/sci/ - Science & Math

>>10373937
>safe
Not at all. The moment the other dealers (and their bosses) discovers you, you are fucked (and I mean it)

Police will be the least of your problems

>>10373969
As a chemist, you would be worth way more alive than dead to the competition. The worst that would happen is you would get kidnapped and forced to make drugs, but even if you refuse it wouldn't be worth it for them to kill you, they would try positive motivation instead.

>>10373969
I think this only applies if you're making meth, opiates, or other hard drugs. If your main product is psychedelics, I doubt you have to worry about these things.

>>10374035
>If your main product is psychedelics, I doubt you have to worry about these things.
Yeah but then you have to worry about the CIA cutting your head off for freeing people from their mind control.

Lots of money, for a while. always having to look over your shoulder, not fun.

With anything Crazy. The strategy has to be, dont do it. But, if you are going to do it, it has to be very short, with a plan to get far and safely away from it, with enough money to make it worth while

>>10374037
Not a problem if you build your lab in Mexico and smuggle yo shit across the border

I have had limited exposure to the manufacture side of amphetamines, if you stay extremely small no one will notice or care, if you get big enough to get noticed you need to be willing to prove yourself dangerous or make yourself disappear before someone does it for you.

>>10373992
>even if you refuse it wouldn't be worth it for them to kill you
You ever heard of "sending a message", if you refused they would either torture you if they really needed a cook but much more likely they would kill you and leave the body with your former employer to let him know this is their market.
Just about every drug other than LSD can be made by a complete amateur with internet access, don't make the mistake of thinking cooks aren't expendable.

>>10374035
>>10374037
>>10374088
LSD is the single most profitable drug, it takes ~$5k of reagents to make ~$1m of product. You think the people producing and distributing this are the peaceful hippies that make the final link in the supply chain? Think again.

>>10373937
Ask Uncle Fester, don't tell him I sent you.

>>10374583
>banana peals and peanut husks
Uncle Tester is Anarchist Cook Book tier, read actual papers that include synthesis methods.

Are the risks diminished for a cook if he only interfaces with his customers via an online drug market? I mean no real life distribution shenanigans

>>10373937
>How interesting, safe, and realistic is a career in clandestine chemistry?
Why don't you try it and find out?

>>10373937
>interesting
no, you'll be doing repetitive shit
>safe
definitely no, toxic reagents, law enforcement, criminal organizations, not good for mental health either
>realistic
yes, very realistic, especially with the job situation for most chemists with a BSc. a lot better than wagecucking.

>career
no lol, see safety. It's just a matter of time before you get caught. However, once you choose it, it will be your career for the rest of your life as you won't be able to get a lab job with a criminal record and will be forced back into clandestine chem once released.

>>10374617
>no, you'll be doing repetitive shit
Yeah but mindless activities can be relaxing.
Tending your garden for instance, is enjoyed by lots of people

>>10374587
But he has a chemical engineering degree?

>>10374606
I think it turns into a delivery problem, but idk if your country's postal system could discover it

>>10374617
If my end goal is clandestine manufacture of legal psychdelic rcs, a BSc is probably not enough. What graduate school subject should I focus on - o-chem, biochem, neurochemistry, or psychopharmacology?

>>10374587
Fester's syntheses suck but hes good for info on setting up clandestine labs

>>10375433
The most dangerous one

>>10374617
>It's just a matter of time before you get caught
Are you saying there are no clandestine chemists who never got caught?

>>10374579
>You think the people producing and distributing this are the peaceful hippies that make the final link in the supply chain? Think again.
Elaborate. What is the LSD supply chain like?
What about stuff like MDMA, research chemicals, LSA...?

>>10375433
Interested in this too. Seems to me that biochem, neurochem and psychopharma teach you about the effects of drugs but not their synthesis, but I might be wrong.

>>10373937
if you want to get into actual clandestine chemistry it can be pretty fun if you like the ochem part
safety should not be an issue as long as you actually know what you are doing

>>10374579
the only reason lsd is the most profitable drug is because it is the end game
production involves working with hard to get shit and really dangerous as well
you can't synth it without proper training and experience in the field

>>10374583
Uncle fester and other people that did write about the production of drugs have really outdated info

>>10375433
key word manufacture, you will want to focus on organic chemistry and then retrosynthesis or anything related where you are studying.
biochem, neurology and psychopharmacology are pretty much useless
if you are in it only for the money you would be better off selling rcs as popular drugs to stupid kids

>>10375757
Do you have any idea what you are talking about?
what does LSA have to do with any of the things you mentioned
RCs are made in chink factories and shipped to the rest of the world
other run of the mill drugs are made in different places (speed in germany, mdma in the netherlands, coke in peru/bolivia/columbia, etc.)

>>10375808
I wouldn't ask that question if I knew anything how things worked. So how is the LSD supply chain organized?

>>10375823
It doesn't exist, people are selling stuff that was made in the 60s
If you can make it you just do it one time and have so much that you would be fine for the rest of your life
Even if there are LSD labs, there might be like 3 in the whole world

>>10375832
So which substance has the best low risk to high potential returns ratio?
Shit like meth and opiates earn big but are extremely dangerous, but psychedelics apparently aren't practical to get into as a clandestine chemist?

>>10375841
depends where you live and what the demand for each drug is
ironically maybe weed is the most profitable
or maybe heroin? as long as you can get a source of pods simple extraction and 1 step reaction from morphine to heroin should be pretty simple but if people don't have a big demand for it where you live it won't be as profitable
questions like that don't have a straight answer

>>10375832
>It doesn't exist, people are selling stuff that was made in the 60s
How doesn't LSD, a super fragile chemical, not degrade after 60 years of exposure to heat, sunlight, etc?

>>10375860
I live in western europe. The country doesn't matter since it's easy as fuck to move shit within the EU. And also because I'm not even a chemist and am certainly not gonna do anything illegal

>>10375864
>How doesn't LSD, a super fragile chemical, not degrade after 60 years of exposure to heat, sunlight, etc?
Long term storage of lsd is a bitch but not hard just keep it out of direct light in a freezer with a stable temperature
it is not like people care about it anyway selling tabs with double the dosage they have that have been sitting somewhere for a long time

>>10375874
As i said, if you don't actually like the organic chemistry part of clandestine CHEMISTRY you won't go far
but if your dick goes hard when you see a molecular structure it is a different story
what is your education background? are you still in uni?

>>10375900
That was just a disclaimer anon. I'm a chem student (first year) and good at org and lab so far.

>>10375841
Shrooms. If you grow a box of them you got like 10 grand USD in a month. spores are readily available online, and any hobbiest mycologist can grow them.

Whoever runs your city will find you and kill you for muscling in on their turf.
And guess what, real life isnt like a tv show

>>10373937
Yeah anon, you're probably just going to get shot after some tweaker gets paid to rat you out for a few extra hits of LSD. You could definitely tap into the market for novel/experimental drugs undergoing testing (but with fully-detailed patents available online).

>>10375860
>ironically maybe weed is the most profitable
>or maybe heroin?
weed is very cheap and anyone with the space can grow it. i think the same is true with poppies.

Why are there no RC vendors in the US? Most of them are in Canada or the EU. Is it potentially dangerous to manufacture, for example, 1P-LSD is the US?

>>10375908
then it is fucking simple
Step 1. finish every course your uni offers on organic chemistry, synthesis of organic molecules, retrosynthesis and related courses
Step 2. go read up on synthesis and common practise that people used before
read shulgins book pihkal and tihkal
Step 3. go read up all the hive and rhodisia and all the other forum archives
Step 4. profit

>>10375928
>tweaker
>few extra hits of LSD

>>10375934
i wasn't talking about growing poppies more like buying bulk
weed is one of the most expensive since the price/dose ration is fucked

>>10375952
>Ban on analogues in the US
hmmmmm i don't know why seems odd that they are all gone

>>10375966
Has anyone in the US been prosecuted for manufacturing analogs?

>>10375916
Is there any way to eat shrooms without killing them or harming them? That's the main reason I prefer chemical psychedelics.

>>10375966
>Step 3. go read up all the hive and rhodisia and all the other forum archives
wat

>>10376013
as i said above RCs are made in china
since all of them are illegal you can't sell them so all clearnet rc vendor or rather "most" of them have gone away

>>10376016
what??? how does eating shrooms harm them? are you scared of eating vegetables as well?

>>10376031
There are a handful of forums about clandestine chemistry, the hive being the most popular
they have are all down for reasons you can guess but the archives of all the posts are still available
the """"""""""new""""""""""""" hive is on r*ddit but it is nothing like its former self
science madness doesn't like talking about drugs but they have a whole subforum for explosives and high energy materials

>>10375808
What is the most common sale denomination (i.e. mg, g) of LSD and what is the price per unit?

>>10376040
> are you scared of eating vegetables as well?
I try to follow only a fruititarian diet, i.e. eating only things that fell to the ground by themselves.

Is there any way to harvest shrooms after they die or is it impossible?

>as i said above RCs are made in china
Do you know if they legal in China?

>>10376016
Harvesting them without destroying the mycelium is easy

remember the mushroom is only the fruiting body

>>10376054
you know jack shit about drugs don't you
common doses of LSD range from 100-200 micrograms (mcg/μg/ug)
Price is around 10$ a tab and a tab is usually 100mcg
pretty expensive

>>10376083
When you buy shrooms they are dried so i would consider them dead
people also tend to sell tubes of liquid equal to X grams of shrooms
i don't know how they make those maybe they extract the psilocybin? haven't looked into that

As for the RC question places like the US and the UK that banned analogues of psychoactives rather than the drugs themselves are putting research chems in the same boat as other drugs
This is not the case for most countries tho, a few popular ones have been banned after they went mainstream see MXE but yes alot of analogues are legal in china
since 95% of producers are chinks if something is illegal there supply for it is really low

>>10376089
Ye the mushroom itself is more of a reproductive organ than the main part of the fungus

>>10376123
I wonder if the Chinese government doesn't care, or do they actively support those labs?

>>10376166
it obviously cares everytime there is an outbreak in freedom land the send people over to china land to complain so they make it illegal and the cycle continues
making analogues is really easy even i could do it and since china understand that it is futile to try to stop the producers they just keep an eye on them but that it about it

>>10375952
Read this:

http://www.kentuckylawjournal.org/index.php/2015/02/22/not-for-human-consumption/

Basically any drug that is considered "substantially similar" to a scheduled drug can be considered the same charge. However the flaw with that was the "not intended for human consumption" labeling, despite everyone rolling their eyes knowing the real intended use. This worked for awhile until a scientific committee was established to schedule specific analogues, which is why we have a huge fucking list of banned analogues. More recent legislation has been passed that allows for: courts to take "flexibility" to "substantially similar" analogues, the atomic/molecular orientation offers little to the idea of similarity between scheduled substances and analogues so the effects of substances are compared to the central nervous system of mice as the real distinctive indication regardless of peer review considering time restraints, and regardless of the "not for human consumption" the jury is expected to make the decision based on what the "professional" states making the defense of "b-but, mice aren't humans! There is no evidence of human research and my possession of it was just for collecting!" absolutely trivial. You think 1 fucking propyl group with a carbonyl tacked on the LSD molecule to make "legal" 1P-LSD will have any hope of surviving a court case on U.S. soil, especially when we all know cops have to meet quota and locking people up is corruptly profitable? You think bribes don't happen in our obviously rigged system if government? The jury has been fed the idea drugs are bad and defending a synthetic drug would ostracize them in front of cops, and possibly family/co-workers/bosses putting their freedom, homes, and jobs on the line. Canada, EU, and China have different laws and you can easily move about countries/provinces/territories. Yes you can order 1P past border customs easy enough but if you're caught you're fucked.

>>10374606
Not really. You wouldn't have to meet up with druggies, but you open yourself up to risks of someone discovering your packages in the mailing system.

you people are nuts. If you have no background in how illegal enterprises work, if we are talking Burger'ville, You will most likely get Busted if you do it more than 3 or 4 times.
Or you will wind up being forced to work in some drug lab for biker gangs. Seriously, anyone even half debating this, if you come from a squeaky clean background, Do Not do it, one thing on your record now fucks you for life.

>tfw the clean and reasonably safe one is the hard one to synthesize

>>10373992
>you would be worth way more alive than dead
>it wouldnt be worth to kill you
I hear this a lot and I dont get it.The drug market is bigger than most of the world's economies. What on earth makes you think they need *you*?
They could go up to whatever washed up chemistry graduate, and pay them 6 figures for a step-by-step guide. Not that you'd need one written down in YOTL 2019, with Internet on your pocket, but there's that.

>but my meth is quality!
And most junkies wont give much of a fuck. There's no market for premium meth because the consumers have no bargaining power. They'll pay you triple for the same ammount just to get their dose.

>>10376276
you are wrong 99% meth and all common drugs for that matter are cut sometimes you get less than 50% product
every junkie knows this and if someone sold actual meth that is 99% pure it would be really popular but it is just too profitable to cut
a lot of people wash their drugs to remove cutting agents and can see how much product they actually got

>>10376187
How hard would it be to learn Chinese. get a PhD in Chemistry from a Chinese university, and join a Chinese RC manufacturing company as an American?

Once you learn the tricks of the trade, would it be feasible to relocate to some island in the Caribbean or some African country, where you can just bribe the government to leave you alone?

>>10376290
no reason to get a phd in chem
one in business would be better, you don't need any knowledge since you are not the one actually making these chems you just own the factories and have to known what is legal and what is not legal
but nowadays when the rc scene is on its last legs it wouldn't be a good idea to dive into a dying industry
if a miracle comes our way and the RC scene is brought back to its former glory it would be worth it otherwise not

Ignore anyone who says this is viable, everyone forgets that in breaking bad, walt wasn't "just" a highschool teacher, he was at caltech doing high level research and is an expert chemist. You can't just take orgo I and II and instantly just know how to make LSD and meth. My orgo teacher years ago put up the synthesis for cocaine and all the goofass kids were like
>is he allowed to do this?
Of course he is, because just giving you the synthetic route doesn't mean you know how to do anything.

Where are you going to get quality instruments and glassware? Just steal everything? What about starting materials? Everything starts to suck dick when you can't just pop open the aldrich catalog and get going. You think drug dealers are just going to line up behind you
>oh hey anon we heard you have a bachelors in chemistry and automatically have synthetic organic experience, here's all of our stock that we haven't been able to move pls be our walter white

>How interesting
If you define interesting as almost poisoning yourself on a daily basis because you have no fumehood and haven't changed the filters in your mask in 3 years, then maybe
>safe
no
>realistic
lmao big no

>>10376303
What if I want to make it myself?

>>10376325
>Where are you going to get quality instruments and glassware?
Same place as all the other chemists?

>>10374088
>he thinks CIA isn't the biggest cartel

>>10375832
>It doesn't exist, people are selling stuff that was made in the 60s
I thought they were just ripping everyone off with analogues