/lit/ - Literature

[Anonymous No.12041803]

Now that digital art has officially surpassed literature both in artistry and immersion, becoming the superior storytelling medium, what will happen to books?

[Anonymous No.12041816]

I don't know friend,
you tell me,
nobody's written a good book
since 1963.

(once more with feeling)

[Anonymous No.12041820]

>>12041803
Do video games provide insightful stories anon? No, they are fun stories that are a vehicle to get you from one gameplay segment to another.

[Anonymous No.12041908]

>>12041820
In the case of RDR2, gameplay is a vehicle that gets me from one narrative cutscene to another

[Anonymous No.12041918]

>>12041908
so it failed as a video game then

[Anonymous No.12041943]

There will always be a place for the Stephen King's,J K Rowling's and Houellebecq's in the world...... but serious literature (the reading of and production of) will become an extremely fringe activity very soon.

we are an image, not text, based culture

[Anonymous No.12041945]

>>12041803
It's tough to achieve storytelling superiority in games without a quadrillion man-hours worth of content. They will always be a big corporate product, the occasional outstanding indie game notwithstanding

[Anonymous No.12041965]

>>12041908
then just watch a playthrough

[Anonymous No.12041994]

>few years ago
>haven't played any videogames since the early 2000s
>The Last of Us is the current hot topic
>"revolutionary; fantastic storytelling"
>decide to give it a try on my niece's Playstation
>it's Hollywood Z movie-tier plot and boring, contrived gameplay

As far as i'm aware, videogames still are only entertaining for braindead plebs

[Anonymous No.12042028]

>>12041803
It’s OVER for books!

[Anonymous No.12042038]

>>12041945
you clearly haven't played RDR2

[Anonymous No.12042052]

>>12041803
Books will still have their place inside the world of video games like Red Dead. I’ve even heard rumors that Pynchon’s next book is going to be release exclusively as a hidden collectible in an open world VR rpg.

[Anonymous No.12042060]

>>12041943
>but serious literature (the reading of and production of) will become an extremely fringe activity very soon.
>
>we are an image, not text, based culture
Everyones read 1984 and blood meridian though, even moby-dick before they're 20

[Anonymous No.12042114]

>fiction
DROPPED

[Anonymous No.12042121]

>>12042028
THIS IS THE END OF BOOKS (This time for sure)

[Anonymous No.12042163]

I used to play a shit ton of vidya but I kinda stopped, now I just occasionally play Mario Maker or replay Super Metroid on my 3DS and can't be arsed to boot up my laptop, but if I did I'd replay SotN or RE4 or Portal or play a difficult/Metroidvania platformer (like Celeste or Aria of Sorrow or Shantae and the Pirate's Curse).
Question is, are any of these games that I never got round to worth going to the effort of playing?
>Silent Hill 2
>Mother 3 (I've tried playing Earthbound but I always stop once I get to Twoson)
>MGS2
>Final Fantasy Tactics

[Anonymous No.12042182]

>>12042163
Silent Hill 2 is /lit/

[Anonymous No.12042240]

>>12041994
I don't entirely disagree with what you say, but you played a game touted by mainstream critics so it's partly your fault. It's like watching a oscar nominated film and thinking that's actually the peak of cinema.

[Anonymous No.12042304]

Video games can be masterpieces in my mind by doing one of two things.
First, they can deliver an engaging, well paced campaign with great gameplay - these are your Mario 64s, your Super Metroids, your Portals, your Resident Evil 4s, your Ocarina of Times, your Symphony of the Nights.
Second, they can use parts of a video game to tell a story that wouldn't work in any other medium - Shadow of the Colossus, BioShock, Undertale and, again, Portal are examples (I haven't played them but it seems like Silent Hill 2 and Mother 3 also fit this category)
None of these games have stories that deep or affecting on their own, if you think of them just as a plot, but they become so much more through the interactive element. SotC's plot isn't anything groundbreaking, but the atmosphere is perfect, the visuals are gorgeous, the design of the colossi are breathtaking and the feeling of the gameplay is unmatched. BioShock was somewhat overrated on release but the atmosphere is also really well done and the 'Would you kindly?' thing, which would be generic in any other medium, used the nature of video game quests and FPS campaigns to make an iconic twist. Undertale gets shit on for the fanbase and occasional Tumblry writing but it does use some very clever narrative techniques, and more than any other game I've played, the gameplay and the story are perfectly intertwined.
A lot of games tried to do similar things with fourth wall breaking stories like Superhot and Pony Island, but Superhot's story is completely irrelevant compared to the gameplay. and Pony Island is absolute trash. These two used hacky 'look at me I'm self aware' writing without Undertale's sincerity and the narrative techniques were more ham-fisted.
There are also 'objective' masterpieces of gaming like Tetris and Counter Strike, but those are more of a craft, to be appreciated the same way as chess or Go, rather than stirring any emotion.
Video games will always fail at telling stories through traditional methods. Modern cutscene-filled games that try to be films are for plebeians that genuinely get all their stories from video games. Visual novels and JRPGs do have their place and are much better than cutscene-a-thons but most of them have bad writing badly translated - a VN or JRPG with true literary sensibilities could work, and something like Final Fantasy is generally much better than most fantasy novels. I am more likely to play Steins;Gate or Final Fantasy IX than I am to play whatever the new bland third person open world game is with a story I don't care about and gameplay I've seen a million times.
Resident Evil 4 takes the best route to these types of games by not taking itself seriously at all. It realises that its writing is B-movie tier and goes with it. And it's fun.
Sorry for spergpost
>>12042060
Imagine being in this much of a bubble
>>12042182
I had a feeling it would be, that and Mother 3 are two games I definitely want to play even now that I play a lot less vidya

[Anonymous No.12042382]

I wasn't expecting such a likeable protagonist from modern rockstar if im honest. Arthur was really damn good. His ending hit me right in the damn feels too.

[Anonymous No.12042394]

>>12041803
>group of 10 people travel around america killing tens of thousands of people without barely losing any of their own

its called the walking dead

[Anonymous No.12042402]

>>12042038
kys dude. the story is on par with walking dead. its an escapist bad ass fantady for npc's

the only good thing this game did was immersion and graphics

[Anonymous No.12042409]

>>12042402
>the story is on par with walking dead. its an escapist bad ass fantady for npc's
lmao imagine unironically thinking this

[Anonymous No.12042434]

>>12042409
its literally the exact same story

>a group of 10 or so bad asses work their way across america burning through thousands and thousands of enemys. they find themselves in incredible situation after incredible and consitently come out on top despite the odds being stacked against them. over the course of the story they form bounds but cracks start to form in some of these relationships

you have to be a seriously juvenile person to resonate with an npc tier story like this. rdr 2 has worse writing than your average hollywood film. its literally tv slop tier writing. the game is only playable because of insane attention to detail that went into creating the world

[Anonymous No.12042446]

>>12042434
>you have to be a seriously juvenile person to resonate with an npc tier story like this
Not him, but literally every tragic story involving a group of people (or, a "gang") has this progression. Also, you obviously do not read and belong on /tv/.

[Anonymous No.12042457]

>>12042446
so its predictable garbage then?

lol imagine deluding yourself into believing the 2nd biggest entertainment release in human history would be anything but slop tier writing for autonomous "people".

[Anonymous No.12042490]

>>12041803
>shit ubisoft clone
>surpassing anything

[Anonymous No.12042570]

I enjoyed RDR2 and thought it was a solid experience all around but at the end of the day it's just GTA with horses. I'm definitely invested in the story and the setting and found the characters very compelling, particularly Dutch, John, and Arthur (who I ended up identifying with), but after a certain point you've blasted enough hillbillies and the amount of sheer slaughter Arthur doles out by the end of the game left me incredulous.

Arthur literally starts behaving like Duke Nukem and goes full commando, massacres entire platoons of soldiers before FIN displays on the screen.

[Anonymous No.12042582]

>>12042457
>the 2nd biggest entertainment release in human history
is this correct?

[Anonymous No.12042591]

>>12042582
yes. gta v is the biggest

[Anonymous No.12042599]

>>12042457
>so its predictable garbage then?
if you're reductive for the sake of being reductive, sure

[Anonymous No.12042601]

>>12042591
biggest in what sense?

[Anonymous No.12042606]

>>12042601
making Republicans rich

[Anonymous No.12042642]

>>12042601
total profit

[Anonymous No.12042649]

Instead of changing the open world formula by rebuilding the architecture they just doubled down of the intricacy of the facade. It's literally 'baroque' the video game. It's still the same shitty, old, drafty building on the inside but this time they got a hack artist to paint some frescoes over the cracking plaster. Anybody impressed by this game is just highlighting that games will never be art because it's consumers aren't even able to identify it. Rockstar has duped so many retards it's hilarious

[Anonymous No.12042687]

>>12042434
It's a very classic plotline but if you look at any western film they all tend to have very predictable archetype story lines. But if you read between the lines it gets more interesting.

Dutch is a Captain Kurtz sort of fallen primitivist figure, who rejects "progress". He robs for ideals rather than just for his own gain, at least initially. Then as the bodies pile up and the unexpected happens again and again, he slowly loses his grip. He begins to become misanthropic and devalue human life.

Meanwhile this is a man who adopts young boys, at ages such as 12 and 13 (the ages he adopted Arthur and John) and indoctrinates him into his views and eventually betrays and manipulates them.

[Anonymous No.12042762]

>>12041908
In the case of RDR2 both the story and the gameplay suck.

[Anonymous No.12042810]

>>12041943
I'm 23 and I've never read Blood Meridian

[Anonymous No.12042857]

>>12042649
Right there with you. I can't remember the last time a game felt so 'video-gamey.' I am instantly removed from the world when I have to think about the controls or the gameplay systems.

If this game looked ten times worse but was twice as well designed I would be transported to the West instantly.

[Anonymous No.12042866]

>>12042857
>>12042649
What kind of changes would you make to the design and open-world system?

[Anonymous No.12042978]

>>12042866
I find myself watching the bottom right corner of the screen for command prompts rather than immersing myself in a moment. I'm then rewarded with my character getting into some more specific position in order to perform the canned animation I've seen dozens of times before.

It's true that spamming the Loot button or opening an inventory menu like Fallout is contrived. It's true that slowly patting down a body is realistic. However, when we look at the net change in immersion, it's clear what choice gets the player back to the engaging moments more quickly is the correct one. What we are looking for in videogames is a representation of reality, not a recreation of reality; we are playing pretend to escape.

Have you tried crafting split shot ammunition at a campfire? Your character does it one at a time, needing a button prompt and an animation to complete the act of crafting. The game taunts you with "X of 200 in inventory" under the menu option. Yes, one has to do something one at a time in real life. It's realistic. It is not immersive and you could say it's actually frustrating.

Or take the health and energy systems. In an older game you would pick up health packs, more recently they switched to regenerating. This game combines both systems into an even more 4th wall shattering experience. I drink tonics to fill my meter and I eat food to fill my core and they're both leveling up at random intervals, and eating or not eating will alter some other hidden gauge that makes my character fat or thin. All this instead of using a bandage or waiting for a bit, which I'm sure was deemed "too videogamey" by a designer who was thinking too hard. Again, we are trying to play pretend here.

[Anonymous No.12043026]

>>12041803
>tfw the music isn't as good as the last game
RDR1
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iZ9iflvCwok
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7IkvAb6THQY
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yag41F7eCLU
RDR2
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6exwe7BY_ss
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YdW5-uJqCVY
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qHer-rGfTco

[Anonymous No.12043088]

>>12041803
i don't want to live on this earth anymore, please spare me my god

[Anonymous No.12043104]

>>12041820
>Do video games provide insightful stories anon?
The first Bioshock is the closest thing we've ever had to an art game. Too bad the sequels went overkill with the violent gamepaly

[Anonymous No.12043111]

>>12041803
those are some shit-tier graphics for 2018

[Anonymous No.12043131]

why are insecure /v/ermin coming to this board to post transparent bait lately?

[Anonymous No.12043150]

>>12041820
Yea they do. It's not the mediums fault if you are a left brain nigger and can't see beneath the surface.

[Anonymous No.12043155]

>>12043111
cus it's a rdr 1 screenshot

[Anonymous No.12043425]

>>12042060
Nigger not even everybody on this board has read all of those books.

[Anonymous No.12043436]

>>12043104
>not Silent Hill 2
top pleb

[Anonymous No.12043444]

>>12043111
AHAHA OWNED BTFO

[Anonymous No.12043559]

>>12041943
Houellebecq is different from those. He even wrote poetry ffs.

[Anonymous No.12043561]

>>12041803
Games aren't art. Literature will always remain superior in my view.

t. game dev

[Anonymous No.12043565]

>>12043111
why would the gods grant the trips to such a shit post?

[Anonymous No.12043767]

>>12041803
>what will happen to books?

They'll continue to fall further and further into completely irrelevance until everything kind of just forgets about them, pretty much the same thing that's been happening for the last like 80 years.

Literature as a medium will not survive this century. Books are going to end up in museums right next to the neanderthal cave paintings.

[Anonymous No.12044155]

>>12043559
He also recorded a great album nearly 20 years ago that everyone should listen to.

[Anonymous No.12044172]

This game has fucking wonky as fuck gun and horse controls and there's no fucking way I'm ever going to pay off the $300 bounty I built up in West Elizabeth, GTAV is the greatest game of the decade, followed only by New Vegas. OP is probably being paid by Rockstar.

[Anonymous No.12044174]

>>12042649
I've read this post before

[Anonymous No.12044177]

>>12044174
It's the truth, though, so that makes sense.

[Anonymous No.12044183]

>>12042304
Good post, but where does RDR2 fit in to your scheme?

[Anonymous No.12044214]

>>12043561
This. Words are much richer than limited interactions. Interaction implies that the player has some kind of an attention disorder, he needs to interact with something to not get bored. Literature is boring, because you just read words on a sheet of paper. It requires an actual intellectual effort, which video games don't, at all.
No video games will ever have the same impact as great movie or a great book, and that's because video games by essence live under the dictature of satisfying a population with attention disorder.

I play RDR2 and I enjoy it tremendously though.

[Anonymous No.12044237]

>>12044214
The consumer being purely passive is precisely the reason why games (video or not) are superior to movies. Books, fiction or not, don't have the same passivity so I find it strange to mix them with movies rather than games. I guess it's because both are well established and thus 'respectable'. But pure video is the real brain dead medium.

[Anonymous No.12044243]

>artistry and immersion, becoming the superior storytelling medium

Video games are different from books, not better.

Just like movies.

A book gets into your brain in ways a visual medium can never reproduce. The ability to convey a character's thoughts and perceptions and even details like smells, etc., are the domain of books, and will be until some new technology can deliver that experience.

[Anonymous No.12044399]

>>12042434
>they find themselves in incredible situation after incredible and consitently come out on top despite the odds being stacked against them. over the course of the story they form bounds but cracks start to form in some of these relationships
Uh m8 the gang fails to come out on top 80% of the time, and when they do succeed it's only in reckless violence that gets them into more trouble. It's a story about decline, it's not an adventure. The game has 6 chapters and the gang only does well in 2 of them.
>Arthur's personal decline in health and attempt to redeem himself before his inevitable death
>the loss of the "wild west" to civilization
>the Indian tribe falling away to violence as the son fails to learn the wisdom of his father
>the confederate families destroying each other clinging to an old order of life
>the fallout and separation of the gang
>Dutch's loss of vision and decline into madness
Time and time again the typical swashbuckling adventure trope of the wild west is beat over the head with the brutal club of the consequences of violence. I know it's a video game and it has a lot of wacky moments but it's still far more mature than the Walking Dead

[Anonymous No.12044411]

>>12044155
Name

[Anonymous No.12044413]

>>12044237
>But pure video is the real brain dead medium.
I find contemplation (movies) to be more interesting and stimulating than interaction at all cost. You can let your thoughts wonder while contemplating.

[Anonymous No.12044416]

>>12044411
Présence Humaine.

He actually reads his poem over very nice arrangements made by Bertrand Burgalat. He did tour to promote this album, and had plenty of groupies.

[Anonymous No.12044448]

>>12044237
Just because you don't directly interact with a film doesn't mean it's passive.

[Anonymous No.12044451]

At least post a video game that is actually immersive.

Feel sorry for people who actually still play games, they peaked like 20 years ago and have only been getting worse since.

[Anonymous No.12044478]

>>12041803
Is Red Dead 2 as great as they say it is? So fucking hyped that I have to remind myself often I'm setting myself up for disappointment if my expectations get higher.

>>12041820
Did you ever play Soma? That game offers some heavy existential punches that I did not see coming. There's a good narrative in the video game medium for you.

[Anonymous No.12044501]

>>12042060
I read blood meridian at 24 and moby dick at 23 am I too late oh i'm only 26 and I haven't even read the rise and fall of the third reich yet is there any hope for me

[Anonymous No.12044505]

>>12042240
not that guy but i'm a pretty kino kind of guy and I saw the revenant and I fucking blew a load in my pants when I saw it like seriously how the fuck did most people say there wasn't a story to that film, it was like I was seeing some Christmas episode of blood meridian and I fucking loved it jeez louise I mean sometimes the Oscars aren't entirely wrong to be honest

[Anonymous No.12044508]

>>12042304
Good post.

[Anonymous No.12044512]

>>12042570
horses are pretty cool though so gta with horses is already sounding like my GOTY. Do you still get to break in wild horses like in Red dead Redemption 1?

[Anonymous No.12044527]

>>12044451
Not that I agree with your sentiment of not playing games still (there's many out there to enjoy but I understand why you say they peaked 20 years ago - many mid-90s PC games are so fucking fantastic).

Thief 2 is something I never got around to playing but I got so autistically into Thief 1, like it's downright one of my favourite games of all time and I struggle to not get too suckered into it whenever I reinstall it on my PC. So fucking good jeez louise I feel bad for people who haven't played Thief 1. I need to play Thief 2 and Deadly Shadows some time I keep telling myself I will when I'm done with being autistic with thief 1 but man that'll be a while still

[Anonymous No.12044530]

except bloodborne I really haven't found any game that had a somewhat interesting narrative
also something like blood borne is only possible in the world of videogames, but it'll never be topped so games are officially dead now

[Anonymous No.12044531]

Play with the free game called Save the Date, and you'll see an example of a game being a true art and conveyor of insightful message.

[Anonymous No.12044549]

>>12041918
AAA games are desgined to appeal to the lowest common denominator. Luckily the brainlets havent infested the grand strategies yet

[Anonymous No.12044562]

Can we just ban /v/ and /pol/ crossposters? If you go to those boards you don't belong here.

[Anonymous No.12044608]

>>12044527
>I understand why you say they peaked 20 years ago
So do I. You grew up, bucko, and kicked a bad habit. Good for you.

[Anonymous No.12044611]

>>12044608
unfortunately, anon, I do still play video games, but I don't entirely disagree with the statement that they peaked 20 years ago, as many of them for PC were incredibly consistent and influential releases for their medium. sorry to burst the bubble, anon, I'm unlikely to ever "grow out" of the video game hobby completely.

[Anonymous No.12044674]

>>12044478
see>>12042649

It has very beautiful settings, amazing lightwork, great attention to details. Gameplay is pathetically abstruse for a game with such a budget. We are actually witnessing that even with infinite money (GTA5 has 6 billion USD in sales, for a budget of 265 million), when you're not very good at programming and thinking gameplay, well, money doesn't help you. It just gives you more time to do mistakes. It may sound harsh, but in the end it remains a basic video game. The most groundbreaking thing about it is the fact that they had so much time and money to work on it.

[Anonymous No.12044724]

>>12044674
That's a shame, but I did enjoy GTA 5 and Red Dead Redemption so I'd imagine when the price comes down for RDR2, I'll still probably pick it up.

[Anonymous No.12044741]

>>12044478
the grafix are amazing and the game is utterly mind-blowing for the first hour but then then the scripted events become incredibly obvious - even more so when they're express purpose is to be realistic and not be noticed - which leaves the whole experience feeling really clunky


As an anon mentioned earlier it's the most "video gamey" game to come out for a while. And that shows itself when it tries hardest to distance the player from the fact their playing a video game. Mashing X button to cook meat and craft bullets individually is the most immersion breaking shit there is.


The plot is like a Tarantino film without the acrid and hilarious dialogue. I probably would have enjoyed it more if I wasn't spoiled.

[Anonymous No.12044756]

>>12044741
Houser brothers are so up their ass that they don't want to work with actual writers. They believe non video game industry people cannot understand what it is to create a video game.
So here we are watching them pretending to do a movie whereas they just can't write dialogues that are actually wit.

[Anonymous No.12044798]

>>12044611
It's like cigarettes. You're unlikely to ever stop using them, but once you grow out of your stupid teenager phase, you come to realize that smoking isn't hot shit, just plain old shit. Same with vidya.

[Anonymous No.12044810]

>>12043104
I guess I can't call Bioshock fags underage anymore but holy shit have some self awareness and play a decent game like System Shock 2 if you're going to make such ludicrous claims about the medium

[Anonymous No.12044829]

>>12044798
Smoking will always be hot shit

[Anonymous No.12044830]

What do you guys think of Dark Souls games?
Theres many video essays on YouTube compared it to the difficult of life and so

[Anonymous No.12044839]

>>12044798
I don't believe I'm in a stupid teenager phase as I pay my bills, my taxes, I read often and intend to further my career, but sometimes it's enjoyable to relax with a strategy game or an RPG. I don't mind using an hour or two of my free time to unwind with another interest and I don't attach a stigma to the hobby of video games.

[Anonymous No.12044849]

what games belong in the canon?

[Anonymous No.12044851]

>>12043436
Silent Hill 2 is the mouth breather's Jacob's Ladder

[Anonymous No.12044854]

>>12044562
I still think segregation would do wonders for this site nowadays.
Anyone who goes on (b tv pol v soc r9k) should only be allowed to post on those boards while we humans get the rest of them.

[Anonymous No.12044859]

>>12041803
the only good parts of RDR2 are the final missions of the main story of the epilogue because of the combination of great music and exciting (though easy and cinematic) gunfights

[Anonymous No.12044863]

>>12044849
Deus Ex
Bioshock
Duke Nukem Forever

[Anonymous No.12044872]

>>12042163
MGS2 is a must play, I love this shit. But you have to play Metal Gear 2 and Metal Gear Solid first.

[Anonymous No.12044877]

>>12044830
The last game I spent money on was Dark Souls. Played a pirated copy for a hundred hours and it was such a beautiful experience that I had to give From Soft money.
As far as I can tell Dark Souls was the last game made I could really fall in love with. Maybe I've gotten too old but there is no hope left for the industry in me. Which is alright because now I want to try going outside and finding out what a girl looks like naked.

[Anonymous No.12044881]

>>12044839
Anon, I too pay bills and my mortgage. However when playing video games (I buy one game a year), I feel like there is always something better that I should do, something more noble, like reading a book, watching a high rated movie (I'm not talking about imdb ratings), socialising, doing sports, fixing stuff, whatever. I feel like playing video game is the most useless form of entertainment. Escapism in its lowest form.

[Anonymous No.12044890]

>>12044530
FROM still have a few surprises left, I think their new VR thing hinted at a something similar in thematic to bloodborne

[Anonymous No.12044893]

>>12044881
To each their own, I guess, we'll have to agree to disagree. I don't mind a video game from time to time but I can appreciate other people won't find the same enjoyment in them.

[Anonymous No.12044894]

>>12044849
Kane and Lynch 2

[Anonymous No.12044898]

>>12044562
Nah, we should ban election tourists like you instead

[Anonymous No.12044900]

>>12041803
They will still be read by adults

[Anonymous No.12044920]

>>12044881
, he posted on 4chan

[Anonymous No.12044938]

this game has excellently modeled horse balls and bull penises

[Anonymous No.12044985]

>>12041803
ive been playing video games for 20 years (like actually playing them, not being born in 1997 pretending you've been doing it your whole life) and only a juvenile could read literature and play video games and think any video game has came anywhere near the level of genius canonical literature approaches

[Anonymous No.12044992]

>>12044985
the best video games are incredible video games, but they're dogshit literature. why even bother comparing them? only children would bother with something as mundane in the first place. literature will never go anywhere as long as humans exist.

[Anonymous No.12045058]

>mfw poor and can only play games that can be emulated on my 2005 PC

[Anonymous No.12045064]

>>12042978
I'm gonna tack onto your post, I've never played this game but one of the biggest issues with open world games is fast/quick travel, minimaps, waypoints, and quest systems. The quest systems are bad because they're like this: go there, do that, meet this condition, return. They need to be more generalised interaction with characters and events, a living world, no strict condition-meeting. The rest of the things take you out of the game and again, make it about condition-meeting that near forces you to ignore almost the entire game. Open worlds can be good primarily for exploration and travelling, the building of atmosphere, and the player-character existing in a living and intricate world. These crutches that collect together to form a navigation system made to allow the player to as-efficiently-as-possible condition-meet, are a complete failure of design. You're staring at markers, minimap, variables, etc. Simply removing them obviously doesn't work as the games are built around them and don't work very well otherwise. This also applies to the more traditional game maps, which are all known with detail and marked. They're not really maps but world documentation, realism would go far in this regard.

Another issue is world space, a wide world is important to the possibilities an open world game offers, and being overly maximalist can ruin the game as well. There is a balance to be found in detail, content/events, and amount of space. This balance is rarely achieved because it requires a specific theme and content direction that most of these games lack any semblance of.

[Anonymous No.12045087]

>>12044985
They are each their own spectrum. A transcendental vidya experience is fundamentally different than and incomparable to a transcendental literary experience.

[Anonymous No.12045124]

Sitting in literature(science) class right now at Uni and the professor brought this up and started talking about RDR2.

S-should I be worried? Does my professor shitpost on /lit/?

[Anonymous No.12045127]

>>12045087
they're on their own spectrum, just like winning a footrace with your friends and successfully performing open heart transplant surgery are both on their own spectrum despite both being achievements of a sort. yet which one would you agree is the more commendable?
there are video games that are very good video games but the best video games do not come close to approaching good literature in any of their common grounds. video games aren't designed to do the things literature does so when people insinuate otherwise it opens all doors to comparing the two and when you do you realize games suck as art (as of now, anyways. the potential is technically unlimited but nobody's concerned with exploring its artistic merits regarding complete tacticle interaction between the medium and the experiencer of it, rather focusing on fun gameplay over a thoughtful experience. and those that do try suck at it, walking simulators and VNs may as well have been comicbooks for how little they utilize the interactivity of a video game)

[Anonymous No.12045132]

>>12045124
What the fuck is literature(science)?

[Anonymous No.12045133]

>>12045124
>literature(science)
What?

[Anonymous No.12045137]

>>12041803
I don't agree with you, OP, but sometimes games do surpass their literary sources. The Witcher 3 is superior to anything Sapkowski's written.

[Anonymous No.12045140]

>>12045124
cute lady(boy)

[Anonymous No.12045151]

>>12045127
You're still comparing artistic mediums as if one can be ranked over another, something I dont agree with. I've had elevating experiences with each, that aren't possible within the other.

[Anonymous No.12045156]

>>12045151
youre a fucking retard, lad. why are you on this board if reading is so hard for you?