/XY as the only judge of gender. And either way, looking critically at how society and (perhaps technology) has been developing since WW2 and where it is going, it is very clear that the idea of strict gender roles isn't going to be too useful soon.

Also, isn't it weird that trousers are traditionally male clothing and skirts female, when it should be the other way around?

>>10520379
Isn't it funny how leftist ideology turned a destitute shithole into a military, industrial and scientific superpower within a few years?
Maybe there is something to leftist thought after all.

>>10522445
>Also, isn't it weird that trousers are traditionally male clothing and skirts female, when it should be the other way around?
Why? Men used to do manual labour a lot more than today, where you need both relatively unrestricted movement, as well as a certain protection from the elements ==> pants.

I guess skirts were both for showing off legs as well as allowing easier access to the pussy, but I am not sure that is the reason for skirts.

>>10522449
Who are you talking about? The US? Because they grew to become a superpower in a time where nothing like current leftism even existed.

>>10523429
Think about the anatomy.
Cock and balls fit better into skirts, a vagina doesn't need that much space.

>>10512898

>>10512898
Never we gotta destroy it

>>10512898
Until humans realise that their material bodies are just vessels to transport the soul, and that they will only escape by becoming enlightening.

Becoming obsessed with the material that is ever non-lasting is a classic fools trap, its like buying an expensive car, good until it leaves the shop floor.

>>10523518
If you wouldn't be able to accidentally sit on your cock while wearing a skirt then your micropenis doesn't need that much space either.

>>10523524

You don't have a soul, you are a body. You have a delusion.

>>10523552
How do you know that?
You are making a fairly bold assumption here.

How would you scientifically approach the problem of the soul?

>>10523552
So you know anon, English had a fairly good philosopher who was a totally against God, near the end of his life he had a spiritual experience and said he would have to change everything he said.

https://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20070523070220AAkeUXs

you know what. i think the trans people are not the one to recieve the hate. its the other ones like pansexual sapiosexual demifuckers who really need the scalpel

>>10523524
>>10523558
There's a limited amount of energy and matter in the universe. If souls were real they would violate the conservation of energy as you'd be able to capture those souls and let them generate energy continuously which would violate the laws of thermodynamics and reverse entropy.

If souls really existed it would be treated like oil is right now. Hitler, Stalin, Mao would cast a huge net around their concentration camps to capture all souls and put them directly to work perpetually moving a turbine to generate power.

Souls violate the notion of conservation of energy and therefor are impossible.

>>10523606
>There's a limited amount of energy and matter in the universe
show that this is true, it sounds like another assumption. And that is not as trivial to prove as it may sound.

>If souls were real they would violate the conservation of energy as you'd be able to capture those souls and let them generate energy continuously which would violate the laws of thermodynamics and reverse entropy.
Perhaps our model cannot account for the existence of the soul as of yet and perhaps we are simply not capable of detecting it.

Your argument doesn't say anything about the soul, try again.

>>10523610
We literally know how much mass-energy the universe contains. It's 4*10^69 joules.

>Perhaps our model cannot account for the existence of the soul as of yet and perhaps we are simply not capable of detecting it.

"Something" always has to interact with the physical world around it if it contains energy or matter. If it doesn't contain energy or matter then it doesn't exist. Us not being able to detect it means it has too little energy or matter for it to be visible to our sensors or that it just straight up doesn't exist.

Either way souls don't exist because they break the conservation of energy unless you are saying that souls have an expiration date but if you say souls are immortal and will exist forever then it invariably breaks the laws of thermodynamics and reverses entropy.

>>10523613
I wont drag into a topic that few have explored, I will state that transwhatever is a rejection of the spiritual for the material, it activates the lizard part of the brain not the human, it concentrates on the present and not on the future or past
it is fundamentally antihuman and antispiritual
also, science religion and philosophy are all one viee to the whole picture, here two of the three are rejected, what has this scientific world created? Endless entertainment conjoined to endless torment

>>10523627
>moving the goalpost
We live in a materialistic world. Souls are disproven by modern physics. Spirituality isn't a real thing but a human delusion.

>What has the scientific world created
Literally everything. Science is a tool, not a way of life. You use it to understand and manipulate the world around you and make it bend to your will. We have used that to shape the world from a hostile place where we are the hunted into a world where we are the absolute rulers. Quality of Life increased exponentially and even the poorest person on the globe has a better quality of life than the best hunter-gatherer.

We cured thousands of diseases, solved sustained hunger, Ascended humanity to a level that is above nature. The "entertainment" you speak of is just a very small insignificant part of what we did.

We didn't create endless torment instead we eliminated most forms of torment so that the very small amount of torment that is still left looks like a real problem.

Science gave humanity true freedom. In the past if you did whatever you wanted you would die in nature. Now you can be a homeless person and literally in every street there is something for you to eat, you can sleep everywhere without being afraid of wildlife and enjoy your time.

Sure most people choose to have an even better life but it doesn't change the fact that now those options are available to us compared to the past.

We are now reaching the point where science even allows us to change our biological fates. We can change our genders and in a couple of decades even bear children etc. This is another layer of freedom and choices that nature didn't grant us but science did. If anything this should be celebrated. Can't you see how the delusion of spiritualism is a prison for your own freedom, choices and quality of life?

>>10523613
>We literally know how much mass-energy the universe contains. It's 4*10^69 joules.
Correction: Our Model suggests that the universe should contain about 4*10^67 joules.
Do you understand the difference between these two statements?

>If it doesn't contain energy or matter then it doesn't exist.
Not true. The conceptual idea that 2+2=4 exists without matter, without energy, without numbers. It is a universal truth about the world unbounded by physical reality.

>Either way souls don't exist because they break the conservation of energy unless you are saying that souls have an expiration date but if you say souls are immortal and will exist forever then it invariably breaks the laws of thermodynamics and reverses entropy.
"Souls cannot exist in out model, except in this way they can"
good argument!

It is very difficult to argue that something does not or can not exist.

>>10523649
I could go on and on too about how Triangles don't actually exist in the real world.
And yet the infrastructure of reality relies on Triangles, they appear everywhere despite no True Triangle existing.
There is a divinity to numbers, as there is to pure logic, it resonates with everything and is staring us in the face.

If you only look out of one window, you only get one view.

Transwhatever is simply running away from reality, there is no meaning to anything in the material world, its fighting over dirt and dust.
Wanting to be known for being Unique and Special, in a world that has rejected those principles.

Liberalism's final form is anti-culture, complete destruction of all institutions leaving only a one powerful state that the individual must rely on for all things.
The state become necessary for freedom and the ability for self-governance is completely eroded. People become numbers and GDP scores, not humans interested in self understanding.
Communities become rabbit huts, inside lonely perfect people in a lonely perfect fake world looking into their 3d glasses for self-verification.
If only they looked deeper and saw themselves and realised that they don't need an identity picked off the shelf to be human

If you only look at the surface, you miss the deeper messages,

When everyone abandons the spooky concept of gender, might be during our lifetimes

Never. Marxists infiltrated western intelligentsia a long time ago. Long march. Institutions. Orwell warned us.

>>10523893
>Liberalism's final form is anti-culture, complete destruction of all institutions leaving only a one powerful state that the individual must rely on for all things.
Anon, where did you learn what the term "liberalism" means, because as far as I am aware of liberalism focuses on the non-intervention of the state. The idea that the state only exists to protect the life, liberty and most importantly property of its citizens. I believe it was John Locked who talked about liberalism in these terms.
Hobbes, another one of those liberals who want the powerful state even said that if the state goes above and beyond these things it is a tyranny and should be overthrown, as the legitimacy to rule does not come from any source but the consent of the people.

I know you worship science like it is God, but you shouldn't be this wrong about basic political philosophy. This calls your knowledge about most things into question.

>>10523902
Marxists really don't care about ideas like gender. Marxism is an ideology applied to money.

Which of Orwell's book are you referencing, the one where the fascists reveal their true face and shed the shackles of ideology or the one where the punchline is that capitalists are pigs?
Neither of the two criticize Marxist ideology, in the former it doesn't come up and in the latter one he endorses it.

>>10523902
What is it with Communists and long marches?
Its like the only thing they do and some how they win all the time. I honestly can't wait for this AGE to be over, what a sucky age,
Women are Trash
Games are Trash
Men are Trash
Science is Trash
Education is Trash
Being poor or rich is Trash
Having a gun is Trash
Not having a gun is Trash

>>10523908
James Madison Fed 10 "Gov exists to protect the largest possible sphere of individual liberty influence and does so by promoting SELF-INTEREST among CITIZENS AND PUBLIC SERVANTS"
A world of individuals who rely on the state, no church, no community, no family

John Locke 2nd Treatise of Government (Talks of dividing the world between the industrious and rational (Liberal Elites) VS querulous and contentious (Everyone else))

Jefferson Quote "To create a Natural ARISTOCRACY"
A new, more intrenched elite

Locke "He who APPROPRIATES land by his labour is adding to the STOCK OF MANKIND"
A world of money and GDP

Hayek "rapid economic advance encourages inequality, not uniform, but echelon fashion. As advancement continues, it requires constant rapid growth."
A limited world trying to contain a successful virus

Liberalism evolved into progressivism and saw the previous inequality as a hinderance to true equality.

Madison Fed 10 "Democracies and their theories erroneously supposed that by reducing mankind to perfect equal rights, that their possessions, opinions and passions would be the same."

Fed 34 "If we mean to be a COMMERCIAL PEOPLE we must have a way to defend commercial means"

(Bold for emphasis not shouting)

Liberalism is the last ideology that will die

>>10523950
It is almost as if liberalism is a bad thing for the people who don't have most of the money, isn't it?

>>10523954
Can say that for any system. The problem is the end evolution is as useful as Monarchy or the old Aristocracy. Propertarisnism gets rid of alot of the bugs in the original laws.

>>10512927
t. believes sex is based on choice of clothing

>>10523969
t. believes clothing should be exclusive to certain sexes

>>10512898
When will it end you ask. When the public knows that they have been poisoned by endocrine disruptions for the purpose of political manipulation and organ harvesting for the production of stem cells (The elixir of everlasting lift). MOAB truth bomb and I just dropped it bitch!

>>10513935
how is not supporting delusions of mentally ill oppression? You don‘t tell a schizophrenic that the ghosts are real to make him feel better, you give him medicamentation and reality checks.

>>10513962
it is not, though, like the color of your eyes.

>>10524022
colors are a social construct

>>10524016
No, problem is that healthy people who do not 100% trust their family are hospitalized, and then they are given pills to see ghosts, so family can keep their property, if they ware healthy they would walk away with their property. If you make them sick family can keep it and psychiater also benefits. That's way it works. In REAL life.

>>10524074
>All schizophrenic people are fake news, they're drugged into seeing and hearing things.
Thank god I wasn't born as stupid and gullible as you.

>>10514237
>They do that for same reason females do.
for favorable mates in reproduction?

>>10514254
I prefer being referred to by my name on an individual basis, since that has a higher correllation with my identity than some grouping. Being falesly associated with an incorrect group should send no sane person on a raging tirade

>>10514270
my being is not a social construct, it is a natural one caused by input in form of photons, pressure waves, electromagnetism and chemical reactions processed, compared and stored in form of random firings and pathing of a neural network.

There is no requirement for anything social.

>>10514654
>Who do you think is getting the majority of transition surgeries?
Thais my dude

>>10515261
are trans women the dudes with cut off dicks and another asshole or the women that cut off their breasts?

>>10524130
Isn’t it Iranians somehow?

>>10515719
at least supervised and treated in some way. They have a worryingly high suicide rate compared to other marginalized groups, even after sexual „correction“

>>10516702
define the properties of gender. If you come up with anything that is distinct from either the word sex or personality let me know, otherwise get off my anonymous writing board

>>10523806
your perception and personality are not conceptual ideas. Also if you claim something independent of the physical world exists, it can per definition not interact with the physical world. So how should a soul be able to reside withing one‘s body or mind without being able to interact or local in spacetime?

>>10523975
wear the clothing you like, people will judge it as they like and all of that has nothing to do with gender, but personality

>>10524025
dude what if your red is my blue

>>10524154

>>10512917
Yes, you're right, gender is a social construct, if a boy wears a dress and has long hair he's still a boy, if a girl wears pants and cuts her hair she's still a girl. Glad you understand.

>>10523806
>Correction: Our Model suggests that the universe should contain about 4*10^67 joules. Do you understand the difference between these two statements?
Yes. 4*10^67 is the amount of mass-energy in the observable universe. While 4*10^69 is the amount of energy released by the big bang. It's reason why we know for certain that the total universe is at least 100x larger than our observable universe.

>>10512898
Are you saying what a woman or man is has any meaning outside of human society? Just It doesn't.

Gender and sex are 100% socially constructed, just because you can't imagine a world where these terms are used completely differently doesn't mean they are somehow intrinsic to our universe. We can chose to define trans women as women, if we find that is beneficial. Biology will still be a thing, its not necessarily a big deal.

>>10523908
I refer to his notes on nationalism. Which I suggest you try reading some time. Because he predicted everything.

https://www.orwellfoundation.com/the-orwell-foundation/orwell/essays-and-other-works/notes-on-nationalism/

>>10513918
Platonic all-male nation without homolust when?

>>10523902
>Orwell warned us.
You mean the guy that not only fought for the CNT-FAI in the Spanish civil war, but wrote a book in praise of them?
Ah! Ahahah!
Ahahahahahahahahaha!

>>10524273
Another dogmatic denial, do you really not recognize the problem with statements like that when pressed for proof? You cannot disprove a negative. Further, presuming that everything is explicitly false unless provent from the axioms, like you do is highly problematic.

The burden of suggesting a theory of the soul is not on me, as I do not claim that souls exists. I only state that a categoric denial of the soul is literally not reasonable.

>>10524118
>s-society does not exists, guys
>am I big brain yet?

>>10512903
>>10514312
feels bad man

>>10524613
His notes on nationalism are quite poignant, read them if you like

I just accepted my bisexuality and I think gender studies are ridiculous.

>>10524637
I am reading them and I don't see any conspiracy theory about the threat of Marxist infiltration nor condemnation of the marxist model. Well exept for his well known hate boner for Stalin and his steamy Soviet ass.

Can you point me to the specific passage that I am supposed to "get"?

>>10513737
>male monkeys prefer boys' toys
>gender and gender role are natural

Okay, but what happens when hormonal or developmental cues are erroneously deployed either for environmental or genetic reasons? Some preliminary studies have shown that transsexual people have minor gendered brain differences that tend to accord to their identified sex. Additionally, it is a well-established fact that many homosexuals and trans people possess irregular r2d4d ratios (a proxy measurement for developmental testosterone exposure) that also agree with either their gendered behaviour or their gender identity: bottoms, trans women and feminine lesbians have high (feminine) ratios, while gaybros and butch lesbians have been measured to have low (masculine) ratios.

While I would freely admit that the cultural prominence queer people are afforded is disproportionate and questionable, biological data do suggest that much of their behaviour has physical origins, and thus, is not "unnatural" or "made up".

Have you ever known a gay or queer person and their family? One of the bisexual women I know has a bisexual brother, a "non-binary" older sibling, and a butch mother who likes to wear suits. There are obviously strongly innate, biological origins for most of queerness.

All you have to do is open a history book to discover that crossdressers have existed since antiquity. Men trying to live as women and women trying to live as men is as old as humanity. Amusingly, some people were getting salty about it back then, too.

So if this behaviour is uncommon, but not infrequent, biological in its nature, and historically present, what's the big deal? Why is it any more abominable than any other mutation that causes "degenerate" behaviour, like increased propensity for addiction (far more common, has genetic, developmental and hormonal correlates) or increased appetite (gluttony)? If we were to cull those that present biological markers for "degenerate" behaviour, you'd be left with a fraction of man, which excludes a majority of the posters present.

The reality is that agricultural society breeds weakness, because it allows us to reproduce in great numbers and protect our kin from the ravages of natural selection that would normally maintain our populations' fitness.

>>10524539
>trams women
>women

>>10513918
In 200 years

Soch fags, can someone of you tell me specifically where sexual dimorphism ends and your soceity begins?
Men being stronger and thus creating a division of labour and changing culture and soceity tilting it a certain way, is that specificly related to sex, or soceital developments.

How about military traditions, and male personality traits that all are foundationally based as bilogical offshoots, of strength and agression?

Also if genders are socially arbitrarily, why don't we see a massive spread in genders cross culturally outside of a few edge cases in thailand or india?

Secondly, how do we ever reconcile that biology influences behavior, and desire far more intrinsically than soceity which simply modifies it. How can the gender is formless crowd and is akin to personality essentially reconcile that all the aspects of sexual dimorpohism play off of traditional gender roles.
And why do traditional gender roles find such dominance in soceities throughout virutally all of history. If it was arbitrary or atleast easily modifiable why don't we see thousands gender roles. Why is it only in the soceity in which we can level the biological gap through technology do we see gender roles breaking down in relevant ways?

>>10524842
1.
It's not that easy.
You need to think about it in different terms. Why do the gender roles look the way they do and what purpose do they serve?
The roles the way they do look, because of the sexual dimorphism, the one was easy.
The purpose of the gender roles is to sustain a specific form of society, where the man works and earns money, while the woman works at the home and take care of the children. You know something like a farm, for instance.
Industrialization changed the society. Now both work in factories, because machines make sexual dimorphism a non-concern.
And now in the current urban society, this has shifted even further. Traditionally male traits like "strength" and "aggression" are worthless, they do not help you survive. It's no longer about how much stuff you can pick up and put down again. It's about what is inside your head.

The thing traditionalists often ignore is that the world has changed irreversibly.
Traditional gender roles are simply not useful anymore.

>Also if genders are socially arbitrarily, why don't we see a massive spread in genders cross culturally outside of a few edge cases in thailand or india?
Religion, areas influenced by Buddhism, Hinduism and other things that preach reincarnation beliefs don't really see gender roles as firm as people do in the christian cultural sphere. It should be obvious that this because the physical aspects of a person are seen as mutable.
In Japan they used to have crossdressing male prostitutes serving both men and women for a long time, for example.

>how do we ever reconcile that biology influences behavior, and desire far more intrinsically than soceity which simply modifies it
Because this is really difficult stuff. We don't know exactly how far either of the two goes or what's going on.

>why do traditional gender roles find such dominance in soceities throughout virutally all of history.
I answered this already, they is useful in societies where this separation is needed.

>>10524884
Let me stop at you at industrialization. Post WW1 and post WW2 many women returned back home from manufacturing jobs. Independence came at a price of high rates of death within the industrialized world. Childbirth is bad but not coal miner bad.

Female participation and female liberation is more of a product of capitalism than anything else. I'd say female work place participation wasn't solidified until birth control where we see male wages flatline in 70s and 80s

Religion isn't a catch all term. Mongols were accepting of many various religions you want to dilute it down specificly?

Also bouncing back between male and female has been considered a third gender but to me that's a copout. That's non standard behavior but it's hardly useful when it's merely bouncing between a binary state.

I'd still argue they are useful in our era. They are intrinsic to humanity. I'd say even without classical division of labour gender roles give meaning to a meaningless world and in fact everything as some point from the way we interact with
hunger, sex, puberty, creativity, isolation is tied back to biological principles and later on to heteronormative, and gender normative norms.

In conclusion I even contest the fact that women fought for their own liberation. I think they were the earliest form of using identity politics when it came to women's right to generate capital.
And I don't think it was a positive broadly speaking, but it did do alot for the economy. GDP and standard of living isn't the end all of human welfare. Hell, we don't even know the end all of human epigentics, or the way gut bacteria changes people across geography. But have of SOCH wants you to find love in peace in neu marxism

>>10524884
>Traditional gender roles are simply not useful anymore.

That's not the problem. The problem is ignoring the traits of both biology sexes. There will be always huge differences between sexes behaviors.

Even if the roles are reversed. Male parenting will do more riskier stuff. Females does less overtime.

>>10512898
One of the main social constructs is inheritance, so the concept is a threat. Hence funding for any retard who gets off on redefining terms as absurdly as one can imagine.

>>10524842
>biology influences behaviour

Yes, and both XY and XX individuals exist on a spectrum. Let’s use the r2d4d range as a rough stand-in for measuring masculinity and femininity. It fills this role effectively, since that it correlates with so many gendered traits.

Women have a mean r2d4d of 0.96 and men have a mean of 0.94. That’s not a big difference relative to the total range. So at the extremes, the most masculine men will be more numerous, and can potentially be more hyper-masculine, than the most masculine women, however the gap remains small. A large plurality of women (30-40%) will possess about the same r2d4d as the average man or lower (be more masculine). A large plurality of men are faggots. This can impact such important things as mathematics ability: studies show that women and men with -or close to- the mean male r2d4d are most likely to be adept at math.

And then there are other variations that can take place. Some women, regardless of their r2d4d, have mutations that cause them to produce more circulating testosterone. This affects their gendered behaviour as well. In an age of rampant obesity, epidemic PCOS causes women to produce excess testosterone and express increasingly masculine behaviour.

My point is that throughout the entire population, there are less than 50% of men and 50% of women who will be “appropriately” gendered in their nature. There are too many biological variables that can alter both physical appearance and personality in too many people for the orthodoxy we idealize to be considered “normative”.

>>10525026
>Yes, and both XY and XX individuals exist on a spectrum.

>>10525058
How is this moving the goalposts? You niggers think that all xx and xy people should adhere to very narrow boundaries of conduct because autism and much feels. I really don’t give a fuck about how people behave, because the biological origins of individual social and cultural expression is subject to so many variables that it seems decidedly restrictive and paramountly fucking sub Saharan nigger retarded to try to contain it.

so i was told this is a science board

>>10525026
So what? I am not sure what you are saying. I am not suggesting a hard male and female. Everything has variability down to specific elements on the periodic table.

My point is that that's not a large enough difference to facilitate new genders, there is obviously will be conditional overlap.

And also would it be desirable to say, a man is not a man based on testorone? I am not exactly sure where I claimed this, but I never sat the exact parameters of masculinity or femininity respectively.

Hell testorone changes as you get older. Older men are still men, Women produce more testorone in male dominated groups. I am not sure what you are trying to say.
I am not sure there is any biological construct that ascribes to the hard lines for specificity in normative gender you have described. As I am sure greater apes and chimps have the same variatibility.

It's like saying there are intersex individualss therefore we can not have normalizations of specific facets of soceity because an outlier exists.

>>10525106
I never said narrow boundaries of conduct. I never said anything specific. Are yous saying there are no boundries on human conduct, are you saying ever human is a random fucking rubix cube capable of everything and then culture and soceity shapes it?

Fuck off with that relativism.

>>10525106
Don't try your luck here again.

There are ANTI-TROLL GUIDES by your genderism groups and website pushing us down with that bullshit spectrum.

>>10516877
>he doesn't know /sci/ has been a /pol/ satellite since long time ago
Newfag.

Is it really hurting you bro?

Like, I don't care if someone is LGBTQ+ or a damn attack helicopter, it's not hurting me any.

>>10525220
>every human is a random fucking rubix cube capable of everything

No, what I'm saying is that forcing roles upon people instead of letting people choose roles that suit them is idiocy. There is too much individual variation in the human population for us to state "men are x, women are y" and expect everyone to conform without tyranny.

I wasn't meaning to address you in particular since it's difficult to distinguish who is posting what on an anonymous forum for Chukchi bone art. My statements were aimed at the "muh traditionalism" mouthbreathers who think we should trap everyone in highly abstract, impractical and unrealistic gender roles because it tickles their fee-fees. Considering tihs is /sci/, half the people screaming about this shit in the thread probably have a dead-average or higher r2d4d and are beta as fuck.

The chaos of the modern disintegration of social and cultural roles is really a symptom of a return to some traditional dynamics. No longer do we reward weak betas, which is ultimately a good thing.

All those outlier 0.001%-er chiseled, taller-than-average dudes with high serum test, high developmental test, high IQ; great mathematical skills despite extreme developmental test exposure, and excellent arteriovenous and immunological health still get laid and have children. Those who are the best; brightest, most attractive, and healthiest out-reproduce the betas on a case-by-case basis. That's justice. I don't see what other goal our society should have.

The betas who get mad about this shit are no more healthy, valuable, or normative than queers. Most of them would have been cleansed through natural processes of disease and dominance. I say we let them all squabble in the mud.

>>10525335
You faggots don't even understand my politics.

>>10524539
Our entire biological function is to reproduce. Trans “women” can’t. It’s more than an edge case we can hand wave away.

>>10524713
If it existed forever and is “natural” then why bother with surgery and hormone therapy and made up pronouns?

>>10520569
if they have truly been routed out, /news/ has to be next

>>10525580
>No, what I'm saying is that forcing roles upon people instead of letting people choose roles that suit them is idiocy.
On the contrary, letting everyone choose their roles is idiocy.

>>10525580

No, what I'm saying is that forcing roles upon people instead of letting people choose roles that suit them is idiocy. There is too much individual variation in the human population for us to state "men are x, women are y" and expect everyone to conform without tyranny.
>nice straw man

I am not the average traditionalist. The average traditionalist in greece or rome wouldn't have mind ass fucking someone if it came to it.

Betas keep soceity stable, marriage keeps betas stable. This isn't rocket science. Also, almost all those psychopaths who end up at the top in those insane positions are men. Logically we want to maximize on those psychopaths

You don't understand my politics either. This is asinine, you are responding to someone else.

Soch, has removed gender as a logical extension of biology and said "Well you know in the past male babies where given pink and wore tights." So there fore it's all arbitrary. I never heard them say. Maybe they liked pink because they thought boys could be better conditioned for blood from an early age and girls for something related to blue.

My politics, is I have no qualms with crossdressors, mutilators, and other men but they retain man hood through whatever transformation they take. They can be a masculine man, or a feminine man. Either or can be contexually valuable. The same case can be made for women. Under my classifaction system which hard filters people, we cull 90% of the nonsense soch has brought with pangenderism by essentially conditioning it with personality
>gender expression
>gender dysphoria
>infinite genders
They have liquidated a valuable definition and soceital stabilizer into a really retarded mess.

Gender has been reduced to personality. I haven't even talked about traditionalism all that much. My personal belief is that if left to their own devices, people would likely flow to traditionalist positions if unhampered. And the stress of soceity is driven by dissonance and disparity in full.

>>10525679
The impulses are natural, while the options afforded by modern medicine are not.

Why dye your hair? Why shave? None of that is natural. The impetus to modify our bodies has its origins in our unconscious minds, and our technologies dictate how we implement it.

Keep in mind that evolution does not respect "order" or "beauty" or clean categorisation that satisfies your feefees, snowflake. Either the mutations that cause aberrant brain chemistry/structure which makes one feel like a different gender do not negatively affect fitness, or in some cases they may positively affect it (see "gay uncle" theory). It is also possible that they are, for structural reasons, common mutations, in the same way that dwarfism occurs quite frequently as a de novo mutation in the gametes of the afflicted's father.

The material world is not a sentient force that is eager to please your autism, fucking simian nigger retard.

>>10525720
>You are responding to someone else

I am. I'm trying to address all the gay-ass 110 IQ betas in this thread that can't wrap their mind around the natural order. This isn't about you, specifically. I can't take on everyone in a thread.

What is this "soch" shit? Explain it, because I don't want to google esoteric, enigmatic garbage. I've already spent enough time reading Mencius Moldbug. The weird-right is too much reading for little profit.

>people would likely flow to traditionalist positions if unhampered

What little we've gleaned from the remains of early man as a hunter gatherer says otherwise. Most of "tradition" is dumb cultural shit that we've invented to constrain the chaotic nature of the inferior.

The truth is that the only self-sorting that we should care about is when the righteous and strong triumph over the weak. Betas are useless and need to be culled. I really don't give a shit how people feel about themselves, as long as they are exceptionally intelligent, and strong in will. Those people don't need our help, and they succeed without intervention. That order is the only one worth retaining, and it is self-perpetuating.

What I worry is that, over time, betas will continue to drag us down thanks to our foolish mercy in letting them survive childhood. The undoing of man will creep up from the folly of our compassion. They may come to outnumber the good and the beautiful, and sunder our society for their own disgusting egos.

>>10525686
Not only are you an idiot whom I hope will be gassed in a moral future, but you need to contextualize your objection.

>>10525806
You think people getting to choose their roles is optimal. It’s not. You think it’s a good idea so that special snowflakes like YOU can choose. But you, like most everyone else, lack self-awareness and insight enough to not fuck that up. Unless you can come up with a world where everyone is an astronaut-president, that can’t happen.
>inb4 within limits
Like biological ones?

>>10525806
>thinks hunter-gatherer society was some Hobbesian ubermensch paradise
Stop posting and go back to your high school homework.

>>10526057
I think you're intentionally misunderstanding me.

Those who are meant to rule transcend any roles given, because they're just better than you. If someone's alpha as fuck, hyper-intelligent, and gay, they run society just like an any alpha. It really doesn't matter, because their success speaks for itself and controlling them in any way is impossible. They own you, not the other way around, peon.

As for anyone beneath that, I feel indifference. I don't find there to be any meaningful reason to restrict the behaviour of people against how they feel about themselves, because historically we've failed to consistently impose restrictions, and in the long run, it doesn't really change what goes on at the top, where things matter.

There have been cross-dressing people and gay and non-binary whatevers forever. Maybe they didn't call themselves exactly these things, but they are a constant. It's something butthurt projecting snowflakes like yourself. Having an autism screeching fit and then demanding everyone dress the way you dressed the dolls in your faggot-ass imaginary dollhouse doesn't override the biological realities that underpin the diversity of human social culture.

I don't see what your job has to do with your gender identity. What I'm saying is that people can feel how they do about themselves gender-identity wise because it really isn't disruptive to anyone but soft pink peaches like yourself. It's all aesthetics, the same type which leads to your obsession that everyone fit into simple categories for your toddler brain. Only an infantile autist cares about sociocultural aesthetics in that way. Don't misconstrue my writing.

Your wilful misunderstanding betrays the disingenuous, emotional motivations of your arguing.

>>10521470
this
/thread

A world without women is a productive world. Africans never developed because they constatnly had women around them keeping their blood in their penis instead of in their brains.

We started developing faster than them because our libidos were not as potent due to the colder climate reducing and of course it making us wear tons of clothing; revealing less skin.

WE NEED TO KILL THE THOTS TOO, FUCK THOTS, THIS IS WHY WE NEED TO CLOTH THE WHORES, SOMEONE PLEASE LISTEN, IMG OING INSANEN i CASNT TOP FAPPING

>>10521470
Gender dysphoria has a lot more in common with body dymsorphic conditions, as one can not handily quantify male and female, and I imagine these social construct can be changed

Why are these so much different from a guy exessively roiding, or anorexia - bulemia type disorders?

What's the difference between someone desiring to have no legs, cutting those legs off and attaining their perfect form?

>>10521516
African american slaves, and post war veterans of ww2 had lower sucide rates, hell I am fairly sure shizos have lower suicide rates and so do jap/china man teens?

>>10525806
If most of culture is dumb shit, why wouldn't we have evidence of dumb fuck pangenderism? Because of the variety of human populations, we should see far more biologically removed genders and gender constructs. When in reality we get fairly consistent behavior between men/women in society, because it's all biologically tethered.

>>10524677
Can you give me an article to look at?

>>10527516
>we should see more irregular genders
We do see those, though. Even historically. Before I got my bachelor’s of science, I took a lot of electives in the classics, South Asian and Islamic history under old dudes untouched by SJW-ism. From the ancient world of Greece to the early caliphate, you have plenty of gender and sexual deviants. The issue is that lots of people put their fingers in their ears or move goalposts.

It also goes to say that without an arena to display nonstandard gender, it becomes difficult to do so. This is why many societies that have abhorred people who deviate don’t have much record besides maybe accusations of “zina” or “sodomy”. People are forced to subsume or hide their ambivalence towards their given identity. You can’t be “queer” if you don’t have the language, and it’s dangerous to be anything but what you’re told you are.

Put differently, a woman two centuries ago who was almost entirely masculine in behaviour, and who didn’t feel very attached to most conventional aspects of womanhood, would not have had the dialect necessary to identify by anything else. Likewise, other women with a similar condition would have been sufficiently common to make any obvious irregularities in their comportment seem not particularly noteworthy. Men with butch moms wouldn’t think much about it. This is particularly interesting given that the r2d4ds and craniometrics of some Mesolithic finds imply that men and women alike used to be more masculine.

Queers of all stripes aren’t outliers. Like i said above, significant pluralities of men and women, by the measure of r2d4d alone, are well-enough outside the borders of developmental gender in accordance with their sex that you could consider them “biologically queer”. 1/3 of all people being faggots, not to mention those with other developmental or hormonal deviations, is not a small number.

>>10527762
I mean, think about it. What would observers call someone who behaves like neither a man nor a woman, in the past? It’s not like they’d care to interview them and ask them to articulate their self-image. Lacking the vocabulary to diagnose the condition, what would they say?

It’s obvious that in the absence of illegality or the threat of misunderstanding, accusations of witchcraft, or corporal punishment, these people have invented a language to describe themselves more accurately. Most of them would not have been able to gather before, much less attain self-recognition.

>>10527762
>>10527762

Alright I said specific, sexual differences we see even among animal. I mean specifically variations outside of the binary that are not included in that binary.

And I mean specifically in a culture and soceital record. I don't mean abohhanrt individuals, by your standards of arbitrary bs culture through out all of the archeolagical record why don't we see more variation

Just because the culture changes doesn't mean it changes irrespective of the biology, scarcity and geography which is another amendment I'd like to make.

Why don't we see larger civilizations across even geographically isolated places develop heavy variants.

Is there anyone in soceity that you would consider an outlier? Or is normativity a non existant constant. Furries who feel that they are a different species, would they count as an outlier or arem their tendency to think of themselves as differnet species extend your big happy family into the broader animal world?

Is there any boundaries where you would formulate exlusionary boundaries, and normative thoughts.
The classic 99% of humanity has been heterosexual loosely or at the worst something like 95% consistently because there is a 5% of variability, our norms for hetero behavior as normal break down?

>>10527780
And sorry, to more directly address what you asked:

We don’t see genders off the charts because there aren’t any. If you look at queer gender shit, almost no one insists they are anything but a variation on male or female. It’s all over the place, but still based on the binary. Some people feel like neither, but that doesn’t mean they are a true separate gender: it implies they feel a sufficient lack of either’s traits so as to be nothing at all. You don’t call a hand without fingers a “new type of hand”.

Arguably, most of the spectrum gender states that are now being thrown around are essentially more granular articulations of the natural states that have always been observable. The clunky “quasi-gender” shit is someone trying to say they feel mostly x but also a little y. That’s just an obtuse format for saying “feminine man” or “masculine woman”.

>>10512898
When more people from more backgrounds stand up to vocally, and intelligently refute it rather than quietly looking away in annoyance.

>>10525677
>Our entire biological function is to reproduce.
Okay.
Now tell why I should factor that in when considering what to refer people by.

>>10527248
The amount of pseudoscience in this post is upsetting.

>>10527930
yeah but it'd make a good sitcom

>>10527501
I don't believe you.
This is just more slander against the transgender community.

>>10527922
Why should we do anything? I know that this will be hard for you to understand at your age, but something are what they are and don’t have a deep philosophical meaning behind them.
And neither does your suggestion that we let everyone be what they wish they were and punish anyone who questions their delusion.

>>10526138
Probably because I don’t want to read your 10 pages of autism even if I agree, even if you’re correct.

>>10514024
>The majority of people would still consider this a man

That's a male, but not a cultural "man". "man" has a specific cultural connotation, a grooming/personality role that most males in the west conform to.

think about this, do you look at a sissy twink or a young boy and think "man"? No one says "it's a man!" when a baby is born. What about some autistic manchild wearing a pink dress, does that look like a "man" to you? You imagine a man as a short haired clean cut male in a suit. So "man" means cultural traits and not just being male

when you mentally image a "man" you imagine a male with short hair, confident driven personality, likes sports, aloof/stoic. Isolated tribes all come up with their own version of "man" in their own language, how their tribe decided males should act, which is not the same as the western idea of "man"

>>10528073
image related

>>10514186
Because our society still makes a difference. Once people stop treating men and women differently (apart from proven biological differences) we won't have genders anymore. There will be an effort to make gender obsolete in certain societies, but this is a long and difficult process simce you will have to raise kids in a genderneutral way, even though they still live in a place, where genders exist.

>>10515896
Maybe they should have used another word for gender so your little brains don't get all mixed up.

>>10520798
Perhaps you could ask yourself the question why they are correlated, if the need to be and if we as humans could become more freely thinking & acting individuals if we started separating them.

>>10525348
>this complete lack of reading comprehension
you must be one of the the_donald refugees

>>10512898
because gotta have some way of natural selection now that food and predators are no longer an issue.

>MFW i unironically actually believe this

>>10512898
You should realize by now trans people are never going to take a step back. People who've always been treated like shit can be kept down, but once people get a taste of freedom they're far more adamant about keeping it. That's completely putting aside the fact that the trend among non trans people is strongly towards greater acceptance, and there's no reason this would change.

In 20 years the number of openly trans people will be far higher, they will be far more accepted, and their transition options will be more accessible, more extensive, and less controversial.

>>10528637
considering they're dedicating themselves to converting children, pushing for the minimum age to "transition" lower and lower
Were they focused on their freedom alone, it would be fine, but because they want to infect children ensures that they'll inevitably be rounded up and exterminated for it
A shame that, they could have had it all, but they got greedy

>>10528637
t. Don’t know shit about history

>>10528637
>In 20 years the number of openly trans people will be far higher...

They will not survive, not even one generation.

>>10527975
they have the highest rate of any minority group at any time far as I am aware. If you can prove that I am wrong go ahead.

>Dude, why don't they just, like, try therapy or something, man
Why do these armchair experts always act like this is some sort of revolutionary insight? Like that wasn't the first thing people tried for decades before finally admitting it doesn't work? You people pretend to care about this shit but you haven't done the slightest research on the topic.

>>10512912
It's common to see the horror stories of the trans movement here. Just wait until those traumatic stories make it to the public consciousness. Not to mention leftist TV is getting exponentially more degenerate to the point that it will be sickening to normal people, if it isn't already.

>>10524166
>gender
notice how it doesn't say penis or vagina

>>10512898
around 2150.