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/lit/ - Literature

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880278 No.880278 [Reply] [Original]

You know what the best part of the Harry Potter series is? When Dumbledore tells Snape that Harry must die, and you feel, along with Snape, the full weight of Dumbledore's betrayal.

>"I thought . . . all these years . . . that we were protecting him for her. For Lily."

It's the only part that can still make me tear up.

>> No.880289

I honestly do not remember the part that you're talking about, so I'm forced to assume that it's not that great and that you're a faggot.

>> No.880294

The best part is when Rowling kills off all of the cool characters at the end. Great way to introduce kids to the meaninglessness of the Universe.

>> No.880297
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880297

>>880294
For real, that sucked. Almost every character I liked died.

>> No.880298

>>880294
I assume you must be talking about the Death Eaters, because no one gave a damn about Lupin, Tonks, or one half of Frend & George.

>> No.880302
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880302

>>880298
FUCKING DOBBY MAN

>> No.880304

>>880289
When he's viewing Snape's memories at the end, you fag. How is it possible to forget that?

>> No.880309 [SPOILER] 
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880309

>>880302
forced drama

this was the only sad death in the last book. had me bawling for hours.

>> No.880310

I don't know if Harry Potter ever made me tear up. Everything sort of turned out as expected; from the prologue of Half-Blood Prince I believed Snape was playing a double-double agent game*; ultimately good, but the reasoning of his love for Lily just came off kind of...hard to believe. And then he just dies? Without doing anything? Just proving himself to Harry? That doesn't seem Snape to me.

It was that moment that really backtracked the progress I thought HBP had made in establishing Rowling as a decent writer. Which sucked, and Deathly Hallows as a whole kind of sucked, even though it was meant to be in tents/intense

*Actually, maybe Occulemency lessons in Order.

>> No.880317

The best part of the series would have been the epic battle between Harry and Voldemort, if Rowling had bothered to write it well and not chickened out.

>> No.880319
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880319

>> No.880326

>>880310
The clues that he had a relationship with Harry's mom had been there for at least two books prior. It fit as there were numerous times when he protected Harry's life. And in addition to giving Harry the memories at the end, he gave him the sword earlier in the book.

>> No.880336

I cried for Voldemort, since he was a lot like me.

>> No.880339

>>880336
How narcissistic of you

>> No.880341

>>880317
The final duel was great. Screw you.

>> No.880344

>>880326
If by "relationship" you mean a one-sided obsession with Lily. Poor guy, I imagine his childhood sucked, he found this spunky happy girl one day, and just made her a symbol of what a good life could be.

>> No.880345

>>880298
I liked Tonks. She was a pretty cool guy.

>> No.880349

>>880339
Well, I was a very overemotional 17 year old at the time.

>> No.880357

>>880345
She was good in book five, but sucked in the last two books.

>> No.880364

>>880357
Being in bad fanfiction like HBP can do that to a character.

>> No.880365

Hermione was a shitty self-insert character who basically ruined the series.

>> No.880368 [SPOILER] 
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880368

this is the lit board, not a tween age shit fest. Wizard crap is not literature.

>> No.880373
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880373

>>880368

>> No.880378

>>880365
I agree with you to some extent. I mean, between her and Harry, there wasn't even a point to Ron. Harry had the courage, the leadership abilities, and the talent at dueling, while Hermione had the brains and the talent at everything else. Ron was a distant third at everything he did.

>> No.880385

>>880344
You are now aware that if Snape had been born thirty years later than he was he would have hung out on 4chan every night.

>> No.880392

>>880344
They were best friends for like seven years.

>> No.880395

>>880378

Yeah, but fuck bro, you need friends. Ron running away from Harry at his time of need, and his return, was the most poignant part of Book 7, if any part could be said to have one

>> No.880407

>>880378
the brain, the broad, and the bumbler.
classic formula for trio.

>> No.880408

>>880395
Agreed.

>> No.880411

last book sucked

harry should of stayed dead and experienced the afterlife in the last chapter

shit would of been tits but instead she stuck to the "HERP DE DERP TYPICAL HAPPY ENDING EVEN THOUGH THE AVERAGE AGE OF MY ORIGINAL FAN BASE IS NOW 18"

jk can suck my dick

>> No.880413

>>880411

The 13 years later or whatever it was chapter should have been left out. It read like bad fan fiction.

>> No.880415

Neville got shafted. He should have killed that crazy bitch.

>> No.880418

>>880413
That's something we can all agree on. I've never heard anyone praise the epilogue, even the hardcore fanfags.

>> No.880419
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880419

>>880344
I read your post and all I thought of was Gatsby.

>> No.880420

>>880413
Yeah, especially the ridiculous names. Harry must really hate his kids.

>> No.880436

>>880419
But it wasn't a one-sided obsession in Gatsby.

>> No.880444

I could see James as Tom. I bet Snape jacked off to Gatsby.

>> No.880448
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880448

>> No.880457
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880457

>My face when Chapter Thirty-Two.

>> No.880464
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880464

>My face when book 6

>> No.880487

You know what I really loved about the books?

It wasn't just harry could be related to, it was as if you could feel his wonder that he suddenly had this ability to fight back, and then he makes friends, and its him finally living his life and you're along for the ride.
It was most likely the portrayal of the Durselys that really got me into the book series, experience in my own life, that makes me come back to the series again and again.

Just reading this thread reminded me how much I enjoyed reading the books, because it didn't feel like a story to me. It felt like a journey, like I was Harry and I emphasized with him at every turn.

>> No.880499

>>880487
Agreed. I think a big part of it was that a lot of the fanbase (myself included) grew up with him, literally, as the books came out.

>> No.880513

owl. fucking owls. and dragons. these are just few of my favourite things.

>> No.880533

>>880487
Sometimes the characters hit too close to home. I think Ron was made to be a bit too flawed.

>> No.880559

In reality, Hermione would have friendzoned Ron.

Stupid books, giving hope to nice guys.

>> No.880563

>>880559
>Ron a nice guy

LOL He was a dick to everyone

>> No.880569

My favorite thing about the harry potter series is that it provided a short window in my life during which I could actually get my friends to read, and then discuss the books with them. Man that was swell.

>> No.880571

>>880559
Hermione wasn't in a position to friendzone anyone. She was socially stunted and only slightly above average looking.

>> No.880586

>>880563
That's what made him great.

>> No.880598

>>880571
I always imagined Hermione was hot, and therefore was not surprised when they got Emma Watson to play her.
She's a bitch though, and kind of arrogant, so I don't really follow the mary sue-ness. Harry got kind of stupid in the later books when the wizard government was trying to play off being his friend and he was pushing them off.

>> No.880604

>>880586
Harry was desperate for anyone to pay attention to him and Ron was afraid of not being able to survive by himself.

>> No.880610

>>880598
>so I don't really follow the mary sue
Mary Sue doesn't mean immaculate, it means a self-insert that's better than everyone else. And that's what Hermione was. By JK Rowling's own admission, Hermione is her when she was a kid, except a genius who's good at almost everything.

>> No.880619
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880619

>>880598
Emma Watson isn't a knockout, though. She's pretty, but she isn't a super model. I think that that's about what Hermione was supposed to be.

>> No.880630

>>880610
Mary sue implies the self insert be flawless, Hermi had flaws and they were obvious. If she was a goddamn knockout and Harry was in love with her for all the books I'd agree.
>>880619
Classic beauty, nothing exotic or flawless. Herm was supposed to be a bookworm, they made her one of those 'oh-her-glasses-come-off-now-she's-a-supermodel' which Watson is now.

>> No.880646

>>880630
>Mary sue implies the self insert be flawless
You're being anal. That only applies to fanfiction. Hermione is an example of a Mary Sue in professional fiction.

>> No.880649

>>880630

To be fair, they did cast her when she was 9.

And for all her Sueness, Hermione was a pretty consistent character throughout the series, and did have her share of flaws.

What really bugged me was when Rowling turned Ginny into a complete Mary-Sue. In HBP, she's suddenly pulling in guys left and right, including Harry, and she's revealed as being amazing at Quidditch, in addition to being a very skilled witch.

>> No.880654

>>880649
Ginny was fine as far as looks and abilities; none of it was far fetched. The problem was that she had no chemistry with Harry and the romance was tacked on.

>> No.880659

>>880646

Mary Sue is a problem with the setting, specifically when a character doesn't fit into that setting but is there anyways, i.e. purple-haired half-angel girl with magic powers in HP universe is a Mary Sue; purple-haired half-angel girl with magic powers in a world where this is normal is just another average citizen.

So explain how Hermione is a Mary Sue when her sole noteworthy feature seems to be her intelligence. She is not remarkably pretty, she is emotional, she is hormonal, she is of no special bloodline or descent, she has no great destiny rivaling Harry Potter's laid out before her, and despite knowing a lot of things, she isn't unbeatable and manages to get captured and imprisoned in the Malfoy Manor. I don't see how this is a Mary Sue at all.

>> No.880663

I really enjoyed the series, despite it's flaws. It's not the kind of literature that needs to be nit-picked and over-analysed. It doesn't strive to be anything more than it is - a teen fantasty.

>> No.880680

>>880630
Is my post and I think that >>880646 is just using a more general mary sue definition being 'self-insert', so really its a semantic argument and not qualitative.
>>880663
I really think that enough, every book can't and shouldn't be Finnegan's Wake.

>> No.880683

>>880659
People always forget that first and foremost, before anything else, a Mary Sue is a self-insert. It's the author. If I wrote some bad fanfiction and put myself in, even if I didn't make myself 100% perfect, it would be a Gary Stu.

Hermione, however, makes it easy. Yes, she has flaws. But she's the most talented student at Hogwarts in all seven books, she's almost always on the moral high ground, she's right about things more often than Harry and Ron combined, and she's one of the few characters that you couldn't interchange with another and get similar results. If you factor that all in with her being an admitted self-insert by Rowling, then, yes, she's a Mary Sue.

She might not be the most Sue of the Sues, but she still towers above the masses with the best of them.

>> No.880690

ALL WAS WELL.

>> No.880692
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880692

>All the books after the fourth book.
>my face

>> No.880697

My favorite Mary Sue is Vladimir Nabokov in Pnin.

>> No.880741

>>880692
fifth book was the best

>> No.880745

4 > 5 > 3 > 6 > 1 > 2 > 7

>> No.880773

7 > 5 > 4 > 3 > 6 > 2 > 1

movies:

6 > 2 > 1 > 5 > 4 > 3

>> No.880789

>>880278

Lies. Hermione is the best part of the HP series.

>> No.880818
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880818

>my face while reading book 6

>> No.880830
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880830

Is something cool supposed to happen when you unite the Hallows?

>> No.880832

>>880830
The moral of the original story was that men could not beat death, so don't try. The story then got distorted to the exact opposite of that and the message became that if you unite all three, you have the power to defeat Death.
>Source: The Tales of Beedle the Bard

>> No.880838

>>880773

I think I love you. Please be female.

>> No.880845

>>880832
>A man in a million could unite the Hallows, Harry.

Then what the hell did Dumbledore mean?

>> No.880846

Anyone who thinks book 7 is the best is clearly of their rocker.

>> No.880893

>>880846
shut up

>> No.880966

>>880845

The point has to do with the quote Harry found on his parents' gravestones. "The last enemy that will be conquered is death." The uniting of the Hallows isn't to literally defeat death.

>> No.880978
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880978

>>880893

>> No.880996

all these books suck, read real lit fantasy faggots

>> No.881003

>>880996

>implying /lit/ doesn't have a secret hard on for fantasy and only claims to like anything else in order to seem deep and intelligent

>> No.881005

>>881003
harry potter sucks, man. i am not even trolling.

petty fucking themes, juvenile parent/child safe depictions of teens.

>> No.881024

>>881005

>child safe

It's a children's book.

>> No.881031

>>881005

I wonder why people even bother to say "not even trolling"...it always serves the opposite purpose and makes me think the speaker is trying to troll me by telling me he's not trolling me.

>> No.881045

I'm not kidding when I say that book 5 was fucking awful. It dragged on so badly that I never finished it.

>> No.881051

>>881045

Book 5 was great. Delores was a super bitch and only those with ADD thought it boring.

>> No.881060

Stopped reading the series in the middle of the Sixth one.
In my opinion the series died after the third book. It ran out of the childish sense of wonder and magic in Goblet Of Fire and it became all angst and teenage crap.

>> No.881063

>>881060

what are you, 11 years old? 4 onwards is when the series got GOOD.

>> No.881082

>>880310

I giggled. And I got stared at. But it was worth it.

>> No.881090

When Sirius died, predictably, I began to dislike the angst in this series.

That was why Dumbledore kicking his boots off didn't surprise me. Rowling resorted to cheap shit like re-introducing parent figures for Harry just so that he can re-live MY PARENTS ARE DEEEEEEEEAD all over again.

>> No.881093

>>881090
I disagree. The 'parent' figures in the books are more like guardian figures. Their death isn't just something for him to be sad about, but something that thrusts him into the reality of the situation. There are no more schemers and planners for the side of the order, or anyone to take charge of protecting him any more. When they die, he realizes that now HE must fight Voldemort actively and directly rather than just taking what comes to him like in previous books, because now that they're gone, it's up to him alone to decide how to oppose them.

>> No.881094

>>881093
>change second 'them' to the Death Eaters
Sorry for any confusion

>> No.881104

>>881093

>There are no more schemers and planners for the side of the order, or anyone to take charge of protecting him any more. When they die, he realizes that now HE must fight Voldemort actively and directly rather than just taking what comes to him like in previous books, because now that they're gone, it's up to him alone to decide how to oppose them.

Yeah, and then Rowling fucks this all up by having him take an Avada Kedavra to the face, and then get back up because, once again, he gets his coals pulled out of the fire by sheer luck. I don't remember exactly, because I haven't picked up Deathly Hallows in a while, but it's because of the scar or because of Lily.

Then he gets the Elder Stick Of Doom, and pwns the fuck out of Voldy.

So the message gets lost in transmission.

I'll admit here and now that I bought-

>HURR BUYING BOOKS
>fag buys books
>fucking tripfags
>buying books olo

Every book in the series, though. Maybe I should re-read all of them before the movie comes out. Hey, you guys, how about a huge /lit/ read-through of Harry Potter? They're kid's books, I bet we could burn through the first three in a week.

>> No.881107

>>881104
I'm already doing that, actually. Already on 7, though.

>> No.881109

>>881104
about to start #1 in Japanese, so it might take a bit longer than normal.

I also felt that Harry coming back up was bullshit. Because of his scar he had "love" on his side? Because his mother made the "ultimate sacrifice?" Bull.shit.
Because he has "friends who love him?"

total cop-out, just going for the happy ending.

>> No.881112

>>881109

I thought he was able to get back up because Voldemort took the hit for him, Voldemort tied Harry's blood to his and the bond between them took the hit when he tried to kill him

>> No.881114

>>881109
>>881107

I guess we should have seen it coming, since it happened to him as a baby. And also, Rowling cemented her tendency to rehash her ideas with the consistent Death of Guardian/Parental Figures thing she had going.

>> No.881119

>>881112
I'm not sure about that, but I know that Harry died. He had to. There was something about it, that I don't really remember. I'm not really concerned as to why.

Sure, it saved him when he was a baby, I can get that. His mom was there, she JUST died. But how many times is this shit supposed to work? It's like anyone who sacrifices themselves for another automatically gives the other immortality or something.

>> No.881121

>>881112
That's what I thought too. My memory is rusty though.

>> No.881127

Voldy made Harry a horcrux by accident. That is why he had to take an Avada Kedavra in the face

>> No.881139
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881139

Dong mind me, just being one of the best characters of the series.

I was also really upset about how much of the 6th book they took out of the movie. I really wanted to see the House of Gaunt chapter and all of Voldys flashbacks.

>> No.881141

>>881139
I expect some of this stuff will be in the final two movies.

>> No.881187

In movies, there's sometimes that big heroic 'Take me instead of him/her/them', where our big bad villain does just that. Now, if they truly were a big bad villain, wouldn't they just kill the person defending the actual target, then kill the target?

That's what I've always thought went through J.K.Rowling's mind when she thought up that part of the series, where Lily gives her life for Harry, then Voldemort proceeds to attempt to kill harry anyway. Sometimes I put myself in the shoes of the author, or pretend I am the author; whatever may be; when I think of that scene, I get the impression that J.K Rowling thought "why don't bad guys just kill the defender and the target if they're really a bad guy" then imposed upon herself/the series a punishment for Voldemort doing so.

Also, maybe it's because I was fortunate in being a year or two within Harry's age in real lie through out the series, but the most cringe-worthy moment of the entire series was when they went to the Quidditch World Cup, and are seduced by the Veela's, and Harry seriously contemplates jumping down to impress them. That was hard to read.

>> No.881207

>>880298
>Frend

>> No.881208

>>880317
I thought it was pretty good, chap.

>> No.881209

>>880298
I gave a damn about Lupin, Tonks, and one half of Fred and George, you smarmy cunt.

>> No.881210

>>881141
Now they have no excuse.

>> No.881219

>>880298

>Frend & George

>Frend Weasley

I do not recall this personage.