/lit/ - Literature

[Anonymous No.9996615]

Is there an equivalent for American culture? Something steeped in the history, culture, and themes characteristic to the US?

[Anonymous No.9996621]

[Anonymous No.9996631]

>>9996621
>>9996615
There are two novels that can change a bookish fourteen-year old's life: The Lord of the Rings and Atlas Shrugged. One is a childish fantasy that often engenders a lifelong obsession with its unbelievable heroes, leading to an emotionally stunted, socially crippled adulthood, unable to deal with the real world. The other, of course, involves orcs.

[Anonymous No.9996644]

Super heros perhaps?
What are you implying? Amerindian and early settler myths turned into an epic? I've read that some Amerindians are not fond of such a thing.

[Anonymous No.9996645]

>>9996631
woah, epick!!!! xDDD im roleing on the floor loling!! upvoted ;)

[Anonymous No.9996649]

>>9996631
Legitimate kek.

[Anonymous No.9996656]

>>9996644
>Amerindian and early settler myths turned into an epic?
Yeah, something like that. I mean, there's people like Hawthorne, Longfellow, Twain, ect. but I dont know man

[Anonymous No.9996665]

>>9996645
>>>9996631
>woah, epick!!!! xDDD im roleing on the floor loling!! upvoted ;)
What triggered this reaction? /pol/acks are really insecure, aren't they? Stop sperging out in every thread, maggot; or even better, go back.

[Anonymous No.9996666]

>>9996631
this is the most obvious joke to make in this situation, and also the worst

[Anonymous No.9996697]

Twain
the way we are taught about settlers in the Great Plains/the West and the destruction of the Indians through YA novels

[Anonymous No.9996708]

>Lord of the Rings
>"history and culture"
Please stop with this nonsense. It's a good fantasy story, but it's not fucking "steeped in history".

[Anonymous No.9996736]

>>9996708
It's derived from Anglo-Saxon poetry, the Norse sagas and English and Teutonic folklore. Tolkien didn't just pull it out of a hat FFS.

[Anonymous No.9996741]

>>9996666
full-house speaks the truth

[Anonymous No.9996771]

A Song of Ice and Fire

[Anonymous No.9996788]

The western seems to me to be the American equivalent of the European medieval fantasy.

Which book I would choose to equate to LotR though, I don't know.

[Anonymous No.9996834]

~=The Hobbit?

[Anonymous No.9996849]

>>9996788
This. The western is the American mythos.

[Anonymous No.9996856]

>>9996666
those digits....

[Anonymous No.9996861]

>>9996631


Upvoted.


[Edit: Wow! Thanks for the gold, kind stranger.]

[Anonymous No.9996864]

>>9996708
It was written by the most famous philologist of the 20th century, a guy who also happened to be the highest ranking professor of a dead language at the most prestigious university on the planet

J.R.R. Tolkien was probably one of the most "steeped in history" human beings who ever lived. To pretend he didn't incorporate his virtually unparalleled knowledge of history and culture into his writing is just flat-out retarded. Seriously, it's something only a mentally retarded person could say.

[Anonymous No.9996867]

>>9996697
solid pick. maybe Steinbeck as well.

[Anonymous No.9996900]

>>9996665
>/pol/acks
>a jew woman

[Anonymous No.9996921]

>>9996900
internet lefties are permanently trying to combat this 2004 Jon Stewart-era fantasy of all Western conservatives as American hillbilly Baptist free marketers

Even if internet lefties have developed some positions past the party line of stoner atheist democrats, that kind of sneering cartoon version of politics still informs their worldview and probably always will

[Anonymous No.9996926]

>>9996900
>/pol/ hates Je-

[Anonymous No.9996952]

>>9996900
Wh-where?

[Anonymous No.9996990]

>>9996645
phone posters should be banned from /lit/

[Anonymous No.9996995]

>>9996621

Is some jew trying to meme this after someone was trying to push Culture of Critique on the board?

[Anonymous No.9996999]

>>9996708

Please don't post again.

[Anonymous No.9997002]

>>9996615
What always surprises me is how good artist Tolkien was. These covers are brilliant.

[Anonymous No.9997105]

[Anonymous No.9997109]

>>9996631
4/10 an attempt was made

[Anonymous No.9997113]

>>9996631
TIL before reddit pickle rick was just pick rick

[Anonymous No.9997115]

>>9996788
anything by Louis L'amour would fit

[Anonymous No.9997226]

>>9997113
Metareddit is still reddit
Please go back there

[Anonymous No.9997238]

>>9996645
>>9997109
>>9997113
>>9997226
Look at all these newfags. This joke has been around /lit/ for years now.

I'm a pretty hardcore reactionary, but Rand is trash. It is possible to remain conservative and still recognize Rand as being a bad writer. They are not mutually exclusive.

[Anonymous No.9997256]

>>9997238
Let's ignore the fact that LoTR came first, and is a major inspiration of almost EVERY fantasy series after it.

Do you know the shit JR Tolkien did to make Lord of the Rings? He made THE ELVISH FUCKING LANGUAGE

A NUANCED LANGUAGE

WITH FUCKING PARTIAL IMPERFECT TENSE

A GRAMMATICALLY CORRECT, COHERENT LANGUAGE

AND ON THE BASIS OF THAT LANGUAGE, AND SEVERAL OTHER FUCKING LANGUAGES, HE MADE THE HOBBIT

YES

HE WROTE THE LANGUAGE BEFORE THE FUCKING STORY

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Languages_constructed_by_J._R._R._Tolkien

BEFORE THE FUCKING PREQUEL STORY TO THE LORD OF THE RINGS, HE WROTE A LANGUAGE

HE WROTE A FUCKING GIGANTIC BACKSTORY, TOO

WITH GODS, AND DEMONS, AND ANGELS, AND SHIT THAT MAKES THE THEOGENY LOOK LIKE AMATEUR HOUR

AND ONLY THEN

ONLY AFTER CREATING SEVERAL FUCKING LANGUAGES

DID HE WRITE THE PREQUEL

YES

THE FUCKING PREQUEL

TO THE LORD OF THE RINGS

AND HERE YOU ARE

YOU FILTHY, FUCKING PLEBIAN

TRYING TO TELL ME THAT TENZIN INFO DUMPING A CORNY COMIC BOOK VILLAIN BACKSTORY

IS THE SAME CALIBER OF WRITING

AS THE MAN

WHO MADE

SEVERAL

FUCKING

LANGUAGES

KILL YOURSELF

SERIOUSLY

KILL YOUR FUCKING SELF

SOMEONE PUTS EFFORT INTO SOMETHING AND CREATES A MASTERPIECE, AND YOU SEE IT THE SAME AS THE SHIT A 9-5ER SPEWED OUT IN A WRITER'S ROOM

[Anonymous No.9997257]

>>9996615
Best candidates are:

>Moby-Dick
>Huckleberry Finn
>Blood Meridian
>Faulkner's Yoknapatawpha county novels (i.e.-all of them)

If you're looking for a straight fantasy inspired by American history and culture, you're not going to come up with anything that great. America has a very strong folk-tale tradition, with regional differences on recurring themes/stories, but in terms as a grandiose mythology it hasn't really been done yet.

It's funny this thread has come up, because it's something I've been thinking about trying my hand at. I think the best way to approach it is through the mythology of the Native Indians merged with the vibrant folk traditions of the US.

[Anonymous No.9997753]

>>9996615
Star Wars

[Anonymous No.9997782]

>>9997257
>It's funny this thread has come up, because it's something I've been thinking about trying my hand at. I think the best way to approach it is through the mythology of the Native Indians merged with the vibrant folk traditions of the US.
I think about this every day, my man. I can not tell you how many folklore books I've read, but I feel like I still cant exactly define what an American folk narrative is. One day I'll get there

[Anonymous No.9997792]

>>9997782
Wild West is American folklore. Or it will be one day

[Anonymous No.9997797]

>>9997792
Westerns are regional and specific, just well defined. A larger, well-defined piece of an even greater puzzle

[Anonymous No.9997826]

>>9996900
You should know better than hoping for a woman's attention, anon. Nice try, though!
>>9996921
How come your sperg friend didn't respond to your plebddit spacing? Why don't you take him and go back, autismo?

[Anonymous No.9997860]

Star Wars.

[Anonymous No.9997914]

>>9997256
Good post, friend
>>9997860
This may actually be the best proposal yet

[Anonymous No.9997945]

>>9997256
I never watched Korra, but I don't get what the author of this pasta was getting at. Tolkien's a better writer because he made up a language? Leaving aside that he plagiarized most of the features from Finnish and Welsh, surely that reasoning would elevate George R. R. Martin and the writers behind Star Trek to his level, wouldn't it?

[Anonymous No.9997973]

>america
>culture
absolutely adoring this meme

[Anonymous No.9998000]

>>9997973
>)

[Anonymous No.9998028]

>>9997257
>>Huckleberry Finn
Why not Tom Sawyer?

[Anonymous No.9998101]

>>9997826
this post reeks of virginity

[Anonymous No.9998353]

>>9997797
A full American epic fantasy incorporating lots of different folkloric elements could be really cool. A protagonist makes a journey westward for whatever reason, encountering witches (of the Salem variety), giants, Indian spirits, gunslingers etc.

Anything like that around already?

[Anonymous No.9998361]

>>9996615
CULTURE OF CRITIQUE
U
L
T
U
R
E OF CRITIQUE

[Anonymous No.9998386]

>>9998353

like this guy said up here>>9997105
Manly Wellman did that a lot in his books, but they're pretty pulpy. Not to say that they are bad, but they lack the literary quality I think OP is looking for

[Anonymous No.9998396]

>>9997256
>Let's ignore the fact that LoTR came first, and is a major inspiration of almost EVERY fantasy series after it.
Not Kull or Conan it didn't.

[Anonymous No.9998816]

[Anonymous No.9999054]

[Anonymous No.9999083]

>>9996615

[Anonymous No.9999172]

>american
>culture

[Anonymous No.9999195]

>>9996615
O Pioneers!, perhaps?
>>9996631
You might not agree with Rand, but calling her an orc is a bit much.

[Anonymous No.9999224]

>>9999195
He didn't, you fucking mongoloid.

[Anonymous No.9999276]

>>9999224
Dearest anon, let us not argue about authorial intent in such a thread. It is practically impossible to ascertain the true nature of that man (or woman)'s post, and to pretend otherwise would be arrogance. You have your interpretation - I have mine - and either one is just fine.

[Anonymous No.9999373]

it occurs to me that Bakshi was attempting this in his film American Pop. It's not a particularly good movie, but the way he tried to execute the idea of a generational American myth was interesting at least.
The medium for such a thing would probably have to be film or derivative of that; something digital/interactive. Europe invented the novel, we invented the motion picture camera.

[Anonymous No.9999384]

>>9996644
What about settler myths and epics...in space?

[Anonymous No.9999404]

>>9996615
Huck Finn/Tom Sawyer/Moby Dick. So Blood Meridian too I suppose. For reference, the most American thing I watched recently is Cop Car. It's absolutely American.

[Anonymous No.9999405]

Something Wicked This Way Comes catches your culture and theme categories.

Winesburg, Ohio,
U.S.A (John Dos Passos), &
Battlefield Earth
may also qualify, but I've only read two of these.

[Anonymous No.9999502]

>>9996615
Hunger Games

[Anonymous No.9999601]

>>9996631
Glad you posted it one of the best memes of all time

[Anonymous No.9999628]

>>9999276
I love this board.

[Anonymous No.9999662]

>>9999628
Because he was capable of shitting that out, and yet totally and utterly misinterpreted some basic english wrt the post in question?

[Anonymous No.9999665]

>>9999662
Yikes

[Anonymous No.9999751]

>>9996631
Le reddit switcheroo!!! xD

[Anonymous No.9999760]

my diary desu

[Anonymous No.10000296]

>>9996864
>this is what anglos believe

[Anonymous No.10000323]

>>9996771
>not The Chronicles Of Amber
come on...

[Anonymous No.10001220]

unironically pic related

[Anonymous No.10001279]

>>9996615
American Gods, Neil Gaiman?
>>10001220
also this. Very american sort of books. In fact I think King's intent with this series was to do the American epic.

[Anonymous No.10001301]

>>9996631
8/10 fuck the haters

[Anonymous No.10001709]

>>9997782
Recc me some American folklore books anon, I'm interested.

[Anonymous No.10002557]

>>9999405
>Winesburg, Ohio,
This is the book I would apply the terms "epic" "mythic" and "adventurous" the least to

[Anonymous No.10002569]

>>10001709
Look for anything with the name Botkin on it. There's also a book called "American Folklore in Literature" or some such that is also good. Its essentially a collection of short stories from authors like Mark Twain and Nathaniel Hawthorne that incorporated elements and themes from American Folklore, compiled into one book. But, yeah, if you're looking for something more grass roots, start with a Treasury of American Folklore by B.A Botkin

[Anonymous No.10002586]

>>10002569
thanks a bunch!

[Anonymous No.10002761]

>>10002586
Oh, Myths and Legends of Our Own Land by Skinner is another really good starting point. Whole thing is online for free, too

[Anonymous No.10002948]

>>10002761
oh boy, thanks for this

[Anonymous No.10003221]

[Anonymous No.10003309]

>>9997115
This. The other anons are correct - the West is America's fabled land, although I think some of the older frontier literature like Cooper might also count.

[Anonymous No.10003322]

>>9997115
>Louis L'amour
wew, my dad fucking loved his sackett series

but yeah, the whole manifest destiny and exploration/pioneering is a huge part of American folklore

[Anonymous No.10003684]

American Gods by that pretentious fuck Neil Gaiman.

[Anonymous No.10003859]

>>9996615
Either The Dog of the South or A Confederacy of Dunces.

[Anonymous No.10003930]

>>10003859
As much as I love Confederacy of Dunces, it is far from being as popular as LotR.

[Anonymous No.10003946]

>>9996615
The closest might be American Gods, but that doesn't really compare (and it's not that great). An American epic might be Gravity's Rainbow, but that's far too difficult for most average readers.

[Anonymous No.10004285]

[Anonymous No.10004319]

>>9996631

[Anonymous No.10004334]

>>9996615
ABSALOM ABSALOM
SOUND / FURY
FLAGS IN THE DUST (SARTORIS)

[Anonymous No.10004395]

>>9996615
clearly feat and loathing in las vegas

[Anonymous No.10004405]

>>10004334

This

dos Passos

[Anonymous No.10004795]

>>9997782
Stop looking at America as one country and focus on regional myths and histories. Our unifying myths are Washington, Jefferson, and Lincoln. Work them in how you can but write about the state or region you live in.

[Anonymous No.10004800]

>>9998396
This. This all day. REH is American Tolkien.

[Anonymous No.10004804]

Dune is the closest we have.

[Anonymous No.10004835]

>>9999405
U.S.A. by Dos Passos seconded.
Epic and way ahead of it's time

[Anonymous No.10004982]

>>9998396
No joke, this guy is literally my 1st cousin thrice removed.

[Anonymous No.10005795]

>>10004334
>southern gothic

[Anonymous No.10005820]

>>9996788
I'd argue that it wouldn't even be a book, it'd be a movie. American westerns are to film what European fantasy noveld are to literature.

[Anonymous No.10005828]

>>9997257
The big issue is that modern America is built on the physical land of America, but the native tribes and tales have long since been wiped out.

American Gods is accurate in that the "American fantasy" is not really its own, but more a mix of other cultures and influences brushed up against the backdrop of modernity and rugged rural individualism (or urban communalism for libfags).

[Anonymous No.10006181]

>>9996631
jeez so many Ayn Rand cocksuckers responding to this and getting mad lmao

[Anonymous No.10006634]

This gets me thinking: are there any great Western books? Obviously Western movies and the West and frontier life are big parts of the American mythos, but are there any great works of literature about it? Would definitely like to read them if there are.

[Anonymous No.10007183]

>>10001709
The Sketch-book of Geoffery Crayon, Gent. by Washington Irving

[Anonymous No.10007637]

[Anonymous No.10007908]

We don't emulate the british. We emulate the continent better. There are no faeries here, but plenty of thieves and swindlers to read about instead. That is because the English are a lot of thieves and swindlers.

[Anonymous No.10008527]

>>10006634
You've not heard /lit/ drone on and on about Blood Meridian?

[Anonymous No.10008645]

>>10006634

As for American authors the Transcendentalists always caught my attention. Ralph Waldo Emerson, Thoreau, amongst others. I find that I connect with their views of man and his relationship with nature.

Also Jack London is another favorite American author. White Fang, Call of the Wild, and The Sea Wolf are all great.

[Anonymous No.10010235]

The Colombiad

[Anonymous No.10011017]

>>9996666
I know this is a literature thread, but those numbers are pretty impressive

>>10006181
I think any perceived anger is mostly projection on your part bud, it's not only Randlets who think Reddit jokes are groan worthy..

[Anonymous No.10011056]

>>9996615
The Illuminatus Trilogy. I am only 40% memeing here. It is an interesting fantastical take on 70's America. Though, without any of the pretense that LOTR had.

[Anonymous No.10011329]

>>9996615
American Psycho (no joke, read it if you haven't, movie doesn't count)

[Anonymous No.10011342]

There's no imprint of paganism on American culture to draw a fantasy mythos from

[Anonymous No.10011359]

>>10011342
There's a whole slew of pagan rituals and beliefs to be found in American folklore, what are you talking about

[Anonymous No.10011607]

>>9996615
Yes; the movies

[Anonymous No.10013563]

>>10011607
gay

[Anonymous No.10013572]

>>9996631
I love how everybody writes 'reddit meme' when this is a very old quote from this

https://kfmonkey.blogspot.com.au/2009/03/ephemera-2009-7.html

[Anonymous No.10014410]

It should be easy enough to create a literal American epic. There's been countless scholarly studies written on epics, just use them as templates, but fill in the American parts yourself