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/lit/ - Literature

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996515 No.996515 [Reply] [Original]

/lilt/, why is it that novels with misanthropic, nihilistic, pessimistic, cynical assholes as the main character are considered classics so often?

I suppose educated, well read people are largely unhappy and cynical?

>> No.996524

I sure as hell am.

>> No.996523

-sigh-

it's so true.

>> No.996526

>>996515
http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/TrueArtIsAngsty

>> No.996532

Because sociable, optimistic, idealistic, flawless characters are fucking boring.

>> No.996559

>>996532
But if I'm to believe the "classics", everyone is in the middle of some sort of crisis of identity, aloof, and disgusted with the world.

In most cases, I cannot relate to these characters. They seem whiny and unwilling to take the reins in their own lives.

>> No.996563

Good literature reflects real life.

Real life sucks and people are idiots.

>> No.996567
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996567

>>996559
>good books have some sort of crisis

>> No.996573

>>996526

god i fucking hate tvtropes

hopefully the zeitgeist will catch up with me soon, as it usually does, and that shit site will go out of fashion

>> No.996574

>>996567
lol, image saved.

>> No.996577

Because like you said, OP, most intelligent people tend to be unhappy and cynical. I personally think they're a bunch of grumpy bastards.

>> No.996578

>>996567

I don't mean I don't like books with conflict. I just can't stand protagonists with no interest in anything but self-pity.

>> No.996580

>>996578
please give some examples

>> No.996586

>>996580
Frankenstein. And there you go.

>> No.996590
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996590

>>996586

>> No.996600

>>996578
I wont troll you and say Catcher In The Rye. I don't often visit /lit/ but I think that book's probably a punchline here.

Books of this sort though. I can't pull any out of my head on the spot, but I've started (and put down) plenty of books where it seems like the author is just venting all his frustrations with himself and humanity.
Personally, I just don't find that entertaining or enlightening. I find it tiring and oppressive.
If I wanted to hear everyone's complaint's with how awful their life is, I'd have become a psychologist.

>> No.996603
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996603

Misanthropy is a rarely adopted mindset and allows the reader to see the world in a totally different way.

Also, people are more empathic towards anti-heros than truly good people.

>> No.996613

>>996603
Then I'm the strange one for not identifying with these sorts of people?

>> No.996618

"Happy Families Are All Alike" -- Tolstoy.

Unhappiness is the source of conflict. Conflict is the source of story.

Unhappy, misanthropic, nihilistic, pessimistic, cynical characters move the stories forward.

>> No.996628

>>996613

If you can't empathise with it due to your personality, these books at least allow you to understand why someone might have that kind of outlook on life.

What point would there be in a story where there was nothing unnatural or strange like a misanthropic mind?

If Holden had been able to adjust to his school life and was comfortable being part of society, there would be no story.

>> No.996631

>>996618
Self-determined, confident people don't solve conflicts?

I see what you guys are saying: without conflict there is no story. I suppose I just can't relate to protagonists who are so unlike myself.
I spend the entire book mentally punching the characters in the face while screaming "What the hell is wrong with you, get your shit together and get going!".

>> No.996634

>>996631

There wouldn't BE a conflict if the character wasn't a misanthrope who detested his society's culture.

>> No.996635

>>996600
>and put down

Perhaps if you actually read any of the books?

>> No.996641

>>996631

You should read Ayn Rand. Seriously.

>> No.996647
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996647

ITT: I realize I'M the strange one.

>> No.996655

>>996641
Objectivism does not mesh well with my outlook.

>> No.996658

>>996647

Actually, most people are like you.

ITT: 2deep4 OP

>> No.996660

>>996515
Examples.

>> No.996670
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996670

>>996655

That's just sillyness bro, you can't only read books which agree with your mindset.

You have to read books which challenge your preconceived notions of reality, or live in perpetually in comfortable ignorance.

>> No.996682

>>996655

It seems like you'd enjoy their hard-working, individualistic protagonists, though.

>> No.996683

>>996658
I suppose then, like most people, I look to literature to escape reality and the oppostie side look to it to dissect this shitty world, tell them why it's shitty, and how it's shittiness affects and already disillusioned character.

>> No.996685
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996685

That is not always true. Filth is not a classic. In fact its a pretty boring read.

>> No.996704

>>996628
The thing is, every book ever is like this
Get some originality, guize

>> No.996716

>>996670
I don't expect what I read to challenge my preconceived notions of reality.
For me, my experiences in the world it's self are tasked with that. I do things I don't like and interact with people unlike me all day long. I've lived in 8 different countries, all unlike my original home, full of people with completely different viewpoints.
Maybe I just expect different things from reading a book?