/sci/ - Science & Math

2) a new big boy crane has arrived. Perhaps they were waiting on this one for the final mating of the two big pieces?

this new section seems to be build differently, or out of a different material. you can see on the right the frame has not yet been populated fully with panels.

>>10244955
Why does it look beat all to hell? That would seem to be sub-optimal, but then I am not an engineer.

the crane appears to be actually part of a crane, which will be assembled on location

>>10244987
could just be an optical trick, but I think you're right. This hopper is for low-altitude test flights, so fine craftsmanship of the outer skin probably isn't a priority.

>>10244954
>construction
not science or math

Who would win

>multibillion dollar federal rocket system contracted out to two collaborating aerospace giants with massive teams of lifelong experts

Or

>one shiney boi

how much do you think these guys are getting paid? 25 bucks an hour?

>>10245015
Probably 40, aerospace welding pay is great.

>>10245017
>aerospace-grade 300-series stainless steel
does that even exist

>>10245021
Now it does.

>>10244997
It's a rocket
Rockets further science
It's more science than engineering general

big fucking crane edition

>>10245015
I got payed 12 to stand around like an idiot and carry pipes, in sure they're getting at least 20

>>10245039
plus you have to live in Boca Chica, which isn't exactly the most exciting place on earth (yet)

>>10245006
S H I N Y B O I

H

I

N

Y

B

O

I

>>10245045
i wonder if the region will boom because of the space port. there's nothing really going on in the area except a nice tourist beach. other than that it's flat, hot, and 90% mexican.

>>10245056
Texas says it'll bring in 500 jerbs to the region by 2027

here's a job for /sci/
-drive down to Boca Chica
-take pictures
-post them here

you'll be paid in (you)'s

>>10245036
>rockets further science
not spacex ones, they are used for marketing and commercial purposes

>>10245169
>SpaceX doesn't launch scientific payloads

Look, we know you don't like Elon Musk but you could at least keep your sperging to actual facts.

>>10245169
>CASSIOPE
>DSCOVR
>Jason-3
>Paz
>TESS
>SAOCOM 1A
>Literal tons of research on the CRS missions
wew

>>10245192
>>10245183
why is baiting elonfags so easy lmao

meanwhile in 1953

>>10245214
>USA will be on Mars first
pretty unrealistic desu

>>10245216
oh fuck didn't notice the earth in the background
argument still stands tho

>>10245216
China needs to figure out how to build things other than refined 80s Russian designs first. It takes a lot of new hardware to land chinks on the moon. For instance, extra sticky rice that doesn't get everywhere

>>10245223
doesn't matter, they are the only ones with enough fuck you money to go to mars

>>10245227
>smug Bezos.jpg

>>10245228
>bringing up bezos in a musk thread
I see you like to live dangerously

>>10245228
Yeah if he can ever manage to build a proper rocket. At the current rate he might manage that by 2030.

darn, just thought of something. you can't plaster on a big-ass American flag on the side of the rocket if the whole thing has to be clear of obstruction for the TPS to work

>>10245236
slow and steady wins the race anon, if he was dependent on as much attention whoring as Elon I'm sure he would've sent an Amazon drone to space too

>>10244987
It's definitely sub-optimal and won't be like that on the actual Starship, however for a simple hopper test vehicle why bother getting all the warps out if they don't matter?

>>10245247
I would like to imagine that the whole thing sounds like this in flight https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LCalLrlA_cI

So this new rocket is going to be fuelled by Methane right? So it's basically a huge BRAAAAAAAAP machine?

>>10245261
methalox burns clean and is odorless; our notion that CH4 smells bad comes from the shit in it when cows fart it out, and the mercaptan that is added to the stuff you buy at the store.

>>10245239
You only need TPS on one side, so the big ass American flag can be painted on the other.

soyuz is popping of momentarily
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hwGaOllKVcA
https://www.nasaspaceflight.com/2018/12/soyuz-2-1a-kanopus-v-pair-additional-payloads/

watch if you want

>>10245279
Fuck yeah I love rocket explosions.

>>10245281
why are some people so insifferable

>>10245286
Because drunk gopniks like yourself cannot even spell, let alone assemble a function orbital class rocket.

>>10245300
>most successful rocket in the history of spaceflight
inb4 lmao it's old

>>10245081
I'm currently in corpus for the Holiday... But I'm about to go back to San Antonio, with no plans on stopping by Boca Chica on the way to take pictures with my shitty phone camera, sorry.

>>10245305
it's fucking old and tiny lmao
fucking coasting on Korolev's legacy

>>10245239
The three draco engines are going to have red, white, and blue exhaust.

>>10245305
Russian spaceflight is a fucking joke without the iron fist of the CCCP to keep that shit in check.

>>10245309
so you literally can't name anything wrong with the rocket itself
reminder that it's actually the cheapest/kg rocket as well, Russians are just greedy fucks

>>10245356
>based laptop choice
>comfy room and colleagues
>no shitty cgi
>no annoying cohosts
literally nothing wrong with this

>>10245308
>mfw i live in corpus and read this
escape while you can

>>10245356
why is there a video editor on the display in the background?

>>10245356
i want to cum on her forehead

>>10245379
that's a man's jaw

>>10245381
i know

soyuz is boring, where's my hop test Elon

wtf it didnt blow up???

>>10245261
It expels just CO2 and water and a little bit of carbon monoxide from incomplete combustion. It gets loaded with methane instead of spraying it, which means the better analog would be BFR as a huge SNIFF poster.

>>10245416
hole-driller in gulag, no need to worry now comrade

>>10245272
No, new design uses polished steel all around, on the back of the vehicle the polish reflects enough heat that nothing else is needed but on the belly they are going to install a coolant loop to keep maximum skin temperature lower. If the back isn't shiny it will overheat, no flags.

>>10245356
so irons not exist in Russia

>>10245425
>no flags
what’s the point then. BFR’s secondary goal to cheap space travel is to swing America’s big dick around at the world’s dinner table, knocking over glasses and generally making a scene for itself

>>10245314
>The three draco engines
They are Raptors you FUCK
Dracos are the tiny maneuvering thrusters on Dragon and Dragon 2, burning hypergolic propellants. Superdracos are the big abort thrusters on Dragon 2 using the same propellants as Draco, originally also meant to allow propulsive landing but that was dropped because NASA was like 'I won't let you use that on any flights we buy from you anyway'. Merlin engines are obviously on Falcon 9 and Heavy and are used for main propulsion, burning kerosene with oxygen. Raptor is the new FFSC engine that burns methane with oxygen and will power the BFR vehicles and their prototypes.

>>10245314
purplish-blue exhaust, no red and not really any white except maybe in the shock cones at low throttle near sea level.

>>10245434
>>10245425
>>10245239
Perhaps they could anodize or impregnate the SS for different colors

>>10245429
>implying BFR won't LITERALLY be a giant silver dildo rocket that makes all women astronauts cum instantly on liftoff due to the vibrations of more than 14 million pounds of thrust
>implying the giant solar arrays won't have huge eagle and american flag decals printed on the shadow side

>>10245438
It will probably come back from its first flight with a slight gold/straw color due to the extreme heat of reentry causing the thickening of the oxide layer that coats the metal, just like colors that form when you are tempering steel tools.

If they anodize the surface to increase the thickness of the oxide layer to get certain colors those colored patches will necessarily also absorb more light and therefore get hotter during reentry.

>>10245446
With ship names like USS Freedom or USS Freedom II, of course

>>10245451
I nominate the name USS Liberty so that when people look it up they get some rather uncomfortable results show up.

>>10245459
elon redpilling people on the jews

>>10245474
Wouldn’t be the first time. Remember the
>”hello?”
tweet? Heh

t. Jew

>>10245451
USS Freedom
USS Liberty
USS (state name here) x50
USS Constitution
USS Triumph
USS PepsiCo

btw USS stands for United States Starship

>>10245459
>USS Liberty
Fuck off /pol/

>>10245485
Not an argument. Israel attacked a United States vessel to instigate a war, demonstrably and provably.

>>10245483
>>10245451
Doesn't Musk name his ships from the book The Player of Games

I can see the Air Force /Space Force getting one for their fleet as a USS Freedom.

>>10245515
Musk's naming is all over the place. ASDS's have Ian Banks universe names. The Boring Company TBM's have names from various poetry. Tesla models were supposed to spell out SEXY until Ford got in the way.
Who knows what the BFR's will be named after

>>10245488
Who's paying you to post here, SJW? Also no one cares even if Israel did it intentionally, which is very far from proven. All the conspirators would be dead by now.

>>10245525
yeah, in my mind any state-approved actions that are like from 50+ years ago are irrelevant. Is Spain still mad at us for the Maine incident? What about Iran Air 655? Turns out the whole world can be shitty.

>>10245521
S3XY is pretty close

>>10245515
Space Force will probably get a page like this as well

So guys, will the Hopper have internal propellant tanks or will its outer skin also be the propellant tank walls? I'm leaning towards the former.

>>10245534
>List of spacecraft carriers in the United States Space Force
based

>>10245535
There's an actual chance asking Elon on Twitter could yield an answer.

>>10245534
Lel it costs a trillion fucking dollars to get a new plane developed, some kind of orbital battleship is a total fucking fantasy for your already incredibly indebted country. Besides, whatever democrat gets in next term is just going to cancel this shit anyway.

>>10245535
internal tanks. that outer skin definitely not strong enough, especially the top part which is like 3mm sheets with tiny welds. This hopper is for testing engines and landing, and probably translation as well. Not much else; it can't get high enough to do any TPS testing

>>10245539
>>10245536
was implying a page listing the starships under the space force, not spacecraft carrier ships. sorry for not being clear. There's a page for submarines as well, for instance

>>10245539
NASA projects maybe, all DOD would have to do is put out a proposal for a space ship and Musk wins with a cheap price.

>List of titan dreadnaughts in the United States Spacey

>>10245544
DOD didn't even give BFR any funding in the recent round (the same round that gave 800 million burger bucks for OmegA development...) I'm sure they'll warm up to it. Perhaps Elon should invite some top brass out to a hop test.

>>10245537
he's tweeting right now

>>10245570
>When he tweets about fucking cars

Nigger I don't give a fuck, talk to me about rockets.

>>10245585
how do you think the car people feel?

>>10245587
https://insideevs.com/check-out-toasted-tesla-model-3-brakes/

>>10245593
no shit, the non P versions don't have the break upgrades. Any modern sedan will cook like that if you rip it around a track.

>>10245587
Literally do not care, 90% of Tesla owners are soi chugging faggots. While I do like in general what Tesla is doing, their support and parts programme is a legit scam.

>>10245593
Those are Brembo brake pads, literally nothing to do with Tesla. It's some fucking yobbo taking his street spec car and thrashing it on the track and whinging when street spec parts are not up to the challenge.

Tomorrow’s schedule
>2-3 new photos
>more shitposting
>hopefully another tweet from Elon

>>10245602
Imokwiththis.jpg

>>10245602

>>10245015
They should be stir welding.

>>10245214
>48 stars
Couldn't they at least try to pay attention?

>>10245536
The proper adjective should be "star"
>Star Carriers
>Battlestars
>Star Destroyers
>Star Cruisers

>>10245785
I doubt the artist cared about the possible statehood of Alaska and Hawaii.

>>10245829
Well why not.

>>10245432
Ya, that one. My b

>>10245483
We'll purchase 200 of'em for the spaceforce.

>>10245789
>star carrier
>traverses the universe picking up red dwarfs and transporting them to more resource rich regions of space for battlestar construction.

>battlestar
>dyson swarm weapon platforms that are essentially astroid tier particle accelerator rings that launch relativistic kinetic rocks and metal

According to russian experts this is not possible and won't be happening because the US government is already investing in its own super heavy system.

>>10245547
Wasn‘t that just because of some very specific technicality?

>>10246121
No. They want low risk projects with trusted companies the latter being the priority. And oversight over the design.
This is why ULA and Orbital ATK (now part of Northrop Grumman) got more than Blue Origin despite presenting vehicles offering considerably less performance. And one of the reasons why SpaceX's BFR was rejected.

>>10245539
What plane?

>>10245862
49 stars was in 1959, current 50 stars was in 1960. The Cosmos Science Fiction and Fantasy Magazine was published on September 1953.

>>10246121
>>10246174
>>10246174
New Glenn was picked because it's basically just an F9 on steroids, so just conservative enough for the Air Force. Also it has a strong financial backing and the size and performance to replace the notoriously tempermental Delta 4 for heavy payloads; for example, the airforce awarded BO money for a pad at Vandenberg (despite the fact that Blue's entire strategy revolves around having most their infrastructure at the cape) which is where they launch big NRO birds from. However, many have overlooked the main factor that sunk the BFR's bid: the requirement for direct to GEO, no spacecraft can return from direct to GEO (it requires more Delta V to ge to the surface of Titan) which completely scuppers the BFR's main selling point.

>>10244987
The tanks will be pressurised, that ought to smooth out the folds.

>>10246394
Those aren't tanks. The tanks will be inside the legged water tower part.

>wake up
>check Elon's twitter
>come here
>no discussion
what the FUCK people

60%+ that BFR reaches orbit in/BEFORE 2020

this one's sort of a given, but good to know

"dramatically better"

>>10246493
>>10246488
lmao how can anyone take this retard seriously

Everything now rests on Starlink.

>>10246521
or a big government check

>>10246493
Carbon comp was known to be a giant shitshow
Good that they dropped it
Clearly steel is better than aluminum too, maybe the primary concern is preventing metal fatigue though

>>10246571
Either one works

>>10246583
Steel is good even when it gets hot, a bunch of research was done on making steel work good when it's cold too, so it works over a wide range. It's just a little bit heavy for it's strength at room temperature

>>10246571
>yooo fuck the government, look where spacex brought us in literally 10 years, nasa is fucking shit, MARS 2020
- spacex fans when its going well
>o-one big government check o-or NASA contract p-please?
-spacex fans when its not going that well

>>10246583
All large space projects involve splitting up the money and goals across the entire military industrial complex. Apollo, Shuttle, ISS.
SpaceX does not really fit into the timelines, goals, and practices.

Expect two separate space programs
>government funded business as usual
>privately funded increasingly regulated and funding starved dreams

>>10246498
If anything his claims are getting more and more accurate as the years go by

>>10246721
yes , so accurate that he started to get sued for them

>>10246521
and good old quality american STEEL !!!!!!!!!!!!!
8=====D

>>10246521
>>10246571
Both are going to happen. Starlink may be huge for the regular commercial Internet, but the military is also interested in it. I think even if Starlink is a commercial flop, the military will still pick up a smaller version of it.

>>10246493
More concerned about "time" after all the SEC and pedoshit this year.

>>10244954
>delightfully counter-intuitive
>a fucking concrete rocket

>>10245763
>stir welding stainless steel

why does the welding job look extremely horrendous?

>>10247035
That's the cheapest way to get it slapped together quickly, and it doesn't need to be a high performance vehicle to serve its purpose.

>>10246616
As it should be. It is becoming increasingly clear that in spaceflight, the ideal system is government giving fixed price contracts to privateers.

>>10247065
>suddenly the government decided to give most of its money to bezos because he can pull more strings with his fuck you money
>"n-not like that!!"

>>10247110
Gotta love corruption and bribery

>>10247110
>yfw thats how it works

can somebody please explain what's going on here, how it's applicable to the public, who's doing all of this, and why I should care / what's so fascinating about it?

>>10247141
thats why stuff that affects the public, like public transportation, utilities and in my opinion the internet should be done by the government, dumbass, even if there isn't "muh healthy" competition

>>10247167
>how it's applicable to the public
it isn't in any way
>who's doing all of this
musks engineers and hired welders because he said so
>what's so fascinating about it
if you are an autist who likes SpaceX and think you will go to Mars because Musk said so you can indulge in your fantasies, otherwise it isn't fascinating at all

>>10247167
BFR is a fully reusable super-heavy-lift rocket. What is being built here is the “hopper” which will do short 5km trips up and down in Texas. It will test the landing software, engines, gimballing, etc.

The end goal of BFR is to enable extremely cheap access to space, and ultimately to launch manned missions to mars as soon as possible.

It’s extremely exciting, since it is the first real flight hardware of the rocket which will make humanity an interplanetary species

i always knew spacefags were all brainlets but being unable to answer simple questions is just embarrassing

shit how do you delete a post on this site do i have to contact admins?

>>10247203
>5km
but that doesn't seem like very far. definitely doesn't seem far enough to go up in space
>goal of BFR is to enable extremely cheap access to space
how are they planning on doing that that differs from the current technology/methods we're using? is it just the fact that the rockets are reusable?

>>10247235
lmao wtf
post 10247167 was mine

>>10247251
>what is "inspect and edit pages"

>>10247238
Checkmark the post, click delete at the bottom

>>10247244
Reusable rockets, and designed from first principles to be cheap to operate.

5km doesn’t seem impressive, but go back and look at the grasshopper program at SpaceX. This sort of hopping is quite useful for collecting data and verifying hardware configurations.

>>10247244
You're ignoring the entire point of the post you shit eating cocksucker

>>10247269
is it not possible to verify hardware configurations from the ground?

>>10247270
wow, thanks for discouraging me from learning more about the current state of science programs that I don't really pay attention to
thanks to your super helpful post, I'm now more open and willing to look at these threads in the future and be even more curious about the great shitposting losers in these threads!

>>10247283
There’s only so much that simulations can teach you. BFR is a new rocket, with new engines. They’re starting from scratch on the software side, most likely. It’s worth it to crash a few hoppers while they figure out the landing algorithms, and test things like uneven terrain landing (which will happen on mars no doubt). This way they can also rapidly iterate on the hardware, as issues become apparent in flight

>>10247290
ah ok
neat, thanks man

>>10247292
I can explain more but I’m on my phone right now, give me a bit

>>10247244
>but that doesn't seem like very far. definitely doesn't seem far enough to go up in space
well yeah, the whole point is going up 5 km

>>10247283
Hop tests are basically the ground

>>10246661
>timelines
as long as possible
>goals
get as much money into private hands as possible
>practices
pork

>>10247244
>is it just the fact that the rockets are reusable?

The goal is not just reusability, but rapid reusability, meaning you dont need to do much but load propellant and go again, an almost aeroplane-like operation. Something like this was the original goal of the Shuttle program, except that failed.

>>10247464
why did it fail back then? nothing has really changed in terms of physics... so why would they be able to create rapid reusable rockets now, besides the availability of time?

>>10247244
lots of vertical integration, less pork spreading

>>10247469
>>10247463
what's pork? and pork spreading?

>>10247464
It was the original plan for the Falcons, then Falcons Block 5, and they failed, too.

I said it once and I'll say it again: Reusability is a meme.

>>10247478
a meme spacex fans like to spew, same for "muh vertical integration"

>>10247469
As you can tell by Tesla's gigantic profits vertical integration is awesome and works fine.

>>10247478
pork is when government contracts are used as job programs instead of actually accomplishing anything
the shuttle suffered greatly from this, where changes in the name of efficiency were blocked because they would put people out of a job, so they were stuck doing it the long and expensive way

Someone posted this in NSF. It's a continually updated map of SpaceX's facilities and activities. StarHopper is on there too.

https://www.google.com/maps/d/viewer?mid=1wvgFIPuOmI8da9EIB88tHo9vamo&hl=en_US&ll=25.987127757997428%2C-97.18535331140924&z=20

>>10247468
Boosters splashed down in salt water, necessitating heavy refurbishment. The External Tank burned up after the burn to orbit was completed and it was jettisoned. After coming back, the heat shield and engines on the shuttle had to be inspected/repaired (heatshield) or removed. torn down, rebuilt, and reinstalled (SSME).

In the end there was simply too much work that needed to be done after each flight for the shuttles, further complicated by the need to have a rescue shuttle ready to go after Columbia burned up due to the foam strike.

>>10247491
The issue was shaving off the heat from re-entry. Side boosters were dirt cheap anyways. Unless they have some wunder-material up their sleeves they are going to run into the same problems. But even without the heatshield-problem reusability is barely possible, see Falcon 9 first stages for that.

>>10247503
also reminder that the bfr is a gigantic dildo multiple times the size of the shuttle, and they want to achieve a reusability multiple times higher than that of it

>>10247478
I guess it's some weird reference to pork barrel policies.

>>10247486
>pork is when government contracts are used as job programs instead of actually accomplishing anything
It's more like if you're a Governor or something like that, and you put in place monetary/trade policies to improve voter opinions. Smoot-Hawley for example is often cited as a result of pork barreling. It does include things like giving grants to industries in exchange for creating jobs/stopping lay-offs and reducing unemployment.

>>10247485
>>10247469
Vertical integration can work, but there are some seriously bogus explanations going around for why it works wrt Elon's projects. And I guess it does reduce pork in the sense that Elon then siphons the money across a number of companies rather than just one.

>>10247503
>Side boosters were dirt cheap anyways.
A single booster on Shuttle cost more than a new Falcon 9. That's true whether or not the solid motor is brand new or rebuilt from a previous flight.

>>10247503
And the shuttle heat shield tiles, while they definitely worked, were fragile as fuck. It was not unheard of for the thing to come back with chunks of dozens of tiles missing, or the tiles outright missing.

>>10247529
That's bull, they were 15-20 million to refurbish and 23 million to build anew.

>>10247538
Yeah, but tearing down an abblative heat shield and putting it back on again isnt going to be cheaper than that, either.

>>10247529
stop fucking lying
>At the time, NASA
estimated the cost of a new solid rocket booster to be
$25 million. The cost of recovering and refurbishing a
single booster was estimated at $7 million
also reminder that a single booster literally has twice the thrust of a spacex f9

>>10247489
doesn't work

>>10247503
the side boosters would have been dirt cheap if they just made new ones, but they took the old ones apart first before they threw them out and pretended to refurbish them

>>10247553
>NASA estimated
ONONONONONONONONO
>twice the thrust of a spacex f9
And no throttling or shutdown ability...

>>10247522
Also, Elon can run his businesses with an eye for efficiency and make changes where changes need to be made

>>10247574
>hurr I don't like facts so I'll just pretend they're lying
literally Elon musk "you're a peso" tier behaviour

>>10247575
>Elon can run his businesses with an eye for efficiency
To do that he would need an eye for efficiency.

>>10247586
it's true, but he's still better at it than NASA, who is hamstrung by Congress

>>10247587
Elon has a non-profitable car company despite cashing in loads of government monies and a rocket company that has done nothing so far despite launching satellites. Why the fuck do shillboys always think they can always shit on the reliable, experienced and high-accomplishing agency that is NASA? Especially considering NASA is what made SpaceX happen and is keeping them afloat.

>>10247599
it's basically this
>>10246616

>>10247599
>a rocket company that has done nothing so far despite launching satellites
isn't that what a rocket company is for? launching satellites? I'd say SpaceX is quite successful in that regards

>>10247551
It is when you dont have to inspect or replace well twenty thousand individually unique tiles every single flight.

>>10247562
???

>>10247608
??? pic related
>>10247599
>shitting on NASA
I love NASA, they had some great accomplishments in the 60s and 70s, but everything since has been hobbled by Congressional and Presidential meddling
The shuttle could have been amazing, but no, it was a dangerous deathtrap, it was too heavy, and it was monstrously expensive

>>10247606
>why did they use tiles instead of a big plate? how the fuck should I know, I'm just a musk fan and not an actual intelligent person with a knowledge of physics

>>10247614
thats weird, im not getting any issue. it loads right away.

>>10247621
does google have an abridged link
try to share it and copy the link

>>10247617
I'm aware of why they didn't use a plate you fuckwit, I'm saying that what the shuttle used, while functional, was too much of a pain in the ass to use outside of the Shuttle program. Can't really do gas-n-go when you have to inspect and fix the multi-thousand segment outer hull after every flight lest a missing tile or two result in a hole big enough to blow your shit up on entry.

>>10247634
so what's SpaceX solution for a rocket three times the size of a space shuttle?

>>10247638
make the whole thing out of stainless steel so it can take more heat
polish it up to a mirror sheen so it reflects most of the heat away
liquid cooling with onboard cryogenic methane

>>10247638
no ablative material. Everything is designed to last N number of stress cycles etc. Engines that can be relit over and over and over again without refurb. Steel construction, so less fatigue failure probability.

Falcon 9 already has little to nothing done on the swap-stuff-our side of refurb

>>10247646
*swap-stuff-out

>>10247645
jet fuel can't melt steel rockets

>>10247617
>least intelligent comment of all time

>>10247645
I fucking hope you're trolling lmao>>10247646
>no ablative material.
>claims to know why they used tiles instead of ablator shields
are you unironically retarded

I hope that if you rap the hulk with your knuckles it makes a nice CLONG CLONG CLONG sound

>>10247679
*rap the hull
man today is not my day with spieling

>>10247638
>>10247645
>>10247646
Basically SpaceX are going to use a combination of a non-ablative TUFROC-derived heat shield (used on the X-37), active cooling and stainless steel heat reflection to minimise reentry loads.

>>10247688
Plus a big fat surface area to hit the atmosphere with; and probably multiple landing burns I’d think. Heat is generated with respect to the cube of the speed right?

>>10247688
>literally using NASA technology and hating on NASA at the same time
>>10247695
>asking retarded questions a high schooler with physics as a faculty could answer
you guys truly are a special breed

FFFUUUUUTTUUUURREEEEE

>>10247698
*wheeze*

>>10247697
aren’t you a jolly individual

>>10247676
it's their plan
we will all see how it works
>>10247688
A what?

>>10247697
>literally using NASA technology and hating on NASA at the same time
I thought we were hating on the Space Shuttle not NASA in general, from all accounts TUFROC is a great heatshield, so good that the airforce wanted it and Boeing stole it.
>A what?
Documents have revealed that SpaceX are involved in a technology transfer with NASA Ames, which involves knowledge about carbon impregnated heat shielding. This basically confirms their in contact with the guys who designed TUFROC: a non-ablative, light-weight, reusable, silica-based, carbon-impregnated heat shield material. It's quite famous due to it being used by the airforce for the X-37 spaceplane and because the team behind it received a NASA invention of the year award.

>>10247755
>I thought we were hating on the Space Shuttle not NASA
is this your first time in a spacex thread?

>>10247768
you fucking schizo

>>10247775
what? lmao

>>10247777
nobody hates NASA, there are no "fanboys", and you're essentially responding to made up phantoms

>>10247807
I hate NASA because they're assdragging embezzling shitters

>>10247812
yeah but that's a factual assessment, not hate

>>10247807
just read the last bfr thread anon
>>10240388

>>10247820
I was there the whole time, you're screaming at clouds

>>10247816
>uses NASA technology
>"lol spacex fags are so delusional they both hate and need NASA at the same time"
>nobody hates NASA anon
>NASA is shit tho
>yes but this isn't hate

>>10247825
NASA being dragged down by congressional meddling and being jerked around by a succession of Presidents doesn't mean that they don't produce worthwhile science and work
it's important to be impassionate about this sort of thing

>>10247831
Don't eat the low effort bait

>>10247880
he hasn't responded to me
he's probably an actual schizo, not some retard baiting for (you)s

>>10247883
>>10247831
>>10247880
>hurr he's just trolling
thankfully the people at NASA aren't retarded petulant children who need to hold a grudge against anyone who won't give them funding, and understand the greater good, are willing to cooperate and pursue their goals, even if it sometimes doesn't work out as expected (shuttle). or else they simply wouldn't provide anything to SpaceX and bfr would be done in about two months.

>>10247892
who's been acting like a petulant child?

>>10247899
Elon my friend, who else

Is this thunderf00t himself?
I think it is

>>10247831
NASA gets abused as a general purpose science agency.

Development and production is needlessly expensive and complex. due to pork spending to keep defense companies alive and jobs spread over 48 states.

Back to BFR now, lads

>>10247907
>anyone critical of muskfags is thunderfoot
why are you guys so obsessed with him?
>>10247908
>the pork spending meme again

>>10247908
it's a damn shame
>>10247912
ooooh, pretty

kinda fucking crazy how quickly this is being whipped up. my glee is immeasurable

>>10247913
it's not a meme

>blind reverence of NASA and refusal to admit they can do wrong
>blind hatred of Musk and refusal to admit he can do right
>obsessed with huffing his own farts and wont listen to anything at all ever
Yep, it's really him, or one of his cultists

>>10247913
SLS using solid boosters. so the company that makes solid rockets for nuclear weapons is kept afloat.

Shuttle parts made in over a dozen states. Mainly the same people that made the Saturn V. Same people making the SLS.

>other space companies: we need a gigantic building, huge tooling, months of prep work, and a massive lab-coat-wearing team to build our rockets
>spacex: lol just rent a fuckload of vertical lifts and cranes

>>10247924
this is just the hopper test vehicle, we'll see what the final production of Starship looks like eventually

>>10247921
>literally admit that NASA made a mistake with the space shuttle
>blind hatred of musk
you know, I wouldn't call it "blind" hatred but whatever suits you best. I used to be a muskfag too, about 2 years ago. then I started studying aerospace engineering.
>won't listen
to what exactly? your obsessions of going to mars because musk said so? you are literally in a thread admiring a shittily wielded grasshopper prototype which won't even fly above 5km. meanwhile the funding situation for spacex is deeply concerning, which is actually kinda sad since falcons were on a really good path, but musk had to come in with his deranged ideas of "muh ebin space colonisation"

>>10247929
>same exact setup, except now they’ve rented five more scissor lifts

>>10247933
wouldn't that be something

>>10247931
oh, it’s YOU. I knew I recognized you posts. Pretty sure you should get checked out by a doc dude

Daily reminder that this instigator was around in the first thread as well. Please ignore him

>>10247936
>hurr I won't respond to criticism, I'd rather call everyone a schizo

>>10247939
>carefully cropping out the people that agree with me
nice job anon

>>10247944
No one agreed with you.
We already have a resident schizo on /sci/. His name is Tooker and we love him very much. Go find another board that doesn’t have one yet

More photos coming over the tubes

>>10247924
Don't you forget the holy inflatable tent

>>10247931
why is it wrong to look with interest upon the hopper test?

>>10247959
every time you call it a tent a Sprung employee sheds a tear

>>10247947
is schizo the only insult you know? at least be more creative.
>>10247963
spacex should be concentrating on commercialisation and establishing their dominance with further price decreases by reusability increases, not build a completely new rocket for (currently) extremely limited uses. it's the same problem that has befallen Tesla and certainly is going to ruin it if it keeps going like that.

>>10247973
eh, if they crash and burn at least it'll be interesting
can't wait for the in-flight abort test

>>10247973
BFR will carry up most of the starlink constellation, which will fund their mars missions. It will also supposedly be cheaper to launch than the falcon 9 because the second stage is reusable. This rocket will do everything you think they should be doing with the falcon 9.

>>10247973
They're still making block 5 9s and Heavies. The dragon 2 is about to start flight.

>>10247981
>it will be cheaper than a significantly smaller and also reusable rocket
>it will do everything other rockets can and more, making them obsolete
hmm why am I not really convinced by this
>This rocket will do everything you think they should be doing with the falcon 9
then why work on the falcon at all and not concentrate all of your workforce on the bfr?

>>10247996
>then why work on the falcon at all and not concentrate all of your workforce on the bfr?
Because right now they are making money by launching falcon 9s.
The falcon 9 proved that propulsive landing and reusability is a viable business model. Unfortunately, it can't land the second stage because its too small to carry enough fuel. The BFR is designed to reuse both stages of the rocket. It will also launch about 10 times more mass than the falcon 9. That means you can send more expensive payloads, or multiple payloads, all for less cost than the falcon 9.

>>10247996
>Cost
Generally rockets get cheaper the more mass they can lift, propellant isn't massively expensive when you compare it with the cost of refurbishing or replacing complex high performance parts like engines every launch. A reusable rocket gets cheaper and cheaper the bigger you can build it, cost-per-kilogram tends to go down. Saturn V for example is cheaper than the shuttle to carry cargo (when you adjust the costs for inflation and all that) simply because it can carry a lot more tonnage per launch, even though individually it's launches are more expensive.
>It will make other rockets obsolete.
If there are no other reusable heavy lift systems operating it will at the very least have a monopoly on launching big payloads, because it's reusable nature will make it less expensive to operate and thus more people can afford to buy space on it.
>Why not drop the F9 for the BFR.
Because right now the F9 is their workhorse rocket, they launch constantly and it helps bring in money for them to continue working on the BFR. To dump the F9 would also be to ask the investors to stay bought in while also having to sit on their hands and wait for the BFR to be ready, it's easier to keep their confidence up if you can show them you're immediately profiting from their investments.

>>10247996
they are moving all of their available workforce to BFR once crew dragon is done, you fucking schizo. We’ve known this since forever

>>10247973
>he thinks he knows exactly what a 7000-person company should do
Well that checks off a diagnosis box: Delusion of grandeur

>>10247973
>he thinks Tesla is in trouble
Wew

>>10247914
>launch day
>all of the lenses of the launch photographers get destroyed by the searing brightness

>>10245356
>Pocockmock
Lmaoing at their letter system,

>>10247244
>is it just the fact that the rockets are reusable?
Mostly. Imagine not being able to use cargo ships more than once.

Calling it now - Super Heavy is also totally different in how it lands/takes off. Elon says that they switched to SS to speed up the program. In my mind, this also means that they’ve opted for a much simpler launch pad. Launch pads take months to make; pouring concrete, installing GSE, range stuff. There is currently basically zero work being done at the Boca Chica launch site. So, Super Heavy will likely be able to take off and land with almost zero ground hardware to support it. Maybe they’ve just added more legs, or something.

>>10248188
correct. From Falcon 9, we can assume similar if not lower non-production related rocket costs; transportation and integration and ground crew + flight management stuff. So, that’s only a couple million per flight.

>>10247916
That’s the difference working wth sheet steel makes

>>10248204
I’m sure that there are more finely made parts that will come from Hawthorn to be added. After all, it could just be this frame that is quick to build, and everything else has already been in the manufacturing stage for weeks. I don’t think we know the exact date that they made the official switch to SS, but it wold be interesting to know

>>10248190
Uh we aren’t seeing any bfr launches until 2020 no reason for box of chica’s to be ready early

>>10248213
I highly doubt the final rocket will actually be made in 6 foot segments either, all hand welded together...

But for a,hopper nothing matters

>>10248215

How's SLS going

>>10248232
Over budget, behind schedule. Same as it always has been, although we are edging closer to the launch date bit by bit. We’re also edging closer and closer to the point where they admit there’s only like two payloads that they’re ever going to launch on it.

they’re working into the night again it seems

>>10247924
Unironically why SpaceX is based

>>10248225
That is no accident

>>10248248
kino

>>10248267
Shotwell recently said in an interview that the direction SpaceX’s culture was heading was worrying. She said that the start-up style, fast-development & flat management hierarchy + open to ideas work environment had faded away now that they have 7000+ employees. She mentioned that they were trying to cut out the inhibiting fat if you will that had grown over time.
Maybe they’ve pushed with that idea and overhauled the employee policies/management etc? The blazing speed of this operation is reassuring.

Short video from local news of the workers working
https://www.kveo.com/news/local-news/spacex-building-prototype-spaceship/1676788557
Anything we can glean from the clips you think?

>You can count on Local 23 News for the latest on the space exploration coverage.
sure

>>10248285
Lets hope this Company doesn't follow the path of the rest

>>10248285
Shotwell seems bretty based and autistic for a women from what I have seen so maybe she can keep this typical corporate shit in check. You are right though, the speed of this is fucking ridiculous, working through christmas and shit. I will be blown away if we really get a test hopper for March.

Just thought of something - flight termination system. For aluminum rockets it’s pretty simple, you run some detonators down the length of the rocket to unzip it when needed. Will standard FTS explosives be strong enough for the 20mm thick steel of BFR? Wonder what other solution they’ll think of, or perhaps a single kg or so charge of HE somewhere does the trick

>>10248346
One way I see them possibly doing it is dumping some LOX into the methane tank(s) then setting it off. The overpressure (coupled with aerodynamic stress incurred by the rocket going out of control before/during flight termination) would then blow the rocket apart.

>>10248346
most rockets carry a small chemical warhead inside to ignite the molecules into resonance, complex but effective

>>10248351
yes, but that’s dependent on your fuel systems being operational. I think that part of the AFTS agreement was that it was completely redundant and separate from the other rocket components

>>10248370
Hmmm, point. Do the BFR first stage tanks share a common bulkhead? Maybe a block of C4 or two there (rupture the tanks), and another block or two near the engines (destroys the plumbing and the thrust structure, terminating thrust) would certainly do the job.

They might also use some form of shaped charge inside the tanks against the wall pointing outwards, but the issue with that then is that whatever explosive they use has to be resistant to multiple exposures to high temperature swings (cryogenic during launch, high temperature during entry) without detonating or degrading.

Another option would be to simply rig the COPVs to automatically and independently open and overpressurize the tanks when the AoA is out of bounds. From there, the pressure spike blows the rocket apart from the inside out.

>>10248380
I don’t think BFR will have any COPV’s

somewhat related, interesting 1960 video about range safety
https://youtu.be/JLDY26gSeMg

>>10247908
Without that "pork spending" neither SpaceX nor Blue Origin would have rocket engineers and experienced aerospace workers they can hire to build their shitty meme rockets. And without the overpaid NASA contracts it would be bankrupt within a year. You fanboys are the biggest cancer.

>>10247916
Just shows they are running out of money even faster than expected. This hop is nothing but a PR to gather funding.

>>10248487
>>10248507

Remember to ignore shitposters and their garbage bait
Giving them yous just makes them shit on the floor even more

>>10247924
>we need the government to pay for our building, tooling, years of prep work, and most importantly paper work

>>10248518
You know, even this memed image pretties up things a lot.
>space stations
>lunar landings
>space infrastructure
>*gross space product*

Sad thing is they'll just build the toll booth in 30 years and call that realistic and a great success no more could be done its physics.

I urge anons to watch the first Mars Direct presentation from Zubrin, and then weep.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vD3U0QcEYXs

>>10248619
spacecraft literally does the same tho
>pretty cgi
>pretty numbers
>somehow making extraordinary claims without anything to back them up
>throwing any kind of realism out of the window and assuming the best case scenario in every action they do
sure it gets people more hyped up than a boring boomer nasa mission but as soon as you fuck up even once your entire shit is in the gutter. Which, let's be frank here is inevatibly going to happen, sooner or later.

He's back

>>10248628
?

>>10248619
Zubrin is cool desu and his plan is absolutely 100% doable. The fact that it wasn't implemented gets me raging and want to gas every one of these piece of shit aerospace companies that siphon space funds into their private yachts. My only bone to pick is that the people who went would have been fucked without radiation protection on Mars. I know he likes to talk about how people kvetch about radiation and he is 100% right, whoever goes has to accept the half year of background rads during travel, but another year and a half of rads in those tuna cans plus the return rads is way too much, this probably could be solved by landing near a hill and digging a hole in the side to move the habs into but that would probably blow the mass budget out for an excavator and moving equipment.

>>10248673
>the future is dwarf fortress
Never fails to make me smile

>>10247697
>>literally using NASA technology and hating on NASA at the same time

NASA can still excel at basic research, it is the rest where they are grossly inefficient, especially when it comes to economic efficiency. It is not hate, just facts.

>>10248695
Just don't fucking reply to him please for god's sake.

>>10248697
let it go dude, he hasn't posted since yesterday

>>10247244
>is it just the fact that the rockets are reusable?

An aeroplane actually costs more than a rocket launch. Reusablity is the reason why average Joe can buy a ticket.

>>10244954
What's the point exactly of doing second stage hops before doing first stage hops?

>>10248730
>second stage hops
>second stage
That's the one.

>>10248741
he's not wrong tho
why start with testing the second stage before the first

>>10248673
The directs have room for optimization and changes, but that's not a problem or a reason why they are ignored. It's actually spectacularly simple - the directs are means to achieve a mission, but there is no mission. There hasn't been since Apollo. Money are channeled into contractors so that they have something to do, rather than doing something.

To the anons who think cancelling SLS is a good idea (it is), keep in mind once it is cancelled the contractors will begin working on something else of equal value and usefulness. This is the problem in the space program and I don't see a solution that doesn't involve sidestepping it entirely for private efforts. Zubrin has been going at it since the 90's and are nearing the 2020's now.


Since we are on Zubrin theme here's another one where he argues against a proponent of the now cancelled* asteroid redirect mission. I think he btfo him in the argument but ultimately the other guy got what he wanted.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OOcvICvy6iE

>*cancelled because it's essentially the lunar orbital tincan

>>10248746
>>10248730

1. Because it is easier to build the second stage since it is smaller and has less engines.

2. Because second stage reentry heating from orbital velocity is the biggest technological obstacle, so it makes sense to tackle it first.

>>10248730
Because it is not a "second stage".
It is an orbiter, transfer vehicle, and a lander meant for Earth and interplanetary operations as well as long term human habitation. Calling it a spaceship is not an exaggeration. It is well beyond conventional capsules or the space shuttle.
It is also larger than most existing rockets even if you count all their stages.

Why SpaceX would chose to work on the most important and difficult part, instead of on an oversized Falcon 9 booster is a simple matter of priorities.

>>10247489
Turns out it worked on my phone
Hmmm
/maps/Ufdd7NP8Amy

More video of the construction https://twitter.com/KVEOACuadros/status/1078654739900977152

Here is a stainless steel aircraft for comparison. BFR will be one shiny boi for sure.

>>10249058
I think the OP photo really shows just how reflective it will be

crane time

moments away from lifting operation; there’s a post about it on the Boca Chica spacex Facebook group. The appear to be about to lift the smaller top section

>>10249138
>>10249146
>>10249194
hype

>>10249138
>Mars InSight placing the protective dome over the seismometer (circa 2018 colorized)

>MU69 flyby
>Bennu orbit insertion
>last Iridium launch
>Delta IV heavy launch
>39A test fit with crew dragon
>starship hopper assembly
>New Shepherd launch
pretty good next couple weeks I’d say

>>10249058
An object that large and this shiny will be quite a sight in the night sky.
Astronomer's are gonna be seething though.

>>10249231
Are you batshit, theyll love it.

>>10249234
they complained with humanity star. Starship will be like 50x brighter, especially with the solar panels deployed. Speaking of which, I wonder where they’ll pop out now

>>10249250
>ecologists mad because methane spraying
>astronomers mad because shiny
>govspace mad because spaceship
>california mad because aliens in the sky

Things aren't looking good.

>>10249290
hah, if you think the LA freakouts over dusk F9 flights is bad image what the Mexicans will think when BFR takes off.

>>10248770
The booster is way harder than the Starship. Also they aren't really working on any difficult parts, just doing some hops in lower atmosphere. This has little to do with any challenges it will face.

The real reason is quite the opposite, doing hops with the Starship is actually way less challenging so they are doing that first, because they want something to show-off asap.

New thread
>>10249331
>>10249331