/sci/ - Science & Math

>>10240021
it's not real, it's a meme that colleges use to look good and get donations. they don't actually do it for grad programs if they're worth shit.
if you're looking at CA, apply to good state schools like UCLA and Berkeley cause they're not legally allowed to do affirmative action by the state. It's quite nice.

>>10240023
I applied to Riverside for Entomology

Do you think some professor wants to spend 6 years babysitting an incompetent retard?
If you don't have what it takes you won't get in.

>>10240024
See? There you go. Riverside is public so they're not legally allowed to even consider the race.
Kind of a meme location though.

>>10240024
>>10240030
Is it even near water? I guess it's called "Riverside" so it probably is near something at least.

>>10240025
I see it at the undergrad level all the time. They think they can shape the student into the kind of worker they want.

Also there is this program at my school:
https://www.csun.edu/build-poder

Those who are accepted into that are given a free ride. Tuition, a monthly stipend, a spot in a lab. Just because they are poor/colored. This is for undergrad mind you. I had to do monkey work and get lucky just to get in a lab and these people just get it handed to them because of the color of their skin?

>>10240030
>>10240032
They have one of the best programs for my area of study in the world.

Yeah the location is shit. There used to be a river nearby, I'm sure it's dried up now.

Depends on the country and university. Some departments get a quota nigger to avoid legal trouble from rejecting other dark-skinned candidates, or to collect brownie points from management and the press.

The greater problem happens when some women get a PhD solely by piggybacking on real researchers, then get a quota job, and suddenly end up as a department head or dean. Have seen it - it's a death sentence for the department.

i just wish i could have gotten away with saying i was a gay indian on all my apps

>>10240034
Based entomologyposter.
I accidentally walked into our entomology building one time and walked around for a long time until I saw some bug posters outside a professor's door. Then I realized what all the locked cabinets around me contained. Thousands of dead bugs. I almost fucking shit myself.
It does seem fun though.

>>10240048
It really is the greatest. I like the potential applied benefits. So many colleagues studying "is this two species or just one?" or "the invertebrate diversity after a fire". Like who the fuck cares? I'll be over here studying how to keep our cash crops pollinated and pest free.

What school?

>>10240021
I'm Romanian, and schools our universities tend have special places for minorities, but seeing "20 places (1 gypsy)" always cracks me up.

>>10240059
Berkeley.
Very cool focus. Best of luck with grad school.

>>10240021
I'm Romanian, and our universities tend to have special places for minorities, but it looks more like segregation than affirmative action. Seeing "20 places (1 gypsy)" on admission websites always cracks me up.

>>10240074
kek

>>10240074
So america goes trough th eeffort of lowering it's academic quality just to give you a chance and you perceive it as segregation? hitler was so fucking right, how inferior can you get. We should stick you in ghettos since you fucking liberal minorities think everything is opressing you.
Fucking piece of shits should learn to real job someday.

The original point of affirmative action was to make sure organizations are in lockstep with societal rulesets established by the government because said organizations have shown to be untrustworthy to a degree. Whether or not this is needed anymore in the U.S. is debatable but that was the original intent.

Plus it is not unique to the west and has appeared in both Russia (under another name) before the civil rights movement in the U.S. and exist now in China as a more extreme version of U.S. affirmative form with ethnic Chinese minorities who not only get college quotas but also did not have to pay local province taxes and was not restricted by the one child policy before it was relaxed.

>>10240021
>how is it legal
asians are fighting to make it unconstitutional soon, please pray for them
>accepted
jews and liberals are amoral sociopaths

>>10240021
>marginal backgrounds
That's not racist, but you are.

>>10240021
It's "AFFIRMATIVE" action because it means they're going out of their way to re-balance the scales. It's like two people are playing a game against each other and the first player has been cheating for years, eventually they agree to stop cheating but that isn't enough to even the scales so they give player 2 a handicap to make things even again. Except that the players are actually racial communities and they're playing for wealth, mobility, etc..

>This is all shit not under their control.
That's exactly the point. It's not their fault they were born into a community with less resources because of centuries of racial inequality.

Really though, OP there are very few people from those communities applying into the programs. The people you've really gotta worry about competing against are the super wealthy white people who grew up in rich communities with great schools, personal tutors, access to state of the art technology, etc.. If anyone has an unfair advantage of you because of where they were born and how they grew up, it's them.

>>10240021
very real

>>10240136
that’s not what the idea was, it was intended to make sure there was good stewardship by token elite minorities in their communities and to uplift them economically and socially, it immediately turned into a program to artificially enrich and prop up inferior populations and to control the public’s perception of minority achievement. With Jews it was done to reward them for being persecuted and smart

Affirmative action is nothing but segregation

>>10240038
This is happening everywhere, not just in academia.

>>10240059
I know entomologists, a few of them have the idea "the only good bug is a dead bug", meanwhile literally every ornithologist, mammalogist, and even herpetologists I've met have the exact opposite idea. How do you feel about the sharp decline in insect populations?

>>10240143
I don't understand what you mean. Because I don't even consider of a person's sex or skin color and only go by their merit and actual knowledge of the subject? lol?

>>10240145
Extremely based and redpilled post.

>>10240161
insects are paramount to life on earth, as Wilson said they are "the little things that run the world". Insects and other small invertebrates are at the base for nearly every ecosystem on the planet (pollinators, detrivores, food sources for higher trophic animals)

>the only good bug is a dead bug
that is a silly statement that has no context, it of course depends on the situation. If it is an invasive species fucking up our crops then yes kill that fucker. It depends. But usually high biodiversity = highly functional ecosytem

The sharp decline is not good obviously. If it continues there will be radical changes in the environment, I'm a firm believer in bottom-up effects, so a decline in insects can have ramifications on everything including the large furry mammals everyone has a hard on for. People are working on that problem so we will see where it goes.

>>10240145
so at what point is the "game" back to even?

>>10240150

Yeah actually it was the idea anon. Before affirmative action there was already good stewardship for the so called token elite minorities. The problem was only specific organizations honored it and it was not a universal behavior by all. Affirmative action came to be as a way to make sure the universal behavior was applied and observed. Giving it a proper platform in the law system to managed.

The ""artificial proping up"" you speak of exist because banks made loans to the common populace for all communities accessible. Which was a way to increase economic output of the nation as a whole thus why we have such a large debt in the first place. Loans to go to college, to own a house/car and to start a business are because of this. It has little to do with alter public perception of any group.

>>10240182
Then again I went to a school that did a lot of agricultural research, so most undergrads weren't taught to exactly be empathetic to insects. It just saddens me to see researchers who would knowingly help destroy the ecosystem completely to maximize production. I worked under a pretty high profile ornithologist and she told me to basically ignore them, I regret that I didn't listen to her.

>>10240200
What school? That seems strange that they would knowingly contribute to the destruction of an ecosystem.

>>10240233
Just a midwestern state school, the "entomology" they were doing was pretty much just pesticide research. In our field lab you could just see the bird decline after each time fields were sprayed, the prof got super stressed every summer.

>>10240193
You're doing a great job of giving idiotic explanations of credit and obfuscating why non-Jews were given affirmative action which was to "insure that the leaders of minority communities were adequately prepared to engage with institutes of power and other majority community leaders both in industry and in politics" but what it immediately turned into was a feeder system for mediocre middleclass and working class minorities to give them economic status they absolutely did not warrant nor deserve>
>it exists because of loans
no, youu're wrong. It exists because of quotas systems in the work place and educational institutes. Blacks don't get loans, they bitch about it constantly, they do however get spots at elite unis and fortune 500 companies which they don't deserve.
>Loans to go to college, to own a house/car and to start a business are because of this. It has little to do with alter public perception of any group.
No, you're stupid and a small brained retard. Don't reply to me again

>>10240253
damn that is dark. pesticide research is important though

>>10240182
no one is working on that problem, its only getting worse in the West. See: France, Costa Rica, Southern United States. Nothing will be done to mitigate whole sale extermination of most valuable pollinators and lower trophic level insect species.

>>10240135
Hes clearly talking about romanian universities

>>10240021

Affirmative action definitely exists, even at the graduate school level unfortunately (or fortunately, depending on which side you stand on). Most of the posters are claiming otherwise saying "oh well, in grad programs you have to be qualified" and that's certainly true. However, if a graduate school has to make a choice between your typical caucasian male and a say female native American who have similar numbers in their applications, the female native American will get in 9 times out of 10. And especially for top programs, there will be 1000s competing for maybe 10-12 spots each year, and at least 50% will have competitive profiles since for grad school applicant pool is very self-selecting.

So affirmative action might be a little bit of a hurdle your typical over-represented groups have to jump through that wamen and minorities dont. But I guess one could claim that's just your good old bias which is practically everywhere. But whatever.

>>10240279
a lot of studies are being done on pollinator health and managing agroecosystems in sustainable ways what are you talking about?

>>10240304
No one is going to do anything about it, France spent billions of dollars on a government program to literally fine and pay farmers to not spray pesticides and in a half decade their pesticide usage rose enormously because it did nothing for the cost-benefit calculus farmers use to decide the pesticide load they make use of. Absolutely nothing will be done to solve the waste management or industrial toxin problems, they will only get worse with time. Of course scientists are doing constant studies on them, I read about it constantly, that is irrelevant to what industry and governments do. Its the same as fracking and deep sea drilling, we know its extraordinarily dangerous for ecoystems, we know that strip mining causes irreparable damage to the soil and seeps horrific carcinogenic chemicals into the water supply of extremely important rivers and water ways, that's not the point, no one does anything. Industry has totally subordinated and marginalized ecological preservation, its never going to swing back the other way. Everything has gotten worse, the soil quality in all continents is plummeting, pollinator populations are plummeting in every single ecosystem, fish and fowl populations are plummeting its never going to reverse course. You can maybe mitigate it but it will not recover.

>>10240313
Can confirm, "protected areas" are a joke. Thing is though, I've seen first hand the arms race farmers go through with these things. Corn weevils become resistant or immune, they up the dose, or just make new exponentially more caustic formulas. It wouldn't be so bad if they didn't dump the amount they do, but it's impossible to find any area untouched.

>>10240264

>You're doing a great job of giving idiotic explanations of credit

So documented facts that are easily searchable are now idiotic explainations?

>to give them economic status they absolutely did not warrant nor deserve

No one in the middle/working class in general deserves their economic status.

>Blacks don't get loans, they bitch about it constantly,

False, they do get loans the issue is there are multiple instances where the rates for those loans are different before their credit is assessed.

>Don't reply to me again

Why? Because you're afraid I noticed the apparent chip on your shoulder or the fact you don't know what you are talking about here? Unlike you I don't need to inject insults in my retorting statements or randomly insert "Jews" in a subject that isn't uniquely American/ Western in application. Which stated in my original post.

>>10240021
In theory, affirmative action works by selecting for diversity when all other characteristics are equal. If you have two candidates that have equal intelligence, equal motivation, equal work ethic etc. but one of them is black, then the black one will be chosen because the black person can contribute something to the organization that the white person cannot: a different viewpoint.

In reality, that's not how it works. But fuck it, you whitoids had enough help for centuries. A little bit of cheating to even out the scores is fine.

Mutt here. When I apply for post graduate should I say I'm black and white or Mexican, black and white? Does the added Mexican help or hurt?

>>10240361
Mexican isn't white, you're black and mexican. Black people don't call themselves black and white because they have some white admixture.

>>10240373
I'm only 40% white (the average "black" is 30%) but I got almost all the white genes in my appearance while my twin sister got all the black genes. That is the only reason I wouldn't feel right leaving off white in case I have to do an in person interview and they think I'm lying.

>>10240387
I don't know whether to feel happy or sad for you

>>10240025
New anon, this is true.

Additionally, it matters in some respects because you can get additional funding from the university for diversity inclusion. I'm not an advocate of affirmative action, but I'd be stupid not to use it when it benefits me. I got a nice package from my university for graduate school due to my ethnicity lol

>>10240409
Feel sad. Now he can't get affirmative action because he's fucking wh*te

>>10240373
Mexican isn't black lol
Get to know the ethnic make up for Mexicans before saying stupid shit.

>>10240361
OP When I applied I put down White, Native American and Other. Just make sure to state somewhere in your application that you are Mexican. Its tricky for us because of the ethnic make up varies widely from Mexican to Mexican. I'm majority Native American and part Iberian.

>>10240030
>state-wide discrimination practices now protect white people from being discriminated against

>>10240387
anon if they question your ethnicity just call them racist and if they continue they're gonna have a hatespeech lawsuit.

>>10240024
Entomology and mycology are such innocent sub-fields

>>10240478
what are you implying?

I am also a mutt. They don't like asians but what about indonesians? i can say i'm pacific islander

>>10240512
>pacific islander
so you're from british settlers of new zealand?

>>10240675
idk. by some definitions Indonesia is part of the pacific islands, I mean it is an island in the Pacific Ocean

>>10240145
except asians didn't even own niggers you white-guilt infested cuck

>>10240021
It's not realyla fctor. Many proffs are overtly racist and (non-Chinese Americam) Asians tend to pick Asians.

>>10240349
Most people who benefit for AA don't use it like the spergs here bitch about.

>>10240264
>they do however get spots at elite unis and fortune 500 companies which they don't deserve.

There numbers aren't that huge and they face a lot of bullshit in those institutions. A lot of Africans and Caribbeans studying in the states face a lot of discrimination or passive aggressive BS in those places.

>>10240760
this is a good point

>>10240786
Asians aren't one massive group. That's why different "Asians" have different factors in regards to education (Hmong vs Chinese).

>>10240795
so are you Chinese or Japanese?

>>10240021
Affirmative action is based on actual merit. It takes more merit for an underprivileged person to achieve the same the same grade as a privileged person

>>10240349
Affirmative action makes the groups who "benefit" it dumber on the long run because they don't have to work at school as much as other people in order to reach the same goal. This is exactly why black IQ is collapsing And this is also why racism increase, with so many illiterate minorities are out there with prestigious degrees, for anyone to see.
The affirmative action beneficiary has been taught to outsource responsibility for his errors and bad behavior during his formative years, it has done a lot of damage to him. Compare their situation to people from asian descent in US; teir clearly mog everyone excepted the jews in academic achievement while the US affirmative action system is clearly rigged against them.

TL,DR: annihilate this cancer known as affirmative action ASAP if you want racism to go away!!

>>10240863
It's not black people's fault that they are genetically predisposed to low IQ. They should not be punished for something they had no control over. If they exert just as much effort, then they should be rewarded just as much

>>10240873
/pol/ pls go

>>10240835
idk about this argument. Why? Because they are graded more harshly? Because they don't have as many resources to study? Fuck off in academics shit is equal and whoever works hard gets the grade.

>>10240878
How is that /pol/?

>>10240878
>Fuck off in academics shit is equal and whoever works hard gets the grade.
You are so dumb.

>>10240873
beliefs around IQ (and its alleged invariability) are complete garbage, there is no such thing as overall "processor-like" brain power. It is overly fantasized pseudomath with pictures basically.
The high correlation between IQ and highschool achievement is simply due to the fact that the former is modeled after the latter.
When people get attention from their parents in their toddler years (parents who talk to them in proper english with rich vocabulary), are exposed to richer life experiences in a more nurturing environment (no ghetto culture), they surely do better but it has nothing to do with some innate biology.

>>10240883
Affirms /pol/ racism immediately followed by a parody of SJW logic.

>>10240885
explain. give one example or idea
they can't afford books? they have to hold a job cuz their parents don't give them money? the teacher a racist? pls enlighten me

>>10240890
Sure retard. If niggers are so smart then why do they still live in shithouses and have 85 average IQ like barely functioning brainlets?

why are asians actively discriminated against for university applications then? Shouldn't there be affirmative action or is everyone just salty that asians perform better?

>>10240915
pretty sure it is exactly that they are just salty that asians perform better

>>10240910
where is the biology/ innate thing factor here? I don't see any.

>>10240947
wypipo had shithouses and low IQ back then.

>>10240897
It is not clear who is pol and who is sjw in the shitposts above though

>>10240950
what does this mean

>>10240041
Indian you can’t but Mexican or black you can

>>10240890
then why do some people have freakishly high iq despite being school in the same, sometimes worse conditions than people with mediocre or low iq?

>>10241186
how do you even accurately measure iq? take some meme test composed of simple questions?

>>10241193
Most people never take the official test.
All this shit is based upon assumptions.

>>10241193
>you can’t accurately measure it
>contradicting the presuppositions of my previous statements
wow who would have thought? you administer a fucking iq test with a professional procter in a controlled setting. Do one at 6 years old, one at 13 and one at 21 and if you want, another at 30 to demonstrate how it degenerates with age past the end of puberty.

read about a south indian who pretended to be a black person to get into school and then got in trouble. He's still a retard, but why does he have to do it?

>>10240023

Bullshit, I am at a major state university and my EE graduate school is filled with incompetent Asians.

>>10241199
lmfao

This thread was moved to >>>/pol/197719011