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/lit/ - Literature

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969004 No.969004 [Reply] [Original]

So I'm reading The Republic.

>> No.969007

that's nice

>> No.969014

Oh, no.

>> No.969015

>>969014
what?

>> No.969017

ban all poetry!

>> No.969019

>>969017
>2deep4me

>> No.969027

>>969017
He was being satirical.

>> No.969028

>>969015
I preferred Utopia. Nothing really wrong with The Republic, I suppose. I disagreed with many of Plato's opinions, but it was interesting.

>> No.969029

>>969017
Quite, it'll weaken the state and its youth!

...OP what's the purpose of this thread...?

>> No.969037

ITT: People interpret Plato word-for-word despite how complex his writing was

>> No.969047

>>969037
>a text can be interpreted any other way than word-for-word
oh /lit/

>> No.969051

>>969047
see: >>969027

>> No.969065

>>969051
even in satire, the text must be a priori to interpretation. I mean, I'm really not suggesting that you don't ''read'' the text, only that...well...saying that there is any other way than ''word-for-word'' is problematic, is it not?

>> No.969075

>>969065
I agree. Clearly, you READ the text, but as with any piece of work like The Republic, you have to do more than just read it.

>> No.969077

>>969065
Yes it's not the best term to use, but I assumed my meaning was clear enough.

>> No.969090

>>969075
More, like what?

>> No.969117

>>969028

>Implying Plato's opinions are easy to discern

>> No.969120

>>969090
Obviously, you have to look for "the point," to be blunt. Why was Plato writing? What change was he trying to effect, or was he trying to effect a change at all? Why does he say what he says? You have to question what you read as well as read it. As with any work of philosophy--any book, one could argue.

>> No.969124

After his tirade against Homer and Hesiod, he goes on to quote them extensively and use them as support to his arguments.

>> No.969132

>>969124

Not only does he use the poets to support his arguments, but he also emulates them in various ways.

His myth of the metals is quite clearly a retelling of Hesiod's myth of the four ages of man. Plato is appropriating his poetic predecessors and adapting them for his own purposes.

>> No.969141

The Republic lecture videos at the following link are well worth watching:

http://ocw.nd.edu/philosophy/ancient-and-medieval-philosophy/lectures

At the very least, they will open your eyes to the depth of the dialogue.

>> No.969144

>>969141
These are best viewed after reading the whole thing right?

>> No.969148

>>969144

Yeah

>> No.969155

So was Plato really such an authoritarian prick?

>> No.969188

>>969155

He hated democracy, but he also hated tyrants.

Make of that what you will.

>> No.969191
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969191

>>This thread

>> No.969195

>>969188
Well I personally believe the best government is a good dictator myself. Still Plato seems to want to take away harmless personal freedoms from the people which I see as tyranny.

>> No.969193
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969193

>>969191

>> No.969206

>>969195

>take away harmless personal freedoms
Can you give me an example of what you have in mind?

>> No.969211

>>969206
Well didn't he want to ban poetry? Take children away from their parents? There's many other things but I can't quite remember them.

>> No.969219
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969219

>>969193

>> No.969222

>>969211
.....Scroll up.

>> No.969225

>>969211
He described a perfect state. Doesn't mean he would put it into practise against his morals...

>> No.969230

>>969027
no he's not

>> No.969236 [DELETED] 

>>969211

>Well didn't he want to ban poetry?
Only some of it.

>Take children away from their parents?
The masses aren't involved in the communistic "common-life" were kids are shared. A lot of the disturbing restrictions only apply to the elites.

The Republic isn't the only work where Plato builds a nation more-or-less from scratch. He also wrote The Laws. This dialogue is less fanciful than The Republic. The Republic always struck me as an unapproachable ideal("a kingdom which exists nowhere upon earth but is laid up in heaven to be the pattern and rule of human life"). In my opinion, you have a much better chance of seeing what kind of nation Plato would have created given the chance by reading The Laws.

>> No.969240

>>969211

>Well didn't he want to ban poetry?
Only some of it.

>Take children away from their parents?
The masses aren't involved in the communistic "common-life" where kids are shared. A lot of the disturbing restrictions only apply to the elites.

The Republic isn't the only work where Plato builds a nation more-or-less from scratch. He also wrote The Laws. This dialogue is less fanciful than The Republic. The Republic always struck me as an unapproachable ideal("a kingdom which exists nowhere upon earth but is laid up in heaven to be the pattern and rule of human life"). In my opinion, you have a much better chance of seeing what kind of nation Plato would have created given the chance by reading The Laws.